Art Jobs

[Anonymous No.2180925]

Does anyone here have a job doing art, like Graphic design, illustration, game design, interior design, mixed media?

I'm interested in the art career field but I don't know how to go about it, I know most places require you to have some sort of degree, I'm just about to start community college, how can I get a glimpse into an art related career field?

[Anonymous No.2180937]

>>2180925
I'm a fulltime freelance illustrator/concept artist.

>I know most places require you to have some sort of degree

Noone gives a crap about what degree you have, all that matters is your portfolio and reputation. The only situation in which someone would ask about your credentials and could be possibly dissapointed if you didnt finish art school is if you wanted to teach somewhere. Or if you manage to find some super oldschool studio that requires artists to have a degree (I dont know of any).

[Anonymous No.2180942]

>>2180937
That clears some misconceptions I've been told

As a full time freelance artist do you look for work or do people come to you?

I know that most artists struggle to make ends meet, is it the same for you?

Did you go to a fancy art school?

[Anonymous No.2180956]

>>2180937
Yup, I also have worked freelance for a living (though right now I have a studio job) and what this anon says is correct. I don't have a degree and have been fine. There is one other scenario where a degree comes into play though, and that's for getting work visas to go to other countries, like if you don't live in the US.

To answer OP's questions:

1) Mostly it is approaching clients, but eventually you get to the point where they will start contacting you as well.

2) Yes it is often a struggle. It requires constant effort to maintain a good flow of clients, and sometimes you have either no work or too much work. Overall the pay is not typically that great compared to other fields when you look at the level of training you need to have undergone.

3) No, I dropped out of art school.

[Anonymous No.2180957]

>>2180956
Forgot to add on to this and say that while not necessary, a good art school can still provide you with connections and learning opportunities that you would otherwise miss out on. But this is only for the top schools really, I wouldn't waste my time or money on anything less.

[Anonymous No.2180961]

>>2180956
Where do you find clients to approach? I have no idea where to look.

[Anonymous No.2180963]

>>2180961
furaffinity

[Anonymous No.2180964]

>>2180961
Kek not >>2180963 that's just some troll. I look through artists' CVs and artworks that they post logos of the companies--see what companies people are working for and then go to their sites and find their emails. You can also check art forums for job postings.

[Anonymous No.2180972]

>>2180964
What kind of e-mail should I send them? I tried this

>Hi! few things to start off with =] 1. yes I sent you an e-mail because you're a company that buys drawings, 'tis an awesome thing to see! 2. I'm Brian. 3. Don't be intimidated, but I'm not a stereotypical artist. If anything, I'll be the one ditching my own work.

[Anonymous No.2180978]

>>2180972

is this for real? or are you trolling hard as fuck right now? because if you honestly send that, you are obviously a combination of the following

a) dumb as shit
b) 13 years old
c) a complete moron
d) mentally retarded

[Anonymous No.2180981]

>>2180972
Consider suicide.

[Anonymous No.2180984]

>>2180925
You don't need a degree for most art careers

[Anonymous No.2180987]

>>2180925

For a studio job

1. git gud
2. git gud
3. get a degree (any) as long as it's not a joke degree that gets you laughed at (eg. psychology)
4. git gud
5. apply with a CV and folio


For freelance

1. git gud
2. suck dicks
3. draw favour of the month fan art on tumblr
4. suck some more dicks on facebook and normalfag social networks
5. open up goytreon

[Anonymous No.2180995]

>>2180987
>get a degree
Nope.

[Anonymous No.2181061]

>>2180978
>>2180981
new as fuck

[Anonymous No.2181086]

>>2181061
I'm here since 2009.

[Anonymous No.2181105]

>>2180972

Holy fuck. Are you retarded? I'm asking seriously, because it sounds like you need a second hand to guide you through your fuck-up.

[Anonymous No.2181107]

>>2181061
Not everybody starts on /b/ my friend

[Anonymous No.2181109]

>>2180987

Why will I need a degree not related to art?

[Anonymous No.2181113]

>>2181109
To make your parents happy.

[Anonymous No.2181114]

>>2180972

n-nice bait.. c-c-cant fool me.

[Anonymous No.2181116]

>>2180972
>>>/out/

[Anonymous No.2181151]

>>2180956
>getting work visas to go to other countries, like if you don't live in the US.
Marko Djurdjevic moved to the US to work with Massive Black and as far as I know he has no degree.
So it is still possible, if you have a Job offer?

[Anonymous No.2181297]

>>2181109
>>2180995

because despite as much of a scam higher education is, proper studios value the skills brought on by studying and graduating at an institute that is not directly related to the job. These are called soft skills and they include everything from basic literacy, communication and teamwork; all of which you will need if you want to work within an actual company.

