Talent doesn't exist

[Anonymous No.3561088]

Prove me wrong.

[Latte No.3561101]

>>3561088
>>3561088
Talent doesn't, but passion does. Only those born passionate about art will do what it takes to get good. Most people don't care enough to dedicate hours of practice and study to art. They'll give up or find excuses but those who really want to will find a way and others to learn from.

[Anonymous No.3561147]

>>3561088
Genetic talent is complete bullshit. By that logic you should only have children with people who are good at the same things you are because then your offspring would also have that natural ability, and the only people who should excel in those fields are those in the bloodline of people who excelled before them. Makes no sense on any level.

And yes, I do know of the study that attempted to rebuke the study showing talent doesn't exist. Anyone who seriously plays chess or any other game that uses elo or some derivative can tell you how flawed of a system it is, and that study includes using chess players based on their elo to try to show skill level isn't all that influenced by time invested. Elo is barely a measure of skill at all. It just measures wins vs losses, and winning doesn't necessarily mean skilled. The system is easy to cheat to become highly ranked, you can win many matches against weak players to artificially inflate your elo and then completely avoid playing against strong players or playing at all to keep it high, it doesn't decay over time so you can sit on it forever, so I consider that study flawed and the original study showing skill mainly to be a function of time * effort still fairly valid as I don't know of any other study that rebukes it.

[Anonymous No.3561160]

>>3561088
You exist.
You have talent.

Therefore, you need to come to my house for your daily beating, anon. :o

[Anonymous No.3561189]

>>3561088
Some people are born with great memory and can replicate an exact cityscape or a face from just a glance. With this you can easily have a large visual library.There are also people who are born with great hand to eye coordination. Talent exists. But its not enough, you also need a ton of practice and hard work. but hey im just a beg so what do i know.

[Anonymous No.3561322]

>>3561189
How about you read my books ok pal.

[Anonymous No.3561360]

>>3561322
no thanks, ill draw and do studies instead

[Anonymous No.3561376]

>>3561160
>EXPRESSION determined 2.jpg
Do you have a folder of reaction images categorised by expression...

[Anonymous No.3561387]

>>3561376
>Do you have a folder of reaction images categorised by expression...
SQUEEEEEEEEEE

I can't believe somebody noticed.

Yes, at first, but then trolls and mods threatened to ban me if I
didn't stop naming my files "EXPRESSION".

So I had to replace many of them with random numbers or words.
:(

So far, no more threats have been made.

[Anonymous No.3561407]

>>3561376
>Do you have a folder of reaction images categorised by expression...
SQUEEEEEEEEEE

I can't believe somebody noticed.

Yes, at first, but then trolls reported me to the mods.
One mod gave me a 5-min ban;
another mod threatened to permaban me (might have been the same mod).
They told me to stop naming my files "EXPRESSION".

So, I renamed my files, and put each one into its own subfolder,
with each subfolder being named EXPRESSION.

Obviously, I overlooked a few files,
... which you noticed.
>>*gulp*
>>pls no bully

[Anonymous No.3563412]

>>3561101
https://news.stanford.edu/2018/06/18/find-passion-may-bad-advice/

[Anonymous No.3563419]

>>3561360

No you won't. You're on /ic/.

[Anonymous No.3563428]

>>3561147
Intelligence is heritable and is the most significant correlate of success in just about everything. Combine that with heritable personality traits that also correlate with success and you have something resembling "genetic talent".

[Anonymous No.3563432]

>>3563419

[Anonymous No.3563581]

I think some people just use their time practicing in a more intelligent and efficient way.

[Anonymous No.3564054]

>>3561088
Everyone can draw, what not everyone can do is endure the crippling depression of your drawings being shit until they stop being shit

[Anonymous No.3564068]

>>3563428
Are you heritable?

[Anonymous No.3564070]

>>3561088
Not everyone made it as a taxi driver.

[Anonymous No.3564072]

>>3561088
Yes it does and if we go deeper free will doesn't exist.

Anti talent propaganda is just there to convince yourself, it's there because you are so pussy that you would stop working hard if you ever faced reality. The fact that talent exists doesn't change anything though. If you spend a lot of time getting good there is a high chance that you will. Just track your fucking time and study everyday for years.

[Anonymous No.3564076]

Talent doesn't exist, but luck yes.

