/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>>4194279
Making the parts that are not muh animu realistic enough to make it easy to ignore the rest

How is this infantile shit supposed to be sexy?

>>4194279
peeing into mouths

peening into anus

>>4194292
what kind of faces should they have then?

>>4194301
If you can’t explain why then you’re probably NGMI. I don’t draw anime but even I know formulas for appeal.

Are you an alien? Do you not know what sexy is?
Here's what people in general seem to be more into:

>making a woman sexy
Wide hips, narrow shoulders, bigger eyes/face, more delicate/less angular traits, emphasis on lips/eyes.
bonus: focus on tits, ass, put a focus on how tall and elegant or how cute she is, appeal to whatever tame fetish you like (skindentation, feet, under/sideboob, armpits, etc.).
You might think that drawing a woman naked is the best way to make it hot, but often some clothing or light censoring can appeal to the imagination, as is the case with your pic

>making a man sexy
there are plenty of ways to do that, they can generally be declined into 3 things- there, in order from most to least popular
>cute/girly boy ("trap" aesthetic, draw a girl without the wide hips and tits, dress it like a dude and call it a boy)
>bishie aesthetic (more manly and toned than the cute boy, can have a V shaped bodytype, long hair, a more masculine feel)
>bara aesthetic (manly muscular bodytype, can be hairy/bearded)

The way you render skin is very important too. Face can be anime style, don't pay attention to the retards pretending otherwise, the biggest patreon whore is going for a semi-animu style and people are eating that shit up. So go for it if you like it. Don't if you don't. There's an audience for both.

>>4194317
How about normal faces without inhumanely large eyes, non-existent noses, weirdly shaped jaws and the proportions of a newborn.

>>4194328
>waaaahh i don't like this stylization so its objectively shit and everyone who does like it is a pedo

crab as fuck m8

>>4194328
photobash a better face on

>>4194330
I'm not saying any of that. You asked how to make this stuff more appealing to normal people who haven't spent half their lives watching animu and are so used to the absurd stylizations that they don't even notice any longer how far it is from reality. And I'm saying: Minimize the animu shit, because most normal people find it off-putting and weird, if indeed your objective is to make it more fit for mainstream. Especially the combination of realism for the body and heavy stylization for the faces is a tightrope walk, bordering on some uncanny valley quality.

>>4194279
band-aids

>>4194328
>we are AMURRCANS AND AMUURCAINS DONT LIKE NO GOOK ASS ANI-MAY

>>4194356
>How do I make these drawings sexier to the average American
>NO DON'T TELL ME

>>4194356
He's not arguing against cuteness or the anime style, but childlike plastic doll faces being photographed to realistic and heavily sexualized bodies. Imagine the Warner Siblings but with the kind of shit people fap/schlick to on the net. Its uncanny as fuck.

Klasky-Csupo, and the shit like Big Mouth that is inspired by it, is an industry joke to the American animation industry. Nickelodeon executives themselves thought the style was so damned ugly, they just stopped hiring the studio despite their good relations.

>>4194356
fuck u as told by ginger was great

>>4194279
Same as porn
imagination and good directing

>>4194279
Soft and squishy-looking flesh. That's why sakimichan sells

>>4194356
Japan: Let’s make the most uninspiring cliche plot, filled to the brim with preset character archetypes, and tropes with same face/skin/height characters sprinkled with fan service shots to shill out weab merch.

US: let’s make distinguishable designs with believable characters in more inspiring settings and story.

>>4194368
you only like it for that one episode.

>>4194279
Are you a woman?

>>4194292
the face is 90% the appeal
give them 3DPD faces and you just lost 95% of those RTs
Now, this isn't even realistic at all, study more retard

>>4194634
>believable characters in more inspiring settings and story
lmao

>>4194634
Never in a million years did I think I'd see someone unironically defend As Told by Ginger

>>4194340
>don’t draw them like a newborn
>lol no im not calling you a pedo
How stupid do you think we are? Everyone here knows exactly what you’re implying. If you think we’re pedophiles, just come out and say it, you’ll feel a lot better.

>>4194634
I bet you think Tall Girl is a good movie

>>4194773
ok you are a pedo. now kys faggot

>>4194818
Stop sperging over an art style you fucking autist I can't wait for someone to gun your retarded ass down.

