/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>>3480390
>am left-brained guy and can't
if you name your limits, you set them

>>3480390
more like small brained

>>3480401
I have already gone through that, I learn very fast with the approach where I get consistent results every time, trust me. I just don't know where to look for that, it seems that most art is centered around "feeling".

>>3480390
>I am left-brained guy

Stopped reading right there.

>>3480390
drawabox
scott robertson
bridgman's constructive anatomy

>>3480406
It doesn't have anything to do with left or right brain. What you want is for it to be like a math problem. It's not. Why do you think people can't agree on what makes something look good when drawing? Why some people love tumbler fem art and some despise it? Why some people argue style is more important than realism? You have to feel Your art.

If you really need things broken down fundamentally, then get a small wood mannequin and imagine each part of the body as exact geometric shapes, then pose the mannequin and go from there. otherwise your goin to be stuck with shit like pic related.

>>3480401
Nice platitude

>>3480426
how do I get a mannequin with hair like that

>I have the ‘tism

The book you want is How to Draw by Scott Robertson.

>>3480426
Alright but as I mentioned earlier, treating it like a math problem lets me learn faster.

you sound underage
there is no
>im x and need to do x

>>3480443
>everyone is the same
empirically untrue

also post your x

>>3480448
Everyone may not be the same, but there’s definitely no such thing as “left brained/right brained.” OP might as well have said, “I need tutorials for elves.”

>>3480453
>i need tutorials for consistent results
>just feel the form bro

Yeah totally the same you waste of human flesh.

>>3480453
>but there’s definitely no such thing as “left brained/right brained.”
It doesn't matter what you call it, different people learn differently and broadly speaking you can categorize those modes of learning. Semantics aside, that needs to be acknowledged.

>>3480453
not to be a pedant but while theres no science behind "left brained" its still an accurate descriptor of someone like saying you have a type A personality or some shit

>>3480390
anyway op you just don't have the spark so give up now

>>3480434
Draw X amount of times for Y results.
Done.

>>3480390
Supplement your art education by studying fields that treat drawing as a science because they serve a practical function, i.e. architecture, engineering, prototyping, medical illustration.

>>3480390
Well, Loomis, Glen Vilppu, Bridgman, and Burne Hogarth,for starters.

Drawing is logical, but it's not the kind of thing where you can follow some set steps every single time like a math problem, I'm sorry to say. It's visual/spatial logic and is dependent on your sense of sight, your inner sense of space, depth perception, and perspective- the visual parts of your brain. So yes, you really do need to 'feel the form' and 'draw what you see' like every person that's ever learned to draw had to do. It's not hard or impossible, you just have to train yourself to do it. Don't do that thing that those "I'm an introvert XD" fags do and set an arbitrary limit on yourself, because you're more than likely completely capable of doing what you think you can't. Do you have eyes? Have you spent your whole life looking out of them? Can you tell how far away or how close things are by sight? Can you walk up to something on a table and pick it up without groping at it like a half blind retard? If you answered yes to all those things, you're capable of visual logic and you don't have any excuse.
That being said, I do understand your confusion, because it wasn't until I watched some videos by Mark Chong that it really clicked for me. Not to say that Mark Chong is like an art messiah or something, but seeing him in action made all the stuff I had read about construction drawing, perspective, space and form finally click together into a cohesive picture that made sense in a way that it never had before.
He has a very logical, practical mindset, so he might help you. Who knows. You can watch this video and see if a visual aid can help you understand.

https://youtu.be/ektQPOQ9HeM

>>3480403
>most scientific and logical part of the brain is the dumb part

found the brainlet.

>>3480401
This
>>3480390
Op I think the Mark Carder Draw Mic paint method would work well for you..

All can be found on the website DrawMixPaint.com. there is also a great forum with users that are very helpful

>>3480433
This. Or Erik Olson if you have the money for a monthly membership.
If you learn perspective like a pro you should be able to tackle many amazing things.
The other one is a good anatomy course. It doesnt matter what mannikin/construction method you learn for figures, if you dont know anatomy it will show. Just accept whatever line quality and results you get and trust you will make rapid progress if you apply yourself. You can get more “feely” when you understand the left-brain side. Or it will just take care of itself.

