/ic/ - Artwork/Critique

Strange proportions and shit wings, but nice overall I guess.

looks cool aside from that uncanny eyeball.

In all honesty while he improved fast, his current work is showing a little stagnation. While things look a little better than they used to, a lot of it is still over-rendered and super tight.And that eyeball is super fucked up.

>>1524361
It's basically the Frazetta effect; once you reach the top the place to go is down. Also, like Frazetta, when they'll happily pay you shit-tons for half-finished paintings, it's hard to stay cutting edge.

The anatomy of the torso on the knife-wielding angel is completely broken and the head on the subservient angel is way too small, like 9 heads tall. And of course there's their shitty and half finished faces--seriously it looks like he spent about fifteen minutes on each face.

And yet, every retard complements him on how awesome the painting is--another good reason to stagnate; when everyone says your work is fantastic it's hard to know where you're going wrong or slacking. This is the reason to develop a perpetually critical eye of your own work.

I'm actually not saying this because I'm one of those twas who gets pleasure from shitting on really good artists, because Algen is definitely a guy I've looked up to as a standard quality, but this is really sloppy work by comparison to his other oeuvre. Frankly I had to google the title of this painting to make sure because I didn't believe it was made by him.

As long as he enjoys what he does, I guess it doesn't matter. He's always had a bit of a problem with proportions though, and it's evident here too. Hope he works through it.

I didn't notice it too much in his manga short story thing, but maybe it's the stylization that's fucked him up a bit.

You know maybe I'm going to get flamed for this but I honestly don't think this looks that cool and I don't really like the majority of his stuff. He's good at rendering and yeah its great hes made huge leaps of improvement but the characters dont speak to me.

I thought frazettas characters were pretty badass. Death dealer was a bit overrated but I think I liked his women more than anything, some of them were sexy, some were half assed and looked retarded

His final image is mediocre at best, and his content is laughable.

No depth at all.

>>1524405
His technical rendering ability has always been his only real advantage over the average pro.

lol doesnt even look threatening at all, the rope looks loose enough for that stupid looking chick to slip out of

anatomy is so fucked and the women have no sex appeal or anything going on thats interesting, i hate this

Can't be the master of everything right away. Drawing multiple characters interacting with each other in the same picture takes practice. He'll probably improve in time

>>1524405
No it's a pretty shitty painting.

Also I want to point out the wings on the characters are all hyper-detailed while the rest of the forms are very loosely rendered which gives the impression that it's a shitty copy and paste job.

Also I wrote the thing about Frazetta--don't get me wrong, I fucking love Frazetta, have one of his books, and in fact I've rarely if ever seen any artist who's work is as easily as his--but he admitted himself that at his height he got paid by publishers for half-finished work, which made many of his later-mid-period work so sloppy, like this piece.

The only difference between Frazetta and Algen's sloppiness, and which makes Frazetta's forgivable is the fact that, aside from imitators, and a few idiosyncratic artists like Lee or Froud who we'rent really in the same field, he really had no competition in his time, a law unto himself, which made it even harder to surpass his own standards. Not so today.

>>1524414
Even guys who came later like Boris vallejo rendered beautifully and had more technical skill in my opinion but i think overall frazetta had stronger characters and more creative power, some of boris's stuff came off as unoriginal. algen needs to practice with his creative ability a little more, he already has the skill to render but i dont like the material its very weak.

even in frazettas sloppier works he always had a pretty good eye for interesting composition at least imo

If I am not mistaken, this artist doesn't give a shit.

>>1524405
I agree with you that not everyting looks good.
I think Angelic destiny is terrible art for magic the gathering. That being said, Its a solid piece but it does not belong there.
On the flipside I do enjoy blood artist, mentor of the meek, Lyev Skyknight.
My main experience with his art is from Magic the gathering so thats where I base my opinion.
More hits than misses but I agree that the picture in the OP isnt awesome.

>>1524398
coined it when he said:
>As long as he enjoys what he does, I guess it doesn't matter.
and
>>1524387
>It's basically the Frazetta effect; once you reach the top the place to go is down. Also, like Frazetta, when they'll happily pay you shit-tons for half-finished paintings, it's hard to stay cutting edge.

Maybe he was under pressure to get the work done on time for commission? There's a hundred possible reasons this work looks so lackluster compared to his other work.

>>1524445
It's showcased on his deviantArt. There really isn't an excuse for this.

>>1524437
What the fuck is THAT supposed to mean? What are the pink lines, why did you draw 'perspective lines' on the stairs?

>>1524485
The pink lines lead to the diagonals' vanishing point.
I wanted to see where the ascending guidelines go.

