/fa/ - Fashion

[Anonymous No.6284366]

Whats so good about rick owens /fa/?

[Anonymous No.6284376]

What isn't there to love?

[Anonymous No.6284373]

He's kind of like a maymay
if you want to be funny and VERY /fa/ you can say ``Rick Ownes" and everybody will get it and laugh w/ you

[Anonymous No.6284379]

everyone actually hates rick owens clothing and pretends to like him as a joke.

[Anonymous No.6284377]

>>6284366

Well, obviously it's more about whether or not to proscribe to that attitude towards dressing. Thing's being exaggerated, but rooted in easy, sportswear-y pieces. It's a disheveled, unpracticed sort of luxury. If you're not into it, you're not into it, but a lot of his designs are actually so basic that lots of people find ways to work it in to their wardrobes.

[Anonymous No.6284384]

You just don't understand, dad

[Anonymous No.6284390]

The fact that if he shook your hand you'd make love to it for hours.

[Anonymous No.6284393]

>>6284366
On a scale of 1 to 10, how much of a basic bitch are you OP?

[Anonymous No.6284417]

We eatin tonight KTT fam

[twerk it No.6284478]

rick is at the perfect crossroads of technical skill, aesthetic innovation, modernity, futurism, and historical perspective. on top of all of that though, nearly everything is just precisely what i want to wear, and frequently just more sophisticated versions of what i used to wear. it's not a case of me buying into his aesthetic so much as his aesthetic aligning with mine.

[aitch No.6284501]

>>6284478
i don't think this could be any closer to my beliefs on his aesthetic concepts and how i relate to them. Well said.

[turnleft !!t/GvfGACpW7 No.6284508]

>>6284478
>that stride on the chick second from the right in red
Makes it look so fucking effortless
>jels

[Anonymous No.6284525]

If fashion was Farscape, we'd all be padawans and Rick Owens would be our Spock.

[twerk it No.6284531]

>>6284501
i was told by someone who knows a lot of people who buy lots of designer fashion for one reason or another, and i guess a lot of the men he knows that buy rick don't really know what to make of it, if they like it, or if it works on them, but they buy into it and wear it anyway, because it's fashion according to papa rick's endorsement. i find that really funny to be honest. i can't imagine his womenswear customer having the same feelings.

[Anonymous No.6284560]

>>6284508
you just gotta die a lil inside

[Anonymous No.6284591]

>>6284478
rick makes draped avant garde clothes from nice materials with questionable quality

my opinion to yours

[twerk it No.6284619]

>>6284591
that's less of an "opinion" and more of a "regurgitation of half-baked notions other people developed for me"

[Anonymous No.6284650]

I've never had the pleasure of owning any of his pieces, but I like drapey fits and geos have grown on me.

[Anonymous No.6284760]

>>6284531

I don't know anyone who does that. I know lots of older men and women who wear Rick and the reason why people who aren't "goth" who like this stuff is because some of it is just incredibly well-fitted and sleek and just works. If you're an older woman, a elegantly draped cashmere cardigan is going to work as well on you as it will on a lithe, young girl. And when you layer this stuff and it just folds in to your existing wardrobe, it becomes even less about "oh, it's so avant garde" and much more about "this is comfortable and it makes me feel good".

[twerk it No.6284821]

>>6284760
i don't either, it's just a second hand anecdote that i think is funny.

> it becomes even less about "oh, it's so avant garde" and much more about "this is comfortable and it makes me feel good".

yeah, i don't really get the criticism rick gets because everything really is novel takes on very classic, well established ideas; not that insipid "tailoring... with a twist!" sort of shit that would get repped in second string magazines, but thoughtful updates on the vocabulary that was established by gres, vionnet, balenciaga, and reinforced before him by yamamoto, demeulemeester, and maybe donna karan. i think people who struggle to "get" are just myopic, or have only paid attention to menswear in the past (i.e., myopic).

[Anonymous No.6284828]

>>6284821

I think there's more Calvin Klein than Donna Karan, but you and I always agree on this sort of thing anyway.

