/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>>6985129
I said not just for anime, is there one for this with cartoons as well?

>>6985133
>>>>>>>>point
>(You)
apply critical thinking

>>6985134
>apply critical thinking
?

>>6985124
my rule of thumb is that the cheek should peak just below the height of the tip of the nose. for drawing girls at least. draw it too high and it stops feeling like a puffy cheeky and becomes a big fat cheekbone instead, not too common when stylizing females
that face from asanagi is in a slightly lower angle so the cheek also peaks below the vertical height of the nose

>>6985124

draw a shovel. put anime eyes on it.
>>6985143
great ref. never visualized it like that before.

>>6985124
You can see the cheek curve begin where the bottom of the eyes are. Or at least that's how I used to gauge it...
>>6985143
S-senpai?!

>>6985143
Thank you so much for this, it's insanely useful, is there more of this?

>>6985142
>my rule of thumb is that the cheek should peak just below the height of the tip of the nose. for drawing girls at least.
Kind of figure the peak of the cheek peaks belows the nose, that's the pattern with most artists I think, but thanks

>>6985143
NTA but i don't understand why this happens, how does the form construction morph downwards?

>>6985124>>6985124
>Could someone please tell me the proportions on the side of the face when it comes to anime and cartoons?
The proportions of an anime chacacter's face change depending on the perspective. Don't think of anime faces as 3-D objects.

>>6985124
just buy an anime bust

>>6985225
crab

>>6985215
Have you ever seen an Asaro head, or wondered what all those lines are in a Reilly construction? That's what that is. Nothing's morphing. It's where two planes meet, rounded out.

>>6985237
I see, halfway through the rotation that point goes from repenting the cheekbone, to representing the jaw

>>6985143
spbp

>>6985124
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2T7cDY7YDsg

>>6985225
Low-IQ shitskin post.
You are subhuman.

>>6985143
Thank you, anon, very cool.

>>6985124
>Could someone please tell me the proportions on the side of the face when it comes to anime and cartoons?
Or, instead, how about you use your eyes to look at your own fucking image?

>>6985124
don't do this hamster shit asanagi does

>>6985361
I don't know about you, but I like my women looking like chipmunks, cry about it.

>>6985129
>>6985134
What's the point of these when 3D models in anime video games get it right as is? Even anime figures get it right, and they keep the likeness and accuracy of the character they're depicting just fine. This just seems needlessly complicated

>>6985368
raped by stepdad phenotype

>>6985373
The mother?
Or her for being such a cute rodent?

>>6985369
the point is you’re wrong and the japanese audience sees the difference

>>6985124
You are jumping too many steps here. Maybe study the form first and then try to rotate the face in the space. This type of issue arises when you have no idea about the underlying form. When you want the draw the face, first visualize the 3D of that face and then project that mental image onto the paper.

>>6985129
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJE1HoHabMw

>>6985369
>What's the point of these when 3D models in anime video games
like say, Guilty Gear? it uses the same technique.

measure? are you a beg? good artists draw by feeling and that's it lol

>>6985369
>Even anime figures get it right, and they keep the likeness and accuracy of the character they're depicting just fine
Lmao no.

>>6985230
Such as? Most anime busts look like shit. The ones that look decent have semi realistic proportions. Might as well just get a realistic head sculpt.

>>6985143
Based

>>6985129
Anyone who posts this can't elaborate an argument

I really recommend preston blair

>>6986857
>t. brainlet

>>6986406
do you faggots need every information spoon fed to you like toddler
yes fucking go buy the realistic bust or whatever you wanna buy and use your brain to figure out the rest

>>6985124
Find a beautiful girl, marry her, get a beautiful child, then use her face as reference. Then take is as a challenge to figure it out and master the face proportions before she becomes an adult.

>>6987031
or just be high iq and get a child bride instead of wasting time like a feminism cuck

>>6985124
Stop trying to measure and start copying to get it down. You already said it yourself, different artists do it different ways, so copy one you like attentively until you get it

>>6985143
Who's the artist? Google only gives me this thread

>>6987972
It's obviously Simon newfag

>>6987972
source:
>>/ic/thread/6404606
IC asks the same questions over and over again.

