/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

Some resources.

Books:
"Understanding Comics", "Making Comics", "Manga in Theory and Practice: The Craft of Creating Manga", "Story: Substance, Structure, Style and the Principles of Screenwriting"

Youtube channels:
"Manga Senpai/Tokyo Name Tank", "SMAC! THE SILENT MANGA AUDITION COMMUNITY"

Whip out your WIPs lads.

>>4701784
Wow that panel with a worm-eye view is very dynamic! Good job!

>>4701784
Looks good! What is it about?

>>4701794
Cheers m8.

>>4701800
Short answer: wizards.

Long answer:
A woman finds her house partially collapsed with a big-ass hole in it and her husband and two sons missing, races to town looking for the local wizard. Finding him and his apprentice in the tavern eating a meal, they immediately send for the local militia to meet them at her ruined house. The wizard and his apprentice make a brief stop at their tower to prepare for the worst as they theorize on what might have happened, surmising it was likely the work of a rogue wizard.
They meet a small squad of militia, captained by a giant woman. Using a hound they follow the scent of the husband, which leads them into a labryinth in the wall of the massive cavern the story takes place in. They scale the wall, enter the labyrinth, make their way through tunnels lined with cables and tubes and long-abandoned machinery, eventually finding the husband carrying his heavily injured eldest son.
To cut this synopsis short they find the rogue wizard squatting in a large structure, exchange a few spells and finish him off, rescuing the youngest son in the process.

It's a prototype of a series I want to make. I'm focusing on drawing backgrounds mostly here, since that's the area I want to improve in the most. I feel like I didn't leave enough room for the action at the end so it ends kinda rushed, and the story isn't particularly tightly written. But in actually trying to depict this setting visually for the first time I realzie things that perhaps should have been obvious to me (such as, being in a giant cavern, it's perpetually dark, so everyone carries lanterns or other lighting devices, buildings and roads are lit with lamps, the environment has a fair amount of bioluminescence etc).

>>4701821
Sounds interesting. I'm curious to see how you depict the dark panels. Actually, I'm curious to see a more finished page in general.

Keep it up tho.

what anime/manga should i watch that can give me inspiration

>>4701989
Take a story that you like and turn it into a manga. Story could be as small as an anecdote or funny episode of your life.

>>4701784
Ehhh, fuck it. Why not. I’ve shown it around irl a bit so I’m interested and in hearing what 4chan thinks.

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1h_55gXL_uwh8V_EimZqdKGYVkKJEBEni

It’s unfinished still ofc, but I’m so far in I won’t really be changing anything as I gotta get it done. That said any useful advice or takeaways I’ll apply to the next project. It’s not “my baby” and I’d rather get something out there, totally finished, flaws and all, than overcook a story trying to get it “just right.” Just a self contained one shot ofc. No pilot, nor plans for a series.

I also want to hear feedback on a specific thing, but I don’t wanna poison the well, so I’ll just wait about a week or so, and we can discuss that toward the end of the thread.

>>4702002
Damn, this is quality stuff.

>>4702002
That's very good, I like it! The art is impactful, dialogs are not forced. Yep it's good. The only thing that I've noticed is weird phrases, like "Not even any bodies". I'm ESL myself, so there is that, but this doesn't sound right. I would write "Not even a body in sight" or "Not even bodies left" or some such.
>I'll just have to take it's head
I think you need to add "off", "take it's head off", If you mean to chop it off instead of hero taking it with him.

Thanks for sharing, that was fun to read even in it's incomplete form!

>>4702002
I really like how gritty your finished pieces look. The Gothic feel and the monster design are great.
The comedy bits, fall a bit flat. Maybe it's just my personal taste but, I would prefer more even serious/drama-esque tone to the narrative. Mostly because of your art style and how you choose to end it.

I really like your crosshatching and the way you use your blacks. Honestly, cant way to see it finished.

>>4702002
I think I would've liked to see our hero put up a bit more of a fight. The story ended up almost a little dull, with a lot of info dump and plain conversations. Your style of storytelling probably would've worked if you had lengthened the page count, not letting the world-building over-take the story and characters.

But take my opinion with a grain of salt. Whatever you think matters most.

>>4702002
There are a lot of problems that require the fundamentals of the story to change to solve. I can't be bothered to get into it in detail, but essentially you're using a Berserk-esque formula with a completely unsuitable MC. Either change the story structure, or change the MC. Also, the attempts at humor and other needless dialogue only serve to ruin what any sort of tension or atmosphere you should be trying to build at the start of the story.

i want to make a long anime story with like about 700 chapters like one piece any tips on how to keep the story consistent and not repetitive

>>4702161
Nobody here can give good advice for that because none of us have experienced that. Almost no series in the range of 700+ chapters isn't repetitive. Even Jojo, which manages to vary it up the most in terms of "story" still falls into formulae with the way he writes fights.
The advice I can give I guess is to not be afraid to shake things right the fuck up. Put massive shakeups every couple hundreds chapters or so, like I dunno, "oh shit, turns out the One Piece is in space!" that allows you to approach the story from a completely different approach to avoid falling into your writing becoming formulaic.

But for the most part, 700+ chapter epics will inevitably be repetitive. It's difficult to avoid.

Also I highly recommend not trying to write 700 chapter story at all. I guarantee there is nothing you can write that wouldnt fit within 40 volumes, and if you're going over that then it's 100% milking a cashcow.

>>4702142
I actually agree with all this, and it’s one of the things I wanted feedback on. For the record, I didn’t write this, my friend did. The only writing I took upon myself to redo was toward the end, a lot of the more exposition type stuff, like her plan to distribute the water, I added a bit more to it as people kept asking me why she killed the huntsman as in the original script my friend didn’t explain it enough, and it lacked flavor when she did the ritual. So I rewrote those parts myself. I also wrote the “but now that we’ve made it this far, there’s something you should know... you are not the hunter, you are the lamb.” Line. The original line my friend wrote was “I wrote a thousand letters yet you were the only one stupid enough to show up.”
Again for the aforementioned reason of it not being clear to readers that she was aiming to offer him up as a sacrifice, and because the original line was imo, weak and lacked punch. Even the timing was off and had no build up.

The rest of the story is basically my friend’s writing 100% with some feedback on my end as editor. He originally wanted the story to be more about her taking revenge on the town for killing her family (who weren’t evil), but I insisted that was a rather weak reveal, especially with how little we have for exposition due to the page limit, and that Red works better as an unjustifiably evil character, she’s just more interesting if she’s an unsympathiable evil cunt imo.

Like I said, I don’t wanna poison the well as people read it, but I have been rather unsatisfied with my friend’s writing, not only cause he’s not keeping up his end of the deal of churning out Drafts on his own while I work on this, but also, his output looks like he’s putting very little effort into it, and it’s bugging me.

cont...

2/2
I actually objected to the more comedic opening like you are, a lot of the jokes fell flat for me too, but he was adamant in keeping it for the tonal shift, and I get what he’s going for with how he structured the story in three parts, and the first 3rd is exciting thanks to some pf the action, and the banter is pretty good, and helps establish the characters very well. I think his ability to characterize characters through dialogue is very good (much better than mine), but it is rather inefficient, and that’s owed in large to his inexperience in manga, and why I’m extra irritated that he still hasn’t listened to me and gotten around to reading manga on a regular basis. Especially the more critically acclaimed shounen like One Piece, YYH, HxH, and so on... since that’s what we’re aiming for.

Anyway, rant over, but I do have my gripes.

In fact, the reason why I added more exposition/flavor to the end, is cause I needed to slow down the ending a bit cause it otherwise ended too abruptly. I agree that the huntsman should have put up more of a fight, but that one is a compromise we had to make due to the page limit.

Anyway, there’s a lot more I can say on this subject matter, as it’s been on my mind for several weeks now, but I’ll leave it at that for now.

>>4702102
I agree here too, but unfortunately there’s only so much you can do with a 55 count page limit. There is a structural issue with it.

Regardless, I’m still gonna finish it as it is, but I don’t disagree with the criticism, it’s been on my mind too.

>>4701764
Is true that most manga artists learn from copying other manga artists?

>>4702161
>700 chapters
I mean, not even Eiichiro Oda thought that One Piece was going to be as long as it currently is. He was only planning to make around 20, 10 or even 5 volumes initially, if I remembered correctly.

Also there’s no point putting in all that time into make a huge serialised work unless you’re getting paid.
700 chapters will probably cost you 20 years of your life working full time. It’s no joke.

>>4702203
Most? We don't know. Plenty have said that they learned how to draw manga by copying their favourites, but realistically most also worked as an assistant to directly study under senior mangaka before they made their own debut serializations, and in some cases went to art schools.

>>4702206
>cost you 20 years of your life working full time
This is incredibly sobering observation. wow.

>>4702201
Man, it's sad he fought you on it. It seems like a missed opportunity.

This is me sperging, but...
I'd change your male character to a more weathered warrior/father type driven by justice instead of money. Swap the girls personality to the purest/helpless being ever. I'd get rid of the third character (even tho his design is nice) and have the girl be sad about the town. Making the MC and the reader pity her. MC would save her life a few times, maybe tell her a similar sad story from his past(so we care about him more). Maybe she would remind him of his dead daughter or something, so he gets attached to her fast. Only for her to do a 180, betray him and kill him in her ritual. Just to make it sting more.
She could even lure him in with the hopes for saving more villagers.

Giving it a sort of corruption of innocence ending. And having her revel in the fact she duped him.

I just want to be hit in the feels man!

>>4702310
That’s more along the lines of how I would have done it. The pitch was simply “lets do a one shot about Rosenrot, where unlike Red Hood, she IS the wolf, and she lures the hero in and kills them.” Everything else hadn’t been worked out, and I left it all in his hands basically. Then, from his original script, we worked together on the name, as he at the time didn’t know how to do names on his own, so I worked with him on it to kinda break down my thinking process. As in previous works, we kept running into the problem of me having to interpret his script, and there being a massive disconnect there. The eSports one basically got scrapped because the final story for the first chapter wound up being a melodramatic clusterfuck. Which was basically several months of work, totally down the drain (years really if you consider all the other work I’d done designing characters, and thinking up ideas for it, worldbuilding, and even designing a fighting game). And look, idc all that much, kill your darlings. It’s part of the learning process. But all the moreso my irritation at him not using this time between him having finished the name for this (two months back) and now, to draft out more names on his own like he’d said he would.

2/3

He’s basically putting things off to the last minute and doing a half-asses job at it if I’m being honest. It’s what bugged me so much about the dialogue, that I had to go back and rewrite several lines toward the end because I didn’t like them. Pic related are the bits of dialogue from his original script from the scene where the huntsman gets btfo and she does the ritual. Worst part being, rather than looking at his work and seeing where he’s just not living up to expectations, he blames it on me. When I told him I rewrote some lines and showed him what I redid, and why I did it, he said “well it’s cause you wanted the blood moon, dark god thing, if it had been how I originally envisioned it, it would have requires less exposition.” But like, the exposition is there not cause the story needs it to make sense, I added it for PACING. But it’s like, he’s the writer, he should be able to have all this under control well before I start putting ink to paper. He should be able to confidently tell what’s working and what’s not going to work. Whatever.

