/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>>4734285
> On the other hand, weekly publishing has created a demand for assistants, which is basically an internship/apprenticeship of future mangakas.

I think bi-weekly releases would still warrant assistants. Depending on the scope of the art, monthly releases might too. It's ultimately a case of detail over time; if people start putting two weeks worth of detail into a bi-weekly series, then I doubt assistants would really go anywhere. Bi-weekly stuff would likely command a higher level of fidelity, so simply submitting weekly-style blank-background quickly-done pages might end up putting people off. If you can't hit that new visual threshold properly on your own then assistants come back into play.

>>4734294
Other factor could be volume of pages in each release. Even if the art doesn't necessarily improve, twice the time theoretically means twice the work hours put into a release (though in practice it means more time to relax between releases).

>>4734156
>>4734169
>>4734178

Thanks for taking the time. I wasn't sure if you were going to come back.
There's not much talk about storytelling(at least manga specific), so I find it interesting to hear your opinions.

I'm especially interested in crafting an experience that's not a chore for the reader. Reading the work of amateurs and comparing them to the pros, there's a few patterns I'm noticing. And this is of course one of them.
Sometimes young creators get bogged down by trying to explain their world, and why it's cool. It's twice as grating if the intro is heavy exposition and the character dialogue starts with some mundane small talk, that could have been cut out(especially if they don't really bring anything to the enjoyment of the story or developing said character).

I'm still working on my art, but I find it sufficient enough for manga. It's the story and the story telling within manga(dialogue, pacing, panel layout ect.) that's got most of my attention these days. Good art won't carry a bad story in the long run. And, since publishing is also my preferred end game, being mediocre isn't really an option. So, thanks for taking the time and telling me a lil bit about editors, as I'm not quite ready to send in a pitch(and decided last minute for Tezuka to test my writing abilities). I do wish I could pick your brain more, but not gonna keep bothering you. Wherever you're pitching to, I hope you get a nice deal and I can buy your work in a bookstore one day. o7

>>4734294
Yeah, I think you are right. There might be less assistants per manga, but they unlikely to go away completely. And who knows, maybe more people will start write manga when the schedule is saner.

Do you know how most mangaka write scripts? (if they do both writing and art) Do they write them out as extensively as screenplays, or are they usually just rough bullet points?

>>4734324
>And who knows, maybe more people will start write manga when the schedule is saner.
Not the same anon. But, there's plenty of manga artist in japan who end up self-publishing. For instance, 10,000 sales in traditional publishing is considered low and you may be canceled. While if you can land 10,000 sales in self-publishing you're doing great. Either way, it's a demanding industry.

>>4734333
Not sure about most mangaka. But, I personally write the script first, just to see if the dialogue flows. If the dialogue is odd in script form it won't look any better drawn.

>>4734301
This is also very true. There's a definite chance that people would accept the same level of weekly art as long as the entries were roughly twice as long, at which point basically nothing has changed and you'll need an assistant anyway.

>>4734312
You're welcome anon; sorry it took so long for me to get back to that particular point. Ended up getting pretty busy and it took a few days for me to collect my thoughts.

> I'm especially interested in crafting an experience that's not a chore for the reader.

IMO, one of the best ways you can do that is assume that the reader isn't stupid and doesn't have to have everything explained to them. It sounds counterintuitive when put like that, but a lot of people dislike silly, trivial, or otherwise unnecessary explanations when they can put two-and-two together (even if they're tolerant of infodumps for important or complex stuff). As long as everything makes sense behind the scenes, readers can usually figure things out; lots of sprawling fan theories for various television shows and so on end up being true. People are very good at sensing patterns.

Plus, in the age of social media, if people are confused or want to know more, they can just ask you. Fans eat up supplementary info that comes from the source, so you can always use lore that doesn't make the cut into a neat little engagement gimmick (as long as you're not J.K. Rowling). Don't feel obligated to explain every portion of your setting either; just make sure it feels consistent so people don't accuse you of asspulls. People like mystery, as it gets them involved in the work more and gives them something to think about during the day.

> I do wish I could pick your brain more, but not gonna keep bothering you. Wherever you're pitching to, I hope you get a nice deal and I can buy your work in a bookstore one day. o7

Feel free anon, I don't really mind. It might take me a little while to get back to you, but I like helping. Thanks for the well-wishes too!

Thoughts on this setup, so far?

>>4734270
how do you learn good paneling?

>>4734609
Read manga, watch movies, observe and analyze. Flow is very important, so try to compose your panels in such a way as to lead the reader's eye through your intended reading order.

If you're looking for a book or tutorial, there are books to teach you but I can't vouch for their usefulness because I've never read them, I just learned by paying attention while consuming. Sorry, this probably wasn't very helpful.

i have black characters in my story will i get in trouble for a lot of cursing and saying nigga

>>4734760
Japs don’t care, and as far as the west is concerned, just pretend to be black.

So you’re limited to 55 pages? Even though there is the option to submit two projects? I was working on chapter 1 of my manga project (unrelated to tue contest) but it’s gonna be 90 pages long and I don’t really have a halfway ending point to cut it.

>>4734604
ugly fat lipps

>>4734856
Your faggitry will not be tolerated.

>>4734794
the boondocks had a lot of cursing the accents and the emotion blacks put in while arguing with each other is gold most anime censors cursing even though its a part of life

>>4734906
Punctuation, nigger, use it.

how do you foreshadow something like a power up

>>4735020
Bro, stop asking the dumb questions, same way you foreshadow anything in writing. It being a power doesn’t make it any different. Read more books, watch more film. Follow the examples of others.

>>4734821
I was working on the first chapter of my manga but rewrote it to make it work for the contest. While I could recycle some pages I had to rewrite most of it since they want a completed story within the one-shot. Every entry counts as a separate one-shot.

>>4734906
Boondocks is a comedy aimed at americans, retard. Target audiences are a thing. Japs won't get any "nigga"isms because they simply do not have a black population to speak of and it doesn't translate to japanese at all.

>>4735298
u fucking idiot thats just part of the audience im targeting its not just about blacks

>>4735234
My chapter 1 works fine as a one shot. But if I’m limited to 55 pages that’s hardly gonna work out.

Thanks for the really cool conversations about manga-crafting and working with editors, etc etc...
Very enlightening! ^_^
Hope to listen in on more cool insights.

In the meantime, Here as some more works I've done so far.

>>4735402
>>4735424
You are a threat. Good luck to you.

>>4736129
Haha, well... If can finish it in time, that is ;P
Thank you, anon! Best of luck to you too! ^_^

>>4735424
Your work is really great and impressive. I saw it in the last thread, too.
If you don't mind some nitpicky critique, your text bubbles are distracting a bit. For your text bubbles, your line spacings are uneven and the text almost hits the sides of the bubbles.
When your comic is finished, check out some tutorials on how to do lettering and run your text through a free online grammar checker too (please don't rely on free scanslations to use as reference!).
If you really want to use 2 different fonts for dialogue, I'd pick something different for the vampire.
Of course when you make it big, this will all get handed by an editor and your assistants but since this is for a contest, they notice this stuff
Again, really nice work!

>>4736428
That's really good feedback.
I pray I have time to go through the text and get it properly handled. T_T

These are the 'hidden' blind-spot areas for someone like myself, and I'm glad you brought it up.
Thank you! ^_^

A want to work with someone who can draw, but as a writer (storyboard)

>>4736428
Not him, but FUCK typesetting in general. I just want to draw, not fuck around with fonts and spacing text and shit like that. Feels like every second spent fucking around with text is a second wasted.

For anyone who is looking for 300-600 DPI PRINT-READY screentones:
https://www.deviantart.com/screentones/art/Dots-and-Screentones-Print-160961623
This deviantart account also has other goodies that might be worth checking out as well.

Picrelated is a set of swatches I made, roughly sorted from lightest to darkest. I selected a set of tones that seemed the most useful for practical shading when used as a brush texture, ending up with twelve, which includes an additional 12 inverted tones (white dots on black BG). While I tried to eliminate redundancies, about half of them are still quite similar to each other. Additionally, five of the inverted tones are almost identical in shade to the black-on-white. I'd say you could safely eliminate about half of these.

Also, small word of warning before you click picrelated, the image is fuckhueg.

>>4736693
>2) You can use these tones for illustration purposes including online and print. School Projects are OK too.
>3) You can use these resources for commerical use. But really
Now that's neat
Thanks

>>4735402

What tool do you use to make the ominous background in the bottom panel? I keep seeing people use it, and would like to know how as well. Overall, this looks really nice anon.

>>4736693

I'm an absolute beginner at this. Is there any particular reason to utilize screentones for shading purposes versus any other brush/methodology?

>>4737373
Hello anon,
I'm currently using Clip Studio Paint.
There's a built-in tool that is called Gauze cloud on the Decorations tool, under the Hatching category.

I basically started painting the area (made a layer behind the character layer) using the opacity and pressure of my tablet to create a cloud-like effect.

