/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>>3322282
Have an instructor that's been in the industry for awhile and teaches us on the side. CINTIQS are a meme, which tablet you use is just preference. Majority actually prefer using an intuos even though companies will buy cintiqs for you since there's a few really bad downsides to using one like the screen heating up and having to always cover half of your drawing with your hand.

That being said I personally wouldn't go with a tablet that has less pen pressure than your standard intuos but you can still get away with that if your painting method relies more on the picker tool than pressure opacity. For size the pen pressure doesn't matter as much.

>>3322289
Ah right another point
One of the downsides of non-screen tablets is that you have to have quite a bit of control over your hand to use them as well as you might use a cintiq since you can't physically see where your hand is moving, but other than that one or the other isn't gonna make your work better.
Just about which you prefer.

>>3322282
I'll say this;
I've been able to create the exact kind of digital painting I always hoped to create, using a Surface Pro 4. You adapt to the foibles.

>>3322282
I just bought the last Cintiq 27QHD on the wacom website. I can't wait to throw my old intuos pro and pen against the wall when it arrives.

>>3322282

Yeah. Just get a cintiq. It will make you 300% faster and 200% better.

>>3322334
explain?

>>3322282
I have a Companion 2, I love it. It's not a meme, it's an incredibly useful tool, and I wouldn't draw digitally any other way. The amount of precision abd accuracy the offer for inking and linework is insane, abd that's where the details matter. It's incredibly useful, there are no viable alternatives. If you wanna DRAW digitally, go Cintiq. If you wanna paint digitally, anything goes. To me, the tablet has paid itself over 10-fold in the 2 years I've had it thanks to its output, how much it helped me improve, and all the commissions I did on it.

>>3322334
This.

>>3322337

Drawing on the screen is just easier, more intuitive, and faster. It's closer to drawing on paper. It's just much more natural and you'll be drawing on a one-to-one basis, so you won't have a tiny little hand gesture be a big stroke on the screen, like if you're working with a small intuos.

If you were a robot, an intuos would be just as good, but you're a human, and working on the surface you're drawing on will always feel better.

I SUCKED at digital art until I got a cintiq. I had struggled with it for years, using tablets of various kinds. I got a cintiq, and made more progress digitally in one year than I did in 5 before that.

As a side note, jumping from a 13 inch to a 22 inch will be less of a leap, but oh my god does it feel good. So go for a 22 if you can afford it.

>>3322344
>. I got a cintiq, and made more progress digitally in one year than I did in 5 before that.
This is my experience as well. The progress I made in digital art in just the year after I got it is crazy, it also motivated me to draw digitally more often as it was no longer a pain, but as fun as traditional.

To me, that makes the price of one totally worth it.

>>3322342
>If you wanna paint digitally, anything goes.
This. I'm >>3322304 and I when it comes to drawing, I would rather use pencil and paper, then paint over a photo of it

>>3322282

I own both a 21UX Cintq and a 13HD that I now only use as a regular tablet.

Screen tablets are superior in one key aspect:
Precision. You can create amazing work on a desk tablet, but a screen tablet is closer to working traditionally. The 13HD is too small though, I would not recommend it to anyone. I got a used 21UX from a friend for a good price and it's a delight to work on. When you're drawing, inking digitally or painting with a lot of directional strokes with the art pen you feel the difference.

Some aspects are better with a regular tablet. I find it less straining on the eyes, simply because a regular monitor is further away from your eyes. The constant heat from the monitor can be a bit irritating too. The precision aspect is also a double edge sword - working on a desk tablet is somewhat akin to working on a upright canvas with a big, long brush. I find that I use my arm/shoulder much more with a screen tablet where as a desk tablet you work more with your wrist. In some ways your mark making takes on a subtle difference, and with a regular tablet sometimes it can be easier to focus on the big forms when painting.

At first I actually hated working on the screen tablet because it felt so different and I was used to a desk tablet after years of working with one. After I got used to it though I realized it was far superior. Also on the plus side, when you're working on a screen tablet your skills are more transferable to traditional mediums. I find that when I have only drawn on a desk tablet for long stretches of time, drawing on paper gets kind of awkward but with a screen tablet I have only improved.

>>3322352
>Also on the plus side, when you're working on a screen tablet your skills are more transferable to traditional mediums. I find that when I have only drawn on a desk tablet for long stretches of time, drawing on paper gets kind of awkward but with a screen tablet I have only improved.
this this this!!

>>3322352
Should I be saving up for the cintiq pro 16 then? especially if i move around a lot

>>3322363
>cintiq pro 16

Can't recommend any tablet I haven't used. Too small for me personally. Try one a couple of times if you can before you buy.

I switch between a ipad pro 12.9 and huion 1060 plus, i used to have a cintiq pro 13 but its not worth it, it just fucking sucks compared to a cintiq that is 20" or higher. ( what makes it shitty is the screen real estate, i have much more space and pixels on the ipad compared to the cintiq 13).

When I'm "good" enough and have the money I'll buy the big ass cintiqs but until then I'll live I do just fine both on screen and off screen

>>3322352
>>3322353

Please explain how working on a screen tablet (a flat surface upon which you draw holding the stylus as a regular pen) provides more transferable skills compared to a screenless tablet (a flat surface upon which you draw holding the stylus as a regular pen)?