Unless you have previous work experience, good luck getting into a studio without a credible degree of some sort. Nobody wants to hire a sperg even if they have a good folio

[Anonymous No.2181301]

>>2181151
Yeah if you have enough experience then it counts as equivalent. But I missed out on a job opportunity like a year ago when a studio wanted me but I didn't have a degree or enough years freelancing. In any case it makes it much easier to get the visa if you have a degree.

[Anonymous No.2181335]

>>2181297
>the skills brought on by studying and graduating at an institute that is not directly related to the job. These are called soft skills and they include everything from basic literacy, communication and teamwork
>basic literacy
This is something you get out of high school, you don't need a university degree.
>communication
And what does this have to do with getting a degree? Do you consider passing a dozen oral exams "communication"? You can pass most oral tests by simply repeating whatever you've read in a book, it's nothing like the "communication" skills that are employers would like you to have.
>teamwork
At this point I seriously doubt you even stepped into a university. You clearly don't know what you're talking about.

[Anonymous No.2181355]

>>2180987
K, so im studying Chemical Engineering but also love doing art would prefer a studio job. If I build up a portfolio which is good will I be able to get a studio job quite easily. Also, another question, what is a 'studio job' and what industries requires guys to be drawing all the time- marketing companies? Game designers?

Finally... I only work in analog form atm (Pen and paint), is digital art a requirement/must for modern studio jobs?

Very basic questions I know, but I have a very basic knowledge of the art industry but would love a job where I can draw for a living.

[Anonymous No.2181385]

I have a question but I don't wanna start a new thread.

I want to pursue more art related fields, but I'm working full time. Should i:
A) work a less stressful job and get gud
B) pursue something like industrial design

I wanna do more creative work but I also want a career

[Anonymous No.2181393]

>>2180972
>2. I'm Brian. 3. Don't be intimidated, but I'm not a stereotypical artist.

[Anonymous No.2181418]

>>2180925
SOMEONE FUCKING PIN IT TO THE FUCKING STICKY. We get those stupid college threads all the time. No you don't need a degree, but it doesn't hurt if you can get one. I am a full time freelance artist too and the only time clients asked about my degree, they were even more impressed with me since I am very driven and capable of studying on my own.

[Anonymous No.2181422]

>>2180972
>'tis
Maximum cringe

[Anonymous No.2181425]

>>2181422
>>2181393
>not recognizing the pasta this came from

[Anonymous No.2181458]

>>2181335
It seems like you're the one who has never stepped into a university classroom. Making it through 4 years of deadlines writing papers about shit you don't care about with total strangers says a lot, especially if you haven't had a job where you had to communicate on a professional level with other college graduates.

[Anonymous No.2181464]

>>2180972
nice

[Anonymous No.2181468]

>>2180987
so this for freelance...

[Anonymous No.2181495]

>>2181385
any thoughts on this

[Anonymous No.2181513]

>>2181385

depends on so many factors man. i'll tell you this though. in order to live a satisfying life as a professional artist, and make an amout of money that allows you to eventually raise a family and send your kids to uni, you need to work extremely... extreeemely fucking hard. both on becoming technically good and on building your brand, self promotion, establishing relationships, etc. the amount of effort it takes is pretty ridiculous. because of that i generally feel like discouraging people from pursuing art as a career. if i had known 'back then' what i know right now, i would have never dropped out of uni.

it might still turn out to have been worth it, when i'm making a good living working at some game company in a couple of years. who knows. at this very moment though, the decision to become an artist looks like a real fucking stupid one.

[Anonymous No.2181519]

>>2181385
Industrial design is extremely stressing

[Anonymous No.2181758]

>>2180972
T-thanks ;_;

[Anonymous No.2181877]

>>2180972
Kek

[Anonymous No.2181883]

>>2181513
how long have you been working as a professional artist?
could you post an example of your work?

[Anonymous No.2181895]

>>2181513
I think you've been listening to too many facebook and youtube artists.

There are hundreds/thousands of hard working artists out there who don't invest major portions of time promoting themselves (some don't do it at all) and building a brand. Lots of these artists you've never heard of and they make a healthy living doing art.

They're able to do it because the time they do spend working is spent drawing/painting/studying and improving their portfolio, the product they sell. Relationships are made through doing actual jobs like any other job. You're not going to go on facebook and friend an AD that works at wizard and get jobs through that. Spending time in art communities online is great for getting your name out there and meeting other artists but the vast majority of employers who will hire you don't look at that shit and wont find you from there. You actually have to go out and approach the companies yourself, find AD's contact info and send them your portfolio. Your facebook art friends wont keep you employed.

Being a working artist is hard, but in this day and age getting a job that provides enough to raise a family is not simple task either. You'd be working just as hard, just as long hours to make ends meet and show your employers they should fire the other guy not you. Don't live your life thinking anything other than art is some "easy street". That'll just make you want to do art less.

[Anonymous No.2181903]

>>2180937
Post your work. I'm curious as to what degree of professionalism are you speaking from.

