/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

>>2203225
chicken scratching from good artists comes from the animation side

i forget the reason, but chicken scratching your drawings there is a good thing for a reason, but i could not tell you off the top of my head.

>>2203288
to small to tell if its a photo or a painting, the compression on it is fucking horrible.
but if it isn't a full painting, i'm going to say its also not an unaltered photo either.

I don't have much money to enroll drawing class, nor purchase statue to practice how to draw.

how do I learn with few money

>>2203667
What's better for sculpting detailed miniatures clay or polymer clay, I'm looking for something that will hold the detail well and will be somewhat easy to work with. I've worked with clay a lot but never brought it down to a miniature level( around the size of a dnd or warhammer model) and I've just bought some polymer clay but I can't figure out how to use it( seems very different from clay to me) should I just try and power through and use the polymer or would clay ( something I have experince in) be just as good?

>>2203687
pirate...
look up some youtube shit, vilppu, proko (as much as i think he is a twat, never pay for his shit, what he makes you pay for is him not talking and just drawing... you can youtube that if you want, and one that he sold to people he fucked up on) and others.

also, figure draw, you got google, google female body builders, you get people who show off muscle without getting the roided up motherfucklers that male body buidlers are.

there are some more things but other people will probably tell you.

>>2203691
what color is it?

>>2203693
The polymer clay I bought is white I have Darwi Classic and Darwi roc but the texture is really different from clay and so is how it works.

>>2203695

sorry, i assumed you were using sculpey
i cant speak from experience in using it much, as when i bought it to play around with was at the beginning of my hands turning to shit, but playing around with it in my hands felt a lot like pottery clay, minus the stickiness and the tendency to crack because it got dry.

watch this person
https://www.youtube.com/user/juliankhor/videos

they use sculpty my take on it from the limited use i got was it is firm, holds detail well, isnt prone to cracking, and while the grey is hard to work with and the pink is to soft, mixing the two yields a very workable and firm result, what you get is purely your own preference.

based on work i seen done in this medium, i would say this over other forms of clay sculpture.

>>2203700
Thank you sculpey looks like something I'd like to try, going to buy some today.
Also since this is a question thread, what happened to your hands?

>>2203715
tendonitis, at least that's what the doctor and specialist said when i still had insurance, some signs of carpal tunnel showed up, just looked up with something came out, its been going on 5 years of a constant dull pain, and even longer than that for the other part of my hands problem...

apparently if i do anything with my fingers that requires grip strength, it randomly causes severe pain and it takes about 2-4 days to go away, making anything that requires the use of my hands damn near impossible.

i believe there is something worse wrong with my hands, but the doctor i went to did not give a fuck, and the specialist i went to told me anything wrong with them is out of his ability to help, just stop doing what makes them hurt.

>>2203718
Have you tried or asked your doctors about cortisone injections?

>>2203667
Is everyone using references all the time or do u kinda stop using them when u get way better?

Maybe bad example but w/e

>>2203752

>>2203754
>>2203752

>>2203752

I don't think people ever stop using them, they're always useful for strengthening a piece you give a shit about.

Drawing without them is fun though.

>>2203751
no insurance anymore, can't get government assistance because i'm labeled a dependant under my parents so no affordable care act help here, and without that, the cheapest insurance that i can get is around 750$ a month, and i cant make an 8 grand+ a year payment.

just looked up what that is, i have been taking 12 ibuprofen a day for years, only stopping a few months ago due to my own stupidity and cutting my thumb bad on a mandolin, anyone who reads these threads may remember that... it took 12 hours for the bleeding to stop, this was largely due to i believe ibuprofen because it acts as a blood thinner, than when i changed bandage, it took another 12 for it to stop, and it took another 2 days past that for me to be able to bring myself to remove the bandage again. yea fun shit worrying if i require a doctor when i have no insurance and it would cost upwards 20 grand to fix.

also, before it comes up, my hands are one in a long string of my body telling me to go fuck myself.

>>2203752
>>2203754
>>2203756
no you dont stop using reference if you are able to get a reference, now...

the first one is likely an Homage, the second is expression reference, the berserk one, i honestly want to say that some of those arent referenced off evil dead, some are just coincidence, lets go from the top left down than to the next set over
not
could be
not
not
not
probably not
could be
not
not
could be
because of how much a spiral of souls pops up in japanese things and some western, im going to say not
white hair, not
i want to say no on this just because its a monster that has a big mouth
most likely not
most likely not
the skeletal viking, its possible.
no, we see monsters with human faces in them or on them allot... though the inspiration for that trend could have come from this.

unless he came out and said thats where he got it from i can chalk this up to coincidence as many of these are common poses and compositions.

>>2203756
most of this is pretty far fetched

>>2203756
>MFW some of the drawings are actually older than their ref counterparts

any good resource and tips for foreshortening?

So, I started on this peice a couple of months ago and only got to the final sketch stage. I've just picked it up again and I realise this is gonna take a long ass time.

How do you guys keep motivated when making something that takes forever?

where do I anatomy

I posted this in than water color thread but it's good to get more opinions:
What is a good brand of watercolor for more of an illustration type of drawing? I've been thinking of either getting:
Winsor and Newton Cotmans
Kuretake Gansai Tambi
Sakura Koi Travel set

I'm looking for something that isn't "chalky."
I've been using tons of random student-grade ones and I'm comfortable with them. Id like to get something a little better.
Something less than $40 would be good. Pans are preferable to tubes for me.

>>2203754

just watch a video of KJG on superani drawing.

momentarily hate yourself and realise that references are not required if you build a strong visual library.

>>2203842
Major Tom to ground control!

Is anyone on cgpeers?

Despite having a good seed to leech ratio, and picking out torrents that have over 50 seeds, i cant seem to connect to peers and download them.

I know this is semi-art related, but whats the problem?

How critical was drawing from life for you? My observation skills suck and I'm working on that.

>>2204104
one of the most important practices because it forces you to think about all the fundamentals; perspective, form, composition, light, etc, not to mention how things actually look as opposed to your second-hand recycled impression from photographs or stylized work.

About to start practice coloring for the first time. And my favorite artists with the best colors is Huang Jia-Wei (pic) and Kr0n. So, how do I go about learning to paint like them? And was this pic done traditionally? Please tell me anything, even if it takes years of practice to learn how to emulate their color, I want to know.

I have still have not read about color theory, nor color themes. Nor do I know anything about coloring digitally. Is there such a thing as realistic coloring, and this would be considered stylized?

Can you learn to draw using only digital methods? I want to get into drawing/painting and I already have a tablet, but physical drawing/painting isn't really attractive to me.

>>2204218
>Can you learn to draw using only digital methods?
Technically, but chances are you'll see much slower progress if you have to wrestle with software, precision issues with the tablet, and of course the hand-eye disconnect. Get a large stack of paper and a pencil, and at least learn your basic mark making skills that way first. This doesn't mean you aren't allowed to work digitally, but if you do try to avoid something that might be a crutch in lieu of learning.

>>2204270
Thanks for the tips. I've had a few art classes so I've done a good bit of work in physical media, including drawing real life nude models (but I still consider myself kind of not that good). I'm really not a fan of the mess and I'd probably practice more if I did everything digitally.

I've used photoshop every day for years for general image editing, so I'm pretty familiar with the "how to use it" side of things, like brushes, blending, erasing, layers, channels, and all of that, so I feel like the only thing I really need to get used to is the feeling of using a tablet itself.

Would I be right in assuming that I could do all the basic "learn to draw" exercises like upside down drawing, blind contour drawing, and things like that on a tablet? I wouldn't really mind the increased learning curve it might bring.

I don't mean to sound dismissive or anything, it's just that I'd enjoy the whole process more if I didn't need to waste a ton of paper.

>>2204303
>Would I be right in assuming that I could do all the basic "learn to draw" exercises like upside down drawing, blind contour drawing, and things like that on a tablet? I wouldn't really mind the increased learning curve it might bring.
Yes, you technically can. I'd advise against cementing yourself in only digital tools though - a lot of learning happens when you play around with different media that forces you to rethink your habits and usual approach. If you want to digital paint, learning how traditional paints work will go a long way to make your work look like a painting, and not some amateur coloring of linework.

At the very least, I'd make sure you're not working on a tiny tablet for ergonomics. I'd also invest in a sketchbook that you carry around everywhere you go - you don't want to be restricted to only draw where you have your computer and tablet set up.

>>2204331
Alright, I'll probably check out physical stuff at some point for painting in particular, since I have a lot of regular drawing supplies. I'm just concerned about not really having the space for canvases and things like that. I got a pretty nice huion with a 9" x 6" active area and it doesn't feel cramped at all.

What are your thoughts on Self Publishing a comic book?
If I have the story all written out, how long do you think it would take me to complete a first draft? One year? 6 months? Just ink, no color.

I was thinking: I write the story, illustrate it, get a first draft...get it critiqued then a second draft...then finally go to kickstarter to raise money to publish it and make swag for supporters.

What do you guys think?

What is a good way/place to find an aspiring art bro who will be honest with me, and I with him, in shitting on ourselves and each other every single day and work, while helping each other in order to get good?
I need a motivational partner.

>>2204367
art gf/bf
or introduce your bf/gf to art

>>2204373
god damn, as I was typing my questions, I realized the whole "till art do us part" kind of vibe it was emitting.
I'm totally asexual, so that isn't possible.