>>3322282
I use a yogabook as a drawing pad - it's got 2048 levels of pressure and no tilt.
I mean it's not amazing but it's still pretty good.

>>3322417
Hand eye coordination.

On one, you see your hand move across the canvas as you draw, giving you more control. Which is basically the same as drawing on traditional.

On the other, you have split that's unnatural to which you must adapt. That difference makes it so that a lot of dexterity does not transfer.

What a stupid question btw. I thought this sort of thing would be self-evident to someone.

>>3322417
the first time you ever drew on a regular tablet, didn't you fuck up every line you made? that's how. drawing directly on a screen is more natural

>>3322334
I agree with 300% faster. The average artwork took me about 8 hours. Once I got my cintiq I could get similiar results within two hours. My drawing skills didn't magically improve but I found out the disconnection between hand to canvas is actually important.

>>3322421
>>3322422
You guys were never taught to look at the model, not at your paper? You never had that exercise where you have to keep drawing without ever looking at your paper?

That's what using a classic tablet is like. EXCEPT you actually have a fucking cursor to look at. I can't fathom what the difficulty is, honestly.
I had one of the first convertible HP tablet that had an active stylus back then, and the parallax was a LOT more annoying to deal with than using my old Intuos, as a matter of fact.
I expect since it's Wacom, the Cintiq would not be so much of a hassle, but I still have no idea what difficulty people have with classic tablets.

>>3322421

Because I've been using regular tablets for over 15 years and it's not really has been a problem for me. I was just wondering.

>>3322352
>>3322377

I used to like my 13 inch but now it just cramps my arm a bunch and I get too sucked into zooming in for details. I wish I could afford a bigger one

>>3322440
>You guys were never taught to look at the model, not at your paper? You never had that exercise where you have to keep drawing without ever looking at your paper?
Did you just read the first chapter of keys to drawing or something? Yes you're supposed to look at your model a lot but the drawing itself and its corrections are made by looking at the paper.
>>3322443
Regular tablets aren't that hard to use, no one is saying that - it's just that cintiqs provide a faster workflow and are much more intuitive because they're closer to traditional. That's all this discussion boils down to.

>>3322446
This, plus doing linework on a regular tablet is absolute hell.

How is using a Cintiq, or any on screen tablet, a meme when we draw on paper? I went from an Intuous Pro small to a Cintiq Pro 16. I work faster, EK remote at the side was nicer/more comfortable to use than my keyboard (for some reason I never bothered using the express keys on the Intuous). The only positive I can think of was the fact that I could have my Intuous wireless. I thought I would have regretted spending that much on a tablet because I’m kinda impulsive but I honestly don’t regret buying the Cintiq Pro.

I have a 13hd cintiq and have had the hdmi unplugged and use it as a regular intuos style one. The screen was nice at first but i find it really uncomfortable to work with maybe because the 13 is so small. Ive used larger ones too and they feel much better. Tldr go big or go home the 13 isnt worth it

>>3322445

Yeah I found it difficult to have a good posture working with it too. I'm by no means buff but I felt like the incredible hulk trying to draw on a receipt with it.

Regular tablets are great for painting. Cintiqs if you work primarily in line and monochrome.

>>3322480
cintiqs are better for painting as well, not just lines.

>>3322488

I have an older model so I don't know if I can trust the color on it. It's a 21UX.

>>3322446
How does a cintiq provide a faster workflow to a tablet? theres no objective or measurable quality to make that statement. Any hand to eye coordination issue from a tablet is all but completely mitigated in a short period of time. I'll back that up with the study of the man who used glasses that inverted his vision only requiring ~2 weeks to adapt.

>>3322496
I say that based on experience with both. Used regular tablets for over 7 years (got used to it within a week). Bought a Cintiq, finished pieces much quicker, didn't even need to get used to it.

>>3322493

I have a 21UX too, the colors and contrast is off but I have a better monitor right next to it that I can check the hues on. I don't find it to be a huge problem though as long as the value relationships are solid.

>>3322496
Also, if you already mentioned the study - if you remove the inverted glases from that person for a long period of time their brain would forget how to use it and they'll have to adapt again (it'll happen faster because the neuto-synaptic flow will already exist but they'll still have to re-learn how to use it).

The point I'm trying to make is that there are some things that our brain can quickly adapt to because we're used to them (traditional drawing, writing and the holding of the pencil from a very young age) and some things would require a learning period that'll take a while to get used to, which is the experience with regular tablets that isn't learned regularly. No matter how long you do aa certain thing, some things are just easier/intuitive for our brains to handle.

>>3322496

>Any hand to eye coordination issue from a tablet is all but completely mitigated in a short period of time

Disagree, that has not been my experience. I have worked with a regular tablet since the early 2000's. I am very comfortable working with it yet I find the Cintiq to be the superior tool.

>>3322496
>Any hand to eye coordination issue from a tablet is all but completely mitigated
Thought so too, then I used a Cintiq.

I thought the cintiq was a meme too until I learned how to actually implement the shortcuts and delegate tasks between the tablet display and the keyboard. Now I can whip through shit at the speed of light and using an Intuos feels like trying to play connect the dots on xanax

Love my Cintiq. Wouldn't give it up at for any shitty non-screen tablet.
If you've never drawn on a piece of paper in your life and have only used a mouse or a non-screen digitizer, you can be forgiven for how bloody naive you sound.