>>1524445
I'm leaning towards this. He was probably under a shitty deadline or something. /ic/ is just spiteful and hates to see some one who worked hard be successful.

pic related: one of his recent works that looks really good.

I know he doesn't have much control over it but seriously. The subject matter is just pure cringe-tier. Just fucking look at it with a straight face - pure nerd fetish fantasy. It isn't interesting, it isn't sexy to a functioning adult, it's just plain embarrassing.

I mean we all know who it's marketed to, so it's not exactly surprising.

>>1524498
>I mean we all know who it's marketed to
who?

>>1524498

Well, it's a product for a fantasy/sci-fi trading card game. There's no real point in stating the obvious. He gets a list of shit to put in a picture and then he does it and gets paid.

>>1524437

So its pretty much correct or at least to an extent that without drawing actuall lines you wont notice it because the differences are so minor, with the exception of you beeing unable to follow straight lines on the picture like on the chair.

>>1524411
He conveyed motion badly, it's meant to be the instant before the rope tightens around her neck.
I think.

His Technical skill is amazing on some levels however is overall design skill is severely lacking and he produces piles and piles of garbage.. when people try to crit him he dennies it and say "but its my style" he overall only excepts praise and has basicly been shunned from every real art community he has to resort from praise from pony and furry drawing anime fags.

>>1524513
>pretty much correct

>>1524514
What "respectable" communities are you thinking of? /ic/? Because Algen was never shunned from any community, the only site he left was Conceptart, for the same reasons Jana, Marko, Wes Burt, Whit Brachna, Rigney and many many other professionals left.

hes done some really nice work besides this i mean just look at his sketchbook on ca.org some really nice pencil sketches too. it can be pretty easy to be spiteful though when youre not successful and youre working your ass off and it seems like you have so far to go and then you see all these people around you making names for themselves. its disheartening. sometimes i dont even want to socialize with other people because its fuckin embarrassing sometimes i dont want even want to leave the house but at least im not one of those kids in africa with their hand in a fuckin lions mouth.

sometimes i think about my art and say what if? What if? What if? What if? And then i slap the wall hella hard and say A-ha!

i talked to my dad the other night and i started crying and said im always going to be a noob on /ic/ and then he bitch slapped the crap out of me so hard that i fell to the ground and he picked me up and then bodyslammed me into the fridge and i started crying even louder and he told me to get the fuck out of the house. tried to give my mom a hug but she said Hmph! and then turned her head in the opposite direction

>>1524437
You really need to study perspective, you seem to have no idea what you are doing.

>>1524519
wes burt is fuckin insane dude

funny how these what do you think of ____ threads consistently attract the biggest idiots on /ic/

>>1524514
> when people try to crit him he dennies it and say "but its my style"

Stop making shit up just for the sake of creating a strawman for future arguments. First of all, Algen has lots of real professional contacts and friends, so if he needs crits, he certainly won't look for it from shitty amateurs on DA or /ic/.

Secondly, the guy has been working his ass off more than anyone on this site and has reaped the fruits of his hard work in the form of great technical skills. That doesn't change the fact that he's still young and pretty much inexperienced overall. He's basically just like you or anyone else on /ic/, still learning, still trying to find his artistic voice, with the exception that he is good enough to work professionally already.

He's a good artist and most anons are jelly of his success.

>>1524361
the faces are kinda misstylized. noses too short and too small.

>>1524521
Actually that diagram is pretty much acurate and does the job to show that the perspective is indeed off..

looking at the stairs and the angel of dominance you can easily see they are not on the same plane.

i guess lasso tool and render won't save him there.

>>1524519
I always find it funny when people try to act like they know what they are talking about.

He Used to always get pissed on CA. when people would leave him crits. he couldn't take it.

>>1524437
Yeah i already knew you didn't know jack shit about perspective from your retarded post on the other thread. thanks for confirming.

>>1524529
the fuck is wrong with u guys? *stands up and starts screaming* this is algens brother he told me to say u guys are fucking pricks. Fuck this we drinkin. Yadus.

>>1524526
You do know a lot of professionals roam /ic/ and /3/ right? But they don't post work because being associated with 4chan is like career suicide.

>>1524437
That's just nitpicking like a faggot. So long as the perspective doesn't look visibly off it doesn't have to be mathematically perfect. There are plenty of flaws with this painting but perspective isn't one of them.

>>1524528
>He Used to always get pissed on CA. when people would leave him crits. he couldn't take it.

Apparently he didn't need the crits then, because he still improved the most during the time he posted on CA. I mean, seriously the whole "he doesn't lisn to muh critique!!!" is kind of silly when you are talking about an artist who has improved at an incredibly fast rate. So not listening to random idiots has paid off for him.

