/fa/ - Fashion

>>13025007
Agree that fur is tacky, but I could never stop buying leather.

OP here, I am also very interested in the defining differences between fascism and national socialism and would very much like to know if at some point in time in some place it will be appropriate to mutilate myself with tattoos.

>>13025015
fuck off nazi scum

>create a movement against meat produced clothing
>your non meat product gets exclusive 'vegan' label and designers raise price
Thanks social movement

How much leather stuff do you guys even have? For me it was belts and some shoes only.. Belts are cool in faux, dress shoes are fucking terrible as far as I've tested

>>13025007
I think it's fine to wear fur and leather, the problem is that there are too many people in today's society, too much outsourcing and deregulation and all of this makes the situation a big complicated unethical clusterfuck. Living in a tribe of ~100 people with crops and cattle, going hunting in the nearby woods and producing clothes that will last many years from the animals which one has tended to all their life and always treated with respect or has encountered as an equal and slain in the wild seems like a very ethical lifestyle.

>>13025030
agree

>>13025007
I reduced my meat consumption heavily in the last few years but I don't really think about this when buying clothes
I've never worn fur-anything but leather shoes are kind of a must for me
Is there any difference in where the leather is sourced between mass produced garbage and brands such as red wing etc.?

>>13025046
>leather source

Not really.

When cattle get taken in for slaughter, the skin comes off after the viscera comes out. It gets tossed into brine tanks and hauled off to the hide processor. Here the hide gets fed into a scraper which gets the fat off and divides the hide into top grain and mids of varying thicknesses or leaves it as is for full grain. It gets spit out of this machine into barrels for tanning.

After its chemically tanned its dried, then worked on automated equipment to soften it then it gets sent off for grading.

This is where the cost comes from. Hides are seperated into grades based on cut and grain and then wholeness: rips, holes, and size/shape; and quality: branding marks, scars, texture, and hand feel or drape.

The better the quality the higher that batch gets at auction and distribution.

Your redwing shoe leather as high quality as it is, I gaurantee you, came from a cow that grew up, ate, and died next to a cow that ended up graded C and turned into a Payless Shoes bargain bin purse.

>sauce: furrier by trade

In a society where meat consumption is a thing it makes no sense to not use every part of the animal.

Furthermore, if you toss your leather jacket in the landfill and come back in 20 years youll find the synthetic thread and zippers and buttons. Throw your faux leather jacket in the landfill and an alien civilation that excavates it 12,000 years after we nuke ourselves will have a nice vintage human jacket to wear after they hose it off.

Just look at Patagonia, their own research shows that washing synthetic clothing is contributing to bioaccumulation of plastics in our foodchains. But every vegan has a fuzzy fleece hoodie. (Granted a good portion of those freaks rarely wash their clothes)

I like leather and fur. I am a fourth generation furrier by trade. Its my livelihood.

>>13025110
I'm big on animal rights but see no problem with fur and leather as long as it's not sourced in some horrific manner like skinning the animal alive or whatever. I think pollution is a much bigger problem.

>>13025030

this, for every aspect of life to be honest

>>13025135
>skinning the animal alive
>buying fur from china

>>13025088
thanks anon, appreciate your knowledge

Let's stay with shoes, I assume at least 99% of the leather used is a byproduct of our meat consumption and not farmed for leather?

>>13025007
I think about it occasionally. Like I'll look at my shoes and think of how sad it is that this nice happy animal had to die for them to be made. And how doublly sad it is that these shoes get beat to shit and eventually thrown out like it's just a piece of fabric, not a part of a real creature. I put myself in the animal's shoes (hooves?) and it's usually a bummer.

But I like leather.

I'm on a vegan diet, but have seriously trouble abandoning leather, wool, down and silk at this point, despite the cruelty related.

It feels like I'd be left with shitty synthetics besides cotton/linen for basics and summer wear. And currently my narcissism and fashion arrogance beats out animal rights in my head.

Send help.

Leather and fur are overrated and kind of shite anyway.
I don't think I've ever seen fur where I was legitimately impressed. Leather shoes make me wretch, especially when fuccbois try to coord them with chinos.
Leather jackets are pretty badass but as far as I can tell there's nothing in genuine leather that imitation leather lacks.

>>13025007
I agree, I hate animal abuse. Unfortunately quality leather boots/shoes are top tier. I definitely will not wear fur.

>>13025266
Leather shoes make you wretch? What is wrong with you?

Using the fur of an animal is objectively better consumption than meat. It’ll last longer than a meal. Even the 60 mink used to make a coat would have greater and longer use than their carcasses for food.

>>13025007
I am agreeing with most other people in this thread. But I do love me some leather shoes. I do wear fur but it's mainly faux since nobody really sells real fur these days.