Would the 16 inch be a happy medium between space and price? I would go +20 but want to save money if possible.

>>3322585
Few questions
Do you currently have a tablet?
What's your monitor size?
Do you plan to use the cintiq as a portable device?

>>3322612
Yeah, Xp-Pen Star 06
My current monitor is 23"
No it would be at my desk for 90% of the time, (unless I move into another room)

>>3322979
Then I recommend you wait and get the larger model. Get a payment plan if you don't want to pay all at once. 22"+ is worth the extra cash you're trying to save

>>3322539
Ah! That makes a lot more sense. I never use the shortcuts and shit on my classic tablet, because there I can't see shit.

I didn't get the whole "Oh no, I can't draw anymore" bullshit.
But being able to use all the tools that the tablet offers, OK, I totally get that.

>>3323113
All they have left is the refurbs and they don't finance those, guess I'll wait and save, thanks.

>>3324010
Actually, I've got a line on a stand alone monitor pretty cheap, but none of the periferal. I can get ahold of a off brand power adaptor and the stylus, but for the video and data inputs can I just use regular DVI-D and USB cords?

>>3322445
another pro for a non display tablet.

encourages good posture and your neck is saved.

only barrier is the screen disconnect but train youself and you can overcome it, at the end of the day your skill is what matters most.

>>3322282
>Is it the best
Yes.
>Is it a crutch
Not anymore of a crutch than anything else digital art related.
>Got alternatives
Ipad pro 12.9 + apple pencil
>are non-screen tablets inferior
Yes. The disconnect can be managed with practice, or you can just not have to deal with it at all with a cintiq. So yes, they're inferior.

I have one and enjoy it, but there's nothing wrong with an intuos 4 and the like.

Anyone else order the 24 pro? It actually comes with the remote this time and has an HDMI port.

>>3325699
It's not even out yet and there's no information on the site.

>>3324790
>encourages good posture and your neck is save
I work out and do stretches daily. I also bought a nice and comfortable 240$ gaming chair to sit in.

This solved the neck/back problems.

>>3325704
I just ordered one this morning, they put it up on the store today.

>>3325718
Both models are out of stock on the US site now. Should be interesting to see how the computer add-on performs.

>>3325736
Damn it looks really nice. How much did it cost?

>>3325741
pretty sure the "engine" costs more than the tablet itself which is insane. 24 pro is 1999.99 usd

>>3325741
2500$ for the i5

3500$ for the xeon processor.

>>3325736
The Cintiq Pro Engine is going to have a Xeon processor and a Quaddro P3200. It'll probably cost between 2500-3500 or even more than that.

man i want to do lineart, but doing it on a regular tablet is ridiculously difficult, so i alwasy end up switching back to reg pencil and paper. i just want an affordable screen tablet that is as close to paper as possible but sadly wacom is the only one that comes close with the downside of extremely expensive shit

>>3322282
Cintiqs are far superior if you need to, or like to do line art. That's all there is to it.

Tablets are fine for painting, infact they might even have a slight edge because your hand isn't on the screen, but when all is said and done, the cintiq is better because you have a more intuitive feel for making lines and brush strokes. I'd choose a cintiq over a regular tablet any day of the week.

>>3322496
>theres no objective or measurable quality to make that statement.

Professionals mostly use Cintiqs for a reason. Intuous I've only seen used in a professional context by Graphic Designers and such.

>Any hand to eye coordination issue from a tablet is all but completely mitigated in a short period of time.

Total Hogwash. Literally the biggest lie I've ever seen on this site. I say this from experience.

>I'll back that up with the study of the man who used glasses that inverted his vision only requiring ~2 weeks to adapt.

You're asking for a scientific study to back up what simple experience has provided for most digital artists. We're not going to give you a research paper to back up what we have all experienced to be the truth. Art is mostly a matter of experience and finding what works best for you, and tablet monitors work better for most artists.

However, given your overly scientific approach and patronizing tone, I suspect that you are less interested in receiving advice from experienced artists and more interested in proving yourself "right" for some god-forsaken reason I cannot begin to comprehend. And if I'm right, then you can piss right off.

I live in a house with four professional artists. There are six Cintiqs in this house. That's ALL the proof I need.

>>3322282

i won a cintiq, the 13 inch HD.

genuinely good, its not the best, but it's very good. if you can afford it then buy it.

>>3326252

Awesome. I used that for a couple of years before upgrading to a 22 inch. Really jump started my digital art skills.

>>3326212
>Professionals mostly use Cintiqs for a reason. Intuous I've only seen used in a professional context by Graphic Designers and such.
Those are nice weasel words and all but it's willfully ignorant to say that there aren't top-tier pros that don't use intuous.

>Total Hogwash. Literally the biggest lie I've ever seen on this sit
You say that on a website that regularly denies the existence of the holocaust? Either you're a denier yourself or congratulations are in order. That is, congratulations for staying on 4chan a whole week!

