/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

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>>2177283
How is this thread related to critisism or artwork?

Metathreads are not allowed.

>lesson 4:loomis
>lesson 5:LOOMIS
>lesson 6:IS LOOM
>lesson 7:ISLAM
>lesson 8: How to melt steel beams and the corrosive properties of jet fuel.

>>2177283
You're dumb.

>>2177298
loomis blah blah blah loomis

>Work on your fundamentals
>Grinds out 1,000s of basic shapes and lines
>shows everyone
>wow good job you drew 400 cubes and triangles and a billion good looking circles!
>time for some more advanced stuff!
>Take those basic shapes and make the figure of a human with them
>oh wow it sucks better go work on your fundamentals some more

>>2177299
so practicing my whole life won't make me better?

you admit that art is all talent and if you aren't born with the skill you will never draw well?

>he actually took the time to create this picture

> he drew thousands of basic shapes and is still garbage

>Lesson 3: perspective
>absolutely nothing is in perspective

Fucking retards don't deserve access in this industry. Please quit and never return; less competition for me.

>>2177309
>He drew thousand of basic shapes and is still garbage
>he was born unable to become an artist

>will claim art has nothing to do with natural talent

>>2177305
>you admit that art is all talent and if you aren't born with the skill you will never draw well?

>>2177314
you're laughing but it's a true statement.

if you aren't born with talent you will never draw a great picture

>>2177315
>if you aren't born with talent you will never draw a great picture

>>2177319
>>2177314
Sick tumblr reaction faces bro

>>2177320

>>2177311
who said they were competition to begin with, HAHA!

You're right, the fact that you spent more time and energy creating an image for a meta thread and then continued to argue in said thread rather than studying and practicing is pretty much a sure sign that art just isn't for you. I hope you find a hobby in which you can turn into a profession and be happy with someday.

>>2177283
The sticky is a joke. I thought it was obvious. Did you think a bunch of wannabes who know next to nothing about drawing or painting could actually put something useful together? Seriously, the only reason it's there is because a larger group of idiots was getting annoyed by a smaller group idiot asking where to start.

It's shit they pulled out thier ass. 100% improvised shit from retards that look at pictures all day. What did you expect?

>>2177324
He could make infographics for Cracked. Seems to suit his talentset.

>>2177325
SHUTUP dont tell them the past details of its creation!

>>2177314
>>2177319
>>2177321
:^)

>>2177283
>thinking the sticky is anything more than a beginners tutorial

>>2177334

>OP will never be able to FEEL it

SHIT THE STICKY GETS WRONG:

"Draw what you see, not what you know"
This is stupid. When an artist is tasked to draw something they often synthesis thier knowledge from previous studies into the drawing at hand. Why do think artists recommend having a reference folder?

It's also stupid because it ignores the fact that at the most basic level drawing requires a translation of abstract ideas. Lines and tone aren't given in nature for you to directly copy. The artists has to abstract those ideas from what they see and then draw it. Drawing doesn't just magically happen from looking at something. There needs to some knowledge about making sense, drawing wise, about what you're looking at in order to draw it.

>>2177342
dank

>>2177325
Are you genuinely retarded? "Study the fundamentals, here are proven books about those fundamentals". How is that a joke? What else is there that needs to be said to a beginner?

I'm getting really tired of whiny noobs like you who think the sticky is shit because they somehow expected the great mysterious secret that no one has told them yet that will magically make them get good.

>>2177343
Absolute beginners do not have knowledge. This is why symbol drawing happens. They draw their preset concept of features instead of what those features really look like. Drawing what you know comes later, after you realize that what you know is wrong and have begun to replace it with concepts of how objects REALLY work.

You aren't wrong, but you're underestimating just how basic some people's skills are. (I think you're also underestimating the role of reference even in very advanced artists' careers.)

>>2177343
That is an age-old advice that is aimed at beginners and part of every drawing 101 class to get people to stop symbol drawing, you dumb fuck.

I don't get why everyone who wants to draw expects to get everything handed to them for free. There is no easy step by step way to become good at art. The sticky is to help people to get out of the super shit tier level which basically focuses just on fundamentals, which is just lines, basic, shapes, and forms in perspective. Once you get that shit down, then it comes time to put in the years of work to make something look ok. Stop expecting over night progress once you finally figure out how to draw a cube in 2 point perspective. Anyone who bitches about the sticky is lazy. The sticky could be slightly better but it has way more than necessary to become proficient at not being a faggot.

Most people think that doing a few lessons out of a book means that they completed it and will move on. In reality, you need to focus on one section for a long ass time. Even the pleb shit.

FOR EXAMPLE, I worked through Scott Robertson's How to Draw book and I spent a fucking week trying to draw a straight line. I was retarded when it came to doing anything with a pen, but after a several thousand 2 inch lines, I could sometimes manage a straight line. I didn't just make 4 straight lines until 1 came out decent and then moved on to the next step. You really have to try your hardest to get through all the shit the book talks about if you want to understand.

