"I've been drawing for years and I still haven't improved."

[Anonymous No.3014084]

Do you thing people are being disingenuous when they say stuff like this (like how fat people say they are """""""""""unable"""""""" to lose weight ) or are people legitimately completely incapable of getting good no matter how much time they spend drawing?

[akirel with down syndrome No.3014087]

>>3014084
but they are fat people who indeed cant lose weight, like boogie. Its a hormonal thing sometimes. Therefore, probabily most be dumb people who cant improve because theirs small brains. No matter how hard they try, they just are dumb with no memory or sense of observation.

[Anonymous No.3014088]

Im convinced that not everyone can learn without an instructor.

[Anonymous No.3014089]

>>3014084
Well if you don't give a fuck about fundies then you're not gonna improve. Or at least you're gonna do it really fucking slowly.

[Anonymous No.3014093]

>>3014087
>he bought into boogie's excuses

Your body can't magically create energy. Energy in, energy out. It's a fucking principle of physics, everyone can lose weight. Spend more energy than you consume = lose weight. Literally.

[Anonymous No.3014095]

>>3014084
Actually gittin gud takes a fairly large amount of effort on top of drawing. As you said, it's like weight loss. If you do things to help you lose the pounds quicker like you study what foods you need to take in, macros, exercise routines, read books on the topic, exct, you will lose weight faster. It's not disingenuous because it's true. You can draw a lot (hours daily) and still be roughly the same after years of work. If you never draw with the intent to grow or learn, you will never really grow and learn. I don't think it's disingenuous or insincere, and I don't think that people are incapable of getting good. What I do think is there are people that lack the willpower and personal strength to improve. And this goes in every asset in their life

some people are just weaker and need to grow as a person before they can grow as an artist. That being said there are various other factors that rule into this

[Anonymous No.3014096]

>>3014084
There's a difference between drawing to draw and drawing to improve.

[akirel with down syndrome No.3014101]

>>3014093
Men. People like him has a really low metabolism, its not as simple as that. I wish it was that simple to bash really fat people, but in some cases is fucking impossible to lose weight without degrading your body. Dont be dumb. Some people eat more than that fat people and are skinny, like me. So, its not equal for everyone. Nature fuck some of us for fun.

[Anonymous No.3014104]

>>3014101
That's why I accept chubby people, but boogie is a gigantic blob. Did you know that your body loses about 8% of its metabolism every 10 years after you reach adulthood? Meaning almost every 60yr old has a worse metabolism than boogie, I see a lot of chubby 60yr olds, but fat like boogie?

How much does boogie exercise? How much do you think he eats?

He's a nice guy and all, but there's no excuse to his extreme fatness. If he switches his diet to full vegetables he will lose 10 pounds + in the first week. Don't buy into fat people's lies, they are excuses.

[Anonymous No.3014106]

>>3014087

Requesting the image of him drinking liters of soda.

[Anonymous No.3014109]

>>3014104
>That's why I accept chubby people, but boogie is a gigantic blob.
You're a good guy, anon.

[Anonymous No.3014120]

>>3014101
High and low metabolism is indeed a thing like you said. And it is why you need to adjust your diet and lifestyle to fit properly. Sometimes people don't get to have fun running around all-you-can-eat buffets and actually need to work to maintain a figure that isn't disgusting. It's all an excuse that they are too lazy to put in the effort. I know because I have low metabolism and was a fat, disgusting kid. I'm not that bad anymore, thank god, but I know that I need to eat more vegetables and proteins than the average person who goes out and eats shit and carbs all day. I haven't touched a soda in months and I haven't had chocolate anything in forever. I need to put in the effort to keep losing weight and I am ok with this. It taught me discipline for every part of my life and I am a better person for it

tl;dr doomed to be fat is an excuse weak willed people use to get away from being called out on their bs, signed, a previously fat

[Anonymous No.3014122]

>>3014109
Thanks

[Anonymous No.3014154]

>>3014084
Just because you're drawing doesn't mean you're learning. It's simple as that. I bet these shitters just draw the same anime girl over and over again with no attempts to actually study anatomy, perspective, etc.

[Anonymous No.3014195]

>>3014084
before is nicer to look at than after

[Anonymous No.3014246]

>>3014084
>manga
>no improvement

Found the problem.

[Anonymous No.3014247]

>>3014246
>manga
>no improvement
What is being a manga artist for 20k/yr?