[twerk it No.6284847]

>>6284828
well, i also left out helmet lang, and he's definitely aware of cdg, i'm sure you can find a lot of other concurrent evolution, but the point is (for our audience, because you already know this) that rick is very firmly aware of what happened, what is happening, and has a solid proposition for what will be happening, and that's why he's been so successful, especially for an essentially independent label.

now if only he was better at picking subordinates. whatever happened to thamanyah?

[twerk it No.6284861]

>>6284847
and you know, i really want owenscorp to grow into a subversive, truly luxurious lvmh group, or a parisian counterpoint to the comme universe. i want there to be more talented, aware, and subversive designers under him.

[turnleft !!t/GvfGACpW7 No.6284868]

>>6284847
doesnt he still operate under him?

i think michele is the heavy hand w/ most of the apprentices iirc

[twerk it No.6284882]

>>6284868
but it seems that the stockist list is receding. i'm not even sure who stocks him anymore, off the top of my head. pugh seems to have similar trouble maintaining accounts, especially for the menswear. i haven't looked at thamanyah as critically as pugh, but pugh has merchandising issues; i.e., everything is difficult and thus expensive to make and too difficult to incorporate alongside non-pugh pieces, plus, he hasn't made an amazing tshirt to bankroll all the neoprene silliness.

[Anonymous No.6284893]

>>6284882
Barney's had pugh's shit in the front window this season here in NYC.
I don't see much of it otherwise, though.
Also, lol@ neoprene silliness

[Clerisy !!JAFrZ3sTBcQ No.6284902]

it cost lots of money and things that cost lots of money make monkeys go OOH OOH ME WANT cos ur DUM FUCKS!@!

[Anonymous No.6284903]

>>6284847

He's still showing. I'm not sure what his sell through rates are, but I'm sure he's not in it for the money anyway.

[twerk it No.6284918]

>>6284893
barneys usually has decent womenswear buys, but the menswear buys are usually pretty conservative compared to independent #avantgarde stores, albeit better than saks, neiman, etc

last time i was at barneys was mostly to scope out the rick fw 12 stuff, this was at the vegas location. the women's floor had all the iconic pieces, cept the veils, but the mens was just like one leather jacket and some drkshdw. none of the high waisted astaire pants, really none of the sneakers aside from geos, none of the tailoring, and this was early in the season so unless it was all snapped up on the first day, they just had a really lame menswear buy. course, nyc might have been different, idk.

[Anonymous No.6284928]

>>6284918

Menswear in LV in general is pretty tame. Bergdorf's has nice Rick buys for such a "mainstream" store.

[turnleft !!t/GvfGACpW7 No.6284930]

>>6284882
?
i think the a lot of the issue is the pricing
GP and thamanyah usually produce a large range of really 'luxurious' pieces at v.high price points and little of anything else.
little is known of them, few people have pieces etc etc ON top of high prices

Although they do occasionally have a selection of pieces which are a bit more affordable (still p.expensive imo)

it always sort of comes down to...
"why would I get BBS/GP tanks (or w/e) when rick (or someone/yy w/e) produce a much more well established and affordable product?"

I had this same talk w/ a few buyers awhile ago about this in regards to the NZ market
Like, in NZ people won't even buy rick because of the unfamilairity and price point let alone BBS or GP.
>Even though their is some womens GP stock

Regardless, they don't make sales.

I think they have strong pieces but...often poorly marketed

[Anonymous No.6284963]

Ask your neighbor who Rick Owens is.

The only reason you guys hype him is because the 'general' public don't know nor do they care about this kind of fashion. When you become an adult with a family, you're going to realize how stupid and ridiculous this trend is.

[User !4JmiEPm2.s No.6284973]

>>6284930

>I think they have strong pieces but...often poorly marketed

yeah, this comes from failures to create a cohesive brand identity, rick has essentially generated a 'world' with his products, applying a distinct set of aesthetic rules to the things he makes, which is an extremely powerful way to create a brand identity and allow for the marketability of the products.