Hope this helped. :)

>>4737373
>>4737553
Sorry, I meant to link this image...
If you're using CSP, you should be able to find this fairly easily.

>>4734821
I've seen your work elsewhere, anon!
Love your stuff! T_Tb

How are are you with your Ramia project?

>>4737553

Unfortunately I only have photoshop instead of CSP, but this was helpful nonetheless to know it was a brush tool. Will look around to see if there's a photoshop similarity/workaround.

>>4737381
Using CSP? No, not really, since you can easily convert any layer's data into screentones and back again. For other programs, this may be the only way to use screentones with them as far as I'm aware.

>>4734604
Kind of hard to follow. Nothing really guides the reader. Probably too incomplete to properly judge though.

>>4734821
I've seen some contestants put in part 1 and part 2. Given your page count, I think that would work rather nicely :)

>>4738977
>Genre: Any genre. It must be a story completed in one issue that is original.
They will probably get disqualified.

>>4737381
I don't know if you're already aware, but if you're making monochrome manga, especially for print, you absolutely CANNOT shade with grays. Monochrome is different from grayscale, you have to shade using hatching or some form of halftone- halftones simulate shades of gray by using tiny dots. "Screentones" are the term for translucent sheets with halftone patterns that artists used to cut out and stick on their monochrome comics for shading and other effects. Largely out of use today since the advent of digital art programs, which are now widely accessible to the public.
If you aren't using a program that doesn't have halftone functionality built in, you have to use tiled brushes like in this post >>4736693
However, if you aren't averse to using a different program, CSP has extensive functionality for painting and drawing in monochrome. Medibang Paint also has halftone layers that allow you to paint and shade in monochrome.
I actually didn't realize that Medibang had these functions because I never really used it before, but since I found that out I've been playing with it a lot, and it's incredibly cool.

>>4738977
Yeah, as >>4738984 says that's a disqual. You're not actually allowed to do that, just as you're not actually allowed to upload colored pages and the like. People just aren't following the rules.

>>4738977
>>4738984
They absolutely will get disqualified. This is a contest for ONE SHOT, SINGLE ISSUE STORIES. Those retards were either too stupid to read the damn rules, or they're posting their shit up there for attention knowing full well they aren't going to get anywhere in the contest.
Long story short, DON'T DO IT. It's one-shot or no shot at all.
The "first chapter of muh 1000 chapter epic mango" is fine if it's a self-contained story, but I wouldn't subtitle it as LE CHAP-DURR ONE like those other dipshits are doing. You aren't entering to actually get a series in Shonen Jump. It's just a contest.
Contradict me if you think I'm wrong on whether or not it would be a good idea to call a contest entry a "first chapter", but if you ask me it just reeks of cringe and neediness and imo I just wouldn't do it, even if you actually are dedicated to working on a longer manga project. Save the "chapter one" business for actual publishing, wheher self-publishing or if it's picked up by a publishing company.

>>4738994
What do you think will happen so some submissions that don't really feel completed? A lot of them are treating this as a pilot of sorts. I'm not really sure how Jump judges one-shots that are a bit too open ended?

>>4739011
>You aren't entering to actually get a series in Shonen Jump. It's just a contest.

Thanks. That's what I was thinking here. >>4739012
I thought I was the only one a bit annoyed at the "CHAPTUR UNO" stuff.

>>4734609
You could try checking out storyboards from movies or tv shows as well. Even with little detail, you can see how they direct the eye and the flow from scene. They also generally detail the composition of each scene too.

>>4739012
> What do you think will happen so some submissions that don't really feel completed?

If you mean one-shots that don't feel as if they've completed in a satisfactory manner, they likely just won't place highly in the rankings.

>>4739012
They'll probably get tossed by the judges even if they're technically qualified. By my reckoning, any good first chapter of a manga, especially series that are going to be published on a chapter by chapter basis, is going to have a strong, self-contained, to the point story in that will make a *strong first impression on the reader* and make them want more stories like it. This is absolutely critical. The first chapter of a manga NEEDS to stand strong on its own, and as such should be written like it's the only chapter you're ever going to get. In essence, a one shot and a first chapter are very similar.
Go read the first chapter of Naruto right the fuck now. Seriously, read it. The premise, main character, and world are introduced in a short and sweet plot, in ONE chapter that's around 50 pages long. Same goes for FullMetal Alchemist. And Bleach. And One Piece. These are the golden standards for Weekly Shonen Jump first chapters, and these absolute fucking shonenshit retards that want so badly to have their own series like their idols that they're trying so hard to be like aren't even paying attention to why they were so successful in the first place.

>>4739050
Yes. Exactly that. Thanks for your input.

>>4739052
>these absolute fucking shonenshit retards that want so badly to have their own series like their idols that they're trying so hard to be like aren't even paying attention to why they were so successful in the first place.
Fucking THIS.

>>4739052
>Go read the first chapter of Naruto right the fuck now.
Read it a couple of years ago. I remember it feeling complete.

>and as such should be written like it's the only chapter you're ever going to get.
That's how I'm approaching it. It's not anything super exciting either. My setting is mundane and I'm focusing more on trying to write entertaining characters. Since that's what the Pros seem to want to see.
I still get insecure a bit, since it's not super stereotypical battle shounen or such. I just hope it places high enough for the pros to read it.

>>4739074
I wouldn't worry about it. Being yourself, writing and drawing something that YOU like and believe in, is what will speak to people the most. If you make some by-the-book, soulless milquetoast shonenshit because you think pandering will make it easier to win, I doubt that any of the long-standing shonen masters judging the work would give it a second glance. They live and breathe shonen. Akira Toriyama, for example, has been doing this for what, 50 years? They'll spot a soulless copy in an instant.

Now I'm not saying that anyone that's making a SUPAR FIGHTAN ACKSHUN story is a hack and should fuck off, because I (for instance) like that kind of thing myself.
It may sound gay as hell but, whatever you do, make it your own and make it come from the heart. That's the real ganbatte spirit, and I feel that's what the judges are going to be looking for. So motherfucking ganbatte, anon.

>>4739052
You guys should read the pilots for those manga to get a better feel for how to do it. They’re a bit different from the Ch.1 variants. The FMA one is especially competent. It’s a very good example of how to do a one shot. And though it got slammed last time I posted it, the pilot for Kubo’s Burn the Witch is also worth studying. Structurally it’s a good example of how to construct a good one shot. Especially if you’re aiming for Jump. Different publishers have different standards/demands. Back to FMA btw, it should be noted that Enix liked it so much, they didn’t even publish it, then just gave Arakawa the ok to build a series out of it right off the bat. It’s probably the quintessential example of a good one shot imo.

>>4739097
Noted. I'll have to dig that up.

>>4739097
I have read the one-shot of dungeon meshi and it basically felt like a short, ultra-condensed glimpse of an alternate universe. Like something that could have happened but never did.

>>4739116
There’s also the pilot episode for Digimon, which later got referenced in the actual lore of the first season. TV, but similar concept. Same rules still apply.

>>4739092
>It may sound gay as hell but, whatever you do, make it your own and make it come from the heart. That's the real ganbatte spirit, and I feel that's what the judges are going to be looking for. So motherfucking ganbatte, anon.

Thanks anon! I'm trying heard to write something, that reflects my type of storytelling.

>>4739011
Oh shit.. Sorry folks.
I spoke ignorantly =A=;;;

Thanks to all the anons who put a break to my potentially ruinous suggestion. T_Tb

>>4739092

>>4734270
>Finished works only.
I still dont get it....it's ok If I enter with a finished chapter 1?
>just black and white
>Shades besides black and white should be achieved through things such as screentones and dot matrices.
Wut

>>4739272
>I still dont get it....it's ok If I enter with a finished chapter 1?
Google what a one-shot is, you dink. Technically you CAN submit a chapter 1, but if it doesn't stand on its own then it's not what they're looking for.
>Wut
The images MUST be monochrome. Screentones achieve different shades of grey by applying a dot (and other shape) patterns with uniform density, resulting in lighter tones from pure black dots, same way hatching or stipling works.
They cannot print your submission if you have actual greys or colors other than black on a white background.

>>4739272
See >>4736693 >>4738986

>>4739272
It's a bunch of dots that give the illusion of different times based on their size and spacing. Go Google it.

>>4739317
Different tones*
Sorry autocorrect is a bitch

Thoughts on this layout so far ?

>>4739352
You need to work on your perspective. And if you're going to cut-off one of the old dudes off frame do the same with the other. Or commit and draw both within frame.

>>4739360
Ok. Thanx 4the tips

>>4739352
I feel like I'm having a stroke trying to figure out what's supposed to be happening.
JolyneGoku splits up Piratecap and Sepphiroth, grabs Piratecap's wrist while staring at her cock(?), then cut to cheesecake doing nothing interesting, then cut back to JolyneGoku threatening the camera, or rather Piratecap, with the hand she was holding Piratecap by the wrist with, then a couple of what I can only assume are meant to be old men but look like women wearing fake beads and moustaches show their approval. Also at some point Piratecap blushes and sneaks a glance at JolyneGoku's bosom.

