/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

just cope

You must be 18 to post here buddy

Death to normies.

>>6494518
maybe you should draw better for yourself

Put it in another perspective; you made this thread asking >>others<< about this sound advice thinking >>others<< are on standby ready to upvote your thinking. What you really should have done was jot it in a diary and keep it to yourself.

Do you understand now? You draw for yourself because you cannot expect >others< to like what you're doing nor should you.

>>6494545
i just thought people somewhere would agree with me lol that's really just it
but this is what i'm talking about, this fucking art bourgeoisie that fucking kick down small artists and giving bad clues on how to succeed
you ask how to reach more people and they say shit like this or "cope"

>>6494542
you meme around but its real man wtf does "drawing because you enjoy it" even fuckin means im doing this for 25 years now, but once you show it to others no one fucking cares wtf should i fucking do

>>6494518
>what will this change
Simply put, "If you dont love yourself, dont expect others to love you", this idea holds true with art.

When you draw "for yourself" it's because you're drawing with commitment and reason built from your very own self, in other words you have a **personal, self fulfilling** reason to draw, which serves as a driving force for passion, motivation, creativity, confidence and other important elements for your art and yourself to grow.
When you draw "for others" it's because you have none of this things, you have no personal reason to draw and therefore you are stagnated and blind from progress, instead you place this reason on others and seek their approval, other are your fuel, but this fuel blows up at you when your expectations are not met, putting you in the scenario you currently are right now.

When you draw for yourself, you give room for others to love what you do, because before they could love it, you already love it yourself, no matter how it turns out.

>>6494542
Also this.

>>6494553
You know deep down how to reach more people. What are the big artists doing (besides followers) that you aren't doing? If you take away social credit score it becomes clear, doesn't it?

>>6494559
i mean the main thing that i dont have is that i cant draw good
like that's the main thing
like, i only ask for people to give their ocs and i draw them for free i'm thirsty for any fuckin attention of someone happy to see art from someone else
just wanna make someone happy yknow

>>6494558
drawing alone already means i'm drawing for myself "drawing for others" isnt something that's possible i dunno what this fuckin means mang

>>6494518
the more approval you crave the less you will get. your art will be boring and stilted and tainted by the thought of "what will others think?".

>>6494579
i know but i cant freaking stop making art, its what ive been doing all my life and if i stop it i'll be more than worthless, it sucks if you dont have real talent

>>6494556
>wtf should i do
Draw or commit suicide.
There is no point in drawing unless you get rich and famous? Die, since you will never be rich or famous.

You could be drawing right now, but you ain't.

>>6494567
First off, learn how to fucking use punctuation marks, holy shit.
>drawing alone already means i'm drawing for myself
Wrong, the act of drawing and your reason to draw are two different things. Drawing is a action, a physical exercise produced by a thought process and driven by a reason. Reason is a mental concept that serves as a driving force that motivates your actions.
When people say "draw for yourself" it's because your reason to draw must come from your own personal desires and thoughts, drawing must be an act of self fulfillment, while sharing your stuff to others is an act for expression and further fulfillment that doesnt relate to your self fulfillment.

Im going to use myself as an example: The reason why I draw is because Im extremely fond to storytelling and creation, I love making character and tell stories, Im not good at storytelling or character design yet, but that is what I strive for. I want people to be happy with the things I do, sure, but that is because I want to share my passion with others, they are not my main reason to draw, but a support for my reason to draw.
I also happen to be good enough to bring some income with my art, which serves as another complement for my reason to draw, because it gives me good money I very much need.

>>6494583
im a suicide attempt survivor and had paralysed legs for a while and still drew this doesnt mean shit + im drawin rn

>>6494589
the only reason i draw is because back then in class i was fucking bored, now its because i want my friends to feel happy seeing fanart, i feel like its good enough

>>6494591
Geez, you're actually serious. I thought you were just another complainer.

>>6494597
i'm a complicated guy i guess

>>6494591
Good fucking god you can't even kill yourself successfully?

>>6494601
Get lost, nosebro.