[Anonymous No.2181922]

>>2181903
That's common knowledge. I'm not that anon, but I work as an editor who contracts art and I don't care and no one I have talked to does either. No one even thinks about it. They're looking for art that matches what they want and comes with good word of mouth.

If it came up as it does with journalists and on rare occasion, talented writers, it would matter which school you went to and most people in the field who actually have a degree have it from a shitty community college or state school art program. The ones with fancy degrees either don't work because their parents are rich, or teach because that's who cares about degrees over results in the real world.

On the graphic design side, you see more degrees, but not necessarily because editors are asking for them. It's usually about two of the three P's: portfolio and personality. In a self contained company, I couldn't really comment.

[Anonymous No.2181925]

>>2181513
>send your kids to uni
1000€/month is a money surplus achievable through fucking porn commissions mate.
Oh wait, you live in the land of "freedom to be robbed". I'm so sorry.

[Anonymous No.2181932]

>>2181458
>It seems like you're the one who has never stepped into a university classroom.
Dude what are you even talking about? What alien classrooms have you been to? Explain to me how a math or history class would improve your teamwork. Or your "communication" skills. Because the ones I've been to certainly didn't. I guess it might be something which happens in joke classes like women studies though. Or is it American education? I hear something similar happens in American high schools, where students "discuss" arguments with their professors all the time instead of learning anything.
>Making it through 4 years of deadlines writing papers about shit you don't care about
>about shit you don't care about
Seriously what are you talking about...
>especially if you haven't had a job where you had to communicate on a professional level with other college graduates.
Your point was that you learn this shit at a university, not during your job which follows your graduation. Of course you're going to learn how to do your job if you do your job. That's called experience, not having a degree. Jesus Christ you're a special kind of retard aren't you?

[Anonymous No.2181934]

>>2181922
>It's usually about two of the three P's: portfolio and personality

The other P being penis size?

[Anonymous No.2181935]

>>2181925
Can you really make that much drawing just porn? As a third worlder I'm extremely interested, a few questions though:

How many hours a week are expected?
Is it a must to get into furshit?

[Anonymous No.2181939]

>>2181935
It all depends on how big your fanbase is. Which in turns depends on how much degenerate shit you're willing to draw, and your skill. It's certainly a most viable way to support yourself if you're from some shithole, like that guy from cambodia or something who could survive on a couple of 10$ sketches a week and make more than a random clerk.

[Anonymous No.2181940]

>>2181939

I'm from a first world shithole (Harlem)

how viable is this for me? Willing to draw practically anything save for scat.

[Anonymous No.2181945]

>>2181939
How do you get popular? Spam drawthreads on /v/ and /a/, set a tumblr, start to follow and reblog loads of shit, samefag like mad, and then set comissions up?

[Anonymous No.2181949]

>>2181940
I'm not from Burgerland so I don't know. But there are porn artists who make a meager first world living out of their job. Lots of them charge up to 200$ for illustrations, some even more. Even though it's not as high a wage as a proper company would pay, you can quite clearly make a living out of it pretty much anywhere. This is assuming you budget and don't splurge by going out to eat at restaurants or something. And if you still can't afford to live where you live, you should probably just relocate.
It also depends on your skill, how fast you are. If it takes you one month to do a 200$ illustration, then you're out of luck. If you can churn them out daily (and have the fanbase for them), you're rich. Not that this later option is feasible, but yeah you get the point: skill matters.

[Anonymous No.2181973]

>>2181934
No comment :^

[Anonymous No.2182000]

>>2181513

I'm in a similar situation, started the path of becoming an artist a while ago, has caused a lot of heartache.

Right now I'm in a decent place working part time and have enough time to practice 3-4 hours a day at least.

It seems a lot of effort to get a job that will only make like 30 k a year unless your a concept artist at a triple a studio. I can't really see myself doing anything else however, I tried just working a normal job and coming home to video games 6 hours a day and its shit.

[Anonymous No.2182001]

>>2181940
It's decent supplemental income if you have the following and are in the right niche where competition is either low or shitty but demand is high. It's all about how fast you work and what your pricing is. Sketches and portraits can make the most money if you're quick at brainstorming and composing, but full color illustrations are money in the bank if you have a speedy workflow.

[Anonymous No.2182017]

>>2181519
What about graphic design?

[Anonymous No.2182153]

>>2182017
Same

[Anonymous No.2182160]

>>2181425
It's not pasta it's an actual thing a guy on Xbox live sent to a girl or someone he thought was a girl.

[Anonymous No.2182167]

>>2181513
>if i had known 'back then' what i know right now, i would have never dropped out of uni.

hahaha, are you me? I rarely come here any more, but I used to always bite back the urge to discourage people who are just getting into this field from pursuing it. I know everyone here is 20 years old and super confident that they're gonna make it, just like I used to be... but I really, really wish I'd listened to the old pro who I saw on CA years and years ago who said that "if you have any other career options open to you, do not become an artist." He was fucking right, and I ignored him because I was a dumb kid, just like the dumb kids here will ignore you and me and tell us that we're just bitter and they're going to be rock stars.

