/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

Trad Art is now considered "unprofessional" looking to the average consumer, they want the look that the Corporations use, clean and soulless.

>>6612603
Why don’t you faggots just draw. AI is immaterial if you are drawing because you enjoy the process and result. Only cloutniggers and shekelchasers are cucked by robots. If you aren’t drawing for fun in 2023, you’re ngmi. Go become a hooker if you need money and attention so bad.

idk

>>6612603
>Why not pivot to a medium that proves your work was human made
Enter the realm of fine-art. Because I don't think you can compete in terms of efficiency with digital (AI assisted or not) artists for illustrations, concept art, ...

Lots of fine-artist teach. Because it's difficult to get good, original ideas, and to have enough talent to execute them with finesse.

So yeah, it's a good bet in the AI context, but it's not the same kind of job

>>6612603
trad work doesnt look good when taken photo or scanned, good luck being a trad artist online without putting your face out there too

>>6612603
nah, there are good printers that can do textured prints, AI can do normal maps too along side art. combine both and you already have a good product, the only problem is that those printers are industrial only atm unless you want to deal with chink customer service.

>>6612603
>Skilled trad work is basically AI proof
It's definitely a key thing. Other elements could include storytelling, concepts, symbolism, biographical elements, graphic design, type, and lettering (yeah I know AI can do text and some 'design' but it looks like shit and has no intentionality). The painter Robert Williams (pic related) has almost all of these elements in his work.
It's not hard to outsmart the algorithm with creativity.

>>6612839
Are you saying OP’s pic doesn’t look good?

>>6612603
A plotter could do traditional, I will be surprised if you don't see some machine doing Bob Ross shlock sometime in the future.

https://youtu.be/2QwnyKZo5mw

>>6612839
>trad work doesnt look good when taken photo or scanned
yeah, ok, sure lol

>>6613033
ain't no collectors (besides some tech dweebs) that want AI 'paintings' by a fucking plotter. the artist's story and vision is a key driver in the fine art world.
all I see is a litany of excuses in here by either shills or crabs.

>>6613043
what a sad pic at 1200

>>6613010
I like robert williams stuff. AI could mimic his art style, but I don't think it could easily produce a painting that kept the symbolism and surrealism of his stuff. (at least the current AI art machines couldnt. who knows what the future brings).

the kind of trad art that is not as affected would be gimmick modernist arts, etsy or craft faire type womanly folk/outsider art, something that is more traditional in subject like still lives, landscapes, oil portraits, narrative paintings.
that are NOT anime, video game, comics or whatever. in other words, the ones that are being affected by AI are not trained or equipped to make the kind of art that are least affected by AI. you think the average /ic/ artist who thinks of anime and nsfw when they think of "art" are prepared to do the kind of works that sell at gallery shows?
it makes even less sense for entertainment and entertainment consumer people on twitter to commission someone to do something in traditional just so it could be viewed on the computer screen or printed multiple times such as for book illustration.

>>6612603
How the fuck are these even done?

>>6612603
You don’t draw either trad or digital, now fuck off you retarded tourist.

>>6613048
Goddamn I want that S.O.D. painting

Tech sirs how do we copy 3d impasto bloody benchod do the needful

>>6612603
Try stained glass painting. If it's not the most ai proof it's got to be close. (Not my work obv.).

>>6613430
put more lines where it's dark, don't put any where it's light

>>6613552
Simple as

>>6613536
you don't just "try" stained glass painting like that, and i doubt the ones who did the glass did the design as well. there are some gimp ways of doing stained glass but it's mostly etsy stuff.
this is like telling fast food fry cooks to try opening up a michelin star restaurant

>>6613555
Well yours looks like complete shit.

>>6613762
No typically the painters also do draft work. Typical division is people who cut and assemble glass and people who design and paint. Some companies divide the craftsman into field and shop, others have them do both.

>>6612829
We need to bash AI shit to maintain a community of real artists. The moment real artists welcome AI slop alongside their own work the art community will be destroyed forever.

>>6612832
I want to draw alongside other people who draw. Not tape bananas on the wall. Retard.

>>6613792
Well that sounds like your problem.

>>6613871
>real artists
the real artists in question

>>6613871
Ganbare anon-kun!