>>6494601
>Le Newgrounds user
>Knows SOME people
>is so funny

>>6494602
>discord tranny finally outs himself
Still not nosebro or whoever the fuck your discord tranny friends are all called, lolifag.
>>6494604
>absolute incoherent faggotry
At least you got yourself to drawing, you stupid fag.

>>6494607
I forgot

>>6494607
Hooh, so you know.

>>6494610
>makes terrible threads
>makes even shittier posts
Who could it be but a discord tranny?

You are just sacrifices to me.

>>6494594
>the only reason i draw is because back then in class i was fucking bored
But then since you're done with school this reason is long gone.
>now its because i want my friends to feel happy seeing fanart
But then you fall flat when people are not happy seeing fanarts
>i feel like its good enough
You clearly arent if you're complaining about people telling you to draw for yourself, cause that only happens when someone clearly shows not being happy with their art.
Im out of patience and you seem to be obtuse, so have a last (Tú).

>>6494542
>>6494583
>>6494601
>>6494607
>>6494609
I recognize that face and that style of roasting. You're a fag, but you make people seethe so effortlessly and so flawlessly, so I respect you. You are a respectable fag, something you dont see often.

>>6494616
>I recognize that face and that style of roasting.
Yeah, no. I really am nobody, but i am everywhere.

>>6494518
It's actually a form of subversive crabbing. These kind of people have nothing better to say so they regurgitate a nice sentiment, afraid of being perceived as a bad person.

>>6494626
thank you, someone gets it

>>6494553
>giving bad clues on how to succeed
They are not giving bad clues, the problem is you want these big artists to give you the secret code so you can get what they have right away. There is no secret code. These artists give advice that you should listen to, but the biggest piece of advice you need to hear is no one is going to give you the magical answer to end your frustration forever. You need to get over your frustration of not being successful and take what you have heard from advice and work off that. Think of the situation like a model kit, these big artists are giving you all the tiny pieces for success, but you have to build the model kit yourself to get success.

>>6494628
>you have to actually use your brain and put in the work
not op but imo a great piece of common sense and good advice
too bad you will literally be carved alive by zoomers because you make them realize they are and should be responsible for their own success

> it's another faggot attention whore screaming at
other attention whores episode
negative self-awareness

>>6494518
So many faggots like you want to “BE” something rather than DO something and it’s why you go nowhere

>>6494626
>>6494627
>being nice is just subversion
To a crab, everything looks like a crab huh

>>6494518
Actually, about 75% of what you draw should be for You. These are the roughs,doodles,experiments and design sketching you will do for the homework required for making your work meant for the public viewing. Pic related took a lot of design work to produce. Five radically different versions of another character. That stuff might be interesting to an art paleontologist or fan interested in the creative process, but not your average Joe

>>6494518
Let’s put it this way. Would you rather just be someone who follows trends, algorithms, and constantly in fear of being “not enough” by your audience? Or would you rather your art having meaning and have an audience who loves your art rather than loving some trend. The former makes more money, sure, yet the latter is both more sustainable for your own well-being. I RARELY, if at all, draw fan art. The closest I’ve done has been draw characters inspired by Touhou or what not yet that has been years ago. I once had the mindset of wanting to impress people with my art. I would be so harsh on myself if I didnt make some beautiful masterpiece every time I had a pencil in my hand. Guess what? I was stuck for years. I stagnated. I couldnt get shit done. I’ve since changed my mindset the past 6 months and found my own meaning in making art, and I’ve improved dramatically. What seperates a good artist and a great artist is the meaning they put behind their works. Think of any great art piece in the last few centuries and it usually has something more than just a canvas filled with pretty colors and compositions. The one thing AI art will never be able to take is meaning behind a piece. If you’re chasing followers, then expect to be a slave to trends and always feeling anxious about staying relevant. If you find meaning in your own craft, then any issues that arise won’t be as dreadful.

>>6494518
Then go draw for others but don't come back crying with a new thread years later down the line about how unfulfilled you feel about your art despite all the validation you receive, I see it happen too often. It might not work for you but it's good advice for other people. I see artists with good skills who always having others telling them how good they are yet the artist still feels invalidated. For people like that they need internal validation, hence "draw for yourself" is advice for those types.
>and its always people that have thousands of followers
Duh, that's what you think because guys who don't have social media you wouldn't even see anyway.
>>6494563
I don't get what you are complaining about. If you are bad then you a have to find people your level and draw their ocs then and you will get your attention. What is the point of this thread?