>You're asking for a scientific study to back up what simple experience has provided for most digital artists...
I'm sorry it took you until this late in life to realize "muh anecdotes" are neither convincing nor persuasive. Wrapping them up in platitudes like
>Art is mostly a matter of experience and finding what works best for you
Doesn't help those you can see right through your pretexts. You have a crutch, you need a crutch, the industry is filled with lazy people who fell ass backwards into their job and need that crutch as well. It's okay to admit that anon, if not to us then simply to yourself. Else you might keep up this seething desperation to justify your own actions as an objective benefit.

>I live in a house with four professional artists
Nothing could hurt your ethos more. You're not such a successful artist that you're living on your own, Neither are your room mates. If anything that makes your argument 4 times as weak, not stronger.

>>3326212
>Intuous I've only seen used in a professional context by Graphic Designers and such.
Worked in two major game companies so far

only ones that use cintiqs are a handful of illustrators or concept artists.

95% of all artists use intuos medium

>>3322496

>theres no objective or measurable quality to make that statement.

There are 2 problems: hand coordination and tablets smaller than monitors.

With a tablet you're forced to zoom when you need precision, and you get lost in details. There are tools that help, precision mode, lazy nezumi, tool stabilization, but drawing with the tablet is still harder than drawing on paper.

Lol at the autistic niggers in this thread that demand scientific peer reviewed studies to back up the claim that screen tablets are superior. Just fucking try it out for yourself, if you like it and can afford one then buy one, otherwise don't

>>3328996
>With a tablet you're forced to zoom when you need precision, and you get lost in details

Actually you don't. If I want precision I have a hotkey that changes the size of my brush. Besides you should regularly be zooming out anyway just like you step away from a canvas.

It seems to me that those who are having trouble with normal pads are those who have never taken the time to properly learn the software they are working with. I mean some never design their own brushes on the fly or look outside the brush tools while complaining at the same time that digital can't do the things you can easily do by looking outside the brush tools.

>>3328589
Not the other anon, but

>You're not such a successful artist that you're living on your own

is the dumbest argument I've ever heard. It's not a measure of skill or even a measure of connection to the industry. Shit maybe they live in a expensive city, maybe they're frugal, either way it's no indication that they never worked for so-so AAA studio.

>>3329031
>If I want precision I have a hotkey that changes the size of my brush

What? I'm talking about line precision.
Tablets are smaller than monitors. This means that the lines you see in your monitor are bigger than the ones you actually draw with your hand on your tablet. That's why it feels unnatural and you tend to zoom.

Again, there are things that while they don't solve the problem, they help: bigger tablets, software like lazy nezumi, the wacom precision mode that makes you draw 1:1. But the point is that this is a specific tablet problem that you don't have with a cintiq.

>>3329093
>I'm talking about line precision.
Then you just need to learn to draw better. Not trying to insult you here, honestly.

>>3329099

If you have good precision with an intuous you're going to have even better precision with a cintiq.

>>3329103
I don't have precision issues though so if that is the only reason to get a Cintiq then I guess I don't need one.

>>3329105
Because you only paint with it probably and you're not concerned about line-art.

>>3329121
That statement shows me that you are an amateur.

>>3329105

I don't care if you're Kim Jung Gi, you're still going to have more accuracy with a more accurate tool. You probably haven't worked with a screen tablet enough to make a sound assessment. I have worked with a regular tablet since the early 2000's. Perfectly comfortable working with one, and I thought screen tablets where a meme for years. I tried one out and I was not impressed. It felt awkward since I was so used working with my regular tablet.

But then I got the chance to work with a big screen tablet for an extend period for free when I loaned my friend's cintiq as he moved abroad. It honestly took a couple of weeks before I could fully adjust but after that period it just clicked. If you think I'm just shit well that's fine, I'm not going to try to convince you further.

>>3329128
Anon. The general consensus seems to be that tablets are more accurate than cintiqs. Anyway, your art is not going to become better from having a cintiq, artists draw with their brain. Stop shilling a questionable tool most can't even afford.

The CINTIQ is so far from my reality, that I dont known what I should think about this.

>>3329223
it's the cost of a car. it's an investment but you should at least be planning to put down a lot of money for art. if you want to work primarily digitally I don't see how it's not a feesible goal for most western people.

>>3329216
>The general consensus seems to be that tablets are more accurate than cintiqs.

Wrong. Where have you gotten this impression?


>Anyway, your art is not going to become better from having a cintiq, artists draw with their brain.

So you're saying the tool doesn't matter. Okay, go ahead and ink a drawing with a mouse or a trackpad.


>Stop shilling

I won't, thank you. It's not like I am getting paid for Wacom for writing this.

>a questionable tool

Hardly questionable when used by a lot of industry pros.

>most can't even afford.

So what? Shit argument.

>>3329243
>Where have you gotten this impression?
Congratulation on not even reading the replies in here. Your only counter arguments seems to have been that you need to zoom in for some reason and that's hard for you.

The only one having an argument here is you while having a hard time dealing with people's opinions. Nobody gives a fuck if you prefer cintiqs and any artist can figure out on their own what tools the need.

Stop making shitty threads.

>>3329253

>Congratulation on not even reading the replies in here.
Your only counter arguments seems to have been that you need to zoom in for some reason and that's hard for you.

I've read every single reply in this thread and many other discussions and I fail to see the consensus you're speaking of. And no, that wasn't me by the way. I can work with a intuos just fine.

