/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>>7068820
Some western / indie publishers of Manga:

Saturday AM ( https://www.saturday-am.com/ )
> Digital indie magazine, seems to be on the up-and-up
> Open submissions for long-form series; also distributes series currently being published elsewhere.
> Regularly publishes one-shots, making it a good potential outlet for already-finished work.

Oni Press ( https://onipress.com/ )
> Technically indie, but at this point large enough by comic standards to be mentioned in the same breath as other publishers.

Antarctic Press ( https://antarctic-press.myshopify.com/ )
> Longtime large-indie publisher of OEL / manga-esque books.
> Seemingly taking submissions at present if http://www.antarctic-press.com/html/submissions.php is anything to go on.

Yen Press ( https://yenpress.com/ )
> Started out as a small indie publisher of original / Korean material, and has grown reasonably popular since.
> As of 2016, it is also one of the western arms of the Kadokawa Corporation, with Kadokawa owning a 51% stake.
> Editorial inquiries can apparently be sent to yenpress@yenpress.com, however, they apparently are not open to new submissions at this time.

Viz Media / Viz Originals ( https://www.viz.com/originals )
> *The* western manga publisher.
> Currently in the exploratory stages of setting up an English label.
> Submissions are open and several books have been announced. However, progress on the label seems to be moving very slowly.
> Still might be worth a shot anyway.

Shrine Comics ( https://shrinecomics.com/ )
> Small indie manga publisher
> Seemingly attempting to make the transition to physical volumes
> Allows crossposting to other sites

Iconic Comics (https://www.iconiccomics.com/))
>A bit like Oni Press and Antarctic Press
>A small publisher with a focus on indie works with manga inspiration

>>7068823
Other open comic publishers:

Dark Horse ( https://www.darkhorse.com )
>Dark Horse still welcomes your submissions, and all submissions will still be reviewed, just as they always have been.
>All unsolicited story/series proposals must have a full creative team on board. Writer-only proposals will not be reviewed.

Image comics ( https://imagecomics.com/ )
>Image Comics only publishes creator-owned material. They do not contract creators; they’re only interested in publishing original content for which you would retain all rights.
>Image Comics publishes creator-owned/creator-generated properties and THEY DON’T PAY PAGE RATES. Image takes a small flat fee off the books published, and it will be the responsibility of the creators to determine the division of the remaining pay between their creative team members.

Drawn and quarterly ( https://drawnandquarterly.com/ )
>Please email a low resolution PDF with at least 20 pages of comics and cover letter to submissions. Do not send dropbox links, scripts, or proposals. Please read our submissions FAQ.

Fantagraphics ( https://www.fantagraphics.com/ )
>submission page: https://www.fantagraphics.com/pages/faq

Top Shelf Productions ( https://www.topshelfcomix.com/ )
>Regarding submissions, we're easy. Just email us a download link of what you'd like us to review. NOTE: We cannot accept cover letters, plot synopses, or scripts unless they are accompanied by a minimum of 10-20 completed pages (i.e., fully inked and lettered comic book pages).

Additional publisher lists:
> https://jasonthibault.com/definitive-list-comic-publisher-submission-guidelines/
> https://writingtipsoasis.com/best-independent-comic-book-publishers/

>>7068826
Current Contests:

Zenon Magazine:
https://comic-zenon.com/article/entry/2023/05/09/132801

Silent Manga Audition: https://www.manga-audition.com/sma20-memorable-smile/

Magic international manga contest: https://www.shibuya-productions.com/en/magic/magic-international-manga-contest.html,73

4-koma Contest:
https://kitakyushu-mangataisho.com/en/

Mangano:
https://manga-no.com/mangano_award_1st#rules

/mmg/'s very own anon-led anthology: /ic/onography
https://discord.gg/QYnFBves7V
https://forms.gle/d3a2Cwwd44sJYyqv9

Additional community added Resources:
Mangafonts: https://mangafonts.carrd.co/
Hiro Mashima YT: https://www.youtube.com/@mashimaCh/videos

How (You) can help /mmg/:

> Know about a contest or a publishing opportunity? TAG THE OP and post a link.
> Have a new resource? TAG THE OP and link / mention it for inclusion.
> Have a link / DL for a mentioned resource? TAG THE OP and mention what you're supplying a link for.
> SCREENSHOT / PASTEBIN effortposts that help you for posterity.

I'm gonna try to upload a comic to medibang's Artstreet, but I noticed that it uses the MangaPlusCreators reader, so should I just upload to the Manga Plus Creators app? to the medibang one? Both?
I do know Medibang has ties with Shueisha so I want to inform myself a little better before doing it.

I've noticed that the quality bar for MangaPlus Creators is way above webtoon's though, even in the bottom of the barrel tier.

Also, is it specifically Shonen?
It never specifies to be entirely Shonen Jump so I just assumed it to be all Shueisha, but I've haven't found anything from Ultra Jump! (Seinen) Or Cookie (Josei).
Do I have to post exclusively Shonen series or do creators have more liberty?

>>7068853
Never noticed any real requirements one way or another to simply post on MPC. Just keep in mind that they do censor for nudity (happened to me), but they are satisfied with simple black bars.

As for quality, it seems more or less the same to me as any other hosting site. This is one of their all time most popular comics, Cat vs the World:

https://medibang.com/mpc/episodes/ip2309020822025040025180524/

I highly, HIGHLY, doubt you draw worse than this.

>>7068866
I really don't, but even then, I've seen worse in Webtoon really, but now regarding to medibang's Artstreet and MPC, is it the same thing? Or if you publish in one you publish in both but not viceversa or how does it work?
Me and a friend are trying to publish, he's trying to escape Webtoon's censorship and I'm a first timer.

OP I'm curious as to what you post as the source image, is it just whatever you are reading?

You guys think the mainstream west is ever going to start getting into more psychological and inspirational manga? they cant be into eating shonen slop forever right? its good especially as a kid but no way the market will never explore beyond battle manga rigth???????????/// we're talking about grown ass westerners who keep watching shit like cucku no hero or shitshitsu kaisen and never think 'maybe i should look for more, this can't be all manga and anime has to offer right?' right??//?
guys?????????????????

>>7068975
I've made around the last five (six?) threads for everyone. I just pick whatever random manga that comes to mind at the time. Then I go through and try to find a (somewhat) cool page.

>>7069234
You are never going to have something like that to even remotely get as widely accepted as shonen (or even isekai generally) - it'd be like expecting old fashioned thriller movies to get even 20% of the mainstream appeal as Marvel at the box office, and that sadly isn't going to happen.

>>7068894
My undestanding is thay the two instances are separate, having posted to both. You are warned however, that the UI is terrible to use on both when compared to other sites. Really wish they would make it easier to navigate around.

digital comics: margins or no?

>>7069285
Yes. There's simply no good reason not to.

>>7069234
Part of the problem is apparently you, because you seem incapable of looking beyond VIZ releases.

Pic up books from some of the other publishers.

>>7068866
>https://medibang.com/mpc/episodes/ip2309020822025040025180524/
im pretty sure some people are botting views on medibang for a chance to win an award because most one shots get 100 views 1000-5000 if the cover is really good and there have been some manga that have like 10 comments saying basically the same vague praise i dont belive that even the best drawn manga on there really gets over 20k views organically

>>7069481
Some people hate read, or cringe read. There was some "comic" on tapas I think, it was labeled Horror/Thriller, and it was some Sami Ways tier woman and the entire story was one done in terrible selfies, with a short caption or hashtag. It had a ton of views, but if you check the comments its just people making fun of it. But they keep commenting deep into it, so engagement is engagement

>>7069481
That's sad if they go to all that effort for what is essentially a worthless "award."

>>7069488
Sure, but 1.3 MILLION views? I'm not saying it's impossible, but those views coupled with a very low relative comment count... whole thing smells fishy to me.

>>7069508
>worthless "award."
i mean paying 100$ or less buying who knows how many views and potentially recieving 600$ plus being published on manga+ isnt that bad of a trade off, its hard to belive 100k+ views on a fringe website even if the artist has a pre existing fanbase especially when most new entries dont brake 300 views(though most of them are dogshit quality)

>>7069481
What is this slop

>>7069717
It's a person with over 1.8 million views on Medibang, 7k twitters followers, and 400k youtube subs.
Clearly any criticism you have is cause you're broke and jellu

>>7069724
Good for them, but that will never bring back the braincells that died reading this

Crossposting from /lit/, hope that's okay.