The one that really peeved me however was when we were drafting up ideas for a pilot (the one about the witch fighting horrors), and the whole meeting for the pilot, he just kept asking me “and then what happens,” as I pretty much came up with everything. I told him to outline the whole thing and then draft a name, but he took so long in doing the outline, I eventually did it myself during work to see if I could do it, and got it done in like a couple hours. The name for it STILL hasn’t been made, but at this point, I might as well do it myself, it’d at least be true to the vision of a single person, and whatever flaws are within it, are there for me to learn from.

3/3

Like, I’m the one who’s moved to Japan with the dream of making it, it’s beginning to feel more and more like he just wants leech off my art skill to get a free meal ticket with minimal effort on his part, especially since, I told him, I’m in this to get into Jump, no matter what it takes, and he’s more adamant and is all like, ahh I’d like to just live off my creative work, get a cheap place in Serbia, fuck Serbian chicks... like, I shouldn’t HAVE to get onto him to read fucking manga. So that’s where I’m at.

I’m thinking of just telling him, “look I’ll do the Alice pilot on my own.” The Reaper one shot for the contest, and the Dark Western are entirely on your hands. Deliver 100% completed names, and if they’re good, I’ll draw them and enter the reaper (which was again, MY idea that I gave to him to elaborate) into JP Tezuka, and, and present the Dark Western with prettied up art and a Japanese translation to an editor. That way if they flop, it’s entirely on him. And that way, I can compare what I can write solo with Alice, to what he can write without me “directing the course of the story.”

It’s genuinely starting to feel like working with him is just straight up holding me back, and I should just get over my lack of confidence as a writer, and learn to do it solo. It’s hard to come to it cause he’s a close friend, and I’m not one to betray his friends, but I’m at wits end at this point.

Sorry for the rant, but I REALLY needed to vent all that.

On the Rosenrot one, yeah, emotional is how I woulda gone. I’ve yet to see him write an emotional story, and I think that’s in large to him not being willing to put himself out there. He often goes more for wit and sarcasm and irony, but especially when that’s going to be translated, that’s a much riskier way to write.

>>4702367
>Serbia
Laughs in Slav


But, nah bro. It sounds like a bad deal on your end. And it kind of explains why the story is so dialogue heavy.

I used to be afraid of writing my own stuff and it was only last year that I stoped being a pussy and wrote my first bits of dialogue. I’d probably never team up with a writer at this point.

Your partner doesn’t seem to care about storytelling much. I don’t see why he wouldn’t read manga just in general. Hell, I even read bad comics just so I can try pinpoint what exactly makes them bad and how to fix it.

But, I don’t want to demoralize you any further. You’ve honestly inspired me to try and make certain beasts in a personal project of mine more gritty. I was already going for a nightmarish feel, but it’s not the right kind of impact.

Looking forward to more of your ink work.

How do you feel about telling your story in a unconventional order? I was thinking of doing something like

3/4 of Act 3>Act 1 >Act 2>last 1/4 of Act 3

>>4702423
Thanks. And naw, don't worry about it. I'm not discouraged at all, despite what I just said, I still think it's overall pretty good, it's just got flaws. It has indeed been refreshing to hear others give similar criticism to what I myself had felt as well. Like I said, I'm not experienced when it comes to writing, outside of working with my friend. And while my ability to storytell, and discern what a story needs in order to be good has indeed improved significantly, through both working with my friend and learning from him, but also independent studying of the craft, I still have a lot of self-doubt when it comes to writing, so oftentimes it's hard to tell when something is a matter of personal taste/style, and a more objective flaw.

Regardless of that, I still feel the one shot is overall is at the very least entertaining. idk if it'll win anything or not, but it's at the very least the best work I've yet produced with my friend, and I can be proud of it on its own merit. The art can also help make up for things that are too far into development to change. Like I said, any feedback I get, is better applied toward the next one, and in fact, why I'm more keen on just doing Alice by myself, and posting the name here for feedback, as I don't pride myself as a writer, and am those more open to being told where I'm fucking up.

>>4702555
Non-sequential storytelling isn't too uncommon. Pulp Fiction probably being the most famous example of it, but it's also not unusual for some writers to start at the climax, and then jump back to where it all started. See: Fight Club for example. That said, I think that perhaps it's a good idea to at least get a decent grasp in basic sequential storytelling before going non-sequential, just to make things less convoluted on your first attempt.

>>4702275
I mean I guess it depends on the quality of work.
It’s not really manga, but Homestuck is a webseries that has been surviving off re-used assets which has made the workflow for the creator much quicker, making it possible for the author to update it very frequently.
But if you’re talking professional standard manga, then yeah judging by Eiichiro Oda who is one of the most hardworking mandakas in the industry, 700 chapters will eat up a good portion of your life and that’s if you’re already the best of the best when it comes to being a fast and efficient work.

>>4702275 #
I mean I guess it depends on the quality of work.
It’s not really manga, but Homestuck is a webseries that has been surviving off re-used assets which has made the workflow for the creator much quicker, making it possible for the author to update it very frequently.
But if you’re talking professional standard manga, then yeah judging by Eiichiro Oda who is one of the most hardworking mandakas in the industry, 700 chapters will eat up a good portion of your life and that’s if you’re already the best of the best when it comes to being a fast and efficient worker.

>>4701784
It's shit, but hey, at least I draw

>>4702728
It's not shit, mate. You've got potential.

>>4702766
Actually, it feels like a downgrade when compared to what I'm capable of on real paper with a real pencil

>>4702203
Most Japanese kids get some formal art training in school anyway, so they already have fundamentals for the most part. I've never seen any manga become successful that was just blatantly copied from another in art style.

>>4702787
>>4702728
It looks like you're covering up weak fundamentals with scratchy linework, which can be passable in pencil, but once you lay down any kind of solid inked line the illusion breaks. The digital medium is exposing your weakness, so I suggest working on both anatomy and pose composition. Your foreshortening on the bottom left panel is way off and runs tangent to the panel border, the entire body in that image is unnatural and awkward looking, his torso is broken and the face seems to shift into a completely different art style of Toriyama-lite for just that shot.

>>4702787
Whereas here it looks like you've gone with a more Western comic style.

>>4701989
Bakuman.

>>4702797
It could definitely be better!

>>4702850
Damnit, wrong board.
Bakuman's great.

>>4702796
Huh, get it, i didn't even pay attention to his anatomical flawns. Thanks anon !
For the change of artstyle, I thought it would be nice to put a more childhish style to my characters when they're just playing around and add a bit more realism during tense scenes, but now that i'm writing it, it feels kinda dumb...

>>4702555
You can't just write a story and then splice it up. The way the disjointed parts are shown to the reader need to have a coherent path. The way you splice it up so that the reader has a certain experience is important.

Best way to learn this unconventional skill is to study other stories with nonlinear narrative.

>>4702864
I've seen that technique used, Toriyama does this a lot in Dragonball, but he keeps the faces consistent and mostly adds detail and exaggeration to the muscles for action scenes. Keep the faces consistent and it could also work for you, but I would suggest staying away from the Toriyama-style eyes and face unless you don't mind being forever considered a knockoff. His style is just too distinct to really imitate. The pic you posted looks just like some DBS fanart, thanks to the facial shapes (and the hair)

Another thing to pay attention to it your panel composition. Take a look at some comics / manga and see how the shots are composed to lead the eye and balance the negative space. Your panels here >>4702728
are shaped haphazardly and don't serve the motion of the action inside them. The bottom left panel has the character all scrunched up and weird because the panel is too small to fit that pose, so either change his pose or change the panel size. The top left panel could stand to be much smaller to make room for it, since it is just a reaction shot.

The right panel is also a strange shape, it has all that blank space in the top left corner while the characters are smashed over to the right side, not sure if you're trying to put some kind of energy blase there or something but it reads awkwardly. If you slant a panel, you generally want to slant in IN the direction of the movement to guide the eye.

Also, never do a straight profile-shot of a head that's supposed to be in perspective like the bald dude in the right panel. We should be looking at the back of his head if he's looking at the other dude, I know that's a difficult angle to pull off but if you find the correct angle is too tough to draw then change the shot, don't try to substitute it with an incorrect angle that you're more comfortable drawing.

You guys are amazing how long have you all been drawing for? Did any of you start late? I want to make manga too but I’m mid 20’s and just starting so I worry I won’t be able to ever catch up

ShonenGODS

>>4703084
It sounds lame, but it's never late.
Some things like technical skill might take a while to catch up, but if you have a story to tell... I say go for it.

Of course, don't be stupid and discard everything to pursue the dream. Make sure your finances are in place, and start small.
Be smart. :)

>>4703084
There’s no need to worry about “catching up”. That’s just a distraction that takes away from being able to progress.

Just start a project and learn the skills you need for it as you go. Honestly, I learn much better now that I’m older, my attention span is better and I grasp concepts easier.

>>4703084
Honestly, as a beginner, you will improve at lightning speed, if you stick the the basics and don't skip any steps. Just start now and have a lot of fun with improving your drawing.

>>4703174
>>4703190
>>4703199
Thanks guys best of luck to you all

Sorry if lewd content isn't the focus of the thread, but I've always wanted to make doujins. I recently saw a draw request on another board and I wanted to try a sequence and finally make an attempt. The problem (on top of my art being bad) is that I have never done this before so I don't know how to go about paneling and sequences. My main problem at the moment is how do I convey growth in a panel gracefully (I can't settle on the 4th panel due to this). Any help and critique is appreciated, thank you.

>>4703272
I found this site very helpful for paneling (just use translator on it).
https://raon-terastorys.com/komawari_2/
https://raon-terastorys.com/komawari_3/

Try to write a short story. Even if it's lewd you'd benefit from some sort narrative to avoid having too many pages that are just a bunch of pinups.

>>4702787
Don't let the sketch -> ink translation fuck you up, everyone gets rocked by their inks looking worse than their sketches. Just gotta keep powering through it until your inking skills surpass your sketches.

>>4703272
If you want to show something growing you could always stick with the tried-and-true static shot approach.Just 3 panels that are a static shot of your subject with whatever the thing is you want to grow (the tits right? so the chest. Can get creative and do two side-by-side static shots too if you like!) and just draw it getting biger over those 3 panels of the same shot/camera angle, then the 4th shot can be the "ta-daaaa" shot like you've got.

Here’s a finished page from a comic I’m working on. The girl in the bottom panel becomes a chicken nugget person after an accident on a field trip.
Have any general tips on making comics & manga really funny? I feel like I’m not funny enough.