>>3480689
Forgot link
https://www.nma.art/learningpaths/a-complete-guide-to-perspective-for-artists-with-erik-olson/

OP is a retarded underage faggot blaming his nature and others that will quit in a week at most

Dont bump, abandon and hide thread

>>3480430
Platitude or not, it's true

>>3480390
Which Japanese book?

>>3480390
Just shut up and draw.

>>3480988
>>3475394

All of them so I guess 3 books?

>>3480390
>I am left-brained guy
Must be hard having half a brain.

My condolences. Disregard the haters.

>>3481054
These are unironically useful, even for fine artists.

>>3481071
Useful af.
At a goance, it looks like fine artists will have to unlearn some of the weird shapes and proportions and add some more trad knowledge but as a system of construction and quick&dirty perspective its quite explicit and ingenious.
The people for whom Loobis is meme-tier should be able to progress with this. If not, ngmi x10.
Its even better if you have some kind of efficient way to OCR/translate the stuff that’s unclear (if any).

Pic related is random screenshot.

>>3480416
Unironically this. You might as well bring up your socionic type lmao.

>>3481071
>>3481106
am I missing something here? This is literally Loomis head construction drawn by mediocre artists.

>>3481130
No. Those books are garbage. Ignore them

>>3481130
>>3481141

I’m pretty old now.
I can actually draw well already.
I’ve read pretty much every book ever written in english (and some Chinese, Russian and German) on figure drawing, incl loomis and many antiquarian books on archive.org and I’m saying these books are useful. But you probably either have to be a beginner already good to see the value in them. If The guy who wrote them knows his stuff. Period.

Do/think what you want with that. Download them or don’t. To say idgaf is understatement.

>>3481149
>a beginner OR already good

I’m phone posting so forgive the typos.
Here is another screen shot from the first book.
In this section you will learn not only proportion but figures perspective in a fun and economical way. In Loomis he shows a a fully drawn loomis-figure in a similar box form. If you dont already know how to draw a good figure you pretty much have to file it away and hope you return to it later. Our Japanese friend gets right to it and you can learn and practice two things at once.
In Bammes (the greatest books/system of figure drawing instruction ever) he stresses the importance of and spends a surprising amount of time teaching proportion. He teaches it in ways that prevent you from getting hung up on the actual drawing so you can learn and internalize the proportions and basic masses. For example he gives exercises where you use a flat brush (or a watercolor brush, like 8-9 size, fully loaded and wet) and build your figures up from the inside out, quickly - aimed solely at understanding, not the picture. The reason for this is that a proportionately correct figure (understood on a deep level not just from memory and checking), executed in primitive shapes with the side of a piece of chalk actually reads more satisfactorily (unless you are a pleb maybe) than a tight, fully rendered but superficially understood drawing.
Anyway, with this in mind if you look at pick related, just using sticks and rectangles in 2D you can learn this, sketch out figures in sophisticated positions correctky, and build up from that when you’ve mastered it. But its WHEN he introductes this and the difference it will make after its second nature, when you try to add 3D to it that shows the author is an actual teacher and a good one.

Dont believe or agree? Cool. Up to you.

>>3481168
The loomis page,

>>3481168
new anon here. damn this is so much better than the loomis page... it may not be better in technical skill but it is heaps better in visually explaining a concept. that's japanese clarity and concision for you.

>>3481169
I seriously hate this page and have never been able to understand it.

Not OP, but these books are massively helpful. Bless

>>3481106
Sauce please

>>3481169
if you lay down on a railroad track like that, you're gonna get hit

>>3481186
Do you have difficulty drawing people from extreme top down or bottom up views? First draw the person on the left, making sure he is eight heads tall. Then on bottom left, see how he takes an approximate rectangle about the height of his head and duplicates it eight times (this method is covered in Perspective Made Easy). You can also take an approximate big rectangle and divide it eight times, either way works. Now transfer the figure to this new grid you made and you will have the proportions neatly laid out for you.

I need a book for simplified perspective, anyone?