>How do you organize character data?

I would use World Trigger's character data pages as a base, but I know that the author has a ton of character profile stuff he doesn't make public.

Would you use an image editor? (I could use Clip Studio to draw facial expressions and also have text explaining stuff).

Or just brainstorm loosely until you get a feel for a character?

Or write down a detailed document for each character and organize them by tag or folder based on affiliation/group/etc.?

>>7069924
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FHons2KWUAElZh4?format=png&name=4096x4096

This is what I use to do a general summary of my characters.

>>7069481
For what it's worth, I think it might count each viewed page of the comic as a separate view. There's definitely still some sus numbers out there though, and a lot of comments do read like botposts.

>>7069519
>plus being published on manga+
That's only if the management like it. This is still a platform largely vetted by humans, it's not algorithmically automated. Botting views won't do any good if the people judging the entries take one look at say "oh, it's botted/hate reads" and move on.

>>7069724
That definitely smells of botting though (unless they're somehow a competent youtuber).

>>7069924
Loosely brainstorm, I don't think I've ever run into an issue where a character has had some many details of note that I've had to create a whole infographic for them. I usually keep it pretty simple. "This is what they're after, here's a note or two about their personality, here are some design elements that are important", stuff like that. I think the stats and shit is pure audience-facing trivia made up later, strikes me as pointless details for the writer to work out while they're coming up with the character when they have more important shit to do than try to figure what zodiac the character was born under.

>>7070000
Checked, very impressive. And don't forget other pointless details like blood type, lol.

Next page of Lustless underway

when did you realize you will never ever be a real mangaka

Uploading schedule?
I'm starting to put out some pages, but they aren't chapters. Are there some sites you upload page by page vs larger dumps? I was thinking pixiv, but this my first "manga", I have no frame of reference

>>7069960
Very cool, thank you.
>>7070000
>I think the stats and shit is pure audience-facing trivia made up later, strikes me as pointless details for the writer to work out while they're coming up with the character when they have more important shit to do than try to figure what zodiac the character was born under.
I would agree in general if the manga in question were not World Trigger. Anyway, thank you for sharing your thoughts.

>>7070177
I never thought I would be a real mangaka, and frankly I have no wish to be. The thought of working myself for 12 hour days to an early grave has no appeal. I just want to tell stories on my own time for others to enjoy.

>>7070179
You can upload individual pages to Pixiv if you want, but they also allow for you to upload an entire chapter simultaneously. Frankly I would wait until you have a workable "chapter" (decide where is a good stopping point in the story) and then upload it all together. Nobody wants to have to keep clicking for more pages.

Is there a decent publishing site that focuses on josei?
I took down my comics from Tapas because it inflates the view counts (if you upload 30 pages for one chapter and one dude reads it, it comes up as 30 views, if you upload 3 pages, it comes up as 3 views)
And I have to compete with over a million generic korean dramas, and webtoons is a no-go for me.

>>7070235
>and webtoons is a no-go for me.
why?

>>7070235
>that Tapas algorithm for inflating viewership counts
You have got to be fucking kidding me. That is simultaneously so genius and so stupid.

>>7070245
Even in the remote case they start paying me, it’ll be an exploitative rate. And honestly I’m better just drawing coomershit to live.

>>7070252
The lesson here is trust nobody ever.

>>7070177
The day I decided that I didn’t want my aorta to explode, to work to the bone, to have no life, and to be exploited then discarded when I don’t reach a certain quota because fans didn’t like a certain take or a change in direction instead of the status quo

>4 panels left

>>7070310
How many panels do you do in color normally?

>>7070338
Not this time. I have a colorist who does posted above and I’ll color correct it when I get to the editing phase

>>7070235
>I took down my comics from Tapas because it inflates the view counts (if you upload 30 pages for one chapter and one dude reads it, it comes up as 30 views, if you upload 3 pages, it comes up as 3 views)
That is fucking crazy.

>>7070235
Not sure how true this is. I have a series with a couple episodes collecting dust that have a decent handful of pages per episode, but still only traffic one or two views.

I'm a bit new to screentones and while I'm enjoying it a lot, I tend to struggle deciding which texture or density to use to express certain things beyond mere shadows.

Is there a list or anything floating around that can help with that? Mostly something that exemplifies the general use of certain tones and what not, ie use "X LPI at Y% Circle for tan skin".

>>7070839
>tfw readers stopped reading at page 1

It seems I didnt get the job so I retvrned to neetedum; So let's ger back to drawing again, kek.
7069924
>>How do you organize character data?

Now that I think about it, I've been drawing comics for 5 years, and I never did a character chart or planned a storyboard. I just draw what's already been planned in my mind. So I decided to try it with Madalena's costume and some information about her (this is harder than I thought).
I would have probably thought about the name of her principality much later, but I am glad I did it sooner. I was between Gothia and Lioni.

>>7070930

>>7070944
You should probably be storyboarding. It helps a lot.

>>7070930
as far as I understand it a view is one per chapter or episode which is vastly more retarded so I don't know where this idea that the count is inflated comes from. He is likely doing much better than he thought.

The bitter truth about mainstream webcomic sites is that if you don't continually fight for front page visibility and no amount of quality or effort means anything if no one sees it. However, the whitepill is that the numbers don't always correlate to your success unless those numbers are dollars. What people tell you directly is far more meaningful.

>>7070844
"draw your own manga: all the basics" by Haruno Nagatomo is a dated book but has a lot on basic toning techniques. Some of the old how to draw manga books actually have valuable basics like that if you're willing to dig for it.
I think observing and imitating is easier. The only standard you should worry about setting is the one you've communicated to the reader, like by being consistant or making something self evident (toned skin= tanned or dark skin)

>>7071029
It's been so long since I last read one of these, they're actually full of interesting little tips that I couldn't find elsewhere. Thank you for the advice, this helps a lot, hopefully I can find a more expansive list in the future.

>>7071029
I mean, the interaction was getting really low and I started making more money with it once I removed it and put it on itch.io with the option to donate, it's not a big amount by any means but it's more than the $0 it made on Tapas, while I break my back trying to bring traffic to their page, for them to make money out of the adds they placed next to my work.

>>7070235
>josei
That would be webtoon. Women 18-35 dominate that platform in both readership and content creation. And if you're worried about view botting, webtoon is by far the worst offender only followed by MangaPlus. I'm sure Tapas does it too but those examples you've observed have not applied to me, I've posted multiple files and have posted on occasion as little as 2 files and have not seen skewed numbers like this, and I'm very obsessive with stats. I suspect if they do bot it would be focused on their Korean originals they love to shill, I notice completely different numbers in comparison to the community section but I haven't looked into the area as much as to claim anything.

It's marketing to men that's the real struggle. You should know that you WILL have an easier time writing romance for women in the current self-publishing climate. So immediately dismissing webtoon of all things as a no-go sounds really silly. If you want to go with a publisher on the other hand, that's a different story. Your best bet with bigger names would be Image or IDW, may as well also send Dark Horse a pitch in the small chance they would bite. And there are of course a plethora of small indie publishers but I'm not versed in those circles to give any recs.

>>7070258
>Even in the remote case they start paying me, it’ll be an exploitative rate. And honestly I’m better just drawing coomershit to live.
You can turn down contracts you know (but always renegotiate before declining, just decline the counter offer if it's too offensive.) People in canvas do it all the time because they realize their patreonbux earn them significantly more income, and simply use the platform to shill patreon. And it's not an insult on the corporate side either. Say you make another comic that's also successful, webtoon is more likely to send you a more attractive offer since you've proven you're a valuable asset.

>>7071080
I see what you mean, maybe I should try on webtoons after all, altho rn I’m trying the indiegogo/kickstarter route, which ironically was a suggestion a publisher made when I pitched another comic

>>7071095
That's a smart suggestion. It's easier to make money self-publishing than going with traditional press at this time and has been for a while (in America, no idea about other markets except Japan where publishing is still beneficial) because boomer management at legacy publishers would rather run their business into the ground than adapt to changing markets.

