/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

[Anonymous No.1577686]

Anime/Manga/Cartooning Thread

"Drawing is very closely related to the other creative arts, all of which are outcroppings of a desire to express individual emotion, to make the other fellow conscious of our inner feelings" - Andrew Loomis

Try to keep calm, have a positive attitude and avoid making Kind Janitor-san angry!

A general message to aspiring artists: Don't ever think that you should stop attempting to learn how to draw because "it takes too long" or "drawing is just a hobby." Being shitty at your hobby is definitely not better than doing your hobby well, no matter what your laziness tells you. Have some dedication in what you love to do, damn it!

Submit your drawings, receive feedback or critique others! Share your knowledge and remember to thank those who've critiqued or red-lined your drawings. Most importantly, have fun.

[Insert genzoman comment here]

>Fresh off the boat? Read the fucking sticky!
http://www.squidoo.com/how-to-draw-learn
http://www.squidoo.com/w-ic-i
>Proko
http://www.proko.com/videos/
>Ctrl+Paint
http://ctrlpaint.com/
>Hitokaku Index
http://www.asahi-net.or.jp/~zm5s-nkmr/
>0033
http://www.pixiv.net/member_illust.php?id=59317
>List of active livestreams
http://livestreamstatuslist.appspot.com/
>fellowBro's books
http://mediafire.com/?i44dwzkf9j9n8
>Tutorial/Reference Collection
http://pinterest.com/characterdesigh/
>Japanese Animu Tutorials
http://iradukai.com/
>Figures
http://reference.sketchdaily.net/

Keep calm, take it easy and remember the words of our good friend Glen Vilppu: “No rules, just tools.”

[Anonymous No.1577691]

To me, animated characters don't have feelings.

I love it when animators draw setting/environment (Eden of the East), but when it comes to characters, it just embodies a certain type of shape and feel and some of the detail is left out.

This is why i hate animu...the qualities of the actual human beings are softened and the artiest just focuses on the eye, hair, and breast.

[Anonymous No.1577702]

[Anonymous No.1577703]

>>1577691

>To me, animated characters don't have feelings.

One of the hallmarks of good animation is the conveyance or outright exaggeration of emotion

That's nice dear. That's really nice you think that way.

>This is why i hate animu...the qualities of the actual human beings are softened and the artiest just focuses on the eye, hair, and breast.

Then stop watching shit anime

[Anonymous No.1577709]

>>1577691
That's the plot and development's problem, not the art style itself. Same way that characters in movies and cartoons can be shit too.

It's an easy way out for most character designers.

What of Otoyomegatari? Not animated but can convey feelings in context to the environment and not just what is necessary for the plot.

What I like about some movies and tv shows is that the little things that they put into the character's speech, demeanor, and dialog content which make's them more similar to people in real life and not just characters serving their purpose to only progress their plot.


That's the problem with a lot of media in general these days. You don't see much development or pacing, just a summary of what's supposed to happen in the plot.

Odd Thomas for example was a movie with great development to get you attached to the relationship between the main characters and you feel invested in watching it.

Anime plot as it is right now in general rely too much on cliche' tropes without trying to mix it up a bit. the Monogatari series were great though.


Expand your horizons and stop seeing anime and everything else on different standards. Genericism (i just made that word up but you know what i mean by it) is existent in both eastern and western media so just deal with it and develop your own tastes and learn to pick the ones you like instead of forcing yourself to watch shit that you hate and cry about it.

[Anonymous No.1577710]

>>1577703
Well opinion is just opinions and I do like animation overall as it can convey lots of meanings.

What sort of nonshit animation are you referring to?

Some of my favorites are CB, GWLTT, GITS, AG, gintama (comedic show that is just right), SC, HXH, etc.

still as an art work, they just seem to lack something

[Anonymous No.1577711]

Is Gunkiss the one doing those hideous sailor moon frame redraws or is it someone else

>Who the fuck is Gunkiss

Pic related

[Anonymous No.1577718]

How do you best avoid same face in the manga/cartoon you are working on? For instance I like pic related but it suffers from a bland same face -- I've tried exagerrated and stylising my own work more and more and it seems to be bringing better results. Has anyone else had this problem?

[Anonymous No.1577727]

>>1577718
almost impossible for artist imo. for some reason all there shit comes out looking the same or having very similar features.. probabbly has something to do with putting themselves as women when they draw.

[Anonymous No.1577733]

>>1577727
>>1577718
this is what I'm getting at. an actual face conveys so much. The flaws, the birthmarks, the wrinkles, color, the eyes.

anime, you can only do so much detail wise.

[Anonymous No.1577741]

>>1577733
Well dude, isn't it the same with cartoons too? I mean, I agree that "anime" art or semi-realistic drawings aren't as detailed as a realistic one, but it's not the point of it. There are some artists who can make characters who don't look the same, and there are others who can't. But I can totally understand what you mean; I can think of many artists that make always the same faces. Take for example most hentai authors.

[Anonymous No.1577742]

>>1577733
idealization and simplification anon

what you're referring to is regular budgeted anime which is okay but you have to consider the time constraints and resources and all that

it kinda spurred on a generation of art styles like that even in later mangas but some still keep true to attention in detail.

also, you'd see a lot more detail being put into BD versions of anime rather than the TV versions


again, birthmarks and wrinkles depend on the character designer, not the artstyle.

have you ever read Vinland Saga?

[Anonymous No.1577745]

>>1577741
but cartoons like futurama or southpark... it's different... to explain it it's tough since it's more of like this feeling rather than physical words

[Anonymous No.1577747]

>>1577733
>an actual face conveys so much
No it doesn't. It's like you are one of those people who think wrinkles on an old man photo convey his "feelings" or some shit. They don't. A man who has been through the war may very well look like one who hasn't, and vice versa.
Expressions conveys feelings, and facial structure may at most convey prejudiced impressions (A jew nose, nigger lips etc.). Expressions are present in most stylized forms too so your point is moot.

[Anonymous No.1577753]

>>1577745
I'll try to make a comparison. Take for example Futurama vs Avatar: The Last Airbender. I love both, but I think there are some big differences in the way they are animated. Same goes for anime. Avatar, for example, has some really beautiful choreographies and overall I find it richer in details. It's also true that the focus of these two cartoons are different.
It's the same for anime, I think. There are some anime that have generic drawings (To Aru saga, for example) and some others that are much more unique or better drawn overall (Ergo Proxy, Monogatari saga).

[Anonymous No.1577754]

>>1577753
I repeated myself a couple of times because painting but I hope the point is clear.

[Anonymous No.1577756]

>>1577747

just my opinions~~

alright then. On OP's picture, how can you tell if it's alive? An actual person? Is it a doll?

now I'm not talking about animation now because the show supplements the character.

standalone anime drawings just feel lifeless to me. Yes the artist can draw extremely well, but when it concerns people something is just off... shit it's though to explain.

I have no problem with mechas though. Shit mang.... gundams are like cocaine

[Anonymous No.1577758]

>>1577753
avatar is a masterpiece. Yes it's a children's show but the issues that the show deals with... the fact that a genocide occurred... It's basically WWII if you look at it closely in children format

[Anonymous No.1577759]

>>1577756
Your taste and opinion is shit.

[Anonymous No.1577762]

>>1577761
>generic
are you some kind of hipster.

[Anonymous No.1577761]

>>1577759
and yours generic.

[Anonymous No.1577764]

>>1577761
>generic
i think you need to look up what that means and look at yourself

[Anonymous No.1577763]

>>1577758
Yes, Avatar is amazing. I loved it, and it's absolutely something I'd recommend to anyone.

[Anonymous No.1577766]

>>1577756
you do realize that you are contradicting yourself right?

[Anonymous No.1577773]

>>1577764
>of relating to a certain class or group
pretty much what i meant.

>>1577762
nope, how am I a hipster? I love anime but just have an issue with a certain aspect of it. Just because someone says something against something, being counter to an "accepted" way of thought doesn't mean someone is hipster. Hell by your definition Copernicus was a fucking hipster and so was Martin Luther (not king jr)

[Anonymous No.1577777]

>>1577766
I'm a walking hypocrite. glad you noticed.

[Anonymous No.1577785]

[Anonymous No.1577797]

I've been working on my faces and I've found that the most crucial aspect to semi-unique looking faces is how the face is shaded/textured. It isn't enough to draw the base features. Easier said than done though.

[Anonymous No.1577814]

>>1577718
>How do you best avoid same face in the manga/cartoon you are working on?
Draw real faces, especially unusual ones instead of models all the time. Learn how faces are different, and how to exaggerate and stylize that. Then incorporate it into your character designs(Should this guy have a big/point/thin/hawkish/bulbous nose? ect.).
>>1577733
>The flaws, the birthmarks, the wrinkles,
These don't actually convey much. The first two nothing, and wrinkles only as a secondary to other features(that is, the movement of the face causes them to change position, but they don't do anything on their own) that everyone has anyways.
>color, the eyes.
Anime does these just fine. The whole point of the larger eyes is to better convey emotion since it's one of the primary non-verbal communicators.
>anime, you can only do so much detail wise.
Pic related. A lot of these are also really easy to tell what emotion they're feeling - even the simplistic ones like Lupin there or the girl from Katanagatari(farthest right, 5th down).
>>1577758
>avatar is a masterpiece.
Yeeeeah I'm gonna have to pretty firmly disagree with you there. The ending was a complete cop-out, that ended up feeling rushed because they spent so many episodes on the gang goofing off. It's the same kind of shit that puts me off Batman.