>>3481208
Read first, then decide if you want to do the exercises afterwards. I find that the exercises in drawabox/dynamic sketching are more helpful so I do that instead. But I did read these books, which helped me understand why all the exercises were set up the way they were.
Perspective Made Easy
Perspective for the Comic Book Artist
How to Draw

>>3480667
Yours is if you can't figure out something everyone who draws can desu.

>>3480476
lol no

>>3480390
what is OP pic from?

>>3481192

This anon above already linked to it:

>>3481054

>>3481186
It's how to put the figure nto perspective, genius.
I suck and even I get that.

>>3481602
I get what it's trying to teach but I've never been able to learn from that page

>>3481602
>”genius”
No need to be caustic about it. Its not about whether someone sucks its about how (well) they learn and how (well) something is presented and explained.
Its quite amazing how often “teachers” strike the wrong balance between too little and too much background info to include and in what order to introduce subjects within an interconnected whole.
Loomis seems to have thought his books were appropriate for absolute beginners but spend any time on this board and you see how many people cant grasp the abstractions he uses.

Also you obviously don’t “suck”. Your sketches are controlled and and appear casually if not effortlessly done. You’ve obviously practiced for some time. Amd if not you’re probably gmi. Just dont be a dick or show off. No one is that good that they can afford to do that.

>>3481618
>giant paragraph just to tell an anon to stop using le mean words
go back

>>3481621
>giant paragraph
>giant

Are you retarded or..?

>>3481316
Spoonfeeding really reached critical mass.
I'm curious how many /ic/ posters actually from 4chan?

>>3481640

What does that even mean?
Stay in school kids or you’ll sound like this guy.

>>3481640
We're all trying to help each other get better at art except crabs of course.

>>3481659
spoonfeeding redditors and tumblr =/= helping
this is 4chan not reddit
/ic/ needs mod. Someone should purge this degeneracy like we purged furfags from porn threads. We need heavy hand.

>>3481676
>Helping people is degeneracy.
Yeah you’re cool man.

>>3481640
Barely any. It's an infestation.
>>3481631
>>3481645
>>3481659
>>3481705
They're so fucking easy to spot too. Just allow gore and open the floodgates for a while to scare them away.

>>3481709
You're trying way too hard dude. I've never even seen plebbit's home page. If this was on /a/ I'd be all against spoonfeeding I just don't see the problem here.

>>3481711
>Chill out fellow 4Channer, I hate Reddit just like the rest of you guys! Screw 9gag, am I right?
>I hate spoonfeeding as much as the next 4Channer, you know? But do it anyway okay
Sorry man I was mistaken you're alright by me, bring more friends

>>3481720
I don't have any friends.

>>3480390
Please don't use your brain as an excuse. It's not some hippie bullshit...Well, it's sort of like that, but combined with raw observation skills. Now there are mathematical proportions when illustrating a form, but you need to do more than just follow basic rules. You DO have to "feel the form" and work your pencil accordingly. Otherwise your lines will look janky, forced or cheap.

Like I said, there are some rules, such as how a slight proportion adjustment of facial features will make something cute or beautiful, but that is half of the process. Just draw, man, and you'll be fine. No more of this "left brain" bullshit.

>>3481709
Ooo gore. Please dont. Thats intimidating.

>claims to be "logical"
>uses debunked pseudoscience like "left-brained"

Besides, art isn't a math formula retard

>>3481793
It is a math formula if you treat it that way. Measurements, proportions, it's math. Hell, lighting on characters is a result of proper wiring of objects.

>>3480390
>Hey guys, very big brain guy here. I'm very smart, but I can't figure out how do you "draw", because I'm very smart. I also like reading quantum physics during lunchbreaks. Can you break down an step-by-step instruction for me?
Yes I can, go read "How to Draw" by Scott Robertson, this book will be your grave.

Honestly this is kinda our fault for recommending Drawing with the Right Side of the Brain.

>>3480949
Nice tautology

>>3481603
>>3481618
Sorry. Is this what you needed help understanding, anon? It gets covered in Successful Drawing (by Andy Loomis of course) along with a lot of other technical drawing techniques and skills. They're pretty invaluable for improving your construction drawing and putting it into perspective.