>>6494518
I’m like you op, I find it difficult to find purpose in drawing for myself. I can think of exactly one time that I really just drew for myself. It was great - a state of pure tranquility and confidence! It was when I started this really shitty comic for the purpose of just letting go of all expectation and just purely creating. That meant no second-guessing myself or critiquing. I just made shit in a pure stream-of-consciousness state of mind without any regard as to how it would be perceived. I was hellbent on creating for the sake of the thing, to hell with everyone else! I was a machine fueled by passion! I was on FIRE, motherfucker!

I tell you that to tell you this… It’s been years since that glorious period. I’m not sure how to get back to that place of pure creation. I still make shit I like, but it doesn’t feel like it did when all those years ago I let go of everything holding me back and just… really CREATED.

Back then I felt peace and purpose and tranquility. Now I feel nothing except mild interest. And on top of all that apathy, social media growth is stagnant. It’s demoralizing. It kills me inside. All of it. I wish I could at least draw for myself like I did all those years ago, but I can’t seem to get back to that place.

>>6494518
OP, you're saying the advice, but what is it you're asking advice for? Draw for yourself is a catch all and applies in certain situations.

Be specific, people like viewers for many reasons.

>>6494712
>nice guy turns mean when called out
ironic.

>>6494518
If kids can draw for themselves why an adult wouldn't be able to? Did you get virtual points brainrot?

>>6494815
That's my one post in this thread thus far? Unless you mean that post is mean spirited, which if I wanted to be mean, I 'd advocate sowing mistrust in kindness like the aforementioned anons. Nothing good comes of building nonsensical biased rules.

>>6494819
>virtual points brainrot
So accurate it hurts

>>6494770
good advice from soulful based man.

>>6494518
It ultimately comes down to this: do you have fun drawing? If not, you shouldn’t draw anymore.

There's no bigger cope than doing art "for yourself."
>"yeah, I spend hundreds of hours painstakingly externalizing my innermost and immediately accessible thoughts into a communicable form... for myself"
No you don't lol.

>>6494939
I coom to my art and no one will ever coom to them until the day I day and even then if I know of the day I die I'll delete everything to hide the shame

>>6494518
most people just want others to be happy but don't understand that people get more happiness by actually getting good

>>6494939

>>6494939
Allow me to *ahem*humble you with this playlist

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHBCWmkfax8&list=PLaPC8V_k6CYWKudWE9RQHaleXpUBAG0Q4

Now ask yourself, do you draw just as much as these kids? Of course, you don't, because you hate drawing for yourself.

>>6494955
C U T E

>>6494939
If you see "drawing for yourself" in from a literal perspective, you are right, taking your time to do something only for your eyes to see is absurd in most cases. Art is a form of communication and as such, unless you're trying to communicate with yourself in some way, it's supposed to be shared.
But the way I see it, drawing for yourself means that the reason you draw comes from your own human desires and emotions, meaning that drawing is always a fulfilling experience even if you're the only one to admire it.

I believe my definition is what people sticks the most when it comes to "drawing for yourself", it's not "draw and dont show it to anyone", it's more like "draw because it fulfills you", it makes more sense when you think about it, since everyone understands drawing and not showing makes no sense most of the time.

>>6494960
>showing off your drawings in a YouTube video for recognition, validation, money, and/or a substitute personality
Thanks for proving my point: art is made for other people.

Do you know how long it takes to envision a painting, or a scene from a film? 0 seconds -- you literally do it in your head in real time. And do you know why you spend months or years translating that idea into a physical form? Because you want to share it with other people who can't see inside your head. That's why art exists, and anyone claiming otherwise is insecure and coping.

>>6494939
Yes I do. Cope, be jealous that I find self-fulfillment from drawing on my own and that you cannot, algorithm slave.