And after I did get through the fucking lines, it doesn't mean that that shit is over and done with. Now I have to carry that shit over to the next lesson. So on and so on... Spend a fucking year on fundamentals, then if it doesn't work I guess you are autistic and are incapable of establishing decent hand eye coordination.

>tldr : Sticky is fine. Shut the fuck up you lazy faggot

>>2177283
But this is really accurate, just put composition, color theory and visual library in there and that's it, if you actually master all those
things and combine them the only thing that is stopping you from creating the next masterpiece is your own taste.

Why do the biggest idiots who don't shit about drawing act like they're spewing sage advice with the sticky?

"Proven" What fucking proof? This is drawing not consumers reports, dumbass. What makes any of you an authority on drawing? Nothing except the other idiot next to you agreeing with whatever cliche shit you're into this week.

>>2177355
SHIT THE STICKY GETS WRONG:

"Symbol Drawing"
All of you dolts have no idea what this means and only use it because you don't know how to look at a drawing. All of drawing use symbols. Some of the best drawings can be condensed down to their basic primitives, shapes, and lines.

When betty introduce the term she was talking about using a stereotypical graphic representation during a particular style of observational drawing. What you fucking morons get wrong and completely miss is that this term only has realm in a particular type of drawing: slow contour drawing. That's it. But even then because drawing works through abtraction there is still some symbolizing happening.

>>2177301
you arent learning. you are just guzzling shit down and thinking if you do it you get gud. why dont you think about why the "fundamentals" matter and then apply that to your studies? lol jk, we know you wont xxDDDD just draw more lines and cirlces!

>>2177357
The sticky is made for dumbfuxks luek yoo. You're grown ass adult and you draw like a child because of the sticky. You're welcome.

>>2177387
eradicating symbol drawing from your brain is still important for stylization unless you've got a job drawing clipart or something. you have to actually know what you're abstracting before you abstract it, and if you're still drawing flat football-shaped eyes or whatever it'll look like shit no matter how much or little detail is involved.

git gud op

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KvSyQDu49pI

>>2177418
Stylization is another stupid word. And if you read a few books suggested you'll know why. Strange how none of you ficking loser are aware of what's in the books suggested.

>>2177387
>All of drawing use symbols

In a useless general sense, yes. In a helpful, specific sense, the use of primitives to build complex figures would be constructional, not symbolic.

>>2177443
Do you even know what a symbol is? You stupidfuckingretard

>>2177283
Whats with all these faggots recently who cant into learning their craft?

Read the sticky then lurk from there. If youre too dumb to figure it out then this isnt for you.

Its about trying to understand it. Watch Vilppu, try to get the mindset.

>>2177283
>>2177301
>>2177309
>thinking "fundamentals" stands for grinding basic shapes and line quality
They are part of it but not THE fundamentals.

>mfw i share the same board as these people

>>2177325
You forgot the "FREE OF CHARGE", you want to be spoonfed, get decent critics and a workflow similar to one you get at school? Go and pay. Stop being so entitled.

>>2177387
Oh silly you, read what you just typed and maybe you will understand how symbol drawing works, you managed to explain it at some point but backpedalled hard. Just a tip, all drawings are symbols, yes but different symbols of the same subject present different results. One will be just a symbol while the other will be........ c'mon i know you can do it.

>pic related

>>2177490
"Fundamentals"
Another fucked term from stupidville. Funny how no one can agree what those are and yet tell you you're always suppose to be working on them.

If you're going to give advice it would help that it be reasonable rather than some vague shit on level with horoscopes.

You are completely stupid if you think a construction made up symbols is not the same as football for an eye.

Think before you post you stupid bitch.

>all this salt

>>2177591
What's that ic? You wish there was a FREE resource that would break down HOW TO BECOME A PROFESSIONAL ILLUSTRATOR/CONCEPT ARTIST into hundreds of easy lessons?

Well, why don't you make it? What's stopping you besides laziness?

http://ninja-art.freeforums.net/

>>2177581
You have your head so far up your ass I'm gonna respond just to make sure you keep posting, because this is pure gold.

Also- Are you the same anon from a while back who claimed there is no such thing as a "cast shadow"? Sure seems like you might be.

>>2177638
ironic shitposting is still shitposting

>>2177648
Do you even know what irony or shitposting is dickhead?

>>2177581
Except lots of people agree what those are? Are you sure you're not the stupid bitch? Because evidence is pointing in that direction.

>>2177642
>who claimed there is no such thing as a "cast shadow

Shadow is absense of light, so cast shadow is just light rays being blocked by an object, occluded shadow is the angle of the object means there is less light, and ambient occlusion is like cast shadow, except for reflected light and not a light source.

