/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>>3435619
Stop crying go draw

>>3435619
?
You just do it. You may not be able to do anything now, but you can start now. A little bit over a long period of time makes a big difference. If you don't start now, then in 10 years you will wish you had.

Imagine how good you will be in only 3 years if you practice every single day.

“I will study and get ready, and perhaps my chance will come.”
-Abraham Lincoln

>>3435619
Take time to draw what you want even if it looks shitty

>>3435622
That was the reason for extensive study of fundamentals in the first place. I ain't going back to that garbage.

>>3435623
Just draw god dammit

>>3435626
I draw every day, I just don't want to feel like complete shit every time I do it for fucks sake, what part of that can't you understand? I've been drawing the same fundamental shit for a year now and I am nowhere near ending it. There is nothing creative or interesting about it.

>>3435627
Have you been drawing boxes for 365 days? What have you done in that year? How many hours a day? Have you done life drawings and reference studies?

>>3435619
>you can't share it anywhere since subjects are really dull and nothing of value

No no no. Make a personal blog and put up everything you do. It's just for yourself. Don't tag anything don't even try to get the blog any kind of social attention. These years are your endurance training; trying to draw for yourself for the sake of yourself.

>>3435628
I've been drawing shit like pic related.

Getting better at proportions, better hand dexterity and linework.

Nothing but that for a whole year. Not exactly those shapes, I've been picking other subjects too, but it's the same formula. Redraw something to get better at specific things. I don't think it needs to be showcased anywhere because it's the most basic shit you can ever see.

>>3435627
take breaks in studying to draw something self-indulgent wtf
doing nothing but studying can be extremely exhausting you gotta mix in some shit just for funsies

>>3435636
What do you mix in if you can't draw anything?

>>3435633
In one year? Have you been drawing for 30 minutes a day? What books have you gone through? Also, you care too much about what others think of your drawings it seems.

>>3435659
I've been drawing for more than 30 min, it's just I was really bad before, like a complete beginner. Regarding books, not much, I am more a fan of videos, these ones help me more, nothing fancy, typical beginner stuff.

I care about drawings because I see it as a good way of socializing (if I were good), without that I have no one and nothing in general. If I am to sacrifice my time in order to get good, I want my rewards aswell.

>>3435619
people start when they are kids where their undeveloped taste lets them be ecstatic at everything they make. try not being such a faggot and you might enjoy art even without the technical skills.

>>3435674
Do "Keys to Drawing" by Bert Dodson. Draw a lot from real life, stop caring what others think about your drawings. Use copy paper and pencil. No erasing. Aim to draw a few hours a day at least. Come back when you're finished with Keys to Drawing and find another book.
Don't forget that not only should you put in time, you should also put in effort. There's a difference between 1 hour of deliberate, attentive practice, and sloppily drawing for an hour.

>>3435658
>What do you mix in if you can't draw anything?
what do you want to draw when you are good? draw that now, don't try and only study fundies, it is fucking retarded and is obviously making you miserable

>>3435762

at this rate the "how to draw anime" posters will be better than you
>tfw tfw i cant draaaaaaaaaw

>>3435619
>Since studying fundamentals takes that much time, it gets boring pretty fast
Are you just grinding cubes and samey sketches of figures every day like an idiot? You understand that you can practice fundies while drawing whatever you like, right?

An anime thread died for this

>>3435621
wholesome

>>3435816
this

>>3435776
I'm pretty sure that's just one guy spamming the same thread over and over

>>3435813
>You understand that you can practice fundies while drawing whatever you like, right?

You can't do that without ingraining bad methods of doing something. You learn fundamentals because you don't want to draw crooked noses or whatever and you won't learn that without resorting to exercises. Personal work stays garbage when you don't commit fully to grinding boxes, that's the reality.

>>3435828
Not OP but I'm getting mixed vibes from this board
There's one group of people telling me to draw bad drawings while practicing fundies on the side, while the other group is telling me to go through learning material and do almost exclusively studies and fundamentals.
Am I doing something wrong by doing only studies and fundamentals? I don't even get bored of it or find anything wrong with it, I just get the vibe that maybe I'm doing something wrong now

>>3435832
Ideally you do only studies and you learn concepts fast, then you create original work with solid fundamentals and you get to know what to learn from that (sometimes you have to go back to certain concepts). But that's ideally.

I don't know the answer really, it seems that you should create original work but it's hard to do that without fundamentals, which take a lot of time. Maybe I am just retarded and it takes too much time for me.

>>3435619
I would draw comics in between studying fundamentals.