The rest of the show was alright but I wouldn't use it as an example of anything amazing. To be honest, I would put Avatar on the same level as Kamen Rider - they feature a lot of the same sort of tropes and characters and fightan' action.
>>1577756
It's called willing suspension of disbelief. Yours is broken for whatever reason in regards to anime.

[Anonymous No.1577822]

>>1577814
your right those are all kind of similar, except maybe dead leaves.

[Anonymous No.1577829]

>>1577822
>those are all kind of similar,
You're either blind or a troll.

[Anonymous No.1577836]

Currently working on a Halloween monster. I would like to thank the guy who posted that Japanese fur tutorial a few threads ago, I started using burn/dodge thanks to that. It's fun.

[Anonymous No.1577840]

>>1577814
lol I've watched all these anime you posted. Like i said, in animation it's different. The characters represent something and become a living embodiment.

The 8th square (this is something i'm not sure where it's from) jumps out way ore than the others do. Again I'm am trying my best to explain something that is more a feeling than actual physical descriptions.

basically what you're saying to me is "your nose is broken". You can't explain smell as well as you can in words.

and to me birthmarks and wrinkles and scars convery a lot to be as an individual. again this is subjective on how we live our lives and interact with people.

[Anonymous No.1577845]

>>1577814
This why i can't watch anime they all have the same exact syle/look for each character especially the females... that image just proves it sadly.

[Anonymous No.1577853]

>>1577845
get your eyes checked

[Anonymous No.1577856]

>>1577845
what

[Anonymous No.1577860]

>>1577836
you forgot to turn on the line/sketch layer, I can't really make out much from this. Except that the background color is hideous.

[Anonymous No.1577862]

>>1577829
>>1577845
>>1577853
He's talking about the style of the animation, not the level of detail or the different shapes and colors they use.

Lets take dragon ball for example. it's a great anime with simple animation. Now if you compare it with dragonball GT, of course it's different but it's still the same style, but added detail and correction to sizes and shapes.

You anon are the ones who are blind in the sense that you can't see other people's perspectives. (referring to the one's who calling out blind).

and making an argument against me is making an argument against yourself because I'm also on everyone's side.

[Anonymous No.1577863]

>>1577862
No, he's trying to stir up shit.
It's called bait and you all fell for it, now stop responding to stuff that isn't a drawing or a legit question.

[Anonymous No.1577864]

>>1577845
>exact same

Are you one of those people who also use the word "literally" when they describe something figuratively?

Like "I literally just shat my pants, those anime characters all have the exact same style!"

[Anonymous No.1577866]

>>1577864
perhaps i might be.

[Anonymous No.1577871]

>>1577863
how is it bait when I posted it?

[Anonymous No.1577870]

>>1577860
>you forgot to turn on the line/sketch layer

I have no idea what these are.

[Anonymous No.1577874]

>>1577870
wait so you are just select tooling everything and coloring?
That doesn't sound like a very solid way.

[Anonymous No.1577880]

>>1577864
i know people don't like that but i think it's fine. it's hyperbole, it's such an apt comparison that it literally transcends the figurative and becomes literal.

[Anonymous No.1577882]

>>1577862
>He's talking about the style of the animation
Then he's still wrong, especially considering that chart is mostly of exceptional directors.

[Anonymous No.1577892]

>>1577882
holy fuck... Okay yes there are styles associated that makes the animu different. I fucking knew fairy tale and rave master was drawn by the same guy. same with fucking summerwars and the girl who leapt through time. There are things that makes certain anime different.

But what I'm coming to is.... collectively they are a genre that is all recognizable as a japanese work. One won;t say futurama, disney, king of the hill, or southpark is a japanese animation (futurama was created by korean animation team).

Anon fucking look past all that shit. Look at an angle where you can see problems. And if you don't well fuck it, your perspective is as flexible as a rock.

[Anonymous No.1577900]

>>1577892
It seems like you lack fundamental knowledge about how Japanese animation is made.
Take a look at this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LLNHSrJoqFM

If you think the animation all look the same, you are either objectively wrong or have really shitty eyesight.

[Anonymous No.1577910]

>>1577900
>using my favorite scenes of the anime to make a point

wat? also naruto copied cb on the naruto neji fight

[Anonymous No.1577912]

>>1577910
You didn't even watch it did you?

Now shut up and watch the other parts so we can stop this meaningless discussion and draw.

[Anonymous No.1577921]

>>1577912
cowboy bebop the fight with the man who was sent to jupiter as a project

soul eater, first episode where they try to get the last soul and fight the witch to level up the weapon.

>4chan, not watching anime

[Anonymous No.1577924]

>>1577921
I'm not asking you to look at the scenes you dense fuck, but actually listening and trying to understand the fucking process behind it all.

[Anonymous No.1577954]

[Anonymous No.1578047]

>>1577892
>Okay yes there are styles associated that makes the animu different.
...which makes them visually distinct, which was the whole point of that chart. Thank you for agreeing.
>collectively they are a genre that is all recognizable as a japanese work.
Do you really think the uninitiated would look at a frame of Jin-Roh and instantly go 'that's Japanese? Not to mention Panty and Stocking nearly passes for American animation, as do others. And many anime don't even play into the visual tropes most commonly associated with anime(big eyes, small nose/mouth). Just as you wouldn't lump Archer in with Futurama stylistically, you wouldn't throw Kaiba and Vampire Hunter D:Bloodlust together. To say Kaiba looks like Vampire Hunter D looks like Sailor Moon looks like Ghost in the Shell looks like Legend of the Galactic Heroes looks like Panty and Stocking because they're Japanese is like saying that all American animation looks the same - that Archer looks like the Simpsons looks like Avatar looks like Billy and Mandy looks like Squidbillies. When in truth, Billy and Mandy hold way more in common visually with Panty and Stocking than Archer.
>futurama was created by korean animation team
Created? Animated, yes. Created? No. Unless Matt Groening has somehow become Korean retroactively.

[Anonymous No.1578094]

[Anonymous No.1578099]

>>1577924
i believe what he used was a strawman argument

[Anonymous No.1578361]

>>1578346
>traditionally manufactured
>not created

you should know that a lot of if not most of the animu being made are adaptations of popular (enough) works or ones that are being sponsored or payed to make.

if you want more diversity give money to the authors of the works you deem fit and/or buy their works instead of crying about how anime is "monotonous" or someshit.

your so called critique or evaluation of the anime/animation industry reeks of ignorance and entitlement and you should grow up and realize this is the real world and economy, money, social preferences, and popularity have actual weight upon you and not just getting bad internet rep or being trolled on tumblr.

[Anonymous No.1578346]

Animu does inherently have a problem of same-face-ness. Studios seem quick to be modish. But that's always been the case with mainstream. You see these long epochs of similar shows, with a rare gem hidden so often.

Maybe, that's why when someone tries to say anime has diversity, they cite work that is years apart and often went almost unnoticed. Well of course that stuff will be different! It wasn't the main stream. It's like that everywhere else.

But with Japanese and Korean studios it's like a plague. It leaves its mark culturally. Personally, I think it's cause of their cultures this happens. They don't like individualism, or at least they don't really understand it all that well. And with the tradition of segregating people and leaving social taboos unchallenged for the greater good, that all makes an extremely shallow gene pool for creativity. It's universally frowned upon to challenge things or to stir controversy. Any art that is strongly denied the ability of intimidating political or social dialogue eventually cycles into redundancy and monotony.

You can parade a "fashion show" of anime all you want, but there is no art in it. It's made to be modish. Lifeless when you think about it. It's not created, it's traditionally manufactured. It titillates on the surface, and that's it. (Which only begs questions at those who mimic and advocate animu customs.)

[Anonymous No.1578368]

>>1578351
>You talk like anime industry is like this big ass industry with unending resources for their animation but in reality it's not.

Not sure how you surmised that. But the entertainment markets aren't radically different nation to nation. It's despotism of financing. The money rolls in from advertisers, private interest, or government subsidy. Nothing strange their. So nobody here really needs to a professional with decades of experience to see the gist of what's going on.

>The anime industry has been at a decline
Markets ebb and flow, again nothing strange there either. But with the anime, looking at its exports there doesn't seem to be much diversifying, creativity wise, even when the market was said to be doing well.

>may not be always accepting of different art styles because of differentiating tastes
It's not about differentiating tastes, if it were you'd still see "different" things striving on the margins of the market and with it fans. But instead you get this cultism. Other "styles" aren't accepted because there are few there able to think outside the norms.

>story and plot which has little to do with the art itself
This is an asinine way of thinking, and misses the point. That makes style a needless thing. But since you already said nobody is willing to to take a risk on different styles, you're entailing it plays a vital part since everyone is playing safe with it. So I don't think you thought this through all that well. Besides, how can the presentation not effect, or not be affected by, the story? That's stupid.

[Anonymous No.1578369]

Aspiring manga drawer here. I haven't drawn much in my life and manga/anime looks like a fun and interesting place to get into drawing. How would one recommend I start?

Is it as simple as trying to copy characters from manga, as I have heard so many times before? Or is there a more structure based approach to it?

[Anonymous No.1578372]

>>1578369
Learn the fundamentals like with everything else, which will greatly help with simplifying things into the style you want to go for.
Also, learn Japanese. It's the only way you'll draw actual manga.

[Anonymous No.1578373]

>>1578372

Please. tell me about the "fundamentals" of manga drawing.