>>13025022
yes blame those fighting the system, what a good little boy you are!

Thanks for the proof that veganism is pseudomoralism.

>I care about animals
>I don't care about humans

Would wool go be non-vegan? You're not taking the sheep's life, but it is part of an animal

Nothing wrong at all with using fur, I don't think. As long as it's humanely captured, killed, and it's an animal that isn't endangered and is in fact actually considered a pest (Wolves, coyotes, raccoons, geese, etc.) then I don't mind. It's sad, but it's nature. These animals are gonna be killed one way or another, may as well use their fur. If it were a domesticated animal, obviously I'd feel terrible, but since it's a wild animal I don't mind. These animals attack livestock, farmers, people, domesticated dogs/cats, and some states have even placed bounties to help hunt over-populated animals that damage the ecosystem. I live in Pennsylvania, and up the Poconos Mountains there are literally fox's/coyotes that roam the street at night, sometimes day.That's how much of a pest they are. I don't mind leather being used for a certain way of fashion, however I do believe giant fur/mink coats are tacky. I only prefer functional fur coats. Honestly, I hate faggot protesters because they really don't seem to understand any of this shit as they live in big cities and have never actually explored a forest or done any activities. They just pour blood on you and call you the murderer.

Source: http://www.iucnredlist.org/details/3745/0

>>13025499
What system? Are you trying to covert the entire world into vegetarianism?

>>13025541
vegans refuse all animal related products iirc
including no dairy
so i'd assume wool is out too

>>13025558
the meat and dairy industry, the main goals are to reduce consumption of these products due to the disastrous environmental impact

>>13025592
>>13025541
It is, but by all means buck convention and rebel against stupidity.

>>13025541
no wool is not vegan

they usually leave sheep open wound's and let bugs and shit fuck with it

>>13025293
Good taste? I dunno

Hey guys I'm actually interested now, what could I wear as an outfit that would be completely vegan friendly?

>>13025637
be one with the earth and just wear leaves, man

>>13025637
Just wear synthetic materials, many of which are derived from petroleum, a non-renewable resource, unlike y'know, modern fur which is renewable and biodegradable, as well as being a natural resource. Hell, let's just cut animals from everything, including food, medical testing, clothes, fuck it! Instead of actually looking for humane ways to capture and hunt animals, let's just do shit that is fundamentally anti-ecological. That's the smarter, vegan friendly way, isn't it?
>>13025595
You're retarded.

>>13025640
My dream.

>>13025653
Or just wear natural based materials like Cotton, Rubber, Cactus Silk esc...

>>13025630
t. Someone who's never sheared a sheep before

>>13025673
Nah sorry, gonna stick with my canada goose jacket that was humanely made instead of stupid and mindless alternatives that either harm the environment or don't keep me as warm as my current humanely made jackets do.

>>13025684
>canada goose
>humanely made
Nice fucking b88

>>13025688
Prove to me canada goose jackets are inhumanely made.

>>13025690
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4FST39BZ-s

>>13025680
do you have trouble communicating without terms like "t."?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fly_strike_in_sheep
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mulesing

>>13025696
Where is the proof that that is a canada goose farm? PETA is a unreliable source as well, and has been known for being inhumane in the past, so how do you feel about being a hypocrite? Your opinion is void. There is no proof this is a Canada Goose supplier, and PETA is a lying, piece of shit company known for animal abuse. Is it wrong what those men are doing and how they are not humanely killing the animals? Yes, of course.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/nathan-j-winograd/peta-kills-puppies-kittens_b_2979220.html

>>13025711
>Calls PETA untrustworthy
>Posts Huffingtonpost as a valid source
Ok anon enjoy living in your dreamworld.

>>13025711
delusional


you are grasping at whatever you can to justify the murder of animals

if you are gonna be a sociopath at least own it

>>13025653
no, you are
im not trying to wipe out animal use for spooky ethics, im trying to REDUCE use for the planet
watch cowspiracy, the production of animal based goods is really bad..

>>13025525
You think they don't know that? "Deep"
misanthropy is the fucking centerpiece of the vegan aesthetic
Somehow they STILL don't realize how obnoxious it makes them.

>>13025722
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/aug/17/peta-sorry-for-taking-girls-dog-putting-it-down
Ohh I'm sorry, am I not using your designated news source, despite there being straight up facts and sources shown in the article? And I'm in the dreamworld? Get a load of this guy. Also, how do we know that was a Canada Goose farm?