>>1524533
>a lot of professionals roam /ic/ and /3/ right? But they don't post work because being associated with 4chan is like career suicide.

Then how do you know they do? I'm Craig Mullins by the way, but I won't post proof because it's career suicide. Just believe me, okay?

>>1524537
But the things he was being critted on are still apparent in his art.

Don't get me wrong. lets say there are 5 things that make good art.

Perspective
Values
Color
Anatomy
Composition

If you are a master of 2 or three of these the other ones will look like you just left them out on purpose or by choice. however will appleflinger we know the truth./

>>1524533
>Career Suicide
>Art

pick one and only one.

who gives a shit i break danced with feng zhu once noah bradley was jealous of our friendship

>>1524539
>professionals = famous people
That's why you are a fucking idiot.
And he's not saying this place is full of them either.

>>1524546
There are a lot of haters of feng zuh especially by the more illustration type people..

>>1524543
>Doesn't mention creativity

Only on ic

>>1524548
i was just fucking around i dont hate on feng zhu i love his work actually, he gives very helpful advice

>>1524549
i dont give a fuck THIS IS THE PATH I CHOOSE.

>>1524551
I know but i have been in private conversations like at bars with groups of working illustrators after conventions and just hear tons of hate on him.

i really don't get it even as someone who has never really used him as a direct source of learning because he started making vids a year or so after i had got out of school. i can appreciate what hes doing.

I guess illustrators don't see him as an actaul artist and think hes in it only for the money or as a job.. but i think he still loves what he does.

And is actually cool down to earth person in real life..

I really don't like how pretencious some artist are becoming or maybe it's im noticing it more as i network with them.

>>1524549

>>1524549
I love this.. i think im more of a hybrid though.. as im good looking and started are before my 20s but didn't start taking it serriously until maybe 20.

im 25. started drawing after things didnt work out with my fiance about 8 months ago. i guess i fail at life

>>1524558
Yeah well maybe.. maybe not

Personally im very good at Math and Creative Writting. My Teachers always wanted me to be a scientist or engineer.

But i always got bored with math and pretty much everything Academic, I loved art smoking pot and pussy, those are the things that got most time.. and of course vidya.

At the age of 17 i got an offer from sony to go work at an animation studio as an intern. i turend it down because i thought animu was dorky and lame at the time.

18 Drop out of highschool with a high GPA but whatever... started working.

Realize i wan't to go to art school but to expensive... still draw a lot. but also want to be pro gamer.. get very good make it to semi nationals as MLG.

Game im good at gets dropped.. back to art.
20 got to a paint class at CC realize im really good. but still lack drawing ability.

Next 5 years self taught.. become good enough to land small indie gig.. life is good.

>>1524556
>>1524563
Nobody fucking cares, this isn't your blog.

>>1524549

Why is he so right?

>>1524566
What is your story anon?

>>1524563
This can't be serious, or English isn't your first language and you make ridiculously shitty choices.

>>1524567
I don't know i think there are two different kinds of commerical artist..

Illustrators..

Draw, boob., fat, disgusting, slobs, smoke weed, all day, single

Concept Artist-

Cool, Very Fashionable, Nornal People, maybe a bit snobby. but overall very clean and fit good looking usually has an almost super model looking fg.

I actually am not making this up either or trying to troll this is just what i noticed from going to events and such.

Maybe it doesn't matter, but Jesus, I'm so sick of any sort of talent being wasted on the same fucking teenage boy vidya fantasy subject matter. You have a right to create whatever you want to, but you'd think they'd get sick of just sexy women and costumes.

>>1524572
It's mostly serrious i never cared much for correct grammer or punctuation unless it was for a test or final.. it slowed me down.

My choices are always shit.. a reality i have to face every morning.

>>1524576

Simply because there is no market for it. You can try but good luck trying to find your next meal.

>>1524579

I don't think my teachers ever taught me grammar in school. They always told me to "spell it to the best of your ability" (fuck you nigger I'm not helping you because I'm not paid enough for this shit). I've learned so much after dropping out of HS and I don't regret it one bit.

>>1524582
It's different if you're being specifically paid for it, as opposed to it making up your hobby.

>>1524579
It just weird - misplaced capital letters, usually when people don't care they leave all of them out. But no problem.

>>1524584
My teachers did that. I started correcting them on their grammar mistakes to annoy them. Good time.

>>1524601
>times
That wasn't on purpose, I swear.

Does Algen have any timelapse videos? I'd love to watch him work..

>>1524610
I heard there's this site called Altavisa, maybe you should try that and look for some!