[Anonymous No.1578377]

>>1578373
I meant fundamentals of art in general.
Unless you want to pull an Araki and copy fashion magazines and your favorite manga until you get competent.

[Anonymous No.1578379]

>>1578377
Sure, whatever that is. I am not very good at drawing as it is. I have checked the "sticky" and found the first link to not be very helpful. The second link doesn't even do anything.

[Anonymous No.1578382]

[Anonymous No.1578384]

>>1578379
Basically, learn anatomy and color/value/etc. You can draw stylized things (cartoon, manga/anime, whatever) when you understand how things work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMUYG1hkY5c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBadnTAzQFc

[Anonymous No.1578385]

>>1578379
The links OP gave at the top are a good place to start. Go through them and then get to drawing, dude.

[Anonymous No.1578386]

>>1578368
>But the entertainment markets aren't radically different nation to nation.

are you really going put every entertainment market in the world under one umbrella?

movies cater to one group and anime caters to another which act differently towards their media.

>But with the anime, looking at its exports there doesn't seem to be much diversifying, creativity wise, even when the market was said to be doing well.

Think of it from the perspective of well off series
>oh hey this show seems to be doing well
>might as well keep going at it since if it aint broke dont fix it and we probably shouldnt tamper with it too much

and then not so well off studios
>oh hey that show seems to be doing nicely
>they must be doing something right so lets see if we cant emulate that and cater to the current popular trend in anime?

you should know this since hollywood seems to have been doing it too. remember in like 2011 or so everyone was suddenly obsessed with superhero remakes, reboot and sequels?


>It's not about differentiating tastes, if it were you'd still see "different" things striving on the margins of the market and with it fans. But instead you get this cultism. Other "styles" aren't accepted because there are few there able to think outside the norms.
>You can parade a "fashion show" of anime all you want, but there is no art in it. It's made to be modish. Lifeless when you think about it. It's not created, it's traditionally manufactured. It titillates on the surface, and that's it. (Which only begs questions at those who mimic and advocate animu customs.

i see contradiction because you try to reject margins in your first argument and then pick it back up later

[Anonymous No.1578388]

>>1578379
The second link is being fixed. In the meantime, use this: http://web.archive.org/web/20130524085021/http://www.squidoo.com/w-ic-i

[Anonymous No.1578389]

>>1578384
Well, I have watched this first one twice. Make no mistake, it's full of valuable information, but at my level it is way over my head. I will give the second one a watch.

[Anonymous No.1578351]

>>1578346
You talk like anime industry is like this big ass industry with unending resources for their animation but in reality it's not. You act like you know all about them but you don't. The anime industry has been at a decline since hurr durr moemoe culture and the economy hasnt been all to kind to them.

Also, there are time constraints since these are made weekly and getting new artists is very expensive and time consuming for each art style and your existing animators are used to a certain art style already.


Other than that, the crowd as they are today may not be always accepting of different art styles because of differentiating tastes so it's better to use existing ones because it works.

You also talk about social taboos and shit but that relies more on to the story and plot which has little to do with the art itself since we are talking to character designing as opposed to plot.

you think every fucking animu is made is made by different studios? think again broheim since studios can work on multiple different animu at a season.

>It's universally frowned upon to challenge things or to stir controversy
KLK, is hated at least by tumblrites and feminists. a lot of other people love it according to the preorder rankings which far exceeds KnK

define what you mean by individualism because it's a very general term.

>And with the tradition of segregating people and leaving social taboos unchallenged for the greater good, that all makes an extremely shallow gene pool for creativity.
being gay was a big social taboo, now traps and yaoi are one of the bigger demographics of animu today.

you have little to no knowledge of asian culture and i suggest you stop talking as if you know all about them.

[Anonymous No.1578395]

>>1578386
cont

>But since you already said nobody is willing to to take a risk on different styles, you're entailing it plays a vital part since everyone is playing safe with it.
I also said that art style was due to convenience in time, and finance

and on art styles

ever watched Aku no Hana? the Manga was actually very popular and a lot of people loved it and praised the plot but when the anime came out with rotoscoped and uncanny valley levels of art style they were put off by the anime thus the show bombed.

i did say little to do with the story but i did not say it does not have anything to do at all. you saying that can be classified as a strawman argument.

[Anonymous No.1578394]

>>1578351
>define what you mean by individualism
"Individualism is a novel expression, to which a novel idea has given birth. Our fathers were only acquainted with egoism (selfishness). Selfishness is a passionate and exaggerated love of self, which leads a man to connect everything with himself and to prefer himself to everything in the world. Individualism is a mature and calm feeling, which disposes each member of the community to sever himself from the mass of his fellows and to draw apart with his family and his friends, so that after he has thus formed a little circle of his own, he willingly leaves society at large to itself. Selfishness originates in blind instinct; individualism proceeds from erroneous judgment more than from depraved feelings; it originates as much in deficiencies of mind as in perversity of heart."
~Alexis de Tocqueville

>being gay was a big social taboo, now traps and yaoi are one of the bigger demographics of animu today.
Homosexuality is perceived radically different outside western thought. Granted the western world has had embarrassment in dealing with it. But with Asian cultures it is never seen more than to be a proclivity, and doesn't stir any arguments of political identity. There isn't much to react to it as a variety of human decency. More often it's presented as a part of some sexual conquest. It's part of that implied narrative that the masculine fuck the feminine, and all social norms must follow through in a sense.

>you have little to no knowledge of asian culture
Sometimes a foreigner can give unique insight, because there aren't those taken-for-granted presuppositions to clout observation.

>>1578361
Adaptations are part of the production cycle. And also suggest a drought in the manufacturing, that there aren't many inside willing or able to create original works. More of that playing-it-safe mentality. Business wise, that's smart. It doesn't do much for the artistic merits. So it remains manufacturing basically.

[Anonymous No.1578399]

>>1578389
Well you can't learn to draw by watching a video, you can't learn to draw by watching all the videos and tutorials in the world. They have helpful tips and information, but you have to study and practice, and the things you have to study and practice are the fundamentals.

The hard path is to copy and mimic anime as it is without trying to understand how it works. You'll get there eventually, but you can't apply your skills to new things, you'll have to do the same learning thing all over again when you want to learn something new.

[Anonymous No.1578400]

>>1578395
>convenience in time, and finance
So is the story, your point is moot here.

[Anonymous No.1578403]

>>1578399
Then how DO I learn to draw manga?

[Anonymous No.1578405]

>>1578395
>Aku no Hana
Wow, another school teen angst piece. How soooo original. I'm sure it wasn't popular for pandering reasons (wink wink).

[Anonymous No.1578407]

Why is flash considered bad for drawing? I'm just making games so I know flash well and I don't need to draw realistic stuff since I'm just doing games duh, will I learn bad habits by using flash?
Also smoothing is weird

[Anonymous No.1578408]

>>1578407
I've only ever heard Flash get flak for the type of shit people make with it.

[Anonymous No.1578409]

>>1578403
As I said;
>Basically, learn anatomy and color/value/etc. You can draw stylized things (cartoon, manga/anime, whatever) when you understand how things work.

Anatomy includes the structure of the face and body.

[Anonymous No.1578410]

>>1578407
Because it's not made for drawing, you have very limited tools for drawing purposes.

[Anonymous No.1578412]

>>1578394
>there aren't many inside willing or able to create original works

that culture was spurred on at the start of the moe moe era since most anime at that point was made to cater to the moe crowd. after that


a story is planned out way before it is approved to be animated by the studio. when the actual animation begins then comes the convenience in time and finance since you not only have to pay people to draw in your studio, you also usually have to release them weekly.

now dont tell me pulling ideas out of your head before doing the actual animating costs money. this ain't kickstarter.

>>1578405
wow missing the point.
also, if you're going to say that's pandering then it's pretty much turned into a buzzword now. plus, presentation is also a factor in being called original.

you could say that Odd Thomas was unoriginal as well because it was a supernatural themed movie but it was damn well directed and plotted.

[Anonymous No.1578411]

>>1578409
Question; I am aware that drawing takes a long time to get good at. If I have to first learn realism to begin to learn manga, does this mean I have many years before I should hope to see any form of accomplishment?

[Anonymous No.1578422]

>>1578408
I can understand that.
>>1578410
I know but if I just need to draw cute animu/cartoony sprites is it ok?
A style like this is already way too detailed for me, you have no idea how low the 2d indie game standards are.
With this in mind would you still recommend going for a "regular" course and then when I'm not shit go back to flash to draw sprites?

[Anonymous No.1578424]

>>1578411
Realism is a little wrong word in my opinion. Technically you could learn everything by drawing anime style, you just have to understand how to think about things. To draw according to proper anatomy.

The point is to "not draw an eye, but to draw the structure of an eye". It's a bit difficult to put to words. You could copy a drawing a thousand times without learning anything at all if you're not trying to understand how the thing you're looking at works.

You'll always make progress as long as you're learning. You don't get better after x amount of years, you'll make gradual progress over time. The years are used to express the typical time required to be considered "good", and "good" means different things to different people.

[Anonymous No.1578426]

>>1578394
no, i dont want his definition or a general definition. i want yours in the context of your argument.

[Anonymous No.1578429]

>>1578424
I know what you mean about understanding how things work.

Another thing I am having a problem with is that, I being pretty new to drawing, have a hard time drawing in general. It's not a thing I have ever done so maybe my hands/eyes/brain just don't GET it yet. Is there anything more solid than "practice" that I can do to improve this?