>>4194367
we gotta need a citation for that

>>4194854
>>4194367
nvm found it on wikipedia

>>4194845
Wishing death upon someone for having an opinion sounds a lot more autistic desu

>>4194292
>wahh anime bad

fuck off contrarian fag

do you know where you are?

>>4194328
Nah man, post an example pic. cuz If you go too real it gets uncanny especially for porn.

>>4194292
You're not alone anon.
Those bodies look fine, but the animu emoji faces are so retarded looking. Pic related would have been made better looking faces imo.

soft bubs
cute faec

>>4194634
>believable characters in more inspiring settings and story
>believable characters in more inspiring
settings and story
>believable characters in more inspiring settings and story

>>4195098
fuckin golem ass chin

I don't have a problem with OP's pic but people who aren't used to anime might like something like this.

>>4195354
thats just superior.

>>4195354
Holy shit thank you. Much better than animu.

>>4195354
People who aren't used to anime on a website that ends with 'chan'...

make everything look shiny

>>4195369
this. every fucking time.

>>4195369
I know. but part of OP's question was asking about appealing to normies.

>>4195354
That looks like an ugly 3dpd

>>4195379
Fair enough.

>>4195380
>idealized/simplified faces and bodies
>"ew too realistic"
This is your brain on anime.

>>4195354
>>4195355
>>4195358
>beom__kim_356.jpg

implying korean faggots are better in any way lmao and dont just try to suck japanese dick at all times

>>4195097
Agreed. It's not even that stylization is inherently bad, it's more like anime faces feel like layers upon layers of stylization, like the stylized version of a parody of a stylization of a face. I understand how it grew over time and that there's some interaction going on between the virtuosity of the artists and people getting used to it forming more and more extreme clichés. It is however definitely hard to "get" when you didn't grow up with it. My parents for example never commented on any western animation, but whenever anime came up they would express their confusion with the large eyes and weird faces. There's definitely something about it that asks for some cultural conditioning to suspend your disbelief.

>>4195463
I grew up with both and feel like I can appreciate pretty much all forms of art. But I find western style boring and anime aesthetic actually feels like it takes balls to pull off because of how stylized it is. Like anyone and their fucking dog can draw lips and a nose but to reduce them into lines and shadows that are still appealing seems more elegant to me

>>4194328
Ugly

>>4195463
I think it's mostly just cultural influences and personal taste that fuel most of these arguments about anime.

>>4195354
Yup this'll appeal to normies, though bikini armor is a cringe.

>>4194634
Oh anon I feel sorry for you...

>>4194279
>>4195354
so for this I should understand, that

the less stylized, the bigger normie magnet it is

>>4195711
Anime isn't the only form of stylization. The below pic is also stylized too (just a bit different from anime flavor stylization).

And normies love anime, just look at Pokémon, DBZ, Naruto, etc. They also love stylization too, if you look at most popular western cartoon shows (which ironically are starting to favor anime-ish styles nowadays).

>>4195736
did you actually read what I wrote or just gave it a passing look? I said
>less stylized
its still stylized, but the second has its smaller eyes, more realistic nose, mouths, ears, head shape

>>4195098
Are you gonna suck his cock in every thread?

>>4195783
Regardless, weebs and normies are still closer than many may think. Anime isn't really a niche market anymore.

>>4195797
cunny

>>4194367
>Nickelodeon executives
because we can totally trust some bigwigs to know about animation. thats not how we got here at all.

>>4194317
>I have never seen sexy drawings of women
The fuck has happened to our culture if this is even a question that needs to be asked

>>4195736
>>4195783
That one is pretty asian looking too, but probably good enough for non animus freaks.

>>4195885
Not liking animu means you're a freak now?
Well excuse me for not liking alien creatures getting molested by tentacle monsters/ugly bastards/their siblings.

>>4195897
Non-freaks, as in, people who are not anime loving freaks

Sorry for coming back, I feel the autismo of this place overwhelming me again.

QUACK

>>4195900
Sorry for the misunderstanding, and nice dubs.

>>4194279
Honestly thought there was gonna be a discussion on proportions and shit ITT.