It's not a good career. It's just not. Any joy you get from painting for a living will be utterly subsumed in the stress of trying to stay afloat. I wish I'd gotten some safe, boring job that I can put 40 hours a week into and be done. This "follow your dreams" culture we have in America is a big part of the reason so many people are living with their parents until they're 30 and working as waiters and baristas.

And the art scene is only getting more competitive. Kids getting into it today will have to compete with Indonesians for whom 3$ an hour is a livable wage even more than you or I do now. Drawing/painting is looking more and more like it's on its way out everywhere, to be replaced by 3d concepting programs that anyone can learn to use. DAZ and that shit is just the beginning - that software is going to become phenomenal in the next few years. The competition in the next 10-15 years is going to go through the roof.

But nobody listens to this stuff until they experience it for themselves.

[Anonymous No.2182190]

>>2181385
Just be warned that if you go into a creative job you will probably spend less of your free time creating your shit and more of it working on client shit. I worked as a low level graphic designer and I hated working on client work instead of my own. I went back to school and got a degree in Electrical Engineering. I now work in the oil fields 2 weeks on 2 weeks off. I spend all my off time drawing, drinking, and max relaxin. I am happier with this than I was clocking in and out doing graphic design.

[Anonymous No.2182203]

I've worked in graphic design most of my adult life..
Got ripped off a few times working for dirt. IT'S HARD WORK TOO. Just jobs and grinding day after day are nightmares to me. It's why I hate life in it's current state. I'm a 100% marxist now and think capitalism strips you of who you are and the bourgeois exploit the fuck out you.

I made $10/hour and did my project usually in half the time it said on the work order.
My BOSS/slave owner charged them $50/hour so he made $100 an hour off of me.
He has about 10 of us working like this.
He lives in a $2 million dollar custom house, I can barely afford to eat and get to work.

Fuck this system of exploitation.
After I quit working for him he had a dozen of workers lines up to replace me. That was 10 years ago, it's worse now. Luckily I found better work but I did that for years.

tl;dr It's all fucked now

[Anonymous No.2182207]

>>2182203
It's all your fault for not stealing all his employees, clients and burning down his house.

[Anonymous No.2182215]

>>2182207

Not the anon you're responding to but the company i'm working for had me sign a contract that protects them from me stealing their clients.

[Anonymous No.2182218]

>>2180972
Pls be real

[Anonymous No.2182230]

>>2182203

sounds like you need to open your own studio.

>>2182167

yeah, fuck. i'm too far down the rabbithole to quit though, and too old to go get an useful degree. if i were to do that it would mean 6-8 years of working nights and weekends while studying for college. i don't have the strenght for that.

any chance you could link to that CA.org post? fucking depressing thread got depressing. i wish i could still believe guys like this >>2181895 who make it all sound so rosey. and to be honest i secretly still have hope that i end up finding it all to be worthwhile. it has to be. i don't want to have to kill myself. a lot of artists who claim to be doing quite well for themselves say a lot of good things about their careers and the industry... and i just have no fucking clue where that shit is coming from.

[Anonymous No.2182232]

>>2182215
My local scene is a bit of a madhouse. Everyone around here is "unionized" and by that I mean anyone not paying their employees the going rate gets blacklisted by the community and has their name ruined. There is no company to sue for breach of contract when they get done. Scabs have their porn dug out of the corners of the internet and sent to clients. It's not usually as wicked as it sounds because most people have sense, but some have lost their companies and something may or may not have caught fire once or twice.

I don't know if graphic designers are just pussies and glad to even have a job, but in every other related field, hell pretty much every field, shit like that doesn't fly.

[Anonymous No.2182242]

>>2180925

Actually, Game Design is far from an Art Job.

It's way more about research and laying on paper every aspect of a game (in terms of rules)

To put it straight, being a Game designer is Writing a 50-500 pages book contaning everything about the game from the character abilities to the menu layout that no one will ever read and YOU have to keep track of what the other people in the production team are doing so you can tell if they're following what's in the book or not

(From a game designer with love)

[Anonymous No.2182253]

>>2182167

Please just don't tell me that you are deathhelm. Because if your work was actually total shit, your opinion is immediatly disqualified.

[Anonymous No.2182278]

>>2182167
> Drawing/painting is looking more and more like it's on its way out everywhere
You having a giggle m8?

[Anonymous No.2182283]

>>2182253
Of course his work is either shit or he fucked up in some other way. Why isn't tehmeh saying that? Why is he saying the exact opposite? Why is every decent pro ever saying the exact opposite?
>it's a conspiracy!
A conspiracy to get more competition... right makes total sense...
>it's a conspiracy to sell you their tutorials!
Many of them don't sell anything like that.