[Anonymous No.1578430]

>>1578412
>a story is planned out way before it is approved to be animated
And just as with every studio, Japanese or other wise. the story conditioned on time and convenience. A saged studio knows beforehand what's going to cost and how to conviently do it. So again the point is moot here.

>presentation is also a factor in being called original.
Lot of popular things are popular because they appeal to the uneducated masses. Most people don't want to think, they just want to be entertained. Very normal behavior really. But that doesn't mean those shows should be distinguishable.

And I don't think rotoscoping is all that original. It's been around since painting-on-film.

[Anonymous No.1578431]

>>1578426
His and mine are the same. Deal with it.

[Anonymous No.1578432]

>>1578430
no one said rotoscoping was original

also, a story is conditioned by either two things, the creator's creativity or current popular trends among its fans.

>>1578431
it might be the same but i want to know your definition in context to the argument

explain it to me, enlighten me

[Anonymous No.1578436]

Trying the box approach for construction. Am I on the right track?

[Anonymous No.1578437]

>>1578422
It's ok for anything with solid shapes like that, but the point is it is very difficult to draw in. You can draw that in a more typical art program too.

Just use flash if you really want to, it's just likely going to be more difficult. The thing is, if your client/boss wants a picture, they're not going to give a shit what method you made it with, as long as the image itself is what they wanted.

>>1578429
There's no way around practice. You can have some resources and methods to help you learn though. Some people find Proko (ProkoTV@youtube) and Vilppu (glennvv@youtube) to be very helpful, but personally I'm a more visual drawer.

Proko especially has some good tutorials that teach you to draw shapes and stuff, very basic stuff and I imagine it's extremely helpful for beginners.

Another thing I've noticed, and a thing that Sycra has said many times, is that people often look for an answer or a solution, some secret or something that makes people good artists. But the thing is that there is no such thing, all it takes is a lot of practice and diligence.

The reason someone is better is because they've either drawn much more than you, and or they have a more of a natural nick for looking at things the right way (understanding, not just copying).

[Anonymous No.1578438]

>>1578432
>no one said rotoscoping was original
But implied it had an endearing quality that made the show standout. The show wasn't all that good to begin with anyway.

>explain it to me, enlighten me
What do you think I would be explaining? You seem aggressive into seeing how I would rephrase it. Perhaps you're just wanting to coax me into something?

The quote isn't divorced from the context here, that's why I chose it. It's about observing a common disposition in a peoples. If you're having trouble with that, sorry, there isn't much else I can do to explain it to you. I like to think the language was pretty straight forward.

[Anonymous No.1578444]

>>1578438
it was used for the sake of being different without considering how the crowd might react.


> Perhaps you're just wanting to coax me into something?
nice avoiding

also, if you want to go that way then individualism means "i want to be a special snowflake no matter what and fuck everyone else unless they agree with me."

you say that korea and japan dont understand individualism when theirs and asia's in general see individualism as "I wanna be who i am for who i am but i dont want to fuck everyone else over and shove what i like down everyone's throats"


individualism is one thing, ability to function in society is another

[Anonymous No.1578480]

redline plox!

[Anonymous No.1578483]

>>1578346
Hmm my view of it is more in the 4 camps theory of Scott McCloud. Anime is more Classicist Animist and is based around traditional standards of beauty rather than extreme experimentalism. You cant really reduce it to anti-individualism though unless youve studied the philosophy and culture excessively.

I mean the Romanticists of the 1800s touted art for art for art sake. The idea that art has to be politically charged and experimental is a concept that arose mainly from Modernism prevalent in the West. Calling it a 'shallow gene pool' is just mean because its a radically different mindset from the West and has its own values which may be just as valid. They just like beauty in a general and classical sense and that means anime now. To go into it proper though would be a discussion more fit for /lit/ since it has to do with Buddhism and a whole load of other aesthetic theory derived from China.

[Anonymous No.1578484]

>>1577921
If'n I'm not mistaken, both were Easter eggs added in as homages to a Bruce Lee scene, but I forget which. The Bebop one just happened to come first.

[Anonymous No.1578485]

>>1578480
Won't redline right now because I woke up and am going back to bed, but
>man hands

[Anonymous No.1578489]

>>1578480
I like it a lot, but as the user above said she has man hands. Also her right hand looks weird; I'm sure you can make it look more natural, expecially since all the fingers seems to have the same length. The right arm too sticks out in a weird way. Also the apples are humongous, maybe you should resize them.
By the way nice work on dat side/underboob.

[Anonymous No.1578491]

>>1578480
I don't know if this much helps.

[Anonymous No.1578507]

>>1578491
the only thing about your redline that is even remotely close to being okay is the bottom left hand

[Anonymous No.1578509]

Some Catrina

[Anonymous No.1578518]

>>1578480
just some thoughts on the pelvis. Hope this helps

[Anonymous No.1578519]

>>1577691
Are we going to have this argument EVERY single anime/manga/cartoon thread. Seriously?
Whatever happened to draw what the fuck you want

[Anonymous No.1578532]

Paint Tool Sai

Is using a Linework layer for lineart not recommended?

[Anonymous No.1578533]

>>1577691
Im hoping youre talking about just animu. Watch The Illusionist (2010) for non-japan animation. If you seriously cant feel that post modernization Parisian melancholy from the world and characters then i dont know what to say.

[Anonymous No.1578534]

>>1578519
As long as people respond.

[Anonymous No.1578538]

>>1578532

No that's vector shit that nobody bothers with

[Anonymous No.1578541]

>>1578518
good redline.

[Anonymous No.1578543]

>>1578538
Sorry, what does that mean? Does vector make for bad looking art?

[Anonymous No.1578552]

>>1578543

Vectors scale to infinity because they are mathematical points

Which is good for some things like graphic design because they need to print their shit out in large sizes. Adobe Illustrator is more suited to vector work. Even PS can do it it with paths but it's a pain in the dick

For the purposes of drawing a web resolution 1000x1000 image in Paintool SAI raster (actual pixels on the screen) is better.

If there's an artist out there that actually uses SAI's vector tools feel free to make me look like a dumbass.

http://www.youthedesigner.com/2012/08/12/how-to-explain-raster-vs-vector-to-your-clients/

[Anonymous No.1578579]

>>1578436
Can't tell if his/her left arm is coming toward or away from me...
But I digress; the box method is great as long as you realize that the anatomy doesn't actually look like that; should mostly be used for getting perspective/foreshortening/embiggening correct.

Not sure of your current skill level, but when I started using boxes, I always wanted to stick to the fucking box until I realized that it was just a tool for building depth.

[Anata no Okaasan No.1578694]

spent way too much time on this sketch

[Anonymous No.1578696]

>>1578694
w-what

[Anonymous No.1578699]

>>1578694
All my wat.

[Anonymous No.1578708]

Idly drawing a stick figure version of Beast from X-Men turns into several pages worth of (weak) concept art. 99% of looks for Beast end up in the 'furry' category. Mixing the intelligence of the character with the beast characteristics is hard when you know there's a legion of users waiting to fap away at it. Very hard.

[Anonymous No.1578711]

ever had one of those pictures that you thought would be really cool but ended up being complete ass in the end

reflecting on this, i REALLY need to work on my edge control and values...

[Anonymous No.1578712]

>>1578711
>complete ass

though I'm not into the same faceness of your style of art I can safely tell you it is no ass.

[Anonymous No.1578714]

>>1578711
Her forearms and hands look really small. Face looks flat, too.

[Anonymous No.1578718]

>>1578509
I'm really diggin' this one.

[Anonymous No.1578775]

>>1578444
>I wanna be who i am for who i am but i dont want to fuck everyone else over and shove what i like down everyone's throats"

That's egoism, which individualism is differentiated in from in the quote. How could you have missed that?

>individualism is one thing, ability to function in society is another
I don't think you have good grasp at what "common disposition" means, or you wouldn't be trying to coax me into this slippery slope argument.

For one thing Japanese and Korean cultures have a tradition of putting the community before the self. Often it's starts at the family and tribal level. You're a son, a brother, a student, etc. way before you're aloud private selfhood. This cultural upbringing caters conformity comfortably, which is probably why anime is so homogeneous. And so, thinking against the grain, even in counter culture circles, doesn really become counter revolutionary, it just becomes thinking on the margins. It's a boring wasteland of same-face anime.

[Anonymous No.1578778]

>>1578775
Well we wont know for sure unless we actually cite from them head on now would we?

[Anonymous No.1578792]

>>1578778
You're not even trying.

[Anonymous No.1578801]

>>1578792
so you're gonna say this right now that monotony of anime automatically means it's because of their culture of of non-individualism?

well i'll be, that would mean that western animation that have shit art is done for the sake of being different!


what i'm truly bothered by is how you act like you know everything about korean and japanese culture and the state of the anime industry

sure, a foreigner can bring unique and new insight to the situation but only after actual research instead of generalizing of someone of another race.

[Anonymous No.1578811]

>>1578801
i think the error in his argument is that anime and all media represents a fantasy.

moeime is how lonely dudes would like the world to be. it's not a reflection of how their world operates. for example. and i think in that world most women are just interchangeable archetypes.

it's the same mistake we on the periphery can often make about Americans. amercians on tv are brash and bold but if you actually go to american everyone is super polite and cowardly, except for the occasional fantasist.

i'm using fantasist here in the sense that they try to act out their fantasies irl. just for clarity.