So what I'm trying to say is that it flows like shit and the black fills lead the eye several panels ahead of the intended reading order. Try not to make the reader have to pass over future panels to read the next one. As it is to move from JolyneGoku in panel 2 to the cheesecake in panel 3 our eyes pass right through JolyneGoku giving us the stink eye in panel 5. Then again going from panel 4 to panel 5 the eye has to go through the two women costume.

>>4739352
Too much white space around the frames. Here's a million dollar idea I'm pretty sure is completely unused in comics, the mad magazine/Sergio Aragonés style small doodles and little gimmick scenes that take up small parts of the white space in their comics.

>>4739366
From what I have gathered, besides the top 2 panels, the rest can be read in any order. He's just talking about how much he needs everyone shown.

>>4739052
>Go read the first chapter of Naruto
This. I decided to reread it since it is completely out now and noticed that first chapter is indeed self-contained: you got introduced to main characters and environment they live in, you also get to see well, character, of those characters in a single, complete story.
And Naruto's character is interesting enough, that you want to know more about him and what he will do next.

BTW, Viz version also has little blurbs from Kashimoto about his failed attempts to get into SJ, as well as other interesting trivia.

>>4739352
The gutters lack in consistency in both size and shape is very jarring.

>>4739352
This makes a lot more sense if it's meant to be read from left to right. It is from left to right..... Right?

Thanx 4 the feed back one and yes it's meant to be read from left to right.

>>4739352
I mean, your drawing is decent, but why do you NEVER post with dialogue. It might actually make this shit easier to follow?

>>4739377
>And Naruto's character is interesting enough, that you want to know more about him and what he will do next.
According to Araki in his Manga in Theory and Practice. He lists(in order of importance) characters, story, setting and theme as the four major fundamentals of manga structure. A lot of submissions seem to hyper-focus on setting and theme and neglect the first two.

>>4739352
>>4739366
Here's how I'd fix it.

>>4739389
Oh. Well, ignore >>4739417 then I guess.

>>4739417
Those faces tho. lol

>>4739398
Not responsible for dialogue that's why I never post it. At least not on here, unfortunately.

>>4739406
Yeah characters are very important.
>A lot of submissions seem to hyper-focus on setting and theme
Well, dialogs and understanding other people (even imaginary) is hard. And we tend to avoid doing hard, unpleasant things.

>>4739429
You writer should really give you the script first.

>>4739432
It's a shame really.

Is Araki's book on manga too shonen-focused or do the core ideas work well for manga in general?

sorry if this has been answered before but does anyone know if the cover counts toward the page limit for the tezuka contest?

>>4734760
Bro.. I would not enter this contest with a comic like that and expect a good result.. They eventually want to publish these in an issue of jump. Do you think they’ll showcase a comic with the word nigga in it? Lmao be realistic think of what they’ve dont so far and make something for a similar PG-1 audience

Also I’m racking my brain i have a month to get out these pages from scratch I’m trying to think of a nice 10 page comic i can creat that feels complete yet exciting

>>4738986

Huh. So all the people who make printed B&W mangas, they're all unanimously forced to utilize halftone patterns? That's surprising. You'd think that printers in 2020 would be better by this point in time.

>>4739897
>namefag
kys

>>4739954
Printers are fine. You can always print in color or in shades of gray, if you want. It will just cost you more.

>>4739849
It’s good for any general storytelling. He uses his work and the work of other Pros as examples, but the info is universal.
>>4739954
In Jumps case it might have to do with the fact that the weekly anthology is printed on recycled paper.

>>4739406
>>4739432
I don't think any of them are hyper-focusing on setting at all. They're just trying to vomit all the setting info needed to understand the terminology onto people, like was stated in the last conversation on the topic.

>>4739897
then jump isn't tryna make a great anime/manga

>>4739849
I'd like to just point out that if there's anything Araki is praised for it sure as fuck ain't writing. His stuff has always been well paneled, mostly well drawn, very detailed and creative schlock. There's very little depth or ambition to the writing at all, even now with Jojolion it's not especially well written, just intriguing. Not only that, but he's been making literally the same work for almost 30 years, he hasn't had to establish a new setting or new concepts to a fresh audience in decades, he has been always appealing to the fans that have been following his manga for decades, meaning they're already sold on the characters, setting, powers etc.
I think he's probably a very inadequate advisor for a new writer. He simply hasn't experienced the current industry, he's basically in a bubble and hasn't had to deal with modern day publishers or audiences in the way a fresh author would have to. I think his area of expertise would be teaching people the technical side of illustrating a manga because that's the area he excels in and is universally applicable... except that's NOT what his book is, at all.

So all this to say is take his book with a grain of salt. Not knocking the guy, love his work, but I wouldn't bother learning his philosophy when writing manga, because that was never his strength. I would absolutely love to learn from him the technicalities of manga, though. His paneling is superb and creative while never feeling obtrusive. DiU has my favourite paneling style in manga -- every panel is sharp and irregular and angular, yet somehow feels like it fits and doesn't feel awkward. Just very good shape language and dynamism.

>>4739954
>Huh. So all the people who make printed B&W mangas, they're all unanimously forced to utilize halftone patterns?
Dude read some fuckin' manga. This is evident to anyone with a pair of eyes. There are manga that use ink washes (see: Takemitsu Zamurai) but they're converted to halftones to print.

>>4740905
His book is still worth a read. And I'm saying this as someone who isn't his fan. I find his art uncanny and unappealing and I'm unfamiliar with his writing. That said, he must be doing something right. His writing advice in the book is very broad and general. And it might not even be useful if you don't somewhat agree with what he's talking about. But, his musings on what makes a series a classic are interesting.

I guess, now that I think about it. It's more advice for polishing up what you already know about manga. "Are you stuck? Is your story not connecting to the readers? Try this and see if it helps." type a thing. He even mentions that he doesn't guarantee his tips will work, as there's also a factor of luck with this industry. But, if you want to hear how someone in the industry is problem solving this is a good book for that.
There's also a segment on his oneshot for the Tezuka submission(won "Selected Wrok" runner-up) if anyone's curious how he tackled that. In general, I'd love to read more books written by pros.

Some info on printing and pre-printing stuff to do. Only tangentially related, but should be interesting to read nonetheless: https://mollyrocket.com/news_0056

>>4740127
>They're just trying to vomit all the setting info
That's hyperfocusing in my book. You can (almost) always use usual terms instead of invented ones and use freed pages to let the characters "breathe".

>>4740905
you learn to write manga, by learning how to write in general, so looking into his book to become a great writer/storyteller is plain dumb as he only gives the most basic of basics in that department

>>4741440
> That's hyperfocusing in my book. You can (almost) always use usual terms instead of invented ones and use freed pages to let the characters "breathe".

The reason why I don't consider it "hyperfocusing on the setting" is because you're not actually focusing on the setting at all, unless one believes power-system and a creation myth is all that constitutes a setting, in which case I'd just argue that they don't know what a setting is at all.

>>4741592
Which entries do that?

>>4740127
This. There’s a fine difference between creating setting, and info-dumping pointless worldbuilding garbage. A lot of setting can actually be constructed visually with the right establishing shots, or cleverly through well-places dialogue.

>>4741592
>power-system and a creation myth
>>4741607
>info-dumping pointless worldbuilding garbage
I just want to know why this shit is so common?

>>4741642
Bad writing is very common.

>>4741592
Well, from point of view of the reader the power system, creation myth and fancy names and world's concepts are part of the setting. And attention of the reader is hyper focused on that by infodumps created by the author. So yes, my bad, author might not be that much focused in the setting at all.

>>4741663
They're part of the setting, yes, but the reason why I protest the idea that this is "hyperfocusing on the setting" is because barely anything in the setting is actually being described at all.

Your average infodump might give you the power system, and either the world's creation myth or the history behind whatever conflict the characters have to deal with, or sometimes both.

But that tends to really be it. What about cultures, or locations, or general, non-conflict / creation history? A lot of the time, we don't even get proper establishment of what kind of place the characters live in or where the journey starts, let alone what the average daily routine is like or what sorts of sights and sounds people are used to. And as stated before in the last discussion, a lot of the time we don't even get to really *see* the world or have any information about it delivered visually, as sometimes environments and visual worldbuilding elements just aren't drawn in at all.

It would be like zooming in on Mona Lisa's mouth and saying that's the entirety of the painting. At best, infodumps are just hyperfocusing on the specific pieces of the setting that the author feels the readers require, as opposed to anything that would constitute a "setting" in its entirety (and even then, I would argue that a lot of infodumps aren't hyperfocusing anyway, since they're often so informationally thin despite being so densely presented that we rarely get a solid "feel" for the world from the dump alone. You could swap many shonen characters in and out of different shonen "worlds" and they wouldn't feel all that out of place due to how barebones a lot of the lore / infodumps end up being, especially for amateur-level works).