Sorry if the pic is sized wrong.

>>4703328
Thank you. Will go through this after work.
>>4703679
>the tits right?
Her entire body. She is growing into a giant monster supposedly

What paper are you lads using? I'm gonna have to draw it with a ballpoint pen hope they don't notice :`]

So here’s my last page for a one-shot. Not the final version of course, but here’s what I can see/tell.

>Inking needs to be done better and more precise. Specially in the second panel, where some lines that are far are thick while some of the closer ones are thin.

>The middle panel needs something in the background, the all-gradient space makes it off. The man of the left feels unfinished, since is a white shirt and white hear (because he is an old man). The table being all white doesn’t help either, but a gradient is not what I’m looking for,

>The last panels while I’m ok with them, they are not manga panels, they feel more like a illustration themselves. That style could be used for big panels or double pages for impact, but for small panels it could be distracting.

>I know it’s not clear what’s happening, makes more sense if you’ve read the previous pages.

Because there’s a ton of pages and I don’t want to take forever in each one of them I’m gonna let those things pass. But feel free to let me know anything that I’m letting pass me by.

>>4703843
my last page so far* sorry i'm dumb.

>>4701840
Here.
I'm not super happy with it but I'm not gonna mess with it anymore. That's what happens when you never practice finishing drawings I guess.

Ahhhh I wanna make comics but I’m still shit

>>4703960
Well you're not gonna get better without drawing comics, so get to it.

>>4703868
I don't understand right half's panels starting with floating head. Is that head of the girl that makes that awesome "oh yeah, I'm gonna kick some real ass!" step above? If so I would consider making shot in profile a 180 degree camera turn is mighty disorienting.

>>4703843
First. I gotta say, I really like the old man. especially in the 4th panel.

>The middle panel needs something in the background, the all-gradient space makes it off. The man of the left feels unfinished, since is a white shirt and white hear (because he is an old man). The table being all white doesn’t help either, but a gradient is not what I’m looking for.

Made a dirty sketch. But, you could try drawing the background. I kind of guessed that there's a shelf/cupboard in the background and winged it. It could defiantly look nicer. Just a suggestion tho.

>The last panels while I’m ok with them, they are not manga panels, they feel more like a illustration themselves.

I'm going to have to disagree here. It shows dread and tension. I'd only maybe change the girl in the middle. I don't know if she's alive or dead or a distant memory. But, to show that's she's someone they're thinking about, I'd draw her torso at the minimum, or a full body. To contrast the man and woman and to show the distance between them.

>>4703868
Thanks for posting.
I'm going to mess with your page a bit and than write my comment. Hope you don't mind.
You work traditionally right?

>>4703995
>You work traditionally right?
No, digitally.

>>4704005
Ah, that makes edits easier.

Tried to add more contrast. I'd redraw panel 3 and search for better lighting, fix the anatomy and such. I know you guys are running out of time for the Tezuka, so don't sweat the finer details.

>>4704200
Ah, that does look better. Thanks anon.
As you say, time's a-ticking, so I'll come back to this page and fix the values later if there's time. For now, I press on!

>>4702275
wait till youve soon hajime no ippo. every chapter put out with stunning art, 1,300+ chapters still ongoing. Morikawa is a beast

>>4701764
1st page
i havent tried drawing manga type stuff in so long, looks pretty shit

>>4704388
Nah, it's a good start. Just keep at it!

>>4704371
>1989
31 years old manga, wow. That's way too old, he should have killed it some 20 years ago.

>>4704431
>he should have killed it some 20 years ago.
I mean, as long as he keeps working on it, he's got a stable job and income. And sometimes that's all that really matters.
From a business perspective he has no reason to stop until the day he dies.
For older artists it can be a lot more riskier to start over with something new. It means giving up on the thing that would put food on your table every night and throwing yourself into a new world where he has to appeal to a new generation of youngsters who's tastes are much different from how they were 30 years ago.

>>4704440
That is true, but going into manga business to well have a business is a weird thing to do IMHO. If it is stable paycheck you are after might as well be a salaryman, no? Unless Monikawa is a boxing otaku. If he is, diving completely into your passion subject is very based and artistic pilled.
Which remind me, I think Golgo 13 is also still an ongoing. Crazy stuff.

>>4704451
he owns a boxing gym and is a second at some of the fights too
plus, its not like the manga feels stretched out or sry, each chapter gets better and better

Hey /ic/. I'm asking for any advice on script writing for mangas. I have ideas in my head but I want to write out a script to really flesh out what I want to do.
Any tips on writing a manga script? I know traditional movie script writing but I'm not sure if it can be applied to mangas. Thank you!

>>4704467
you need to make a 'name', a rough manga draft. after you finalize that, make a sketched out storyboard & ink it.

>>4704471
Yeah, I was thinking of doing a rough draft but I was fishing for any little tips. Thanks for this, though. I'm planning to hopefully distribute a 18p doujin in Japan next year if Corona isn't an issue by next year.

>>4704453
So boxing is a passion subject for him then. I guess he doesn't even think of drawing the manga as a job. That's pretty great success in my book.

Also, looked up the Golgo 13. It started in 1968 and indeed still going.

>>4704477
>tips
take a look at >>4701780

>>4704481
yep, i actually was just looking at this, just wanted a human response. thanks alot though!

>>4704440
>>4704451
It’s less to do with money, and more to do with legacy. Mainstream manga like Ippo sell millions of volumes and their creators are definitely millionaires. It’s like Garfield. Why does he keep doing it? Because he can.

>>4704471
Hmm, for me I have to write out a script first before I can draw on it. Maybe my drawing skills just aren't quick enough yet.

>>4704467
For me, storytelling principles are the same no matter if you writing for cinema, tv, novels, or comics. So you can absolutely apply what you know about screenwriting to comic writing. Good books to help you transition into comics are Scott McCloud's books and Will Eisner's books.

>>4704487
what i would do is imagine the scenes in my head and just very roughly sketch what i think it would look like along with the speech. It's essentially the same as writing a script, but you give thought to the art as well when doing it.

>>4704451
Golga 13 is like what, within the top 3 highest selling manga in history?
It's weird how you rarely hear about it outside of japan. Unless there are some other countries that are obsessed with it that I'm not aware of.

>>4704499
It must be, baka updates, says that "Is the bestselling seinen manga as of 2019 with 200 million volumes sold.". So that should place in top 3 I think.
As for why it is not well known: maybe because it is not heavily advertised and, well, boring since it is all the same kill this or kill that story all the time?

>>4704467
I start with a script first. I’m the artist as well so my scene descriptions are vague. The rest is pure dialogue. Manga is very visual, so I make sure the dialogue is as short and succinct as possible. Any silent moments will be filled by the art.

>>4704371
>>4702275
>>4702206
idk about 1300+ chapters im only going up to 700 chapters depending on what i can come up with during that period 1300+ chapters my manga will get dull and repetitive i would end it and make a new manga with my knowledge then i will also have takes and opinions. i like how togashi wrote yuyu hakusho and hunterxhunter

>>4704553
>only going up to 700
Why? What’s the point of 700 chapters?

>>4704553
Just so you’re aware. 700 chapters is 14,000 pages. Measure how long it takes you to do 1 page to get an idea of how much of your life this will be. For most pro mangaka working full time at 10+ hours DAILY, with no weekends or breaks, this is 15+ years.

>>4704587
Sorry, that’s 10+ hours daily with assistants and editors, for a weekly schedule. Most monthly don’t have assistants, so you can cut your maximum output buy 60% to 30 pages monthly working solo. Or 12 chapters a year. So around 35-40 years of your life. Maybe more. In other words, you wanna make sure you’re getting paid to make this, and for that, you should instead start small, and seek a story people would be interested in reading. As in, start smaller stories, and if interest is peaked to where it’s possible, you turn that into a large series of 700+ chapters.

>>4704598
i wanna do what the author of tower of god did i dont want a weekly shonnen schedule

>>4704623
Still. What’s the point of the arbitrary number of 700 chapters? Just because you like certain series and they happen to be long, doesn’t mean that that will make you just as good of a storyteller.
Manga is about entering the reader. If you don’t have a story you want to tell, than a billion random chapters of nothing are going to be pointless.
Have you ever completed even one chapter of your work?

>>4705091
>Have you ever completed even one chapter of your work?

lmaooo yes in my head im not ready to publish my manga im still studying how to make arcs and weapons ill decrease it to 500 chapters if it makes you happy annon

>>4704623
Author of ToG has been at it for several years and his passion really drove the start of his story. My best advice to you is to get to work

>>4705351
It’s not about making me happy anon.
It’s quality over quantity. And in the long run, making sure you don’t give up because you’ve set unrealistic goals.
Sure, you can have a really long series... But you have no clue if you’ll even be able to finish one chapter, yet alone 700 of them. And if you do, how can you tell that the readers will stick around after chapter one?

Start small and build your way up.

>lmaooo yes in my head
At least write your story down ffs...

>>4704471
You can do a script for manga/comics. They tend to be more lose format wise than movie/tv shows. Here's an example of what more or less the base for a comic script looks like.

>>4705472

>>4705474

>>4705472
2000AD put out a script book a couple years ago and I'll always share it when the subject of writing for comics comes up:

https://mega.nz/file/gtNQgY6L#p7vPA_fLOUwxINMBzAX62w_xx282FVQoMhUHDGtiCpE

Previews here:

https://shop.2000ad.com/catalogue/XB583

I keep feeling scared to try and start a new comic page because of my lack of ability. I draw sucky hands and have wonky anatomy, so it gets harder when trying to fit them in small panels. Fug lads
I've been commissioned to draw two pages before which I completed and now I have two more to do. Do you guys know when you started getting a good grasp on making em? The thought of manga making excites me but its also more demanding than pin ups in my experience so far

>>4705840
>Do you guys know when you started getting a good grasp on making em?
Pages or hands?
Is it just the anatomy that's giving you trouble, or something else?

>>4705998
Both but I think I'm really wondering about composition. Knowing how to place things within the panels and how to arrange things

>>4706017
Don't overthink it. Comics are a problem of quantity. While yes, you want individual pages to be well composed and well drawn, but you cannot forget that you need to draw an ungodly number of pages AFTER that. It's not feasible for all of them to be well composed and drawn when you're working on a deadline and especially when you're inexperienced. So just draw. You'll improve by just sheer volume. This is why you shouldn't START with your 700 chapter masterpiece or whatever because you're just going to be fucking it by starting it when you have no idea what you're doing. You need to make "sacrificial" works to build up your experience.

>>4706017
I've shilled this blog before, but it's probably the best thing I've read for grasping composition for manga.

https://raon-terastorys.com/komawari_3/
https://raon-terastorys.com/kouzu/

Auto translate it to English and read his articles. The rest is just practice.