You really think I don't know this shit? I'm not the one hiding behind merc_wip, my art is there for people to see I know the fundamentals.

>>2177638
BWAHAHA YOU AGAIN. T thought you got banned after that picasso hate thread, but then you made the "magic brush" thread and I laughed at you harder. I could have sworn you were gone but here you are again. nice banner btw. real cute that you gave Laura a droopy eye

>>2177283
this is true though. you need to know basics to apply them retard. if you take how to make confident lines, break things into basic shapes and render them in proper perspective you can do anything.you just need practice. your just bitter because your early studies look like shit so you move on to the next step. basically, dont end up like>>2177638

>>2177660
where's your art bro?

Gonna write an essay on why posting merc_wip is cool?

>>2177650
What evidence, bitch? You morons use to have threads debating that shit. And all that happen was anons would tak on one more subject heading and call it a fundamental. And here is the kicker, not one of you dumb fucks could figure out what glued them altogether. You couldn't figure out how not to compartmentalize all those fucking fundamentals.

Go ahead and quote me your vilpooh or lumpis see how far that gets you. Go back to your asian coloring books, you stupid foureyed bitch.

>>2177662
short essay: I don't respect you enough to actually post anything other than this. A shitpost for a shitpost my friend

>>2177665
>being this mad
Lol, continue sucking ass because you can't grasp basic concepts.

>>2177667
I'm ROFLOL. /ic/ has single handedly dumbed down the internet about drawing. This shit can be seen in reddit, facebook, deviantart, tumblr. It actually makes the smarter ones stand out more. I laugh my ass off every time you dumbfucks preach to each other. And I bust a gut when the same dumbfucks post thier work.

Go ahead and tell i'm butthurt you stupid bitch see if that makes your shit look any better.

>>2177652
lol I remember you. Get your head out of your ass m8, that's just how communication works. You wanna get technical, there's also no such thing as a 'nut' because it's an abstract concept with no basis in reality (peanuts and walnuts aren't nuts, for instance). But when someone says 'i want mixed nuts', we know they want things like peanuts and walnuts along with almonds because that's how most people use the term 'nuts'.

srsly bro, 'cast shadow' is a phrase we use to describe something to each other. It's how language works. Quit being a pretentious twat. You might be technically right, but you're wrong because you're ignoring context and intent.

>>2177672
>continuing to rage like a total autist
>blaming /ic/ for your own shortcomings
Just two of the reasons you're not going to make it.

>>2177673
Wow you didn't even read what I wrote. You said "you said there's no such thing as cast shadow" and I said no I'm not that dude, and explained what it is.

Btw here's your shitty essay on why you think posting merc_wip doesn't make you a no talent no balls hack. Please stop samefagging. Everyone can tell.

>This may may is used when OP or another anon with their head up their own ass says "why don't you post your work" or "I don't see you doing better". It was derived from that being the original post it was in. These days, merc.wip stands for much more, most importantly a statement against the rampant faggotry of self righteous assholes who think that criticism and critique is only Valid if they lose to the person trying to help them in a dick wagging contest. One could also interpreted it as an insult, that you are not worth the time of posting an up to date wip, so you get merc.

>Tldr: "n-no you post your work" is perhaps one of the easiest ways to de-credit yourself as an artist. It shows your unable to take negative feedback and lash out with a blind autism . The critique is valid, and if it isnt, other anon will call it out as wrong. But that's rare. Just like this thread. You posted your shit work. I said it's shit, stiff, needs loomis . Nobody corrected me because I'm right. You respond like a retard, I post ,meme to mock you

>>/ic/thread/2070063

Do you fags really have nothing better to do than argue about dumb semantics?

Pretty much every single week without fail some idealist normie will come from whatever corner of the internet to /ic/ and feels that it's their responsibility to change things. It's a shame because without fail they all devolve into shitposting and mudslinging.

Sometimes it's a butthurt beginner that is incapable of dealing with frustration, sometimes it's some dumb facebook group that does nothing but gossip to fill a void in their lives that creating art somehow can't and sometimes it's a dumb /b/ tard that has spent all of two weeks on 4chan. Regardless of the retarded drama it keeps things interesting on what would otherwise be a pretty dead board so yes, please keep telling us how the sticky is the worst thing ever and please keep getting more and more off topic trying to make a point just so you can win an argument over the internet that has nothing to do with the original intent of the thread at hand, it's pretty much the only reason I stick around /ic/ now.

B-but Betty book is actually shit with made up pseudoscience

bottom left isn't that hard to do

>>2177719
>it's pretty much the only reason I stick around /ic/ now.

Leave. Get a life fagot and leave art dscussion for the srs guys.

>>2177387
It just means that when you see an eye you don't draw a fucking circumference with a black circle inside (oh that's an eye! eyes are supposed to be like this!), but draw what you actually see, as in shapes, shades, contrasts and so

I feel that sticky is actually stucky made up by pros from ic that fear possible competition, make young aspiring artists sore loomsers and pursue wrong direction
Just like all those patreon tuts.