[Anonymous No.1578817]

>>1578811
>but if you actually go to american everyone is super polite and cowardly,
Really? 'cause here in my little corner of New England they're all a bunch of assholes. They won't tell you to fuck off, but they'll give you just about the shortest answer possible and a sneer.

[Anonymous No.1578825]

>>1578694
/d/ pls go.

[Anonymous No.1578829]

>>1578817
yes, try going to any other english speaking country and see how often someone calls you 'sir' compared to america( except maybe canada i guess) not to mention all those weird fake swear words. sorry curse words, sorry 'cuss' words.

but anyway i didn't say they're friendly, just polite, and of course being polite always tends to have a secret fuck you in it somewhere.

[Anonymous No.1578834]

>>1578829
But that's just it, they're not even polite around here. They wear their contempt for everyone(everyone meaning not only tourists but also natives) on their sleeve and the "fuck you" isn't even remotely secret.

And I've never heard anyone call someone sir around here who wasn't with the navy, coast guard, or police.

[Anonymous No.1578836]

>>1578829
english people hold the title sir in a higher regard

my teacher told me about his english prof who'd get real pissy if someone called him sir because it's only a title given by the queen

[Anonymous No.1578863]

>>1578801
>so you're gonna say this right now that monotony of anime automatically means it's because of their culture of of non-individualism?
Not automatically, but a vacancy of individualism would probably correlate with high levels of homogeneity. I'm not saying that one thing causes the other, I'm just observing a relation, and using anime as an example.

>well i'll be, that would mean that western animation that have shit art is done for the sake of being different!
I don't care about western animation. That's irrelevant.

>what i'm truly bothered by is how you act like you know everything
It's an observation, stop getting angst. I'm not prescribing a political agenda. But you seem willing to project that I am.

>sure, a foreigner can bring unique and new insight to the situation but only after actual research instead of generalizing of someone of another race.
What, you want a book report? I'm not going to hold your hand with every little detail. So what if it's generalizing? You been doing it as well too. Extrapolation shouldn't be foreign concept to you.

And don't try to play the race card here either. This about cultures that pertain to a nation. I couldn't care less about how an "Asian race" thinks. If you can't distinguish between race and culture here, maybe you shouldn't be having this conversation.

>>1578811
>error in his argument is that anime and all media represents a fantasy
My argument is anime, as an artifact of the cultural that made it, is homogeneous because the cultural mindset is retarded against things like rugged individualism. Conformity is paramount, divergent creativity is taboo. Nearly all the variants of anime styles are styles of conformity. And this air of conformity is in their stories as well. (not just with the fantasies) When you skeletonize the whole thing, it's redundant and monotonous.

[Anonymous No.1578872]

>>1578863
>cited sources is now hand holding
ha

[Anonymous No.1578876]

>>1578863
>i've been generalizing
there are docs on the situation in anime industry
cited from animators and studios too

>What, you want a book report? I'm not going to hold your hand with every little detail
my sides are burning. what, are you gonna say that using citation is cheating now?

[Anonymous No.1578905]

>>1578872
Requiring a source for every little thing requires justification? And opinions always need to come from someone other than myself?

So, if I said water is wet, it would be required of me to cite a source? Or else I would just be an idiot who doesn't know what she is talking about.

Oh, never mind the child like dependency of always needing some authority! Oh, never mind the bullshit contorting your trying to put on the conversation! Oh, never mind the deduction of independent thought! You can't function or think for yourself without somebody being there to hold your hand every step of the way, you must have a citation for everything trivial thing no matter how vague!

>>1578876
>there are docs on the situation in anime industry
I'm sure there are, I read a few. I read news articles, and sometimes watch interviews. So, what? I can extrapolate my own opinions, and somehow you thinks that's wrong? If there is a specific point you want a source on to understand better, then you should think about asking the right questions.

Asking for a reference cited page for every little comment is asinine. It's just you fishing for some trivial thing to make a big deal of. You need to be more precise when asking for a citation on something. You need to clarify what information you're after, or what kind of information you need. You need to frame how you want the information backed up. And asking if someone else said it doesn't do that alone. You need to give your interpretation up to the point, and then ask for a citation. Just asking for a citation blatantly will only give you more useless information than what you need.

If you want a citation by your way, then Google,"Anime+conformity+Japan" I'm sure you will find more than what you need. And I'm sure you will finger point any trivial thing as if it would unraveled the whole argument. Only an idiot would play the kind of game your trying.

[Anonymous No.1578910]

Can you guys take this somewhere else? Get a hotel room and fuck already, god damn.

[Anonymous No.1578928]

>>1578910
This is typical when anime is discussed. Im not sure if its a troll but I do kinda understand the argument.

Again let's just say anime is a painting. A painting can't be like a photo, it's ducking impossible. You can't compare two types of different medium. Anime as it is, is fine. Yes there are draw back but what can you do? Nothing is perfect.

Less arguments and more constructive discussion.

[Anonymous No.1578943]

>>1578928
citation needed

[Anonymous No.1578945]

>>1578905
>So, if I said water is wet, it would be required of me to cite a source? Or else I would just be an idiot who doesn't know what she is talking about.

>Water is wet
>prove it
>go to your bathroom (assuming your water supply has not been cut off)
>turn on the tap
there is your citation


>Oh, never mind the child like dependency of always needing some authority! Oh, never mind the bullshit contorting your trying to put on the conversation! Oh, never mind the deduction of independent thought! You can't function or think for yourself without somebody being there to hold your hand every step of the way, you must have a citation for everything trivial thing no matter how vague!
>What i think is true even if it's a generalization without proof of correlation because I say it is!

>deduction of independent thought
>without research

oh and according to your sources of searching those words

>http://www.tourism4peace.com/off-the-beat-path/the-influence-of-anime-on-japanese-lifestyle/
conformity seems to drive anime popularity rather than homogenize it. the so called homogeneity can be easily attributed to the age old tactic of appealing to the tastes of the public like any usual product distributor. supply and demand. this is further strengthened by the documentations of the anime industry.

>I don't care about western animation. That's irrelevant.


Opinion? okay, fair game but you have an uneducated opinion which shows just how little a scope you see the world through and tries to use strawman arguments to put down anyone who tries to reason or discuss. Not to mention trying to justify your avoiding to bring any sort of proof. Opinions are not an excuse to spout nonsensical bullshit laced with uneducated generalizations of something without proper research into your own arguments.

Deduction of independent thought also requires logic and proof, just like science. A methodical way of presenting your views.

[Anonymous No.1578949]

so many words, so little artwork.

[Anonymous No.1578952]

>>1578949
Wacom tablet is in the mail. Waiting on it now. A-am I gonna make better art with it /ic/?

[Anonymous No.1578956]

>>1578952
Seeing as how I pretty much improved after I got mine and practiced a lot, sure yeah why not.

I only got better faster because of how convenient it is to clean anyway, the lining and technical knowledge doesnt change much so no matter what you still need to study and practice

[Anonymous No.1578957]

>>1578532
I don't like it.
I tried it in clip studio though and it wasn't that bad but I'd need to spend more time with it.

[Anonymous No.1578960]

>>1578532
GIMP has better vector lines than SAI

[Anonymous No.1578962]

>>1578928
>>1578945
What part of
>Can you guys take this somewhere else?
Is giving you trouble?

[Anonymous No.1578965]

>>1578956
I'm stuck in the valley of shitty perspective and shoddy/no use of proper coloring or values at the moment. The ease of using a tablet for coloring and having a bunch of tools seems like a better option over buying traditional tools.

Also I used up. So. Much. Fucking. Paper.

If anyone would like to share their pros and cons of a tablet I'd love to hear them.

[Anonymous No.1578969]

>>1578965
>Also I used up. So. Much. Fucking. Paper.
Welcome to the world of being an artist


Also, unless you got a cintiq or a tablet with a screen trying to draw while watching the screen can feel weird and takes time to get used to but it shouldn't be too long. I got used to in in like 2-4 days i think but it takes longer to be actually good at it.

it'll improve your skills on paper too.

be sure to study from books, life and other people's work

i know studying from life sounds heavy but you dont have to study everything at once, just what you need at the time and keep adding more when you need it.

[Anonymous No.1578970]

>>1578969
>while watching the screen
I meant the monitor

[Anonymous No.1578971]

>>1578970
My biggest issue is simple shit like anatomy. The reason for this is because I can't make up my mind over I'm trying to draw a 3D image or an image in 2D that is shaded and valued correctly.

[Anonymous No.1579026]

>>1578971
study from other works would be your best bet to simplify that

[Anonymous No.1579081]

>>1578945
homogeneity and conformity are related.

[Anonymous No.1579120]

I've been trying to draw for quite some time, and I've got the bare minimum down right, so I'm confident in drawing in a more eastern fasion. I keep practicing every other day, as to not wear myself out; I've been doing generic portraits and simple crap like that. Now that I'm out of college, I can move on to my own interests.

I bear a single question based on my interests though; How do you learn to draw based off of your favorite artist? In my case, Galaxist is the artist I want to emulate, but his pixiv gallery got emptied, and I didn't save any of his older works, so I can't see how his stuff evolved over time. I've always enjoyed his works, simply because he drew such cute, soft girls, as well as stylish shoes, of all things.

How can I learn to emulate another's style without losing my own? I don't intend to one-up or create similar works for money, as that would just be a side hobby, but I'd like to draw similar to another artist. How should I start doing this? I have thoroughly read the sticky, but I could not find an answer within.