Yeah, whom are you going to believe, an anon on /ic/ or people who have shown you they actually have the skills needed to succeed?

[Anonymous No.2182302]

>>2181922
No it's not common knowledge it's called conjecture. And on top of that most of what you're saying is just popular talk, a fad way to talk about the business on the internet by people who have little understanding of what's going on in the real world for everybody else.

[Anonymous No.2182305]

>>2182283
>whom
just avoid this word if you don't know how to use it

[Anonymous No.2182320]

>>2182305
"Whom" is the object you cretin. "You" is the subject. It's correct.
>"You are going to believe X"
>"Whom you are going to believe"

[Anonymous No.2182324]

>>2182305
>American education

[Anonymous No.2182350]

>>2182283

A lot of these artists are making money selling tutorials to aspiring artists, it'd be bad for business if they told everyone the industry is going to shit.

I've also found that any realistic or cynical opinions about art are treated with a lot of hostility. Not on this board mind you but in general.

But one example is Craig Mullins which shit on the industry in his interview with schoolism I even think he said they'd have software that does everything for you but I honestly don't buy that.

I fall somewhere in the middle on the whole thing, yes the industry is definitely worse and will get worse until 3rd world countries standard of living gets on par with ours than I think we will start seeing a reversal where the industry improves.

I also think its totally possible to become a concept artist and make good money, you just have to be really persistent and be willing to sacrifice to become insanely good

[Anonymous No.2182362]

>>2182283

Hm not sure how this Tehmeh guy really is. However I also made sure to contact like 10 artists when I was still starting out, being very open about my fears etc and basically asking them the rudest question on earth. They all said something along the lines of 'The work is out there, there is enough of it and it's not going anywhere anytime soon. You just gotta get good'. This was many years ago however and right now I'm still trembling with fear every second of my life.

>Mullins says market is super crowded and rates are dropping
>Artstation founder says shit is looking bleak for artists
>Software making things easier for artists constantly
>Lots of depressed fellas who you can tell are afraid to speak openly because gotta keep up the appearance so the clients don't get turned off

[Anonymous No.2182365]

>>2182350
>>2182362
Craig Mullins is just bitter that his work is too "artsy" for the mainstream industry, he himself said he got "fired" multiple times because he failed to deliver what the clients expected, it's in his Sijun posts.

[Anonymous No.2182366]

>>2182320

le petit crouton

[Anonymous No.2182376]

>>2182350
>A lot of these artists are making money selling tutorials to aspiring artists
And a lot of them aren't. Actually Noah, one of those artists who is making a fortune out of doing just that, is one of the few who actually complained about the industry. And guess what, he isn't that good. Coincidence?

[Anonymous No.2182386]

>>2182362
>Artstation founder says shit is looking bleak for artists
Link? I hope he isn't basing his calculations on the job offers on his websites.
>go to artstation which is the "leading community for professional artists"
>check freelance work offers
>7 results

[Anonymous No.2182391]

>>2182376

Noah has complained about industry rates and such, but overall is isn't cynical. I've never heard him say the industry is dieing or anything.

He's also fairly good at what he's know for which is environment illustration, I know ic hates him for whatever reason but he is a good landscape illustrator at he very least.

>>2182365

I never knew that, but its still an example against good artists not complaining about the industry. While keeping in mind whats good has been a rising standard for a while now.


Anyways I don't think anyone can deny that the industry has been getting worse, look at old mtg cards even the good ones were stuff that mid tier deviant art artists could do now and they would never get hired at fantasy flight, let alone mtg now a days.

I don't think we should be saying the industry is shit and dying or anything, but at the same be realistic about how much hard work and sacrifice it takes to become a successful professional artist.

[Anonymous No.2182408]

>>2182391
>Noah has complained
>ic hates him

That about sums it the fuck up. Noah whines a lot and I hate him because he has really pushed this trend of these digital "art camps". His camp is actually fairly well run from the look of it, but a lot of his imitators don't run good ones. I also think that his ego is a little too big. That being said I am still a fan of his work and I really think a lot of the hate he gets is pretty undeserved.

>>2182350
>the industry is definitely worse and will get worse until 3rd world countries standard of living gets on par with ours

This is another one I hear a lot but I don't see it as being true. If you live in a big city (Seattle for me) and are able to meet with people face to face you have a lot better customer retention and word of mouth spreads around fast. A lot of the really awesome artists in China, Peru, whatever don't get the same level of word of mouth that you can generate if you meet with people. I just do graphic design and some UI/UX work for companies here and being able to meet with people made my freelancing a lot more successful.

[Anonymous No.2182438]

>>2182391
>He's also fairly good at what he's know for which is environment illustration....

Wut? Ic might hate him but that doesn't change the fact he's not that good at what he does, generic uninspired enviro. I also don't see a shit ton of environment only art being made which could be why he complains about jobs.