[Clerisy !!JAFrZ3sTBcQ No.6284974]

>>6284963
when u become an "adult"
LMFAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
SHSAHAHA

hey
hey du
lMAOO
u r fukin lelcomedywsilvergoldebronze u get all 3 medals cos ur the fukin winner of lyf

[Anonymous No.6284988]

>>6284821
wats wrong with tailoring with a twist

[twerk it No.6284989]

>>6284973
moreover, rick has a lot of thoughtfully designed but easily approachable pieces that cross merchandise with just about anything while still giving you a taste of the vision; the tshirt is unlike anyone else's (except for some people that have tried, mostly unsuccessfully, to copy his) but is still easy to style into any fit, for example.

pugh has the vision, but he's lacking in basics that reflect the neoprene silliness while crossing over to and appealing to the, say, balenciaga or dior customer. thamanyah isn't even on that radar.

[Anonymous No.6284996]

>>6284619
what no its not

u lose internet troll

[Anonymous No.6285003]

>>6284882
>he hasn't made an amazing tshirt to bankroll all the neoprene silliness.
what does that mean

[turnleft !!t/GvfGACpW7 No.6285006]

>>6284973
the culture that rick generated is also really exceptional esp. when you backtrack progress from where he met michele-->paris etc
although in paris it was (from what i;ve heard) a lot of networking and social events to get exposure.
idk if rick places any sort of boundaries on himself in regards to 'rules' actively but I think he has a really strong idea of where he wants to be in the future and adapts it actively each season to reach this goal.
But I don't now about thta either because a lot of things in regards to his label are pretty spontaneous and are just sort of little strokes of genius that worked out by some miracle.

>Rick Owens
>Strokes of genius that somehow worked out.

[User !4JmiEPm2.s No.6285010]

>>6284988

its been done to death, and its body has been pissed on by countless other brands. its kinda tired.

>>6284989

>still giving you a taste of the vision

yeah, its really hard to apply the same elegance as you do to a massive shearling coat to a simple tee shirt, but the ability to transfer his aesthetic effortlessly from one to the other has essentially allowed him to be successful (in my observation)

[twerk it No.6285012]

>>6284989
also rick's tshirts look really fucking cool on hangers, especially the super skinny ones with negative ease that have tons of stretch, they're so slim and delicate looking
i'm not just nerding out tho, they have great hanger appeal, really eye catching

[User !4JmiEPm2.s No.6285031]

>>6285003

it means he hasnt been able to create simple, appealing, more accessible garments that reflect the same vision/aesthetic.

>>6285006

>But I don't now about thta either because a lot of things in regards to his label are pretty spontaneous and are just sort of little strokes of genius that worked out by some miracle.

I dont think its really a miracle, i think he is an extremely well trained, well educated designer who surrounds himself with the right people, but yeah i think his cult of personality is pretty exceptional.

[Anonymous No.6285027]

>>6285010
>its been done to death, and its body has been pissed on by countless other brands. its kinda tired.
ah i see
how does rick differ from classic menswear with a twist?like the fact that he does skirts and stuff???

[turnleft !!t/GvfGACpW7 No.6285033]

>>6285012
>Hanger appeal
>FashionPsych101 w/ twerk

[Anonymous No.6285036]

>>6284989

What do you make of all the cotton and silk jersey pieces, though, like the crossover tops that he makes almost every season?

[User !4JmiEPm2.s No.6285041]

>>6285027

Because rather than just 'twisting' menswear, he regenerates it and redefines it from the ground up. He doesnt just move the angle of the lapel, he slices the whole thing off.

[Anonymous No.6285044]

>>6285033

I think there's crossover with consumer psychology, but basic merchandising is basic merchandising.

[twerk it No.6285048]

>>6285003
sales of basics will always, always outstrip your crazy coats and veil beanies. you still need those pieces, because they draw attention, they get you free publicity because photographers want them for their shoots, and you know, people think, i can't afford the coat or can't twerk the veil, but i can wear the tshirt. and the tshirt can be produced really quickly, out of fabric that you buy by tens of thousands of yards for a huge discount, and you don't really have to recreate it every season, and so you have a gigantic profit margin because material, labor, and r&d are reduced to nothing.

>>6285006
rick has a clear vision, he already has his collections and evolution planned out in advance.