>>2204367
There is some kind of art buddy section on this forum
http://www.sycra.net/forum/
I don't know much about it but this forum seems pretty active, maybe you'll have some luck.

How do I make my guidelines work and look balanced ? I know all the basics and learned perspective but no matter what I do I can't seem to make it work and make it seem balanced. I'm not giving up I just wanna know what I can do to improve

>>2203848
Bump, I would also like to know,are their any preferred anatomy books ?

>>2203667
how do i know if its a circle in perspective with inverted thickness or an oval with standard thickness?

>>2204408
>make my guidelines work and look balanced ?
I'm not even sure what that means. Best post an example.

>>2204416
You asked this before. The surrounding context will tell you if it's an oval or a circle in perspective. If there is no context then it literally doesn't matter.

>>2204421
I mean make them look equal and symmetric
I'll post some examples when I get home which will be a while but I'll do it

>>2203837
well dont comic books, you dont see foreshortening used a whole lot, at least to dramatic effect outside of them.

>>2203842
i personally value output over polish.
lets say for instance i want to animate something, i would take a well done animatic over a finished product just because far less work needs to be done
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKTGTyxdsoU
i wouldn't bother "finishing" work until i'm either fast enough to belt it out in an hour or so, or until i'm good enough my gains in skill dont make all prior work look like shit.

>>2204415
>>2203848
vilppu does a video series that should be fairly good.

keep in mind, know the major forms and than move on to minor, no point in learning everything at once when you wont remember it.

>>2203871
in all honesty, i would go to dickblick, look at the brands they have, then look up youtube videos on those brands and see people use them, my bet is that ic knows shit overall about watercolor much less trying to get good watercolors for cheap.

if i knew where the point of diminishing returns would be for watercolor i would tell you.

>>2203891
his ability to do it from memory comes from knowing what needs to be there to look right, you would be stupid if you think a reference would make his work even better.

>>2204085
check their white list, the program you are useing/the version may be blacklisted.

>>2204121
>>2204104
it helps, but its not really important... lets put it this way, you get a good artist and put them in front of a photo or an object people who think they can tell the difference largely cant, and with a bad artist well, they are shit to begin with so its hard to tell there too.

i would still say drawing from life is better, but its nowhere near the extent most people make it out to be.

>>2204376
>I'm totally asexual, so that isn't possible.
Very sorry, I just assumed the opposite. I think you should do the same but to someone that you are related to. Or possibly a friend at the university or at work. It can be hard to bring up the topic if you're not in a certain situation, and sometimes you do not have a reason to even talk about personal hobbies. However, I don't think it is bad to give it a shot. Good luck, I hope you find a good friend who likes art or is interested in trying it out. Maybe you can ask for someone's email on here. You won't be able to meet them in person, though.

>>2204216
honestly i would say dont learn from Kr0n just because some of the images use an abusive amount of filters over them, as for the other guy, desaturate the fuck out of your colors it seems. pick few colors, and make sure they are more earthy, and go from there. just from the image you posted, it looks water color, but it may not be.

also note the lines he uses, they add a texture to the color, its not the color itself that you like most likely.

>>2204337
the biggest failing of digital is how new it is, in 5 years something could come out that fundamentally changes how you do digital work where as with traditional, we more or less know every way to put medium on canvas/paper backed up by hundreds of years of people doing art... digitall you got maybe a good 15 years of how art is done now on computers.

everything traditional can be done digitally, but i would never advise learning digitally as a primary way... at least outside of learning colors, as that shits expensive traditional.

>>2204344
write the story and do a very VERY rough drawing first draft and see if shit works. if its go onto second draft and make it a bit cleaner and if nothing needs improvement go onto inking and publish, the best way would be a digital copy as more profit to you and small print runs if you decide to show up and conventions, kickstart a print run if you really want to and make the swag they get things like signatures, a doodle, and for a high tier an illustration.

>>2204373
yea... no, never do this with someone you put your dick in if you ever want to put the dick in them again.

>>2204376
>>2204367
post practice stuff on /ic/ and get it torn apart, never post personal work, that you need someone who knows you and not an anon on 4chan.

How do I balance study + practice? I feel like I get lost / overwhelmed in doing both.

Also what exactly does it mean if I feel like I do rather well when drawing with references but cannot draw at all without one? Is this a bad habit as well?

How much time should I be dedicating to practicing at an absolute beginner entry level?

I have a lot of free time in my hands but I don't want to overdo it this is one of the cases where more isn't better.

im going to start a master copy and the red is something like 3000x4000 pixels. do i really need to work in the 6kx8k or 9kx12k? my comp wont be able to handle that

>>2204495
>How do I balance study + practice? I feel like I get lost / overwhelmed in doing both.
Make a plan and stick to it. Maybe you have X time to work on art in a day/week. Set a fraction of time to be devoted to study and the rest to practice. Make the decision then don't worry about it for a month or two, then reassess that ratio. Maybe you're at a point where a 40/60 split of study to practice is optimal. Maybe your visual library needs a ton of development, and a 70/30 split might work better. Experiment.

>Also what exactly does it mean if I feel like I do rather well when drawing with references but cannot draw at all without one? Is this a bad habit as well?
Everybody from total amateur to working professional can produce better work with references to consult. Your visual library will always be limited compared to the vast amount of stuff out there in the world - not to mention various nuanced lighting effects that are difficult to predict but easier to observe.

If you feel like nothing you produce without refs is any good, then you probably aren't practicing enough, and you probably aren't thinking critically enough during your studies. It's surprisingly easy to do a study where you essentially just copy without analyzing or learning. If you aren't thinking about the 'whys' when doing a study, you won't be learning as efficiently.

It's also possible that the main problem is your grasp over perspective, basic forms, and construction. Are you able to observe a reference that shows an object from one camera angle, and then you draw it from a completely different camera angle? If not, then you want to focus on training your ability to envision and rotate forms at will. Construction is super useful here as you can simplify complex forms into a series of boxes, or even one large box as it has a clear X,Y, and Z axis.

>>2204528
As much time as you're willing to put in, but start small. Dedicate something like 30min everyday. Try to stick to the same start and end time each day as well. Do that for two weeks. Make it a habit. Once the habit is in place, you can slowly ramp up the time spent drawing. Maybe add 15 minutes, then lock that in for another two weeks. Then another 15 for the next two weeks, etc. Repeat until you reach your target. Avoid doing too much too quickly or else you'll just burn out and not draw for months.

When just starting out, you probably need time to build up neuronal connections for the hand eye coordination needed. I haven't read any literature on the topic, but I imagine practicing 8hrs a day compared to 1hr won't speed up that process 8x. I could be wrong though, as I'm only speculating.

>>2204542
3000px for the short side is plenty. You could technically work smaller than that too, though you won't be able to get into details as well, and a lot of brushes don't behave ideally when they're used at small sizes.

Work as big as your computer can comfortably handle.

>>2204556
ill try to go 25% bigger and see how that goes. im doing brierstadt sunlight and shadow if it matters

What are some great measuring techniques? I often use mi pencil to do so, measuring the length and height (In units, of course) that the pose will occupy before I draw it.

Are there any books which specify on measuring? Any advice or tips are also greatly appreciated.

>>2204616
use a ruler :^)

how does a paint box work on photoshop? Which way is hue and saturation etc.

I would go to /co/ but I decided to ask you guys first

What are some really good mystery comics? Im not talking like 50s detective work but the nitty gritty stuff. (50s detective stuff works too)

Who are the mystery comic masters?

What happened to the Sakimichan thread? I've seen similar threads dissappear before, are they not allowed, and does the op get a warning?

>>2204776

Mods delete them

And I hope the OP gets perma'd next time because those threads always spiral into a shitfest.

Warm ups. What kind of warm ups should I do? What kind of warm ups do you guys do?

Learning how to properly draw the human body is an incredibly daunting task and "just doing it" is a heavy order. There has to be an artist who presents it in a simple form, simple and easy to digest and work along with. I've heard Loomis, Bridgeman, Hogarth, Hampton and Vilppu but there are so many different people to learn from, and they all approach it so radically different it feels like. In the end they're all drawing the same thing, and any time I try to read through one of those books I just worry and panic and not draw anything.

>>2204783
In vilppu's drawing manual he works you throw drawing bodies starting with the torso with circular forms. sometimes I try to do a handful of those and some sketches off pinterest pictures. try to incorporate it into your routine, like taking a shower and brushing your teeth everyday.

Do alot of you have depression?

>>2204806
drawing solves my depression but makes me anxious

What's the best way to learn of to draw poses and add dynamism?
Is it to study poses? To speed draw models posing?

i just put a few good scratches in my intuos pen small. how do I fix it? can it be buffed out?

going to be a long shot but does anyone have a torrent of the masters of anatomy book?

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1302528630/masters-of-anatomy

>>2204694
i dont know any, however you may want to clarify, do you want the mystery to be something only the people in the story can figure out, or do you want to be given all the information too so you may have a legit shot at figuring it out?

>>2204776
>>2204779
for fuck sake the last time i looked at them they were at 25 grand, now they are at 33...

they get removed because they devolve into breaking global rules all the time.

