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/ic/ - Artwork/Critique


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2285243 No.2285243 [Reply] [Original]

help me out here /ic/

>>which is better for create art ( Photoshop or on Manga studio)?
>>im a new here soo sorry for this stupid question

>> No.2285346

>>2285243
photoshop is for editing photos.... thats like using flash to animate.

true, the tools are broad enough that you COULD do it, but there are better suited programs to say the least...

im of the opinion that you shouldnt use commercial software when quality fos alternatives exist... of which there are plenty when it comes to drawing software.

to name a few: "Krita", "MyPaint", "Paint.Net", "GIMP"

>> No.2285367

>>2285346
>photoshop is for editing photos.... thats like using flash to animate.

You're so fucking wrong it makes me slightly sick.

>> No.2285371

>>2285367
don't ruin it, OP will probably buy it

>> No.2285382

i used to have manga studio but then my laptop exploded so i decided to go open source.
honestly kritas the best!! once you get used to it, its even better than manga studio imo. mypaint is good too but its too laggy for me

>> No.2285384

>>2285367
im not saying you cant, or even that the drawing tools on photoshop are bad by any stretch ... its just really not what it is explicitly intended for.

There are better programs, thats no lie.

>> No.2285389

>>2285384
If that's true then why do the majority of high level artists/ pros use photoshop? It's not like they're choosing to battle with an inferior program, which is pretty much what you're suggesting.

>> No.2285392

>>2285384
>>2285389
>>2285382
guys thanks

>> No.2285398

>>2285389
the same reason flash has come to be prevalent within vector animation. once something becomes the standard, its hard to dethrone it.

alot of professional artists have gotten used to the workflow of photoshop and have no reason to change - but for someone who has no prior experience with photoshop it doesnt make sense to chose that over a dedicated drawing program.

In the end, it wont really matter much what program you choose as they wont draw the picture for you - but if you ask me its hard to not recommend something like krita over photoshop... its free, its open source, its a dedicated drawing program with all functionalities purposefully created for that purpose rather than being an afterthought in a primarly photo editing software... aka less bloated.

try a free trial of photoshop and compare it with krita and see which you prefer by all means - the important thing is to pick one and stick with it.

>> No.2285402

>>2285389
if that's your only reason for choosing photoshop, you best be quitting art.

>> No.2285409

>>2285402
I don't remember saying I used Photoshop.

>> No.2285410

>>2285398
So you'd recommend Krita over any of the other programs like MS or SAI?

>> No.2285420

>>2285409
then don't quit art and pat yourself in the back.

>> No.2285511

>If that's true then why do the majority of high level artists/ pros use photoshop?

reminds me of the retard who insist on using Zebra G pens to draw because all japanese comic artists use the bullshit dip pen

>> No.2285512

>>2285243
Manga studio's ruler and perspective tools are god-like, seriously amazing. I'd kill for tools like that in PS

>> No.2285513

>>2285389
>this argument again

NASA uses macs. Would you use a mac?

>> No.2285591

>>2285410
i havent used manga studio or sai so i couldnt recommend it over them sorry!

they're probably both good!?!?

>> No.2285621

Fervent user of Clip Studio Paint here.
(Manga Studio is a localised version of CSP right?)

I like the brush engine and stabilisers, plus the materials and shit that comes with EX makes drawing a breeze, especially with the 3D models you can throw in and pose on the canvas itself.

Though, the colours aren't as great as what you'll achieve in photoshop, but it does a lot of things right. Imo, it's a mixture of SAI, Photoshop and a 3D software in one.

Sai, on the other hand, is the best software to get started and acquainted with digital media.

>> No.2285633

>>2285398
this isn't /g/ dude no need to act like a freetard

>> No.2285701

>>2285633
open source is ideal... im not saying to put up with a lesser quality program just because its open source, but in situations where viable fos alternatives exist to commercial software theres no reason not to use them ... and drawing software is one of those situations.

The only reason not to use one of the fos drawing programs is that youre already used to the work flow of a paid program.

>> No.2285710

Only use manga studio if you know how to professionally ink comics like those japs because it speeds up their workflow (and making comics in general). Don't be a friggin waaboo by using it otherwise. Look at this shit this guy said
>>2285621
>especially with the 3D models you can....
I thought we were learning how to <DRAW> here not be a one trick pony hack.

>> No.2285727

>>2285710
What would you recommend, then?

>> No.2285732

just use any of them, the program it's the least important

>> No.2285826

>>2285732
Sure, but the whole point of the thread is to discuss which best suits our needs. "Just use any of them" is such a worthless comment.

>> No.2285843

>>2285701
>open source is ideal
Top kek. That gave me a giggle mate. I stopped reading there.