[Anonymous No.3014315]

>>3014084
It's different from fatties.
There is no guarantee that a retard can grasp drawing. No matter the amount of practice or how good a teacher.

[Anonymous No.3014338]

>>3014120
But if they don't care about not being fat then why would they spend the extra effort?

[Anonymous No.3014341]

>>3014087
>but they are fat people who indeed cant lose weight, like boogie.
boogie eats fucking whipped cream straight from the can you fucking retard holy shit how gullible can one person be

[Anonymous No.3014343]

>>3014084
idk man. some people just like doodling as a form of comfort and relaxation.

[Anonymous No.3014344]

>>3014341
How else are you supposed to fucking eat it? In a bowl?

[Anonymous No.3014345]

>>3014246
That's ripped right from one of the covers of Azumanga Daioh.

[Anonymous No.3014347]

getting gud actually required the level of intensity and practice that only an insane person would be willing to put themselves through. unless they're just idiot savants or ungodly talented, and even then it takes incredible dedication to produce content. you have to be addicted to it. it's why things are often described as insanely good. people can go mental from doing art. people don't want to do that, they just want to scribble things that feel good that remind them of nice things or whatever.

[Anonymous No.3014355]

>>3014338
that comment thread is about a man who cares enough about not being fat to make continuous excuses about not losing weight instead of telling people he doesn't care/likes being fat
no need to be defensive, fatty
t. another ex-fatty

[Anonymous No.3014357]

>>3014101
The fatter you become the higher amount of calories is required to maintain all that fat. Boogie and people like him who are blobs of fat has to eat a lot more than your average slim jim.
Boogie's(and people like him) problem isn't "low metabolism". He has an eating disorder. He can't stop eating and he said so himself he uses food to comfort himself.

"Muh low metabolism" is a lame excuse.

Enough of that garbage. Since drawing ability is completely logical. These people who never improve are essentially going into math class and never listen to anything anyone says and just do their thing. Their math of course doesn't make any sense since they don't know the logic or anything about math. They are just writing down shit their own way.
At a glance their math reads as whatever they are trying to do, but the closer you look the more fucked up it is.

This is OP's image.

[Anonymous No.3014367]

>>3014357
art is not exactly math dude but I get what you're saying. more likely she was extremely young in the first pic and over time she was able to look at it and apply her knowledge about how things like light and shadow work in a rudimentary way.
people are legit scared to draw things on paper. they think they have to make perfect lines or they'll screw it up. it's weird but it's really like performing chemistry to some.

[Anonymous No.3014381]

>>3014367
>people are legit scared to draw things on paper. they think they have to make perfect lines or they'll screw it up. it's weird but it's really like performing chemistry to some.
Yeah and that's because art unlike math, where even if you know the answer, you can't get it right on the first attempt or even the hundredth. You have to constantly try again like in chemistry with mixtures to produce different effects. At least in math, you'll get a simple problem in less than a week. In art, you're always dealing with complex and real problems from the start.

[Anonymous No.3014798]

Watts says it best. But basically you need to draw a ton, but that alone is not enough, it also needs to be done in a way that helps you improve, with good eyes telling you what's wrong.

You can technically draw every day by sitting in a sandbox and making stick figures 24/7 but you'll be like these DA people who make 0 progress. They're not disingenuous because they think the amount of time they put into their sand drawings is worth something.

[Anonymous No.3014817]

>>3014084
I cannot draw shapes correctly. Canfuckingnot. Starting at step fucking one "Draw the outline of this cup/vase/egg/simple household object" I am incapable. It seems like it's something so absolutely fundamental, that it is never explained. People just draw the right shape they meant to draw as if by some sorcery. I cannot. It is always, always, always misshapen, disproportional, and ugly.

[Anonymous No.3014834]

>>3014817
Don't focus on the outlines, they are just a tool to show up the form, just like values. you are hurting yourself by focusing on perfect outlines and shapes.

[Anonymous No.3014836]

>>3014817
>1. draw line, lightly
>2. draw another
>3. repeat
>4. erase when needed, when lines become too dense too be intelligible, but you should be drawing lightly in the first place

literally do this right now

[Anonymous No.3014855]

>>3014106
This one?