>>2204783
warmups are really just you getting use to using the shit so gesture, 5 minute quick sketches that kind of deal is a good warmup.

>>2204806
yes... got to say most of us get it at some point due to art, every one does due to life but art specifically because the first time you overtake your ability to see flaws will feel fantastic, but than once your eye sees the flaws again... thats a low blow...

>>2204820
um... that word mean study dynamic shit? try looking up boxing stills, or even just sports in general.

if that wasn't it, then tell me what you are looking for and ill see if i can think of something.

>>2204819
same, though it doesn't really "solve" mine, it just takes the edge off a little

>>2204454
thank you. using utorrent was the issue. i switched to bittorrent and now it loads perfectly.

Hi /ic/, could you give me some tips? I was starting with animu and been drawing faces the most, so the style has been imprinted in my mind. Now, when I try to draw from life, I can manage the bodies more or less, but faces are a nasty pile of misaligned symbols. I think I know at least some of the basics of the shapes and placement of facial features, but what I get is always a manga-esque parody of what I try to draw. What should I do to get rid of this? Should I first practice naked skulls? Try breaking all heads and faces down into shapes and blocks? Focus on drawing e.g. only eyes or mouths?

Reading the first link in the sticky says "If you can't draw from memory you are a beginner, no matter if you can copy photorealistic portrait" or something like that.
My question is: is being beginner if I can draw decently anatomy from memory but can't photo realistic copy even an apple?

Not exactly sure if this is the right place to ask but what style of art is this?

This question has probably been answered a hundred times but i'm gonna ask it again since i don't feel like wasting an hour digging through information.

Is there any way for someone who only has a mouse to work with for digital drawing to still be able to make smooth lines? I can't for the life of me make a line with my mouse without it looking all jittered.

>>2205144
You can use the pen tool in photoshop. You'll probably need to look up a video on how to use it though because it's not that intuitive for many people.

>>2205153
Is the pen tool really the best option? It doesn't really look that useful as a tool for drawing.

>>2205156

Not >>2205153 but I do vector art traces almost exclusively using the pen tool (as most do), so yes, it is quite capable.

It's tedious to use even when you're good with it though compared to a tablet for just drawing.

>>2205139
looks like all those fairy elves fantasy watercolor stuff

>>2205153
This works but, for me, tends to make things look mechanical and lifeless

My question is:
30 and 60 second gestures, will these help me get better at poses and anatomy? I feel like sometimes I get the pose well and other times it's just crap.

Should I be doing longer studies to strengthen my fundamentals?

Can someone help me identify the two vanishing points in this image? Its so flat and straight on im having a hard time figuring it out. I think maybe at least one vanishing point is within the picture frame.

>>2205243
there's only one!

>>2205258
I thought all 'real world' spaces have at least 2 vanishing points, because 2 are needed to form the horizon line?

>>2205243
A vanishing point is the point where lines that are parallel in the real world appear to converge. That means that every parallel line that isn't orthogonal to your line of site (a line drawn on the picture plane) will have a vanishing point.

The bulk of this scene is simple 1pt perspective. The diagonal lines from that ceiling-thing top center, and the diagonal lines from those blocks on the ground should converge to the same vanishing point.

The top and bottom bars of the stair railing in on an incline. They aren't parallel to the lines mentioned earlier, but they are parallel to each other IRL. They converge to their own vanishing point, along with anything else that's parallel to them.

On the right side of the building, there's effectively a large bezel - instead of a front and a side plane that are 90 degrees to each other, you have another plane between them that's about 45 degrees to each. The IRL horizontal lines of the window and molding are converging to it's own vanishing point.

The first and third vanishing points I mentioned should both be on the horizon, as the lines from those vanishing points are parallel to the ground plane IRL. The second vanishing point (the one from the railing) will not be on the horizon line, but instead be much higher.

I should also add that depending on the lens used, you could have some fisheye effect. What this means in effect is that lines orthogonal to your line of sight will also gain vanishing points - one straight up, one down, one left, and one right all far off the page. This is likely an oversimplification.

>>2205261
you could be right anon but i've never heard of that, the horizon line is just at eye level. one point perspective is only a thing when you're looking at something straight on, if that's what you meant?

>>2205261
Yes but this picture is too cropped to really find the other points

>>2205261
Like, technically? When you're facing something straight on, one of the vanishing points is right in front of you, and so there are two others that are just way off in the distance. Bringing those two vanishing points closer to the one in front of you gives you a fish eye distortion affect because they eventually curve towards each other, making a line parallel to the horizon line. You can see this in your image: if you look at the horizontals on the door, they're all straight and parallel. But if you compare the horizontals on those concrete rails on the bottom left and right corner, they tilt slightly away from each other.

And don't get caught up thinking that an image will only have two vanishing points either! Everything has its own vanishing point, and things that are parallel with each other or in line with each other simply share their vanishing points. You can see this on the right side of the house: instead of the wall turning at a 90 degree angle, it goes out at a 45 degree angle instead. So, that 45 degree angle wall has different vanishing points from the rest of the house.

>>2205299
posted this in the old thread by accident

tl;dr - do I set tablet to use full area or to use monitors aspect ratio?

there are good resources for starting with digital painting?

So ellipses get flatter the closer they get to the horizon line.
Is there anyway to measure how much flatter/wider an ellipse should be?

>>2205302
Portion it to a small area on your monitor IMO. The bigger your tablet the bigger you can go. If you use your whole monitor it'll feel like you're ice skating.

>>2205304
ctrlpaint.com

>>2205333
Yes, but it relies on drawing a perfect square in perspective that encases the circle. There are a few different ways to draw a perfect square in perspective - a quick way is through the use of an accurately placed diagonal vanishing point.

What are some good and helpful exercises to do at a beginner level that don't require much effort and you can do everywhere without much effort?

I've been doing the rotating cube and boxes exercise from https://youtu.be/Ynxpq0E3Suk?list=PL9E67C703FE7F7D66

Anyone else has some tips or cool videos like this?

What's a good pen for drawing?

I've currently been using a shitty office ballpoint pen that I want experiment more with.

So when I'm working on perspective and scenery is it okay to use a ruler ?

>>2205426
Yes

How does one create shorter / taller figures while maintaining proper proportions? I feel like this was something I could never grasp

>>2205431
A lot of artists tell me it's cheating and I should do it free hand, why is that ?

>>2205465
No such thing as "cheating". There is missing out on a chance to learn.

You should practice your ability to draw all types of lines, including straight lines. If you need a ruler for every single straight line you draw, then you should probably practice that.

If your goal is to learn perspective, then avoiding a ruler will only bring more harm than good. Nothing will line up as it should. Everyone uses a straight edge when establishing a perspective grid. Use a ruler for all of those guidelines so that they actually do what they're supposed to do. Then when it comes to drawing the forms you set out to draw, it's up to you if you still want to use the ruler for that step. If it involved short lines that you should probably be able to freehand, then skip the ruler. If it involves lines that are a foot long, then might as well use the ruler.

It's your learning: you decide what you should do. Keep your long term goals in mind, but focus on the short term goals for the given exercise.

>tldr: Watch any instructional perspective video. All straight guidelines are made using a ruler.

>>2205432
>How does one create shorter / taller figures while maintaining proper proportions?
"Proper proportions" is an idealized average. It will give you figures of the idealized height. Drawing it smaller only gives you a smaller drawing of the idealized average figure of idealized height.

Compare the proportions of a child to an adult. Compare the proportions of a basketball player to a cheerleader. You'll find that their proportions differ, but usually in predictable ways. A taller figure has more "head units" to their height. A shorter figure has less, but a lot of the height disparity is in the legs. A short figure has legs that are proportionally shorter than a taller figure. Torsos will see a difference as well, but less extreme than with legs.

>>2205465

Probably to encourage you to work on your line control, but when it comes to perspective there is absolutely nothing wrong with using a ruler. Not using one is just imposing an arbitrary hassle for practically no benefit. Some people will view literally any tool as a crutch.

i'm going through loomis's figure drawing book and i'm having a lot of trouble with the arcs of movement in perspective. i went through Perspective made easy as well, and i found i understood the content well, but i'm having difficulty applying what i've learned to figure drawing. basically i'm having trouble finding the lengths of things in perspective

>>2205432
Keep the heads the same scale.
There could be some differences (especially with younger kids) but all of the limbs and all of the landmarks are in the same areas.
Bruh, it's not that hard

I think I understand mirroring an object for a reflection but what the heck do you do when you need to reflect something on an angled surface>

am i the only one who is so paranoid that i have to keep all my digital drawings/writings on a non-internet connected device?

>>2205826
Yes. Seek help.

Is it a bad thing to have too many layers, even on a simple image?

I keep making new layers to make corrections and stuff to preserve what I had before just in case, but it feels like a habit I should break.

picrelated

>>2205418

get a fountain pen

speedballs are pretty cheap iirc

how does one do studies?

>>2205878
Just progressively flatten groups layers as you progress. Save a copy of the fully unflattened version if you're afraid, then delete that copy when you're done with the piece.

HOW THE FUCK DO YOU ALIGN THINGS TO THE CENTER IN CLIP STUDIO PAINT

Um, I'm hoping this is the best place to ask but I really dig collage art but it doesn't seem like there aren't a lot of...resources for it. Is there any tips, techniques, and shit that would help a beginner? Like best glue, paper, etc?