>>3435834
I just love practicing fundamentals, something must be wrong with me

>>3435828
i hate to bring out the ngmi but...you're not going to make it with that attitude.

you can't go from nothing to master without being bad, then ok, then good in the middle.

i mean you wouldn't take this ridiculous tack with anything else, you don't learn to drive by refusing to start the car until you've practiced turning the wheel for 100s of hours.

you just to accept that you're bad and your drawings will look bad for a while.

life isn't an anime

>>3435842
Sure but I know from my own personal experience that what you are saying won't get me anywhere. I have done some personal work in my life, obviously trash and I haven't gained anything from that. Literally nothing, except from getting hit in the head that I have to study.

I don't know why you people insist on doing bad art, there is nothing and I mean nothing valuable in it. You see shit and you are reminded for the 100th time that you have to grind more boxes again.

>>3435832
It's a matter of what's your ultimate goal as an artist.
Maybe you're just a designer or don't really care where you go with your artwork, you just love drawing. That's fantastic, keep drawing whatever makes you happy. But for the group who wants to become a concept artist for sci fi video games, or want to make a living selling semi realistic portrait oil paintings, or want to become the next big comic artist with their shonen comedy series idea- grinding fundies and boxes all day will not let them reach their goal. It's great that you can draw cubes and cylinders from every angle imaginable, but you still have to apply that knowledge to draw figures, clothing, interiors, furniture, buildings, skies, oceans, shoes, desks, faces, etc infinitum. And as great as you are with basic shapes, applying that knowledge to draw more complex subjects requires your effort in actually drawing those objects. How the fuck do you expect to draw good looking people if you never attempt to draw people to begin with? If your attempt at drawing looks bad, it only means you can IMPROVE. You can analyze what you drew, compare it with real life reference, and say "Alright, I understand my mistakes. Let me try again and fix those mistakes with my new drawing".

>>3435857
perhaps if you stopped thinking about it in terms of it's immediate emotional context you'd have a broader understanding,

the purpose isn't to motivate you or make you feel like this or that, it's to make you learn by trial and error.

Why do I bother with this shitty board. Most of you barely progress for years and there's literally nothing you can say to me that would be truly valuable. Yeye draw for fun stay shit, your whole life motto you fucking art failures.

>>3435897
yet you keep posting your whining about how HARD drawing is instead of doing anything

>>3435905
My problem is that I want to improve instead of stagnating. Everything you propose is anything but improving. You realize "drawing for fun" is what people do when they are very casual about it? If you ask professionals, they'll say that drawing isn't fun until you get good, hmmm, I wonder who is right...

>>3435934
ask a professional how many boxes they drew instead lol

>>3435938
Drawing boxes is not meant to be taken literally, it's only a part of the grind. It's just that grind itself is monotonous as hell so it's represented as drawing boxes millions of times. Nobody does that seriously without being autistic.

>>3435943
so drawing boxes is actually code for just draw, makes sense

>>3435934
If you already had all the answers then why did you bother coming here OP ? To make this board your personal blog ? I pity your arrogance, Take one minute to understand the meaning behind drawing for fun while still bad at it.
Drawing for fun on it's own would ingrain bad practices, but drawing for fun then revising that drawing and using that drawing as a means of study through trial and error is a learning process that will result in progression you can actually see .
ngmi op sorry

>>3435962
If only your tips weren't literally limited to "just draw bro" even when I said myself that I draw, I just have problems with handling constant grind, it's burning me out. You tell me to do exactly what I do now.

>>3435997
you have poor reading comprehension

>>3435997
I gave you advice further up in the thread
Do Keys to Drawing
Fuck sake, if all you wanted was to rant there's an own thread for that

me mr nigger hehe

>>3436037
Is "Keys to Drawing with Imagination: Strategies and Exercises for Gaining Confidence and Enhancing Your Creativity" a different book? It's the same guy and I think this would tackle my problem better judging by the title. dunno

>>3435619
Mindfully study/copy artwork that's in the style of your end goal. You'll be drawing what you love without stumbling completely in the dark and have a better sense of what fundamentals you need to improve and how to apply them. You should copy them exactly but just be sure to break down the images properly instead of copying like a photocopy machine so that you can use the same drawing process on your own original work. Doing that enough will make the transition from studying to creating something you're not ashamed of much smoother.

You can also try finding or making a group/blog where you can post those fundamental exercises and copies. People definitely take interest in that stuff. Particularly other artists doing the same thing.

>>3435619
Are you drawing things you like anon? Don't tell me you've been only doing fundies and studies all this time. I think you just dug a hole for yourself when you decided to do only fundies and studies. It became your new safe space. Artist that have made it mostly drew things that they like from imagination. They only do studies for 1 week max before they go back to drawing from imagination. What have you been doing OP? Poor OP thinks that art is a math equation. If I do fundies + studies × 1 year I'll be the next Ruan Jia in no time. Thats not how it works OP. You need to change your mindset on how to do art.