But still recommend posting on webtoon, it's literally free advertising and the only downside is taking the minutes of time out of your day to post there. I suggest posting with romance as your main category (I'm assuming it involves romance since you mentioned josei) and start posting on a weekly on the dot schedule, starting with your first 3 chapters. Color is highly encouraged but not required, but it must be in scrolling format, otherwise it WILL get ignored by the algorithm. Unless your art is complete shit I guarantee you will find an audience very quickly in romance, especially if it fills a niche.

>>7070944
Going off of what >>7071022 said, you really should storyboard. Ideas that sound great might run into issues or might be better placed in a different order when you've had time to look at everything in the planning stage. Storyboarding generally can only help - at worst its just a neutral use of time.

SOUL

I feel like I'm going insane but is this a AI paintover job?

>>7071170
It could be, or its just the kind of "quick sloppiness" one comes to expect when reading manhwas, given the crazy deadlines they have. Personally I'm slightly leaning towards AI paintjob.

Also, that neck to head ratio, damn. I get that men generally aren't drawn with slender necks (duh), but this guy is approaching cylinder-head status, a straight tube, lol.

>>7071194
That panel isn't even the worst of it, it's one of those bl comics (clicked on the cover due to my suspicions) but holy fuck the yaoi hands are comically bad, it's not enough that they're larger than a toddlers body in some panels but the artist clearly doesn't know how to draw them at all so whatever she's tracing be it 3d or AI the fingers end up looking like flaccid raw sausages.

>>7071211
Examples please? Could use a laugh.

>>7071211
>tfw all my characters have big hands

>>7071224
Alright but fair warning it's some real body horror shit.

>>7071228
This big?

>>7071238
holy shit kek

>>7071238
Holy fucking shit. Also that guy in the upper right panel, is he supposed to be a manlet? If all-black guy is an even 6'0", brown haired dude has to be like 5'5". What in the hell are all these proportions lmao.

>>7071243
I doubt even the artist knows, even the few backgrounds presented in the whole comic aren't drawn with a semblance of perspective.

>>7071245
J-JOTARO?

>>7071245
I'm almost convinced fully now that this is AI. Look at all-black guy's shirt, specifically the drapery around (our POV) the bottom left. What in the hell is that awkward diagonal line fold? Why on earth would that be there, especially with those perpendicular folds that make way more sense? Nobody on /mmg/, hell all of /ic/, would make that drapery choice.

>>7071282
Also just the simple fact that nobody who draws hands that bad could render that good.

>>7071238
>This big?
Proportionally? Darn near. I think I'm gonna scale em back, I haven't officially uploaded anything for my manga yet so I might be in the clear

>>7071299
Big hands and feet aren't intrinsically bad, it really depends. Look at all the art for Street Fighter 3 - all those external body parts are intentionally drawn a bit big regardless of gender and yet it works.

If I want to translate my work to japanese and use DeepL, can you arrange the text that you get so its on the top to bottom format? Would it still make sense?

>>7071301
I draw big hands and feet because my artwork is cartoony. I don't think it rings the same as the yaoi stuff. I don't draw hands different for big gay men. But I will say that after seeing >>7071238 I think I might experiment with making them a little smaller

>>7071309
I wouldn't worry as much in your case because it's so heavily stylized, to be honest. It's jarring as hell in manhwas because they (ostensibly) are trying to have a more grounded appearance.

>>7071317
fair enough.
>>7071157
What is this? Looks like one piece

>>7071309
based nutmeg merchant

>>7071335
Good guess

>>7071309
I'd make the arms a bit longer, tho

Another page sketched out for my comic .

>>7071370
I used to, but with my "manga" I've made them shorter. I intend to ask you guys for for some advice right before I finishing inking my prologue
>>7071373
>Another
I dont recall seeing any of this. You got a link?

>>7071370
I used to, but with my "manga" I've made them shorter. I intend to ask you guys for for some advice right before I finishing inking my prologue
>>7071373
>Another
I dont recall seeing any of this. You got a link?

Any guide or tips on monsters design that anyone can spare

>>7071379
First time I've posted here. All I have are rough sketches. My original idea was to finish it and then print copies to sell in-person but that might be retarded. I've got a Twitter @freefriedmurphy

>>7071393
Well I like your writing. I chuckled.
>>7071373
And this masked fighter reminds me of earthworm jim and the poopsmith .

Ring ring. New Apocalypse Knight page calling. You gonna pick up?
https://tapas.io/episode/3087198
https://apocalypseknight.the-comic.org/comics/8

>>7071700
no

>>7071700
Are you guys actually publishing each separate page on its own? For what reason? Just finish the whole thing and release it together.

>>7071968
Each page keeps engagement up. Consistent content makes more people inclined to keep coming back. It's what most webcomics I've seen do. If I were to release 1 full comic, you'd get one every like two months and at that point the lull between comics would kill any momentum that is gaining.

We will be publishing the full issue on sites that do better with that sort of stuff but for these two we've done page by page.

>>7071988
nta but I'm saving up at least 5 pages before I dump

>>7072145
Hey man, more power to you. I'm willing to change my release amount/plan but I just have to know that it's not going to affect what I have going on right now.

>>7071988
If it works for you then it works for you, who am I to judge? I just personally would get impatient getting drip-fed the plot one page at a time, that's all.

new project chapter 2 sketch done
titles look ok, gonna use them on all the strips this chapter
really trying to pay attention to flow, placing word bubbles where my eyes land after the previous panel

>>7072307
The flow and the panneling definitely improved. Nice work anon.

>>7071988
Your comic has no engagement. Your plan isn't working dude.

>>7071988
Reading one page at a time is like watching 2 minutes of a tv show at a time. I would wait for a full chapter to release instead.

>>7072333
>>7072340
Be careful anons. The anon you're talking to is the guy responsible for killing hyw. He can't handle criticism or feedback at all and might start lashing out by destroying these threads with spergouts like he did to hyw threads on /co.

>>7072361
....? Don't /hyw/ comics literally pop up weekly? Besides, I thought /co/ was filled with drama idiots on all sides anyway.

>>7072367
Sorry I meant threads, not comics. I should go to bed, too tired.

>>7072367
Exactly, that place is filled with schizos

>>7072317
thanks bro

>>7072367
>>7072370
>>7072375
yeah, and the writer of Apocalpyse Knight is resident schizo and shitposter in chief. If these threads go to shit like hyw, I know who to blame. >>7071700

>>7071988
>Consistent content makes more people inclined to keep coming back.
Consistent substantial content, anon. Unless you're releasing a page or more a day, you're probably better off building up a substantial drop rather than, for example, just a page that sets up the next scene or whatever.
Gag webcomics can get away with releasing a single page a week or every other day because each page stands alone. Not the case for story comics like this.

I'm working on a new romance one shot. The premise is a femcel girl who lives in the Nevada desert and blogs about ancient aliens meets an alien prince of pluto who is a weeb for earth because he grew up consuming earth media instead of paying attention in class. If I enjoy drawing it I'll make more but I atleast will finish the one shot. Here's the female lead Penny Perez.

>>7072444
Here's another promo I did, with the Prince in his alien private school uniform.

The alien prince's name is Zag, short for Zagreus. He likes racing space ships and traveling the solar system while avoiding all responsibility and education. In this comic, ancient aliens theory is real so all the alien royal houses still use greek, egyptian, mayan and sumerian names.

>>7072444
Trips, nice. Speaking of space aliens, omeow you ever been out to Roswell, NM in real life? I have, and holy fucking shit it was such a tourist trap, which was totally to be expected. So much flying saucer shaped... well, everything, lol.

>>7071411
Thank ya

>>7072476
I've never been to New Mexico but I imagine Roswell would be like that. Penny lives in a desert town near Area 51, inspired by all the desert towns I've been to and driven through in CA and NV like Baker or places in Coachella valley near Joshua Tree.

im new here. can i post my script for my manga so you guys can read it and critique? or is only in the process of drawing the manga allowed?

>>7072515
We don't normally do script editing solely. What makes more sense is for you to at least have some quick storyboarding thumbnails to go along with the script, since this is a visual medium after all. What might work on paper may need some edits to work better with paneling.

>>7072522
ah ok i see. thanks

>>7072361
>killing hyw.
I have no idea what that is, so I don't know if that's good or bad

A three-panel storyboard for one of the pages in Chapter 4! I think I'm about 70% done with the storyboarding now.

