/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>no tip
At least one good thing out of this, huh.

>>4490380
Tell me OP, what news from down under?

How do they get away with paying highly skilled and talented artists less than random schmuck working in Mcdonalds?

>>4490417
Maybe they really love their job as opposed ot the mcdonalds guy

>>4490417
You can't outsource production of fast food to another country but you can outsource production of animation to people with smaller wages. I guess Japanese distrust of socialism and lack of labour unionization also plays a role.

>>4490404
>meanwhile he's still trying to make it into the industry with low beg western animu doodles
idk you tell me anon

>>4490417
Well given the twitter comments this dude receives, it's a pretty well established mentality in Japan that these artsy kinds of people are seen as bottom leeches who should be happy with minimal wages.
It's very underappreciated and ignorant, especially since the morning/evening anime shows and manga volumes that 80% of the populace at least casually enjoys as a form of entertainment, are created by these people who are basically only fueled by their passion whilst being ridiculed and extorted.

Then again around 18% of japanese women work in the red light industry, over 60% of people are bullied on workplace, family life is barely a thing, etc. so their sense for what is morally right is already silly.

Japan is a shithole, everybody knows this full well, that's why we bully westerners trying to take their jobs.

>>4490380
Damn, that's pretty cheap. I think it might be worth hiring one for drawing my hobby VN instead of getting good at art.

>>4490570
kek

>Say 3 or 4 lines in shitty ear-piercing loli voice
>Instant celebrity and live a good life

>Draw and animate for hours on end
>get paid pocket change and bullied every day.

that is fucking bullshit.

>>4490607
It’s because of brand name, anon. People(mostly normies) tend to watch things with their favorite voice actor or actor, they don’t see the animation or story/play important. Why do you think movie actors, actors in geneal reach celebrity tier, while the production team fall behind?

>>4490615
Still is bullshit.

>>4490380
Who butchered her nose?
Cant Japanese into cosmetic surgery?

>>4490380
why dont they go freelance and animate fanart of their old employer's characters getting fucked hard?
those guy reproduce easily the style of trigger/love live whatever, easy coombux if it's money you're looking for

>>4490380
I was busy making $200 a day.

>>4490683
>I was busy making $200 a day.

good job i didnt know sucking dick pays so well

>>4490539
>that's why we bully westerners trying to take their jobs.
The fuck you on about?

>>4490380
https://youtu.be/3wgn7f0iOsk

>mfw animators can easily be paid proper ammount but higher ups just gobble all the money because capitalism

>>4490674
chinks are bots, they dont know how to enjoy the game, they just spec their stats and sit down to rot

>>4490380
Wow I could actually hire a cute japanese animator to work and animate for me full time. Maybe I could even get her to move in with me. I would make her animate all kinds of dirty stuff for me. I could make her live in a cage under my bed and she would be so passive she'd actually put up with it. Haha imagine the possibilities.

>>4490732
>B-B-B-BUT CAPITALISM IS EVUL!
Here we go again.

>>4490914
>CAPITALISM EVUL
not really, people that use this sytem are.
its like the pedostache dilemma, Everyone with a mustache isnt a pedo but every pedo has a mustache

>>4490884
until you get metoo'd and shekelberg gives her all of your shit

>>4490884
Take your meds, you sound like some fa/g/ that turned some innocent anon into a tranny

Seems that this channel will talk about this topic every month now then

Anyway they always show wages for entry level or training positions, these will always pay less in any field, specially with art related things and specially with animation in Japan where I assume the supply of animators is higher than anywhere else. I'd like to see how's his salary now.

>>4490380
No fucking way.... I earned more as concert security in 3 days, and you can't really get more unskilled than that... How fucked up is that

>>4490969
Because anime production tend to spend most of the money on voice actors and executives.

>>4490732
Higher ups gobble all the money because they are the ones taking all the risk.
There is literally nothing stopping people with talent from starting their own shit and get paid proper. Oh wait there is one thing stopping them, they don't want to take the risk. They would rather be paid 270 dollars a month.
No risk, no reward.

>>4490914
Its not the system, its the people. Also fuck off you /pol/nigger, your the one starting.

>>4490607
What did you expect from a post-Tsutomu Miyazaki Japan?
After the otaku murders anime became non-mainstream, basically killing the consumer base and forcing the industry to rely on the obsessive lolicon creeps who still bought anime goods in order to survive.
That's the reason why there's so much moeblob going on right now in the industry.

>>4491181
>Not hating capitalism is /pol/ now
Jesus.

>>4491192
interesting take

>>4490724
>he doesn't know Ken-sama

>>4490380
>bro I love capitali-

>>4490536
>around 18% of japanese women work in the red light industry, over 60% of people are bullied on workplace, family life is barely a thing
It's depressing how much Japanese society kinda sucks in comparison to the image they project worldwide.
It's not new to me but every time I'm reminded I feel a bit sadder.
Not that America's any better,but our society at least doesn't feel the need to put up fronts all the time.

>>4490615
>while the production team fall behind?
I started feeling like I was living in a different world back when I was a kid and realized "oh wait there's actual people who design all the cool settings, mechanical stuff, and costumes in the cartoons, games and movies I watch/play?" I was so blown away, that no body recognized them on a wider scale.

>>4490536
>it's a pretty well established mentality in Japan that these artsy kinds of people are seen as bottom leeches who should be happy with minimal wages.

And the other threads about mangaka had me thinking Japan is the only place left where comics is a respected medium.

Artists really don't have a single place in the world where they can go work and be respected, huh?