>>3436056
ISBN 978-0891343370

>>3435828
Only if you are an absolute retard with huge learning issues and total inability to think critically of your own work. But in this case you are ngmi anyway.

>>3435828
>I draw shit whenever I draw anything
Why? Draw something you want to draw, take a look, it looks fucked up, why? Look for resources related to how you've fucked up and practice that. Do it again, is it still fucked up? You probably haven't been able to absorb what you just studied, blame it on /ic/ and continue to grind yourself to tears.

>>3435997
There are no tips. This problem is way to personal for a tailor made answer.

You hate drawing, probably been """grinding"""" for a whole year, and not seen any results but y'know what? I think you're lying.

You're lying to yourself. You want the prize now. You're not patient enough and want drawing skills to come falling out of the sky.

It's hard but unless you swallow your pride and adopt a "trial and error" mindset to learning, as opposed to a "one-size-fits-all" approach, you'll be here next year, having accomplished nothing.

Learn to draw specific things, grow your knowledge of how the world works by filling your head with images, Don't just memorize them, break them down into shapes, analyze lighting, anatomy, form, perspective, do it all and try to memorise what you learnt.

Drawing from imagination is just taking what you understand about the real world, and warping it. make the noses you've studied longer, put the wings of an eagle on a human, blaah blaah.

I think a large number of people on this board don't practice drawing for real; instead, they make small efforts for a long-ish period of time, then use that frustration (which was bound to build up since you weren't TRYING FOR REAL) as moral licensing to whine about how fundies aren't helping. Even if they won't admit it to themselves, they want a secret trick, that hidden formula that'll make them amazing instantly.

>>3436315
You're so right. How did you know? I will admit it. I always am looking for that secret trick on this board. It's probably the only reason to come here. Maybe it will be found one day. I never know, so I have to check every day, every hour. I don't really know what trying for real is too. I put in the effort, but sure I could put in more. When is trying for real though? I always feel like I could have spent more time thinking instead of making a mark. How do you not let the frustration build up when you aren't even sure you were giving it your all and best? How do you make the frustration go away?

throw your studies at /ic/ and try to be social. misery loves company.

>>3435828
Or you know. Learn how to draw what you see first? I don't know why most of ic trips over itself on this one fact. Most artists learn to draw classically first. Then they move on to grind boxes. And that's kinda obvious. Because learning to draw what you see is learning to see itself. Once you can do that, you can actually commit to memory what is actually accurate. Majority of big name artists learned to draw classically first, then moved on to do their construction figure drawing. Everyone's got a hard-on for Steve Huston but this is exactly what he did as well.

>>3435619
retarded loser who only studies fundamentals and wonders why he cant draw
its because your drafting not drawing you loser
do both and youll notice you get better

>>3436471
What's the difference between drafting and drawing?

>>3436499
drafting(in terms of art) is what you're doing. making pieces from imagination while also mot employing any design at all. you only gain those skills from designing things, and when you are learning the fundies you are not applying very much of your own design sensibilities.

youre obviously too scared to actually draw something because youre shit at drawing so you make yourself feel good because you think you know the fundies when you obviously dont as evidenced by >>3435633 because not only is that image out of perspectice, but the shadows are incorrect and the linework is shoddy. you were right to name that picture asd because you most likely have it if you studied art for one year and you are at that level

>>3436534
That's retarded. Drafting in art just means technical drawing. Most of you could actually get better if you learned classical drawing first. That way, you can draw anything you see. That goes into your visual memory as you draw more and more. Then churn the boxes and construction. Look at any artist and this is what they have done as well. Construction is a big part of drawing for animation. But look at any big shot animators and they have all been trained classically. Grim Natwick went to Ecole des Beaux-Arts, came back with that training and you can see exactly how far it took him from that point.

Construction comes after that. I used to think of classical drawing as churning out measurements with a skewer and plumblines. "What's the point in drawings things exactly?" Well turns out, a lot. Most books on classical drawing usually mention some variation of this thought, 'Drawing is seeing.' And learning to measure and sight angles and proportion enables you to see everything differently. So when you churn construction box-humans, you're actually seeing them better. Not to mention, once you can see accurately, that is the point at which drawing will be most useful to you. You're actually able to recall because you're putting real measurements into your visual memory. Look at any great anime artist and you'll see the same history.

>>3435633
Why not just draw anything that's interesting to you and apply the same lessons. You will still get better at proportions. In fact, it's recommended that you switch up subject matter often so your eye doesn't get lazy.

>>3436543
he's not interested in anything lol, he's one of those 'i want to be good at something ummm, drawing seems easy' dudes.