>>3481618
Also, thanks. I have passable line control, which isn't too difficult to learn if you practice drawing from the shoulder, drawing circles and lines and all that jazz as a warmup before drawing. It's basically just working on your hand eye coordination. I used to not even be able to draw a straight line freehand.
As for the actual figures themselves, I'm horribly out of practice (I've barely drawn in months) and I said that I suck because 1. Artists tend to be (or should be) self-critical or else you end up like that Christopher Hart guy or a DeviantArt hugboxed autist that pisses themselves every time they get criticized.
Have you seen Christofer Hart's YT channel? Watch one of his recent videos. It'll scare the pants right off of you.

2. I'm horribly out of practice and I can see everything I did wrong with those little figures, and it makes me want to die.

As for the 'genius' comment, I'm accustomed to the verbal rough housing here on 4chan and I kind of default to it. Also being a bit of an ass. Apologies for that.

>>3482231
didn't know he had a youtube channel but its legitimately the saddest thing ive ever seen

>>3480390
>I am left-brained guy

No you are not. You are just making up excuses. You already have all the info you need to approach it methodically. It's not up to other people to constantly explain to you how to make something good.

>>3482122
You think people telling you something is true is a platitude? That just says a lot about you.

>>3482252
>call a platitude a platitude
>Oh wow I know so much about you now because I'm psychic Sherlock Holmes
Go on then, read me my horoscope

>>3482116
It's a wonderful book. Excellent reference. I have it in hardcover.

>>3482335
Reference for what you bimbo, its a book about construction. Didn't you said that you need to focus on it while having HtD in hardcover?

>>3480390
You're also going to have to study 2D composition or all you end up making is ugly pictures drawn well.

As for consistent results, that's what computer graphics is for. What takes a week to do getting a good computer model made and rendered can be done in an afternoon by making a basic and low detail computer model and then working out details and rendering by hand, but if you need repeatability, the computer will do better than you ever will. There's really a point to recognizing what makes sense to do in the production process and when you're doing something that doesn't even win you points for uniqueness.

>>3482340
On how good Scott Robertson is drawing ugly airplanes really well

>>3482231
>I suck I suck I suck I suck
godam you're totally gonna make it now can I lick ur shoes

>>3482297
you sound like a dumbass.

>>3481168
>Bammes
Just checked the books, why didn't /ic/ mention him before?

>>3482354
The chinese value humility, the original poster is gmi

>>3481640
You do realise that the vast majority of drawthreads on 4chin behave like non 4chinners for a very obvious reason that a lot of drawfags are random imports. Or we'd prefer to sound like a newfag and git gud then waste time finding it ourselves

>>3481316
And thanks!

OP here, left-brained guy is a figure of speech. It's more about the approach to learning and as I said, I can't feel anything, I have to be sure 100% what I am doing in order to be able to replicate the results.

>>3480390
"Feel the form" is not abstract at all.
You know how you smile when drawing the smiley face, and then it turns out extra smile-y?
Well, feeling the form is just that, except instead of imagining the happiness, you imagine the volume and instead of extra smiley, you get extra volumetric.

>>3485956
are you a STEM guy? Might be good if you take up industrial design, those might be right up your alley. And as suggested by other anons, go study How to draw by Scott Robertson

>>3485989
Well I want to do character illustration the most but I'll give Robertson a try.

>>3480460

IIRC recent research has totally destroyed the idea of "learning types". Everyone learns the same way fundamentally. There's only better or worse way of studying.

>>3486037
So what is the better way?

>>3480390

Wow OP are you me? add lack of short therm memory and you are me.

>>3480426

Hum... no? your drawing needs proof that it can exist like a photography, otherwise you could invent nonsense.

The only prof that drawings and paintings have are photos and video.

>>3480416
Came here to post this. Scrolled just to make sure someone else didn't say it first.

>>3486080
Thanks for your worthless input. You can now go and end your worthless life.

>>3486086

Cunt.

>>3486086
You're that assblasted, huh?

bump

Left/right brained dichotomy is a meme but if you want stuff that is rule based and logical go through Hampton and Scott Robertson.