>>6985741
>are you a beg?
Yes

.

>>6985124
Just remember that female characters are supposed to look like literal children according to every manga ever. Anything else and you're literally drawing a man

>>6985143
Sauce? Kinda looks like Simon

>>6989690
Never mind lol

>>6989374
Come on, there are characters that look like actual mature women.
Problem is nailing the look.

men literally just have pointier chins and bigger eyebrows

>>6990179
Left looks more like a boy

>>6985124

>>6990583
It's the shounen hair blob.

>>6990586
neither is anime

>>6985124
>Could someone please tell me the proportions on the side of the face when it comes to anime and cartoons?
There isn't any you fucking retard, it's as varied as real life faces are
You can't just homogenize proportions without ending up a samefag hack. You can have a preference but characters with different shapes to there anatomy will always make for a more skilled toolset of artistic talent.

>>6985369
These were made before the technique Arc systems figured out tbf.

>>6989737
You're both right, it's just most modern anime panders to pedos so we stop getting hot adult women. Lots of pre 2010s anime had plenty of hot adult women more than even cute looking anime girls.

>>6990801
If the first thing that comes to your mind when you see this is pedophilia, then you are the pedophile who is insecure about it. Child like facial features just have certain aesthetic to it and looks so beautiful.

>>6990819
this
plus they’re so small and tight

>>6985124
Fuck off beg, you have to feel the face, there's not a magic formula

>>6990819
sexy child

>>6990819
This photo doesn't feature 30 pantyshots of her per episode.

>>6990952
while a fair criticism of the photo, that doesn’t really address the argument

>>6990960

>>6990819
What the fuck are you even talking about, we were talking about anime characters. The fact you thought of (and saved) a picture of a child to detest this "logic" of yours, speaks more volume of your mental state
I literally was talking about anime like the topic of this thread was clearly about. So why did you default to real life for?

>>6991037
Precisely the fallacious logic you just reiterated in another ironic and mellifluous variation: beautiful child face = pedophilia.
Do you only save pictures of things you fap to? A simple mind that cannot think beyond "can fuck; cannot fuck".

>>6991037
what’s wrong with pictures of little girls exactly?

>>6991059
He doesn't like how they make him feel.

>>6991052
>beautiful child face
There's a different meaning behind that, but again, I was explicitly talking about anime characters.

>>6991052
>>6991059
Who the fuck saves data on shit they don't give a shit about? Quit the bs, faggots.

>>6991162
>hurr durr let me just waste time googling every time I need a reference, I can’t waste precious megabytes to save a jpg
it’s practically 2024, esl-kun, an ipad has terabytes of storage, let alone a pc

>>6991162
This photo of a shoe sole means the world to me. That's why I have it saved in its own array of precious bytes on my beloved sweet little hard drive so no one can ever hurt my array of shoe sole bytes.

>>6991173
>>6991211
>Going this off topic

>>6991236
is the topic you not being a massive faggot?

>>6989374
I think women with the second face look beautiful

>>6985124
Let me save you some time in your art journey. You can learn some rough guidelines for proportions, but you're never going to construct and measure your way into drawing an appealing face. You are thinking about this backwards. You don't draw better faces because your understanding of formulas deepen, but because you develop an eye for shapes as you observe and practice.

>>6985215
Because the dot at the intersection of the line is at a new location on the face at every turn. It goes from the cheekbone to the angle of the mandible, like a tear running down the upside down U lines

>>6985143
Amazing

I like how begtards are going apeshit over a reilly rhythm like it’s going to make them draw anime lel

>>6993115
>reilly rhythm
what's that?

>>6989374
you can draw girls like the right but you gotta draw the men like actual men with masculine facial features at that point (if you want them to look different) and not like femboy protags from harem anime. lots of manga have those manly men but theres also lots of manga where female and male heads seem to look the same except for a minor ass difference like eyebrow thickness. its a personal choice but to say theres no manly heads or long female heads is a lie.