>>6285033
lol, it's a pretty well established concept

>>6285036
what do you mean? are you asking for my personal or critical opinion?

[turnleft !!t/GvfGACpW7 No.6285049]

>>6285031
idk i think coming from hustling in the back allies of holly wood, going 2 france paris w/o strong exposure and coming out as one of the most successful labels in a bit more than a decade is something p.exceptional.

not that I know any of the finer details

[Anonymous No.6285061]

>>6285048

I mostly meant where do you think the jersey pieces fit in to the product matrix? Like stuff like this.

[Anonymous No.6285067]

>>6285031
>>6285041
>>6285048
thanks guys, always sharing valuable information.

[User !4JmiEPm2.s No.6285074]

>>6285049

he was working in fashion in LA starting in 1985, which was the height of the garment industry in Los Angeles, which was a bit of luck for him. There was a huge amount of money, and several large fashion corporations had offices here and were hiring patternmakers and designers constantly. This allowed him to work constantly with entrepreneurs because there was enough money to start experimenting with clothing relatively easily. I think that timing is something that helped very much.

[turnleft !!t/GvfGACpW7 No.6285076]

>>6285061
soz for the really shitty thumbnail but a lot of the tanks are found underneath the jacket looks

its really nice to not have sleeves under the jacket.

[Anonymous No.6285081]

>>6285048
>>6285061

Really, mostly products like these. Do you think that they're too far removed from the rest of the ready-to-wear? Or are you getting at something else?

[turnleft !!t/GvfGACpW7 No.6285090]

>>6285074
mhm yeah that's what i mean

a lot of it was just right time right place etc stars aligning or whatever.

again, this is sort of inherent of everything but really if you look at some of the events its just like 'wtf, that really happened?'

[Anonymous No.6285105]

so how excited is everyone for ss14 shows this month

[twerk it No.6285110]

>>6285061
o, i thot u were talkin about rick
pugh's basics are frequently less thoughtful than rick's, and with poorer cross-merchandisability; the sheer panelling on that, and that's something he does a lot, it's definitely in line with his vision, and it makes sense for his customer, but it doesn't style well with things that aren't pugh and won't appeal much to the broader fashion customer. i mean, you can go to sz and find the thread about rick stuff and you'll see straight guys with a tepid sense of style talking about layering their rick ts because they're afraid of people seeing their nips, or cutting them shorter because they're afraid of people asking about their dress, and so for better or worse rick has created something subversive that people who don't really have the chonies to wear it still want to buy. i don't see this piece appealing to that same customer. it's too "gay".

>>6285081
too sloppy in design, for one thing. lots of really heavy handed piece work. not subtle at all, and really, not that novel. when rick proposed a bias cut tshirt with no side seams and a spine seam, with really high set armscyes, that was, and still is, extremely novel. this is not.

[Anonymous No.6285138]

>>6285110
>pugh's basics are frequently less thoughtful than rick's, and with poorer cross-merchandisability

I get what you're saying, but I don't think any designer should be designing with OTHER designers in mind. If you have a vision that you want to articulate, I dont see how it helps you ask yourself, "Well, what other brands could my customer wear with this?" I think that's more a question of production and the wholesale team, but I think I don't see why you would criticize a designer for having a very clear concept that reads through from start to finish.

[Anonymous No.6285144]

>>6285110
>or cutting them shorter because they're afraid of people asking about their dress

w
h
y

[Anonymous No.6285157]

>>6285138
>I dont see how it helps you ask yourself, "Well, what other brands could my customer wear with this?"

Actually that is kind of important, you have to keep in mind the specifics of who you're planning to market to and what other brands would your work be sold next to

[twerk it No.6285162]

>>6285138
cross-merchandisability just hearkens back to wearability. pugh's basics have contrast panelling, or huge asymmetrical panels, or just panels everywhere in general. i could wear a rick t every day until it reeks of bo and falls apart, but i don't see the same wearability in most of pugh's basics; additionally, he's changing it up constantly, so r&d must be high, and some of them seem like they'd be more laborious to produce than rick's spinal seamed ts. keep in mind, some of this is just a critical opinion; if pugh's work doesn't cross-merchandise well, it doesn't do us any favors to ignore it when trying to discuss why he is or is not selling well. the simple fact is that you can't expect many of your customers to buy into your vision totally and unyieldingly, you need *something* to sell to the less devout.