[Anonymous No.1579153]

>>1579120
>How can I learn to emulate another's style without losing my own?
you can't really lose your own style anyway if you already have one. and if you don't, you don't have to worry about losing anything either.

if you want to get the influence of another artist into your style, just try to draw in the same style as the artist.
usually you won't be able to do it anyway, but you'll get closer the more you try to figure things out. then you'll eventually grasp some stuff that you can incorporate into your own style.

there isn't much to think about in terms of style anyway so don't worry about it.
it actually can be pretty bad because you could end up with a style you can't use, you'll be able to recreate certain images from memory but you can't actually draw freely with the style because you lack the understanding or the fundamentals.
don't worry too much about style, worry more about your general ability.

[Anonymous No.1579202]

>>1578905
What you call conformity and homogenity is perceived differently within the culture itself. They have considerably different values from you which doesnt invalidate those values. Its just a difference in taste in the end.

For example Japanese aesthetics is based of buddhist aesthetics, focused around impermanence and simplicity. You can see how this manifests in the form of haiku and noh plays where its minimal and structured. Basho, in his Haiku, shows that you don't need great tummultous changes but merely slight variations and minimal description to achieve a powerful effect. Its a very western view to see art as needing great innovation and great radicalism to be 'individual' since modernism when all was toppled by abstract art and high avantgardism. The change can be seen in language as well for example Japanese is based of Chinese and Chinese is a symbol oriented tonal language based off fixed symbols and variations within those symbols while English is a melting pot of different words that come from different cultures.

Basically you can't make huge value judgments like Japanese are overtly Conformist or anti-Individualistic unless you actually acquire the mindset to think about the culture from their view. What they appreciate is simple beauty and slight variations in style but this doesn't mean a lack of individuality, just different values and means to express that individuality. So in the end its all subjective.

[Anonymous No.1579221]

so is talking about drawing more entertaining than actually drawing or what

[Anonymous No.1579224]

>>1579221
Of course it is. Why do you think art criticism is a 'thing' in academic circles.

[Anonymous No.1579228]

>>1579224
>>1579221
Less talking more Loomis.

[Anonymous No.1579254]

Sorry for the chicken scratch

[Anonymous No.1579257]

>>1579254
Shit forgot picture

[Anonymous No.1579269]

>>1579257
Try not to "pet" your lines, instead strive for long confident strokes. Try to get rid of the habit of lifting the stylus too soon, something that helped me was drawing ellipses without lifting the pen and go for a perfect circle each and every time.

[Anonymous No.1579296]

>>1579120
>How can I learn to emulate another's style without losing my own?
Define what makes their style theirs and what makes your yours. You don't have to be bound to a single style, but it does mean analyzing and practicing different kinds of stylization.

See; Animators. They basically do this all the time. It's the whole point of the model sheets that go around; too keep everyone animating within the same style.

[Anonymous No.1579297]

>>1579257
i like how the lines are all furry but you still used different weights

[Anonymous No.1579311]

>>1579297
I didn't do that are purpose.

Also anyone know of any good guides on drawing women?

[Anonymous No.1579326]

>>1579311
Loomis figure drawing for all its worth
Hogarth dynamicfigure drawing

[Anonymous No.1579328]

>>1579257
the eyes and nose are too far up the head, it doesn't look like your person has any cheek bones, and the chin is way too sharp. look up some reference pics for heads.

rounder cheekbones typically make for a more "feminine" or cute face, while sharper ones make for a more "masculine" or mature one.

[Anonymous No.1579371]

Reposting

Is there a way to make sure that the pupils are correctly aligned?

[Anonymous No.1579373]

>>1579371
Flipping your canvas occasionally does a world of good.

[Anonymous No.1579380]

>>1579371
Is she leaning or just off-balance?

[Anonymous No.1579383]

>>1579380
Not meant to be leaning so I guess she's off balance

[Anonymous No.1579385]

>>1578711
Palette is kinda dull and composition could be thought out better. Technically it's fine

[Anonymous No.1579390]

>>1579383
just indicate that she's leaning against a wall, propped up by her arse, that's what it looks like.

[Anonymous No.1579504]

Critique please

[Anonymous No.1579505]

Critique please

[Anonymous No.1579527]

>>1579505
Her pose is really stiff and awkward. I would lean her torso so shes sitting up more and straighten the arm. The anatomy in the hands and feet are off especially so I would do some studies.
Also remember that hair follows gravity, right now its curved with her head, but since her head it tilted it should be going more down.

[Anonymous No.1579530]

Please shit all over my Asuka "manly" Soryu drawing

[Anonymous No.1579533]

>>1579527
I've always drawn poses very stiff, and I don't even think my eye can spot how stiff the characters are, do you know how I could fix this?

Studies meaning drawing lots of hands and feet at different angles, using the images for the hands here? http://reference.sketchdaily.net/
There are only 24 here, I'm not too sure how to approach drawing hands (or feet) for studies. I've seen a few construction guides but they all seem like magic to me as I can't seem to follow them well.
(Or should I take pictures of my own hands and feet from several angles and positions and draw them?)

Thanks for the feedback!

[Anonymous No.1579534]

>>1579202
Yeah no.

[Anonymous No.1579536]

>>1579533
Not the same anon but gesture drawing and basically just being more confident with your drawings

[Anonymous No.1579539]

>>1579533
learn gestures and the line of action principle

and make it look lessed forced and awkward

it helps to put yourself in the shoes of the one doing that pose

[Anonymous No.1579544]

>>1579505
some redline for you

[Anonymous No.1579546]

>>1579544
Not him but

What if it's here sticking her chest out and arching her back?

[Anonymous No.1579549]

>>1579533
No problem! Like the others who replied said, practice gesture. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8j39NqwL7s4&list=PLtG4P3lq8RHGuMuprDarMz_Y9Fbw_d2ws these videos are all very helpful. I suggest watching them and you can do studies easily over at http://artists.pixelovely.com/practice-tools/figure-drawing/
Gesture drawing is really helpful with relaxing and creating dynamic poses.
As for practicing hands and feet, you can look at your own or just look up pictures of them online. I'm sure there's some videos on youtube that will help break down how to draw them. It's all just practice.

[Anonymous No.1579552]

>>1579546
ah right, I should of looked at that pelvis direction better. I'll give that another shot with chest poking out

[Anonymous No.1579553]

>>1579536
>>1579539
Pic related are my previous attempts at drawing gesture (using posemaniac), though I don't think I knew about the line of action principle back then. I'll try to incorporate it into my drawings and see what happens.
Thanks!

>>1579544
>>1579546
>>1579552
I don't really remember how this was supposed to look like even though I drew this yesterday. Anything that would make it look better than the original would be appreciated thanks!

>>1579549
Those videos really seem useful, I'll definitely try to learn from those. Heck, I didn't even really know what "gesture" meant before watching the first one lol
Cheers!

[Anonymous No.1579556]

>>1579553
you shouldn't rely too much on posemaniacs

yeah, they train you with poses and gets your work faster but they dont really make you understand the logic or how the pose actually works. pair it up with some gesture, perspective proportions and anatomy studies and your golden

yeah, seems a lot but you dont have to learn every pose at once, just the ones you need at the time.

[Anonymous No.1579557]

>>1579556
Gotcha. I'll first try to pick up some stuff from Proko's Gesture studies and then I'll try to find a good resource for the perspective proportions.

Thanks you and everyone else for the replies, it's made me realise I was just sugarcoating everything and that I really do need to go back to basics

[Anonymous No.1579558]

>>1579557
atta boy

[Anonymous No.1579572]

>>1579549
>No.1579546
gave it a shot, took a bit longer than expected.
it's always good to try what the pose feels like, this one is not comfortable at all.

[Anonymous No.1579577]

>>1579572
Heheh yeah it doesn't look comfortable indeed
I guess I really need to think about the poses a little more in terms of that
Thanks!

[Anonymous No.1579578]

>>1579572
I think it's because you have a dick, unless you're a chick

[Anonymous No.1579759]

>>1579228
I'm not qualified to red-line things so this might not even be helpful

[Anonymous No.1579764]

>>1579759
did mikufag just redline himself?

[Anonymous No.1579763]

>>1579759
>I'm not qualified to red-line
so don't. you flattened any hint of perspective that was there (with the elbow coming forward)

[Anonymous No.1579781]

>>1579764
That was not I who redlined, but thank you to the Anon who devoted his or her time to do so.

[Anonymous No.1579801]

Anyone got a teal related folder?
I got an imgur link and a local folder for that a while ago but lost it because my computer was broken.

[Anonymous No.1579803]

>>1579228
Long arm is long. Also your expression is still stiff.

[Anata no Okaasan No.1579812]

>>1579801
http://imgur.com/a/8eHzD

[Anonymous No.1579835]

>>1577686
TFW watching anime 6 episodes in.. realise main characters best friend is actually a boy...

how can you into this shit.

[Anonymous No.1579840]

>>1579835
you don't, just quit watching anime obviously you don't have the talent to watch anime.

>also watching anime with girly boy

that means you're watching those MOE MOE anime, go watch real anime like queen's blade. hue huehueheuhehehue *spoiler* rana is a girly boy too*

[Anonymous No.1579847]

>http://www.squidoo.com/w-ic-i
Has been unpublished.

[Anonymous No.1579848]

>>1579840
NAh it was actually Attack of Titan or something. pretty good.

the charter was "arimen" or something like that.