>>6994889
>its a personal choice but to say theres no manly heads or long female heads is a lie.
So basically every head is the same with slight differences?

>>6990586
very cool and usefull image

>>6985124
Sad to say anime heads are one of those things that can't be "learnt" via a specific method like with Loomis or something. There are alot of things in these heads that stay pretty consistent anatomy wise like the zygomatic bone, cheek padding etc etc. But you end up using these anatomy as more of a mental checkpoint/waypoint since these heads are more rooted on raw gesture instead of anatomy.

To give an example, when you're drawing the line from the cranium > eye socket > zygomatic bone > cheek > chin. It's way more helpful to think of these anatomy as where a line starts and ends, trying to mentally force realistic anatomy/forms over these faces will more figuratively kneecap you instead of helping you. You have to intentionally keep these anatomy superfluous in order to preserve the gesture of the one line that represents all this anatomy. Over the years of studying multiple artists styles, you will start noticing what certain aspects are inline with realistic anatomy and throw out in favor of more gesturey forms. Vilppu's video courses help a ton with developing this "feeling" of what is right and wrong in a stylistic head even though he's drawing are realistic heads, his thought process in developing forms imo is the best for making cute anime heads.

>>6985129
THE ANIME HEAD DOES REPRESENT AN ACTUAL 3D OBJECT YOU STUPID FUCKING BASTARD

>>6998387
and yet arcsys games (and other 3dcg studios) keep deforming them as if they weren't

>>6999584
>>6998387
>>6985134
>>6985129

Anime faces ARE unusual and they are ugliest at extreme angles so they made a way to make it not ugly by mimicking 2D. 2D comes before 3D, 2D is also inconsistent because artists dont measure everything like you retards as well as prioritize making it look pretty over anatomical consistency.

>>6985143
simon posting? in 2023?

>>6999584
Xrd and Granblue have photo modes where you can look all around the model during a still frame without any angle-specific deformity

>>6999614
irrelevant since they deform those models per frame
in fact this guy >>6985134 copied them extensively

>>6990586
artist?

>>6999619
your face also deforms whenever you open your gorilla mouth to screech

>>6999621
here, have a pity response.
would have felt guilty leaving, knowing how much you need your dopamine fix that is

>>6999619
NTA, what'd be your method when it comes to learning anime heads? Since copying 3D models is not an option?

I've been struggling with heads, since copying them can lead to bad habits, I'd like to know

>>6999630
from what I've seen it's just your regular head but with the lower third (mouth part) reduced to a half of it's size.
the eyes seems to defy any logic so do whatever.

>>6989374
based japs

Literally simplified Loomis.
https://youtu.be/mWEKKwKZtWU?si=ol2g3zPhQJpWC_Qa
https://youtu.be/wYWnfJDxfts?si=BEOpKCn09ujCgqfa

>>7000012
Meant for>>6999630

>>6999636
Huh, never noticed that, thanks anon!

>>7000012
>>7000021
Thanks for these

>>6998387
retard

>>6985129
>>6985134
https://sketchfab.com/3d-models/yor-eb40444c37a24229a8d0e9499945f168

>>7002307
there’s a lot of cheating with invisible geometry and edge detection there, it’s literally changing the actual visible topography as the camera rotates, and it still looks like shit, I wonder if you actually studied it at all

>>7002339
>a lot of cheating
there isn't when compared to the post i quoted or guilty gear.
>it’s literally changing the actual visible topography as the camera rotates
you mean the out line for the nose? because even without it still would look good.

>>7002348
you didn’t study it at all, have you?

>>7002339
It doesn't change at all. That's just an inverted hull to get outlines, dunning kruger retard. Turn on the matcap if it doesn't you

>>7002349
i have just not consistent enough for it be effective.

>>7000012
nice

>>7002339
There's no topology changes, it's just cleverly edited normals.

>>7002357
>>7002409
Not him and I don’t give a shit about nigg/3/r semantics, the outline clearly pops out of nowhere with the eye still visible under it, then starts occluding the eye.