Too bad we ended up with retards who can't figure out that anime and cartoons are just abstractions of real-life

Realism obviously looks western but what may be less obvious is how to stylize without relying on anime tropes.

Here's an example of less stylized western art vs more stylized western art

Note that it's possible to do "cute" without omitting noses, cheeks or lips. Big eyes don't automatically mean anime either so don't be afraid to use them.

>>4195897
both aliens and anime are an human inventions. You know whats not a human invention and has the same proportions? babies and toddlers

not liking anime means you cant appreciate cute things, therefore you would make a bad parent, which would rather half ass his duties as one and see them as chores rather than enjoy spending time with his kids and educating them

>>4194301
I find it all gross and pedo, too.
Lot of nonces in this thread.

>>4195920
Left far superior to the right, in buckets.

>>4195920
neither of those faces look cute though

>>4195927
That's subjective taste. Like the anon above you said, I find the left face to be appealing and cute.

Euro comics can be a gold mine for stylization ideas, though you'll find much of the stuff that works in manga is used by western comics too, big eyes, big heads, simple faces, etc.

A lot of the manga in 80's and 70's actually looked very similar to this.

>>4195930
her eyes are wonky, giant chin, big unattractive nose, hair has no highlights and looks bad and uninteresting. Just a few things that make it objectively unappealing

this is what I mean like, people that draw anime/hyper-stylized stuff understand faces and design appeal on a much deeper level than people that just draw people like they are in real life, but 2d.

>>4195920
omg is she alright?

>>4196047
n.dofline has a yummy way of drawing girls, but the subject matter isn't everyone's cup of tea. That was just one of the least "guro" pics of his I could find

>>4196045
her eyes are wonky, giant chin, big unattractive nose, hair has no highlights and looks bad and uninteresting. Just a few things that make it objectively unappealing
You do know that real people have bones in their faces, right?

>>4196052
This way of drawing is just like the old seaside 'saucy' postcards. Pretty trashy.

>>4195923
that gif's adorable

>>4196068
That's actually kinda cute

>>4196066
How’s that an argument? Because you have bones it means your face needs to be fucked up and ugly?

>>4195354
Dead eyes

>>4195097
>anime face bad
>these other anime faces would look better
ok

>>4195354
>muddy
>dead face
This will appeal to autistic /ic/ contrarians

>>4196075
Well your observations about a 'massive chin' etc were nonsense, so I wondered if maybe you were unaware real beans had musculature. If you want to draw attention to something being outsized, maybe the massive bobblehead of the one on the right? With shoulders like elbows perhaps?

>>4194356
>>4194634
its 4chan its not worth arguing this

>>4195326
it is absolutely hilarious you decided to use AoT as your reaction for this

>>4196086
I was the one who said that I didn’t like either one. But if I had to pick then I’d pick right just because it’s more expressive.

Even if we put aside the fact that facial appeal is subjective, the perspective on the face is clearly fucked. Maybe it’s appealing for you but objectively it is not a good drawing

>>4196045
>It doesn't look like my animu girls, therefore it's objectively ugly!

>>4196079
Name me some anime that looks like that. I'll wait.

>>4195354
based

>>4194325
>"Do you not know what sexy is?"
>proceeds to post pseudo-furry bs pic

dropped

>>4194634
how come burger shows are literally the peak of uninspiring soulless shit

>>4195354
standard korean style, it's not bad

>>4194634
>>4194674
>>4194811
>>4195326
As told by ginger is ART that gives you FEELS unlike 99% of anime you braindead waifufaging imbeciles. If you don't understand the artistry and failed in recognising show's based intent you got pleb filtered.
> I'M A FUCKING SEAL GIRL
> LIVING IN THE REAL WORLD
> WHERE IT'S SO HARD TO GET BYYYYYYYY
> COS SEALS CAN'T EVEN CRY
get fucked.

>>4196258
coom is a legit feel

>>4196258
99% of weebs are coomers, what did you expect?
If they can't fap to it and think it looks "ugly", they're not interested.

>>4196274
>>4196258

All that disgusting shit is a part of the lefttie campaign against meritocracy and the good successful people.