>>2205878
How does your computer not crash? I start getting nervous around 15 layers..

How do you know your are not just symbol drawing? I mean, if you practice enough, you'll just learn to put together symbols at a right angle..

How long is acceptable to take for commissions? I'm thinking about doing line art.

Also, how do you go about, just announce prices and examples on your tumblr, set up a paypal and wait?

And also, what's up with the slots many artists talk about?

>>2205965
Symbol drawing is flat. A symbolic drawing of an eye would be like a sticker on a flat plane, as you rotate it the drawing itself stays the same, but is skewed.

You aren't symbol drawing when you're actually drawing forms. So for the eye, that would be the spherical form of the eyeball, the thick eyelids wrapping around that sphere, etc. The symbolic way of drawing an eye from a front view should quickly fall apart when seen from any other angle. Drawing the eye with forms should be accurate and true to life from any angle, and as such the drawing itself is different depending on the angle viewed.

If you can rotate forms in 3D space and draw them accurately from any angle, then you aren't symbol drawing. If your idea of rotating a 3D form looks the same as doing a transform/distort in photoshop of the front view, then you're symbol drawing.

>>2206054
>How long is acceptable to take for commissions?
Whatever you and the client agreed upon, and no later than that. If you say it will take 2 weeks, and you specify the start date and the date of completion, then stick to that. This might exclude time spent waiting on feedback.

>Also, how do you go about, just announce prices and examples on your tumblr, set up a paypal and wait?
You get popular first by posting tons of stuff frequently. Once you're at the point that many people are asking you about commissions, then you open up for commissions.

>what's up with the slots many artists talk about?
Some artists are popular, and they prefer to announce when they're taking X number of commissions as a single chunk. That translates to X slots. Once those slots are filled, they aren't taking any new commissions unless otherwise announced. If it's something like 10 slots, and each commission will take a week, then the 5th commission would be done in the 5th week, etc. Think of it as a cue.

___________

Also, even though you didn't ask, I should also point out that whatever you do, make sure you're making minimum wage at the VERY least (including time spent communicating). If you aren't then it just isn't worth your time to do cheap commissions. Ideally you'd just spend your time gittin' gud, then do freelance work for actual clients. Slaving away at cheap rates is an easy way to kill your passion.

>>2206120
>>2206122

Thank you both for going in such detail, thoroughly answering all my questions, I feel a lot more enlightened now!

>>2204376
>asexual

>>>/tumblr/

>>2203667
Im having issues timing myself when I draw. Recently I stopped setting up a one hour timer, do I need to measure how many hours I draw a day? Or should I get back to timing myself?

>be in life drawing session
>the model girl has at least d cup
>lecturer keeps commenting on breasts in people's drawings
>he asks the model to stand up and rotate slowly so that people can have a good look at how breasts look in different angles
>he explains the softness of the skin tissue, gravity and weight more and more
Just curious, is this normal in life drawing sessions?

any advice or resources on using charcoal pencil like how to get good gradients basic techniques?

I actually have a specific quesiton: anyone located in LA? What kind of art related places do you go to? Like live drawing sessions, ateliers, places to sketch, favorite cafes, etc.

>>2205258
excuse me anon, but I think you put the vanishing point way too low.

Is it ok to not do line work like this person?

http://okolnir.net/post/128130852907/process-gif-for-dj-sona-buy-the-print-my-art

>>2206391
>do I need to measure how many hours I draw a day?
No, but it can be a useful metric to see if you're reaching your micro-goals. It might also help you to identify which days you didn't draw as much as planned, and see if those days have anything in common that you can address.

Do whatever will get you to draw the most.

>>2206333
Has nothing to do with "i am a special snowflake and my body is diverse", but a hardline stance on not having progeny until I can secure a solid future for myself.
faget

>>2206422
Can't wait for him to start taking about a penis

>>2206422
I don't see why you consider that as an odd thing

>>2206422
You should already do the same for basically anything else you draw from an IRL reference, so why would a person be any different?

>>2206422
No. Most models are flat and ugly as fuck. A good one with contours that aren't just cellulite is a good thing.

>>2204990
got to be honest, when i was in school i did draw anime a lot, or at least in that style a lot and never really had an issue with going from that style back to realistic...

just draw what you see and make a conscious effort of doing that, dont go from imagination for a bit just so you always have some way to compare your results.

>>2205061
that sticky is honestly horrible, it gives you a decent guide but it tells everyone they are a beginner when that clearly isn't the case

>>2205139
i would say its inspired by stained glass or is a stained glass style.

>>2205144
>>2205153
>>2205156
>>2205158
there is a program that has a pen tool like option, and from that you can move the lines in a more intuitive way instead of the way photoshop handles it, i dont remember which program it is though so you are on your own for that.

>>2205302
can you set your tablet to only work in a certian area of the screen? also how big is your tablet?

>>2205418
pentel pocket brush.

>>2205426
yes, its good, but dont go autistic with the levels or perspective you could impart on a piece, just use the ruler to check your shit quick and move on.

>>2205432
google short people skinny and tall, look at what is about the same on all of them and than use that as the basis for all of it.

>>2205826
no, alot of people find it more comforting to draw their crap on offline media and in sketchbooks they will never show off.

>>2205960
you aren't getting much help from ic on this.
as for glue, i do papercraft every now and then, the stuff that comes in a brown bottle and tacky was really good, aleene's is the brand, as for paper, it would depend on how many layers but i would say cardstock.

>>2205965
>>2206120
>>2206312
the issue is you are able to not symbol draw but suck to much to properly draw forms, in that case it still looks like symbols. i never use that term for a reason, its to big of a catch all with a frustrating definition.

>>2206054
>>2206122
make sure if you take more than one commission they know they are number 2 or something. also, make sure they are aware life is able to catch up to you and delay shit.

both of those are more for non commercial clients.

what i would do is where i want to get commissions from, give multiple examples of each tier of what you will do. and than set up shop, but the better way is to wait till asked.

>>2206527
i dont think thats asexual than... at least to my understanding it was you are completely uninterested in sex, while you sound like you are just controlling yourself.

>>2206391
dont time the sessions, just time the individual drawings. there is no point in doing a 30 second gesture or 5 minute quick sketch if you dont follow a set time.

>>2206428
over hand grip with a taper point.

>>2206430
i dont live there but if i did i would go to watts, ot at least do the online course till fundamantals are good enough than go in person.

>>2206518
define the line work? do you mean the beginning sketch or something further on

Not sure if this is the proper thread to ask but, Does anyone know where i can find some good refrences/tutorials on anime anatomy?

>>2206932
no

>>2206653
no

>>2206653
>watts
Really? I'm nervous around the famous ones.

>>2206935
go for the online classes for a bit, its cheaper than in person and will teach you allot, it will also be a good way to gauge your skill, but yea, its in all honesty very cheap from what im told for what they offer.

>>2206932
anatomy is anatomy, you want to know what to study for just anime, the major forms, almost all manga never goes beyond showing the major forms, and when they tackle minor, they tend to treat it the same way western superhero comics do, they know the major forms, and know where the minor forms are but fudge the minor.

>>2206933
specifically which part of >>2206653 was no?

Is this site workin'

>>2206653
>if you dont follow a set time
so i shouldnt do the same pose 10+ times until it looks good/anatomically correct?

>>2206950
what i said is dont time the session as in, dont go into it thinking "ima draw for 2 hours" and than time out 2 hours, however if you do a 30 second gesture, or a 10 minute quick sketch, you should time those because if you take longer it loses most of its purpose.

>>2204422
it does matter

>>2207042
Sorry to hear that. Best of luck figuring that out then.

Does anyone know any good forums for industrial design?

>>2207042
There's no way to differentiate the two you dope, aside from asking the artist what he wants it to be.

Are there any good videos that show how to properly do gesture drawing with charcoal.

any of you guys got some tutorials or tips for me on how to improve my drawing skills?

>>2207109
Read the sticky man, its all there :p

>>2203667
Have a girlfriend who hand draws a lot. She's really good but cant buy high quality materials (is currently using regular paper, pencils, colored pencils, and pens.) I'd like to buy her some high quality stuff for Christmas but I don't know shit about this kind of stuff. Can you guys recommend me good paper/colored pencil/pens to buy her? If possible websites that sell them at good prices? Thanks so much.

>>2207328
buy faber castell colored pencils. or prismacolor colored pencils
Faber castell is better for detailed things, if that is what she does. Prismacolor is more for nature things. At least I feel that way about them.
Buy her mixed media paper in a sketchbook.
Buy her sakura micron pens, 005, 01, 03, and 05.

My digital sketches always look much better than my traditional ones; livelier, better posing, etc.

I also have problems drawing large on paper, usually I don't take up as much space as I should

Does anyone have advice for me so I can improve myself traditionally?

One more thing: would it be a bad idea to trace my digital sketches onto paper, and go from there? has anyone else here tried this?

>>2207532
it sounds like you developed some bad habits from digital. When you sketch traditionally, the tablet or computer doesn't refine the line for you like you're used to, so you have to develop technical skills to catch up. Draw in pen so you can see your mistakes, keep practicing and adjust your lines accordingly. Eventually you won't have to adjust, your wrist will be naturally trained to make beautiful, gestural lines.

