/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>>6943489
No and that's why is been 404d for months kek

>>6943521
The funniest part is that anons have still been saying "read the sticky" the whole time.
Not even the shills are reading it

>>6943489
I have, 7 years ago when I first started drawing.

>>6943564
what does your work look like now?

>>6943558
To be fair, most read the sticky years ago.

>>6943489
I read it, but it mostly ranted about goofy made-up bullshit like "symbol drawing" rather than the actual problems I was facing, so I turned to other resources.

>>6943489
Ignored it I was too busy drawing

>>6943877
Its over

I did also, on june 9th of 2016, i remember the date because i used to store every crap i did with the date. This is how my stuff looks like rn.

>>6944391
this is how it looked before

>>6944395

>>6943489
I followed the sticky and the "big sticky" google doc as well.... its only an introduction but I found it helpful as a starting point

>>6944391
so it IS possible to make it

Niggas actually reading shit bro wtf just draw already this isn't a fucking book club

>>6943489
I read it back in 2018, honestly for an absolute beginner it isn't too bad, at least gave me an idea on the importance of fundies and stuff

It was pretty bad overrationalized pseudoscience (le upside down stravinsky, symbol drawing) typical of online art instruction, so no. You don't need to read a bunch of shit before drawing.

>>6944681
turbo/beg/ here, is it that bad? what would you recommend instead? i feel like "just draw" is just gonna result in burnout and no gains. obviously any beginner needs to practice a lot but with some structure to it, no?

>>6944771
It was just too "neat." Do this, get this. "The ultimate goal of art is to learn these 'fundamentals' and move away from symbol drawing," blah blah blah the usual bullshit. The first thing it has you drawing is an ultra-stylized Picasso sketch, what is that if not "symbol drawn"? It was evidently the brainchild of some wannabe concept artist, and frankly their work was not very good, though I know that's a bit of ad hom.

I think what you should do is develop an affinity for drawing, if that's even possible. Learn to draw for drawing's sake first, learn to feel, just be at peace in the simple act itself. Then, organically work on problems as they show up in your work. Going in headfirst results/time oriented seems to fail at an alarming rate. Everybody who got good says they like doing it or did at some point.
But people don't seem to care for this answer because it's too open ended and vague, but that's what I think art is really about. Gradual discovery and personal growth.

>>6944792
>The first thing it has you drawing is an ultra-stylized Picasso sketch, what is that if not "symbol drawn"?
You're seriously fucking retarded.
The drawing itself is symbol drawn but the way the exercise gets you started on leaving symbol drawing is by copying it line by line, that's why you do it upside down you fucking mongrel. So that the relevant information is the lines and not what they represent.
That aside your second paragraph is a somewhat good point, the idea is to merge both approaches. Working on problems as they show up is dangerous because early on everything is a problem and you won't even know how to identify what the problems are. It's better to have a base in things at first and have some technical know-how and terminology under your belt (i.e. turn your uknown unknowns into known unknowns). But yes, ultimately the "how to git gud in one year" posters are all gonna fail because grinding fundies alone will not develop enough comfort with drawing and sensibility to actually carry you through the tough spots.

>>6944991
Symbol drawing is NOT REAL, you dumb faggot. Or rather - and I shouldn't have to explain this - *everything* is symbol drawing, so it's not worth pointing out that *anything* is. That's all drawing is, is symbols. You aren't drying "the thing itself" so stop trying to.
It's the tards who think it's more than that - who think they're going to become so transcendent from grinding, become so giga brained that they start perceiving reality on a different dimensional palne - who never get anywhere.
>Working on problems as they show up is dangerous
There is nothing "dangerous" about drawing, god damn it. This is exactly the mentality I'm criticizing. This notion that we're born with original sin, and all practice is about purging yourself of evil. Have some fun and lighten up a little, and work on one problem at a time. It's literally not that bad.

>>6944999
>Or rather - and I shouldn't have to explain this - *everything* is symbol drawing
Are you so fucking stupid that you think every term is literal?
Obviously it's impossible to draw without abstraction, but the problem with beginners is that they abstract the subject's identity (symbols for "eye") instead of abstracting observed shapes, lines and values ("symbol" for "that crevice between the eyelid and the browbone")
Fuck man, if you can't understand a term like "symbol" drawing.
>There is nothing "dangerous" about drawing, god damn it.
Stupid fucking literal retard, it's not danger in drawing its' danger in a mindset and approach. The danger is that it prolongs the time between your current ability and your desired outcome if you have to reinvent every technical concept in draftsmanship from scratch. People might get frustrated because they keep bumping up against a wall, have no guidance about what the wall even IS because they don't know how to IDENTIFY problems and quit art after a year.
Overly technical and results-oriented approaches will generate frustration, but "solve problems as you go" can generate a shitton of frustration as well once the artist starts to form a clear image of the results they want and they don't know what it even is missing, they don't have the words to describe what the problems in their art are, so they CANT even start the process of solving the problem.

>>/ic/image/okWU7F4Mw_3LdfRI5OWGtQ

I read the sticky years ago and I didn't follow it. :^)

>>6945064
If you can't figure out how to get good while having fun, I have no time for you. I'm done pretending that some people aren't just visually and creatively retarded.

>>6945133
I think I'm having plenty of fun and getting decent enough. I've been slow but I've enjoyed the ride.

Now post your work.

>>6945140
no lol
not sure why you even posted yours
retard

>>6943489
>sticky turns 10 years old
>dies
Is it an omen artsisters?

>>6945141
/beg/let talking big game

>>6945148
Whatever helps you sleep at night. Not interested in mogging anybody and I don't pmw when prompted aggressively. If "find the fun in it and work on one problem at a time" sounds unreasonable to you, then that's no skin off my back.