>>4706039
>>4706041
Thank. I'll figure out the tricks after study and practice I'm sure along with just learning how to draw better. Maybe I'll post a wip later but I'm not sure

I want to keep the thread positive but allow me just one doomer question, did anyone else recently find out that the so called Tezuka International Contest is actually just the same as the one the Japanese enter in as well? The contest prizes are the exact same. 99% of gaikokujin entries are getting raped yo

>>4706113
They're not the same. Japanese entrants have to submit to the regular contest, this one is specifically for foreign entrants.

>If you want to participate in the regular 100th TEZUKA MANGA CONTEST (Japanese only), the requirements are different. In that case, see the following link to participate.
>https://www.shonenjump.com/j/mangasho/teaka/
From the contest page.

>>4706113
>find out that
Nice framing as if it is actually true, and not just your attempt at trolling and disinformation, faggot.

Anybody happen to know when to use katakana and when to use hiragana for JP SFX? It almost seems to be arbitrary in the manga I've read.

>>4705351
>yes in my head
So no, you don't have any chapter done. Figures.

>>4705498
Thanks for sharing, anon!

So about how many pages do you fellas think you're doing? I'm wondering if I start late July I can finish by sept 1

So is this the general "comic thread" or is it solely for people trying to make it in japanese markets

>>4706156
Please just learn to read

>>4706123
>>4706147
Chill my niggers, I just figured that since the judges were the same, that explains how they managed to get oda, toriyama etc to judge the western ones as well - if it we're just one contest. Also the fact that the prizes were the same for the international one threw me off.
I'm very happy to hear that they are in fact separate, I thought it was too good to be true. It does say that the requirements are different for the Japanese one, but maybe that just means the submission language? I'd err on the side of pessimism. Although I did email Medibang asking them to clarify so hopefully I can assuage my worries soon.

>>4706148
It's arbitrary. Katakana is more angular though, so using for "sudden, loud, unexpected" things like explosions will probably look better than hiragana, which is curvy and better suited for "feel nice, ordinary" kind of effects.
Consult manga that you like.

>>4706156
It's manga thread, but I don't see why can't you apply stuff discussed here for comics too.

>>4706168
>It does say that the requirements are different for the Japanese one, but maybe that just means the submission language?
The japanese contest has a smaller page limit (31 instead of 55) and a later deadline (the end of Sept rather than the start of it). The link tells you this.

>>4706172
>It's arbitrary.
Good to know, thanks.

>>4706181
No, you read it wrong. The akatsuka gag manga award is 7 to 31 pages and the tezuka is "31 pages". I think there's some implicit Japanese thing I'm missing because they can't literally be asking every entry to be 31 pages, so I assume there's some Japanese implicit grammar rule I'm missing which means it's 31+ pages.
That said nowhere on that page does it say 55, which is the hard limit for the international ones, so I'll just assume you're correct.

>>4706153
>>4705455
i wrote down 15 pages of character development and plot so far anons im currently writing up villains and villain groups now i have to make sure everything is consistent before i publish

>>4705351
>ill decrease it to 500 chapters if it makes you happy annon
I guarantee you'll already start to feel burnt out on the second page.

>>4706318
Sigh... God speed then, anon.

>>4706164
Concede

>>4706249
It's straight up just 31 pages. Not one more, not one less.

I’m drawing mine traditionally so I don’t have anything to preview ready but I’ll post my MC refs!! I’m doing a pretty simple action comedy comic with a focus on background world building I guess, I’m not good at describing it...! Good luck everyone with working hard this Summer :)

>>4706249
As >>4706342 says, it's a different page count requirement.

Even if it were "no less than" 31 pages, this would be different from the western ruleset, which specifies no minimum page count (there are people planning things like two 25 page entries, for instance).

>>4706491
I love these, anon, especially the line thickness, the smiley shoes and the weird noodle dog

>mfw finally getting the action/climax
>7 straight pages of ass-kicking planned

>>4706491
very nice, definitely want to read just based on character design and style

>>4706796
>>4706686
Thanks guys! I’ll try to post some other previews in the future while I’m working on it.

>>4706793
>it ends up looking Tails Gets Trolled tier

>>4706342
>>4706502
Well thanks for double clarifying, I'm starting to think I have hope of winning a prize now

>>/a/205462192
pack it boys
greatest manga has already been made

>>4707313
>he can’t link properly
Way to go retard.

>>4707313
>>>/a/205462192

>>4707106
so amazing and based?

>>4701997
>>4701989
These are good answers.

>>4701989
Make sure you are reading manga for art style inspiration, not story inspiration. You don't want to be derivative.

Bakuman is good for tewching you the process.

Thoughts or suggestions? How's it looking, so far?

>>4707523
Chix R caliente. What is going on, tho

>>4707523
He should have let them fuck. #Cockblocker

>>4705498
Holy fuck, this looks dope. Thanks, anon!

>>4707534
Previous page, the guy breaking up the 2 women, just introduced the cat-women to the rest of the group.

The 2 women have actually been trying to kill each other for the last few chapters. The rest of the gang are reacting to the dysfunction.

>>4707594
Do you have any more of this?

>>4703995
Thanks anon. The panel seems to be daylight, so i'll make it to be on night. If i have time i'll check the middle one.

Thanks!

>>4707580
No problem! I've been rather hard-pressed in finding good examples and that book really helped me.

>>4707523
This is headache inducing. Could you please next time remove the underdrawing or whatever the fuck that is?

>>4708354
I kinda like it; sort of reminds of the glitch effects in last year's Mister Miracle comic.

>>4708175
We've been at this since the 6th or 7th grade, so yeah, there's more. That said, if you think this looks like trash, you'll vomit if you see the rest.

>>4708354
Will do. Sorry about that.

>>4708523
>That said, if you think this looks like trash, you'll vomit if you see the rest.
Boy do I know that feeling well.

>>4708523
Never said it looked like trash, tho.......

How do i make a male character design interesting? Without armour or any fancy shit like that.

>>4709938
Clothes, face and figure, hair style, tattoo, smartphone strap, catch phrase, unusual behavior, etc, etc.
What people you find interesting? Why?
Apply that.

>>4709938
It's all in the eyes.

Decided to give up on the contest since I was using a non-monochrome style and don't really feel like starting over. Godspeed to the rest of you lads.

Think it's safe to post work here? I'm worried my professional contacts will think posting here is a bit dodgy

>>4710541
Don't worry about the contest mate. Just keep learning and improving and you'll be set.

For posting your work here, I think its fine. A lot of professionals publicly post here and as long as you don't out yourself as a prick you'll be okay.

Do you guys draw with overhand grip?

>>4710802
No.

>>4710873
Like never? I’m just learning it and I want to do manga so I don’t know if I’m wasting my time getting comfortable with it

I would like to make my manga ready for print but also viewable on the net. How do I handle screentones to prevent morie?

>>4710923
Nah, never. That grip is useful when you’re trying to block in surfaces. Especially traditionally. In a way it could help you search for the right line while sketching, but I find it overkill for just manga. I have seen a few old-school mangaka use it, so it’s not like it’s not allowed. Just use the grip that’s most comfortable.

I’d focus practicing inking more than sketching anyway. Because that alone will take some time to learn.

>>4710929
Wtf is morie

>>4710946
I think they meant moire
https://tips.clip-studio.com/en-us/articles/1019

>>4710988
Correct, thanks for the link

>>4710988
Huh. I dont get how that can happen

>>4711011

>>4710943
Thanks for the advice bro, do you ever use any other grips than the standard tripod?

>>4710929
Resize your lineart at one size for print and one size for web viewing. Put tones down for both. Submit the web viewing size. Keep the larger print size files safe in case you win or want to print it yourself somewhere.

This is the only way and it is painful. Screen tones don't resize well.

>>4711125
Nah, not for manga at the very least. I’m too focused on what’s happening on the page to care how I’m holding the pencil.

Kind of a noob question, but when sketching the page, do you guys like to stay zoomed out or do you zoom into each panel? Wondering if this affects work flow and quality. I finished my thumbnail sketches and now im moving onto the real sketches, I'd like to finish before the day is over in 7 hours

>>4711157
You're working on the draft? Stay zoomed out so you can see the whole page.

>>4711163
Technically my second draft? I sloppily sketch out stuff with very little detail just to get an idea of the composition for when I'm ready for the real sketch
This will be the third time I try doing a comic page
Not sure how to make use of CSP's comic tools yet so I manually make the borders for now as well, I really need to learn those over time

>>4711157
You can zoom in to draw, but zooming out helps you see your drawing errors better.

>>4711215
I'll try to stay zoomed out for the sake of practice and challenge myself then

>>4711157
While drafting, zoomed out. While inking, I zoom in and out as needed.

How long does it take to get somewhat good with a G-pen?

>>4711327
No idea desu, but since I’m mostly digital, my digital skills are much better than my traditional ones since I’ve become so reliant on the lasso tool to fix mistakes. I might pick one up soon just to mess around with it though. I’ve been told it’s really hard to use, though I have used nib pens in the past.

>>4711327
I'm 100% digital as well. But, I did dabble in G-pens for a bit. I don't like them, they're too soft. I like the Spoon Nibs quite a bit, tho.

Kinda wish I were a trad chad. I feel inferior relying on digital tools sometimes because then I can't doodle on real paper well. It must be fun making manga traditionally even if a pain in the ass

>>4711371
Eh, I like the lack of having to clean up afterwards. Don't have to wait for ink to dry, don't have to scan things in, just edit as you go.
It's very comfy desu.

>>4711392
Once you go digital, it's hard to go back. ^_^;

>>4711327
I'm a digital baby but when I was first starting out I tried a proper gpen. They're weird, I don't know if I was using it wrong or just had bad paper or something but it was very scratchy to draw or write with, would often catch on the paper, wouldn't hold ink very well either and was just generally very unpleasant to draw with. That said, I might have just been doing it wrong. I was using one you had to dip into ink to draw with, not a fountain pen. If I switched back to physical I would probably like to try out a fountain pen, but would probably mostly stick with a millipen + brush pen, because they seem far more comfortable to draw with.

CSP-bros, how long does it take you to do a typical page? I’ve been trying to fuck around and do a page a day and it takes around 3 to 4 hours and I feel like that’s a long ass time, considering the fairly cartoonish artstyle I’m using. Granted, the first day, I just bounced around different pages, but still. Feels like I’m getting better with each page I shit out though.

These are the only two I can really say are “done”

>>4711567
Dude, 3-4 hours is a really good pace. You can try to shorten it if you want but I think you're already pretty fast.

>>4711567
Psh way longer than 4 hours for a 5 panel page with a character or two in each one. Almost done with the sketch and I'm like 4 hours in including the thumbnail draft

Do you think the winner is getting serialised?

>>4711577
Well shit, that’s encouraging. I thought I was dragging ass.