>>7072451
Extremely cute, and this is the kind of idea that could turn into a smash hit. Ganbatte anon!

>>7072444
>femcel
at least make her ugly

>>7072574
You should keep that resolution. Soul

>>7072645
>You should keep that resolution. Soul
There's always something really fun about drawing within a small confined space while trying to express as much as you can. I use a tiny 2 pixel brush when storyboarding.

Side note: When I eventually combine Chapters 1-4 together to finally make an actual tankobon for physical sale, I'm thinking of including the entire storyboard at the back of the book as a little easter egg for any reader that wants to see how things have changed. If any of you were a hypothetical purchaser (of any manga, doesn't have to be about mine), would you appreciate that kind of thing at the end of a book?

>>7072677
Yes, yes I would. I love extra stuff at the end like that.
What I dont like is when mangakas put that stuff at the end of a short chapter, like its supposed to be alternative for actual content. I skip stuff that messes with my flow while reading

>>7072641
>>femcel
>at least make her ugly
maybe shes autistic

>>7072721
Ive dated (one) autistic girl, and she had a good body, no need for social skills. She was never single

>>7072444
thats a funny concept. has potential
>>7072574
good storyboard. wheres the finished page?

>>7072361
I don't fucking care about any of this drama between you faggy doodle sloppers go back to how's your shit-comics and stay there.

>>7072598
Thanks, I'm gonna do my best.
>>7072641
She's a femcel due to her antisocial personality, lack of sleep, and obsession with ancient aliens and working on her website and doing alien research. She pushes people away because she's dedicated to the mission.
>>7072721
>>7072723
Pretty antisocial nerd girls exist anons. The truth is out there.

>manga making general
only authentic Japanese wannabes allowed

So because it was ruled that a comic using AI art isn't copyrightable does that mean that one of the few way artists are going to be able to make a living is with comics/manga?

Is this my only hope to make a living?

>>7072781

>>7054428

Has anyone worked with people on fiverr to get help with there comics or manga and what wast he experience like if so?

>>7072834
>Very cool!

>>7072726
Still storyboarding the remaining 30% of the chapter, and then I'll start inking. This chapter is going to end the current arc so it's a bit longer than the last three chapters I've made. Thanks for the feedback though, nice to hear.

whats your mangas target audience?

>>7072976
Probably the young male adult audience, although if I got women interested thats a pleasant surprise too.

>>7072976
The future me

>>7072976
Just me
But if other people like it, that's cool too

>>7072976
Does JJK really have a split 50/50 audience?

>>7073043
Why is that surprising? It looks like KnY and AoT are even more popular with female audiences than JJK. Honestly, those ones seem more like Fujo bait and have lots of pretty boys, compared to like, DBZ, Bleach, Naruto, etc. which are more about the fights.

>>7072976
My current one is girls/women 15-35 and boys under 18.
If I get any following from that, then I switch it up do what I actually want

>>7073077
Have women as readers/viewers ever shown a liking to a series that had women fighting in it? The only thing that kind of comes to mind is the Magical Girl genre.

>>7072976
This doesn't take trans into account.
And my audience is 100% trans

>>7073077
AOT is not surprising to me because it's more of a horror manga and those are automatically more popular among women, but JJK isn't at all different from the standard shounen in terms of action. I think the only actual fujobaity character is Gojo?

>>7073123
I dunno, maybe Claymore? How did that do with female audiences? Most of the battle series with femaile characters often seem to be battle harems, with lots of fanservice, ecchi, or straight up nudity aimed toward guys, though.

>>7072976
If I take into account my Brazilian readers, it seems Blue Parrot Beak has more female readers than Altarusia. In fact, only men liked and complimented Altarusia. Which is strange since BPA was intended to be 100% aimed at men. The main characters aren't even pretty, btw.

>>7073193
Men like cute girls, simple as.

>>7073196
Universal Truth. Also, men appear to have a far broader taste in female characters (from cute to bimbo) than women.

>>7073206
I would agree to a point. Women seem to fit a standarized spectrum of what they may find attractive a bit more neatly, but there's still ladies who like various types. There are twink fans, bara body fans, fuccboi style senpaitachi, etc. Its just not as relatively large I feel.

>>7073208
Of course there are, but I believe that women typically don't go too far from their preferences. Rarely will you find women on the opposite end of the spectrum (extremely mature, bulky guys) if she prefers cute boys.

>>7072684
Ok cool, thanks for letting me know. I always thought that behind the scenes stuff was neat, so I'll try to throw it all in as a back of book bonus. Given the storyboard "page" sizes are so much smaller, probably 2 or 4 to a page.

>>7073196
Honestly, everyone likes cute girls. Even girls. There's plenty of girls I find that like a lot of ecchi stuff, or even buy castoff/H-figures, or and/or like those types of series.

>>7073206
That's because men have more sex drive which results in various fetishes in all kinds of flavors of women.

AAAAAAAAA I FUCKING HAAAAATE 3D!!! FUCK WORST KOREA AND THEIR SHIT TIER FAST FOOD ENTERTAINMENT SLOPPY SLOP!!! I'M SICK OF PRETENDING IT'S ACCEPTABLE BECAUSE "MUH DEADLINES" AND "MUH MENTAL HEALTH" BS IT LOOKS LIKE ASS AND I REFUSE TO READ ANYTHING WITH SKETCHUP FLIPS SLAPPED ON!!! I THINK YOU'RE A LAZY PIECE OF SHIT AND YOUR PRODUCT IS JUST THAT A PRODUCT TO CONSOOM ITS NOT ART AND YOU SHOULD FEEL BAD!!!

>>7073291
>>7073214
What's that study again where it showed that women who play videogames gravitate in extremely large majorities to the prettiest/cutest girl characters, whereas men were surprisingly evenly distributed (with perhaps a few percentage points extra here and there for male characters) across the board?

>>7073323
Given that some of them are clearly turning to AI, you'd think that they would train their LORAs to not make abnormally shaped men, since there are countless ones in existence they can pull off the internet that have proper proportions, and yet they, uh... don't. They unironically seem to like that look, where men are weirdly way too tall and the heads are dwarfed by the rest of their body and the hands are enormous.

>>7073325
You mean as in make cutesy characters in customization? Yeah I see that a lot. It depends on the game but I tend to play male characters, but I'm a lesbo so my inputs invalid.

>>7073332
Nah, I meant as in pre-defined characters, not so much user customizable. But the point probably stands all the same anyway. Barring a few people I know who would find it hilarious to try to make the most hideously ugly character possible, everyone wants to look cool/sexy.

>>7072834
Very nice, I love the way you draw the face, blog?

>>7073160
JJK is full of hot guys+ horror and gore, judging by kimetsu no yaiba that's the best way to appeal to both guys and girls. Also the fights don't last forever like naruto or dbz which turns girls away. Also there is minimal ecchi fanservice in jjk to turn girls away.

>>7072834
>when you're only 3 minutes into "Crusade and chill" and she already gives you that look

>feel like making a manga
>realize I'd have to do everything right-to-left
>feel my soul die a little

>>7072367
>I thought /co/ was filled with drama idiots on all sides anyway.
They are. and seeing from posts like >>7072361 >>7072383 it seems like they're already bringing their faggotry with them. Can you guys do this board a favor and keep posting here on the low. In other words, don't shill this place to /hyw/ or wherever you guys came from? I don't care what your cope is, that general is full of schizos and I don't want to have to scan through dramafagging.

>>7073435
You dont absolutely have to unless you're unironically trying to get published by an honest to goodness Japanese publisher like porn anon is (pls don't kill me, its just the easiest name that popped into my head since that's what you're publishing).

>>7073443
Just make a new general not associated with /hyw/ instead of mass infiltrating another thread. If the schizo sees you posting here they will just ruin this general for people not associated with the drama and that's not fair to /ic/ at all. Go back, stop taking the bait like autist and hit up the mods on irc until they ban them permanently. The boards barely has jannies and zero mods so you are better off there than here. Now get the fuck out.

>>7073435
call it manhwa

>>7073476
Betz/ Apocalypse anon needs to fuck out of here if he knows what's good for him.

How long is everyone's manga planned to be? Roughly how many chapters (or volumes of around 200 pages each) are you ideally planning to do?