As for proportion, map out your composition on paper before you start. Establish key points in the image (if drawing figure, establish the top of the head and the placement of the feet) before going into detail.

about commissions, what is the best way for manage the payment? do a sketch and ask for the money? show WIP and ask for it? ask for half money before start? how I avoid scam/fake request?

beginner here, i started with loomis as the sticky instructed

how do i git gud at these spheres?

>>2207102
Anyone?

>>2206653
>define the line work? do you mean the beginning sketch or something further on

beginning, where it's mainly sketches and then you paint under and sculpt as you go

>>2207763
where'd you download the pdf for this?

>>2207815
Sticky

>>2207102
>>2207790
Sorry, I have tips for figure drawing but if you're only doing gestures with it, than I've nothing to say except use vine for darks that stay dark, use willow for grayish large areas
Willow seems softer to me.

Sites like elance, odesk etc... what's /ic/'s experience with them? Do they work to fill in the gaps between 'real' clients?

I hate the idea of joining them and becoming one of those underbidding 20$-a-logo assholes but at the same time maybe it's time to grow some humility and just do it for a year or two.

Yes? No?

>>2207820
Yeah, it seems like something that isn't terribly common. Vilppu only briefly touches on it in his videos, yet I've been watching Japanese artists use it to get the silhouette and work from the outside in with their existing knowledge of anatomy and the speed they achieve is really impressive. I've been using it myself recently, but don't have much knowledge behind the technique so I'm just copying what they do in the videos. It's working really well, but I'd still like the understand the technicalities behind it.

>>2204616

I'm doing drawing on the right side of the brain, and the chapter on perspective deals with this. She talks about using a "basic unit" so you can scale things in your work properly. Helped me immensely.

Anyone have guide on starting a tumblr,I've used fb/dA before but not twitter/tumblr,can someone run down how the system work(hashtag/commenting system/ favourite/follow) ,and how do i gain exposure on tumblr?Thanks a lot.

Are there good books/videos you would recommend on getting better at drawing layouts, and framing in general?

I've read Framed Ink so far, and Vilppu's sketching on location.

How do I draw monsters/demons ? When ever I look for "how to's" and tutorials I get childish level stuff. Is there any good books on this topic ?

Why aren't 1/2 the images on this board not loading?

>>2208444

Good, not just me.

Saw it on /v/ earlier too.

Wonder what it is.

what is /i/? I went over there out of curiosity, and it just looks like all the shitposting and shit threads of /ic/ collected into one place.

>>2207814
from what i can tell the linework there is more or less just guidelines, you dont need to do it but its helpful.

>>2207102
>>2207790
vilppu, proko, their pencils they use are charcoal, vilppu also uses dirty cloth to do it... in fact, watch vilppu's gesture video he goes over a fuck ton of different ways to gesture.

>>2207109
have to post something you made for us to tell you where to improve... preferably something you did for practice.

>>2207337
>>2207328
dont buy special paper, just buy good paper.
as for what they other guy said, ill add in a pentel pocket brush... thing is fun as fuck to draw with.

depending on what she draws and what color pallet she really likes, you many find a set up copics that she would like. and just for the hell of it, get her a giant ass chunk of graphite, like an inch thick thing, she may use it or have no idea how to use it, but interesting none the less.

>>2207532
overhand grip and use your arm, its uncomfortable to draw really small like that.

>>2207638
idealy you charge them for every step of the process however that's usually never going to be the case, i would go a down payment that is equal to all the work that i put in and material cost (if its digital, rental) plus minimum wage for the time you work, and then never give them the finished product until they pay the rest. also, if you go through paypal, never let them pay you, always send invoices, that way they cant fuck you over.

>>2207763
i dont understand what you are asking...

>>2207868
do you absolutely have to do this for money is the question. ideally you practice till you have the skill to not do bitch work, but if you cant wait then there's little other options.

>>2208405
first off a good understanding of anatomy is required. second everything on the body should have a purpose, beyond that i cant help you much.

>>2208444
part of the site was down recently, so either an attack on 4chan or some hardware issues

Is it normal that I cant keep my arm steady while I'm measuring? My arm tends to shake a bit when I try to measure a model, its pretty much the same kind of unsteadiness you get when you try to take a photo and you hold the camera very precisely, which sometimes results your hand shaking a little bit.

Is there a way to avoid this? I'm afraid this will lead to badly rendered drawings. Should I just learn to deal with this? Are there any other ways to measure?

>>2208508
It's for the artists of /a/ and /h/. It's not as serious about art as we are over here. It's more of a playful fun sort of art board, it's not so bad

Beginner here. Been practicing for about 6 months. Is observational drawing the primary skill for getting good at drawing from imagination? I've been working tirelessly on my perspective and construction to the point where my constructed figures look a lot more convincing than those I draw from reference/life. Should I focus more on observational drawing?

I've watched videos with drawing tutors a lot them talk about this distinction between "copying" what you see and "recreating" it. For example, if you just copy the shapes but don't understand how they actually describe the 3D form that you're seeing then you're basically just learning to copy. I've met artists as well who can only copy poses from references. Should I be worried about this? Am I overthinking it? Is it just a case of do lots of observational drawing and it can't help but enrich your imaginative drawing?

>>2208764
Learn the basics, practice them, then you be able to create your own works from imagination and reference. Don't over think it and don't spend too much time on perspective

What's the point of going to an art school?

What's the point of going to an animation school?

What's the point of going to a film school?

>>2208594
loosen up, dont hold shit to tightly, dont fully extend your arm ect, ect, just remember how extended you make it and do that every time.

>>2208764
you are over thinking right now.
how you get the initial skill doesnt matter to much in the long run, whether its from copying photos or not, the problem comes in once you have the skills and you only copy.
also, lets be clear, there is a difference between using a photo as a reference, and copying.
if you aren't thinking and are copying what you see, you are fucking up. always be aware and never go into autopilot when you are using a reference.

>>2208823
1) a good teacher can tell you exactly what to do and show you what to do and shave years off of time it would take you to get good. the issue is finding a good teacher... good thing is, we got watts online for 1200$ a year, apposed to an art school that starts at 30k a semester.

2) learning programs, techniques, and how things are done. i would say animation done in this country is likely going to be 3d, so it should teach you how to make, rig, and manipulate 3d characters.

3) learning the camera, learning cinematography, dos and don'ts, ect ect

the sad thing is, just by finishing any of these doesn't guarantee you a job, or even set you on a path to getting a job that uses the skill you just acquired.

>>2208594
Yeah sure, its not really a big problem.
As you do it more your arm will get stronger and not shake and the more you do it the less you'll have to do it with your arm anyways. (your eyes will just know)
Carry on, not a big deal. If it persists I dunno, do weight lifting or something. Its just the heaviness of your arm.

Why are people too retarded to read the sticky when it's literally the first post you see when you open /ic/?

any resources and vids on how to choose colors for your char design?

So I want to get a job in illustration or animation, I'm 22 and studying 5 days a week at art school. I've never had a job before.
When I graduate with a kick ass portfolio and go job hunting will employers care about my blank job history or do they only care about my skills? Basically how fucked am i?

>>2208874
because the sticky is absolute shit.

>>2208907
from my understanding, when hired off a portfolio you get a lower than you would like position and are on a trial basis, once they see you are up to snuff and can handle a workload, you get normal employee status. once you have a few years under your belt and are hired off portfolio, you can get higher positions and start off as a normal employe.

>>2208907
I would try to land some small freelance gigs while in school. They don't ask about past experience and go on portfolio alone. Then afterwards when you graduate you can tell companies that you have some experience with freelance work, and are comfortable working within restrictions/styles, working with other people, meeting deadlines, communicating etc.

That being said, depending on what school and depending on the level of your work, some companies might just hire you anyways regardless of lack of experience if they think you are a top talent that can become a powerful force they want on their side in a few years.

holy fuck my tablet just came in and I'm completely inept in using it

how long does it usually take before I really get intuition to what I'm doing? do I have to relearn all my drawing skills or will I be able to adapt really quickly?

I really don't want this to be a waste of money, I can still return it.

I'm not interested in building a visual library. All I want to do is observational drawing. I don't have a lot of things around me to draw.

Will I become a good artist if all I ever draw right now is my hands? Will I be more or less prepared for figure drawing, landscape drawing, and abstract drawing from practicing hands all the time?

If not what is the DEFINITIVE thing I should buy and draw repeatedly to get better. I'd like to just focus on one thing and practice it to death and still be versatile.

>just spent ages learning to put 3 lines in a circle to make it into a sphere like Loomis teaches to draw characters
>too anxious to test my new learned skills by actually drawing more than just the circle
feel like i'm gonna have a panic attack just thinking about it

help

>>2209257
WOW buddy if that's all it takes to trip you into a panic attack then either get meds or accept that art just ain't for you.

>>2209259
dont be mean

>>2209270
i'm not even. learning to draw is exactly that; learning. a constant process of discovering and assimilating new skills and techniques.

if you're having a serious emotional reaction to the idea of using one of the simplest, most basic techniques when it comes to figure drawing, you'll presumably face the same roadblock every time you try to learn something that might allow you to improve. you've already tripped at the starting line. do you really think you're qualified to finish the race?

get medicated. that's not me being snide or anything, that's my legitimate advice. the anxieties you are facing here are not normal or understandable to the layman, like stage-fright or whatever - there's obviously a deeper problem there that's tied to you in particular. psychiatric help can solve that. then start trying to get better at art.