[Anata no Okaasan No.1579854]

>>1579848
>using its english translated name
are you a casual by any chance

[Anonymous No.1579863]

>>1579854
yeah bro this maybe my 5th or 6th anime ever..

[Anonymous No.1579867]

>>1579848
It's "Armin", and you should read the manga.

[Anata no Okaasan No.1579868]

>>1579863
shit i bet youre streaming it too
i also bet one of the 6 anime is Full Metal Alchemist: Brotherhood or Deathnote

[Anonymous No.1579870]

>>1579868
please stop using romaji, it's disgusting.

[進撃の巨人 No.1579872]

>>1579868
please stop using romaji, it's disgusting.

[Anonymous No.1579884]

>>1579872
いいえ、馬鹿

[Anonymous No.1579885]

>>1579868
mfw 2 out of 6

[Anonymous No.1579913]

"Submit your drawings, receive feedback or critique others! Share your knowledge and remember to thank those who've critiqued or red-lined your drawings. Most importantly, have fun."

CAN YOU DENSE FUCKS STOP ARGUING ABOUT WHATS ORIGINAL AND JUST POST SOME GODDAMN CARTOONS. FUCK.

>expecting that much from /ic/

have my shitty concept art

[Anonymous No.1579931]

>>1577710
You're one of the biggest faggots i've ever seen on 4chan, all boards, and i didn't expect to see that level on /ic/, wow... I'm humbled...

[Anonymous No.1579937]

>>1579931
REFER TO
>>1579913

AND STOP SHITPOSTING YOU FAGGOT.

[Anonymous No.1579938]

Holy shit this thread.... If its a troll its one thing... But seriously...

[Anonymous No.1580018]

animurr

[Anonymous No.1580022]

>>1580018
thank you

[Anonymous No.1580079]

>>1578817
Not trying to derail, but
>New England
Speaking as a Southerner, you Yankees can just be real brutish to one another and, well, us. New England is perhaps the least friendly regional sector of the Union.

[Anonymous No.1580084]

>>1580018
>M-muh broken giraffeneck...

[Anonymous No.1580097]

I shouldnt attempt such shit yet. But meh, more art less text

[Anonymous No.1580183]

>>1580097
im not sure what you want to be told. its a really rough liney sketch without a real purpose or much of anything. more confident lines i suppose?

[Anonymous No.1580379]

>>1580097
OPPAI BIIIMU

captcha: rownly wave :c

[Anonymous No.1580455]

>>1580079
New England guy here; I totally agree with you. I was in Virginia a couple of years ago and it was amazing how much more friendly everyone was.

Now I just want to get the fuck out of this miserable corner of the US.

[Anonymous No.1580467]

>>1577686
never done anime before but after watching "attack on titan" recently i wanted to try.

i didn't use ref. just sketching what i could remember.

crits?

i love the setting/costume design and colors in the show.

reminds me of "Destiny" the game being made by bungie.

[Anonymous No.1580488]

>>1580467
Here another one, still from memory.

[Anonymous No.1580489]

>>1580467
Here another one, still from memory.

[Anonymous No.1580504]

>>1580489
Very cute. Please, give her an umbrella or flowers instead of ammunition!

[Anonymous No.1580532]

could you please give some feedback, i dunno what's not good (besides non-symmetrical ears)
this was supposed to be a grinning fox

[Anonymous No.1580534]

>>1580532
hi im not sure im new to anime see ^ but i would say lose some neck and set the head in the circle more

[Anonymous No.1580563]

>>1580379
>:c
Lefty, is that you?

[Anonymous No.1580575]

>>1580532
It ... doesn't look much like a fox.
The ears are too small and the wrong shape, fox's ears are more like larger versions of cats' ears.
The muzzle looks odd, parts of it seem to be in profile, while other parts are in a 3/4 view.

I'm not sure whether you're anthropomorphizing it, or how much, but if you're not:
Foxes don't have dark eyebrows.
The iris should take up most of the eye.
The neck should be a bit wider.

[Anonymous No.1580603]

>>1580534
>>1580575
made another one.
i'm not trying to make a furry, however it isn't quite a fox, so i think eyes are justified as they are and left them like that.
Heather Dale - Black Fox (song for reference, was pretty cool, so i decided to try and scribble him)

[Anonymous No.1580638]

>>1580532
>>1580603
Redlined it, kind of Work on that perspective, bro. And there seems to be too much detail going on in the back. Keep all the contrast and detail near the focus, being the eyes.

He also doesn't seem like a grinning fox, he looked more angry.

[Anonymous No.1580641]

>>1580638
good work anon, this is what i was talking about making him fit in the circle more.

[Anonymous No.1580644]

>>1580641
Thanks.
>>1580638
Forgot to mention, in a design like this, which would be used for t-shirts and avatars and such, that dark shading at the bottom of the chin was a bit much. I just added some line weight to imply a shadow and make it stick out more. It's a pretty neat trick you can use for a lot of things.

[Anonymous No.1580710]

>>1580638
thanks, Anon, yours looks pretty much like what i wanted mine to be.
so i sat there looking at the picture and trying not to copy it completely, that's what i came up with.
i'll work a little bit more on the mouth and the white "thing", cause now it looks like a stache, but overall i like it now, thx

[Anonymous No.1580723]

>>1580710
and here're the final tweaks, if anyone was interested

[Anata no Okaasan No.1580787]

>>1580563
yes
:c

[Anonymous No.1580792]

Quick sketch of Ao Oni before I head to work.

Could use help on perspective. I still don't understand the rules for 2-point.

[Anonymous No.1580805]

>>1580787
Never change :3

[Anonymous No.1580832]

>>1580489

Who is it supposed to be? Sasha? Blade tip is wrong. Watch the noodle arms.

>>1580467

Terrible faces. Weak gestures.

And it's shingeki no kyojin, pleb. Proper titles. Also, when doing fanart always use reference, so people can tell who the fuck it's supposed to be and you can get the details correct.

[Anonymous No.1580843]

>>1580792
Hard to explain without showing exactly how I did it.

Pretty much why the room space looks a bit awkward is because the vanishing points of the room aren't far enough apart, although it's not technically wrong. Just read this Anon.

http://kriscrash.dk/d/David_Chelsea_-_Perspective_For_Comic_Book_Artists.pdf

[Anonymous No.1580847]

>>1580832
not really doing fan art those are just sketches

the other is a drawing... they were for gasp "fun" and only took me maybe 10 minutes.

[Anonymous No.1580850]

>>1580792
Imagine the world being divided up into CUBES. The EDGES of the cubes going in one direction will CONVERGE at a VANISHING POINT, while the edges PERPENDICULAR to the PREVIOUS edges will converge at the other VANISHING POINT.

Meanwhile the VERTICAL edges will go perfectly straight up, and are PARALLEL to each other.

[Anonymous No.1580859]

First time drawing women, I have to no idea what i'm doing, redline pls.

[Anonymous No.1580863]

>>1580859
Forgot pic again shit

[Anonymous No.1580867]

>>1580863
sticky etc.

[Anonymous No.1580869]

>>1580867
That poster was asking for a redline, hey whatever happened to that one redline thread anyway?

[Anonymous No.1580879]

>>1580869
a redline is there to correct. when nothing in the image is correct, a redline is just a completely new drawing. thus its not gonna be of any use to the original poster, as he clearly does not yet have an understanding of the subject matter he tried to draw. (as he stated himself in his post) THUS, a redline is unnecessary, the poster should rather sit down his ass and study, instead of asking for redlines on his doodles.

sage for good measure. nothing personal

[Anonymous No.1580881]

>>1580879
Well, that's true you have a good point there.

[Anonymous No.1580884]

>>1580879
I feel like less of a person now

[Anonymous No.1580901]

>>1580863
Don't hide hands, also try and use cleaner lines. Like the other guy said, read the sticky and do some anatomy and life studies. Learn muscles and study proportions. As everyone on /ic/ says, needs more Loomis.

[Anonymous No.1580905]

>>1579913
Does that princess have 5 o'clock shadow?

[Anonymous No.1580907]

>>1580905
i think it's supposed to be a tan

[Anonymous No.1580910]

>>1580884
Don't worry, we still love you Anon. This parrot right here will be your best friend, don't ignore it but instead embrace his words of wisdom.

>>1575567

[Anonymous No.1580911]

>>1580907
Oh, I see the outline of goggles now.

[Anonymous No.1580921]

>>1580863
maybe?

[Anonymous No.1581348]

>tfw teal will probably never tealline your drawing because they are too bad to fix or too bland to notice

[Anonymous No.1581353]

>>1581348
nahm you just need to ask hard enough and he'll do it. (if he is here atm)

[Anonymous No.1581363]

>>1577718
It's quite simple to do, but it takes actual effort. It's all about knowing how to draw real faces and how individual people are. You can simplify things and work them into your chraracters. You can take real people and translate some characteristic they have pretty easily. A crooked nose, the shape of their face, the slant of the eyes, the fat hanging over the eye, bushy eyebrows, buck teeth showing, shape of the lips, facial hair, and so on.

In the end, there's no other way, really.

[Anonymous No.1581378]

>>1580863
not correct but a starting point.

[Anonymous No.1581379]

>>1581378
amazing anon. can you redline mine as well anon?

Its the one with the dual sword girl. from Attack on Titan.

inb4 / not proper japan name

[Anonymous No.1581381]

>>1581378
way to go, you turned a 3/4 view to a flat face-on, because you can't do any better.

