the importance of good reference for your work.

[Anonymous No.3937548]

Is there any reason why I can get semi professional or professional results when I use reference while my full drawings from imagination looks like complete /beg/ stuff?

Sure, I can draw completelly from imagination like pic related, even if I copied the designs, the pose, the folds on the clothes and the shading are still my work.

I'm happy with pic related and outside /ic/ hardcore autism, people on normie sites were impressed by it.
I think pic related could work as a real page in a manga magazine, I've seen worse shit being published in japan.
Some japs told me it looked fine pic related.

Of course I still relied on reference to make this drawing, even if the pose is from imagination.
I've come to the conclusion the real profressional artists, all used reference or copied from real life models.

My work simply goes from advanced /beg/ shit when I relly 100% on imagination to semi professional results when I relly on good references, even I can get some realistic results when I use photo studies.

It seems loomis in his books also talk about the same, and he talks about using photo reference to increase the quality of your work.

People alway praise my works when I relly more on reference, and for me, they clearly are more skilled on surface.
But I still feel using reference is like cheating, but at the same time I see I wont get professional results from pure imagination, I'm not that good.
Even /ic/ also falls on the same trap as non trained artists when they praise a more realistic drawing without realizing is just a copy from a reference.

[Anonymous No.3937549]

>>3937548
Post work where you used reference for comparison.

[Anonymous No.3937550]

>>3937548
Uh just keep drawing both from reference and imagination and your imaginative work will eventually improve as you're able to remember how stuff looks from your referenced work.

[Anonymous No.3937551]

>>3937548
>I'm happy with pic related
You shouldn't be.

[Anonymous No.3937552]

>>3937549
>>3937551
This was made with a 3D render, to copy kof 12 sprites technique.

It looks (I think) like something that could be accepted in a real videogame.

[Anonymous No.3937555]

>>3937548
holy crap this has to be a meme
this is an unprecedented level of dunning-kruger cope

[Anonymous No.3937556]

>>3937549
>>3937551
This was done after I learned about matte painting from some gnomon DVD.

You can see the results are clearly more advanced than my imagination work.

>>3937550
Sure, but even then, imagination works always, even top tier artists on history has always mistakes or weird proportions or impossible shit.

Imagination work always have errors, even top tier artists /ic/ loves to talk about.

[Anonymous No.3937557]

>>3937555
I drew this almost a decade ago, using a photo as reference.
You can see it looks better acording to /ic/ autism than my imagination works.

[Anonymous No.3937568]

>>3937556
Wtf you call this semi-pro?

It's still /beg OP

[Anonymous No.3937571]

>>3937556
Shit doesn't have to be perfect, that's not the point of art
Imagination is always an idealized version of reality, you can get really close to depicting reality with imaginative work. But if you expect perfection you'll be disappointed, reality isn't perfect anyway.

[Anonymous No.3937575]

>>3937548
>I've come to the conclusion the real profressional artists, all used reference or copied from real life models.

Correct. You're on your way to making it. But you need to stop thinking of using references/models as simply copying unless you 're going for a near 1:1 reproduction, and even then if you do that there's still a lot you can learn (master studies).

Everyone but /begs/ who want to cope for their lack of basic drawing skills know how important reference is. 90% of illustrators worth their salt has relied on models and references, and the old masters would copy other masters before them to learn and to use their work as references ontop of using models to finish their paintings.

What you have in your head even if you're a master like Alex Ross or James Gurney, is never as real or lifelike as it could be and there's always more you can learn from nature to give life to your drawings. Gurney was able to bring his ideas to life and paint them as realistically as he does because he uses references, does studies for every piece, and builds models. That's just part of creating imaginative realism.

Especially as a beginner, your drawings from imagination look like shit because you've done so little studying from observation that you have so little memory of how figures actually look and move and how to draw them for example. If you can't draw a figure very well from observation, how do you expect to figures well from imagination? You clearly can't do it without the image right there in front of your eyes so don't even expect to get anything of value from imagination.

If you can draw what you see well then you can realistically draw that again from memory afterwards (or something similar) with enough practice. This is how Kim Jung Gi got to where he is - he became really good at drawing from memory and that hugely carried over drawing to from imagination. Drawing from imagination is mostly drawing from memory and part invention. Read his interviews.

[Anonymous No.3937576]

>>3937568
depends on your goals.

my goal is to be more on the cartoony imagination animation kind of the drawing size.

my goal isn't fine art realism.

professional only means being paid, there's not quality requeriments for being a professional outside getting paid.

>>3937571
I mean the quality diference between full imagination work and rellying heavily on reference.

[Anonymous No.3940348]

People like KJG existing is just proof that you and the like are too lazy to actually teach yourself how to do anything, you will always opt for taking a shortcut if its the bare minimum of taking you somewhere you can pretend youre happy
Dont skimp, dont make excuses and stop pondering, art is not hard just time consuming and thought intensive

[Anonymous No.3940488]

>>3937548
Creativity and ideas aren't just something that happen by magic. The brain is a muscle, and you need to train it. Most art education past the first year focuses on concept, not technique. You have to do the same slog through shitty ideas until the good ones start popping up - and the sad fact is, there are more artists with high skill levels with no ideas, than artists with both.
>I've come to the conclusion the real profressional artists, all used reference or copied from real life models.
Of course they do. Artists have used reference and models the entire history of art.
>But I still feel using reference is like cheating
You probably picked up this ridiculous idea here, and you need to get that bad idea out of your brain.

You're like everyone else here - you overwhelmingly focused on technique, and didn't explore ideas. Well, now is the time for that. It might happen quickly, or slowly, or not at all, but now is the time you start working on concept and narrative. Or, start working with collaborators. Everyone thinks every artist is a good painter, writer, and editor, but it's a select few who can do all of that. Try illustrating a book. Start simple. Look at how you use your skills to convey narrative, not accuracy. Learn how to tell stories (assuming, going by your art, you want to be a cartoonist). Not everyone is a storyteller, I'm not, and I came to terms with that a long time ago, and I'm fine with that.

[Anonymous No.3940498]

>>3937556
wait, weren't you that same anon who made a thread with the same pic related?You asked if that pic could make you money or something like that

[Anonymous No.3940551]

You're actually dunning-kruger. You're not anywhere near semi pro, even with reference. Shut up and keep practicing brainlet.

[Anonymous No.3940569]

>>3940551
>You're actually dunning-kruger.
I always laugh, when someone posts this, because most people don't even know what that means, and you're just using it like "faggot', as an insult.
>Shut up and keep practicing brainlet.
isn't a critique, it's a personal attack.

[Anonymous No.3940574]

>>3940569
ohh i love it its like a cringe compilation but i have the satisfaction knowing how retarded you are

[Anonymous No.3940583]

>>3940574
Thanks for proving me right. It's times like this I wished this place wasn't anonymous, so I could send your dumb ass to the ignore file.

But hey, if you want to spend your life irrationally angry and bringing nothing of value to the table, have at it - you're doing a good job of just that already. Go pro.

[Anonymous No.3940918]

>>3940551
This