>manga making general
its manga time sumimasen

>>7073510
All of you niggers need to go back. You don't even draw manga.

>>7073595
Post yours

>>7072574
Nice work
>>7072834
What is your comic?

>>7071700
I read the whole thing. It's not very entertaining desu. It's no something I'd hedge my whole career on, if I were you and your partner. I think a better thing for you two to do atm, is take the time to create one shots (30-50 pages) and release them in full when they're done do people get a complete product they can binge, and watch you grow over time.

Some feedback:
>your opening page is extremely boring, manga is essentially a battle to keep readers reading from one page to the next, your opening should be a hook that both sets up the premise, but also grabs readers by the balls with intrigue.
For reference, check out:
https://mangakakalot.com/chapter/dv934507/chapter_1
>Similar things can be said about how you introduce your main characters. Manga especially is well known for havingg really memorable character introductions, think: Jotaro locks himself in prison, Luffy pops from a Barrell, Naruto Graffitis the Hokage statues, etc... your first scene should be one that is both unique and interesting, but aldp communicates a lot about WHO your character is through action. Also, this is not exclusive to manga, you see it in Western Media too. Think, Walter driving the RV in Breaking Bad, Tony Stark's intro in Iron Man, etc...
>The art style, the excessive use of grey, and the lack of hard black and white contrast makes the entire thing hard to read. I know you're going for a mood, but it's not working, and this is due to lack of proper artistic development. You'd be better off using 3 tones, pure white, pure black, and 50% to represent shadow and playing with that plus hatching, the current style doesn't work. Having a 20% being the brightest tone sucks.
>Character design needs work too. None of the characters are particularly remarkable or captivating

1/2

>>7073646
Like I said, if this is your dream project. My suggestion would be to wrap it up as a 50 page one shot. Then go make a different one shot. And just keep making one shots to improve. You're also allowed to explore the same ideas from multiple angles if you like. Sticking to one story will hamper your growth and you'll only create a mediocre product one one will be interested in. You live in a world where attention economy is scarce. You should do your best to put your best foot forward rather than relying on gimmicks. Audiences I think will also be happy to wait a month or whatever, if after the wait they get a complete story.

>>7071700
Use a comic font, ffs.

>>7073736
nta but I disagree, that font kinda suits his style. It would be nice if it were a little more legible though, maybe bold or larger.

>>7073603
>>7073603
>>7073603
/wmg/ Webtoon Making General is a go for those interested

Is this a good story concept guys?

A mafia story, but it has wands and magic in it.

Think of the Godfather mixed with Fantastic Beasts/Harry Potter

>>7073785
Good on you for making this. I don't know if it'll get enough traction for a long catalog shelf life as a separate general, but here's hoping.

>>7073786
yeah sure. but can you make it interesting? can you draw?

>>7073323
>>7073329
kek thats just the fujo phenomenon, nothing new, infact how do u cunts not know this posting in a manga thread

How do i make cloudy dark clouds with just screentones?

>>7073786
Not bad, actually if you are open to ideas you could make a urban fantasy "my home hero"

dumping a few pages, let me know what you think or just enjoy reading.
1/5

>>7074252
2/5

>>7074253
3/5

>>7074254
4/5

>>7074255
5/5

>>7074255
Yo voidanon good to see you again

>>7074252
Oh shit its voidanon, always nice to read your works. I dont really have anything other than two points:

1) Am I just getting scale wrong, or are all of your pages landscape oriented? Are you planning on making one of those long books in the future?

2) This is a very minor nitpick, but I feel that the bottom left and bottom right panels in >>7074254 are slightly hard to read given the shading values/contrast you've chosen. This may just be a me-only thing though.

Otherwise cool shit as usual.

How big should the dots of the screentones be?
If I were doing this tradtionally it would be a simple matter of just buying the screentone and the paper and the dots would naturally be the same size everyone else uses. But digitally I can scale everything any way I like so I'm not sure what the "correct" size of the screentones should be.
I've tried comparing it side by side with real manga pages but they were too blurry to tell the size of the dots.
Working with Sai btw.

>>7074285
>bottom left and bottom right panels in >>7074254 # are slightly hard to read given the shading values/contrast
thanks for the crit! I agree 100%, I think I overdid the shading both on the background and the characters so there's no clear silhouette to draw the eye there, it's just a jungle of lines.
I think I can learn from this

>>7074403
I think just some mild shading on the walls of the building in the bottom right panel would work to help set it apart so it doesnt all blend in together. Same for the floor in the bottom left panel, albeit with it naturally fading away to nothing the closer it gets to the "spotlight."

>>7074285
>are all of your pages landscape oriented?
I was just making comic strips at first, but the idea grew and I stuck to the format because it's "special".
>Are you planning on making one of those long books in the future?
I don't have any knowledge about how to go to print but but a cute little paperback would be fun to make

>>7074253
>>7074254
It reads weird, Not a great flow. It goes up down, then left to right

>>7073877
yeah i would say so. but i have no clue how to start it off. im thinking of it being a revenge story

>>7074476
Sit down first and chart the entire thing out in terms of major plot points, don't just wing it completely. Your work and pacing will thank you later for it.

Did some studies of Chainsaw Man and holy shit the panels are so simple. Barely any tricky perspectives, minimal backgrounds, straightforward flow. For once I feel like I would be able to produce something comparable, I'm just not sure I would want to.

I wonder whether non-artists actually think this looks good or interesting.

>>7074613
I did a quick peek, and you're pretty much on the money with Chainsaw Man. Barring a few action-scene money shots (not including real life photos the mangakas took and then converted into lineart via CSP), it's a surprisingly simple manga. Almost nothing but boxes of various sizes for paneling laid out plainly, and as you say, some relatively simplistic poses.

Guess the story and characters are good enough by themselves.

>>7074613
>>7074626
Good storytelling and writing trumps all. Cool flashy layouts can be cool, but good and easy to follow storytelling always wins in the end.

Are there any modern shounen with elaborate/complicated chara designs (think D.Gray-Man, Hoshin Engi, Shaman King, etc. basically 90s/2000s era shonen jump) left? Especially in comparison to the minimalistic ones in stuff like Chainsawman and Jujutsu Kaisen.

>>7074613
>>7074626
>>7074671
Pretty sure that CSM is the epitome of a manga that became popular because of the violence, gore, cool-ass demon designs, and Denji being a "literally me" type who's only motivation was to touch boobies and eat food that didn't come from an actual trash can.

Plus, he kind bucked the trend of most Shounen MCs, and his relationship with Power was kind of funny and weird. The art and paneling was always pretty average, and it was kind of a good example of how you something doesn't have to be crazy and blow people away to be successful.

>>7074686
>Denji being a "literally me" type
Did people really take it this way? I eventually read CSM and Denji strikes me as a really pathetic, broken and dumb person but the comic doesn't beat you over the head with it so you just pity him instead of despising him.

>>7074678
modern artists can't fucking draw, so everything has to be simple enough for even them to do it.

>>7074692
Is there a particular reason you're shitting up this thread & the webtoon thread? Are you even making a manga or a webtoon?

>>7074678
Demon Slayer characters have a lot of detail

>>7074696
Where is yours?

>>7074690
At the basic level, where he was just a horny teenager who wanted sex and food, but yeah, the whole point was that he was pretty dumb and easily exploited by Makima, who treated him like a literal animal, and he acted the part, even if unknowingly.

>>7074703
I'm working on it. Are you?

>>7074707
Of course. I am also pointing out how modern manga art is getting worse by the day. You got something to say?

>>7070177
I AM a real mangaka. What kinda question is this? All you have to do is make manga

>>7074709
>You got something to say?
Yeah, how big is the stick up your ass?

>>7074733
>no rebuttal, just wanted to bitch because someone said something that wasn't sunshine and rainbows
That's what I thought.

>>7074322
60 is the basic, one-size-fits-all solution. You basically can't go wrong with it.

>>7074762
60 what?

>>7074767
https://tips.clip-studio.com/en-us/articles/6198
>Set the frequency to anywhere between 50 lpi - 60 lpi . [ 50-60 lpi is the standard frequency for manga ]

>>7074678
All the characters on this page are about as elaborate or complicated as CSM or JJK though. If not simpler, in the case of the enemy duelist there.