>>6945152
>no work posted
>no valid opinion

>>6945153
>You should just draw and let shortcomings in your work inform what you study
>I challenge thee to a duel! Prove your honor!
nope
every time

>>6943489
Yes. It's extremely basic shit I learned in my public school's art class that was for 14-18 year olds.

For serious stuff, read this
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0B8VO-JQCy3HgelpRajdPY3RSXzg?resourcekey=0-7iamq2WLg5aaDd3T3I8e1w

>>6943716
It's not made up bullshit when 90% of beg and all children do it. It just wasn't your problem.

>>6945158
Tons of effort to avoid posting work.
>You should just draw and let shortcomings in your work inform what you study
This is fine, I just think people benefit from having a technical jump off point early on, gives guidance and structure.
>all art is symbol drawing so symbol drawing isn't a thing
Nah, "symbol drawing" is just a useful term for the pattern that beginners do that hurts them when trying to draw from observation.
>Organically work on problems as they pop up
Without technical guidance, you won't know what the problems ARE beyond "it looks off". This is a good approach ONLY provided you have at least some basics to even spot and articulate problems, basics like those found in the sticky.
Somehow those last two bits lead to all your babble and zero work posted.

>>6944397
Very pretty.

>>6944771
You need to read it. That anon is retarded and thinks their experience that they didn't need it means others don't need it.

>>6945162
You're a real fool, man. I'm not posting my work because I never agreed to. That's a rule you made up in your head and you expect me to comply. There's not a single thing you could ever say to convince me to comply. Right now I'm just having a go at you.

>>6945166
>I'm not posting my work b-because it's not in the rules

>>6945164
>you need someone to tell you what to draw
It's like throwing in the towel before you begin

>>6945168
I love that you posted your work, thinking I'm obligated by the artist's code of chivalry to respond in kind, and in fact I don't have to. Makes my nipples pointy. Makes my dick hard.

>>6945170
>/beg/ with bad advice for other /beg/s
>not posting work

the classic

>>6945140
Great work! If you clean up your line weight, this would look fantastic. I like the inspiration form classic art. If you made the line behind her head gold it would better convey the sun is at her back.

>>6945173
keep going, I'm close

>>6945174
thanks anon, sun is supposed to come from the upper right, that's how the figure and lion are lit, the glow behind her is supposed to be some kind of halo.

>>6945169
It doesn't tell you what to draw. It explains art concepts. Art concepts taught in basic ass art classes. The amount of people who crawl into ic/ who haven't drawn since fucking kindergarten, need the ground work desperately. The greatest advice I was ever told is not told anywhere on ic/ it's ridiculous the hold crabs claws have on this place. Here's the crab advice and the results that make people burn out.

>Draw only one thing till you master it
>Now you can't draw anything else without it looking shitty
>Practice by drawing half assed floating forms
>Now you can't finish anything
>Never ever use references or you're cheating!!!
>Oh uh, ignore professionals in the industry who use references all the time including pictures of themselves.

Pic related is Frank Frazetta. A legend who made unrealistic men and women based on his own muscled body and his wife's hot body.

>>6945180
Do you really need a sticky to tell you to use photo ref? I feel like the sticky barely even emphasized that...rather it hammered in the notion that drawing is bleak misery until you suffer grinding "fundamentals" for a decade or whatever, then it miraculously gets fun when you can draw a realistic pencil portrait of your grandma. I think that's one of the worst ideas about drawing and art ever perpetuated.

>>6943877
That's the way to do it. Nice art, btw.

>>6943521
>"hmmm, im gonna focus on developing my art skills for a while, 4chan had a illustration board and a sticky right?

oh well.

>>6944792
You’re both right and wrong at the same time. The Picasso exercise is upside down precisely for the student to “de-symbolize” from what they think they know. The abstract nature of Stravinsky also helps in that regard. The goal is for students to treat lines and shapes as pure geometric forms on a 2d plane and how they relate to one another.


With that said and although it can help you to see reality with more clarity I’m not so sure there is one best method to become an artist. Recent generations lost faith in intuition and are so inherently insecure that they need a clear step by step plan to follow.

So after over a decade in this limbo my advice is to try very hard to think what you really want to do with art. The most natural process is through mimesis, or imitation, it’s literally how humans learn to survive. The same way we learn stuff like drawing. If you’re really serious about it take inspiration from what moves you and follow your intuition. It can tell you to learn from a master, join a school, read a specific book..

Don’t get into the rabbit hole or self-learning online only books. Rarely produces results without a strong foundation usually passed from master to pupil. I learned more in 6 months of art school without reading any book than going through all figure drawing books you can think of.

Ultimately you won’t get nowhere it you aren’t serious. If you have no goal and just want to “draw” to fill some kind of void in your life or reach for validation you will go from meme book and will linger in here until you’re too old to get anywhere. Like me.

Things to take away from this thread: if you listen to guidance, put it into action, and adjust to your needs as you learn and grow, you will make it.

If you argue about what the best starting point or way to explain something is, instead of doing that something, you are not going to make it.

>>6943489
I have been here 6 years and have yet to follow and read the sticky

>>6943576
The silence says more than a thousand words.

I did years ago, it's aids. Glad it's gone, I eventually learned. It wasn't hard just had to stop being stupid.

Still not where I want to be but at least I'm not going backwards anymore lol

>>6943489
Read the sticky and trying to study the books they suggest. Keys to drawing made a night and day difference. My skill is still somewhat bad but way better than before. This is probably better than going to art school.

>>6945140
Do you have more tarot cards or blog?