>>4491105
>Le risk arguement
>Just start your own shit stupid

>>>>>The only way to start your own shit is with capital, something animators don't have because these generous "risktakers" make sure they take their cut of the pie and keep their animators dependent on them by paying them barely living wages
Excellent argument bro way to recognize the feedback loop bro way to recognize that animators are paid fairly and the ones that aren't are just cause they're lazy and unskilled bro

>>4491105
Based retard

>>4491396
I’m just going to abuse the disability welfare system here in the states, not like I actually do anything but draw and I went to a school which was host to severely disabled and sometimes actually retarded students

>>4491396
>Japan is the only place left where comics is a respected medium.
>Artists really don't have a single place in the world where they can go work and be respected, huh?
While anon's post was depressing look at the other side.
The presence of large masses of otaku and events like Comiket and anime expo at least suggest that like in America there is a huge amount of support even if in the wider scope of society interest in such media is still a fringe thing.
Not to mention places like Akihabara which serves as a mecca or haven for all this culture.

>>4490755
>having passion for a project and the craft itself makes you a bug
Neck yourself slav

>>4491396
the trick is to not give a shit

>>4491192
Miyazaki is a bitter old fuck though

>>4490380
Why don't animators just sell art on the side? You can get $50 for a drawing if you sell on deviantart, their frames being paid $1.7USD for has lining and coloring and shading.

Where is the data?
They pretend that young animators would get 270$ for 3 years, while working full-time with free overtime.
All with expenses not below 600$, and so 90% of animators would quit before the 3 years.

This is obviously impossible. The guy went to an animation school.
How would schools like that would even exist, knowing that it would condemn the parents to assist their child for 5 years minimum, with only 10% chance to become a professional?
If it was the case only rich kids and a handful of passionate and/or schizo people.

>>4490380
Why don't these animators just say no to shitty wages? No pay = no work. It's basic capitalism. I think Japanese people are just too cucked what happened to the samurai spirit? Stand up for yourselves you pussies.

>>4493429
Wont it just get outsourced to some shithole then? I doubt the people there will turn down that pay

>>4493574
So what if it does? Shitholes produce shithole work. The quality will take a plunge. Fans will revolt. Hardcore fans will raise up a stink about the animators not getting paid. This is capitalism. Animators aren't "powerless", they set the terms if they just find their balls.

>>4490615
I've never watched an anime because of a voice actor, nor have I ever heard of any westerner doing this. Japanese anime fans apparently are the equivalent of people who follow the kardashians in the west.

>>4493580
>you could just become a homeless bum if you don't wanna work for this wage, you have all the power wagey :^)
libertarians are retards living in an abstract world of forms #53425

>>4493796
the trick here anon, is to have a backup plan to get the extra money outside of your art. concert security, computer programming and the like can be things you do on the side instead of putting all your eggs in one basket.
if you get into trouble and butt heads with executives that are fucking over your whole team, you can leave and walk out with the talent by your side and use your funds to do your own thing.

its the samurai spirit; defending your honour at all costs, no matter the consequences. do you really think there aren't people out there willing to fund you because they admire your integrity?

>>4493796
Homeless bum is probably the only option for low skill worker who doesn't want to work for 10 bucks an hour at Walmart. We aren't talking about that though. This is animators accepting 270 dollars a month to work full time with unpaid overtime. They could just quit and go work at Walmart. Animators created this situation by always undercutting their animator competition.
>they will just outsource to shithole countries
Ok so let them. Then it is up to the consumer to accept whatever the product quality is that comes out of these shithole countries and if turns out to be garbage and the consumer accepts it still, then that is what the consumer deserves. Anyone with taste will go elsewhere for their entertainment.

>>4493796
Business people are all homeless bums as soon as they walk out of the negotiation? Does Trump look like a homeless bum to you? What are you smoking kid.

>>4490732
>noooo muh capitalism
>Wait bro i have a great idea, maybe someone should create a steam but for anime
>(soijack face.gif) BUT WE ALREADY HAVE NETFLIX AND CRUNCHYROLL THEY WILL HElP THEIR INDUSTRY.
>Oh ok...

>>4493991
The situation you presented doesn't end up helping skilled animators though in either outcome.
>Consoomers accepts drop in quality from outsourcing work, shitholes continue to be exploited for their cheap labor. The original animators who tried to demand higher pay are now left with no domestic demand of their skill and must look for work outside of their skillset.
>Consoomer doesn't accept drop in quality, stops paying for anime. Investors, instead of accept pay raise for their skilled animators, will instead take their money to other industries and invest there where the pay demand is lower for maximum profits. Animators once again is left with no market for their skill.
I mean I'd HOPE an organized strike between animators and customers could turn out positive for the workers, but the way the system is structured I see the animators losing 7 times out of 10, so accepting the shit pay ends up being the defacto safe choice for people working out passion in the industry. Atleast that's what I see as the explanation for the shit situation.

>>4490380
Why can't these retards just start a patreon or pixiv fanbox, animated porn in a literal goldmine

>>4490536
Almost 20% of Japanese women are involved in red light work? That is shocking.

Why don't they just form an union?

Where can I hire one of these artists?

How many of these guys does it take to animate an entire episode

>>4493791
>nor have I ever heard of any westerner doing this
Sawashirofags instantly come to mind.

i'm going to severely doubt the legitimacy of these numbers
$270 a month in a country with first world costs would cause droves of homeless animators and as far as I know such a thing hasn't happened yet

>>4491192
also this was a truly seething take, but anime tiddies are an uncontested goldmine and anime is more mainstream worldwide than ever.

>>4499127
pixiv

>>4490417
>schmuck
you are jew*sh aret you?

>>4490536
>18% of japanese women work in the red light industry
googled this with no results. source for this information?

>>4490615
>People(mostly normies) tend to watch things with their favorite voice actor or actor
not normies, more like mouth breathing neanderthals. Everyone who's obsessed with certain voice actors are weird fringe retards with no concept of human decency. Funnily, in all country and of all demographic.