>>1524549

Goddamnit you're correct so hard

this thread is shit. fuck all of you.

starting to hate /ic/

>why do you post faggot

habit. go fuck yourself.

>>1524610
No but he's got a bunch of real time livestream videos.

>>1524619
then get the fuck out, bitch

>>1524576
>You have a right to create whatever you want to, but you'd think they'd get sick of just sexy women and costumes.

Some do, some don't. Apparently Algen likes drawing sexy chicks, there's nothing wrong with that. Just get good yourself and be happy that one artist who is better than you won't be of any competition because you specialize in different subject matters.

>>1524576

who the fuck are you to make that statement?

fucking inbred cocksucker

>>1524575
I went to school for Illustration and my teachers fell into 2 categories, straight edge social retards that did traditional work and the hipster smoke weed every day graphical design based ones. Only one illustration teacher I had was remotely normal.

>>1524549

See, picture wise i respect the right one more than the left one.

The left is artist jerking off on paper. The right is an artist taking something imaginary, something he has never seen, and tried to portray it as realistic as possible.

The distinct difference between those 2 pictures is that the left one could have been made by a 4 year old, and the right one actually requires skill.

>>1524639

Go fap to cartoons you autist fuckface

>>1524656
I can slap your mother?

>>1524660

Cum on then

>>1524549
>illustration is a medium

Naw, you're a fucking idiot lol.

>>1524661
I'm getting kind of hard but dont know why this is happening lol?

>>1524654

Left one is Roberto Matta, Surrealist artist.

>>1524654
>something he has never seen
>hes never seen women, fire, steel, or the moon
Illustration is grounded in things people have seen, which is what makes it interesting in the first place.

The amount of stupidity in this thread fucking amazes me.

>>1524671

spraycan street artists can shit out images like this by the metric ton

>>1524676

let's see them

>>1524675
Thanks for contributing a little more

ITT: amateurs who haven't seriously studied art for more than a year

>>1524729

ITT: Meaninglessly labeling anonymous people.

>>1524746

ITT: uncreative parody posts

>>1524437
ok, because this guy make me laugh, I done the perspective correctly. as you can see the ground is more or less correctly done, but the windows doesnt really add up, assuming the wall follow the same grid that the ground.

>>1524799
are you retarded? you didnt line up the lines on the window at all hahaha
the window is fine

appleflinger's main problem is he has no confidence in rendering/brush economy and his stuff is rather chincy all around plus animu faces

This reminds me

Did anyone save a copy of algenpfleger's progress thread before the CA forums got nuked?

Id love to see him draw some real guro.
It'd be hot...

>>1524807
I'm ready to admit i was a bit fast on the windows, but no, they are not fine. I invite you to try by yourself, you will see.

he's using alot of texture and photos (tiled floors for example) and lasso tool to save time because he is having trouble with his hand (some tendon pain but nothing serious). To me these areas are always completely out of place expecially the floor in some of his images

>>1524807
Think you nailed his problem. He renders and works at everything to the point of it feeling artificial.

>>1524550
creativity has nothing on skill

i'd take "old man with staff looking at huge thing" done well over an artist vomiting on a canvas.

>>1524792

ITT : recursive shitposting

This thread is why art students are so fake, and why the teachers HATE you guys.

>>1524827
There are plenty of loose areas in his paintings. He is actually really good at indicating detail, so rookies like yourself believe it is much tighter than it really is.

>>1524495
lower body makes no sense, it looks like some sort of alien tentacle under there.

making algenpfleger threads is like injecting rabies into /ic/ with a syringe.

fucking awesome.

>>1524921
You idiots say this crap every time something is hidden behind fabric or armor. Study more anatomy, you need it.

>>1524962
the space between where her hip is and where the butt should be is huge and has a really strange curve to it. Just see the curve of the back of the figure..it's unnatural.

>>1524973
lol what?

he just posted it

What's the history between Alg and /ic/?
Why is he so special?

>>1525424
1. Algenpfleger works hard

2. Algenpfleger surpasses many of his generation

3. /ic/ gets jealous and starts to make Algenpfleger threads.

He posted here a few times, btw, but only after getting linked to the thread. He's rather a /fit/izen.

>>1525426
how did he get so good just from doing an assload of studies or what?

>>1525428
By doing lots of studies but also doing lots of sketches from imagination where he applies the studies.

>>1525426

I was thinking the same thing. People overly criticize his work and are rather bitter towards him.

Funny considering he is at a level most of you will never achieve.

>>1524826
He doesn't use any photo textures at all, he's always using texture brushes for this clean, heavily detailed look. At least in every single video he has on his livestream and that texturing look hasn't changed at all since then. Photo textures would look much dirtier.