>>6494977
You still have to be ALONE drawing for youreslf, bringing what you want from within to fill an entire sketchbook, doll it up with colors, expressions, etc, and THEN you can show it to the world if you want to.

It doesn't work the other way around. You can't fill a sketchbook if your priority is to draw for others. What part of this do you not get?

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLaPC8V_k6CYWKudWE9RQHaleXpUBAG0Q4

>>6494677
Summed up perfectly.

You know what, you're right.
Do only art to show it to others and get those followers to become an e-celebrity so you get those sweet patreonbux and only end up posting videogame clips on your twitter profiles to stay relevant enough so that people don't unsub from your patreon.
You should have no other reason to draw but to become an internet famous and avoid getting a real job so then that you can get your own anime and get a Japanese gf who is also a voice actress, a vtuber and a pornstar that only has sex with you and pays for your hobbies.

Yes, everyone that say to """"draw for yousrelf"""" is just seething and coping because they are permabeg who can't break 50 followers LMAO
like fucking imagine drawing because you actually want to LOL

>>6494579
I agree then again that's the problem with our brains, not like there's a switch to stop craving it as it's rooted in upbringing or trauma. you need cognitive therapy for that.

>>6495027
I don't understand why everyone on /ic/ thinks they can only make money from art with patreonbux and being internet famous or concept art. There's so many jobs in the art and design world you can do with a decent salary without needing to be on social media.

>>6495043
wow like seething much? fuck capitalism lol
your just jealous you dont earn as much as famous artists

>>6495047
Yeah I admit it, you might be right. Kinda jealous of coom artists that I'm not famous enough to groom my one million followers.

>>6494939
Henry Darger

>>6494518
truth is, drawing for yourself or chasing the algorithm, it makes no difference. social media is very random, you see really good artists with no followers and god-awful ones with a ton of them. regular posting is necessary but doesn't guarantee anything. some got lucky by drawing shit they liked and got noticed so they kept doing it. even the most passionate person can eventually get discouraged if ignored long enough. my main advice would be to learn to have fun. what worked for me was first setting a regular daily time, stop beating myself up about not having done as much one day compared to another (I cut the train of thought short, it doesn't work well at first but becomes natural eventually), alternate between practice and pleasure pieces (don't put stakes on practice ones, it's about learning, not the result, you can put them on the more personal pieces) and regular exposure therapy to older work. first to reduce the anguish or guild at your former skills and also to build confidence by trying to find 1-3 thing per piece you think you did well. eventually it makes it easier to get started daily and enjoyment becomes increasingly frequent.

>>6495054
keep seething followlet
While you cry and get mad on 4chigns there are famous artist who make money by offering discord access and a lot of teenage kids (who i am legally compelled to say that they're 18+) who pay for it while other adults pay to get to roleplay as 18 y.o. and make new friendships and exchange private pictures with these definitely 18+ y.o. teenagers lmao

>>6495034
You can do the cognitive therapy for yourself you know. No matter how you feel, if you recognize you value something better, you can take steps to realize your ideal, instead of suffering for what amounts to bullshit. Smack your brain around and tell it to knock it off with those negative waves until you can build a habit. The more you learn, the more you'll grow, until you reach the point where anything lesser is outright disgusting, and it'd be an effort to even consider it.

>>6495062
Wow, a proud sleazeball pedo, who'd have guessed.

>>6495062
Are you challenging me, anon? I'll show you, just you wait in three years I will become the greatest discord pimp ring coom artist and master the ways of taking advantage of porn-addicts and tax evasion.

>>6495062

The pandemic is over. Ain't nobody spending large sums of cash on bootcamps and special discord access nowadays.

>>6495069
you're talking like someone who don't need it to begin with so your advice reflects that. and yes you do the cognitive therapy yourself, it's a set of habits you have to carve in your brain, but there's no magic "off switch".

>>6495083
You have me actually. I have never needed the advice. But I believe the advice works, based on science and no small amount of personal observation. What I'm keenly aware of, however, is just how little effect just saying it usually has. Usually, it takes some sort of life cataclysm to want to question to the level of changing something so ingrained.