[Anonymous No.6285190]

>>6285157

I think there's a difference between being realistic and letting pragmatism water down design. How else do you explain the glut of low/mid-market contemporary womenswear that is practically indistinguishable from each other. For every Gareth Pugh you have, you have a hundred Brandy Melvilles, Torn by Ronny Kobo, and Ella Mosses.

[twerk it No.6285208]

>>6285190
my answer to that is that, in addition to being easier to cross-merchandise, rick's basics are also more interesting and more sophisticated, just better designed all around, than pugh's.

[Anonymous No.6285220]

>>6285208

Well, I guess what I see as the difference is that Pugh's basics aren't really basic. They're obviously meant to do a lot more on their own than a Rick tee. I'm not a fan of his work either, but it seems a little apples-to-oranges to me.

[twerk it No.6285232]

>>6285220
http://www.thecorner.com/us/men/zip-sweatshirt_cod43176927vo.html?utm_campaign=affiliazione_us&utm_content=10&utm_medium=affiliazione&utm_source=linkshare_us&tp=40548

:^)

[Anonymous No.6285237]

>>6285232

Right, but that's not a tee. If you even look at how his collections are styled, there's not really that much layering on so much as many garments have lots of panels, inserts, etc. I think everyone's compared him to Rick since he started, but I frankly think the whole idea of comparing the two is a little flawed.

[twerk it No.6285245]

>>6285237
not at all, given that we wantonly pilfers rick's vocabulary, especially that square cut peplum.

[Anonymous No.6285303]

>>6284930

>I had this same talk w/ a few buyers awhile ago about this in regards to the NZ market

I think at this point the next question in my mind is why is the NZ market so stunted in comparison to Oz? They have a fuckton of avant-garde stores moving product, what's the deal there?

>>6284963

Actually at this point I think Rick has very much crossed over into the notoriety sphere where people hate him for being popular. So while you're correct in that there are people who will hate him as soon as he's popular the reality is that it's already happened and if you haven't realized it you're a massive pleb.

The only issue is now you have to face the people in this thread who don't care about his notoriety and are discussing him right now.

>>6285138

>I dont see how it helps you ask yourself, "Well, what other brands could my customer wear with this?"

That's actually insanely important and something you're taught in fashion school day 1. It's also important to recognize what similar brands are missing and what they're already doing really well. The stuff they're missing you capitalize on and offer, the stuff they're doing really well you might want to think twice about doing yourself.

You have to remember your customers (the buyers) are their customers, you are competing over the exact same people. It would be totally idiotic to not pay attention to your competition. The buyers are selecting your clothes based on what they've selected from everyone else. You obviously need to consider this and figure out how to game it.

[turnleft !!t/GvfGACpW7 No.6285317]

>>6285303
nz is poor

expensive food
expensive living
little means of capita
relatively small wages.
like all our necessities are outrageously expensive considering what we get.
on the other hand we have one of the most beautiful environments in the world and a p.cool society so it's not too big of a deal.

[Anonymous No.6285321]

>>6284366
Rickwife is pretty good.

[Anonymous No.6285394]

Wearing Rick right now.

A. Design. As mentioned before, the garments are innovative from a fundamental level. His experience making and stitching together fabrics is evident; as much as I respect hedi's vision ca. 2003 much of it amounted to putting in a dart here and there, reducing clutter, extending sleeves or nipping a waist. twerk will take me to task on my respect for hedi but I just bring him up as a comparison example. Plenty of brands even fall short of vision: look at supreme, who merely slap on a flavor-of-the-month print to classic garments. Underneath all of this of course is fast fashion. Comparing anything from H&M, Topman, etc to mainline Rick is like putting a shopping cart next to a Porsche. For better or worse, many of the garments from Rick I've had are untailorable in the sense that the patterns would be alien to any tailor looking at them.