Beauty is hard. Looking good requires both a natural gift and a constant effort.
So the fat and ugly femcel dykes are jealous and bash the successful women and beauty as patriarchy and exploitation shit.
They are just mad they can't have a piece of that pie because they are shit people.

Same with shit art. Accomplishing beautiful work is ficking hard and purple haired degenerates can't do that due to bad genes.
So they bash beauty and try and force that art is an abstract explession, everything is of equal value blah blah.
Its basically the same commie shit about equality of outcome.

And ofcourse that disgusting shit art is targeted at children before they learn to appreciate effort and accomplishments.

And ofcourse beauty is virtue.
A person of beauty has to at least have good genes and discipline to maintaint themselves.

The opposite is true as well. Obesity correlates with stupidity. Every single downie is obese, most obese people are stupid.
A person of normal human level intelligence just wouldn't let himself fall so low.

>>4196303
You can have Westetn examples of beauty, it's not exclusively anime.
Just look at the female artworks made by the old masters, animu shit doesn't hold a candle to it.

So long as the woman is at a healthy weight (not overweight or underweight), doesn't have any deformities, and is fertile/youthful, then how she is stylized/depicted in art starts getting subjective in terms of "beauty".

Do you really think the left side of >>4195920 is "ugly"? Or >>4195354 ?
Maybe they're plain looking, but not ugly.
Your pic related is closer to ugly.

>>4196319
I was talking about the modern western cartoons, this >>4194356 , and the unholy cancer of calarts and tumblr.


The west used to draw sexy animation.
Loooong looong time ago before the left leaning publications shut it down.

As for Stilization itself, there's more than one approach to it.
Anime isn't a genre with laws.
Anime is the entire eastern school of stylization that picked up where the western was murdered.

Some of the anime artists are legit masters of painting who prefer this streamlined and idealized depiction of beauty.
Some western guys do well too.

>>4195923
My child was born recently, I was like wtf my son is so fecking chibi.

>>4195923
>>4196396
Fake. Weebs don't reproduce and find anything 3D to be ugly.

>>4196400
It's possible if you're not a ngmi and can make enough money

For losers ITT who still don't get it, the exaggeration of expressive features in anime/manga (inspired) styles whilst retaining otherwise grounded proportions simulates the level of attention the viewer would pay to these features in real life, particularly facial expressions.
The development of the style was generally to make it easier to draw and hence animate whilst allowing for recognisable expressions and gestures without falling too far into abstract cartoonish styles.

>>4195881
>no nose
Manara is part of the club too, nosefags BTFO

>>4194279
Check out "Chambeadoras"

>>4194279
Oscar bazaldua. He drew porn comics that appealled to normies.

>>4194279
Reference some pinup girl magazine/posters/advertisements over the past 100 years.
You can see "normies" getting tattoos of pinups all the time and it's great but your question in particular is pretty broad in general cause everyone has their own types.

>>4197144
>CANGREJITOS PLAYEROS Y RINCONEROS

based

>>4196303
Yes this is me hello

>>4196167

>>4196167

>>4197482
>>4197562
Those are the exception to the rule. They obviously copy Western artists like Nell Brinkley and don't represent the typical anime stylization of giant eyes with nonexistent noses. If anything it's Japs imitating Western stylization in those examples.

just look at playboy art

sokol was the king

>>4197567

>>4197563
I don't think it's necessarily fair to see anime characters with realistic designs and say "they're just taking influence from western artists". We don't own realism. Western animation doesn't even look like this either. It's usually caricature.

>>4197567
diff artist

>>4197567
>>4197569
>>4197572

These are caricatures which Japanese animation rarely ever does. Funny noses, wide hips, puffy lips, tiny eyes, Odd limb proportions, It's expressive ALL over.

Anime/Manga art typically get rid of anatomical expression for repeated symbols. Which is why it looks very similar.

>>4197570
My main point was aimed at the anon calling this specific style >>4195097 anime. Which it really isn't.

It's inspired by the 20's illistration era of Western art. Cowboy Bebop doesn't use this distinct style, but Ergoproxy does.