>>2177728
Duh. I've been saying that for ages.

>Within the Art education industry, artists, who are financially struggling themselves, parasitically feed off of a massive pool of art students, who are bled dry, sold false hope when they can't possibly all make it. To keep them buying, art educators perpetuate an elaborate series of myths which hold students back.

http://ninja-art.freeforums.net/thread/29/considering-jointing-forum

>>2177728
The sticky is fine, people who complain about the sticky are retards. I'm still waiting for OP to explain why his examples of perspective drawing aren't in perspective.

>>2177728
>people actually believe this

>>2177735
>>2177738
Artist guild shills, please.

>>2177740
>>2177728

You know, you amateur shitters are always whining and complaining, but how about you actually tell us WHAT exactly you think the sticky is missing. What magical advice do you think should be there that it is currently lacking?

>>2177733
Every pro I know keeps stressing how competitive and cut-throat the art industry is and how you have to be nearly obsessive in your work ethic to make it. It's not the teacher's fault that there are millions on lazy fucks who just go to art school because their parents want them to go to college and they think it's the easiest one to get a degree in.

Can you call art schools a scheme to suck money out of lazy rich kids? Maybe, but they don't deserve any better.

>reading books in sticky
>spending tons of hours for practicing what you've learned from theory
>not improving

quit art. simple as that man. IF and only IF you would enjoy drawing and really want to improve, you wouldn't open threads like this.
I bet you have ZERO drawings where you have actually spend at least 2 hours on (no matter how shitty it is).

Evrything ever basically

Suck up above you

Under cut your equals

Shit on those below

Thats why people are so hostile to helping others for free

Do you fuckin expect to instantly learn playing piano, just because you've shoved millions of dollars into your teacher? Dude youre a faggot and a loser at the same time, dude, fuckin leave your basement more often.

>>2177834
>Thats why people are so hostile to helping others for free

Not really my experience to be honest. The art community tends to be quite helpful with lots of pros giving out advice, doing livestreams where they answer questions and are generally just trying to give back to the community. Granted, that kinda changed since gumroad became a thing. Still, the hostile people always seem to be beginners who get really angry and frustrated at the world due to their own lack of ability. They can't possibly fathom that the problem lies with them, so they just assume that all these people are conspiring against them, keeping that one secret to themselves that would instantly make them git gud.

>>2177283
>>2177325
>>2177390
>>2177728
If you think that sticky is bad, then say how to fix it.
Pro tip: you can't.

>>2177284
underrated reply.

>>2177581
just about every single thing you said is wrong.
>Fundamentals
>Symbol Drawing
>Draw what you see, not what you know
you don't understand what any of these mean. you most likely can't even draw, and yet you are standing on a soapbox misleading other beginners. you are just being contrarian. people like you shouldn't be allowed to post.

>>2177283
i still don't understand why people would possibly think that drawing lines and triangles will make you learn how to draw. where are you getting this from?
those are just WARMUP and MOTOR SKILL practices! they are all supplementary.

and about basic shapes, you are supposed to BUILD something out of those basic shapes. everyone and their mother can learn to draw boxes and squares. the point is simplify the human body (for example) into those basic shapes in order to understand it better.

>>2177916
Not one of you dickless wannabes has ever been able to successfully applied the shit that comes out of each of your mouths. You can't even defend whatre talking about without some kind circular logic.

Let's see you repeat /ic/ mantras and tired cliches without adding anything substantial to back them up. Go ahead and name drop without making a point. The circles you draw aren't as amusing as the ones you argue around with.

>>2177992
Go back to drawing already asshole.

>>2177581
>Another fucked term from stupidville. Funny how no one can agree what those are and yet tell you you're always suppose to be working on them
ಠ_ಠ
Is this...is this bait?

>>2177992
do me a favor and stop writing about things you don't understand.
you are basically just whining because you're not getting any of these concepts. and now you're blaming your incompetence on /ic/, as if we are trying to trick you.

like a little fucking kid throwing a tantrum. stop posting already.

>>2177992
Not him, but those aren't "/ic/ mantras and clichés" you fucking moron, it's common sense what every reputable art school and atelier in the entire world teaches their students.

I'm honestly not sure just what the fuck you are even trying to say. That the fundamentals are bad? That there is a way to get good at art that doesn't involve drawing from life, understanding 3dimensional shapes and studying the fundamentals? It genuinely blows my mind just how fucking arrogant, ignorant and flat out stupid you noobs are. Why do you act like you know it all when you clearly come here for help, asking how to suck less? Then you get angry at us because it's too difficult for you and you are too dumb to learn? Just fuck off.