>The only one having an argument here is you while having a hard time dealing with people's opinions. Nobody gives a fuck if you prefer cintiqs and any artist can figure out on their own what tools the need.

no u

>Stop making shitty threads.

It doesn't make much sense that I would be OP since I have expressed my opinion rather clearly.

>>3329216
>The general consensus

Sure.
How many professional artists prefer the tablet?

This thread is a waste of time.

Does anyone in this thread have firsthand advice/experience for the best mobile workstation? Torn between the surface pro 2017 version or I guess the cintiq mobilestudio. Not as impressed with the cintiq engine concept to wait so would rather just buy something now. Tired of watching the same pros/cons, but feel like if the surface is just more convenient/efficient then i'll use it more when mobile.

>>3329081
>charitable leaps of logic
Or... not

>>3328923

Well, I've worked around (2D) animators for years now and 95% of them use Cintiqs.

If they're manipulating 3D models or working in a 3D space, then they're using the tablets for a different purpose. I usually use my mouse to interact with 3D models, except for the times I've played around with Zbrush.

>only ones that use cintiqs are a handful of illustrators or concept artists.

Well there you go then. In my business that's pretty much everybody.

>>3328589

If you're the person I was arguing with before, then I was right to tell you to piss off. If you're someone else, piss off anyway.

>it's willfully ignorant to say that there aren't top-tier pros that don't use intuous.

Oh I know. But they're freaks and far outside the norm. More power to 'em though.

>Total Hogwash. Literally the biggest lie I've ever seen on this sit
You say that on a website that regularly denies the existence of the holocaust? Either you're a denier yourself or congratulations are in order. That is, congratulations for staying on 4chan a whole week!

What is hyperbole?

>You have a crutch, you need a crutch,

Having good tools is a crutch. Got it. Do you have brain damage BTW?

>the industry is filled with lazy people who fell ass backwards into their job and need that crutch as well.

HAHAHA! Every single person I know who's made it into this industry has fought tooth and nail for everything they ever got.

>You're not such a successful artist that you're living on your own, Neither are your room mates. If anything that makes your argument 4 times as weak, not stronger.

You know how I know you've never lived in LA? One of my roomates has worked for WB Nick and Dreamworks. Also this apartment is huge.

>>3329010

>Lol at the autistic niggers in this thread that demand scientific peer reviewed studies to back up the claim that screen tablets are superior. Just fucking try it out for yourself, if you like it and can afford one then buy one, otherwise don't

THANK YOU.

>>3329216
>The general consensus seems to be that tablets are more accurate than cintiqs.

You can't just make stuff up and claim it's the general consensus, Anon.

>>3329507
Not an argument

>>3329514
Also not an argument.

>>3329225

It is more expansive then car here.
Minimum gain is 900/month.
A car cost is 1500 ~ 3000.
CINTIQ cost is 15k ~ 25k.

Totally out from my reality.

>>3329548
>CINTIQ cost is 15k ~ 25k.

wtf? then just buy it on amazon at 1k $ and have it shipped, how can it cost 15k in your country?

>>3329559

If I buy on Amazon, price raise to 30k.

>how can it cost 15k in your country?

Taxes...

>>3329548
>>3329559
>>3329594

Uhm guys, none of you have said what currency you're talking about...

>>3329599

R$

Not is because currency.
Otherwise cost would be 2500 ~ 3000.

Expansive too, but not a murder.

>>3329611
Rupies?

>>3329594
>Taxes...

>3000% taxes

da fuck? where is this ? how?

>>3329637
Socialism fambino, gotta tax everything for the (((public good))).

>>3329648
Answer the question

>>3329658
Yes

Anyone here recommend any cintiq alternatives? I'm looking at the new Huion 16" and the XP pen 16".

Both 8k levels pressure sensitivity and decent displays. I've never used a pen display before but I would much rather spend 500 beaver bucks than almost 1500

>>3322291
idk, i don't even use mine that much, but a few weeks of practice and I'm already able to make stuff i'm happy with. its really just a matter of getting comfortable with it.
for the price, i think the intuos is fantastic

is it worth it to get a refurbished cintiq 13hd or just buy a new laptop and a cintiq pro 16 if i move around a lot

>>3329854
13inch HD is a worthy device and served me well for over a year until I upgraded, but if you've got the budget for a 16 inch... the bigger screen will probably be more comfortable to draw on.

>>3329637
>>3329658

>where is this ? how?

Communism.
We "voted" on communists.

Open your eyes.
We know how communists works.

>>3329858
what did you upgrade to? I feel like i won't be upgrading anytime soon, so the 16+laptop is steep but seems better for me since i move around for college and back home

>>3329505
As opposed to what? You made the false dichotomy.

>>3329710
How big is your monitor? If over 20" , I would go for a similar sized pen display.

As for brand, Probably the two you mentioned and UGEE, are the most recurring recommendations for alternatives.

Note that while you're getting a steep "discount" buying off brand, you pay for it in functionality. As shitty as all drivers for tablets seem to be, Wacom updates there's most frequently, so if there's a bug, it's more likely to persist in an off brand than a wacom product.

>>3329710
The Huion 15.6 inch tablet uses a 6-bit monitor with dithering, so kinda shitty for the price compared to the XP-Pen Artist 16/16 Pro.
>>3329937
Probably avoid UGEE. The Huion GT-191 is probably the best option for ~400/500 with screen size but without express buttons. Sometimes on sale on newegg for like 420 USD, and according to Parkablogs' second review achieves roughly 100% sRGB.