[Anonymous No.3564085]

>>3564076
Luck doesn’t exist. Prove me wrong.

[Anonymous No.3564090]

>>3561088
"Muh talent doesn't exist" faggots are almost entirely comprised of people who don't want to face the reality that some people are just inherently better off than others at different things. They're the autists that clung to their elementary school teacher's speech about how anybody could grow up to be an astronaut for a little too long.

Some people's base stats are better than others', and depending on which combination of base stats they excel in they'll naturally have more of an affinity and ability for certain tasks/jobs/hobbies. Nobody can prove you wrong because your head's too far up your ass to listen to anyone, and there are too many studies you can cherrypick off the internet to validate yourself with.

[Anonymous No.3564468]

>>3564090
So...talent doesn't exist?

[Anonymous No.3564479]

So, let me get this straight, and I know I'm asking a bunch of anonymous users on 4chan, so I'll sprinkle in a few hurr durrs and ngmi and post your works so that I can blend in, but how many of you really believe in what you post here? Is this your place to vent because if it is, I'm not coming here to take a shit on your Cheerios or anything, but just the fact that each and every one of you tear at each other's throats through anonymity posting they way you do, is really sad.

Why don't the lot of you get serious about what you want to do with your artwork and really help each other instead of flinging handfuls of shit at each other?

Can't this place be something you all can return back to from time to time to help each other become better? Do you really hate each other that much?

Talent does, and it doesn't exist. You all should know better than that.

[Anonymous No.3564486]

>>3561088
Talent exist as in the sense that there are inherent biological advantages that differ from person to person, maybe even early environmental influences could be considered talent. However I feel discipline and dedicated time are more important in the long run

[Anonymous No.3564491]

>>3564486
So a person born on a cloud is inherently better than one who isn't? That doesn't sound right.

[Anonymous No.3564498]

>>3564491
A child who is born with a parent that tells them that getting a halo tattoo at 15 is a bad idea is inherently better yes.

[Anonymous No.3564502]

>>3564498
Have you tried getting the tattoo removed? How old are you now?

[containercore !o3a0NktvbA No.3564504]

>>3561088
There are people who improve consistently without expending a lot of effort and people who struggle immensely and never improve. Some people have a natural acumen for learning art and thinking visually, and that's what talent is.

[Anonymous No.3564506]

>>3564504
Name some of these individuals. I'd love to see their work to see if what you say is true.

[Anonymous No.3564709]

>>3564506
albert einstein

[Anonymous No.3564712]

>>3561407
I admire the dedication. Can you put them all in a zip?

[Anonymous No.3564805]

Real shit, it definitely does exist, but it shouldn't even occur to you to worry about it if you love making art in the first place. Caring about not having talent is either being afraid of not cashing in or gaining recognition as easily, or ultimately boils down to not actually liking art enough in one way or another.

[Anonymous No.3564816]

>>3561088
i think it does, you often get people who say they aren't a natural talent in their field so they have to go about doing whatever they do art/writing/directing/acting/sports/chess etc. in a different way.

so idk john singer sargent can do all kinds of cool brushwork because he's very talented while maybe beaugereau might do his licky seamless thing because you can still create beautiful images that way without needing to be quick or deft with the brush. (just as an example maybe beaugereau's sketches are even better than his paintings idk)

[Anonymous No.3564959]

>>3561088
It does, but contrary to popular opinion it doesn't make you instantly good or give you a head start.
It just means you learn faster.

[Anonymous No.3564976]

>>3564506
here we go

>show me examples so I can strawman pls

ad infinitum


talent is an obvious fact. everyone has during their lifetime encountered someone with talent. but people choose to believe it doesn't exist, so it is their own choice if they want to be good at something. "I could do it if I wanted to". *leans back in couch*

[Anonymous No.3565739]

>>3564976
>talent is a fact
>my evidence? it is just obvious!
yea no you have no position whatsoever lol keep your dark ages beliefs and your dark ages level of evidence with the cavemen, enjoy being held back your whole life, satisfied with mediocrity because you have legitimately deluded yourself into thinking your failures are some kind of built in part of you

[Anonymous No.3566157]

>>3565739
Have you ever seen a single human being in your life? Do you even know what genetics are?
Human beings can have anywhere between 0 to around 220 IQ. A 50 IQ downie is intellectually as close to the average human as he is to a fucking rock.
Let's ignore IQ for a second, just imagine the potential variations in physical size and development of humans' visual cortexes alone: no two people in history will ever have the exact same one. Imagine how basic visual processing really gets when you turn to the animal kingdom. Microorganisms don't even have it.
You are rejecting basic common sense and centuries of research, so please shut your fucking mouth.