Also, that anon's examples still have obvious 'tells' that it's anime in some of the character designs. They only superficially look like the above artist's art style at first glance, so he's wrong to call it 'anime' just because it shares some similarities to a couple of niche 20's-inspired animes.

Its just a drawing to me. Not sexy or anything.

>>4197573
Anon, the best-selling manga series in history is One Piece

>>4197581
I think there are people in this thread using the term anime as a catch all for any art that looks asian and not just animation specifically.

If you look at the differences between western and eastern art they sure do look a lot like the differences between the actual physical ethnotypes - westerners, as a rule, tend to have bigger noses, while asians have flatter faces, especially around the eyes/nose area. Often their actual noses are just little nubs where it would be the tip of a westerner's giant iceberg. Western women have shapelier bodies. Even cultural things, like asians using primarily their eyes to emote while westerners use their mouths to express emotion more. Which leads to asian cartoonists emphasizing the eyes and trying to make them as large and expressive as possible, while westerners like to draw detailed mouths with defined lips even when drawing in otherwise simplified style. Westerners, in certain cultures especially (like Italians) also use their entire bodies to emote which probably just looks ridiculous to asians who tend to avoid unnecessary movement. Hence why the bodies in western cartoons tend to be drawn more fluidly and kinetically, with exaggerated poses. If you haven't noticed, Disney characters never fucking stop moving.

When a cartoonist who spends all their time around a certain ethnotype and culture all that is going to seep into it when they draw people. I think it's instinctual, which is why it's so hard to unlearn when you try to draw in an "anime style" and aren't actually asian. And it seems to go the other way too, you can sort of tell the art was drawn by an asian even if they're trying to emulate a western style.

Like, I legit went "THAT'S supposed to look like Nell Brinkley?" I had to squint and yeah maybe I can sort of see the intention but it still looks 100% asian to me. I dig the style though, much better than what I normally see in the japanimations.

>>4197144
>>4197567
>>4197569
OP probably wants to know how to appeal to a wide audience and not just "normies".

>>4197563
>If anything it's Japs imitating Western stylization in those examples.
Japan has been copying western stuff since the inception of anime, I don't get what is your point. The fact that a style of anime character is popular doesn't invalidate the fact that there are plenty of other styles that try different things. It's the same as saying that western stuff is just cape shit.

>>4197573
>These are caricatures which Japanese animation rarely ever does
anime IS caricature, how in the heck can you even say that shit. Where do you think the big eyes thing comes from?

>>4197667
It's not "caricature" in the same way that Western stuff is. I probably shouldn't have used that word, but what I mean is anime bodies don't have much variance. The proportions are still reasonable and subtle. If you were to draw me as an anime character you could trace me with a fine tipped pen and call it a day.

>>4197608
One Piece is anything but typical though. The pure mental insanity of the character designs are in a league of their own.

>>4197652
If you want widest possible appeal but don't want to do boring realism, drawing inspiration from pixar / nu-disney is probably the safest bet. That's what's "in" right now, globally speaking. Even the vidyas do it (fortnite, overwatch). Appeals to both western and eastern markets, to young and old.

Anime while more popular than it was 20 years ago is still something of a "sub-culture" thing in the west and the audience skews toward young people who grew up with it.

the more realistic your faces the more easily and effectively you can express nuanced emotions

yes/no/maybe?

its at least got to be more effective than EEEEEEEH!?!? baka hentai moe blobs

>>4196219
its only a funny picture of a rabbit and a sloth, lay off the coom bro

>>4199066
go back to l3ddit roastie

>>4199142
and stay porn-addled, cum-for-brains

>>4199142
Memes were never a high-intellect thing but they really are regressing

>>4196303
> good genes
This is in support of meritocracy?

>>4196303
>Every single downie is obese
There was a kid with downs in my elementary school and he wasn't fat

>>4195599
Are you one of those muh practicality fags?

>>4195097
Fuck off and let anime be anime. The more emoji it is the better self-defense it keeps away from the mainline mainstream.

>>4196219
imagine being this retarded

>>4199204
I like drawing beanpole eyes.

>>4194328
ok boomer

>>4199204
Then why is Simpsons, Futurama, and Family Guy porn so popular? Normies already love emoji-faced characters. Checkmate weeb

>>4199262
Is it actually that popular?