>>13025525
or ecology????
veganism is good for the environment

>>13025726
correlation =/= causation


supporting the animal agriculture industry does more damage to human beings and the earth dooming everybody including human beings


humans are animals as well

the only difference is they can consent

>>13025733
what a fucking awful post

>>13025724
Well yeah, when animals are overpopulated and are damaging the ecosystem, naturally we're gonna kill them. I'm not saying kill giraffes or elephants in Africa, I'm saying kill animals like raccoons, foxes, coyotes, wolves, bobcats, etc. when they become overpopulated in our state. Of course, you're probably a sheltered, spoiled white guy who lives in a nice suburban home in a city, and has never actually done any sort of outdoor activities or lived near any sort of forest, and likes to force their views onto other people. Honestly man, you're just a moron trying to guilt trip me by saying I'm a murderer and a sociopath. Refer to here as an example: Coyote populations are only rising and are migrating into other areas. It even specifically says "The ability of Coyotes to exploit human resources allows them to occupy urban areas." But of course, you care more about guilt tripping than humanly slaying an animal that is populating into our lands because you're sheltered and retarded.
http://www.iucnredlist.org/details/3745/0

>>13025740
you're right you did make one

>>13025765
ahahw wow i sure have been told xD

>>13025752
>humanly slaying an animal
how is this done?

>>13025842
shocked with electricity before slitting throats

>>13025848
so if someone shocked you or i with electricity and slit our throats it would be humane?

after all less carbon footprint?

>>13025842
Rubber legtraps, and a shot to the head. Simple as that. Quick, humane way.

>>13025752
>There are no current threats to Coyote populations throughout their range. Local reductions are temporary and their range has been expanding. Conservation measures have not been needed to maintain viable populations. Coyotes adapt to human environs and occupy most habitats, including urban areas. Hybridization with dogs may be a threat near urban areas. Genetic contamination between dogs, Coyotes, and Grey Wolves may be occurring in north-eastern U.S. Hybridization between Coyotes and Red Wolves is problematic for Red Wolf recovery in south-eastern U.S.
needless death

>>13025862
no such thing as 'humane' death

>>13025007
I'll have you know that I'm on a strict raw organic ketogenic paleo-vegan diet.

>>13025752
>elephants
>not damaging the ecosystem
WEW

>>13025871
are you stupid? What planet do you live on, Uranus?

>>13025920
you can't humanely kill something (animals) that doesnt wish to die

wake up

>>13025752
>Well yeah, when animals are overpopulated and are damaging the ecosystem, naturally we're gonna kill them.

just because something is 'natural' doesn't mean it should be done
viruses are natural
poison ivy is natural
sociopaths are naturally inclined to have the desire to murder people

does that mean we should invite or accept those things?


if you really were in support of 'population control' then wouldn't you just sedate the animals and sterilize them?
'convenience' does not justify the murder of a living being with sentience

i'm not trying to 'guilt trip' you, i'm giving you logic and reason and telling you to consider alternatives, if you are a sociopath and do not have empathy for animals or humans there is nothing else to say. but if you have empathy for an animal, why be selective about it? why kill coyotes and foxes but not dogs or cats? the 'population control' argument is an excuse as stated with the sterilization over flat out murder.


humane slaying doesn't exist, there is no need to murder the animals
we do not need to kill coyotes to survive
they do not want to be 'killed' regardless of whether or not it's 'humane'

we have a 'natural' ecosystem and our hunting and pollution has only damaged it

fission-fusion adaptation has occurred in coyotes after being the target of hunter throughout decades.


do you believe in 'humanely' killing children in order to reduce over population? would you be for china doing it?


so you don't support animal agriculture?
because the reason cows are 'overpopulated' is due to the supply and demand and forced impregnation in order to continue to cycle of suffering and death for meat and dairy

population control doesn't work or else the coyote or other species you named would almost be extinct

I like my crocodile double monks.

Dont like it? Go eat a dick and fuck off.

>>13025952
attention whore

Fashion industry
>child labour
>pollution from textile mills
Most of the people I see in Canada Goose coats are Asian. Either that or plain Janes. There is so much consumer overload in our society.

I buy few pieces but as high end as I can afford at the time. It would be difficult for me to take any stick for my leather Vibergs that I'll have for decades from someone that owns truckloads of plastic junk like tech gadgets and lives with 3 cats.

>>13025266
there's a lot of dumb shit that gets posted here but this takes the cake
good job

>>13025939
>if you really were in support of 'population control' then wouldn't you just sedate the animals and sterilize them?

If you REALLY believe that sterilzation, which with livestock is usually castration, is somehow less painful than killing them outright via a cull, you're delusional.

>>13025936
THEY'RE FUCKING ANIMALS

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

t. a literal vegetarian

>>13026032
you only tackled one component of what i said

animal castration is not inhumane if it spares the deaths of offspring that have not been born yet, vegans aren't against fixing their pets

animal death via human is inhumane if it is already alive

>>13026052
what

what is the difference between human and coyotes that make it acceptable to kill non-human animals?