>>2209079
No, go outside. Take a life drawing class.

How do I learn to draw like this? is there a disney/anime starter kit guide? it seems like it'd be pretty easy to make and impress plebs. dont get me wrong though I like this style. so yeah any suggested reads or guides?

>>2209341
>dat thumb

>>2209341
The face is very cute but that hand is JUST

>>2209341
stop aspiring to the level of other artists, and stop focusing on stylization. Stylization comes after realism, not before.

Anime and disney are based on reality, so without knowledge of reality you can't even hope to exaggerate or distort it, can you?

>>2209359
you're assuming I can't draw realistically or understand anatomy. I'm not aspiring to that artist I just like the style and wanted to try emulating it for fun.
I'll just check out some disney books maybe

>>2203756
What a stretch lmfao

>>2209341
>that hand
>is she leaning forward or bending at the waist?

About to pull da trigga on a wacom ART PEN. Tell me if it's worth it for rotation with photoshop brushes, bros

>>2209362
sorry, the pic you posted is just kinda... meh, so I assumed you were a beginner

Try studying glen keane

I tried asking this in the beginner thread but it kind of went unanswered, so I'll try here if it isn't too annoying.
So basically, as indicated by the above, I am a beginner. So I was wondering if taking classes to learn how to draw can be worth the money? It seems more suited to someone who does not have self discipline into the extreme, or am I wrong?

>>2209392
mor loomis

>>2209392
Pretty much. Thanks to the internet you can get the knowledge and practice independently if you look for it, so you're pretty much buying the environment of working in a classroom.

If you learn better in classes than on your own and you have the dosh, why not? Structure early on can make for better habits later. If you can study fine on your own, why not keep the cash?

>>2209382
her digital stuff is pretty gud tbh

>>2209397
The book annoys me to no end though, I can't stand to read it.

>>2209398
Yeah that makes sense, thanks. I figure I'll give it a try, at any rate only good things can come out of it.

>>2209399
she's got cute faces and hair down, it seems. it's below the neck that things get fucked up.

fittingly she doesn't seem to draw much more than neck up ever.

>>2209408
she does seem to have a problem with drawing below the waist and bodies in general. she's probably drawn way more heads and not much body studies.
still some of it's pretty impressive, she's like 16 too.

>>2209422
maybe I'm just shilling her because her stuff turns me on

>>2209425
For 16? That is pretty impressive. Hopefully she'll climb out of the bust rut and lrn2body when she gets tired of being an instagram ho.

Is everyone here a millionaire to afford Vilppu? Or am I just super poor?

Drawing traditionally, I'm fairly fast. Drawing digitally I slow down to a crawl. I can never get the right line the first time like I can on paper and Ctrl Z everywhere.

I've been drawing digitally for a few years now, and I'm getting better but I'm sure as hell not getting faster. What do?

>>2209448
this is the internet you dont have to pay for everything

>>2209463

I literally just found the book thread and I feel like the biggest asshole.

>>2209466
technically since your first thought was to legitimately obtain rather than pirate, you're less of an asshole than those assholes. kinda slow, though.

Hey /ic/
I have bought all the recommended books and was getting ready to start my journey

Although I am wondering if starting on a Tablet is a good idea?
Should I start on paper with pencil or is a tablet a good place to start too?

Did the recent Wacom Intuos driver screw anyone else over? I tried the restart service in Windows trick, and even that didn't work.

>>2209508
I recommend just practicing both traditional and digital as much as you can.

What happens to d/ic/ks who aren't neets, and in college planning to get some business job? Do they post their art online on the side hoping to one day get commissions or work? Are there any d/ic/ks that are able to have a girlfriend? Goddammit /ic/, life would be so much simpler if i were still into waifuism. I guess all I can do is work my hardest before freedom is all over.

Is Photoshop CC the best one or something, I see alot of artists using it.

>>2209540
well adobe does (supposedly) respond to user feedback.
yet for some reason you still can't access the top menu stuff using only keyboard shortcuts on the mac version.

>>2208937
ok, im going to talk from the prospective of someone who can't draw on a tablet and got one to make photoshop easier.

at first i wanted to draw on a tablet, but that idea whet right out my head after about 3 months, and this was when i still had most of my skill.

as for using the tablet... this is going to sound weird, but find image macros with text, and photoshop out the text only using paint. this should get you use to using the tablet relatively fast, if you want to, photoshopping out the subtitles on anime also helps, what you want right now isn't to practice how you are going to use the tablet in the future but get over how weird it fells to use right now.

after about a week of doing this and not using a mouse at all, you should move on to drawing, as you are likely use to the table enough to move on.

for me, my skill never transitioned over the coarse of... i think 10 years and 3 when i was actively doing digital shit (anymore i dont draw digitally, ill paint, but not draw)

if you cant get use to it after i would say 3 months, im going to say you aren't able to use a tablet to draw digitally, and at that point you may want to look at monitors that are penable displays.

>>2209079
>>2209291
yes and no, yes in the case of you will have mastered the hardest part of a human body to get right, no in the sense that if you want to draw a landscape you wont know how to take that in.

>>2209341
ok, first things first, the only good aspect of this drawing is the head, and this artist is 100% incapable of drawing a masculine looking face, i may not be able to look back far enough to see her try, but the only one i saw was a god damn mess.

this is what you get when you learn to render before you finish learning how to draw, she can paint her mistakes good enough to hider her fuck ups but they are still there... now onto how to take this kind of drawing... note the simplified face, this shape is the basis for every one of the drawings. he plays around with the shape a bit, but fails at being able to construct a head properly when she deviates for this.

now note the eyes, if these were missing, there would be absolutely nothing in this image worth learning... note disney and well dont manga/anime, they live and die by facial expressions, almost all of the expression is conveyed through the eyes.

now on a final note, look at the hair, its VERY simple when it comes to how it was designed, but the execution of the render there is what's impressive about it. you have to look at hair as form, and even than, you have to look at it as patches of shade with highlights and not individual hairs... of everything this artist does, they got this concept down pat... if only they applies what they know about doing hair to the rest of the body, they could be someone special,

the nose and mouth, while also fairly competently done, they are able to not exist or be heavily simplified and still the piece would be just as strong.

at least that's how is see it.

>>2209379
if you already have the intuos to use it with, why not get it. some of what makes these pens fun to use is likely a style of drawing you dont even use yet...

that said, if its something you dont like/will never use, wacom products keep a surprising amount of their value for resale.

>>2209392
>>2209402

ok, will an art class help you.
thats highly dependant on if you have a good teacher.
lets assume you have a good teacher, yes, its SO FUCKING WORTH IT.
you can learn everything on your own, but lets face it, you will go in the wrong directions and practice the wrong things, or worse yet, develop a bad habit you dont know is bad and bites you in the ass later on.

a good teacher will be able to tell you where you are, what would be good for you to do, and what you could do to better learn.

WITH THAT SAID
if you have it in the budget, watts online for a month costs 100$
you have what are probably the best living teachers all trying to teach you what you need, and if i remember correctly, there is something like 600 hours in the beginning coarse already online.

what i recommend is getting 1 month of watts, and a video capture software, that way you dont ping the service twice and are able save the material locally, so after 3 or so weeks you can cancel and learn off of what you saved. watts basically encourages you to use their service this way (cancel any time and come back later, not save their shit) but apparently they watch the bandwidth you use, so i suggest never download with a downloader, either record what you were watching with screen capture, or save the cache, this way it looks like you are watching the videos only and not saving them.

>>2209453
get a penable display
doesn't need to be a cintiq, hell, go to a best buy and demo a galazy note and see if you have the same issue drawing on that, if not, look into cintiq alternatives 400$ for 19+ inches is fantastic.

>>2209508
study traditional but dabble digital if that's what you want

>>2209453
you could do what i've seen other artists do: work at insanely high resolutions and abuse the eraser tool so hairy lines blend together and other lines taper off or cohere like they were drawn in one pass

>>2209526
people who have a backup plan for if art fails them always go with the backup plan, when art gets hard and they need to buckle down, they just dont have the ability to do that, and instead go the easier route of their second option.

if their second option is living hell for them, than they may take art seriously again, but that isn't the likely outcome.

>>2209540
no, it is shitty for art, but it is hands down the best image manipulation tool ever made.
the reason all artists use it is as follows

1) they see their favorite artist using it so they decide to use the same tools
2) they work in the industry and are forced to use it because clients demand psd
3) they used photoshop in the past and know the program well so they stay in it

see, photoshop became industry standard, so everyone uses it because everyone uses it, and because the number one file format is more or less proprietary, you are required to use it to guarantee compatibility.

there are better programs when it comes to art, manga studio 5 comes to mind, than photoshop, but because its industry standard, you are not able to use it as freely as many people would like if you want a job at a studio.

>>2209624
How is photoshop shitty for art?

>>2209624
People use photoshop because it's fucking easy. No need to emulate traditional brush mechanics or anything. You just make it.

>image manipulation
And that's exactly why it's good. You turn a blank page into something.