>>4711597
They're not, unless an editor approaches them outside the contest and says that they want to offer them a deal. There's no hope of serialization as writ in the contest itself, only the publishing of your one-shot.

>>4710705
That's good to hear I guess. Even though I've given up on the contest I'm potentially on the verge of getting a great deal elsewhere, so I wouldn't want to jeopardize it by doing something deemed unprofessional; not sure if sharing here is that or not.

I guess maybe I'll finally post something later.

>>4711587
What’s your workflow like? Script, thumbs, draft, lineart, fills and tones, etc?

What are the chances of a westerner getting published or serialized to be placed aside estern themed work like manga anyway? I don't think I'd like working with the western comic dudes too much if that ever did come up
Kinda sucks im not japanese bros

>>4711565
>They're weird, I don't know if I was using it wrong or just had bad paper or something
Probably using it wrong, g-pen is notoriously hard to use even for some professional mangaka

>it was very scratchy to draw or write with
Might have been the nature of the pen, might have been improper pressure or weird ink idk.

>would often catch on the paper
Thats a problem with your angle of nib to paper. It's very particular and if you do it wrong it catches.

>wouldn't hold ink very well either and was just generally very unpleasant to draw with.

Probably bad ink, paper, and technique all in one man. Not your fault though, g-pen is advanced tier nib. It takes a lot of practice.

>>4711567
It's taking me a lot longer, a page takes me a while day, but I'm also trying to Todd McFarlane my way through it and make the art look good as much as possible.

>>4711565
If you're having trouble with the ink flowing. Try to place the tip over fire for a second. The're usually coated in oil and that prevents it from flowing.

>>4711567
3-4 hours is decent time. You will get faster if you keep it up. You might even get a bit slower, but more detailed.

Be mindful of the panel spacing tho.

>>4711612
Someone else does the script for me since it's a commission. I only started drawing last jan too so I'm always having to correct my mistakes where I can making the process longer.
So as of right now, I read over the clients script, make the thumnail which takes me 30 minutes or so per page, then I do the sketch which can take a few hours depending on the details and if it's something I'm more comfortable with, then line art which is another 2 hours or so per page, and then I do color
Color I think I know how to save time next time i do it. I'll work through gray scaling i think, then add the hues, and then the lighting over the whole bodies so that im not constantly playing with laayers

Is anybody drawing non digitally? What kind and size of paper are you using?

>>4711567
>I’ve been trying to fuck around and do a page a day and it takes around 3 to 4 hours and I feel like that’s a long ass time
That's a normal amount of time even for professional mangaka. You can either work out a way to reduce that time with shortcuts OR you can just add more hours to your day by sleeping less and drawing more.
>>4711587
Now THAT is too slow, bro. Stop sketching and start inking or you're never gonna make deadlines.

>>4711597
Almost certainly not. One, because the prize is not being serialized but for the one-shot to be included in the magazine, serialization offers MAY come from that but most likely not and two because chances are none of the entrants are going to meet WSJ's standards for publication. There's a good chance nobody will win 1st prize.

>>4711621
>If you're having trouble with the ink flowing. Try to place the tip over fire for a second. The're usually coated in oil and that prevents it from flowing.
Keep in mind this was literally 6 years ago now. I still keep the nibs because fuck they're really useful for cleaning little crevices in electronics but they were not well maintained or anything. Plus I doubt I'll ever switch to trad properly, digital is just far too convenient.

>>4711621
I noticed that, I think I turned off the gutter snap thing when I was rearranging panels. I still have a lot to learn about making comics with this program.

>>4711632
>Now THAT is too slow, bro
It's due to my inexperience of drawing honestly. I'm a /beg/ who somehow landed returning commissioned comic pages. I thanked them for letting me try my hand at it since I wanted to learn how to do doujins when I'm more experienced with drawing, so getting paid to practice now is pretty alright

>>4711622
You just started drawing 7 months ago and you’re doing commissions already? Or am I misunderstanding?

>>4711645
Oops sorry, jan of last year, 2019

>>4711630
B4.

>>4711644
Having comics to draw while you're learning is excellent practice. Remember to use references and you'll learn a lot very quickly as a consequence of having a lot of shit to draw with a deadline. Good luck anon and try not to let the inevitable hump (when you can see all the flaws in your work but don't know how to fix them) turn you away.

>>4711632

>Keep in mind this was literally 6 years ago now. I still keep the nibs because fuck they're really useful for cleaning little crevices in electronics but they were not well maintained or anything. Plus I doubt I'll ever switch to trad properly, digital is just far too convenient.

Ah, okay. Yeah, I'd only go back to Nibs if I ever wanted to mess with Watercolor illustrations again. Even then, there's waterproof pens that are more continent.

>Almost certainly not. One, because the prize is not being serialized but for the one-shot to be included in the magazine, serialization offers MAY come from that but most likely not and two because chances are none of the entrants are going to meet WSJ's standards for publication. There's a good chance nobody will win 1st prize.

Not same Anon. But, that's interesting.
I'm toying with a script last minute, but don't wanna commit to Jump publishing desu. Just want to give it an honest shot.

>>4711653
Thanks

>>4711654
Yeah this time I gathered some better references and I think the sketch is looking better than my previous pages. Sometimes it is time consuming to find the references I need so I just try to wing some stuff. Practicing character consistency at different angles is fun as well
I'd post a wip but I feel like I shouldn't since it's intended to go on their patreon, it's a fetish based patreon that has support to then fund several artists commission work to supply content for the niche fetish. It's a wholesome set up honestly

>>4711678
You don’t have any work to post? I’m curious to see your advancement after a year and a half.

>>4711678
Don't fall into the mistake of feeling good over your sketches. They're only the scaffolding for your finished drawings, and will often look better to you because they're loose and allow you to draw very vaguely. I'm going to say something that will be very helpful to you in the long run right now: Finish everything you sketch, even if you only post the sketch. Finishing drawings is a skill in and of itself and is much more important than drawing a nice sketch, since it's the part you want people to see. Your finished drawings WILL look worse than your sketches, basically all the time. You need to confront that early and often to get over it and make progress in finishing drawings well.
I'm suffering from this problem now and boy does it feel bad. My pages look really nice in the sketch but then just completely lose all appeal in the process of finishing them and I really really wish I had spent more time practicing my inking to avoid this.

>>4711690
I don't have any comics of mine to post but I do have personal work which were focused on 1-2 characters, my comics have lower detailed characters atm, but here's my work in another thread >>4701113
>>4711702
Yeahh I know of the sketch losing soul meme once you ink it, I'll try to keep line weight in mind. I still have a lot of trouble trying to show a good amount of expression and faces but practice should solve it. I wanna do some focused grinding very soon and hopefully do a personal work comic so that I can post it

>>4711702
Gonna have to agree with this anon here. Had same problems pop up in the past.

>>4711702
Try changing the color of your sketches to blue and drawing over it if you aren't already. It's helped my line art miles in terms of speed and overall quality by simply being able to differentiate better from sketch.

>>4711708
That’s pretty good for such a short amount of time.

>>4710541
>>4710705
>>4711610

This is sort of against my better judgement but I suppose I'll post something. Here's one of my favorite pages from the one-shot I was working on.

Even though I'm dropping out of the contest it seems like it'd be a bit of a waste to throw out what already exists, so maybe I'll try and finish it in my spare time if none of my current bids at professionalism doesn't work out. Maybe I'll post it up somewhere for free if it does end up being finished, since I do actually enjoy working on it.

>>4711734
looks like Made in Abyss
nice

>>4711734
Looks really good.
Are you giving up because it's not monochrome? How many pages did you do?

>>4711730
I always drop the opacity of my sketches to <30% to avoid that problem already. It's just being too used to drawing very loose sketches then losing that looseness in drawing nice clean lines.
There's also the issue of values. I'm this guy >>4703868 and as you can see, the sketch here >>4701784 leaves values up to implication that I then failed to deliver on in the inks. It's an issue of the imagination doing a much better job than my skill in inks delivers on currently.

>>4711733
Thanks, that's probably due to me always spending a lot of time with each piece, aka polishing shit as someone on asg told me
My goal this year is to be able to construct characters properly and more quickly so that I can experiment with comic making more often

>>4711734
Neat sense of scale

>>4711734
By the way if you ARE giving up because it's not monochrome, you can easily convert layers to monochrome with CSP. If you kept the project file with all the layers intact then even better, you can convert just the tone layers to monochrome.
Pic related, there's a button that allows you to convert back and forth easily.

>>4711734
This looks pretty dope, post more

>>4711744
To me your inks don't drop in quality too badly compared to some other myself and other artists. I think losing looseness inking is an inevitability unless you're well trained.
Personally I do both, drop the opacity AND change the draft to blue. I used to do only the former, but my eye kept confusing the draft into the inks making them look shitty once I erased them. I was mindlessly inking before that, but forcing myself to think improved my lines and confidence drastically.

>>4711741
>>4711753
>>4711765
Thanks anons, I appreciate it. MIA was one of my main visual inspirations, so I'm glad it comes through.

>>4711743
>>4711765
This is why I'm giving in, yeah. I actually tried a monochrome conversion, but I just can't get a small enough dot matrix. It washes out a lot of detail in the pages with backgrounds (which, sadly, is most of them, since I wanted to have a consistent sense / reminder of scale throughout the one-shot).

I only did a handful of pages, but I'd rather make the work my way as opposed to compromising for a contest I don't think I'll win anyway. I could have done a different work in a different style maybe, but I don't think I have enough time at this stage; I'm a pretty slow artist.

On the bright side though, if certain other things work out, I might end up getting a tanko-based deal with a publisher. So, cross your fingers for me, if you want to. Hope you guys place well.

>>4711802
That's pretty cute anon.
When you say publisher, do you mean Viz Originals? I'm only asking cuz, I'm mildly interested, but their info is kinda vague. And I don't wanna send in a pitch just yet.

Either way. Good luck! I hope you get it.

>>4711802
Oh man it looks dope.
>tanko-based deal
I wish you luck, fingers crossed! :)
Do tankobones allow for grayscale printing? Or you will be forced to use screentones?

>>4711802
Very ethereal. Looks great! :)

>>4711614
>What are the chances of a westerner getting published or serialized to be placed aside estern themed work like manga anyway?
The same as it is for any Japanese person provided you match the base standard skill and can effectively communicate in Japanese (though fluency is preferred). Getting serialized is tough as it’s heavily reliant on luck, alongside a high skill floor.

>>4711847
>The same as it is for any Japanese person
I'm not sure if that's true, remember the whole baka gaijin thing.

>>4711858
>remember the whole baka gaijin thing.
No such thing. That’s nonsense propagated by loser gaijins who come here expecting people to fellate them for being American (in most cases), and expect Japan to conform to their whim. Japan, like anywhere else, will generally treat everyone fairly and with equal opportunity provided you’re willing to assimilate into their culture, and have earned the merit.