>>7074692
Modern manga artists draw circles around you, I, and everybody else on /ic/. They are still crazy skilled comic artists, just like old manga artists were crazy skilled comic artists. Nothing has changed but the styles of the time. So recognize what is simply to your taste and what isn't instead of conflating it with the skill of the author.

>>7074709
It's not.
You are basically just shitting up the thread to whine. If you wanna do that there's plenty of threads on /a/ that would be more to your liking.

>>7074686
Fuji, Gege, Gotouge, Isayama, ONE and IMO Soul Eater guy are the ones who started the trend of messy art and things not needing to be completely perfect which is popular now. Not to mention Takashi, the OG

>>7074690
I don't think Denji was meant to be a literally me, he's a funny shonen lead with no ambition or drive, that's what seperates him from other shonen protags and was so refreshing. But if the comedy in CSM wasn't so good, no one would care about it. The comedy and characters are it's selling point. The simple storytelling and panelling helps accentuate the absurdity of characters like Power and Denji and makes their behavior seem even more ridiculous.

>>7074709
I can smell you how's your comic shitters from a mile away. Can you fuck off back there already? Your general looks like it's back.

>>7074767
60L. When you get tone sheets IRL they have number classications. One of the numbers determines the value (how dark it is) and the other determines what density of dots it's using to achieve that. Lower number = less dots = more visible dots. 60L isn't the highest density of dots, but it's good enough to trick the eye at reading distance, so it's the "standard".
Dunno how you'd go about applying this to Sai. It's not exactly a tool specialized for manga/manga-styled illustration, unless I'm missing something.

>>7074778
There is no "trend" of messy art. You just haven't read enough older manga to see the ones that were rougher in the art department.
And your examples are nonsense. Soul Eater? There's absolutely nothing about that art that is even remotely "messy". It's clean as a whistle. Even when they drawings are wonky, it's a very tight and polished inking style. And AoT is constantly lambasted for its crappy art, nobody's trying to fucking replicate it.

>>7074686
>>7074626
>>7074613
You say this about Chainsaw Man, but the Bomb Devil arc and International Assassins are both full of incredibly creative paneling and storytelling.

>>7074788
>You just haven't read enough older manga to see the ones that were rougher in the art department.
Can you point me towards some older manga with sketchy art styles similar to JJK and Chainsaw Man please?

>>7074793
I apologize if there happened to be some creative stuff somewhere. I just clicked on random episodes and scrolled through, and a lot of it was just "Rectangle Land." Just what I encountered, that's all.

>>7074776
>Modern manga artists draw circles around you, I, and everybody else on /ic/
Hilarious cope. I said some comic had shit art, and you felt called out. You told on yourself.

>>7074773
I don't have CSP sorry, I just have a png of a screentone but I don't know how big to put it on the page

>>7074812
Sorry, I myself only work with Photoshop to draw. You might have to search Sai forums.... or just buy CSP when it's drastically on sale and get it over with forever.

>>7074797
If you're going to keep calling them sketchy, then no, I can't, because nothing looks like those series. It's one of the reasons they're popular, they're unique. Neither one of them are what I would call "sketchy", because nothing about them look anything like a sketch or like they're leaning into a stylishly-unfinished look.
Older sketchy manga... Blade of the Immortal comes to mind. I'm struggling to remember any names. Go read older manga yourself, you'll run into them.

>>7074810
You said modern manga artists can't draw, which is what I responded to. It's blatantly wrong, and downright ignorant. Spend less time arguing on /a/ and more time reading new and old series so you can suffer along with the rest of us when some retard from /a/ starts up with the same old WSJ flame war rhetoric.

Be the change you want to see anons...

>>7074793
I was personally never even saying CSM was bad or anything, but there is something of an "unrefined" look to it. And I don't even mean that as in it doesn't look good on a technical level, just that it doesn't seem to have a final layer of polish on it.

What actually bugs more so than "messy" art is manga that have a heavy reliance on screentones. Like, personally I think 1-3 layers is fine, but there are some manga where you strip away the tones, and there's almost nothing left but very scant lineart.

If anything, one of the manga I've been reading a bit recently is Dai Dark, which is another one where the art is VERY scratchy and unrefined. Backgrounds, ship interiors, and other things can sometimes just be abstract shapes. But I think its one of those things where the style can actually lend to the subject. Dai Dark's visuals are often pretty dark, and there's sort of marriage of like, weird technology and gore. So the scratchy nature lends to the strange, uncomfortable environments, ships, and locations, with busted up, used scraps that they use to get by for tools, weapons, and gear.

Dorohedoro looked a bit like this too, but it felt a bit more refined, but I couldn't imagine either having a more polished looking art style or presentation. Its just not what the setting calls for. And I kind of feel like that's a bit true, especially for some series like CSM and Demon Slayer (though not to the same extent of Dai Dark/Dorohedoro.)

>>7074613
when I see stuff like chainsawman it just makes me feel hopeless instead of hopeful. I wouldn't say I draw better than him, but he clearly half asses it and a lot of panels just look like shit. I read some random pages and its people just yapping on and on with panels full of text, so I don't know what to think anymore. I guess mangas can afford to have boring chapters that dump exposition and fans will read it without complaining, they're not trying to attract readers halfway through the series. But I don't see anything to learn from it, so I've been focusing on only chapter 1s of different manga for ideas.

>>7074822
>Neither one of them are what I would call "sketchy", because nothing about them look anything like a sketch or like they're leaning into a stylishly-unfinished look.
how would you describe the art style of these manga?

>>7074871
Gege's work leans heavily into big splotches with a lot of velocity in the lines. So I guess I would say he aims to convey speed and energy.
Looking again and Fujimoto's work I think I would describe as sketchy, actually. The line work is very loose and imprecise. It feels like it was drawn in a rush, with very little care put into making pretty lines or rendering details with much fidelity. Still can't think of anything that looks like it though.

>>7074822
>You just haven't read enough older manga to see the ones that were rougher in the art department.
>Older sketchy manga... Blade of the Immortal comes to mind. I'm struggling to remember any names. Go read older manga yourself, you'll run into them.

>Blade of the Immortal looks nothing like JJK or CSM, the art is not sketchy at all. If there are apparently so many old manga that look like this why can't you name even one?

>>7074877
do you nerds ever stop to wonder if this is a debate worth having?

>>7074877
>Blade of the Immortal looks nothing like JJK or CSM
Isn't that what I said in that very post? That nothing looks like those series?
>the art is not sketchy at all.
You mean aside from the literal charcoal sketches?
>If there are apparently so many old manga that look like this why can't you name even one?
I said it's not a trend and it's not new. I didn't say it was common, just as it's not common today. If you pick up magazines from any era except maybe the earliest 60s-style stuff you'll likely run into works that lean into having a stylishly-unfinished or rough, sketchy look eventually.

Last (You) from me, I've had enough time-wasting debates. I've got drawing to do, and if you have comics to draw like you claim to then you do too.

>>7074891
>You mean aside from the literal charcoal sketches?
This page is technically clean and highly polished, the opposite of sketchy.

I need screentone brushes. Where do I get some?

>>7073786
Instead of Harry potter style wizards you should do gandalf style wizards with staves and they smoke crack from big long pipes.

>>7073786
This sounds like Dorohedoro and JJK to me, but you can focus more on the organized crime/mafia aspects to make it more unique maybe.

Ok I will listen the anons and for this chapter I will make the complete storyboard of it first.

>>7075071

>>7075073

>>7075071
Honestly I'm impressed you managed to do without, but yeah. Storyboard is only going to help, there are no negatives.

I apologize in advance if this is more suited for the stupid questions thread, but for anons who have experience with this kind of thing how the hell do I print my comic? I tried to do it at a staples once but it came out as total trash, said comic is also unfortunately 3 x 4 since it was made for fun to post online without considering having a physical copy of it- and had zero clue on how printing worked. Admittedly I still don't, but I know now that anything I make that I want printed needs to be drawn on a much, much bigger canvas in the future.

Any tips for applying digital screentones and emulate traditional inking better? I use CSP but this specific drawing was started from a trad sketch.