>Anyways I don't think anyone can deny that the industry has been getting worse, look at old mtg cards....
>......but at the same be realistic about how much hard work and sacrifice it takes to become a successful professional artist

Thats not getting worse you moron, thats standards getting higher. Just because your shit tier art isn't good enough to get a job doesn't mean less jobs exist, or those jobs pay less. The "industry" doesn't owe your entitled ass a job, you raise your level of skill to the industry standards and then you get work. Just because it takes a lot of work to get there doesn't mean you should be paid more or guaranteed a job. By the way people do make more now for MTG cards than they did in the old days so I'm not sure what your complaining about.

>ic talking like anyone here regularly works in "the industry" and by extension can give objective information on how bad it is.
lol

[Anonymous No.2182448]

>>2182408
>UI/UX work for companies

City where I live seems to have a ridiculous demand for this type of work. How do I go about securing a slice of that pie? Do I need coding skills for that or is it just visual design of interface 'images' ?

[Anonymous No.2182511]

>>2182448
Learn to code! That is the biggest step. I mostly do UX these days and you really don't have to code a lot as much as think about a site/app as how a user would, but being able to code really helps.

If you can code and make websites you can start to make shit for a portfolio. Get in with some non-profits and do some work for them so you have references. Learn all the buzzwords and hot trends in UI/UX and then make-up some bullshit apps so you can design UIs for them. The app doesn't have to function and the mock-ups for the UI can just be high resolution wireframes that don't do anything other than show proof of concept.

If you do all the stuff on code academy for web dev, and read some UI/UX blogs you can be trained for the job in six months. If you get lucky with your non-profits, and applications you can have a job in 8ish months total. Again that is like the best case most luck scenario I know of.

If you have the money TAKE CLASSES.https://www.codefellows.org/ has some good UX ones and they do a decent job helping you get a job. Universities also offer lots of programming night classes you could take as well.

[Anonymous No.2182528]

You fuckers deserve what you get. I've been saying for years that commoditification is going to rip the carpet right out from under you.

The entire time you shits have been clambering to make your shit look like the nexts guy's, hollering muh standards muh industry techniques, youve been moving closer and closer commodifing creativity. You people refuse to believe an artist should be paid for thier creativity and instead opt that artist should be paid on how well they can replicate another's procedure.

You artist deserve the poor house.

[Anonymous No.2182574]

>>2182528
>muh standards muh industry techniques
>implying industry standards weren't around when the old masters painted.

Holy shit take your filthy (you) and go back to reddit with your b8's

[Anonymous No.2182613]

>>2182574
Holy shit you're retarded and completely ignorant of history. The old masters didn't have universal standards. Thier procedures were top secret, that's how they stayed competitive. It was a guild system that used innovation and creativity to earn respect. Old master were experimenter. Thier work help others later to develop standards. But now all you retards do is repeat standards without contributing anything. You're an ungrateful bunch of little shits just looking to game the system without doing any real creative work.

[Anonymous No.2182616]

>>2182574
>implying industry standards weren't around when the old masters painted.
They certainly weren't around 20 years ago.

[Anonymous No.2182633]

>>2182616
So loomis, and da fundamentals are a new thing?

[Anonymous No.2182636]

>>2182408

I agree about noah for the most part.

I also agree that those who can meet face to face with clients have a huge advantage , but its clear outsourcing to the third world is still a huge thing.

>>2182438

I never said that I deserve a job or am entitled to one that's ridiculous.

But its objectively true that mtg pays less now than would have 10 years ago when adjusted for inflation, I'm pretty sure Noah has said they haven't even raised there rates in 15 years.

Also rising standards do mean that the industry is getting worse, rising standards means they have a bigger pool of artists to chose from and less jobs proportionally.

If they suddenly required you to be a junior chief to work at McDonalds with the same pay I'm pretty sure you'd say the fast food industry is getting worse , but suddenly when the standards are higher in art you just claim there entitled which isn't even an argument.

>implying you have to work in an industry in order to comment on how good or bad it is

[Anonymous No.2182648]

>>2180972
god, please dont be bait. fucking kek.

[Anonymous No.2182652]

>>2182633
As industry standards for what /ic/ wants to do? Yes. Pick up an old D&D book, old magic cards etc. see if those images would get accepted by WotC today. I don't remember which pro said it, but look even at Star Wars concepts and designs, see if Hollywood would consider them up to standard. Protip: they wouldn't.

[Anonymous No.2182654]

>>2182613
Someone is pooper peeved they got an art degree and all the "secrets" of art can be found freely online. You realize there were painters during the same time period as the old masters who were just there to make a buck right? Not all of them were trying to be immortalized forever and that a big part of why we have the old masters is because their works survived and the rest didn't? What is wrong with industry standards and developing a standard technique for digital painting? It's a standard for a reason you fucking nog. Go piss on cardboard and call it art if you want to be edgy and ignore the standards.