>>4739429
Where is the finished product posted?

>>4741677
You are preaching to the choir, my friend :) The source of our disagreement or, rather, misunderstanding is how we interpret the "hyperfocusing on the setting". From your point of view, I gather, it means "author spend tremendous amount of energy on building very elaborate and delicate world". But I read it as "hyperfocusing [reader's attention] on setting". That's basically it.
I'm with you on critique of the info dumps. Background information should go into reader's mind via well, background channels. Otherwise reader's interest should be piqued by some means before a character/narrator goes into a tirade about this or that.

>>4741686
> But I read it as "hyperfocusing [reader's attention] on setting". That's basically it.

But that's the thing, I don't think that authors are really doing that either. All that they're doing is trying to get all of the information out the door that they think will make the rest of the story make sense as quickly as possible. They don't even want the reader to "focus" on it so much as they just want the reader to "know" it quickly and via any means necessary. Authors that infodump are treating the setting's information like the figures at the front of an instruction manual; there for reference so that everything makes sense later, as opposed to something breathable, flexible, and interwoven into the story in its own right.

That's not to say the setting shouldn't answer questions about what's going on (it should, at least in many circumstances), just that it should do so in a more graceful and arguably gradual way.

sep 1 2020 huh

first im hearing of this

1 month to crank out 50 pages huh

行こう!

I have only two shonen type stories in my head, and they're honestly both from middle school, which one should i go with?

>PROBE11:
>A small capsule space ship equipped with two heavy machine guns crash lands on an arctic planet. The duo is reduced when the female gunner finds out her male pilot is dead. stranded, yadda yadda yadda

>SHADOWALL
>Vampires and Sky ships ahoy! Vampires and piracy yadda yadda

>>4741734
PROBE11 because at least the backgrounds won't take long to draw. Hop to it.

>>4741735

i would have to make the lead not female right? cause its shonen?

>>4741737
No? Teen boys love hot chicks, dude.
If you're not confident then what the fuck ever, have the chick die in the crash instead.

>Done with paneling and lineart
>Still missing tones and effects
>Still can't get them right
>4chan range banned my ISP so I can only phone post now
Fuck

>>4741737
No. Shonen describes the target audience. If 12-18 year old males are who you're trying to entertain, you're fine. Yotsuba!& is shonen but it has a young girl as the lead character. Literally do anything you want that isn't porn/guro and you're fine.

>>4741642
I find that nerds tend to get very sucked into worldbuilding, as that’s the most speculative part of all discussion, and it’s also what hooks them once they’re drawn in, allowing them to geek out over space ship models, power levels, and expand upon, or role play in that universe. So, when most nerds get onto writing, the first thing they set out toward building is the world. Worldbuilding is also the easiest to write of the 4 pillars Araki describes. You can lose yourself building a massive intricate world for years, never actually writing a story, and simply indulging in your imagination. The other 3, theme, plot, and especially character are significantly more difficult to write as they require story crafting skill and experience. I’d say Theme is the next easiest to get lost in, especially for deepfags who spend hours doing critical analysis of fiction, and love wanking over how “intelligent” a certain work is due to it’s symbolism and hidden meaning.

Imo, the single-most important piece to a story, is by far character. As good characters will write the story simply by acting how they naturally would. Character however is also the hardest to nail down.

Plot is like the backbone of a story, but an over reliance on plot can lead to stories where things feel forced, convoluted, or the characters act in unnatural ways feeling like cardboard cutouts. Characters will be what draw people to your story and get them to come back for more. So if you’re gonna focus on one thing, it should be that. Unfortunately most amateur writers don’t know how to write characters, and the more antisocial ones have a difficult time understanding people, thus, they fall back on building massive worlds thinking this will draw people in, because they’re so drawn in by their own world, and dump it all at the start of a story in hopes that readers will be willing to invest more if “only they knew how cool and original my world is.”

>>4737577
The 16 first pages are fully done, the storyboards are mostly finished, and other pages are more or less in progress in no actual order with some here and there finished too. Since I also have my resin statues work I’m busy on the side but in August I’ll take a break to focus more on it.

>>4742048
I sure hope you're doing that in CSP so you can convert those values into screentones. You're in trouble if not.

>>4742085
I’m working pretty much exclusively with Procreate on Ipad. No plan to convert into screentones, I don’t like those.

>>4740905

Anon, the reason I asked was because I wasn't sure what the reason for the halftone adoption was, whether it was because its strictly from an economic sense and all the artists/studios just want to save money for other stuff (and there's obviously nothing wrong with that), or if it's because they absolutely have no choice in the matter because that's just how the industry printers work.

>>4742101
It's to keep magazine sales prices low.

Manga magazines are seen as "disposable" -- which is to say, you buy it and throw it away after reading it. Obviously this doesn't quite apply to tankoubon/kanzenban releases which exist for collection purposes, but because the works are made for magazine release primarily they're made using magazine rules: printed as cheaply as possible, which means monochrome on cheap paper. This is the reason you can buy a thick-ass WSJ issue for a couple bucks. It's totally opposite the west's approach, which is geared entirely around collectors and small-scale but high-quality print releases (note: referring to the actual printing, not the content).

What software do you used? Is Manga Studio 5 any good?

>>4742129
photoshop and clip studio but mostly photoshop

>>4742129
CSP here.

>>4734821
>>4742048
blog?

>>4742048
>Shup up
?

>>4742122

Ok, I understand now. If the western approach is the polar opposite, with smaller scale but higher quality, do they just shade however they want and work with any XYZ print shop that will not "downgrade" the printing by conversion towards halftones?

>>4742163
I've got no idea how the western comic industry does its printing, sorry.

>>4742173

That's cool, no worries. Thanks for helping another anon out regardless.

has anyone read this book and is it good

>>4742097
>He doesn't know.

>>4742575
They're probably not entering the contest.

my latest page

draw > lose confidence at my shit drawing > get angry at my shit > use anger as energy to draw better > drawing evolves > happy > draw more > lose confidence > etc

40 days left, 37 pages to go...

>>4742144
STUDIOCHADS

>>4741734

PROBE11 page 1 panel 1 finished : 3

im okay with my work looking somewhat amateurish im just gonna try to get a finished product in and not worry about seriously being a contender lol

>>4743150

page 2 in progress

>>4743617
Keep it up anon!

>>4743633

^_^

Done for today I suppose...

Decided to go a stylistic (read: lazy) route for the last panel.

>>4742828
>they

>>4743937
What?

>>4741876
exactly, characters to me feel the most important but as autistic and very socially secluded person, writing and actual human with emotions that is actually believable seems impossible to me. i just think i am missing some essential part that get human to understand social behaviors from a young age, and no matter how much time i'll spend trying to figure it out, nothing will come out of it like trying to describe color to a blind person.

>>4744136
>Using they as a pronoun.

>>4734270
So I'm trying to reverse engineer screentones used in my favorite manga, and it's very annoying due to lossy rescaling of original scans, or low resolutions in general. Apparently I got banned on baka.bt due to inactivity, and I couldn't find decent raws on general trackers, so I can't even look at them properly.
It seems like there are different frequencies going on in example 2 and 3, but I can't figure out how to properly recreate them in CSP. If any of you fine gentleman know how to do it, or if there are any proper books/tutorials on the subject I'll be eternally grateful.

>>4744782
> The singular they emerged by the 14th century, about a century after plural they. It has been commonly employed in everyday English ever since then and has gained currency in official contexts.

Does it hurt you to use google, anon?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singular_they

>>4744957
Have you tried using grayscale and then activating the half-tone layer property to make it monochrome? (pic related)

>>4744967
of course, but it's also dependent on your dpi, and is not as controllable as mixing a couple screentones yourself. Like, a lot of these manga were done traditionally, by mixing multiple screentones and scraping them off too, and I wanna know the exact process.

I noticed most manga you read online are blurred a bit so that the half-tones don't look terrible when zooming out or scaling down the scans.
Tried it on my own work for posting online so it doesn't lose the manga feel.

>>4744984
There's so little good info online when it comes to achieving a genuine manga look in english.
Maybe those authors have a twitter account where you could ask them about it? Even without knowing japanese there's a good chance they will read the twitter translation if they notice your tweet that is.

>>4744995
Absolutely agree on lack of information, I actually did write a couple mangaka assistants, but no responses yet.

Keep up the hard work, anons!
Let's push through!

Ok
Someone told me that it's ok If I use pencil and paper because my huion (yes I know the risks) didn't arrive...so:
1. I'll copy the paneling of doujins by hand because it seems easier and i'm going to take my time taking good pics.
2. Since i'm using pencil, bond paper and I don't fully understand the rules im going to use just one tone for the shadows and everything (white and 2B black).
3. I'll make a total of "36" pages including the title page, respect page, and the final 2 pages will have a description of a weapon (35) and some form of thank you and a bit of coom (36)
4. I'm not sure how to "fibish" a chapter 0 so it'll end with the MC recovering, walking and listening to the radio.
Am I gnmi?