>>3329886

A 22 inch Cintiq. It's lovely, but it is not portable.

>>3329937

I can't speak for any of the other brands, but avoid UGEE if at all possible. I had to use them at my last job and they are TERRIBLE. All your lines will be rough and jittery, and the monitor itself sucks.

They cut my productivity in half. I am not even joking.

I still have a trusty ancient Cintiq 12WX, ask me anything.

what about the ipad pro + penc?
pr surface pro 4/5 ?

>>3330174
How big is your viewing monitor? If different, than by how much and does it affect you workflow?

>>3329430

Just buy the screen 24 or 32.

And then build a mini itx machine and plug the cintiq to it.... It's going to run way better than a shitty prebuilt that wacom would come up with.

You can make a mini itx computer that's the size of a ps4, there's legitimately ZERO reason to buy a cintiq engine you are an absolute autist if you do

>>3330343
IPad pro is superior if you can adjust to the workflow.

Example ipad pro would be good for illustrator and comic work ( procreate/csp/mediabang) granted you are okay with the 12.9 size. It's even more worth it if you can adjust both to a screen tablet and off screen ( desktop) you can always get a cintiq later ( big boi 20""+)

Otherwise if you need Photoshop and only use one system and your doing more than just illustrations, surface pro.

The ipad pro is the one true portable drawing device hands down.

>>3328589
Gianofag you need to restrain yourself and never enter tablet threads again. Get out.

>>3330668
My desktop monitor is 24", I turn off the cintiq's monitor and use it like an intuos if I need to paint and color.
The 12wx has shitty colors, but except that and the dust trying to get under the glass (I taped all the fucking holes around the screen) and the parallax and the wonky cursor at the edges, well, it's just perfect for sketching and doing linework.

And don't remind me the times we only had two points of calibration.

Btw, I use it so much lately I named it "dust collector". Fucking corporate jobs man.

Cintiq is too expensive, but I am interested in screen tablets, what's a cheaper alternative?

>>3325713
>he fell for fit meme and gaming chair meme

you guys realize there are more options than either a giant pen monitor or awkward pen tablet? you can get a great tablet PC for under $800. in fact most tablet two in ones and tablet PCs have pen pressure these days.

my HP spectre was about 350 used and i use it for school, drawing, TV, browsing, everything

>>3330822
Thanks for replying. I had thought of snagging a really old model like the 12 on ebay, just to see, but it seems like it'll be more useful to me to buy this gen from your description.

Got a 22hd, thought it was a good size and decent price point.

I just got a XP-Pen Artist 13.3. I can't get the driver to work on my laptop... It won't detect the pen.

Can anyone help?

>>3331078
Oh yeah, I installed the driver from the USB drive that came with it, and I've tried installing without firewall/anti-virus.

>>3331078
>>3331080
Nevermind. Got it to work. Like an idiot, I was connecting the tablet wrong to my laptop. :P

It's preference. It does feel natural to draw directly but I think this is a placebo effect artists make up or are just used to in industry standards. I use my intuous more just for the convenience.

>>3329507
>HAHAHA! Every single person I know who's made it into this industry has fought tooth and nail for everything they ever got.
Nice dramatics. Did know people were still fighting tooth and nail in 1st world 21st century liberal government countries

Fact: The majority of people in this industry have either
a) come from middle class backgrounds
b) gone through art school
c) been drawing since an early age
or
d) all of the above

In other words they have been coasting on head starts and stable support since an early childhood having every opportunity and second chance handed to them and receiving the privilege of guidance granted to a very fortunate few. All so that they (You and "all the people you've known") can turn a life time of mediocrity into a base level of commercial and creative viability.

If you can fake it for 20 years you'll make it eventually ;^)

Is Huion GT-220 V2 good or is it just another cheap sham product?

>cheaper than Cintiq 13HD
>8,5 inch bigger screen

Almost all of the reviews on Youtube are
>so Huion sent me this thing and it's great
How can I trust the opinion of someone who didn't actually put money in it? How do I know if I'd be getting my money's worth?

>>3322282
I have a skrubby question

how do these screen tablets actually work in conjunction with a pc? do they just display your monitor, or do they have their own OS? Can you use any software you want, or do they come with their own?

>>3333813
They're just an extra monitor you connect to your PC, you're free to use whatever software you want with them.

>>3333774
there's one youtuber that sold her cintiq 13HD because the huion GT-220 V2 she was sent for free was much better (probably because it's the same but bigger)

You need to see the marks you make under the pencil you use to make them.

If I buy an ipad pro is the 12 inch a must?
Also what's the best storage?

Surfacepro 2 is cheap and can be used as much as it is convenient!
I think that it is not for professional use

Surfacepro 2 is cheap and can be used as much as it is convenient!
I think that it is not for professional use
Sorry I mistook the image size once

>>3333748

>the industry is filled with lazy people who fell ass backwards into their job and need that crutch as well.

>c) been drawing since an early age

Lazy people who stumbled into their jobs, who have been practicing their whole lives to perfect their craft?

You do have brain damage don't you?

No wait.