>>2177995
>>2178001
Wow. What a shock.
You dumbfucks get called out on your shit and all you do is cry to be left alone. And you fuckwits have the gaul to call deviantart or tumblr "hugboxes." Oh the irony!

>>2178011
kek. i deal with you like this because i'm sure i argued with you before. it was about "symbol drawing" and i explained what it has to do with "drawing what you see".

your reaction? this: >>2177343
there is no hope for you. you don't understand any of the things you are talking about and you are unwilling to read, as you have proven last time. you are just hopelessly contrarian.
you probably haven't even read edwards book properly because you understanding for all of these terms is ABYSMAL.

>>2177581
>You are completely stupid if you think a construction made up symbols is not the same as football for an eye.

Either you are trolling or you are genuinely retarded. Symbol drawing refers to flat SYMBOLIC representations of what you see. I.E. a football for an eye as you say. Construction breaks down the complex anatomy into simplified 3D shapes so you can draw what is actually there in perspective in 3D space instead of relying on flat symbols. For example a sphere representing the eyeball, which then allows you to understand how the eyelid accurately wraps around it, how it lies within the brow ridge, how the pupil changes in perspective due to sitting on a rounded surface etc. That is the exact opposite of symbol drawing and at the end of it you have something that represents reality, or if you are into stylization, something that is based on reality, as opposed to your shitty drawings with footballs for eyes that just look like a toddler drew it.

>>2177998
There is a high chance that poster is BonesofRuin. I've seen him posting his shitty comic in the draw thread quite often recently. He's genuinely autistic / mentally challenged and suffers from quite possibly the worst case of Dunning Kruger I've ever seen.

>>2178014

Lol and any other fitting meme. You dumbshits keep going back to symbol drawing and yet can't quote anything about it except from yourselves. It's almost as if you're talking about something you don't know anything about. GASP!

Tell me more about flatness, miss symbol fairy. Tell me how that has anything to do with it. Never mind the flatness of that Picasso excercise that's an exception, right?

Listen yeah ill fuck you all up anyday.

>>2178020
You're fucking retarded. 'flat' isn't a buzzword you moron, that picasso piece is flat as shit as is all abstract art when you get down to it. It's not an exception and nobody claims it is, wtf, the picasso exercise is meant to dissociate you from your logical understanding of the image and translate it into something that you can only understand to be spatial relationships between lines. Picasso is used because Betty Edwards uses it in her book but you can use almost any line drawing as long as it's comprehensive enough.

All you people who've been drawing straight lines for a year. Do you really believe you are going to make it?
I mean its a good practice and all, but imagine you don't make it, its quite hilarious actually. I feel for some of you the idea of training to get good is almost romantic. You sitting down, working hard to git gud, doing the fundamentals all the time. What if its all a lie, what if you are a joke. I'd like to meet a professional, or amazing artist who goes yeah, i spent the time drawing lines and elipses and its a proven method.
You are basically drawing thousands of circles and lines whilst the universe sniggers at you.

>>2178020
i'll explain at least this one last time so listen closely:

symbol drawing is not about drawing "stereotypical symbols" that's just the example she used to explain the concept itself.
symbol drawing means that instead of drawing what is in front of you, you draw what you THINK is in front of you.
basically instead of taking in and observing reality with your eyes, you are using information that is already in your brain, which means that you are not learning anything new.

another thing: the relationshit between drawing what you see and know is not an OR relationship.
"drawing what you know" is a redundant phrase because that's what we do when drawing from imagination anyway.
drawing what you see, on the other hand is a skill that needs to be trained. just as the book explains, humans have a tendency to not take in all the unecessary information their eyes give them. only artists train themselves to do that. only artists need to "draw what they see".

>>2178030
Bzzzzzzzzzzzzz

>>2178034
And you still can't qoute anybody but yourself. I can't say I'm disappointed it's to be expect from a dumb bitch.

>>2178040
read some books and you'll get your quotes.
and then MAYBE everything will start to make sense for you.
i can't guarantee it though, considering your mental capabilities.

>>2177283
an artform is practiced more than learned.
the learning part is simple

>>2178039
"Wow! You sure showed me!" :^)

>>2178040
Just out of curiousity, what do you consider important when it comes to improving art art? Clearly you disagree with the rest of us, so what is it that YOU think makes art look good, not just subjectively but from a technical viewpoint. Are you even able to tell the difference between good art and bad art? Are you able to put into words what makes good art good and bad art bad?

>>2178045
Typical /ic/ response. Somebody asks for particulars and you dumb fucks say vague shit like read the whole book, a book none you dimshits have read cover to cover. And when you limbwristed artistes are pushed even more you start crying about spoon feeding. If you don't want to spoonfeed retards then why make the sticky as it is?

Continue on with your bullshit excuses. Tell me again how everyone agrees with yet you can't find anyone notable to actually say it.

>>2178048
Weebs have nothing to offer. Why act like it?