>>4745439
>I don't fully understand the rules
What don’t you understand?

And it is possible to edit pencil to look like ink. But you’d have to have clean lines and I’m not sure if scanning or taking photos would be better. It’s been years since I fiddled with pencil like that.

>>4741734

So I didn't work on pages today (yet) because I want to be more certain on the four things talked about in >>4741876

my greatest challenge is that I'm considering the entire story be just one character and her interactions with the wild (for this one chapter anyways,)

PLOT -
-opening - character is trapped on ice planet, but armed with technological suit and weapons
-Narrator, who is character offers brief explanation as to the original mission before the crash (why did they crash ? is it important i explain that?)
- problems are finding food, shelter, running into wild animals
-climax - turns out the planet is actually a giant animal! the animal leaves its hibernative state andd ??? ?
-falling action ???
-resolution ???
CHARACTER - SUZANNA H.
ISTP
Introverted - didn't really get along with people anyways so doesn't the ice planet so lonesome
Sensing - looks to the world around her, mainly as an escape from her feelings. does this first when she discovers her copilot is dead, only later comes to terms with it. survivors guilt ensues?? (maybe)
Thinking - doesn't just rush in into situation
Perceiving - doesn't make the best judgements after the fact however, perhaps continually rushes back into dangerous situation?

maybe only have the story last 24 hours?

does the character decide to live on the planet after all?

pic related is me narrowing things down

>>4745619

also i think my biggest weakness going into this is world building (hence why i chose the desolate ice planet)

is it really so important? can someone with more experience help me out here... why and do i worldbuild? can't i just focus on the story?

>>4745620
You’re overthinking things. That discussion was about people being to distracted by worldbuilding and not focused enough on telling the actual story.

>>4745619
I tried using this method creating characters at some point, and what I found (personally) was that it just puts me into analysis paralysis.
I overthink and over research things, and it just feels 'lifeless' if that makes sense.

I think drawing from experience, and using basic archetypal personalities to having a starting point and organically build on top works better for me.

Of course, I'm sure everyone has their own way of approaching this. But i do feel like your chart is going overboard in figuring out your character.

>>4745652

thats what i figured as well. this is actually very unlike me.

i was thinking of just going with the flow, but I still don't have a story worked out.

maybe i just won't have the story totally worked out and aimlessly draw panel after panel

>>4745661

also drew a character sheet for the MC

>>4744995
>There's so little good info online when it comes to achieving a genuine manga look in english.
I feel like that's because there aren't really many or any westerners who've figured out the "manga look" authentically. The best way to learn is to work as an assistant on an actual manga and obviously that's simply not a job you can just fall into as a westerner, you'd have to take several deliberate steps to get to that point first, and it's pretty much the bottom of the totem pole.

But anyway screentones specifically are probably the hardest part of the "authentic" look because they don't look right in digital. They simply look different on paper, and simplest way to achieve that look is to print it and rescan it. Being on paper and then scanned adds subtle noise that helps hide the pixels and moire effect.

>>4745439
>1. I'll copy the paneling of doujins by hand because it seems easier and i'm going to take my time taking good pics.
Don't. Doujins are not a good model to use for paneling because the rules for paneling an erotic work evolved differently. Most obviously, they ignore panel gaps a lot, which is something you definitely do not want to do outside of specific effects in a proper manga. If you're going to copy something then copy actual manga. There's no better model for the thing you want to make than the thing that's already made.

>4. I'm not sure how to "fibish" a chapter 0 so it'll end with the MC recovering, walking and listening to the radio.
As long as you have a beginning, middle and end then it's "finished" enough. All it needs to do is stand on its own. The emphasis that's being put on this point is to ward away retards who upload their 25 page chapter that ends mid fight with a "to be continued in chapter x"! like it's an actual serialized chapter. As long as you don't do dumb shit like that then you can do whatever, the goal here is to entertain within a single work.

>>4745506
Thanks anon, I guess that i'll just have to replace my pencil with a pen.
>>4741734
I thought that only japs had to make 50 pages...

>>4745619
Oh, was phonefagging and didn’t see that chart.
Yeah, I’d say it’s overkill too. I do something similar to >>4745652. Once I have the basic idea of the character archetype, I focus on how they interact with other characters and the world. My biggest fear is boring the reader with mundane interactions. That’s why I’m still stuck on the draft.
>>4745668
Nice.

>>4745681
You don’t have to hit 50 pages.

>>4745652
If you're freezing up because you're worried that you're not thinking it through enough, then... stop thinking and just draw. Seriously, time's a tickin', you don't have the time to think it through at this point and all this thought and effort is 100% wasted if you don't finish in time.
I realize this sounds fishy coming from someone your submission is going to be competing with, but at the end of the day there will be no competition for you if you don't have something to submit because you tried to make it too "correct".

>>4745681
>I thought that only japs had to make 50 pages...
Japs need to crank out 31 pages.
The limit for foreigners is 55, but that's the upper limit. We're allowed to submit any number of pages as long as its not more than 55.

>>4745692
Oh yeah.. I'm in high gear atm. ^_^
I was just relating to my experience getting paralyzed back in the day. :P

I'm hoping I can get it done in time.. but we'll see.. Still have around a month left.
Kinda wish I could take a week or two off... But not in the cards, I'm afraid. T_T

Best of luck to your submission as well, anon!

>>4745680
>I feel like that's because there aren't really many or any westerners who've figured out the "manga look" authentically.
Can you elaborate on this? Just really curious what is the authentic “manga look”. And how you differentiate it.

To add to the thing you said about assistant work. There was a western chick who was an assistant for Prince of Tennis. Her work wasn’t any better for it. Not sure if it improved by now(was years ago).

>>4745759
>Can you elaborate on this? Just really curious what is the authentic “manga look”. And how you differentiate it.
I mean that there aren't many in the first place that are trying to emulate japanese printed comics and much much fewer still could reasonably be mistaken for being of japanese origin.
Personally I think the line between "western" and "eastern" art is a lot more blurred that seems to be the common opinion on /ic/ but the angle of approach manga takes is very different from the angle of approach western comics, even webcomics, take. And without actually taking that very same angle of approach yourself it's very difficult to emulate the subtle differences between eastern comics and western comics. The differences permeate every aspect of making a comic, from the writing, the character designs, the dialogue, the speech bubbles and typsetting, the paneling, the overarching stories, even the tools used to put pen on paper and even the technique of using those tools all differ in some way in varying degrees of subtlety.

>>4745668
>5 heads
Is she a dwarf?
>shoulders wider than hips
Is it a tranny?

>>4742097
O SHIT NIGGY WTF U DOIN
If you're hoping to enter the contest then you're on your way to Get Fuckedville, entries are monochrome only, no grayscale allowed. >>4738986

You'll have to either get Clip Studio Paint or Medibang Paint on your iPad to convert that into halftone. The big plus is that Medibang's free and has halftone layers that allow you to paint and draw in halftone monochrome, as well as the ability to convert pre-existing images to halftone.

You're either going to have to do all your work in Procreate, then export and convert it to halftone in Medibang or CSP; or switch to Medibang/CSP and do all of it there.
HOWEVER, I think you'll be fine if you do your art in Procreate and then convert it in Medibang, I took the liberty of running your double page spread >>4734821 through the halftone conversion process and it still looks great with no real loss of detail. So long as you EXPORT THE IMAGES AT FULL PUBLISHING SIZE AT 600 DPI, AND CRANK THE RESOLUTION OF THE DOTS ALL THE WAY UP, your image will convert quite cleanly to halftone.
I had to upscale the image to around 6000x4000, convert, then rasterize and take a screenshot because the full sized image was fuckhueg, but this should be a pretty fair approximation of what it would look like in print. Halftones tend to look fucky on screens unless they're jpeg'd and blurred a little, but irl on paper they look perfecty natural.
Having to convert your pages into halftone might be a PITA but it's a hell of a lot better than submitting this thing you worked on so hard only to be told that your entry was automatically denied because it doesn't meet the image requirements.

>>4745776
>angle of approach manga takes is very different from the angle of approach western comics, even webcomics, take
I agree with this. That's why I don't really like to lump them into the same category. But, the comic industry is small and scattered, so I see why some would just group everything together nowadays. Webcomics in particular are very different than what they were decades ago.

>>4745776
>The differences permeate every aspect of making a comic, from the writing, the character designs, the dialogue, the speech bubbles and typsetting, the paneling
Yes, it's a shame there really isn't much discussion around the intricate things online. Ironically this was the only place I found where people who aren't total /beg/ discuss manga specific things. Reddit is infested by pre-teens, Tapastic is useless and too broad and forums aren't in vogue anymore. Most western creators quit while they're ahead, or just swap to illustrations and call it manga(because muh style).
I remember before the "gotta be Japenez to mek manga" meme was a thing online. People were genuinely trying, despite the fact the industry(in the west) was still small and inexperienced(thanks to Tokyopop, I guess). Nowadays people give up the moment they get someone sperging at them about what is "authentic manga".

