/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>>3966164
Lol just scribble your rough sketches.
You'll unironically like it more.

>>3966164
Pyw

>>3966166
This.
As pretentious as it sounds art is a living breathing thing, it grows organically.

>>3966164
Yup, you're correct, it's all 100% due to being born with natural talent, you weren't doing anything wrong, it's just you weren't lucky enough to be gifted with a talent in art, good on you for finally realizing this fact.

>>3966176
Having fun does good for your soul, and your art

>>3966164
>I've wasted every day drawing for 3 years now and I'm thinking it's time to finally give up. Natural talent is 100% real
okay, give up. why should we give a flying fuck about you?

you obviously don't know how to study or practice, even a monkey would improve drawing every day for 3 years

go do something easier like playing videogames and watching anime, you know you want to
keep telling yourself its not your fault

>>3966164
>spends the majority of the time relying on references and copying calling it "studying"
>wonders why he has no idea what he's doing when he draws something original
>wonders why it comes out as shit because he never draws from imagination.
The sooner you start drawing independently without reference or copy the sooner you will learn how to start drawing. The only time you may use a reference is to help you draw annoying shit like hands and feet in a foreshortened or difficult perspective. It's your own fault for falling for the grind boxes and you will automatically learn how to draw trap.

>>3966164
>I'm thinking it's time to finally give up
Just fucking do it and GTFO already.
Stop opening idiotic threads already, you spineless piece of human garbage.

>>3966164
The answer is right in front of you, dummy. If it's fucking awful you need to do more of that in particular.

>>3966164
>Natural talent is 100% real

Good, good... let the Spark flow through your Ligameme.

>>3966164
no it's not real it's not a natural talent at all it took me 7 years to figure it out I thought it'd take 2 but 3 is pretty much nothing so don't worry about it

Stop being so fucking dramatic and draw faggot

>>3967854
Artist?

>>3966164
Sucks to be you talentless peasant

>>3966164
It took me 7 years to consider myself OK

>>3967854
>pontificating on how people study wrong and how much work it is
>drawing is shit
every single time

>>3971383
pyw

>>3971384
I don't associate with this shithole

>>3971386
shitter detected
redline it or be forever btfo fag

Everyday I am thankful for posts like this because I'm the same, but at least now I feel less alone

>>3971468
>redline it
I wouldn't make a pretentious anime drawing to say this. I'd make a Twitter post that says
>To beginner artists who asked me how to improve: don't get stuck on instructional books and tutorials. You have to practice those concepts one you have learned them, so study perspective, anatomy, and so on by drawing the actual things. Cheers.

>>3971383
Redline it

>>3971508

Retard.

>>3971468
>>3971516
>>3971522
suck my dick

OP here for the first time. Was going to let this thread die but since it's active again...
I fucking lost it when I posed this, but since then I've figured out a few things. I look at other peoples art way too much, and because of that every time I try to draw I'm trying to be someone else based on what I've been looking at. Not comparing myself to anyone else, and experimenting on my own to decide how to do things has made such a big difference.

The people saying I'm not studying properly are half-right. I wasn't just drawing anime girls, but I was relying too heavily on reference and using digital art to quickly fix my mistakes instead of acknowledging what I did wrong and re-doing it. Moving to traditional and only looking at reference AFTER finishing the drawing to check for mistakes is far better for learning.

>>3967848
>>3971382
Interesting you both say 7 years. I've realised I was too interested in being "good" at art right now, instead of focusing on getting there. I guess it's going to take as long as it takes and that's okay.

And lastly, thanks to the people who bluntly told me to fuck off and give up. Made me realise that even if I'm being a little bitch, I couldn't actually give up even if I tried.

>>3971469
Hopefully some of this will be able to help you a little bit.

>>3966166
>>3966176
>>3966187
Seconding these statements.
>>3966203
Also this. Learn to draw simple 3D forms freehand, both geometric (boxes, cylinders, compound shapes) and organic. Once you get an intuitive grasp of 3D form, space, and perspective, you can learn to draw anything from any angle from your imagination by translating what you're studying into a 3D model of sorts in your head, instead of trying to recreate a flat image.