>>2178085
>If you don't want to spoonfeed retards then why make the sticky as it is?
The sticky is there so we don't have to.

>>2178050
How can I disagree with anything that poo-poo's out of your head? None of it is clear. None of you can make them cohesively work together. You can't put your money where your mouth is about the facts. It seems all you can do is sing memes. How can anyone argue against a meme? Why should they? I'm just here calling you out on your shit, dumbass.

Now tell me I'm avoiding the issue. Tell me I'm the one who doesn't know shit when all I did was point out the problems with your. I thought you dumbfucks came here for the honest critiques? What, you don't like it when it's happening to you?

>>2178092
It's kind of hard to tell you anything other than you're avoiding the issue when you answered none of his questions and just flung inept insults at him.

>>2178089
So you shouldn't act like bitch when someone asks you to back your shit up. Or are you going to say go read the sticky? Say it you stupid cunt. See what it makes you look like.

>>2178096
I'm going to tell you to read the sticky, because obviously you don't want to learn.
I'd say go to /b/

>>2178033
Scott Robertson said himself that he filled sketchbooks with elipses when he attended art school.

>>2178096
The symbol drawing concept is introduced in Drawing on the 'Right Side of the Brain by Betty Edwards'. The suggestion to repetitiously make marks such as ellipses, lines and curves is found in Michael Hampton's book, 'Figure Drawing : Design and Invention' as well as 'How to Draw' by Scott Robertson. The concept of using primitive shapes like cubes, spheres, cones, pyramids and cylinders to aid in your construction of human figures, animals, objects and so on is an age old technique that you can find in many books, including 'Fun with a Pencil' by Andrew Loomis

>>2178095
Shut the fuck up bitch. You don't deserve any respect. If you can't handle it, quit. Rather then crying, why not actually start backing shit up instead of trying to manipulate the argument into some idiotic logic loop?

Half you fuckers are clever at finding shit on the internet, yet none of you can be counted on to argue a point about drawing. And the other half just goes along with it. What a spectacle of dumbfucks.

Now say something passive agressive to show me up. That will surely make your shit drawing thesis shine even more.

>>2178107
Quote betty then dipshit. See how far you get. Show us the level of reading comprehension you have, you stupid fucking cunt.

>>2178096
It seems like you've realized just how much time and practice it's going to take to improve to become decent but you don't want to admit to yourself that you're going to have to actually work and overcome your frustration rather than blaming it on anything else.

Why are you so hung up on /ic/ anyways? If you're as well versed as you allude you are then why even bother here?

>>2178114
Go read her books and quote her yourself you fat little queer or better yet just piss off

>>2178114
She has two whole chapters that cover the topic, anon

>>2178033
Drawing lines improves your accuracy when drawing lines (tautology, yes, I know) and drawing ellipses WITH RESPECT TO PERSPECTIVE improves your ability to draw any roundish object in perspective.

It's a legit booster shot, but you shouldn't make it your only form of practice - and I think the conceit that anyone has ever said you should ONLY draw ellipses is a lie designed to provoke arguments in what is already a screeching nightmare of a thread.

>>2178085
i did gave a response earlier (>>2178034), and you didn't read it again! instead you are asking for "quotes".
you you really think i care enough to search through a book for citations just so i can argue again a complete moron like you?
i don't fucking think so. my memories of the book will have to suffice.

if you had ANY READING COMPREHENSION WHATSOEVER then you wouldn't have come to all these retarded conclusions in the first place, so arguing with you is just hopeless.
go read some books, read them 3 times each, maybe then you'll get it.

i really wouldn't care to debate you, if it weren't for the fact that you are spreading balantly harmful information.
again, like i said from the very beginning, please, P L E A S E stop talking about things you don't understand.

ITT an underage 'epic trole xDD' with saucer tits baits /ic/

As if the op image didn't make it obvious enough.

[ - ]

>>2178117
I don't see you "making it" bitch.

>>2178145
Nobody cares what you 'see', you can't even read

Troll or not, this is just pure cancer

>>2178145
I also don't blame my lack of understanding basic theory and my shortcomings on others. Why are you so upset at /ic/ though?

>>2178153
You mean i can't read stupid shit? Well you're right about that. Keep making excuses you dumb bitch. Tell me I'm being asshole that'll prove the sticky is right, that'll show me.

>>2178155

Underrated post. There is so much salt on this thread, it's hilarious.

>Select all pictures with salad

>>2178191
The only on with excuses here is you homo.

"hurr it's everyone else's fault I'm gay as fuck and can't draw for shit lol'' - u

>>2178191
The only one with excuses here is you homo.