>>6612603
I'd like to get into engraving. It seems like something you could make money at.
>>6613792
rude

>>6613871
unironically this.
gatekeeping is necessary, and the moment you stop shaming it is the moment they all think they're accepted and spam their bullshit everywhere.

i've seen it happen hundreds of times in the past.

>>6614631
like how twitter (mostly anime) artists took over /ic/
hypocrites

>>6614503
He's right, pros use references and trace all the time, it's an age old tradition and still used in manga. A good artist knows how to transform it into his own style and to change it from the reference. I don't put that in the same category as AI, which throws up rando recycled slop on command.

>>6614637
anime website.

>>6614654
The big difference is intention behind what's going on.

But I still think anyone who claims tracing and photobashing is okay is a complete fraud. Its "acceptable" when you're shitting out 5000 images a week to make deadlines for your manga, its another thing when you're using it to impress people about your artistic skills on twitter, and its 90% just traced over photobashing bullshit.

>>6612802
>>6612829
>>6612830
>>6612832
>>6612839
>>6612862
>>6613010
>>6613012
>>6613033

all valid

>>6613033
>>6613033
>>6613033
>>6613033
>>6613033

thanks for this video ! i really enjoyed it!

>>6612603
/ic/ is rooted in racism and tradition that's why they insist in making your go through loomis books instead of following our AAVE artists

>>6613883
Oh the irony.

>>6613883
Not all fine art circles are MOMA bullshit. One commercial art becomes inaccessible as a career thanks to Ai there's going to be tons of artists flooding fine arts circles and this will create the potential to start new movements.

>>6615935
I fucking hope you are right faggot

>>6614724
Don’t listen to this nigga

>>6613871
There is no such thing as real artists. Just artists. And if you use AI to make art you are an artist just like if you use a pencil to create art. The only difference is the guy using AI art is probably making better art, faster, than the guy using a pencil(retarded). It's like using a hammer instead of a drill. Walking instead of driving. Using a carrier pigeon instead of sending a text.

Get with the times, autist. The skills you value is about to be near worthless thanks to technology, and that's a good thing.

>>6612829
>let somebody else make money from your art while you treat it as a hobby

>>6619273
>implying anyone wants your art
regardless, can you stop it? no? so what are you doing?

>>6619244
This is the ai spammer

>>6619244
>There is no such thing as Trans Women. Just women. And if you say you are a woman you are a woman just like someone who has a vagina. The only difference is the woman without a vagina is probably a better a woman than the woman with a real vagina(retarded). Get with the times, chud. Your definition of women is about to be near worthless thanks to technology, and that's a good thing.

>>6619399
>>6619431
>so fucking stupid they can't even argue

>>6619309
>so what are you doing?
cope/seething nobody will buy my tumblrshit rednose art comic about being closet and shaming people that joined the AI arms race

>>6619478
No point arguing with nasty trannies. Just mock them.

>>6619244
>And if you use AI to make art you are an artist just like if you use a pencil to create art.
Even accepting the premise that AI is 'just a tool' like a pencil (which I don't), it's a shitty tool. Even digital pales in comparison to the granularity of traditional.
Anyone who has seen an original piece of art by an accomplished illustrator can clearly see the difference. AI looks like smeared shit in comparison.

>>6619510
you have terrible taste

>>6619562
>you have terrible taste
If you can't appreciate Wallace Wood, you have none.

>>6619510
The problem is that doing work at that level is too taxing, I think these days with the help of digital you can do high level work without burning yourself and still do original art which you can pick up and look at it, this is so important that I can't stress it enough.

Wally Wood suffered a lot and ended up killing himself because of health issues.
>For much of his adult life, Wood had chronic, unexplainable headaches. In the 1970s, following bouts with alcoholism, Wood had kidney failure. A stroke in 1978 caused a loss of vision in one eye. Faced with declining health and career prospects, he shot and killed himself in Los Angeles on November 2, 1981. Toward the end of his life, an embittered Wood would say, according to one biography, "If I had it all to do over again, I'd cut off my hands.
I have headaches a lot because I suffer from astigmatism and I think the same as Wood did, knowing what I know now I would have made different choices but this is life, you can only guess so far ahead.

>>6619655
To add to that, painting is my brain medicine, if I don't do it for too long I start to feel down. Digital work doesn't give any similar response in me, it's like eating synthetic food, it may look similar, taste similar but you know it's all artificial.