>>7002307
this is some nightmare fuel goofy looking shit
also, you desperately need to upgrade that potato

>>6986990
And still no arguments

>>7002445
>potato
the site worked fine and the vid looked fine before i put it through the webm converter, i do need to upgrade though.

>>7002307
>>7002445
oh my god YOR????

>>7002724
YOR MOM

>>7002412
it's called a shader nigga. it's designed to imitate an outline even if the model is posed differently.
if the outline distorts, it just means the shader isn't perfect at certain angles/positions.
it's incredibly unusual to make an outline shader selectively pop out to occlude something because they're usually created for use for several character models.

>>7002741
There’s literally 2 wireframes overlaid on the model, nignog.

>>7002357
>>7002752
correct
>>7002741
>>7002339
krugers

>>7002752
doesn't mean there's no additional outline shader. it's common to also resize the entire model, recolor it, and overlay it over the existing model to emulate an outline.

>>7002726
YOR THE BOAR

>>7002755
>doesn't mean there's no hyper-plurtonic gaussian distribution, it's also common to-
yes, that's what he just said you super-kruger, stop being retarded, every day this board strays farther from Loomis, what can we do at this point? are people just as retarded on discord?

>>7002754
you’re literally showcasing two different topologies, one of which overrides the other at certain angles, retard

>>7002759
calling backface-culling artifacts cheating is strange. it's just a graphical side-effect, not a deliberate choice.

>>7002760
https://bnpr.gitbook.io/bnpr/outline/inverse-hull-method
Are you a product of incest? Yes there are two topologies. The one on top is INVERTED (hence the inverted in inverted hull) so that it renders when you're looking at the inside of the mesh, not the outside. Is the mesh changing in real-time relative to the camera position using some gorilla shader magic you made up inside your head? No. Are you retarded? Yes. Do you know 3D? No. Do you know 2D? No. Will you ever study Loomis let alone 3D? No.

>>7002763
nobody said the mesh is changing, you gorilla nigger, the point is that the fucking outlines distort based on viewing angle rather than strictly adhere to a 3d form because as was already fucking demonstrated, the outlines pop in in front (read above, topographically) of the primary form and then occlude it as physical planes situated above the “original” mesh (as in what we previously perceived as the object), which literally cannot fucking physically happen in reality, producing different overlapping forms than merely rotating a physical form
are you fucking retarded, nigger?

>>7002767
>rather than strictly adhere to a 3d form
You didn't even read the article. I hope they find a cure.

>>7002763
>>7002767
eg, if this were an actual physical form, the overlap would happen at the blue line, but in the render, the overlap will be at the red line, meaning it is not an actual stable 3d form

>>7002772
>meaning it is not an actual stable 3d form
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect

>>7002771
I don’t need to read irrelevant shit when I have functioning eyes, you stupid fucking nigger, I can see the outline occluding forms that would have been visible on an actual 3d form because I can fucking see it popping into existence with the background forms still visible between it and the fucking occluding form

>>7002785
>I don’t need to read irrelevant shit when I have functioning eyes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intellectual_disability

I accept your concession

>>7002784
>>7002787
How is he wrong, you can literally see the nose being extended in the gif, hiding more of the eye and even hovering over the original centerline contour still visible under the new contour

>>7002795
they're arguing about two different things.

>>7002412
>>7002741
>>7002752
>>7002754
>>7002755
>>7002759
>>7002760
>>7002762
>>7002763
>>7002767
>>7002771
>>7002772
>>7002784
>>7002785
>>7002787
>>7002789
>>7002795
>>7002797
pyw

>>7002801
Your turn, bucko.

>>7002795
assuming you're not the same sperg all you need to do is use your internet priveleges to learn more and look into the article i linked >>7002763,
>you can literally see the nose being extended in the gif
I must have gotten baited for (you)s because that literally does not happen in the sketchfab link, you can see for yourself nothing is changing between the wireframe and the original, he moved the fucking camera when he took the two screen captures

>>7002807
don't care, pyw

>>7002802
never post works again

>>7002767
it's a stretch to say that back-face culling is contributing that much to a distorted 3d form.
i think the take-away is that we should examine another 3d model because we can't even remove the outline effect on this one to compare.