[Anonymous No.3566159]

>>3566157
aww poor baby can't produce any real evidence for his position

[Anonymous No.3566161]

>>3566159
Hey, don't call that person a baby!

Fuck's the matter with you?!

[Anonymous No.3566168]

Talent per se doesn't exist, but taste and different learning speeds do exist. Anyone can learn the technical aspects of art, but only someone with good taste can bring someone fresh out of it.

[Anonymous No.3566673]

>>3561088
Talent is compulsion and eagerness.

[Anonymous No.3567025]

Talent can be defined by the ability to develop new skills and the capacity to learn. Nobody has a natural, biological aptitude for anything other than survival.
Talent = intelligence.
Calling it "talent" is just a way for people who don't have it to feel better about themselves.

[Anonymous No.3567081]

>>3561088

Guess it exists. Doesn't change you're a bad artist not making content.

Damn.

Should have made content instead of a shitty thread.

Too bad.

[Anonymous No.3567349]

>>3561088
If you define talent as born ability to draw/paint/etc then I doubt blind people have much talent.

But talent wont yield any results without work.

[Anonymous No.3567369]

This information is probably useless because it's anecdotal but...

As a child(maybe around 7-10) I remember experiencing pure joy whenever I had to do art assignments, and pure anguish whenever i had to do anything mathematical.

This naturally lead me to develop my artistic skills from an early age. So basically the combination of passion at an early age + more over all hours led me to outperforming my peers early on, where did that initial passion come from? Might have been environment, my parents were hippies and always promoted the arts in our home. Or genetic, my mom is an artist.

It's a tricky question, but I think that all the factors are at play, so yes... Talent does exist, and if the talent is there you'd better not squander it bucko.

[Anonymous No.3567396]

>>3561088
compare frank frazetta and drawabox

[Anonymous No.3567443]

>>3564976
Source? There is a lot of scientific literature pointing to the fact that talent does not in fact exist, though most of it is done on musicians, and chess players. Read a book retard.

[Anonymous No.3567457]

>>3567443
[citation needed]

[Anonymous No.3567458]

>>3567457
Start with this

https://hbr.org/2007/07/the-making-of-an-expert

[Anonymous No.3567462]

Here is a tip: if you have two theories and one gives you an excuse to be lazy, the other one is probably right. Saying you don't have talent is just an excuse to be lazy and not do the hard work.

[Anonymous No.3567530]

>>3561088
Even if it exists how does it matter? You won't know if you're talented unless you try, and you can't know for sure how hard other people (talented or not) try or have tried.

Just get to it for real and see how far you can go.

[Anonymous No.3569819]

>>3561407
You're either a girl or a massive faggot. Either way you suck dicks.

[Anonymous No.3569824]

[Anonymous No.3569897]

>>3569819
I'm a massive faggot :3 <3

[Anonymous No.3569899]

>>3569819
I'm a massive phaggot :3
And I love you <3

[Anonymous No.3569903]

>>3569899
I never said it was bad.

[Anonymous No.3569904]

If we define talent as a natural aptitude it's pretty obvious people have natural talent. Just because there isn't a specific art gene that makes you good at like, watercolours doesn't mean there aren't natural predispositions that make you good at something. I bet you virtually everyone on /ic/ can name one of the fundamental art skills they found easier or harder than another, and that it'll vary from person to person. To imagine that all human beings are blank slates and that grit and determination are the only factors in skill acquisition is naive.

/ic/'s 'talent doesn't exist' is just a kneejerk reaction to 'if you don't have talent why even bother'. They're both dumb perspectives. /ic/ has a major problem with adopting the radical opposite of a notion they reject, too many people have never heard the word 'nuance' in their fucking life.

[Anonymous No.3569911]

>>3569903
Do you love me?

[Anonymous No.3569914]

>>3569911
I love your pretty lips bby.