>>3966164
You don't improve by just doodling, you need to practice something right. If you practice licking a basketball your'e not gonna score any hoops after a decade. sit down, learn fundies ,use your head.

>>3971383
this is pretty decent, don't come here to bitch, if you want advice take it if not go to vent.

>ITT: anons who decided to be artists a year ago giving advice to Anon who realized the truth after 3 years trying.
Don't let them convince you to go on with your self deception. Now that you have faced the truth, leave all the pressure of trying to get better and enjoy making art for yourself.

Post your art. I'll tell you if it's trash. This is the most recent thing I've drawn not are from yesterday. The first is from reference, the second isn't.

>>3971783
Both are from yesterday *

>>3966164
You're probably not as good as you think you are, or know as much as you think you do. 3 years is not enough time all to git gud if you haven't been smart about how you study and practice. Post your work.

>>3966193
it's not about study or practice, it's about enjoying the process, which not to come 1st, not the other way around.
it doesn't matter how much time you practice or doing studies fundies or whatever.
if you don't enjoy it, it's a lost cuase.

>>3966164
I used to be just like you
I mean I still suck but I actually enjoy drawing now
I just learned to enjoy drawing 3d shapes and dumb shit like that
Also, don't be so hard on yourself no one is looking at you
It takes away the shame and embarrassment you might feel because for me it was all internal

>>3971940
Yeah, that last part is definitely something I need to work on. Every time I mess up I feel like there's people watching me through a camera and laughing at me.
...not sure if that's normal or not.

>>3971937
that's way if you started ding it as a kid, and still doing it you probably like it, doesn't matter what skill level your'e at. the love is there, just need to supplement it with fundies if needed.
but what happens when you are older is that you start in reverse as in fundies\ wanting to get better, because you are older, you want to catch up.
and after some time of studies, you get to the actual drawing and you find out that you don't even like it +_+

Honestly I had way more fun drawing when I was an idiot kid copying anime or just doodling whatever I was thinking about. Now that I know how shitty I was back then and how shitty I am now there's no point. I can never have fun again because I know I'll always be terrible. Talent truly is real and if you don't have it in some area you're worthless. If you haven't discovered your talent by the time you're 20 years old you need to give up and rot because it is never going to get better for you.

>>3966164
>Natural talent is 100% real and I hate the fags that convinced me otherwise.
Natural talent is totally, and I agree that people who claim otherwise are annoying fags, but still, I think almost anyone could develope a neat style. Maybe your style won't be phenominal, but I'm sure you could do something with it.

>>3971937
"just draw" is really the truth. if people would just try it, before getting into all this fundamentales fiasco, maybe they'l have better understanding if they want to move forward with it.

>>3971973
ya that's true i guess. i think my biggest problem is that i just don't like it enough to get to that level.
and i'm not talking about fundies and practice, that's the easy part. the hard part is to draw for yourself, to just draw.
and how can you do it to get to a nice level, if you are not liking it. it will just be a grind.

>>3966164
"just draw"

Talent is real if you say it isn't you're retarded. the whole entire "Anyone can draw" quote is true. Everyone can draw it's just that not everyone can draw well.

talent is obviously real if you werent born with a pen in your hand you're ngmi

>>3972191
Not OP, I'm someone you can say is "talented" with drawing. IE I was lucky enough to pick it up when I was a child and get past being a /beg/ as I grew up.

I could draw better than a lot of people on /ic/ when I was 14. But does that mean getting better is easier for me? While I do believe I can absorb knowledge and apply it to what I already know easier than some people, I don't know if that's just because I've been doing it so long or if its a natural inclination. I still have to spend hours upon hours to see noticeable improvements and I'm in my mid 20s and I'm still not a professional artist.

Being "talented" isn't really a super power. You still have to do the same amount of work, you probably just get a little bit more out of it.

>>3972208
I'm 16 and I can draw better than most people in /beg, not really sure that being better than people on this board matters.