The above is a technical point about design, but his clothes also are innovative in design at an artistic level. His silhouette is often dropped a foot or two from the typical one you'd find in gq editorials in the last 20 years. The result is languid and relaxed but not voluminous or baggy.

B. comfort. All of the textiles are soft and comfortable enough to wear to bed. The processing and finishing is far beyond the sandblasted jeans on diesel's rack--and I've enjoyed wearing diesel in the past. The comfort extends to his more formal wear, too. His blazers and trousers don't sacrifice comfort, but don't look like sized up men's wear house either.

C. Brand. He doesn't do advertising, he designs and makes furniture for his stores, his hand is in everything from production to sales. There are some brands thaw hose clothes I've liked only to be turned off by obnoxious branding or status-symbol seeking. The latest instance is SLP.

There are a few drawbacks though. I'd like to wear something every once in awhile that isn't black or grey. I wish he'd revive the horse-lung color for a season or two at least.

[Anonymous No.6285398]

>>6284373
Did you know your opening speech marks are back-tics.

[Anonymous No.6285436]

>>6285394

You don't have to shit on other people in order to adequately express your love for Rick, especially not people equally capable or fighting in completely different arenas, and most importantly of all not tailors, who most of which could take a dump on Rick's skills.

[twerk it No.6285443]

>>6285394
no, hedi has his place, but it's mostly the skill of his team at dh that he receives credit for. anyway, rick has a lot of colors to choose from, and black and white and shades of gray are what the buyers gravitate towards. for spring 2013, his colorways included "titty pink". you'll find some of the interesting colors in women's buys, but never, ever in men's. maybe you could talk to the people at the rick flagships to ask about a special order of basics?

[Anonymous No.6285449]

>>6285443
yea I'm aware that there are colors every season but it's never the good pieces. always tees or shorts. I might just go and chat with my local stocking tho

[Anonymous No.6285456]

>>6285449
whoops, that should be local stockist. This iPad autocorrect is cramping my style. Just look at what it did, I typed iPad in lowercase and it turns me into an ad machine. Fucking narcissists.

[Anonymous No.6285497]

>>6285317
Have you been to the Zambesi store in Britomart, turnleft? Do they have much rick stuff there? Pretty keen to have a gander.

[twerk it No.6285510]

>>6285436>and most importantly of all not tailors, who most of which could take a dump on Rick's skills.

lol what

[turnleft !!t/GvfGACpW7 No.6285521]

>>6285497
they have a 3season or s/t old rick blazer going for 800 I think in sz 50
Some ramones last I checked
And a few womens shoes
Some GP jackets too
Lots of drkshdw

Ummm this was as of like a month ago.
The womens selection is WAY better

Ponsonby has/had a stronger range.

[Anonymous No.6285541]

>>6284366
If I were a woman, I'd really go for Rick's stuff. He's got some extremely beautiful designs.

But as I am a man, there are only a handful decent boots and a handful decent jackets, but his quality is said to be sub-par and for that price I will get myself something better. Then only his goof ninja stuff remains, and I think that's fashion that only fits teenagers or very young adults that still live with their parents or have recently moved out and do a very basic job or something artsy. Although I am only 21, I think due to my lifestyle I am too old to wear Rick, I simply feel like a streetwear-wrapped child wearing geobaskets, it doesn't represent my current lifestyle well, so I steer clear of RO.

Other people who endorse different lifestyles look can look pretty good in his stuff, but I'd probably get ridiculed by my peers for dressing like that.

[Anonymous No.6285564]

>>6285541
Rick's stuff is aimed at well-to-do 40 year olds and 30 something artsy types. The man says so himself, over and over. It's really not for kids.

[Anonymous No.6285572]

>>6285564
as I said, "something artsy". As I am not doing anything artsy, I'd feel out of place wearing Rick now that I'm at University. If I had that kind of money back then, I'd probably have loved to wear Rick back in high school, though.

[twerk it No.6285604]

>>6285572
the point being that the demographic your described, "streetwear wrapped children", are not and will not ever be rick's customer. you only have exposure to some rap stars and their followers, but the reality is that most of rick's menswear sells to people approaching and solidly in middle age; the people who can actually afford it.

you've completely blundered your assessment of rick's menswear.