"hurr it's everyone else's fault I'm gay as fuck and can't draw for shit lol'' - u and ur momma 2

I wonder if this guy is this argumentative about everything else in life
>In order to learn another language you need to learn it's grammar
>NO YOU FUCKING DON'T YOU STUPID BITCH SHOW ME WHERE IT SAYS I DO
>If you want to make a house you need to build it on top of a strong foundation
>BITCH QUOTE WHERE EXACTLY IT SAYS HOUSES NEED FOUNDATIONS
>If you want to create a pasta dish you need to boil some water
>SHOW ME EXACTLY WHERE CHEF EMIRIL SAYS TO BOIL WATER BITCH YOU CAN'T BITCH
>BITCH

>>2178236
Kek

>>2178234
Don't pretend you're swinging a big dick, bitch, with the sticky. It's shit and none you stupid fucks can handle that sad fact. It's funny, you all say you're here to learn but none of you twinky-wannabes can stand it when someone disagrees and points shit out to you.

>>2178247
The only one that has issues with coping with dissenting opinions here is you, brosef as you've made it abundantly clear in this thread. Anyone that would have this strong of a negative opinion of the sticky would have moved on and found something else that worked for them but you seem to be incapable of dealing with your emotions when it comes to something you get frustrated with.
>inb4 bitch

>>2178247
If you know better than Vilppu, Hampton, Loomis, Edwards and so on maybe you should write your own book and make your own sticky if you have everything figured out, needle dick.

>>2178247
Can you just admit that you're pretending to be an absolute retard for fun, now?

>people thinking they will ever be "good enough" at art and stop practicing.

even the most hardened veterans fuck it up sometimes

>There are people who think they'll get good at things they don't practice

>There are people who spend hours drawing boxes and circles

These are supposed to be 5min exercises, do a few before you start every day and then start working on actually challenging things, Like people or cars or whatever you want to improve at drawing.

http://www.learning-to-see.co.uk/six-simple-drawing-projects

Check this out, it helped me get an organized mind instead doing random shit.

>>2177343
10/10 good advice

>>2178263
>>2178254
>>2178251
>WAAAH! Stop making fun of muh sticky.

>>2178394
No, we're telling you to stop being a whiny retard and stop embarassing yourself. You can't make fun of the sticky as the sticky is mostly just a collection of books you should read.

I'm not too fond on the sticky, but you're even more stupid for not taking the help how you should take it OP. It's a guide for absolute beginners who don't know how the human body looks like or what a box looks like to you if you were an ant, etc etc. The practice is not only implied for art, but implied for anything in general, people don't say "fuck you just practice" because the fundamentals aren't worth it, they say it because you can't know how to play the guitar if you don't practice. Same way, only practicing will get you nowhere
if you don't know how playing the guitar works. Merge both practice and fundamentals in a big amount and after some years you should be good.

>>2178247
>but none of you twinky-wannabes can stand it when someone disagrees and points shit out to you.

Please feel free to finally say something other than "it's shit lel". I'm still waiting for you to explain what essential piece of advice the sticky is lacking. You've been arguing for hours about how shit it is, yet you haven't mentioned once what would make it not shit.

>>2177343
You're so fucking dumb, line weight is determined by what you see and you learn when to apply it through practice fuck you're so dumb and this is why you'll never draw le epic animu

why do i respond to these baits

>>2177343
This. You should draw what you know, and if you're not good enough, you don't know enough.

I listen to both d/ic/ks and professional artists talking about everything Art. Guess fucking what: they almost always start by what the sticky or what /ic/ says, Loomis. If you think the sticky, a basic as fuck point to start, is total bullshit, then by all means drop it and start listening to the top teachers and artists who've made it in the industry, twitch youtube wherever you want but please check them out. Some of the books they always recommend are Loomis's, Hampton's, DWTRSOTB, James Gurney's Color and Light, Keys to Drawing, etcetera etcetera. It's not me or /ic/ or the sticky who are saying those are the best options, it's the people you'd wish to be who are saying it.
The sticky is not a religion book, it's a starting point, you read it and use it as a launcher for your journey, but you should read it like only once or twice. From there and even if you don't like the sticky you practice, have fun, listen to people who know more and have done more than you, etc. Results nigga, look for the results and the people who have them, you'll see they start almost in the same place.

>>2178404
Alright, that's it, I'm out. The stupidity in this thread is just blowing my mind. I should have done what >>2177284 suggested right from the beginning.

>>2178410
See you in 2 minutes, Fred. You'll be curious of the next reply and take a peek just to see what it is.

>>2178410
It's true though. If you don't understand what you are drawing you won't draw it well. Parrot copying without comprehension will only take you so far. Sorry if I'm repeating what's already been said I just joined this thread.

>>2178407
Just qoute something, cite exactly where your ideas adout drawing come from, instead of stating vague locations of where you got your shit. Religious nuts can tell you what book and passage in the bible they're refering to. But not one fucking loser bitch on /ic/ can cite anything warranting discussion from any of the sources they recommend.