>All so that they (You and "all the people you've known") can turn a life time of mediocrity into a base level of commercial and creative viability.

You are only interested in tearing down other people's accomplishments by de-legitimizing them any way that you possibly can.

Do you do this to make yourself feel better about your own failures? Is that it?

I'm 100% sure that's it.

>>3333813

They run as a monitor and have drivers that basically synchronize what's on the screen with the input from the tablet. You have to calibrate them when you set them up to make sure the input from the tablet lines up with the display on the monitor.

Think of it as a tablet layered directly on top of a monitor.

as someone who wanted to switch from traditional to digital and that mostly does pencil drawings i fucking wish i saved up for something onscreen as oppose to a desktop tablet, i bought a desk tablet and its been about 2 months and i cant get use to it and dont like it very much. i dont even want to draw digitally because the disconnect for me is so bad. even when i try to recreate one of my traditional drawings it comes out worst on the computer

i dont even touch the tablet anymore desu

>>3334231
I have one of these. The pen tracking is absolute hot garbage. Doesn't always match up, despite calibration to try and deal with it.

>>3334426

I made that mistake myself. When I finally switched to tablet monitors it was like flipping a switch in my brain.

>>3334426

Only change brush to something emulate the real tool.
If you use standard tool, results will be naturally worst.

>>3329507
>Well there you go then. In my business that's pretty much everybody.
And again, game industry even among concept artists they are a rarity. Not pretty much everybody.

>>3333829
>>3334393
Okay, thanks guys

Not sure if this is the right thread for this, but I have an old Wacom Intous PTZ-930, that I use with Sketchbook 6 and it works well enough.

But I am wondering if I should look into upgrading either the tablet or switch to a different program. Any suggestions are appreciated.

>>3335260
If it works why fix it?

>>3322291
this is me, i have a intuous pen and touch since 2013, cant draw really well in it as well as in paper, when i do only digital takes almost a day for something relativlily easy, my works are tradicional lines scanned and colored in photoshop because of that. i still have a in between step that is correcting the line art in photoshop (proportions etc), print in cyan and pen it over to have a clear line.
i wanted a display tablet since i knew they exist but 1000 for a 13hd is too much for me, thinking of getting a Yiynova a new brand appearing rivaling wacom at a very nice price, still i'm always thinking and never bought one

Thinking about putting stickers on my cintiq. Whats your opinion on this?

>>3336692
As long as they are appealing, or even give you good vibes. I would.

>>3336692
what the fuck model is this? why is the workspace so fucking small?

>>3336692
I don't like putting stickers on things, I find it looks dirty if it's not paper. But you should decorate it however you want, its your cintiq, your money.

So, I have an old ass Bamboo I've been using because I was always super jewy about spending money on tablets. I finally spluged and got an Artist 10S but I've come into a huge problem: pen sensitivity doesn't fucking exist.

Now besides the fact that the given CD is useless for the drivers (cause you have to go to their site and get the newest driver anyway) and that the then downloaded up to date drivers don't detect the tablet, how the fuck do I avoid killing myself for burning $200 on this otherwise really pretty tablet?

>inb4 have you tried unplugging, plugging it in again?
Obvs yes. Tablet turns on and responds on screen, but thick to thin lines is not something that exists, Running on Win10 if that helps.

>>3322282
Is it even worth Buying a cintiq when a bigger Huion is much cheaper?

>>3336827
because huion is trash quality (i had one for a few days before i got my money refunded for the terrible quality) and the cintiq isnt
and before people go "but those have wobbly lines!" they dont if you just turn of windows freehand and then you get the best experience with digital art IMO
but you should sit in a position where you can hold it in your lap, because its gonna kill your back in a regular computer chair.

>>3336848
>it's trash
Nice claim now back it up with some substance.

>>3336712
Looks like a 22" to me.

>>3336876
Look at all that dpace being unused.shat a fucking rip.

>>3337171

Yeah I have no idea what's up with that, unless they're trying to mirror a small monitor, but why you would do that I have no idea.

>>3333829
>>3334393

I ordered the X Pen Artist Pro 16, cant wait to try it out!

>>3337185
Hope it works for you. I'm nervous about using anything that isn't Wacom at this point, but at the same time there desperately need to be more viable options on the tablet market.

>>3328923
Must be a shit game studio then. Everyone at my studio uses cintiqs, mostly 22, but a couple 27.
Are the rest of the artists at your place like UI people or something?

>>3336812
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cCI7WB-ttw

got your shit anon, windows 10 is shit because of windows ink and makes every device working on it a touch even if it isnt one.
Try video related. But for context if you go to the tablet app and check (or) uncheck a box saying window ink the sensitivity will work, but the resize short work, and vice versa. the video makes both short cuts work that dont know if it work on other programs hope it helps

>>3337616
Tell me about it. I'm still having pressure issues but I've got a much better start than I did a few days ago.
This vid didn't help too much but there was one in the suggested that fixed the problem, so if anyones planning on getting an XPPen I'm back here with this heads up.
The firmware needs to be modified for the drivers to work. I finally got mine to work so hopefully anyone else having the" tablet not found" issue can clean it up and get back to work.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxgQCmjWmR8&t=141s

So it seems like everything other than a cintiq sucks in some form or another, not to mention that coordination is just overall better ona screen tablet rather than a pen tablet. I don’t have enough for a larger cintiq and an iPad plus pencil seems to be the next best thing. The only thing is that there’s no photoshop and clip studio has a monthly fee would it still be worth it ?