>>7002811

>>7002807
Are you an ESL?

>>7002815
pyw

>>7002825
fuck off cris

>>7002811
the other poster isn’t me, I’m still getting used to the new tablet

>>7002811
fuck i have so many impersonators this is my real work though

>>7002795
>How is he wrong,
There are no forms popping in and out of existence, no topology changes at all. The render looks the way it does because it's two meshes, a slightly-upscaled one on top of the other which had its normals inverted.
Insistently trying to formulate some bizarre mathematical hypotheses or claims about "unstable 3D forms" is ignorant, and trying to lecture others in such a state is a sign of Dunning-Kruger effect.

>>7002807
confirmed visual retard

>>7002862
this is cris from /3/ im talking to isnt it

>>7002865
nigger, are you going to address the point or just keep crying about some cross boarding boogeyman you’re butthurt about?

>>7002867
what even is the point anymore? the arguments went too off tangent.

>>7002869
the only thing that went off tangent is you deflecting the obvious by pretending the camera moved, it doesn’t happen on the link, bringing up some literallywho from another board and the 5 other pathetic attempts you made
reread the posts or fuck off

>>7002872
consider reading the dunning-kruger wikipedia before the 3D one

>>7002872
what the fuck are you on about. you two are just slinging insults back and forth.
there is literally no point anymore. you're accomplishing nothing.

I accept your concession

>>7002877
winrar of the interwebs

>>7002854
>>7002862
>>7002865
>>7002867
>>7002869
>>7002872
>>7002874
>>7002876
>>7002877
POST WORKS OR GTFO

>>7002880

>>7002877
take my upvote fellow redditor!

>>6985124
There is no standar or common way to measure the eye and cheek curvws. Do whatever you want and if it looks good, use it.

>>7002899
>he doesn’t know about the anime method
nobody tell him

>>7002307
YOR FREES THE WORLD

Bump

>>7002827
got a blog king?

>>7002801
>>7002811
>>7002880
they won't

>>7002843
holy fuck I remember this shit

Unironically and literally feel the form

Unironically feel the form

Bump

>>7012330

>>7002821
Why does this look like Varric Tethras?

>>7012330
>>7014048
/asg/fags are scared by it

>>7014222
damn…

>>6985143
>that middle soul

>>7014048
Source of the page?

>>7016043
copy slayers twice.

>>7012330
>>7014048
biblically accurate animu gyaru

>>7017273
What book?

>>7012330

>>7014048

>>7017724

Bump

>>7019423
you ain’t gettin no tutorials from me

>>6985124
I came to the conclusion that the way you do this is one of the things that make styles different.
>What's a good way to measure the eye and cheek curves?
It roughly starts at the nose bridge/beginng of the ear line.

>>7016695
>left to right
huh??? huh????

>>7019462
it's from a relic of the dark age of localization.

>>6991874
Thats not a woman thats a monster

>>7002827
i once again beg for you blog anon

>>7002307
god I want to fuck Yor so badly

>>7016043
I LIKE OLD ANIME HEY I PRETEND TO LIKE OLD ANIME
DID I TELL YOU THAT I LIKE OLD ANIME YET MY TWITTER PROFILE PICTURE IS FROM COWBOY BEBOP
PLEASE THINK I'M COOL BECAUSE I LIKE OLD ANIME PLEASE I BEG OF YOU PLEAAAAAASEEEEEEEEEE

>>6985143
i dont get it

>>6991052
This man is a pedo in denial on an anonymous board. Hide ya wife. Hide ya kids.

>>7023819
There is no single answer to OP's question, because characters vary, and the contour of the face changes with the perspective. This image only shows the change as the head turns left/right. Once you add tilting up and down, the position options become even wider.
In other words, there is no particular design rule about where to place the curve of the cheek. The actual challenge is keeping that curve, however it's placed in the design, consistent across various perspectives and situations. This is of particular concern for people who wish to draw in this style. After all, they are derived from animation. Faces have to turn. It's why "turn sheet" is a thing.

>>6985124
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2r9u5l0Y6k

Bump