>>3972222
based dunning Kruger faggot

>>3972222
It doesn't because that's one step above saying you're better than everyone who doesn't draw. I was just making the point that I'm someone who you could say is lucky to be "talented" but it doesn't make me automatically good and successful if I don't put in the amount of work doing the right things it takes to get there.

>>3972223
Ok crab lmfao, Most people on /beg aren't good stop coping. I'm shit but so is everyone else in /beg to an even larger degree.

>>3972223
Majority of people in /beg can't draw and are wasting their time. I'm pretty sure you're one of them.

>>3966164
Why is /ic/ so fulled of this pussys?

>>3972245
Of course they can't draw. They just haven't learned yet, silly.

>>3972259
Do you know that some people in /beg have been there for years?

>>3966164
does talent really matter ? i'll take loving what you do instead of being talented, ofcourse you can be both. that's just cruel :0

>>3972265
not him but if you don't do fundies your'e not actually drawing, your'e just scribling, The problem with some of beg is that they are too braindead to learn em.
He's right, they literally haven't figured out what drawing is yet.

>>3972268
personal experience tells me being untalented at what i love is a good way to make me hate it over time

>>3971983
>i think my biggest problem is that i just don't like it enough
>>3971983
>the hard part is to draw for yourself, to just draw
That's a problem for everyone though. The thing is, the better you get, the more critical you become, and your standards get higher and higher.
So even if you can draw really well, you still always have to struggle with yourself to actually keep drawing. This is somethign which will never really stop.

>>3972268
It matters, in the context of being a successful, professional artist, and a hobbyist. Neither is "bad", per se.
Me, I discovered guitar when I was 14, and was consumed with it, along with art (been drawing since I could hold a pencil, mom was an artist). I had the usual teenage dreams of rock stardom and being in a band, etc, etc. But no matter how hard I practiced, and learned, it just wasn't coming into focus, and some things, I just couldn't do. So when I got into college, and was living in LA, and saw that really good guitarists, and I mean really fucking good, like I'll never play half as well good, were dime a dozen...I gave it up. I still play. I love playing. It's a hobby now. I went full on into art, and have never regretted, but I have whatever it is - talent, spark, passion, whatever. But I "get" art. I kinda get guitar, but not enough to express myself in a meaningful way.
Now, this place? 90% of the people here either see art as a means to an end (porn), or they're in love with the IDEA of being an artist, or a concept artist, or manga artist, but they don't "get" the actual process or think like one. And never will, probably. They're better off pursuing art as a serious hobby, but their ego and "want!" and everything else (and here, mental issues) prevents them from letting go of serious pursuit.
If you've spent 3 years and not gotten anywhere, it's time to find something else to pursue in life, professionally. Even talented art students often never end up working as artists. But they find ways to channel their creative energy. If you post "I don't know what to draw"...hate to say it, but you're not an artist. You're just not. You're the 15 year old me who wanted to be a rock star, but it hadn't sunk in yet that it wasn't going to happen. Which is what your teen years are for, but at some point, you have to be honest with yourself, and "want!" isn't enough.

>>3972471
>If you've spent 3 years and not gotten anywhere, it's time to find something else to pursue in life, professionally.
What do you even mean by "not gotten anywhere"? I think many people could become decent artists, if they would just put the work into it. I know this from myself. I know that I have talent, but I just don't draw enough. I mostly never finish stuff and just draw too casually. This is something you can change anytime though

It definitely shouldn't take more than a year to stop being awful. To be pretty okay even.

>>3972502
>I know that I have talent, but I just don't draw enough
cope cope cope

>>3972471
>Art must "click" with you, otherwise you can't go anywhere with it.
>Just give up bro! Trust me, it's better for you!
Nice.

>>3972208
Same, desu. I've managed to get where I am by sheer attrition over the years, but then again it's not saying much. If I had stumbled across some of the learning resources I've found back then, I would be much better by now. It's a matter of having the right information and putting in the time to draw and learn, I believe.