>>2182616
Because there were no art schools, or art books on sale 20 years ago :^) Digital art is a relatively new medium and so it has newer standards yes, but a lot of them are taken from pencil, and traditional painting. Some of them are entirely new to digital art.

[Anonymous No.2182666]

>>2182652
It's almost as if standards change over time. Loomis teaches the absolute basics of drawing and theory for drawing. Not "This is what you should be aiming to recreate 100% of the time with your art."

I think I am missing the point of your post anon.

[Anonymous No.2182676]

>>2182652
LoL has a style a lot of people emulate and some of them even end up playing with the big boys, lommis is nothing but the cinder blacks of your career.

[Anonymous No.2182691]

>>2182652
You're missing the point. The problem comes from a lack of creativity and innovation. The problem is that everything looks too similar. And on top of that you all do it the same way because you only think there is one way of doing something. The standard today is to copy those wizrd cards, appilbutt, hethcliffstone, tumblr nose, stepheny universe shits just like the other guy. That's your generations standards. Deal with the problems you made.

[Anonymous No.2182699]

>>2182636
>Also rising standards do mean that the industry is getting worse, rising standards means they have a bigger pool.....
It actually means the opposite. Higher standards means there are less people out there fitting the level of skill you need, you only hire the best of the best. You seem to be falsely equating high skill level with degrading job opportunities. Just because you cant get jobs with a low level of art doesn't mean the industry is going under, just that your lazy ass has to get better with the times.

>If they suddenly required you to be a junior chief to work at McDonalds with the same pay I'm pretty sure you'd say the fast food industry is getting worse ....
What? Equating MTG to a minimum wage job is retarded. People aren't paid minimum wage to work on MTG. If it takes you so long to finish a painting that you're working on minimum wages then we're back to you sucking again.

>implying you have to work in an industry in order to comment on how good or bad it is
Actually yeah, how the hell would you know what the ins and outs of the industry are without ever working in it? How could you truly know what the pay is, what jobs you can get and who's hiring unless your actually doing it? Your just regurgitating anecdotal statements by a handful of whiney artists. (who are mostly mediocre by pro standards)

>>2182691
Most companies don't gamble on untested shit. Thats why people "copy" work thats out there, changing there style a little here and there to be slightly different. No one is going to hire someone like picasso for an MtG cards because he's different and "innovative". You sound like someone too lazy to git gud and you're mad you'll never make it.

[Anonymous No.2182721]

>>2182691
I donno bro, but a lot of people develop their own style after they copy some style they like and do it often enough to see how the style actually works and what principles it pulls from to look cohesive and good, and then after you truly learn it you can have your own personal style develop. At least that is what most everyone says and what I have personally experienced.

[Anonymous No.2182747]

This whole thread is a big circle jerk for lazy assholes who don't have the motivation/discipline to make it, so they're trying to convince themselves there's no point in trying to feel good about giving up.

If you think the job market for art is shit then just keep it to yourself and give up on your dreams, no point in trying to stop other people from doing it. They'll find out on their own from personal experience if it cant be done. Personally I rather try and fail then take a few out of context remarks by frustrated artists and delude myself into giving up.

[Anonymous No.2182767]

>>2182302
>real world
>giving a fuck about degrees

[Anonymous No.2182779]

>>2182747
I didn't give up anon. :)

[Anonymous No.2182795]

>>2182699

>It actually means the opposite. Higher standards means there are less people out there fitting the level of skill you need, you only hire the best of the best. You seem to be falsely equating high skill level with degrading job opportunities. Just because you cant get jobs with a low level of art doesn't mean the industry is going under, just that your lazy ass has to get better with the times.

I never said once the industry is going under, I said its worse than what it was b4 your reading comprehension is complete shit.

Also companies don't "need" a certain calibur of art, quality is determined in context. Its only because theres a ton of really good artists compared tot he amount of jobs that there standards are so high now.

>What? Equating MTG to a minimum wage job is retarded. People aren't paid minimum wage to work on MTG. If it takes you so long to finish a painting that you're working on minimum wages then we're back to you sucking again.

Did you even pass highschool or are you retarded?

The point isn't that mtg is a minimum wage job, Its that higher standards and lower pay means the industry is worse than it was 15 years ago.

Your either deliberately misconstruing my points, which means your just a pompous dipshit or you have no reading comprehension.

>Actually yeah, how the hell would you know what the ins and outs of the industry are without ever working in it? How could you truly know what the pay is, what jobs you can get and who's hiring unless your actually doing it? Your just regurgitating anecdotal statements by a handful of whiney artists. (who are mostly mediocre by pro standards)

You ask artists who are actually in the industry and use data from employment statistics god your fucking dumb.