[Anonymous No.3014861]

Keep training, NO EXCUSE.
Draw, but don't just draw a lot, draw smarter...
Unless you're a complete brainlet, you CAN improve. And behaving like a pathetic drama queen won't help you to reach higher goals. Cheer up & forget all these "talent" excuses, the key, and you know it, lies in 2 words : Hard work!

[Anonymous No.3014898]

>do you believe artists are essentially honest people?

Categorically no.
The amount of bullshitting artists do to make their work seem effortless is transparent and pathetic.

>look at this 45 hour digital painting that I did
>it actually only took me 20 minutes

Yeah, sure it did champ.

[Anonymous No.3014901]

>>3014084
Some people practice wrong. Just repeating an action doesn't guarantee improvement.
>Accuracy is more important than "fundies"
>It's what makes your fundies and study worthwhile, otherwise you're wasting time.

[Anonymous No.3015022]

>>3014898
>Paint a serious piece
>"A quick sketch to start the day guys xD"
Every goddamn time

[Anonymous No.3015064]

>>3014817
>It seems like it's something so absolutely fundamental, that it is never explained.

Read Keys to Drawing, the chapter explaining Sighting.

Then read that picture, it explains how to enclose the picture in a bigger, more primitive shape (the "enveloppe") and from there to refine with correct proportions.

[Anonymous No.3015328]

>>3014084
The root of the problem is that they just don't know how to get gud, they never had the right opportunities that gave them the experiences that would put them on the path to learning.

The reason why that is, is that beginners often have backwards values, and tend hold on to the things that hold them back. For example: "lol xd using reference feels like cheating" or "I don't care to learn how to draw the body, I just want to learn the face", or they do bad practices like tracing, or watching yt tutorials on how to "draw an anime face in 12 easy steps!"

They fall into a pitfall and because they don't realize they are in one, never try to get out. They just assume hey this is it, this is what art is like. They never taste the satisfaction of improvement, they don't know they joy of making something that actually looks good or of higher quality, even if it's with reference or a copy.

[Anonymous No.3015335]

>>3015328
/thread

[Anonymous No.3017269]

>>3015064
Hi, anon! Sighting, I'm familiar with, and I need to be better about using it, but this envelope thing is fucking fantastic! It's the missing step in every drawing book right before "draw this circle"! I drew a face that wasn't total dog shit! I mean, it wasn't good. I need to practice a lot, but it had the proportions of a human head!

[Anonymous No.3017500]

>>3015328
Similar to this, I think one of the issues is that a lot of people understate the importance of instruction. There's a lot of emphasis put on trying hard and practicing to improve, but if I locked you in a room with a book that's in Chinese and told you to translate it, no amount of work or effort will get you anywhere unless you have some proper instruction to begin with.

[Anonymous No.3017616]

>>3017500
This, I bought all the ic books but I just don't know where to start. I'm doing perspective now but do I just keep grinding those assignments? When do I stop and move on? I've been trying for years like OP's post but I need a teacher, but for that I would need to quit my job and move somewhere else.

[Anonymous No.3017622]

>>3014247
But they aren't manga artists who know how to draw basic structures outside of a dorito chin, hedgehog hair and bug eyes. Starting with any style with stunt you.

[Anonymous No.3017624]

>>3017616
Yeah an actual teacher does absolute wonders, even if they're no master themselves. Someone who can start you off to the point where you can make your own decisions in learning is key.

[Anonymous No.3017626]

>>3014836
DESU I think what might help him more is to understand how the object is broken down. What helped me a lot w figure drawing was seeing actual muscle and bone structure, same with houses and other items. A good tip I can give is to make the object out of clay first - once your hands and eyes know how it is build your ability to put it onto paper will increase - it should at least, maybe im just autistic.

[Anonymous No.3017629]

>>3014898
I do this because I'm scared that my work will seem like a sketch rather than a finished piece, I'll be honest. I know that it's completely all in my head, and is contributing to younger artists feeling worse about work they took time on but it's just irrational, I'm trying to change it. My old sketchbooks used to say "under 30m studies" in front of it in case anyone looked at it without my seeing them. It's a terrible habit born out of insecurity due to other artists doing the same thing. There are some people who can do truly beautiful and dynamic 5 minute gestural studies with feasible mass but they're rare - first step towards stopping this mentality is to own up to it publically I guess - thanks for the kick of self awareness I needed to do so.

I'll try to find security in my hour long poses and landscapes as they are — long studies I've learned from and not some offshoot passive shit scribble I did on the toilet.