On "talent", though, I think that Kim Jung Gi is probably the one example that I can think of where actual talent applies. This man didn't just love drawing, he lived and breathed it his whole life. When he wasn't drawing, he was thinking about it, studying and absorbing all the visual data he could get his eyes on.

>>3972471
exactly, how many people that that were children did draw when they were little, most i think. and how many stuck with it ? how many picked it up later in life ?
if you didn't stick with it as a child, what changed now ?

>>3966164
people who don't actually like doing it will get do the point that they are decent.
to get to the next level you have to put down the hours, and to do so you have to like it.
i mean how can someone draw day after day, hour after hour, if they don't like it ?
i don't want to do a half-assed job, either you are in or not.
but maybe that's untalented part of me speaking, who knows.

anyone else allergic to improvement?

>>3972853
with me the improving part is not the problem, but i am allergic to actually doing it :0

>>3972852
>you have to put down the hours, and to do so you have to like it
It's not just about liking it. I love art, even my own stuff, and I also enjoy drawing.
It's just hard for me to find motivation because I'm basically constantly depressed.

You don't just have to like drawing, you also have to be somewhat happy and satisfied with your life. Either this, or be some kind of robot who can just turn off and just draw.

>>3972268
>does talent really matter?
this board constantly posts that russian guy and sakimichan, what do you think?

>>3973111
if you can't naturally be happy, you have to work at it just like anything else.

some people are godlike artists by not really thinking about it, a big part of that is just being capable of investing a lot of time subconsciously.

if you're depressed there has to be an underlying reason for it, since this is /ic/ it's probably 24/7 dopamine overloaded brain due to vidya/porn/x over the years.

>>3973144
>you have to work at it
there is nothing you can work on, if you live in a world full of retards
i know, people like you just always blame the depressed person themselves, because you will never admit how sick this society is, in order to stay bluepilled and not becoming depressed yourself

>>3966164
>3 years
are you fucking kidding me? that's barely 2000 hours, if that.
talent is cheap and plentiful, and it doesn't make hard work like drawing any easier. you want to know an absolute that's 100% true? the 10000 hour rule. honestly reflect on how much time you actually draw. I'm willing to bet it averages to less than 2-3 hours a day including breaks and distractions, so that's around 800-1000 hours a year. there is no way you are even close to 5000 hours in 3 years unless you were really drawing 8 solid hours a day for that entire time. even a majority of pros take several years before they hit their stride, and even in their prime, they still have bad drawing days because they're human.
stop quitting things when it gets too difficult. you are in the thick of it, and it might even get worse before it gets any better. so are you really going to quit drawing because it's not coming easy to you in less than the amount of time it takes to get a bachelor's degree? i sure hope not.

>>3973183
alternatively, it's easier to just not do anything and be a vegetable

>>3973185
>I'm willing to bet it averages to less than 2-3 hours a day including breaks and distractions,

most people don't even realize how little they draw. you actually need to use a time-tracking app to see how much shit you get done.

when people say they work "2-3hours" it's probably more like 1-1.5h. then you also have to consider how efficient you actually are and how much you're just comfort zoning and actually trying to get better.

Don't listen to the rants In this thread they're stupid

>>3966164
You don't have my permission to quit.

A curse will be put upon you if you don't heed my warning.

Talent can only take you so far. I guess I had some level of technical talent since I got past /beg/ level with a month of casual studying as a teen but I've been stuck ever since because of my laziness. I stopped drawing for a long time because I didn't want to put in any effort and would only draw like once a year. Now I've started again and force myself to draw every day because everyone has to work hard, even if they have talent.

I honestly think whatever little talent I had ruined me more than if I didn't have any at all. For me, 2-3 hours is a good day since I never did anything like that before but >>3973185 and others say it's nothing. I don't want to make excuses for myself but I wish I had had to work hard from the beginning rather than coasting along until I hit a plateau.

I do think talent is required for having good ideas and "soul" though. I have technical talent but not this type, unfortunately. That's another thing that makes me want to give up, since anyone can develop technical skills with effort but you're either creative or not.