Thanks anons if I win something i'll ask for Miura

>>4745880
You'll what now?

>>4745643
That wasn't what that conversation was about. It was even stated otherwise in some of the posts.

>>4745899
Than what was it about?

>>4745938
It was about the perils of infodumping as a content delivery mechanism. Infodumping isn't the only way to worldbuild, and is in fact an inferior way of doing so. It was about people being distracted with the delivery of information in such a way that they deliver that information in a sub-par and interruptive fashion.

>>4745955
Sure, but it was also about writers being so in love with worldbuilding that they resort to infodumping because they spend so much time on it. The thing is, how much worldbuilding do you really need for a oneshot?

>>4745971
Again, infodumping has less to do with "the world" and more to do with a rush to make the plot understandable. Infodumping does not require a large amount of worldbuilding and often describes very little of the world at all.

>>4745971
>The thing is, how much worldbuilding do you really need for a oneshot?
Different guy here.
If you're talking about infodump-style worldbuilding, only the bare necessary information for the reader to be able to make sense of what's happening. Otherwise the worldbuilding shouldn't feel obtrusive, more like just details that are implied by events and interactions. Obviously you the writer should be aware of the world your story takes place in, but one shouldn't stop the progression of the story to show the world when the page count is so limited, unless that's the goal of your work.
That's my opinion, anyway.

>>4745620
>why and do i worldbuild? can't i just focus on the story?

I said he was overthinking because >>4741876 was responding to >>4741642.

>>4746004
>>4746005
It got really confusing, really fast. So the question is. What exactly is >>4745620 asking?
Does he need to write intricate lore in order to write his oneshot. No, probably not. Does the world need to make some sense? Yeah, defiantly.

He might think he's doing a good job, but if his delivery isn't on point none of that matters. And the question was too broad and vague for a small oneshot project. So what exactly is the problem? I want to help the anon out, but I guess I just don't understand the question.

>>4735424
I am impressed that you've got his grasp on the handgun done correctly. That is something that people, especially in television and movies, get wrong all the time. Great little detail that most probably wouldn't notice but likely took very little extra time to get right.

>>4746190
I'm not gonna lie, I noticed and thought it looked a bit weird but held off on being "that guy" who bitches about how a drawing is holding a firearm. Interesting to hear that that's actually the correct way to hold a gun. Learn something new every day I suppose.

>>4734270
How would someone find a trustworthy writer to collab with?

>>4746190
Thanks anon! I'm glad you noticed that little detail. ^_^

>>4746214

You could do what I did and pose your story on /lit/

i got an overwhelming great positive response and lots of critique

>>>/lit/15941804

>>4746231
Legitimately curious how you're going to balance the huge onslaught of ideas.

>I'm not trying to win
Forgive my very results focused brain, but why are you competing? I'd like to place in honorable at the least, winning would be nice, but I'm prepared to lose. Is it just to give you something to work on with a deadline?

Should i post fanart of a character that's similar to an original character that i'm working on?Will it seem as if i'm trying to rip off or emulate the character in my own work even though that isn't my intention

>>4746892
Post example.

>>4746904
One of my characters is a young girl with a robotic arm and i wanted to do fanart of SCP-191 which is also a cyborg girl.They look and act different it's just the core idea is the same

>>4746918
>They look and act different
Well, I can't tell how similar unless I see it. But, if it's just one random robotic arm. Than it should be different enough. Go with your gut, I suppose.

>>4746384

>something to work on with a deadline?

yeppp.

Honestly after seeing stuff like >>4745035
>>4745041 (how old are you btw and how long have you been drawing? legit curious cus its good stuff)

I can tell I still have a ways to go. I would love to be honorable mention as well but I'm just being realistic.

>>4746384

>Legitimately curious how you're going to balance the huge onslaught of ideas.

So far I think I'm going with the Interstellar rip off idea

>MC communicates with father/loved one at home through some skype peripheral
>Days go by on the planet but years start to pass on the home planet
>???? some conflict

>>4747007
Hey, thanks so much for the kind words. ^_^
I'm currently in my mid-30's. (Fun times!)

Not sure what the average age range is in this thread, but it's really invigorating to see everyone discuss and share their works, etc.

Honestly, I always feel like I'm lagging behind with my art. Whenever I see these amazing artworks, and realize they are 10+ years younger than me... I tend to get dejected and ask myself, 'What have I been doing all this time?' ^_^;;;

[insert MGSV Miller meme, "Why are we still here? Just to suffer?!"]

But yeah! I'm glad you like my works.
I remember having to re-do >>4745041 2,3 times just to make it not look awful. :P
I was getting worried telling myself, 'at this rate, I won't finish anything damnit!'

Just plugging away after finishing my day job. And utilizing weekends as best as I can.

I hope everyone's week end well. And wishing everyone a great weekend!

>>4745955
Guy who made that post here. I know what the discussion was about, but my post in particular was more in criticism of amateur writer who miss the forest for the trees and prioritize worldbuilding over the more important element: character.

>>4745971
Not very much. Though it varies from story to story. That said, the point of a story is to show CHANGE. Change needs to happen, you start somewhere, and where you end up is totally different. Because a one shot only offers you 55 pages, its best to focus on character, and internal change as that’s easiest to convey in such a short story. Who is your character, what are their flaws, what is their lesson? How do they learn it? How does this affect them?

>>4745619
You’re overthinking things way too much. You did all this personality test psychoanalyst stuff but still failed to reach the core of WHO your character is. Sit down and write some scenes involving your character. Put them in different scenarios, and write out how they act and react to different things. Think of them as a PERSON. A friend. Let them come alive. Give them a ubique voice, and traits, and forms of self-expression. Writing isn’t formulaic. No amount of planning will prepare you for the actual task of having to bring a character to life. That comes from experience.

Think about their flaws, their quirks, their fears, their likes and dislikes. Also, if you’re gonna use personality tests, use Jung and the Enneagram, not Myers Briggs Horoscope shit. The former at least actually looks at personality through the lens of behavior changing under different forms of pressure and stimuli.

>>4745836
Well, thanks for the tips, but as mentioned earlier, it’s gonna be more pages than the contest allows, anyway.
My ch1 fits fine as a one shot so figured I could give it a try (and just remove the ch1 title) but there aren’t really any good enough parts to end at before the limit of 55 pages.

On that note I’ll be done this week end with the 24 first pages, gonna post it online.

>>4747261
I like you anon. This is a good post.
> Writing isn’t formulaic. No amount of planning will prepare you for the actual task of having to bring a character to life. That comes from experience.
100%

>>4747265
Sick, drop a link when you're done.

>>4747261
> I know what the discussion was about, but my post in particular was more in criticism of amateur writer who miss the forest for the trees and prioritize worldbuilding over the more important element: character.

I'm referring to the other posts (>>4741677 >>4741698) explicitly countering that idea via the idea that infodumping isn't actually "prioritizing worldbuilding" anyway. It's prioritizing "getting to the plot as quickly as possible" which results in clumsiness. It's not really "prioritizing the world" if you neither show it nor linger on it.

>>4747501
Your arguing semantics and completely missing what that anon and me were talking about. Since I was the one who asked >>4741642

>>4747527
Anon, how is infodumping "prioritizing the world" if you're A.) never actually showing the world, B.) skimming over lots of setting information and only showing some of it, and C.) presenting that setting information as quickly and densely as possible solely so that the audience can move on and get to the story?

The only way I can rationalize any of this as being remotely "prioritizing the world" is if spending any time *whatsoever* to display some of the world is "prioritizing the world." It just doesn't make any sense.

>>4747585
For the last damn time. >>4741642 (me) and >>4741876 aka >>4747261
Were having a completely different discussion to your damn semantics discussion that I don't give a crap about.
>> I know what the discussion was about, but my post in particular was more in criticism of amateur writer who miss the forest for the trees and prioritize worldbuilding over the more important element: character.
He clearly states what he was talking about too. And yet you still go off on a tangent.

>>4741677 and >>4741698 were not part of that discussion and if you wanna tag them, than tag them. But, the one who got tagged was >>4741876, so stop arguing with the dude for no reason.

>>4745899
>>4745955
And stop telling us what the discussion was about, if you're clearly still thinking about other posts.

>"prioritizing worldbuilding"
And this is a simple concept that you would understand if you weren't so busy arguing semantics. Writers get anal about their LOTR ripoff world, create a creation myhtos, create some random gay magics... realize their world is their baby and shit all over their opening story with the world info they've created, because they didn't really do anything else for months. There is no plot to get to, there are no good characters, just the epic world that we now need to love just as much as the author. But, it's okay, because their magic system is totally not a ripoff of something else and who cares what the main characters are fighting for, it's just epic. You clearly haven't read enough trash to know what me and anon were getting at.