>>6619655
Wood suffered because of a lot of reasons, including the exploitative comic industry and possible undiagnosed biploar and PTSD (WW2 vet).
As for the work it's all about pacing yourself and enjoying the content. Robert Crumb also does high level work and has gone strong into his 70s.
>with the help of digital
Yeah staring at a screen all day isn't exactly healthy. My days as a full time graphic designer were the fattest most migraine inducing time of my life.

>>6614674
A good artist will use the tools properly, a poor artist will spew out blatant shit.

>>6612603
Photobashers are the biggest checks. Their shit is hard to learn and hard to master but AI does it in seconds.

>>6620571
*Cucks
Kill Google
Roundhouse kick Google.
Feed Google to wild animals.

>>6612603
Tradshitters need to stop trying to appear relevant.
They quite literally never got over the bootyblasting digital art gave them

>never post your art because youre shit
>never post your art because youre still shit 5 year later
>never post your art because its been 10 years since you got a cheap wacom and havent improved a bit

That's only true right now though. What do you think the AI isn't exponentially improving all the time? Anything a human artist can create it can eventually create in time. There's no fundamental natural limitation that makes it unable to create a certain type of art.

>>6620730
Ai is one thing, robotics is another. The physical aspect is the limitation.

>>6620804
That's only if you need a physical copy of the work though. An AI could create an exact digital recreation of the traditional physical work.

>>6613555
nice birb nice art (I hope the bird is okay)

>>6620730
>What do you think the AI isn't exponentially improving all the time
It's literally not though. even the big bois at Open AI have said they have reached limits and are not training gpt5.
You are acting like AGI is a given. AGI is still hypothetical.

>>6620682
>Tradshitters need to stop trying to appear relevant.
Name 5 top tier world class artists from the last 10 years who have worked exclusively digital.
You can't.

>>6620730
>Anything a human artist can create it can eventually create in time.
Ever stepped into an art museum? Literal cavemen can MOG AI.
>>6620811
>That's only if you need a physical copy of the work though.
Well you need it. A successful artist can make thousands a year off of original art.
>An AI could create an exact digital recreation of the traditional physical work.
LOL! Again, this reveals you've never seen physical art in person. The very idea is laughable. Hell, AI fucks up already fucked up photobashed Artstation shit.

>>6612603
OP pic is so good it almost made me bust in my pants hands-free.
how do i get that good at inking?

>>6613401
>Anime doesn't belong in galleries
>Araki's art went to the fuckin Louvre
Sorry anon, you don't seem to understand neither the anime or the gallery world.

>>6620730
AI cant make SOVLFVLL mistakes. its mistakes are miscalculated aberrations that look like a surrealist intentionally made it, whereas human mistakes are in the very fine lines

>>6621176
Yeah but that's fucking Araki though and not some retarded internet coomer. He's got connections.

>>6612603
Digital and trad can go hand in hand, You can iterate much faster in digital making it superior for learning how to draw and render for a /beg/, and the sense of aesthetic can be brought over to trad later on.

>>6621279
you can also just AI generate something digitally and copy it by hand and claim it as your own

>>6621284
You still need to learn to draw to copy it by hand, just check the perma/beg/s in /asg/ never improving while churning out subpar copies.

>>6621284
It takes skill to copy/trace well. Hope you're enjoying your tour.

>>6620489
are adult androids cheaper than kiddie androids?
kek

>>6621284
>trace AIslop
>it still looks like generic AIslop
lol why

>>6612603
Because people had other interests and expectations when they learned art. Maybe you'll cry because it's commercial, but say you were inspired by art from games or comics and learned how to draw so you could join one of those industries - you just got rugpulled and there's actually no place for you there, and no place for you in any adjacent industries either. Your only option now is to uh paint portraits and landscapes on canvas, competing in a very limited market with all the other artists shunted out of digital doing the same thing you are.

>>6624830
you will lose, AI tranny. your bugman techslop isn't going to be the magical black box where everyone's personal identity will simply vanish. It won't be allowed to be

>>6624835
I don't like AI and I'm pretty sure you're an AI shill false flagging, but how will it not be allowed?