>> No.2285934

>>2285710
theres nothing wrong with convenience features like posable 3D reference models.. sure you shouldnt rely on them, but in the end its not about how you arrive at the end result of a drawing, but the quality of the work.

anything that allows you to make a better drawing in a faster timeframe is by no means "wrong"... especially when youre using manga studio for its intended purpose of making comics.

if youre making full length comics, anything that let you quickly test a pose is epic.

>> No.2285951

>>2285934
Crutches are crutches, anon. I don't know how it's convenient when in the timeframe it takes you to set up a 3D model you would already have a draft of your pose in a minute. The folks at Smithmicro would love to offer you a position to work for them in their marketing department. People who rely on 3D crutches don't know they need to understand the limitations of the body and end up breaking the 3D models posture. They don't look up the believability of how a person interacts with everyday objects/environment and so their drawing suffers regardless. And when using a 3D model they completely forget about the gesture so it becomes still as the draw the contour that is already there.

It's better to look at a photobook that has life in it in my opinion. Now obviously you can to use 3D for more complex things like backgrounds, but knowledge of perspective needs to be present.

>> No.2285963

>>2285951
"gesture" doesnt exist, so thats your first mistake - if you truly believed in technical drawing you would admit that as a concept its a load of crock.

theres nothing to say about it other than it simply doesnt exist - its stone soup... medicine water... a vial of snake oil.

its a bullshit critique that for some reason the "know-nots" on /ic/ have taken a fancy to as their go to pretentious spew line.

if you believe that 3D can be advantageous as a reference when it comes to backgrounds, theres no reason that the same references cant be used for humans as well. 3D forms are 3D forms.

>> No.2285966

>>2285951
>>2285963
as a side note, would you assume a drunk driver slamming his around a cars controls is the default state of driving a car?

no, so why assume the worst out of using a 3D CGI reference model.

>> No.2285975
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2285975

>>2285963
>"gesture" doesnt exist, so thats your first mistake - if you truly believed in technical drawing you would admit that as a concept its a load of crock.

Someone simply just couldn't graduate feel school. It's okay bro not everyone is able to wield the ability of the flow.
>if you believe that 3D can be advantageous as a reference when it comes to backgrounds, theres no reason that the same references cant be used for humans as well. 3D forms are 3D forms.

Backgrounds nobody really cares about/people spend on average less than 30 seconds on each panel. It's there to fill in the gaps. Tite Kubo got away with barely any backgrounds so guess what was most important....that's right, the characters. Do you really think Tite Kubo used a 3D model for every little thing he drew? Do you think that Tite Kubo does not do gesture drawing to draw impact fight scenes?

You can run away from the fundamentals anon but you'll always be a hack.

>> No.2285979
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2285979

>>2285975
are you joking right now? you literally just scribbled on the page.

I can do that as well bud... do you not understand that gesture is literally garbage that has no bearing on an images outcome - its the zodiac calender of drawing.

>> No.2285983

>>2285963

I would absolutely love to see your work right now, I guarantee it's completely lifeless. The point of gesture isn't to perfectly replicate real humans, it's meant to push poses beyond what you're likely to see in real life and make them read better.

Of course it doesn't fucking "exist", it's an absract concept but that doesn't mean it isn't useful. Are you trying to say that the entirety of philosophy on literally any topic is "stone soup" and worthless because you can't autistically tie it directly to the physical world? Are you literally retarded?

>> No.2285991

>>2285979
It's called visual language. If you don't know that and its importance then I can conclude I'm speaking to a complete and utter moron.


>I can do that as well bud... do you not understand that gesture is literally garbage that has no bearing on an images outcome

Gesture is a tool to draw from imagination, noob. A tool for experimentation and planning.

>> No.2285993

>>2285991
>noob
>bleach
>not even posting a good example of gesture

stop embarassing everyone

>> No.2285996

>>2285993

I don't want to waste my epic insults on you and drag this thread to 200+ replies in yet another debate about X that will go nowhere nor change your outlook.

If it's a fight you're looking for you know where to find me.

>> No.2285997
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2285997

>>2285983
you tie merit to philosophy as well? well i guess that partially explains it...

anyway, youre wrong about the point of gesture, its a false fundamental that has little relevance even in its intended purpose. the same fluidity that can be found in "gesture drawings" can just as easily be found by confident linework. an "understanding" of gesture isnt even a benign error or a misabstraction - it is actually incredibly toxic to progress as an artist is it obscures the truth of reality and the poses of a form, its arbitrary guesswork at best.

>> No.2286005
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2286005

>>2285997
I don't think anyone has ever suggested attempting gesture drawing without first having a solid handle on the other fundamentals. Yes, people abuse it and use it as a crutch to hide their lack of understanding in other areas, but what you're saying here is a straw man. I'm not claiming that it's a necessity for a good drawing, I'm saying that it has a place in art and isn't totally worthless as you seem to think.

>> No.2286236

>>2285346
>photoshop is for editing photos.... thats like using flash to animate.
Why live?