>>2209633
at some point they just stopped updating it in terms of how painting works, its not the primary use of photoshop and the fact you can do it at all and as well as you can with the tools they give you make sure its good enough that businesses dont seek out better art applications to use.

take a look at manga studio, sai, painter, all of which if you only look at it for making art are better than photoshop, look up bugs that are present with tablets, photoshop is the only one that has those bugs and if they are present in other programs its a hardware failure.

>>2209661
no, you are an idiot. image manipulation is cropping a photo, balancing the color, adding some filters, removing sections of an image and moving to another canvas, and in that regard, its the best program for the job you can get, however once you so into drawing and creating from scratch, thats where other art programs run circles around photoshop.

and you want to say its easy? its not, at fucking all, easy. Once you go beyond the simple i pick this brush and start going into brush tools, that's when the program becomes overwhelming for most people... granted the need to do that is really only to mimic more traditional mediums, if you just want digital its still a clusterfuck but by no means as bad.

photoshop made damn sure 1 thing and one thing only is the best, image manipulation, because if it gets passed up by any other program, there is no longer a need for photoshop. everything else in photoshop is a far far back number 2 in priority of development.

look at it this way, when people who make lets go manga studio get artists to demo it, and those artists than go on to praise the program but they cant use it due to all their contacts and people they work for use photoshop and thats the required program, you will understand the reason its called industry standard... not because its the best but because its what is required to be used.

>>2209669
>and you want to say its easy? its not, at fucking all, easy.

You need to watch some damn youtube videos. There's a ton of them. All these industry pros do the same thing:paint over each stroke until it's finished. I've done it before myself learning it from them.

What you don't know how do blend in photoshop or something?

>>2209675
this likely is never going to go further than me saying its not the best and you trying to tell me it is.

and what you bring up isnt even what im talking about when i said its not easy, the example i gave was advanced brush settings where someone tried to make it mimic water color exactly, and to his credit, it kind of worked.

>>2209675
>What you don't know how do blend in photoshop or something?
I don't, any tips you might share? I know hard round and soft round are all I need when starting to learn stuff and soft makes soft transitions and hard makes hard transitions but that's all. All those cool guys on youtube have some kind of workflow where they just yoink stuff on canvas and control their brush. What I don't really get is how their brushes blend without looking like this(my brush settings suck probably), their brushes looks more like gouache.

>>2209690
Your brush settings do suck. Can you screen cap them for us? Looks like you might have low transparency or be in a multiply blending mode.

>>2209690
set the brush opacity to 50% and use the color picker. It's an easy controlled way to blend two values/colors

what first, fun with pencil or Keys to Drawing ?

>>2209899
Keys. FWAP is deceptively advanced.

>>2209902
but fwp is free tho and keys to drawing is not

>>2209763
I realise I had wet edges, I turn it off. But now another strange thing arises, I marked it in red, that kinda tail each time I end the stroke
>>2209773
thanks will try

>>2209690
Make sure you are using the ALT key for the color picker. It gives you manual control of what colors you blend.

>>2209425
>cant draw hands
>instead of learning to draw hand puts them behind the back

>>2209907

Everything is free anon.

>>2209907

Bullshit.

I'll even dropbox it for you.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/e2vo6l7stpbq081/Keys%20to%20Drawing.pdf?dl=0

>>2209938
Thanks man that will def help.

>>2209616
Very informative, thank you. I'm going to hope I have a good teacher.

My problem area are currently breasts, how can I draw them properly? I don't know how to get them down as gesture either.

I have a license of photoshop elements. It's valid to start digital painting? or it's better clip studio paint, which I already have?

>>2209988
THANK

U

ANON

<333

>>2210080
Think waterballoons.

No, really. Imagine she's got some full waterballoons on her chest where the breasts are, and draw accordingly. Really helped me get a handle on tit physics.

Also, the outside border of the breast is on the same line as the as the outside border of the armpit, and it lifts the boob accordingly when the arm lifts. People forget that. Best I can do to show what I mean by the line with a trackpad.

>>2209936
shape dynamics
min diameter is set to 0% and control is set to pen pressure
the strokes will naturally taper off to a point like that as you stop drawing if you ease off applying pressure

raise the minimum diameter to get rid of skinny tails, or turn off the pen pressure control

How exactly do I get lines like this? I want to be able to paint / render much like this style, but I have no idea how one goes from sketch + line art phase to something where it does not even look like it's there anymore

>>2203667
What's a good tool to use on Manga Studio to achieve decent lines? Pencil is all fine and dandy for sketching, but I'm at a loss when it comes to achieving those clean looking lines I see on other peoples' work

Also, I have no idea how to colour, besides the obvious flat colours

>>2210178
>How exactly do I get lines like this?
>posts image with no lines

You paint son

>>2210201
Nah, I think he might be talking about the slight stereoscopic filter that's on it. Clearest on the knife. Looks like there's some pretty heavy texture use on the clothes, too.

*You paint then postprocess the shit out of it son

>>2210211

So a lot of it is really kinda just digital magic tricks then?

Who would you guys consider to be masters of composition? I feel like it's one of my weak points and I need some people to study from.

>>2210223
Well, kinda. There's still a level to skill to it, as you have to know what specifically you're trying to do and how to do it well to get that sort of effect. And you already have to be good at the actual painting part or else it will be incredibly obvious that you're compensating.

Digital magic tricks can't make you draw well, but if you already know how to draw well, they can save you hella time. Postprocessing can take an almost finished well-drawn picture to a fine polish at incredible speeds, but it can't make a shit picture into a good one.

>>2210255
Well, depends on what you wanna draw. A well composed children's book illustration vs. a well composed post apocalyptic wasteland illustration are going to be using some different elements.

But mainly, look at the images and scenes that seem to just really appeal to people. Get some screenshots from movies and games you really like visually, but also look at the sort of screenshots other people are taking. Look at the winners of photo contests - NatGeo is GREAT for this. Aesthetic tumblrs, though kinda dumb 90% of the time, can be good for this too.

Also, start a folder for images that, for whatever reason, really seem to grab you and leave an impact.

>>2210302

Oh thank you very much! The one thing that has just always escaped me about stuff like this is where I'll see this artist's early processes where they have sketching and lines drawn in, then out comes this final product where they just seemingly disappear, and I have no idea how it's done, especially with painting.

>>2210094
You're welcome. Gonna delete it now.

>>2210313
>screenshots from movies and games
Oh duh, I should've thought of that. Thanks for the tips bruh.

I'm collecting books to learn from because getting classes where I live is just a fucking hassle.

Out of this torrent
>https://kat.cr/drawing-book-collection-pdf-t8999552.html
what is really useful?

Starting out with watercolors and don't know many people who use them so I can't seem to get any solid feedback.

They feel Ok, but I don't quite get the effects that I want. My picture is on this post and I will post another with the effects I mean.

>>2210387
This is similar to what I am going for. I love this artist's work, but I can't seem to get those dark deep colors, while having it still look good and not grainy. Yet, I also am missing out on some of those hard lines created when one layer of colors is applied to another.

Is this more of an experience thing or am I just doing something wrong?

Also, are there any really, really solid watercolor tutorials that anyone can recommend? I have been teaching myself

everything i draw from imagination looks the same, what do i do to stop this

>>2210402
what do you mean? the people's faces look the same? or..?

>>2210406
yeah, my drawings all kinda look sameish, ive tried drawing lots of people from reference but when it comes back to just doodling or drawing from imagination everybody still sort of looks the same

>>2210085
i think clip studio hands down in this case, though my opinion above should tell you even if you had full up to date photoshop i would still say clip stuido, the only difference being its not as clear cut for everyone in that case.

>>2210211
i dont think its stereoscopic, its chromatic aberration, its a filter that gets abused allot now because it adds more color and makes it look like more work was done when it wasn't... to this pieces credit, its not as bad as some people.

>>2210354
they paint over the lines and refine the painting... here, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYXpNXVoMlg its traditional but it will give you a good idea of what happens.

>>2210313
>>2210376
look for movies that won awards or were nominated for cinematography.

>>2210389
ok, let me start out with this.
look up frank frazetta's watercolor work, dude was famous for useing the shiitiest materials in his work considering the skill he had, watercolor is one where he would pick up a disney mickey mouse kids set and use that in professional work.

some of what you want to achieve with water color is hard without having a good company behind it, some of what you want is more an experience thing. looking at the two, i'm going to say you used a lot more water than they did, the pigment spread out and collected at the edges in your more than it did his, where his is a fairly uniform color throughout where he put it.

i would say the main difference is going to come down to skill, better brushes, better paints can help but are also not really necessary.

to be honest, if i were you i would start drawing flowers, learn to water color with them, they are a variety of colors, and allow you to really get in and use the colors at their most vibrant, see what the pigments do, and allow for experimentation. and on a plus side, you could probably sell your practice pieces for 2-10$ each if they are pretty enough.

>>2210409
>>2210402
>>2210406

im going to guess that you learned how to do the construction of a face, but didn't learn the mussel and shit underneath.

you should probably look into that, and than learn how to play with that to make different faces.

>>2210418
Watercolor guy here.

Thanks for the advice. I will check out Frank Frazetta.

I am using Winsor & Newton half pans. I have a Cotman Round 5 and a Cotman 3/8 One Stroke. I also have Winsor & Newton Series 7 Round #2 (which I use for inking), but I wasn't sure if I should use those for watercolor too.