>>7075238
Hi Gabe. I'll give you the advice my editor gave me:
Use rougher lines. Real traditional inking is imperfect. It's incredibly difficult to get perfectly clean lines in analog, and when you look closely at manga line work is usually rougher than it first appears, and that's after printing it smooths out some of the imperfections. In comparison, it's very easy to get clean line work in digital, so it can look inorganic when such imperfections are missing. So in digital, you should tend toward drawing the lines somewhat rougher than what you'd expect. Pic related is an example of what I mean, but you don't need to make it this rough. My editor told me to build up the lines with thinner, smaller strokes, but use whatever method you need.
Regarding screentones, honestly just use CSP. Paint the tones in grayscale (personally I just make a layer and drop the opacity to the value I want and fill it in with a hard brush) then convert the layer to screentone (either by clicking the screentone button or by making the canvas 2-tone monochrome, the former gives you more control). Unless you have a particular effect you want, the 60L screentone is fine, as is 85L.

Are y'all crabby or supportive here?
From 0 (crab) to 10 (supportive)

>>7075615
>Support each other and talk about your work or the work of others that excites you.
>Thanks to everyone for making /mmg/ a level-headed and helpful place. Remember, drawing and making comics and manga are difficult endeavors, and we're all in this struggle together.

Not far enough into any of my projects to really share, but I like seeing what other anons are making

>it's OVER for you

>>7075824
What's your character, anon?

>>7075878
K. Still gonna draw tho.

>>7075878
This is solid advice, what do you mean by it's over?

>>7075887
>>7075892
it sounded funny to me (the way they wrote in all caps and red and underlined "OVER" because a chapter isn't interesting once)

>>7075878
This is true, but I've already read past some crappy prologues or boring chapters because I've read that something significant does happen.

>>7075900
Yeah, was gonna say I must be a saint or something when it comes to readers, cos for any new series I always give it three entire chapters to hit its stride when its beginning, or I always allow the mangaka to maybe hit a road bump, cos not everyone is always going to be a perfect hitter.

>>7075878
Is this retard really trying to say that having a hook at the end of a chapter will leave readers feeling betrayed? That's a very common and well used device to make them want to read the next.

>>7075900
>>7075906
I have much less patience. If the 1st chapter doesn't hook me I'm not going to give it a chance unless there's some extremely attractive waifu that checks all my boxes. And if there's a chapter 0 in the front or it starts with a lore dump I won't even bother finishing.

>>7075919
ki-sho-ten-ketsu doesn't really have a conclusion, the last part is more like a peak

>>7075878
It's true, but I think in the indie webcomic market, this rule doesn't mean that much. Since most of us work with self-published webcomics, you know how difficult it is to make someone at least care for the existence of your work, to pass from the first page (they lost interest in the first speech balloon or the first draw they see).
If you already have a good network and social influence in your artistic community or are working for a company (like Shonnen Jump, for example) where the readers expect a level of quality, then of course you should stick to it.
Although I think if there are 100 people who managed to live by only drawing indie

>>7075919
He means cheap, blatant hooks. Don't treat your readers like retards, they can tell that just throwing in a new character at the end of a chapter void of any other interesting development is a desperate move to hold their interest. It's not the fact of a new character showing up at the end of the chapter that's bad, it's when you realize that you didn't make the rest of the chapter interesting and throw a new character in right at the end that's bad.

>>7075955
>this rule doesn't mean that much.
It's not a rule, and it only doesn't matter insofar as you're not going to have your series ended when it fails to capture a large enough audience, and you don't have an editor to point out when you're resorting to cheap twists. The effect on the readership is the same, and just because an audience who follow you the author might be more forgiving than an audience that follows a magazine as a whole doesn't mean you should disrespect them with last-second attempts to salvage a boring chapter.

>>7075878
>Rent a Girlfriend
>300 chapters and absolutely no progress

Yeah, right.

>>7076024
Judging by reader reaction to this manga as each chapter comes out, he's completely right, readers fucking hate it. But at this point they're invested, so they keep coming back. Obviously they're exaggerating, you're not going to have your series axed if one chapter performs poorly, but the point is that you have to remember to keep each chapter consistently interesting or your series is likely to fail. There are exceptions you can think of because they stick out, but you can't think of all the series that failed to keep things interesting and were cancelled as a result because that's the normal expected outcome.

Does any of this really apply to online comics read for free? There's got to be another model to describe how to get readers online when people are busy doing a million other things. If someone is in a manga shop, they're there to buy a manga and will heavily consider yours by looking at the cover. That's already an ENORMOUS advantage compared to internet comics.

>>7076039
Why wouldn't it be the same online? People might see a cool cover or image, think "looks cool", check it out and either continue to read it or bounce off it based on whether or not it's interesting.

>>7076045
If people browse through in their feed? Probably.
But as mentioned before, if your story is a slow burn, you're going to lose your audience, even if you have some top tier stuff that happens later.
The great thing about online, is people post images from way down the line. Someone posts some waifu, or an action scene, or even just a reaction face and if it peaks peoples interest, they are going to want to know more.
In a manga shop that isn't the case, you are really relying on the cover art, or a clerk or patrons opinion.

>>7076185
>The great thing about online, is people post images from way down the line. Someone posts some waifu, or an action scene, or even just a reaction face and if it peaks peoples interest, they are going to want to know more.

That happens plenty with manga, too...

>>7076185
But I always flip through a manga to see if I spot some cool art throughout the book

You don't?

>>7076185
>But as mentioned before, if your story is a slow burn, you're going to lose your audience, even if you have some top tier stuff that happens later.
A "slow-burn" doesn't mean it's uninteresting though, and I would argue basically any good slow-burn is one that manages to make the build up compelling. Breaking Bad and Better Caul Saul are both highly lauded slow-burn series, they still make an effort to make the build up a compelling experience. Things should still develop in an interesting way, whether it's a slow-burn or something that goes right in from the start. You should never put all your chips into the later parts making up for the early parts, because if the early parts aren't interesting nobody will ever make it to those later parts.

>>7076189
I don't see how anyone can really check out a physical manga and DON'T flip through the pages. How can you not, just in case, lol. What if the later art is cool? What is the later art is NOT cool? You have to scope it out for 2 seconds.

>>7076189
>if I spot some cool art
Exactly. The cover got you. That isn't always the case though, picrel. One of my favorite's, but the cover is boring, I doubt I would have ever picked this up, I only read it through word of mouth

>>7076216
The cover should catch your attention and give you an idea of what the book is about yes, but it's not always reflective of the art quality inside. I flip through to see if the art in the book itself is pleasant to look at or has cool moments consistently.

Reading American comics all my life taught me to never trust a cover for quality.

I also don't read any comics/manga that don't have art I like, story/plot are not enough to make up for it since the visual nature of the medium automatically limits it from getting by on dialogue alone compared to actual novels.

>>7076194
Yes but I would argue a majority (over 50%) of the modern audience don't like slow burns. Breaking Bad is both a good and bad example. It's a good example since it's popular, but I it was really word of mouth that got that to it's popularity. I remember trying to watch it, and it was boring so I stopped. I didn't try again until 2 years ago, and of course I'm glad I did.
I'd argue the sopranos would be more slow burn, but the characters and amazing acting is what kept people watching, more than just people saying how great it was...but it was great.

>>7076229
>Yes but I would argue a majority (over 50%) of the modern audience don't like slow burns.
So? You're not aiming to capture 100% of the modern audience, that would be ridiculous. Bakuman touched on this in a way I feel is pretty accurate -- you're never going to please everybody, so don't aim for that. Instead, focus on making something that 20% of readers can really enjoy. Even works aiming for mass appeal can't hope to win over 50% of a modern audience. If even 20% of the modern audience reads it you're doing very well.
And yes there's plenty of examples I could have used, BB just came to mind first. It's a relatively recent (mostly thinking of BCS here) example of a very successful slow burn, and if TV watchers can enjoy a slow burn then you can bet comic/manga readers can too. So long as the journey is entertaining.

Bump

>>7075243
Alrighty, here's another attempt. While your tips worked greatly in regard to screentones (in fact, I was able to place them in just 10 minutes instead of 30), I also realized that changing brush and intentionally make the drawing slighty less clean doesn't make that much of a difference.
Still, thanks for you help, might try making my next monochrome drawing with thinner pen sizes and see if it works better.