I should have specified, I’m Japananon. Most of what you read about Japan on the internet is total bullshit propagated by butthurt gaijins.

>>4711858
Frankly, choosing between equally skilled native and foreign authors, I would choose native one. Less surprises this way, and business is not a place for surprises.
That being said, maybe having a gaigin author could produce nice hype and increase the sales.
Hard choice.

>>4711886
Yeah, I can imagine the marketing going wild.
Didn't Oda endorse Radiant? How is that perceived in Japan?

>>4711817
>>4711827

Thanks anons, I appreciate it a lot. Just doing what little I can.

> When you say publisher, do you mean Viz Originals? I'm only asking cuz, I'm mildly interested, but their info is kinda vague. And I don't wanna send in a pitch just yet.

I don't know if it would be in good professional taste for me to say right now, so I can neither confirm nor deny, sorry anon. Regarding VIZ Originals itself though, it's been slow moving due to corona and other factors, but I think you should give it a go. Given what I know about the program, it seems like it could be a good opportunity. Based on the artists attached to the two currently-announced series, it seems like they're aiming for a reasonably-high point of visual fidelity, so at the very least they seem committed to creating a quality line.

>>4711820
No idea. What I brought in for talks is a wholly different concept in a different style (pic related), and while I'd still rather not use screentones if I can get away with it (I'm just not that fond of them), I'd be open to it at the very least, especially since I'll need some midtones for the visuals I want. So, we'll see. It might not even matter.

>>4711894
>I can neither confirm nor deny, sorry anon.

Thanks anyways tho.
I want to be able to write unfiltered dialogue, so it'd be mature themed. Drama-esque like Beastars (because I don't know what else to compare it to).

Ignoring the publisher. Do you have any experiences with submitting pitches? I don't know if I should flesh out my work more, or send a pitch. I'd like to talk to some editors, but no idea what to expect.

>>4711894
I took a peak inside of one of the recently printed tanks, and it does use the screentones. But it only means that they are in use, not that you have to use them.
Anyway.
Like the character, esp. the hair! Looks both lively and cute :)
Good luck, anon!

>>4702275
well, being a mangaka is a job like any other. what did you expect?

>>4711886
There’s a few foreigners who are published mangaka in Japan, all of them for smaller prints, but still. Within SJ, you got Boichi who is a native born Korean, so that should tell you just how open-minded Shueisha is as a company, given how Korea is one of the countries where there is actual animosity towards in Japan. I’ve also heard of a couple of westerners who work as assistants for Shueisha mangaka.

There’s no real discrimination if your work is good and speak the language. Getting published is still hard regardless though.

>>4711910
Yeah, we'll see what the editor has to say about the screentones and so on. Honestly, if it's what they want, it's what they want. I'm more flexible on the visuals for what I pitched, since I do want it to be a bit more dynamic in presentation than those pages I posted earlier anyway. Thanks for the well-wishes though anon, I'll do my best and hope for the best.

>>4711906
They'd be okay with more graphic content from what I understand (especially since they're looking for shonen as part of the lineup), though that's something you'd have to take up with the editors / submission team in terms of how much leeway you'd have in terms of dialogue and portrayal and so on. I can't say for sure.

> Do you have any experiences with submitting pitches? I don't know if I should flesh out my work more, or send a pitch. I'd like to talk to some editors, but no idea what to expect.

Sure, I can talk a little bit about this.

What a publisher wants to see from you in terms of a pitch is going to vary from publisher to publisher. Generally, a publisher (or an editor, if you have a direct contact) will make clear what their expectations are from you, whether this is in direct conversation, at a portfolio review, or through the guidelines of their open submissions page. So, whether or not you "have enough" will depend on what each editor is looking for. Some will just want writeups / summaries and test pages, some will want both of those and some concept art on top of that, and yet others will want all of that plus some advance scripts or storyboards.

A piece of advice: unless an editor explicitly says you can, don't pitch without art. If you're a writer, find an artist to attach to the project and make some concept art in advance. Depending on the publisher, test pages will be a requirement, which means you'll either have to find an artist anyway, or have some past pages you've done in collaboration with an artist to share, if they say you can.

More in the next post.

>>4711958
Oh yeah, wanted to add that one of the benefits you bring forth as a foreigner is a new perspective. You were raised in a different culture than the Japanese, and thus were influenced by different things and have a different way of looking at life. Unfortunately all the gaijin authors I know use this to write about foreigners living in Japan as their niche, but European culture has a lot to offer, and if you write inspired by western authors, you can tell stories that would he rather fresh to the Japanese. A European’s understanding of Christianity and European culture for example is likely to be much more throrough than that of a Japanese person’s, because you inherited that culture, and innately know all the nuances to it.

>>4711962
I’m interested, is your pitch offer in order to get published in Japan? Or overseas?

>>4711962
If you're an artist, there's a few things you should keep in mind when pitching or talking to an editor.

The first is that you should know how to design, not just how to draw. A well-designed character that doesn't have any solid visual hooks is difficult to market. I know that sounds cynical but that's just how it is. When I talked to my editor contact, one of the things that they really liked about my work was that the characters were very "cosplayable," for lack of a better word (it's not exactly how they described it). There's a level beyond simple recognition or "uniqueness" that makes a character distinctly recognizable as not only a character from a given series, but a specifically fictional one, if that makes sense. It's the difference between seeing someone in a costume and assuming they're just dressed up or wearing weird clothing, and seeing someone dressed up and knowing that they're cosplaying as a specific character, even if you don't know where that character is from. In other words, there's a level to uniqueness of character that extends beyond recognition and instead deals with unique traits in and of themselves in relation to the character. I hope that makes sense, I don't think I explained it very cohesively but I'm not sure how else to talk about it.

Another thing: be good at backgrounds. Lots of people, even people who are very good at drawing characters, are bad at backgrounds. Having good backgrounds can automatically elevate your work above that of many others. This is especially true if you're going for a non-weekly deal, since there's less of a reason (read: almost no reason) to skimp on the visual fidelity of monthly or yearly releases. A good set of backgrounds can also add as much visual character to your comic or manga as the characters themselves, especially if the two link together in interesting ways. Even a lot of popular manga neglects this (Made In Abyss does this very well, as does Nausicaa of the Valley of the Wind.)

>>4711970
Whether or not I'd get published in Japan would depend on whether or not the series does well domestically (and whether or not I get the deal in the first place of course). The company is a JP-owned subsidiary though, so they'd have the channels to make that happen if it were warranted.

>>4711977
Hey thanks for this.
I’m currently out, so I can’t post my work. But I’m confident in my skills. Not sure bout my character designs, but I’m decent at backgrounds.
I think my biggest fear is having to change my story too much. Or having to censor it. It’s not really out there, but I’d like to incorporate adult language and themes. I’m not native to America, so I worry about the western sensitivities when it comes to publishing.

I’m still figuring out my options. But I’ll try to participate in the Tezuka. Gonna see if I can finish in time(started today lol).

>>4711962
Thanks for sharing your insights!
Your works are really nice! ^_^

How come people act like every single mangaka is miserable when serialized

>>4711977
Ahhh... I wonder if I kinda missed out on my character design for my submission.
Now looking at them.. They look rather bland. ^_^;

>>4711977
>>4711962
Ok, this has been really really informative. I’m very excited to go to Shueisha now and see what they say. My character design skills especially have always received a lot of praise, particularly the Tiger Square characters:

https://chagoxchago.artstation.com/projects/OyPBOv

Once I’m done with the entries for this contest, I’m gonna prepare some stuff for three different pitches, Alice, Tiger Square, and probably the Dark Western, and go to them with everything I have. I wanna go above and beyond all expectations to really secure a chance at getting a visa.

>>4712033
>https://chagoxchago.artstation.com/projects/OyPBOv
Designs are tight! :)

>>4712010
> I think my biggest fear is having to change my story too much. Or having to censor it. It’s not really out there, but I’d like to incorporate adult language and themes. I’m not native to America, so I worry about the western sensitivities when it comes to publishing.

Lots of people on 4chan would likely disagree for various reasons, but I think the degree of sensitivity in western publishing is generally overblown. A lot of the weirder, more violent and strange stuff is published independently or by smaller publishers, but there's lots and lots of content that doesn't pull any punches. The issue, though, is that it's not as popular as many other things, and thus some editors won't want to take a chance on it because the returns aren't as guaranteed. It's the same thing in Japan, though since a larger population percentage reads comics there, there's a better "chance" at non-standard content making it big (and even then, we in the west generally don't get to see it, since such works rarely get to the point where they gain enough of a following to warrant non-fan translation). I'm curious to see your work, but I think ultimately what you're going to have to do is put together a packet and shop it around and see what people say, as you won't know what'll be said until people start to say it.

>>4712025
>>4712030
Thank you anon, I'm glad they resonate to some degree. Character design is an ongoing process, so even if you might have missed out this time around, if you feel passionate about the story, you should sit down and do some more design experimentation. It's pretty common for the first round of designs to end up being thrown away in favor of new takes. You should post some for feedback, I'm curious about your work too.

>>4712033
Best of luck anon, there's some really neat designs there. Maybe if we both get lucky, our works will be side-by-side on bookshelves someday.

>>4712084
Thanks for the encouragement! ^_^
I'm still 1/3 in, and worried whether I can finish this in time.
But here are some pages I've done.

>>4712084

>>4712088
>>4712089
These are really nice anon, you have an interesting style. I'm not exactly certain what you're going for in terms of concept and worldbuilding (seems like supernatural being hunters in a semi-modern setting from the limited context I have), but I do agree that the characters could use a little more spice.

This is something that you can easily do through some costuming changes. What your characters wear can say a lot about the setting and their station in life, and can also be the perfect opportunity to work in visual motifs that blend with their physical design or establish important visual or scale elements. If I knew what you were aiming for conceptually, I might be able to offer some more direct feedback, but here's something a little more general in the meantime.

For instance, take a look at the two characters on the side there; those are the designs I used for the one-shot. Facially, they're very simple, with only minor differences and not all that much going on. The vast majority of the detail, shape language, and visual distinction and storytelling happens through the costuming. If you're clever about it, you can use your costuming as a microcosm of the rest of your setting, showcasing elements of how characters live and what they do.

On the level of pure visual interest, one thing that tends to look rather nice is what's called "shape repetition." This is a concept used a lot in the concept art field; generally it's the idea of reinforcing visual traits by baking specific shapes into various parts of a design in order to create interesting overall forms and a distinct silhouette. The character on the left, for instance, has a "rounded upward arrow" look due to the shape of their cloak, mushroom helmet, and pants, all of which echo a narrow top and flared bottom, while the character on the right has recurring tapered points via their cloak and leaf-hood.

>>4712088
>>4712089
These are really nice anon, you have an interesting style. I'm not exactly certain what you're going for in terms of concept and worldbuilding (seems like supernatural being hunters in a semi-modern setting from the limited context I have), but I do agree that the characters could use a little more spice.