>>3337934
I used a 13 inch Cintiq for over a year until I could afford enough for a 22. It's still a good investment I think. The Apple Pencil seems very nice, but the fact that the iPad can't run Photoshop is a big deal-breaker for me.

Wtf, Craig mullins is my dad and I'm using mouse. Tablet is shit unless you want beautiful strokes like John Singer Sargent or shit.

>>3337986
Yeah I wanna be able to use those programs too it’s just the cost is so unsettling for such a small screen

>>3322282
Yes, cintiq is the absolute best tool for artist who makes digital art.

>>3337986
To be perfectly honest I think that the ipad and the apple pencil is a pretty solid setup. They manage to make procreate feel just as comfortable as photoshop. I actually tend to find that sketching in procreate is more comfortable then my cintiq/just as natural feeling as paper. Plus you can take it out and about with you which is kinda nice for plein air or commute drawing or whatever else.
And it records video of when you draw which is pretty neat.

I got by with an Intuos for a long time. I have a Cintiq now and I probably wouldn't go back. There are downsides to a Cintiq. The ergonomics aren't as good. If you aren't careful you can scratch up the Cintiq. Your hand can cover up menus and such.

If you're comfortable with an Intuos, stick with it.

I have a Cintiq Companion Hybrid, pretty much acts like a 13hd but with a battery. However, there are no official Android updates for it unless you prefer version JellyBean forever.

>>3333831
Literally anything's better than using a 13 inch screen for digital art, though.

>>3337934
I've loaned a Surface Pro from my university and honestly, if it didn't track poorly I'd prefer the pen nib + drawing surface to my Cintiq. But the Surface has wobbly ntrig tracking so now I have to hope someone else brings out a screen tablet with a less thick cover that doesn't use the scratchiest hard plastic nibs possible honestly why the fuck has Wacom kept the same shit nib for 20 years

>>3339855
Was it one of the newer surface pros? From what I've seen from testing em they're much better than they used to be. I use a surface pro 3 and the wobble is a bit annoying but I'm too poor to upgrade

>>3339993
Yeah it's a new one, the wobble still makes it almost unusably bad and the only way around it is cranked up line smoothing in Photoshop. Glad I'm mostly using it for note taking and sound/video editing rather than actually trying to use it for art because the only good thing about it is that the friction is a bit closer to what you'd expect of a pen/pencil on paper and you can't even take advantage of that because the slow, precise lines that are easier to do with the added friction are exactly what's being ruined by the ntrig wobble.
Also, fuck trying to draw with the official keyboard plugged in, shit gets in the way. I've seen how much that thing costs and at that price point it should be wireless if they're serious about the Surface being used as a digital art device.

Loish alternates between a Cintiq and an Intuos Large and her work on either is completely indistinguishable.

>>3340056
You can do that with a mouse if you put the effort in, so why buy any tablet?
Oh right, convenience. CTRL+Z goes from my most used keys to something I barely touch at all depending on which device I'm working with. I had an Intuos for 8 years beforehand and feel like I can say, with confidence, that it wouldn't have even been a huge improvement over a mouse if the pen wasn't pressure sensitive.

>>3339993
>>3340053
Here's how bad the surface 4's ntrig is for drawing: the cursor actually moves about 2 full millimeters away from where it is as soon as the pen starts actually drawing. This is what happens when I line up the cursor with a dot and start drawing, I'm not moving the pen to the left at all, that's the cursor immediately jumping there the second I put pressure on the nib.

>>3340094
>why buy any tablet
Two words: carpal tunnel

>>3340183
Real smartguys draw with an ergonomic vertical mouse

>>3340139
Correction: Surface 2017
Apparently other ntrig pens like the Bamboo Ink and Adonit Ink are suitable replacements to get around the cursor jumping problem, but the line jitter on these pens are reportedly about as bad as the Surface 4 pen. It's probably best to wait for the next Surface to come out and get some reviews if drawing is your concern, or just get an ipad or whole-ass Cintiq 2/mobile studio pro, because people are even recommending older Surface pens over the 2017 one.

Remember the videos of people drawing with ketchup on frites? Or the jew guy using Milky Bar for doing his studies?

Yeah, so point is:

Can you draw on/using anything? Yes.

Should you?

No. Absolutely no unless you are still a student and have fuckton of time that you value a lot less than money.

Tablet isn't super responsive and easily customizable? Well, duh, you can work with that, if you spend some more time and effort during drawing to compensate and also go through all the settings to find something workable.

Screen isn't positioned where you draw? Ok, you can compensate that, you "just" will have to spend additional time to adjust and unlearn intuitive "look at the paper" kind of deal.

Same goes with everything in life. You don't have money for new car? Drive 20 year old one, it will still get you into destination. Will it be less comfortable, more expensive in exploitation and something can fuck up along the way? Probably, maybe not. But hey, it's better than public transport or going by foot, right?


Oh and also same goes for traditional art, BUT here tools actually matter. There's no way your cheap ass paints will look better than high-pigmented expensive ones. But your art is shit anyways since you are on /ic/, so who cares.