Also, using lasso tool doesn't save time, the contrary in fact, having to mask absolutely everything in the image and having dozens of layers to manage takes MUCH longer than a straight forward painterly approach.

>>1525432
Whats more important Bearded Dragon Studies or Anatomy Studies?

>>1525435

cactii studies. all day erry day cactii.

>>1525436
Bearded dragons are so fucking adorable though

Guys, his wrist is almost broken after the training periods years ago, I think the fact that he went downhill now and mostly use pentool for lineart is pretty obvious because of his wrist.
It's not that I defend him or anything, his rendering is still good but the rest is kinda mediocre. At least there is reason why he hasn't gotten better for a long time I think.

>>1525438

holy shit is it really that bad? this is a little scary to me because a couple of months ago i too got hit by the tendonitis fairy. i don't think it was full blown carpal tunnel but definitely was incapable to draw for 1-2 weeks.

i thought he recovered? omg omg omg

>>1525462
I don't know much but I think it does affect him.
I think he gets better now but he just use pentool to avoid hurting his tendon.
http://algenpfleger.deviantart.com/art/ASKtheARTIST-Interview-350639763

<algenpfleger>Hehe there was some bad luck involved in that as well - I did get tendonitis and struggled with it for about two years, and that impacted my style a lot - I had to give up making many brushstrokes or lines, even though I really like the aesthetics of it. Instead I went for selections and paths and the clean looks, because those are tools that you can use without applying pressure with your pen. That shaped my look a lot O_O''

>>1525462
>holy shit is it really that bad?

Of course not, people on /ic/ love making shit up. He did have a wrist problem years ago, but it's long gone as he mentioned in his recent DA interview.

>>1525438
>At least there is reason why he hasn't gotten better for a long time I think.

The reason why he hasn't gotten much better is because there are no obvious fundamental flaws he has to work out anymore. When you are still a beginner, you can make visible improvement every month, but once you have strong fundamentals and know what you are doing, your improvement becomes more and more subtle.

The number one "critique" people on /ic/ have for Algen's work is that they don't like his subject matter and how he approaches it. That got nothing to do with improvement but is entirely due to his personal taste.

He was nothing five years ago, imagine all of yourselves at his level in a few years..

>>1524865
>implying
I already know that he is sometimes loose in certain areas of his drawings. For example in this painting >>1524495 her right breast is visibly cross hatched.

What I meant by over rendering is that he insists on making his subject matter look so realistic that everything just becomes artificial as a result. I don't know how he does it, but every time I look at appleflinger's work I find it mundane and unconvincing.

>>1525471
not everyone has a private tutor

>>1525477

you don't need a private tutor to get algen-good within 5 years. anyone that doesn't hold a fulltime job or studies fulltime can get algen-good within ~3 years. some probably even within ~2 years.

>>1525477
I want to have sex with tutor...

>>1525471
its very possible to reach his level dude im sick of people acting like hes a prodigy, there are alot of people who have reached pro level in a matter of a few years. you just have to want it bad enough. it can take some people longer than others, but its not impossible. some people might even have more potential than him. everyone can learn fundamentals, in the end its the persons taste and creativity who sets them apart from the rest, and algens creativity isnt mind blowing

>>1525482
Not who you replied too, but he learned alot from hanging around Janaschi. And if I am not mistaken, he used his collaborations with her as his own stuff.

>>1525423
I wonder why people spend so much time on clean lines when they don't even use them in the final image.

sage because another shitty jealousy thread

>>1525494
I think he does that because it make better layer mask, that's why his painting is always clean and sharp.

>>1525485
>And if I am not mistaken, he used his collaborations with her as his own stuff.

Well, you are mistaken. Both Jana and Algen have uploaded collabs between each other to their DA accounts or conceptart sketchbooks and they always mentioned that those images were collabs.

>>1525505

Strange he says in his interview that doing collabs was a big mistake and slowed his progress.

>>1525426
the fact that he is better doesnt mean he cannot get criticised

>>1525510
How is that strange and how does one thing have to do with the other?

>My name is *thefluffyshrimp
Fuck you, no it's not.

>>1525435

The most important step, even before anatomy, is perspective.

The fastest way to master perspective is to master toilet studies. I've seen people who were shit and they were litteraly flushed by toilet studies.

>>1525621
Why can't I stop laughing

>>1525621
Why can't I stop laughing...can't breathe

His rendering is nice, but his drawings are always off. Like always. That fact is further amplified by overly rendered paintings.

I'm having a great time just contemplating your insights. just wanna say thanks. i'm not even halfway through the thread, and had to stop to just say thank you.