>>4199279
It gets thousands if not millions of views on western rule 34 sites along with PornHub, redtube, xhamster, etc.

Remember those flash pop up adds of Marge and Lois on PornHub? Those have a huge fanbase.

>>4194671
He said realistic enough and OP is talking about normies, not you. He's right. The bodies are sexy because they are realistic enough, and the body being attractive makes it ok to ignore the face, which is on the level of a simple smiley face and therefore unattractive.

>>4194356
I like beauty but this isn't a good thing. It just means anime aims to cash out on sex appeal.

>>4199060
The strength of cartoons is exaggeration, not subtlety.

If you go for realism and nuance of emotion you'll always lose to live actors.

>>4194279
Soul vs Soulless

>>4199471
I would argue that's more technically impressive when animated films/tv shows/etc. use mature subtle acting over the easy route of going all in. Imo cartoons like Ren and Stimpy are easier to produce than, say, a more nuanced product that can capture live action qualities.

For example, A Scanner Darkly was pretty based, and the new Undone animated series looks kino as fuck.
Not to say Ren and Stimpy style stuff is "bad," just different.

>>4199484
I guess it's a question of do you watch things for technical impressiveness alone or some other measure of quality.

Sure someone playing Beethoven's 5th by farting and burping alone is impressive but does it sound better than when played with proper instruments suited for the job?

>>4197570
hmmm, the scale seems to start from -10 cm instead of 0

>>4199484
A Scanner Darkly and Undone are done by rotoscoping, which is literally just tracing over frames of live footage.

I dare say animating by hand a la ren and stimpy is 10x harder.

>>4199706
>10x harder
Just 10 times than literally tracing? It's at least a thousand times harder or more.

>>4199712
I went for 10x cause I've actually tried rotoscoping myself. It's harder to get looking right than you think.

Not nearly as hard as animating without tracing, of course, but without ref you have more freedom to simplify things which evens it out a bit.

>>4196045
>objectively
Opinion discarded. That word is the calling card for pseud aspie faggots who think using it means you're automatically correct about any retarded claim you pull out of your fat ass.

>>4196045
Oh I read the rest of your post. You're just a pervert who can't relate to real people. Don't bother learning to be an artist, you just want to consume pornography.

>>4194279
Loli.

>>4199967
This

weebs are a cancer to society

>>4196396
kek

I wanna draw anime kids but I'm not a pedo nor do I want to be seen like one.

>>4199967
Normies do not like this

>>4200553
even the degenerates of society hate pedos, fuck off with your normie shit

>>4200556
???
why would you reply to me with this
I just said normies don't like loli

>>4196045
This is your brain on anime and coom.

>>4199952
>>4199965
>>4200570

you think this looks attractive

I'm sorry you have no taste

>>4200830
>n-no only my animu girls are attractive!!
Cope and seeth weeb

>>4199967
>>4200527
>non-nude but still lewd lolis
good taste

>>4200830
You know, both of the drawings in the image are a bit amateurish, even n.dofline, as much as he is worshipped in the guro circles isn't exactly a pro. It was more to illustrate a point about stylization using two drawings with the same subject than to present some high standard to aspire to.

Still, bringing up objectivity in a discussion about stylization is a bit funny as the only thing truly objective is reality itself and more you deviate from reality the more subjective things become by nature. Anime is especially a very acquired taste and requiring such taste to appreciate something is kind of the opposite of objectivity.

>>4194279
Not having toddler faces on women's bodies is a good start

>>4201274
cute face + sexy body is the best

>>4201200
This is what bugs me about weebfags. Anime IS an acquired taste and that's fine. Accepting that means we can discuss and dissect what makes a piece work and how to better develop art styles that better please particular audiences.

But weebfags huffing and puffing about their favored coomshit kills all discussion.

>>4199157
Courting the right person instead of the first loser who spread her legs for you is merit.

>>4199157
It's hard to have merit when you're stupid, sick and have a seizure every now and then.

>>4201746
you can have a cute face without it looking prepubescent

>>4195374
>>4195369
Yeah thats maybe because the OP asked for a style that appealed specifically to normies and people not into anime of any kind you fucking apes

>>4195354
source?