>>3435619
if you watched the Original Karate Kid, Daniel's "training" consisted of karate lessons disguised as chores.

little did he know those "chores" consisted of moves that related directly to fundamentals of karate. And it was being implanted subconsciously into his mind and body without him realizing it.. This scenario can be translated into fine art as well.

this is for you and any /ic/ anon who worry about whether they are wasting time over doing art fundamentals. It's safe to assume you've understood the basics. Okay. So, put it to real practice now. Remember, understanding fundamentals are meant to give your memory some basic foundation. If you've done that enough (best not to overdo it - 15min/day max) move on to the next level of your art training by going out and using what you've now learned.

one simple way to do this is sitting at a cafe and drawing people: sitting, standing, talking, etc...DON'T aim for photorealism yet. Just draw them using what you know from the ground level fundamentals using circles, squares, triangles...time yourself (20sec, 30sec, 1min, 5min, 15-30min) because it will force your mind to develop that mind-hand-eye connection whenever you approach art.

the third phase of your training will then be aiming for drawing what you see (realism). Again time yourself but allow 10-15 min max as a start. Then gradually add 5min to that based on your comfort level.

don't overwhelm or concern yourself with details too soon. Draw large shapes you see and work down to details.

approaching your art training this way will quiet any unrealistic and overwhelming expectation you put on yourself as a would be artist. And builds confidence. have faith in yourself over this.

Not OP but I am traumatized to do original work after so many bad pieces that I am afraid I'll never do anything again. I just don't want to go back to that feeling that it's shit again and I can't show it or even look at it myself. It seems easier to just dig yourself under the ground and do "fundamentals" till you are ready but that moment may never come. Drawing is mentally exhausting and it's hard to find it fun really.

>>3436543
ok boomer

>>3435619
Honestly most of my improvement came from drawing stuff that I could jack off to. It made all those hours of practice pretty easy. My advice would be to draw for yourself. There must be something you want to draw. Whenever you practice your fundamentals go back after and draw what you want to draw, but incorporate what you've been studying.
If you don't find drawing enjoyable, don't do it. And don't be afraid to draw crap. Chances are, nobody will see it but you.
Also use a mirror/invert tool to let you see your drawings flipped. Lots of people starting out don't understand the concept of your work growing on you as you draw it, as a result you become unable to see basic errors like misalignment or disproportion. Mirroring your drawings will help you spot this stuff easily.

>>3435619
YOU HAVE TO DO BOTH.
Even if it still looks like shit you still have to keep drawing what you actually want in addition to your studies so you don't lose sight of your goals.

>>3436693
based karate kid poster

>>3435619
By having fun and allowing myself to mess up, while being eager to improve my skillset?

>>3435619
- If you don't see improvement in one year you are studying wrong.
- If you keep drawing fucking basic shapes for an entire year you are studying wrong.
- If you can't aply what you are learning to your drawing to see an inmediate improvement, you are not learning anything in reality.

The things you mentioned are things that take a month max to grasp in any learning program, and then you move to harder topics. You are not suposed to be at introductory excercises for a whole fucking year. I repeat, you CANNOT be drawing this shit >>3435633 after a year of practice.

I'm going to bet that you just mindlesly drew the same shit over and over with no thought put into it.

>>3440271
Teach us more

>>3435619
I feel the same way. It takes too long to learn the fundamentals and make art the "proper" way.

So I just cheat and use technology. Take a picture, photoshop it and wa la, art.

>>3435674
>If I am to sacrifice my time in order to get good, I want my rewards aswell.
oh so you're an autist lol

>>3435857
maybe stop fuckin grinding boxes and grind the parts of the drawing you suck at, duhhh

>>3440271
>You are not suposed to be at introductory excercises for a whole fucking year. I repeat, you CANNOT be drawing this shit >>3435633 # after a year of practice

People shouldn’t ONLY be doing introductory exercises, they should be doing actual drawing as well. However, that exercise is from Watts Atelier, and Jeff Watts’s philosophy about exercises like it is that you should return to them and do them at all stages of mastery.

>>3440333
Yeah, I agree with that, there are several levels of realism in shadows, for example, and it's always good to practice next level techniques with simple forms before jumping to more complex ones.
But this anon hasn't finished not even one cycle of fundamentals. So he is not returning to the exercises, he's just never leaving them.

>>3435674
Did you seriosly picked one of the most autistic and reclusive disciplines there are as a way of socializing?
I have no words. You deserve your lack of improvement.

>>3435619

The key is drawing what you want to draw while keeping the fundamentals and references on hand. That way you don't get bored with doing routines over and over again. You have to have an idea that you can give your 100% to.

It's a distraction while still doing something important.