This is something that you can easily do through some costuming changes. What your characters wear can say a lot about the setting and their station in life, and can also be the perfect opportunity to work in visual motifs that blend with their physical design or establish important visual or scale elements. If I knew what you were aiming for conceptually, I might be able to offer some more direct feedback, but here's something a little more general in the meantime.

For instance, take a look at the two characters on the side there; those are the designs I used for the one-shot. Facially, they're very simple, with only minor differences and not all that much going on. The vast majority of the detail, shape language, and visual distinction and storytelling happens through the costuming. If you're clever about it, you can use your costuming as a microcosm of the rest of your setting, showcasing elements of how characters live and what they do.

On the level of pure visual interest, one thing that tends to look rather nice is what's called "shape repetition." This is a concept used a lot in the concept art field; generally it's the idea of reinforcing visual traits by baking specific shapes into various parts of a design in order to create interesting overall forms and a distinct silhouette. The character on the left, for instance, has a "rounded upward arrow" look due to the shape of their cloak, mushroom helmet, and pants, all of which echo a narrow top and flared bottom, while the character on the right has recurring tapered points via their cloak and leaf-hood.

>>4712084
>I think the degree of sensitivity in western publishing is generally overblown.

That's good to know. Like I said, my stuff isn't that bad in general. It's defiantly more mild, than GoT for instance.
I think it'd be more attractive to a female audience too.

>I think ultimately what you're going to have to do is put together a packet and shop it around and see what people say, as you won't know what'll be said until people start to say it.

I'll deffo put some stuff together. There's really no going around it isn't it? Haha
But thanks for your insight. It's really helpful. I came to 4chan on a whim, but this thread is really nice to come back to. I don't have any art friends who I can chat to about this.


>mfw I brag about my backgrounds
>mfw I don't have anything cleaned up to show

Why am I like this???

Threw together some stuff that's not my main project. Don't wanna waste time cleaning up the first pic right now, since I'm seriously considering Tezuka. The oneshot will be about the two guys on the third pic. I will post more once I have it.
I am also this anon.

>>4702310
>>4703995
>>4704200

>>4712146
I generally don't like using my own work as an example because I'm far from the best or most qualified artist out there, and I fear coming across as having a sense of unwarranted self-importance, but it works well enough as a case study and it's what I have on hand for now, as far as both shape language and visual storytelling go. You can also take a look at stylized videogame character concepts, as they'll use a lot of that same shape-based thinking.

You can also take a look at >>4712033's concepts for more idea of visual worldbuilding; you can tell from the concepts at hand that the story takes place in an eastern world (or that, at the very least, most of the characters involved hail from such a place), and that there is, additionally, a heavy martial-arts focus on the mythos used. The setting is "baked into" the characters in a sense; that's what I mean by making your costuming or designs into a "microcosm" of your overall setting.

Hope this helps, anon.

>>4712147
It's good that you bring up Game of Thrones as an example actually, since I find that if you want to look at where a lot of the "darker" subject matter is, you'll find it in a lot of television shows instead--since that medium is where these ideas can find a more profitable audience. GoT, American Horror Story, Breaking Bad, A Handmaiden's Tale, Westworld, Babylon Berlin, DarK, Altered Carbon--all these series and more contain dark, disturbing, or otherwise heavy content, and are well-received and taken seriously. Darker and more serious stuff in and of itself can exist just fine, it's just that the western comic market is already very small, so niche interests in a niche market will be of questionable value to the business-minded.

So, don't worry too much about your subject matter. Just worry about how you can market it to an audience and a potential editor. Publishing is a business, so ultimately publishers are going to put a high priority on whether or not your work is sellable (and whether or not it is isn't a hard and fast science, so if your concept is good enough, you can sway them on it).

Don't worry about having nothing clean to post, sometimes that's just how it is. Your sketches look really nice; just remember to pay attention to depth and perspective, since you have some mismatches in certain places.

>>4712146
>>4712150

Oh no.. These are really helpful.
Thank you so much!
I guess I'm a bit shy to share unfinished works, but maybe it's important to get some feedback regardless.
Even if I can't apply them to this current submission... It'll be super helpful to keep in mind later. ^_^

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1IiNpiMxirX9MatIqPONgBuakruU2LTSV?usp=sharing

Excuse the super rough thumbnails, as they will probably make little to no sense.. But hopefully with the pages that are cleaned up, you can get a general sense what I'm going for. ^_^;

>>4712084
>Maybe if we both get lucky, our works will be side-by-side on bookshelves someday.
That would be cool. Two 4channers made it with the big boys. I dig your designs as well btw, I think they have a lot of unique appeal. Thanks for all the info too, it’s been incredibly encouraging. Really lifted my spirits.

>>4712173
>Just worry about how you can market it to an audience and a potential editor. Publishing is a business, so ultimately publishers are going to put a high priority on whether or not your work is sellable (and whether or not it is isn't a hard and fast science, so if your concept is good enough, you can sway them on it).

I think I should be fine than. It only gets a bit dark towards the end. But, but I don't think I'd consider it edgy either. I just have a subconscious tick, where I compare my stuff to the milder Shounens. And that's not really my writing style atm.

>Your sketches look really nice; just remember to pay attention to depth and perspective, since you have some mismatches in certain places.

Thank you for your honesty.
I didn't plan that one piece out so I ended up fighting the perspective instead of just redrawing it haha.

>>4706168
Yfw the western pile of entries are saved for the last minute of the meeting

>>4712182
Make that three my niggas.

>>4712206
>>4712182

Bumping it to four.

this thread got really interesting

>>4712221
Can you make it five?

>>4712242
Why, of course!

>>4712033
Wow, those look very good!

>>4712176
This gives me a better idea of what you're going for, yeah. If your two main characters are part of some organization (a piece of dialogue seems to imply such), I'd have experimented with giving them uniforms. Otherwise, if you want them to be undercover or just have them in plain clothes, there are still other avenues open to you.

Personally, I like looking into urban fashion / streetwear for interesting modern looks; I put together a little collage of what I'm talking about for you. Not all of what you find in that realm will always be applicable to whatever you're trying to design (or look good in general), but it can be a good starting point for "realistic" clothing that nonetheless looks visually interesting or has some interesting shapes. That way, you can bump up their visual interest and give them some unique looks while nonetheless keeping them somewhat grounded and keeping them from getting a little too visually crazy or non-modern.

>>4712182
Thanks anon, glad all this was helpful. Best of luck with your own editor!

>>4712206
>>4712221
>>4712242
And yes; may we all find success.

>>4712185
> I just have a subconscious tick, where I compare my stuff to the milder Shounens. And that's not really my writing style atm.

I'm sure that there are avenues for that sort of thing available. Something to keep in mind is that editors will generally be more aware of non-popular works because they're, well, editors; it's their job to keep a pulse on things beyond the usual. So, don't worry about "shocking" an editor because what you've presented doesn't seem like it could fit into the standard shonen jump lineup or whatever. Chances are they've read similar stuff before. They'll have a greater sense of context for your work than most audiences will (and maybe a greater sense of context than you have yourself).

>>4712277
Thanks for more context. Beastars is the closest comparison I have. And it's published by Viz, so that took some of my edge off.

Different question tho. What are the turnout expectations in the west? How much time is given to finish a project? Be it chapter or full book?

Aren't you guys just talking about the seinen genre, meant for young adults

>>4712288
My particular case would probably be more Josei. It's a romance, mystery, drama. My MC is female.

>>4712283
That's publisher-dependent. Some publishers (particularly smaller ones) see themselves as lassiez-faire publishers of finished material, and thus only publish completed works, leaving the turnaround time entirely up to you. Western comic issues to my understanding tend to fall between 28-32 pages and are generally either bi-weekly or once-monthly depending on popularity. If you're working with volumes, sometimes they'll demand a book of a specific length once a year, or every few months. JP-style weekly releases are very very rare in the west; I don't know of any places outside of Japan that do that, unless you count Webtoons and webcomics, which are traditionally weekly.

So, it all depends. Your publisher will set the pace.

>>4712296

Ah, I see. My end goal is getting to Tankobon style books. So doing one a year, doesn't sound too bad. And, yeah. It's all speculation.

I wish there were still physical shonen jump magazines in the west bros

>>4712306
Me too, anon, me too.

>>4712306
Tell me about this anon. How was it?

is anyone here even drawing traditionally? For some reason I enjoy sketching and inking traditionally much more than digital.

>>4712312
Like the opening sequence of el dorado
But really I dunno. They already stopped by the time I was interested. I hope physical copy culture never fully dies out

>>4712328
I held a Weekly Jump book, once, years ago, in Germany...
It was really hard to get any comics where I'm from. Now, I'm in the US and the cashiers start chatting to me about any books I buy. Times really have changed.

>>4712325
I'm not, but don't let that stop you.

>>4712325
I'd like to but it's simply not practical for me.

>>4712325
I am, but I'm both /beg/ and consider manga-making only as a recreational hobby.

>>4712325
I used to, but it became such a source of stress for me, making things "perfect" when ink has no forgiveness whatsoever. I wanted to practice being forgiving of my art, so I only ink digitally now. I still do all my studies in my sketchbook with pencil, but for actual illustrations and such I do it digitally.

>>4712242
L-let's make it six, senpai...

>>4712337
>I held a Weekly Jump book, once, years ago, in Germany...
Found a German translated shonen Jump from 2002 a few days ago in my attic, it was great.

https://imgur.com/gallery/yn27Cj7
I generally don't post here much, but sense it's about the Tezuka Award, I thought I might post my promo of the first 10 pages.

>>4712368
Do you prefer not using white out for some reason?

>>4712325
>is anyone here even drawing traditionally?
yes
i start with pencils on deleter A4 paper, ink on another sheet then scan the inked page to photoshop and do touch-ups digitally
one thing i am considering is doing 100% photofiltered backgrounds so all i have to do is draw characters and items

don't have anything to show because it's for the contest

>>4712084
Wow that picture is amazing, how did you learn to draw?

>>4711962
>>4711977
Quick addition to these, since some other things came up that I should probably mention:

-- If a publisher or editor invites you to a portfolio review or pitch session or similar after seeing your work via submission or other means, bear in mind that they're giving you an interview-style personality test. Editors want to make sure that you're not crazy or a dirtbag and so on, and also want to make sure that you have some knowledge of the medium and interesting opinions on things. The last thing a publisher wants is to hire a creator that they don't trust in front of a comic con panel audience or alone in an interview with a journalist, whether that's because they'll go nuts or because they're uninformed or because they're just boring. Be humble, be truthful, and be kind.

-- You don't have to butter them up though. Lots of editors are very critical (because their job is literally to criticize work submitted to them), and thus have their own thoughts on the state of the industry and so on. When I met with my contact, we ended up having a back-and-forth on our mutual criticism regarding the lack of smooth integration between setting and story in a lot of manga.