Anyone find that creating manga (especially storyboarding) requires a lot of concentration and is exhausting? Even on a day off I can only work 2-3 hours total usually. I wonder how serialized mangaka do 8, let alone 14 hours per day. Maybe the hours spent just inking and applying tones are less intense?

>>7077126
No, I love it and it comes extremely naturally to me. The part I hate most is inking.

>>7076903
>I also realized that changing brush and intentionally make the drawing slighty less clean doesn't make that much of a difference.
Well, "slightly" won't cut it then, will it? A different brush isn't what I'm talking about, it's the technique that's the problem. When all your lines are attempting to be single, long strokes it looks boring. The lines will lack character.
This is a quick example to demonstrate what I mean.

>>7077126
>Anyone find that creating manga (especially storyboarding) requires a lot of concentration and is exhausting?
Yes. It's a very mentally taxing activity, this what you should expect.
>I wonder how serialized mangaka do 8, let alone 14 hours per day
They're operating at like 20% capacity 90% of the time, I imagine.

>>7077126
Yes. I love it, but it does take a lot of concentration from me. Sometimes I just sit there looking at a blank "canvas" thinking about how I want the panels to flow, where the speech bubbles will go, etc. Its a ton of fun and exciting, but yes I find it mentally exhausting after about 3-4 hours nonstop.

And of course you're going to be slower than if you were drawing anything else since you have to plan all aspects of the comic - something a normal artist wouldn't have to do.

>>7077143
Well, that's great. Although I never said I don't love it or that it doesn't come naturally, just that it takes concentration.
>>7077146
Yeah, mentally taxing, that's an apt expression
>>7077148
To be fair I'm sure other artists also do a lot of composition work but I absolutely agree

>>7077153
I dont doubt many do composition work, just not to the extent of dozens of pages at a time complete with plot and exposition. I think the biggest challenge is just simply having the self discipine (or brain damage) to see an entire chapter or one-shot through. I love making chapters but fuck me if I didnt feel some parts were a complete slog.

>>7077172
Good point.
Also, it doesn't work all the time but a good heuristic to think about is if something is a pain to draw or write, the readers will find it a pain to read.

>>7077205
that's blowing my mind right now.

Ugh. I can't get used to a g-pen or any g-pen at all. I know it's kino or whatever but I prefer a more pencil-like pen, I don't know. I used to be a tradfag so I theoretically should be okay with drawing with what is essentially a pen but I just feel so much more comfortable with a pencil. I just end up returning to the Yowata pencil set on the asset store no matter what. I've got to keep trying though, maybe some day I'll finally find a proper manga pen I like

What are good G-pens to buy? I have always been ok with them, but never took it seriously trying to get good with them.

I personally have no good experience with G-pens. At worst they're frustrating, and best they're the same quality as a good fineliner but with the extra steps of dipping ink every few strokes. Not worth the hassle imo.

>>7077205
>is if something is a pain to draw or write, the readers will find it a pain to read.
I'm really not sure that's true. I mean, it's a pain to draw stairs, but it's not like it's a pain to read panels with stairs in them. What's the best choice for the work isn't always what's most fun to draw.

I'm finally over with the panels, but now i don't know how to typesettling

>>7076039
>>7076045
I'd actually argue anecdotally that the cover is more important online than on a printed book.
Reason being, the book selection at a store is infinitely more limited. When I go to a store, I might thumb through 10 books to see if something gets my attention, but online I'll scroll down and just see 100 covers that all look the same, my eyes will glaze over and I'll give up trying to find something.
Standing out would then be far more important to getting my attention online than in a store where the offering is already filtered and ordered and presented in an organized, structured manner, whereas online I'm bombarded with every shit tier comic with 5 chapters that some jp student decided to translate as practice that week.

>>7075071
I'M THE STRONGEST EXORCIST OF THE MAIDEN SOL-ACK KKKK

Post your links boys
I'm in the mood to read some mangas/webtoons

>mangas
I don't want you reading my Manga

>>7077604
>I don't want you reading my Manga
why would I want to anyway, baka?

>>7077408
Given how small /mmg/ is I'm very fairly certain everyone who has wanted to read my manga already has, but I will post it again just in case:

https://globalcomix.com/c/aecast

>>7077408 https://namicomi.com/en/chapter/D3zkjELM
There you go. It’s a paranormal romance.

>>7077408
There you go m8. It's about a bard who gets sent to a village that never heard music before.

>>7077821
Forgot the link like a dummy
https://m.tapas.io/series/oi/info

Hey guys, I'm going to create my first comic and I just had a couple questions. What resolution do you prefer to make your pages? I read that 1700x2400 is good, but I still wanted to ask what y'all prefer. And what drawing programs do you like to use? I used to use Sai and moved to Krita since my old version of Sai was so basic I couldn't do much with it other than nice lines (it was a version from like 2007 or something). I can make great lines in Krita too, but as far as manga-ish effects go I'm not sure it's the greatest program to use. I had to download effects brushes and even then, they don't seem to be that great and the fill tool is literal shit that leaves gaps and empty pixels everywhere. And filling in every single base color myself is a huge pain. Please tell me there's a better bucket/fill tool out there. I am kind of a boomer so I'm not good at this techy stuff... sorry.

>>7077933
Dimension-wise, what is good for a "manga" (especially one if you actually want to print one day) is different from what is good for a site like Tapas or Webtoons. 1700x2400 is fine, just always make sure to have your resolution be at the size of the actual page or higher so you can downsize as needed.

As for programs, a ton of people use CSP. For manga, it's likely the biggest market share, with Photoshop and Krita following behind. CSP is also nice in that you have a built in community that shares brushes and other templates. I myself have both CSP and Photoshop, but I stick with PS simply because I've used it all my life, I have enough brushes for what I need, and I frankly can't be bothered to relearn CSP's key bindings.

Lastly, you're gonna have to get used to doing things manually to an extent, never gonna get a perfect bucket tool. I just do everything manually with a brush tool, lol.

>>7077940
Thanks for the reply. Shit, I guess I was being hopeful that they invented a true fill/bucket tool by now. I feel like I spend way too much time filling in base colors, it drives me nuts and is my least favorite part of digital work. I used early PS all throughout middle school and high school until I found Sai, so I bet new PS would overload my brain. I suppose I'll grab both CSP and PS and see if I can make anything worthwhile with 'em.

>>7077948
If you're buying anything, I would frankly push anyone that is shopping around towards CSP simply because they 1) have a huge community with everyone sharing brushes and templates, etc. like it's going out of style, and 2) CSP is willing to go on sale twice(?) a year. The top tier at that point is like $100 or so, and once you buy it you're done forever. Photoshop on the other hand is Adobe, and we all know how they try to fuck you over via nickle and diming you to death. Again, I just stick with PS because I've used it for too many years and I can't be arsed to learn CSP's different keys at the moment.

>>7077667
>>7077733
I have not read nor heard of either of these ,thank you
>>7077821
I'm familiar with Oi but i've never read it, thank you.

How exactly do you guys make a living doing manga in the west?

Thread is close to dying, so I made a new one at:

>>7078211
>>7078211
>>7078211
>>7078211

>>7077146
You gave it soul.

>>7078217
Why? Usually it's best to wait till page 8, no?

>>7077363
good point. That is the "other" model I was talking about. Online you need to catch the attention of someone who isn't even looking for a comic to read.

And I do flip through comics before reading them, but there are plenty of webcomics with shit art or completely generic art that are extremely popular, so what gives? I'm just trying to dissect these webtoons and figure out what is good about them.

>>7078217
>Thread is close to dying
>not even at bump limit
fuck off newfag

>>7078389
>but there are plenty of webcomics with shit art or completely generic art that are extremely popular, so what gives?
Majority of people will simply click on whatever is at the top of their algorithm slop trough. Sad truth.

>>7078389
I think for most people, the art has to at least just be serviceable. I honestly think webcomics need to have several hooks, though: Some sort of interesting cover/first that looks good enough to draw people in. An interesting or thoughtful "elevator pitch" or blurb that sounds like an interesting enough premise to at least make someone want to check it out. Reasonable enough writing that generates intrigue, if you're not outright starting with a big action scene. Regular/consistent updates that also maintain relatively consistent art and writing quality, etc.

>>7077940
You can change every csp keybind, thats why csp its great, you can make it fit your needs, when i used ps it was like fighting against the program, doing anything was a pain in the ass