[Anonymous No.1581442]

It's a bit sad that most artists emulate the same blobface style that is popular right now, so little variety.

[Anonymous No.1581473]

>>1581442
dunno, what do you consider a blobface?

[Anonymous No.1581475]

hi guys, first time posting here.. hoping for some constructive useful advice. i referred to someone elses fan art for this and i was wondering if simply copying and understanding the perspective and how to draw is any useful in learning how to draw?

[Anonymous No.1581478]

>>1581473
a skinny impoverished face, i would guess

[Anonymous No.1581479]

>>1581475
no, it's not. you should draw from life if possible, but otherwise use photo references. Not someone else's art, unless they're a master.

Check out the resources in the sticky, especially Drawing on The Right Side of the Brain, and Keys to Drawing.

[Anonymous No.1581480]

>>1581479
got it, what is considered 'practice' in drawing? is it simply drawing different things until you get a natural feel of it? any particular way of practicing? i hear that drawing from memory is a good way

[Anonymous No.1581482]

>>1581473

[Anonymous No.1581485]

[Anonymous No.1581486]

>>1581485

Practice your anatomy, especially hands, and work on the face.

[Anonymous No.1581489]

>>1581486
yeah I really suck at hands and perspective

[Anonymous No.1581493]

>>1581489

Perspective isnt the problem here. Have you done a nude body sketch at the beginning of the drawing?

[Anonymous No.1581499]

>>1581493
Yes I do, but I don't really know if it was right or wrong, and I always draw over it many times until I am tired and move on.

[Anonymous No.1581513]

>>1578694
This is fucking beautiful.

[Anonymous No.1581514]

>>1581493
Well, what is the best way to learn anatomy anyway? I tried Loomis and Hampton, but only a few ideas get in my head, I tend to forgot about most of the parts in book when I draw (every time I draw my bad habits of flat formless structures, perspective, hand is crippled etc... come up, I used to draw animu before I know /ic/ that's why I learned a lot of bad habits)
And I barely make any progress with my art...
Sometimes I wonder if I'm just too dumb to even understand Loomis...

[Anonymous No.1581523]

>>1579530
You need to study up on heads, Loomis can help with that and his books can be found in the sticky. Don't use such sharp corners around the eyes.

[Anonymous No.1581524]

>>1581514

Loomis is just a help, not the end of all things. Just practise, portray figures, until you get the feeling for it.

[Anonymous No.1581526]

>>1581514
draw a lot from life if you can, photos if you can't and get an anatomy chart to hang on your wall, focus on working out how the parts work together to create movement, understanding the function is way more important than being able to name specific groups.

to see what i mean and learn something, why not look at 'flexors and extensors' in the forearms, get an idea of how they work, where they are, what they do and then see how that effects your drawing of a hand and forearm. you should notice that knowing about them gives you a better idea about the mass and the range of motion.

[Anonymous No.1581527]

>>1581524
Ok I think I will start saving more reference to get out of my old mindless drawing habit.
I know drawing require a lot of thinking and analysis but when I draw I barely think.

[Anonymous No.1581530]

>>1581514
you can try this http://www.anatomyarcade.com/games/PAM/PAM.html for fun

[Anonymous No.1581531]

>>1581527

Yeah, practice is just essential. The more you draw certain things the more you get the feel for it.

[Anonymous No.1581532]

>>1577718

In the context of cartooning/comics/anime, there is great value in developing your personal "same face". This represents your individual ideal for beauty, and it's likely the face you will use for your main character. The main character is who you will be drawing the most, so it is important you can draw it consistently and quickly.

This face will also be your reference point for every other type you construct. Simply describing a character as having a long face or a fat chin or a big nose is rather meaningless. Those features are *relative to the main character.* This is the same with physique. Tall, short, strong, weak, these are all relative qualities, not absolute ones.

Same face is often not a reflection of poor or limited drawing skills, but the lack of different character types. Basically, it is as much a problem of poor writing and creativity, as it is drawing. In a harem anime, the girls are all attractive, and have only minimal differences aside from some well-developed tropes and accessories. A comic with a team of Superheroes has the same problem; outside of their abilities and color schemes, most of the guys are square jawed tough guys who would be hard to distinguish when not in costume.

So if you want to avoid same face, then stop drawing just pretty and young girls, or tough heroic guys. Think about your characters, who they are, what they do, how they live. Those will naturally guide your design decisions.

[Anonymous No.1581534]

>>1581526
thanks, I will try to learn more about muscles and how they functioning
>>1581530
Oh wow this is awesome

[Anonymous No.1581540]

I'm trying to get into 80s style.

[Anonymous No.1581544]

>>1581540
yay reminds me of er, dominion tank police.

her right hand is a bit short.

[Anonymous No.1581559]

>>1581348

I'm going to put this as nice as I can because I suffered and still suffer from a similar mindset:

Get some initiative and help yourself. Waiting for your hero to save you isn't going get that next picture done. In drawing, you're not only improving your eyes and hands but also your critical thinking skills. Waiting for someone to point you in a direction isn't moving forward. Draw, take your hits and eat shit with it and start the next drawing. Temper yourself in that mental burden and never stop looking for resources on your own. Teal's lesson plan (Linear perspective, then Hampton with still-lifes of animu figurines) is very good for what he does and there are simple truths in it, but you're you and not him.

Become a hero for yourself.

[Anonymous No.1581561]

>>1581559
her face is priceless, lol

[Anonymous No.1581563]

>>1577686

What's those pointy things people in old anime had just above their mouths?

[Anonymous No.1581566]

>>1581559
is funnier when you know in japan they have a door-knob licking fetish

[Anonymous No.1581568]

>>1581563
noses

[Anonymous No.1581573]

>>1581563
>>1581568
Remember kids, the nose knows!

[Anonymous No.1581580]

>>1581559

That's not the proper way to use an onani hole.

[ThDark No.1581640]

Since I can't tell if that new draw thread is legit and what I do counts as cartooning, I'll post this here.

Still working on this, lineart is always the most time-consuming part.

[Anonymous No.1581659]

>>1581640
Cool stuff, man, but it looks like the robot's about to tip onto mechanic dude.

[ThDark No.1581678]

>>1581659
In my mind, the big backpack/thing keeps the balance in line, wanted to make it look a little hunched.
But if that doesn't come across I'll mess with it a bit.

[Anonymous No.1581679]

>>1581678

I think it give it an old school Toriyama feel

[Anonymous No.1581716]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtriF_RR7gM
Just leaving this here

[Anonymous No.1581833]

daily dose

[Anonymous No.1581897]

>>1581716
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtriF_RR7gM

Very interesting. He mentions some things that you really tend to overlook like the whole creating mirror image of an eye and such.

[Anonymous No.1581899]

>>1581833
dem dykes. Soften up dem chins

[Anonymous No.1581986]

Been practicing figures from imagination... how am i doing?

[Anonymous No.1581996]

>>1581986

Kind of symbolized, stiff and boring.

Look into how to utilize line width, it would help.

Also I'm realizing I've been drawing eyes wrong by mirroring them

So how rustle draws them, is that more correct?

[tehmeh No.1581997]

>>1581996
post best work in this thread.. someone post a shitty gif implying it's terrible.

stay classy /ic/

also listen to him. he made some good points.

[tehmeh No.1581999]

>>1581997
this ain't me bitch, dont make me bring out the trips

[doppelganger No.1582000]

>>1581999

:O


amazing

[Anonymous No.1582002]

>>1582000
>>1581999
>>1581997
Oh, /ic/ don't ever change :3

[temeh No.1582003]

>>1581986
i can't tell if you constructed the poses or not. You should do it. you seem to get lost into small areas. Hands, faces, feet.. An eye here, an eye there. you forget to look at the whole. Proportion, mass, perspective, and anatomy are all missing. try to take breaks more often, flip the canvas more often. definitely take advantage of constructing with shapes and action lines more. I think you're at the point where if you recognized your faults you could fix them if you tried and tried.

[Anonymous No.1582008]

>>1581997

Would you have preferred it if I told him to Loomis instead?

[Anonymous No.1582187]

japanese dragon

[Anonymous No.1582225]

Making a little comic, critique is appreciated.

[Anonymous No.1582228]

why do I always forget the fucking picture

[Anonymous No.1582231]

>>1582228
>Chickenscratchy lines
>no perspective
>empty room
>huge white space
Keep trying anon

[Anonymous No.1582233]

For a project

[Anonymous No.1582239]

>>1582233
[hues interenally]

[Anonymous No.1582254]

>>1582231
That white space was ment for other panels

[Anonymous No.1582359]

>>1581986
I like your lines. They are living. Especially on the second figure. Go practice feet, it looks like you don't know a lot about them. Same with knees and the whole leg. Also, break the habit of adding muscles, if don't know their correct connection\place.

[Anonymous No.1582472]

New thread?

[Anonymous No.1582654]

>>1581540
The folds in the clothes, both her shirt especially under her breasts and pants from the knees down look unnatural. It's the same with her boots as well. Not sure if the hairline should be that high, but I suppose that's an aesthetic choice.

>>1581659
Gonna agree with this guy. It looks visually very appealing though.

>>1582233
Her feet doesn't look like they're in a proper position to balance the character in that particular stance.

>>1582239
Same problem but this character is also leaning reaaaally far back. She looks too tall as well and the folds of the clothes aren't convincing or flowing correctly especially on her arms.