-- DO know why you're there and who you're pitching to, though. One of the lead-ins the editor gave me when we talked was asking me if I was *really* there for comics and that they weren't taking pitches for anime and so on. This gives me the impression that a lot of people either don't put in their research or go in with an "any publisher's a goal" type mindset and fire their ideas or portfolios off blindly to incompatible entities. Know what your chosen publisher publishes, read their material, and submit similar material. If the publisher is open to alternative, out-of-their-wheelhouse ideas, they will tell you. If you walk into a meeting and slap down something unworkable in front of an editor, there's no recovery. It's the number one way to show you don't know what you're doing.

>>4712512
Thanks for more gems anon.

>When I met with my contact, we ended up having a back-and-forth on our mutual criticism regarding the lack of smooth integration between setting and story in a lot of manga.

I am interested in this conversation. I’m noticing a lot of exposition heavy entries.

>>4712510
Thanks anon, I really appreciate it. Most of the way that I learned was via trial and error and advice from other artists, so I sadly don't have a bunch of links to just put down for you.

That said, I'm a big believer in constructivist fundamentals: depth, form, and perspective first, then anatomy, then lighting, then on from there. I know it might seem like a big meme, but the box drawing exercises really do help. The point of all that simple shape drawing is to train your eye to sense depth and form in a 2D space. When you have that ability, you can rotate forms in your head, and complex things (such as people) become far, far easier to draw.

It's all about internalizing the baseline elements so that you can do them without thinking about them at all. When you don't have to invest any mental energy into the fundamentals, then you can invest more energy into the high-level work, such as basic detailing, rendering, designing, and so on. And once you have *those* on automatic, you can begin putting more time into the more advanced versions of all those things, and so on.

>>4712526
I should probably get some rest for right now, but when I have time after I wake up, I can probably share some thoughts on that. Sorry for the wait.

>>4712535
Rest well anon! o7
I’m enjoying this chat.

>>4712535
Thank you for the advice bro

Hi everyone! I finished and uploaded my entry for the contest.
Any general feedback would be appreciated--I don't have the energy to continually re-edit and change things (as I've been doing for the past few days), however it would be nice to have pointers for improvements in future works.

https://medibang.com/book/e02007101107485310001766144/view/

>>4711802
>>4711734
Give us a link once you're done--this looks really comfy and cool.

>>4711567
>>4711636
If you're learning a new program, let alone new to making comics, it's normal for it to take a long time in the beginning--once you establish a solid pipeline though, you can shit pages out with less stress.
I had a similiar feeling making my oneshot as well--I was trying to draw cleaner than I usually do, attempting to make more detailed backgrounds, and also drawing mechs, which I've never done before--a lot of it was new territory for me.

>>4701764
>Unspecified. It's recommended you work at at least 600 DPI regardless.
Do the pages you upload have to be full resolution? I tried doing that, and the browser mars the screentones to hell and back, so I had to upload downsized versions.

>>4712623
>Do the pages you upload have to be full resolution?
This question was answered via email in one of the previous threads IIRC, they said it was fine to upload downscaled versions, the 600 dpi is requirement is for print.

>>4712631
I see--many thanks!

What fonts do ya’ll use?

>>4712271
Thank you anon, these are very helpful. ^_^
Appreciate you taking out the time of your day to share your feedback and insight.

>>4712623
Pacing is a little weird but I can't really put my finger on it. One shots are hard to deal with so I understand how difficult it can be. Still, something is off. Kinda felt like you wasted a lot of pages in the beginning with lots of different shots of the girl smoking. Some of it was nice for your establishing shots but a lot of it was unnecessary. Maybe she could have been thinking about her time as a fighter or watching something about fighting or you could have been showing off her being arms or something, making a little more interest. Don't quite know what you would do, just shooting in the dark there. Eh, and your character development was kind of weak. The part where the old man in the mech came in felt strange because his accomplices totally gave up but he busts out of nowhere to fight? Wouldn't they know he was there and act accordingly? Or was he just a random guy? It kind of took me out of it. I liked your premise and your art, though your story and dialogue needs work (how many times did I just read "eh..." "Eh?" and "EHHHH???" - would have been nice to have her bitching or saying she doesn't give a fuck or something) Cool splash pages btw, I liked those a lot.

>>4712811
>her veiny arms*
Sorry, this is what I get for phoneposting

>>4712811
Thanks for the feedback anon.

From what I've extracted from your comments, the pacing is wonky due to the lack of build-up: things seem to happen out of the blue without rhyme or reason, the old dude in the mech busting out being an example.
I also agree that more could have been done with depicting Lilac's backstory as a martial artist--however, I would keep the establishing shots at the beginning, since I wanted to depict how slow and uneventful Lilac's life was at that time, while setting up the world the story takes place in.

Again, many thanks fren

>>4712811
Thanks for the feedback anon.

From what I've extracted from your comments, the pacing is wonky due to the lack of build-up: things seem to happen out of the blue without rhyme or reason, the old dude in the mech busting out being an example. I'll keep this in mind with future works.
I also agree that more could have been done with depicting Lilac's backstory as a martial artist--however, I would keep the establishing shots at the beginning, since I wanted to depict how slow and uneventful Lilac's life was at that time, while setting up the world the story takes place in.
In terms of dialogue, I'll likely edit and polish it in the near future.

>>4712900
>I would keep the establishing shots at the beginning, since I wanted to depict how slow and uneventful Lilac's life was at that time, while setting up the world the story takes place in.
That's fine I just wish there was more showing the world and how slow her life is rather than 3 pages of shots of her smoking, you know?

Anyways, looking forward to what you do in the future

>>4712623
> Give us a link once you're done--this looks really comfy and cool.

Thanks anon, will do if I manage to see it through to the end. I took a look at your own entry, and here's my thoughts.

I disagree with >>4712811 insofar as I felt the pacing wasn't all that bad for a one-shot (though you definitely could have benefited from using the extra 9 pages of length that you didn't get to). There were a few oddities in there, such as the main character seeming initially reluctant then really getting into it and then seemingly falling out of it again when she meekly asks the criminals to surrender, but I thought her overall emotional arc was satisfying. The butterfly at the end feels like a payoff without a setup, as the reader is never clued in to the significance of butterflies in a thematic or setting sense, so that rung hollow for me; that page space could have been used for something else.

There was also a moment of confusion for me when the second robot was introduced. The way that the Iron Lung is spoken about earlier on makes it seem as if it's the first machine of its kind (the main girl's surprise comes from the fact that she's looking at a giant robot, and the builders describe it as a "new weapon"), and it thus turned me around a little bit when it was revealed that what appeared to be common criminals *also* had a giant robot, which would imply that they're more common than one might think. Having the black-haired girl focus on what makes her robot the Giant Robotiest of all the Giant Robots would alleviate this problem, as it makes the Iron Lung special in comparison without throwing the reader for a loop when another machine shows up.

(ctnd.)

>>4713636

I think the biggest thing holding the one-shot back though is the fact that the visuals are very hard to look at. I don't mean that in the sense that they're ugly (there's some good foundational drawing in there), I mean that in the sense that everything is so loose and open that I found myself having to work in order to parse what was going on on the page. Things were okay for the robot fight scenes (likely mostly because they were happening on top of blank backgrounds), but as soon as characters or objects were placed in environments or against backgrounds, things became very messy and confusing. The light and sketchy lines and hatching that you use throughout also make black fills very jarring. Every time they appear, they stand out to a huge degree, and become the most dominant thing on the page. This becomes especially unfortunate when the black-haired girl gets more and more screentime, as her hair is extremely distracting and pulls me out of the panel flow. Visually, it feels more like a set of roughs or a Name than a finished work.

I would highly suggest investing more time into working on your line confidence and your inking skills so that you can generate cleaner pages and better element separation.

As a bit of an aside, I personally would have gone with an alternative robot design as well. It feels very light-weight and "actionfigure-y" to me; for something named the "Iron Lung," I would have expected a machine with a greater sense of scale, bulk, and weight to it, but that's pure preference on my end. I'm sure other readers would disagree.

All in all, I think you have a great overall story that's unfortunately marred by what feels like a desire for quickness in the art and writing stages. It's okay to slow down; give yourself a little more trust and patience and take your time, especially when it comes to keeping your art clean. Greater readability would very much increase the power of the fight scenes and the overall narrative.

>>4712526
>>4712547
Also, haven't forgotten about this bit. Will get to it later today.

>>4713651
Thanks friend.
Very much looking forward to read your thoughts.

1/2
>>4712623
Read it last night, slept on it and I'm gonna add my two cents.

Let's see... I like how the one shot starts and ends with the MC and the nurse. The first three pages are slow, but don't bother me much. Two pages for the nurse and the MC arguing over cigarettes could have been shortened into one. Now I'm a bit older, so I got distracted by the fact that the MC is young, dying and there's no sign of a guardian. She gets approached to pilot a weapon/mecha and somehow gets forced into a car, no questioned asked. I can suspend my disbelief, but I still ask myself "How is this legal?".

She asks if she gets payed and never gets an answer. It's implied she'll get to "kick some ass", but if falls flat, since we don't really know the MC. Maybe if Trisha was an old friend, her comment would make more sense?
Than there's a bunch of pages with her getting into the robot. It's good imagery, but not plot relevant. For a series, I think that particular pacing would be fine, but for a one shot it took a bit too long imo.
MC gets told to fight crime, kicks rando bank-robbers up, only gets mildly in trouble. Again "How is this legal?", "Where are the police mechas if rando robbers have their own mech?". I agree with >>4713636 about the butterfly.

2/2
>>4714187 >>4712623
Now, in general I like your dialogue. But, you have a lot of fluff and characters that seem to be mind readers. Trisha in particular.
She's the eccentric scientist/engineer, but is a bit over the top. She spends a lot of time forcing the plot forward and makes the reserved MC seem blander than she probably is. I wish you touched upon why she's so excited about her job? Right now she's just a character who likes to create for the sake of it, but she's also irresponsible with her creations and the people she wants to employ. Trisha also magically knows what is troubling MC and how to solve it. The "What would a hero do?" line is cheese and it would only work if the MC has some sort of emotional attachment to that phrase.
The nurse just seems to just kind of be there, she never worries that the MC could potentially get hurt fighting the bank robbers.

I wont touch too much on the art since >>4713649 did a better job.

>>4712623
I'm a newbie, but I just want to say that I loved it. I feel like the other critiques you got were kinda nitpicky. Overall you can tell a pretty entertaining story. It was really fun and I flew through the pages quickly. Good job.

>merge vector layers
>some parts that intersected get erased
How come this happens and is there a way to fix it? Talking about csp btw which i figured many of you use

New thread

>>4714673
>>4714673
>>4714673
>>4714673