>>6495073
You will never earn money by pimping out gullible teenagers who want to form parasocial relationships with famous people to predators
seethe
>>6495076
lmao as if
You'd need to first offer tributes to the already famous artists so that they allow you to enter the inner circle and boost your social media accounts lmao
>>6495077
youre're just jelaous you aren't part of any community
cope n seethe

>>6495092
yes, we agree. shall we get back to drawing?

>>6495101
I have to say depends on why you're doing it, don't I? Without going all "I got this buddy, see..." I hope you think about it anon. But sure back to drawing.

>>6495100
I am in some 'paid' discords, but I still prefer /ic/. Outside of this place, you'll only get "good job :-)" fire emoji replies unless you specifically pay more for 1 on 1s. At least on /ic/ you get a wide variety of comments.

>>6495114
step anon where are you point that big hecc frog dildo?

>>6494518
most of us have gone through what you're currently going through
you're not going get anywhere by crying about it like only a tiny sunset of artists haven't had this struggle.

youre fucked OP if you dont draw for yourself

>>6495083
The habit is the "magic off switch".
t. psychologist for 12 years.

Behavioral rehabilitation really is as easy as just doing something different for 90 days.

>>6495302
this is beyond behavioral rehabilitation you retard, it's not about making a lazy drawfag learn discipline or setting a routine habit. even if 90 days was universally applicable it isn't an off switch. I guess next you're gonna cure veterans with ptsd or deep phobia mr "above 12 yo".

>>6495378
Then just kys.
You're not entitled to other people's time and attention. Specially when you're clearly unwilling to pursue wellness and just want to whine your way into a vague idea of success.

How about:

>"Draw for Yourself but imagine some Greater Applications for your blossoming craft skill.

In other words, learn how to draw in YOUR OWN STYLE. That will take a lot of experiments, so do it. It need not be realistically portrayed, but have a market in mind when you start composing more complex pictures

>>6495100
I'm joking, anon I don't even used social media or discord.

You need technical skill and appeal. Most people have neither. Very few popular artists only have appeal (being consistent is a technical skill), and there are thousands of godlike concept artists that nobody cares about.

>>6494518
I usually think of this advice as more about selection of subjects that are consistent with your personal interest rather than a description of platonic ideal relating to the act of art making in general.

>>6495378
You're kind of right, it is beyond behavioral rehabilitation. It requires cognitive rehabilitation. There are success stories in every category, but you will never see a celebration like the cure for cancer was found, because each one is personal. Such is the nature of the mind. I've personally watched 'npc's, people with next to no apparent original thought or critical ability, suddenly become explorers of the mind and philosophy, like a kid learning about dinosaurs for the first time. I've seen people with no apparent regard for anything but status become humble and genuinely caring. And there's no small share of veterans and others- with absolutely traumatic experience who still become successful.
All of them won't, but there are few true hard barriers to the mind, even physiologically. And that is both terrifying and awesome. Because everything you do multiplies, to come back to either hunt you or turn you into a beast -and that, I can absolutely personally vouch for.
Do you want to be fickle prey to your own devices,(and anyone else who smells your weakness) or a demon hunter? That's the choice in front of you.
Have a good day drawing.

>>6494518
I forget which muscisian said it, but he stated that the audience always comes last when it comes to making music.

People dont know what they want, but if you know what you want, people will likely be on board. 8 billion people in the world, theres a chance.

>>6494518
if you only making art to grow an audience then you should probably go find something better to do to grow that audience. sounds like you just dont like art but want to be popular. go do music or something bro.

also stop using twitch emotes on fucking 4chan you cringe retard

ITT: Narcissist OP runs rampant trying to defend his narcissism.
Do you do anything except think about yourself all day?

>>6498033
You don't know what narcissism means, ESLkyun.

>>6494518
>i dont want to draw anything for ME
NGMI
literally just stop drawing, there is no point if thats how you really feel

>>6498156
>waah waah wah how do I make people realise how awesome I am without putting in any effort? Stop arguing against me and agree with me! Do something for myself, without thinking about what other people think of ME, how is that even possible?!?!?!
Ok, Mr. Denial.

>>6494518
You're fucked up and I pity the people who know you irl.
Seek therapy or rope.