According to your standards we can't judge any field without personally being in it which is a fucking retarded idea with no basis in reality.

[Anonymous No.2182798]

>>2182747

You can be realistic about the industry while still aiming to someday be in it.

[Anonymous No.2182806]

>>2182747
>so they're trying to convince themselves

sounds like you're trying to convince YOUR self. Any time there's any thread that discusses the reality of making a living at this, one of the most competitive fields in the world, you retards get butthurt and lash out. You want it to be all Tony Robbins motivational hype, all the time.

newsflash: you're not doing yourself any favors lying to yourself. but nothing will convince you, so you'll keep lying to yourself until it becomes impossible to keep the lie going, at which point you'll want to warn people about how tough this field actually is, but people will tell you that you're just a lazy asshole who didn't have discipline.

[Anonymous No.2182819]

>>2182798
Being realistic isn't going on threads online shitting on other artists about how it's all pointless and don't bother. Nice try. lol

>>2182795
How can an industry that's larger than it's ever been, that pays more than it ever has been worse than before? You don't know shit about what your talking about. You havent asked any fucken aritsts your just pulling shit out of your ass. And I know are because you haven't said anything here that isn't either anecdotal or the same handful of repeated shit I've seen posted by a few artists around the web for years.

>According to your standards we can't judge any field without personally being in it which is a fucking retarded idea with no basis in reality

You can make generalizations about things and talk about them with out firsthand knowledge, sure. But going around saying the whole art market is shit and worse off than it was before would require some firsthand knowledge and a bit of experience before I'd take anything you say seriously. People are free to say as they like, but unless you have some firsthand knowledge about something what your spouting amounts to a pile of shit and I'm not required to believe you.

>>2182806
Who's convincing themselves? We all know how hard it is you moron. You think you're actually figuring something out no one else has? lol. No one is looking for Tony Robbins bullshit, I'm just calling out 14 year old morons like yourself who just spout off bullshit and try and act like they know whats up. Hah.

Sounds like you have some butthurt going on there, keeping track of all the threads like this one and getting mad at anyone who calls you out. Get over yourself dude, go study, oh wait you probably are one of those lazy assholes. Hard workers don't go to online forums to vent their frustration about how "it's hard, wahhh. It's so competitive...Wahhh." They just get shit done.

[Anonymous No.2182824]

>>2181934
>The other P being penis size?
"How's this for a portfolio?"
>flop it out like a limp zucchini
>gentle waterfall sounds ensue

[Anonymous No.2182826]

>>2181935
>>2181939
>>2181940
Sparrow.

[Anonymous No.2182863]

Op here... I've skimmed threw the comments and from what I've gathered... art jobs ain't shit

I think I'll just keep doing it as my hobby..

I have thought about becoming a High School Art teacher, high school kids are alright and teaching art is fun cause it's teaching kids to be creative, and creativity isn't wrong or right it's something anyone can enjoy

[Anonymous No.2182884]

>>2182863
You are best off getting a more stable reliable tech/trade job imo and doing art as a hobby/commission until you have a large enough following that you can self-sustain off of commissions from the community that you cultivated, small game companies, small industrial jobs, patreon, youtube, etc.

After doing that for a few years you can then start to approach bigger studios (Blizzard, EA, Valve, etc) and try to get a high paying career job. Just my two cents as someone who does UI/UX for a career and art as a hobby (I currently suck at digital painting)

[Anonymous No.2183058]

>>2180925

I'm doing an art test right now. A single asset, a little button for an interface. an illustration of an item. since the art director knows his shit they want to have a single artist do all the buttons. so they are unified in style and technique. i said i'd bill 2 hours, charged 60$, they paid immediatly zero fucks given. now i'm spending a little more time, 3-4 hours on it. to really do a good job. total workload is around 25 assets. they only asked for a mockup so i could reasonably bill 3 hours per polished asset. lets say i spend 4 hours though.

if i get the gig i'll be looking at 25*90$=2250$. for 100 hours of work. 22/h is really poor as a freelancer. Nonetheless it's money. And I'm also only just getting started.

[Anonymous No.2184414]

>>2181109
>Why will I need a degree not related to art?
Better chances of having decent work if you can't get a cushy art gig.

Also the vast majority of hiring managers and HR departments use software to sift through applications and resumes looking for keywords.

If you don't have a degree expect a 90% chance of your resume going in the garbage before a human eye even sees it.

The 10% chance of it not going in the garbage right away is if you already have an in with the company through networking or a friendship.

[Anonymous No.2184418]

>>2180978
Summer pls

[Anonymous No.2184421]

>>2181932
Not that anon but plenty of required gen eds involve group work.

Like Speech, Comm 1 and Comm 2, some of the required Social Science gen eds, and plenty of the different degree specific 3000 and up level classes involved discussion.

It's like you think dry as fuck lecture is the only way to learn.

[Anonymous No.2186116]

>>2180972
top kek