I actually sold the attached pic and the Silver Surfer one for $35 each. Guy who bought them liked them, but I was not 100% satisfied.

The flowers thing is something I could do a bunch of on one piece of paper for practice. I like that idea.

>>2210423
as long as the water color doesn't damage the brush, theres no real reason you couldn't use it, though depending on how much inking you do you may want to save the brush for that only because once they bristles fray a bit, doing line work with inking can become hard if not impossible.

on that note, you ever try out a pentel pocket brush? from my understanding its one of if not the best brush in its price range for inking, and once the cartridge runs out, you can use it as a dip brush.

>>2209435
I thought she said she was 16(or maybe 18) when she had a paigeeworld account. It's an anime drawing app, but who knows. She could be any age.
I think she lacks knowing where muscles go, and is pretty good with rendering and hair as most people who started with anime are best with hair and eyes.
I feel like she should practice backgrounds more rather than just drawing bust ups of charcters

>>2210428
That was my main worry was fraying. But I have two of them, so I may try it out.

I have, but I honestly did not like the pentel brush. It felt way too pliable and I couldn't get quite the lines I wanted. But I may just need to spend more time with it.

I got a couple brush pens from jetpens.com (which is so bad for my wallet, they have awesome stuff there) that I love. A small rigid one (Tombow Fudenosuke) I like to use for line work. Perfect for me. Also got a bigger brush pen that i do not know the name of (all in Japanese).

How should my hand look like when I'm drawing? Most professional sources say the pencil should be held between the fingers and the thumb, preferably while standing up, but most of my "skill" is in the incorrect way (like when writing), and I don't know if the correct way can translate into digital drawings (which I plan to do when I get a tablet). So, hand, shoulder, pencil, tablets, drawing boards, stands, sitting, standing, carpal tunnel, skill, what to do?

>>2210498

There's no "wrong" way unless you're hanging upside from the ceiling or something.

The only reason teachers want you to hold your pencil a ccertain way is so that you'll break bad habits. As long as you're using your shoulder/elbow for broader strokes you're doing fine. I personally hold my pencil like you would a regular writing instrument when sketching. I'll hold it between my fingers and thumb if I'm using an easel or am shading large areas. I'll hold the pencil from further back towards the eraser side when I want a really light touch.

It all depends on you and what you get comfortable with. Just don't develop bad habits.

When using a tablet I just use the pen like a normal writing instrument but I'm still using shoulder/elbow movements.

>>2210509
Thanks, you eased my concern.

>>2210375
so u dont get arrested??

feel really jealous when i see other peoples art and its really good and ill never be able to draw good in my life even if i practice forever

Beginner thread told me to fuck off:

Would anybody be able to point me to a good rundown for a complete beginner to painting in photoshop?
Note I'm familiar to digital painting in general, I've used manga studio for a few months and I'm competent with that, but every time I try to figure out photoshop (I downloaded CC but as far as I can tell it's basically CS6 for all intents and purposes?) it feels completely fucking impenetrable. Specifically the brushes, I can't find a single brush that doesn't look and feel like garbage.

As an example of the sort of brushstroke I'm trying to find and can't figure out how to replicate, this is the sort of stuff I usually work with in Manga Studio.

>>2210742
ctrl+paint is pretty good for all that stuff
http://www.ctrlpaint.com/library/

>>2210691
The people you see are not gods or chosen souls with divine power. They're human beings like you, the difference is that they worked hard to get there. You can get there too, but only if you work as hard as they did.

>>2210767
i feel like im working hard in the wrong way or something

>>2210769
remember that your work output needs to be more study then free drawing. meaning you have to spend more time learning from books or nature then drawing whatever the fuck you want. Thats kinda key when it comes to this stuff

How do I become more creative?

Every time I sit down to try and draw I get pissed and annoyed because I can't think of things to draw. Most of the time when I do think of something I want to draw I lose sight of my original design and end up drawing some garbage.

>>2210802
When you can't draw, just draw what's around you.

>>2210651
My dropbox space is precious.

Will someone who is able to make gifs from videos please check out
1:28 - 1:38

Highly relevant to /ic/

http://youtu.be/lXF6uP26C3I

>>2210814

What's the context behind that exactly? What a waste of perfectly good canvas paper.

>>2210843
Idk but she is mad at the teacher of he class (who is videotaping her critique and later uploads her sperg out onto the internet. Kinda lame of the prof)
But she does lose her cool . I like the passion she displays while destroying her work, though.

Even though i can't save gifs to this ifad, i just wish to see it breathe life as a gif

Hey /ic/
From the basics how does one get into drawing anime style? I have no idea how to even get into it and it seemed somewhat fun to draw doujins

What should I do to get myself to be creative in thinking of what to draw? I'd like to get better but it's hard to do when I spend a good hour just trying to think of something to draw in the first place.

>>2210954

>>2210954
You gotta stimulate your mind, go places, see things, watch movies, whatever.

In this video on creativity John Cleese talks about it taking like half an hour of fucking around for your mind to get into a state of creative play. So try drawing dicks or whatever amuses you. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qby0ed4aVpo

When you absolutely feel like you can't think of anything to draw just do exercises. Practice drawing lines between two points, practice mark making, draw ovals, draw beans, draw three dimensional geometric shapes, etcetera.

>>2210951
dont

>>2211020
ok

>>2210133
thanks man! it helped now can try actual painting, it will fail miserably probably but I will try anyway

What painting is this?

>>2211152
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nocturne_in_Black_and_Gold_%E2%80%93_The_Falling_Rocket

tip: Click the arrow next to the post number to reverse image search. This was the top result.

tried traditional drawing with graphite pen, felt good. should i invest in better pen? If so, what?

what should i be practicing to make something like this?

>>2211173
landscapes, architechture, color, perspective, and a little anatomy

will these grow mold on the bristles if they are wet and capped for several days? There is no tiny hole to allow air inside. If there is water inside, the brush stays damp at all times

>>2211234

Not sure if its the same but my pentel pocket brush doesn't have a hole in the cap and I haven't noticed any mould.

Then again it does run on ink and not water, but googling 'moldy brushes' doesn't bring up anything painting related.

>>2211173
Not values, that's for sure.

>>2211229
what prespective?

Are there any tutorials on Digital Painting that explains basic concepts valid for all programs?
Most stuff is either focused on Photoshop or SAI, I'm on Linux right now so all I have is Krita.

>>2211251
it's the difference between drawing something close up and something far away. Let's say you're drawing a tree very close and a tree far away. There are some really good books on it you can find from fineartvn dot blogspot dot com (there are a lot of ads but it is good, don't worry) It is also the difference of something from above than something from below. a box above you looks different from a box below you

How to refill these? I have never owned one before and just ordered one. I would like to put my own ink inside. This is a duke 209 fude nib fountain pen.

>>2211239
Okay thank you. since it is so inexpensive, i think i will just leave the water in it and see

>>2211274
Well, what would be different? I've used Krita as well (kind of just waiting for updates) and it has the essentials (selections, layers, blend modes, et cetera).

So I downloaded the pdf from the sticky. Which one should I start at?

>>2211378
successful drawing or figure draw would be my suggestion, but lots of other people say you start with fun with a pencil. Fun with a Pencil is more for people who have never drawn in their life before

>>2211383
Thanks.

>>2210814
>>2210942

I hope this will suffice.

>>2211392
the whole scene.

>>2211396


Ahhh.

>>2211396
Thanks, Anon.

NEW THREAD

>>2211554
>>2211554
>>2211554
>>2211554
>>2211554

answering from >>2210498 down in the new thread if i has something to add or answer.

>>2203667
I have a question that is quite important to me.

I know that some people say that you should think of bodies in shapes first and that you should lay those shapes down to get a feel of the pose or head, animal, whatever. Now I prefer, or rather approach drawing more with contour in mind, this does not mean that I see a photo and copy the lines but instead follow the general flow, making marks and getting a nice basis for the rest of my drawing (I usually do this with one main contour, mostly the backside and then go onto the smaller enclosed spaces.

I read that solomon j solomon says that drawing contour is essential to encapsulate a pose or gesture and that those quick guide lines only make it harder later because you need to reset them.

Now my question is, should I force myself to learn to see in shapes a little more too? Like resizing or zooming into a photo after the inital phase, or should I try to build a pose with the underlying structure as my main tool? I know quite a lot about anatomy, but when I draw I tend to use it as a supporting tool, comparing my knowledge of anatomy to what I show on my paper and sometimes I build figures from the subcutaneous bones and take those landmarks to start off with ripcage pelvis head and the lot.

this got long, but I would appreciate an answer

>>2203837
study foreshortening bodies and get a grasp on perspective. Its a pretty worthless skill though, compared to stuff you should probably learn rather

>>2204616
Solomon j solomon (great pre raph artist) says in his book that you should take the head as a measurement for the rest of the body, count the amount of heads you get (with the pencil) and then lay in the contour of the head and shoulders, the rest should be easy if you do it correctly.

What are the differences between drawing with mechanical and wood pencils

Should I be constantly looking back and forth between my drawing and what I am drawing from?

Or should I be looking exclusively at what I am drawing from?

Is watching some Murata's videos actually a good thing to learn some tips from a pro?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4KuRO8xmHs