>>4747645
> Were having a completely different discussion to your damn semantics discussion that I don't give a crap about.

It was intrinsically linked to the prior conversation that I was referencing and is derived in part from it via including some of the posts I talked about in >>4741642. If you want to declare it a separate conversation then fine; no need to be an asshole about it, jesus.

> And this is a simple concept that you would understand if you weren't so busy arguing semantics. Writers get anal about their LOTR ripoff world, create a creation myhtos, create some random gay magics... realize their world is their baby and shit all over their opening story with the world info they've created, because they didn't really do anything else for months. There is no plot to get to, there are no good characters, just the epic world that we now need to love just as much as the author. But, it's okay, because their magic system is totally not a ripoff of something else and who cares what the main characters are fighting for, it's just epic. You clearly haven't read enough trash to know what me and anon were getting at.

None of this actually addresses the questions that I've asked, or addresses the act of infodumping at all. Infodumping in and of itself isn't "prioritizing story," and that's all that I'm getting at. If this is unrelated to your conversation then fine, but at least try and be reasonable to other people.

>>4747663
> Infodumping in and of itself isn't "prioritizing story,"

Meant "prioritizing worldbuilding" here.

>>4746892
Even if theres nothing actually wrong with it and your character is distinct, I would still say you probably shouldn't draw attention to it unless someone asks.
That said it's not like SCP is gonna sue you or anything, you could have literally 100% lifted the character, name and all, and you wouldn't get in trouble because SCP is a glorified fanfiction anthology, nobody owns those characters.

>>4747663
>intrinsically linked to the prior conversation
No one here is a mind reader, dude. Link shit accordingly.
>I talked about in >>4741642 (You).
That's my post? What did (You) talk about there?
>If you want to declare it a separate conversation then fine; no need to be an asshole about it, jesus.
Yeah, I did. >>4745643 >>4745938 >>4745971 >>4746044 >>4747527 so, sorry if I'm kinda pissy about this crap.


To your main question. I don't fucking understand it okay. Maybe because English is my second language, maybe I'm retarded and NGMI.

> Infodumping in and of itself isn't "prioritizing worldbuilding" and that's all that I'm getting at.
In the authors eyes or the readers? If the author is shitting his info about the world lore in the first 5 pages, but the actual story has no relevance to the infodump. How is that not the author shitting his worldbuilding?
And yes, you can infodump on the dumbest crap like how some character is dressed(like tons of fanfics). And I wouldn't link that to worldbuilding. That doesn't change the fact that >>4741642 discussion was strictly about shit like infodumping the authors little spreadsheets about the world.

How would I go about converting my inkwashed art to halftone in Medibang like this? >>4745836

>>4747959
Press the button that does it for yoy.

>>4747937
Christ anon, calm the fuck down.

> That's my post? What did (You) talk about there?
> No one here is a mind reader, dude. Link shit accordingly.
*I* talked about the posts *linked* in that one. This is going in circles and you're clearly not understanding me while getting hostile so I'm bowing out.

bost bages

ok

since the other guy posted a WIP i guess ill post this garbage as well

>>4748447
train

>>4742129
not this anon but bump

>mfw finally used to the velocity setting in CSP

>>4747959
>Convert layer to 8 Bit
>Effects: Halftone
Bam, done

>>4748773
Awesome, is there a certain filetype I need to export it as for printing?

Sorry for the dumb questions, I am not caught up on digital art technology.

>>4747122
Your art is beautiful man! I’m late 20’s and feel the same way sometimes.

Then i have to remind myself Akira toriyama didnt start working on dragon ball until he was 28 or 29.

Miyazaki was almost 40 when he directed his first film

Yoshitaka Amano was 30 when he moved back in with his in laws to start his journey as a fine artist before working on the final fantasy series.


Keep pushing ahead! There are people in the world who need your work!

>>4748700
did you drew this? moar.

>>4749173
That really means a lot to me, thank you so much! T_Tb
Let's do our best!

>>4749337
sadly no
https://mangadex.org/title/36595/ryoumin-0-nin-start-no-henkyou-ryoushusama

bage

Some progress.
Keep up the hard work, anons!

Turns out that the detail loss I was experiencing with monochrome conversion was due to me testing on the wrong file sizes. Now I've lost far too much time to ever make it by the contest deadline.

I feel like a total, absolute idiot.

>>4749027
Just export it as a lossless filetype like PNG.

WHITE KNIGHT, CH. 1 has been submitted to the Tezuka manga contest.
Will it best the other entries? Will you be cheering on Aino
Itsuki's once in a lifetime masterpiece?
https://medibang.com/book/j02007150547514300015172361/view/
Read it here for a limited time only!! Other entries available as well!

>>4750151
There'll be contests every year. Not of this scale, but still. Keep at it.

>>4750187
>https://medibang.com/book/j02007150547514300015172361/view/

omg... I can't unsee the My Hero Academia and Kimetsu no Yaiba art style overlaps.

>>4750190
> Not of this scale, but still.

That's kind of the point, though. I feel like I passed on a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity and I'm an idiot for doing it.

>>4750187
Portions of this look directly traced.

>>4750221
That may be the joke.

>>4750218
Welp, such are the consequences of being ill-prepared. Learn your tools, folks.

>tfw art school gave the habit of trying to render every fucking little thing with 15 values
>taking way too long per page, but OCD/autism isn't letting me just do lines

I'm considering using my first couple pages as grayscale "color pages" then just FirePunch-ing the rest of it
anyone else done something like this?

>>4750234
>anyone else done something like this?
If you mean overrendering everything, yes, when I was a retard beginner who didn't know anything. Don't be that.
Less is more. You're trying to create an easily-readable comic here, not an art gallery. Keep it simple stupid!

>>4750187
>>4750198

>>4750249
KnY copied White Knight?!

>>4750484
The plot thickens!

>>4750249
Lmaooo, even the bubbles are traced.

>>4750249
fucking lol

>>4750249
I really hope this kid is only in high school or something so I can give him the benefit of the doubt. I mean if you're going to trace, at least trace with good line quality.

>>4750646
i dont read a lot of manga but this looks traced as fuck

>>4750648
they literally just traced bakugo from mha

Hope everyone had a good weekend. ^_^
Let's keep pushing through!

pg3....

im abusing three dots...

>>4752957
might want to liquify that hand a little bit

>>4752982
like redraw it?

>>4750187
>>4750249
This can't be fucking serious.

>>4753003
yeah
the ring finger is too long and you're missing the knuckle curve
and the top two fingers look like they're a different angle than the rest of the hand

>inb4 pyw

Do they only accept the ''manga style'' comics with screentones etc. or Are you allowed to submit work that uses other techniques? I've been thinking about making comic with oil brushes to give it impressionistic style

>>4753087
it's going to be printed (if you win) so it does need to be screentoned

which manga story prose/style are you leaning your story toward, /ic/? I'm doing a shonen romance so I'm mixing it some classic shoujo story from Kyoko sensei

>>4753305
>which manga story prose/style are you leaning your story toward, /ic/?
My Hero Academia x Chainsaw Man x Bleach x Jojo

>>4753053

>in b4 pyw
>that pre-emptive posting of work
>that

not everyones crabpeople on /ic/ you're allowed to crit lol

thanks is it fixed now?

>>4753305
I like Blame! a lot. I can't emulate that level of skill or detail in the environments because I don't have the same background in technical illustration or assistants or as much mileage but I can certainly try to incorporate elements of the presentation style into my one-shot, and so I have.

>>4753713
looks better
also dialogue tip:
>If he's dead, then I'm stranded here!
reads easier than
>If he's gone, then I'm stranded here for broke or madness.
this will also be easier for the jap translators

and just a personal nitpick about the font, maybe use something less curvy (whizbang, anime ace, wildwords, etc) as your base/most used, the font you have here can work for when a character is yelling, like in the 2nd panel
good luck to you anon i would like to read this when you submit it

>>4753751
>>4753713
>yelling
my bad, that's a thought bubble

Do you guys think a King Arthur manga would be viable? I'm scared its gonna be considered unoriginal
I just dont want my comic to be relegated to a fate clone even though it has nothing to do with it

>>4753751
>anime ace

thanks for this

>>4753867
anything can viable if you have a vested interest in it. if you're passionate about it it'll come through

also not to everyone, i recommend printing out your manga on paper, like newsprint just to see what it looks like.

im now pushing my values and shadows more b/c of how lame/harder to read when printed now i can see that.

>>4753751

I think I'm just going to handwrite all my text. I realize it's more graphic novel than manga but fuck it i can't find a font i'm content with.

next two pages drafted out

>>4753867
You’re close.

I had an idea a long time ago to tell the story of King Arthur in manga format, but a “if Arthur was a girl” sort of story precisely because I was thoroughly dissatisfied with how poorly Fate handled that concept, not even bothering to explore all the potential it offered doing stuff like “oh yeah, Merlin gave her a penis and thus Mordred was born.” etc...