>>6619709
>>6619666
Nice try satan, I'll still draw digitally because unlike you (supposedly) I actually enjoy drawing on a tablet

>>6624895
... And will therefore continue to work like that. Fuck you.

>>6624795
People with shit taste or failed artist don’t care

>>6624901
...and why should I care about people with shit taste or failed artists?

>>6624906
Patreon

>>6612603
>he thinks it's ai proof
Entire rap albums are being made by AI technology and you think a artsyle is safe from it?
>give robot arm and pen
Now what?

>>6627550
DESU anon you say this but that sounds like money and your claim is basically to have a glorified printer at that point with nothing setting it apart really.

>>6612603
Yes but skilled trad work also requires. And every "artist" worried about AI does not have that.

>>6627550
Do you see robots competing against humans in sports? At the Olympics?

>>6627747
>requires
Requires what? Skill?

>>6627922
For you.

>>6624918
>money
>working with customers
lol. i'd rather make good shit instead if I were to do this. I'd feel insulted if my audience was retards with low standards

>>6619709
Mort Drucker lived to 91, and was working drawing until close to the end.

Picrel: An illustration he did for Burger King takeaway bags.

>>6628071
boomer globohomo style

>>6627986
What? You didn't answer the question

>>6628071
Lol his name is literally "printer", in German

>>6612603
In 5000 years nothing will be safe from AI

>>6614503
That's called being a professional illustrator, not a real artist. For example, if you want to make money off furry porn commissions but you don't actually want to draw furry porn, what you do is you trace a frame from a porn video then you trace a dog head. The furfags will jerk to it anyway and you'll become richer without actually having to draw yiff.

>>6628109
>seething because AI can't do it

>>6628193
You're a skilled guy.

>>6628249
What the fuck are you trying to say?

>>6621126
deal
>dave rapoza
>sakimi sama
>brent eviston

>>6628071
love his stuff, thanks for posting. there needs to be a resurgence of classic cartooning and illustration. it's time.

>>6628259
Googled.
Eviston doesn't exclusively work in digital (in fact every image I saw was traditional).
The other two, well, *cough* ...

>>6628254
It would be very skilful...

>>6628375
i was obviously being facetious but are you really crabbing on mr. rapoza

>>6628394
What would be? Geez anon, speak in full sentences, I'm not gonna read your mind

>>6628430
He draws coom art, doesn't he

>>6620682
Youre obsolete digitalshitter. Time to actually learn how to draw instead of using g->Fill tool and photos.

>>6621126
Ishida Sui
Oda
Kubo
One Punch Man Artist
Miura

Get rekt

>>6621162
this is an etching by norman lindsay so the process is very different from traditional inking, but control of your lines is still pretty much king.
>>6613430
Etching
>>6613552
you could also throw the plate in acid for longer and get darker lines instead of adding more lines. In some areas of this print you can see that the light areas have similar density of lines as some of the darks like on the devil on the right, but the difference in etching times give you a difference in value.

>but I see nobody ranking it as peak art skill.
Could it be because you peruse opinions of dumb pedestrian consumers?

Ban AI threads.

>>6612829
I read this in Zim's voice and it was incredible.

>>6630896
I got traumatized as a kid when I saw the episode where gameboys got under their literal skins and became a part of their body

>>6613010
This is an excellent point. Basically all that image generators can do is make remixes of images that have been fed into its training data. In a lot of respects, they're very much like tracers or photobashers who rely entirely on manipulating images, but they're actually worse since they can't go outside of their parameters/training data, and prompting is a very limited and very fickle way of directing them. The only way to get decently well directed output is to supply material to use image2image on, but even then you're still going to need to do a lot of tard wrangling and the end result still won't match that of a skilled artist- who in the end would have expended a lot less resources and effort than an AIgger in getting those results.
See Cuckoldry Redditor basedjaking over their REVOLUTIONARY AI ROCK PAPER SCISSORS AYYYNIME THAT'S GOING TO CHANGE THE ANIMATION INDUSTRY- and the end result is quite literally just rotoscoping, but shittier than if a decent artist had done it.
One of the biggest issues that tracers and photobashers have is almost always that of what you're talking about- storytelling and intention. Something almost always feels off and lifeless in their work, and it becomes more pronounced when there's supposed to be an actual story being portrayed. See picrelated.