Go ahead and rattle of a book or video with any specifics. Go ahead and tell me to read the sticky even though no one of you dolts did that for your self. Name drop like that's going to make real difference.

>>2178489
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtrIxvAGSh0
Literally last thing I watched, don't let the numbers fool you: this man, among other things, has worked for that one nerdy Magic cards game with great artworks everyone seems to do when they reach pro level. In this video he just talks about the books he has, from things he uses as inspiration starting with a LOTR sketchbook to things he's learned from like Bridgeman's (wait, THAT Bridgeman the sticky talked about? no way!!!1!). And this is just a casual "oh yeah this is what helped me when I got serious" video, there are other people who have more specific videos with extensive talks about this stuff and information on what books to get if you want to git gud.

Don't be silly anon, think about what you're saying. You're ranting against well known artists that have shared their knowledge through history, just because le fat 4chan boogeyman can't possibly be right and share stuff to succeed in anything. Like I said, the sticky alone isn't going to make you a pro, if you think that you're fucking stupid. It's a guide to BEGIN, but there's little wrong with it and let me tell you, the things that are wrong are definitely not the books that happen to be listed.

>>2178489
>Religious nuts can tell you what book and passage in the bible they're refering to

It's funny how you're so mad at us for not reading a thing while you steadfastly refuse to read the posts you're replying to.

>the sticky is not a religion book

>>2178503
This is exactly what i said would happen. You're a fucking moron. All I asked was for one of you, sorry excuse for a whore, to substantiate something out of the sticky and you reply back with bullshit and some video of a twink giving us his top 10.

Is that what the sticky really is, a fucking greatest hit collection by a bunch of fucking idiots? You can't even support one fucking claim can you? You never read or watched anything in that fucking thing did you? You just glanced at and thought you got it already. You're a bitch idiot.

>>2178515
Why do you think i said that, dumbass? Because even a nut can point to exactly where he got his shit from but you can't. That makes you dumber than a fucking nut.

>>2177418
>eradicating symbol drawing from your brain is still important
I still have no idea what people mean by that.

Isn't the whole point of drawing to get better? Like seriously, who the hell draw eyes by doing a circle add a dot and call it done?

I'm a shitty beginner and I'm stuck to basic crap... But if anything, I'd want my drawings to look better. More elegant. More detailed. Just better, always.

Well, except I have no idea how to study.

>>2178521
>this isn't a religion
>WHY AREN'T YOU MAKING IT YOUR RELIGION

>>2178518
What exactly are your recommendations for the sticky? You seem to know more than whoever put it together almost a decade ago.

>>2178536
How can I reccomend anything if none you buttards knows exactly why any of the material is in there? You can't even argue for any of that shit that is already in the sticky on it's own merits. What would another recommendation do? Nothing!

Go ahead and name drop again. Tell me more about your circle jerk recommendations and how you don't know exactly what's in it.

>>2178536
>decade ago
>not just 2013
>not just a the same faggots you're arguing with who "put it together"

You never know, that guy could be a contributor...in fact I was too.

>>2178552
I didn't read the sticky because I already knew how to paint before I came here, but some of the books I found most valuable happen to be in it. I think you just have nothing better to do but bitch about nothing. It's sad.

>>2178553
I didn't know, I'm relatively new here for being on 4chan since too fucking long ago.

>150 posts responding to apoorly written troll thread

Jesus christ /ic/

>>2178559
By how long this has lasted, I don't think this is a troll thread, anon. The guy reminds me of this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdn1s8FxrUg

Great Artwork/Critique, OP. You sure are helping.

>>2177430
Impressive
[spoiler]And his wife is hot as fuck[spoiler]

>>2177314
the reality is that if you born with lucky context, you have most work done, smart and wealthy parents that pay you personal traditional & pro mentor since childhood makes the difference between normalfags and later called genius by idiots

everyone can reach there, but everyone can't access the context to reach there, at my country for example art education is deeply fucked up (and it's europe)

>this thread is still bumping

>>2178404
>>2177343
see this is what happens when you troll on /ic/ (at least i hope you are trolling)
beginners will actually believe it and regurgitate it, just like that original retard on a soapbox did.
and thus /ic/ became a little worse, again.

>>2178552
>moving the goalpost.
first you spout a bunch of dumb incorrect garbage, and now that everyone is calling you a moron, you suddenly start asking for quotes, as if that has anything to do with the STUPID SHIT you said. as if your "expert opinion" needs book citations to disprove.

if you had any experience with art then this entire argument wouldn't even exist.
proof: in this entire thread, save for you initial stupid posts, you never argued for your points even once once challenged. you only do stupid shit like asking for quotes.
why is that? it's because you don't actually understand it enough to argue about it. you don't have any experience.

>>2178853
Your circular logic is what moves the goalpost, stupid bitch

>>2177321
>>2177319
>>2177314
>>2177340
>>2177591
Really makes me want to eat a salad.