Overall though, I fell out of love with the idea for similar reasons to what you’re bringing up, and overall, I kinda evolved the concept. Better to take the Arthurian tales as a base to create an original story with an original setting and original characters. Mixing multiple things to create something new is how I approach some of my brainstorming these days. Or rather, take a base core concept, and blend it with numerous things to put my own spin on things. It’s how I came up with Rosenrot, which is essentially Little Red, but with Bloodborne and such mixed in, or Alice which is Buffy essentially, but with Warhammer and Alice in Wonderland and Crypt Horrors thrown in, etc... for the Arthur concept, the direction in which I took the idea just to give you and example of how I chose to evolve it, and this is one of the pitches I’ll be presenting, is take the Aurthirian mythos of the “sword in the stone” and a king who was hidden away, Merlin, Excalibur, and knights of the round, and set it in something kinda similar to Iron Harvest or Violet Evergarden, and once again, Genderbend the Arthur character so this time we get to explore the personal stress the MC has to face in hiding her gender as well as her connection to the Lancelot character. May have been done, may have not been done, who knows, but just throwing those ideas together as well as a comparatively more modern setting, you start to see all sorts of potential for something more fresh and original.

Take a base concept, and mix it with stuff that contrasts it or enhances it to take it somewhere new.

>>4753923
One piece of advice:
>Show, don't tell.

Narrating everything can annoy the reader since you're basically insulting their intelligence.

>>4754144
I like the fact you're drafting analogically, you're good. Won't be easier for you to just ink traditionally?
I think digital art screws your style and pencils. From a draft it looks great, but the final result (digital) looks kinda meh. And it's not about the art. It's rather about lines and general flatness
Sorry if my eng is utterly bad. I'm italian

>>4754539

wow thanks for this... i didn't mean it that way but youre totally right

>>4754561

no i get what you are saying....i think i need to loosen up my digital some. thanks. :)

>>4750187
BASED

>>4754144
this looks ages better than >>4753923
>>4754561
Anon is right.

>>4734821
>>4747265
Here is it, the 24 first pages are uploaded.
https://www.pixiv.net/en/artworks/83286840
https://mangadex.org/chapter/973902/1

For me it's the "Grizzled old man and little girl" duo

>>4754868
>https://mangadex.org/chapter/973902/1
Love it!
Your works are really cool! :)
Hope to see more. ^_^

>>4754868
>https://www.pixiv.net/en/artworks/83286840

honestly the layers and layers and layers its got going on really made my mind dance but i caught myself laughing when theyre like "yeah maybe we're out of touch"

tropes aside. serious charm desu sewiously

>>4754868
Artistically it's alright but sometimes it's very hard to tell what's going on.
The beginning was fun though

>>4755168
Like when?

>>4755225
Page 4, second panel
Page 8, first panel
Page 9, third and last panel
Page 10, last panel
Page 11, second panel
Page 22, second and third panel

Basically most of the panels where the mc is.

>>4755294
Well, at this point in the story, most of her body is intended to be hidden by her heavy cape, that’s why. In contrast to the spread cover where you can see it properly.

>>4755168
Yeah I like the style but everything is so dark, barely any contrast or balance. I feel like I'm reading a black page with some word bubbles scattered around. Maybe that's the intention though, I dunno

>>4755395
>>4755402
>technical mistake
>"No, it's the story"
>"No, that's intentional"
of course, anon, of course.
I won't bother giving any more feedback because i know how it's gonna play out.
Good luck, you'll need a fuckton of it

>>4755409
I’m simply explaining the thought process to confirm what part you’re talking about. If the problem you mentioned was about not being to see properly her body because of the cape, yeah, that’s intended.

>>4755413
Yeah, anon, good luck

>>4754868
>big tiddy knight girl
Y E S
That's a plus in my book. There aren't nearly enough out there.
I have to agree with >>4755294, in a different manner, though. Every time the MC hits the scene, the BG and the other characters look cheap in contrast (best example is p16 upper right frame, in my opinion).

>>4755498
what gives you that "cheap" vibe? the fact she got that helmet with lots of shades? I mean, in those pages her design is pretty simple, a mass of black and the helmet mostly.

>>4755509
Maybe "cheap" was the wrong descriptor.
The clearly MC sticks out in a lot of cases to the point of seemingly making you aware of how the others, or the whole scene in general, are drawn, if you catch my drift.

>>4755577
Well, it’s true that by concept she’ll stand out in the first place. I still tried to give details to the other characters but they’re still pretty normal at their design core. While she has far more unusual and unique design elements.
Which is intended too, it’s part of the joke with her sitting with the kids. Overall I won’t go final fantasy/mmorpg style with the humans, they’ll look mostly normal and grounded.

The demon characters that will appear later will stand out more too. They’ll be an important part of the focus.

Here are some full page excerpts.
Only one month and a few days left.. Ughhh... starting to feel the pressure! T_T

>>4755620
ngmi

>>4755664
personally I think you tried to condense too much panels into this spread, just the monsters would have been a clear and neat focus.

But well, I guess you're also trying to fit in the 55 pages limit?

Just realize I'm seeing some moire on one of the pages.. I should look into that. ^_^;

>>4755680
A compromise. ^_^;
That being said, I'm sure there's a much better way to make it flow and present better.. But I chalk that up to my lack of ability at this current stage. T_T

Hopefully I learn from this and can improve further with my next attempt. ^_^

>>4755689
I would advise to maybe put the reactions on panels on the left, so we have a full and proper view of the monster. Right now he feels half hidden by the panels and the onomatopeia.
Basically just a reorganization of the page.

>>4755413
the crab wouldn't tell you but background is messy, anon.

Thinking of making a comic.
Have only rough ideas for now.

>>4754868
Imo some pages look muddied and don’t have enough contrast. The erasing/white soft brush you used for your light source brings the quality of your work down(when you cover your ink work with it).

Your NPCs are all a bit too gray in general. And I mean the same shade of gray. Your black haired characters are inked sloppily tho. You have the ability to clean up that hair, but you decided to kinda wing it. It’s a shame because it looks sloppy.

If you’re going to color this, than I understand why everything is gray. But, if you want it to be grayscale it needs more contrast.

The way you space your panels out seem a bit random and inconsistent too.

>>4755652
I know right? I keep double checking that I'm still on track to make it in time.

>>4755669
>>4755666
>>4755664
>>4755656
>>4755652

im fangirling hard on your ass

and im a dude

>>4755939

>>4755937
Let's do our best!

>>4746199
>Interesting to hear that that's actually the correct way to hold a gun.

It's not so much the "correct" grasp/grip, but it is a great example of the current orthodoxy of handgun shooting. The hand position in the comic is not necessarily intuitive, but neither is handgun shooting. Not in the same way rifle shooting can be for most people. That hand position allows the most contact between the support hand, which should have a tight grip on the gun, and the frame of the gun. That means more control and better recoil management. The wrist of the support hand is also typically locked out providing a more rigid platform and faster return to target after recoil. If you watch videos of competitive handgun shooters e.g. IPSC and IDPA you'll see roughly the same hand positioning. It will look a bit different for each individual, some will be choked up more on the gun with a very forward support hand and some will be further back.

Good hand positioning will also be different with different types of handguns e.g. the correct support hand grasp for shooting a revolver will look quite different because of the gap between the barrel/frame and cylinder that allows high pressure gas to escape. It makes it more difficult to safely place your support hand too far forward so typically you will see the support thumb sort of wrap around on top of the shooting hand thumb. In the past you would even see revolver shooters use a grip where they crossed their thumbs over the backstrap of the grip.

If you went back 10 to 20 years ago you would see a lot more people using a more conservative hand position, further back more "tea cupping" and Weaver stance push-and-pull. What was considered correct or "the best" handgun shooting technique has changed over time and what you tend to see on television and movies, outside of movies that put in the work e.g. Way of the Gun, Heat, Collateral etc., is terrible.

>>4756122
i'm another anon. I've been working my ass as well and seeing how nicely you act here gives me hope. Let's do our best, good luck pal

After getting over my earlier doldrums, I think I'm going to continue with my plans to press on without the contest. I'll have to get some freelance work out of the way first, but I think I just like the concept far too much to let it go quietly. I'm still afraid that looking at it will remind me of how much I messed up, but perhaps the joy of simply working on it at my own pace will bury that feeling.

Keep working hard, everyone.

>>4757988
Im in the same line too, I'm still too inexperience with it, I'll comeback next contest stronger.

>>4757912
The pursuit of art can be joyous, but also full of agony and stress (granted, everyone's mileage will vary, and I admit a lot of it is self-inflicting ^_^;; )

We're all in this together.
And not just the manga contest.. But just creating art and trying to tell a story in general.

Let's give it our best, and keep on rocking!

A bit of a time skip, but some more action-y moments.

pg 4

pg5

noo thredde

>>4760396
>>4760396
>>4760396
>>4760396