>>13026068
oh gee I dunno consciousness and abstract thought? LOL

>>13025939
First things first, a virus isn't the same thing as hunting and killing an overpopulated animal and using their bodyparts. Not only that, I'm not a sociopath, and I don't have any desire to murder people because I'm mentally sane. Hell, I don't even hunt, I just hike, go kayaking, and be comfy in my nice jacket.
I'm with you, I can't look at videos of animals being killed because it's just too fucking uncomfortable, and I don't think I could kill one either. I'd be the same with videos of members of ISIS being shot in the face, I don't want to see it, nor do I want to be the one doing the shooting, but it needs to be done.
We don't kill dogs or cats because they're domesticated, they (usually) have enough intelligence to just be "Okay, I'm gonna back the fuck off and be a good kitty/puppy and relax." Coyotes/foxes/wolves on the other hand? They kill domesticated animals/people. There are videos of it happening in suburban neighborhoods at night. There are also videos of coyotes attempting to lure domesticated animals/people away from their area so they can ambush them and kill them with other coyotes.
I truly am with you on that fact that if an animal is in anyway not threatening/overpopulated at all, we shouldn't touch it, even if it's at a stable population. But if you're going to be a farmer, you're gonna have to kill animals to keep them away from your animals. Coyotes are the number one predator problem for ranchers, they prey on new-born calves and lambs.
I don't support killing children because a child is completely different from a wild animal, but I do believe there should be something ethical in place to help limit births and over pop., that doesn't involve murdering babies.
Honestly, I can't say anything for the sterilization idea because I'm not educated enough to even know if that could work or not, but the current system we have right now does work.
I think animal agriculture is a completely different situation as well.

>>13026065
>animal death
>inhumane
>anything about an animal
>being human or inhuman
Yeah, see, this is your problem right here.

Now if you'll excuse me, I have to commit genocide on millions of helpless micro-organisms on my hands. It's very inhumane of me.

>>13026081
Fuck, I formatted this terrible. Apologies, I thought I double spaced between sentences.

>>13026068
really makes you think

>>13026065
You vegans argue that anything that causes pain and suffering to animals is de-facto cruelty, justifiable or not.

By your own belief system's credo, what you suppose is inhuman and cruel by default

>vegans aren't against fixing their pets

Vegans are against having pets at all.

Speaking of pets though, animals will still have to die at slaughterhouses, considering that most of our pets are obligate carnivores.

Oh, and on that note, we'd still have shitloads of farms, because animal shit is the best natural fertilizer, and you know you chemophobic vegans won't eat anything "unnatural"

>>13025864
>Coyotes are opportunistic, generalist predators that eat a variety of food items, typically consuming items in relation to changes in availability. Coyotes eat foods ranging from fruit and insects to large ungulates and livestock. Livestock and wild ungulates may often be represented in coyote stomachs and scats as carrion, but predation on large ungulates (native and domestic) does occur (Andelt 1987). Predation by Coyotes on neonates of native ungulates can be high during fawning (Andelt 1987). Coyotes in suburban areas are adept at exploiting human-made food resources and will readily consume dog food or other human-related items.

Oh alright don't include the part that proves my point.

>>13025030
Yeah, and? Your ability to imagine such a world doesn't make it real. As a society we do not have that connection to nature, and sadly, we cannot buy our way back into it.
>>13025551
Fur isn't "captured" man. Those animals you listed would never be used for clothing except for extremely niche/local markets because of their "dirty", commonplace reputation. If that's the way to do it around your neck of the woods, more power to ya.
>>13025752
I grew up in the forest. We're talking about the massive senseless slaughter factories which make up the majority of the market. Not a small scale neighborhood trying to protect their pets and livestock.

You guys are kind of living in a dream world. This fairy tale you have about a trapper bringing hides to trade on the market... Doesn't exist.

>>13025255
>India doing that to cows
Pretty sure they find them sacred or whatever there.

>>13026097
>Doesn't know about crop cycling

>>13026119
In the tourism brochure yeah. Come on man, Where's your cynicism.

go to bed greg

>>13026126
You still need fertilizer for that, you AG101 flunkie.

>>13026111
First things first, much respect to you for growing up in the forest, I don't think people appreciate the woods or nature that much anymore. As for slaughterhouses, I agree that animals need painkillers and to be sedated before being killed because it's fucking disgusting when they're killed alive, such as the preparation of halal meat. I also think that animal abuse is completely disgusting and that farms who mistreat animals are filled with complete scumbags.

>Those animals you listed would never be used for clothing
I can name multiple brands/stores that use those animals, and I know multiple people who wear fur. My coat has coyote fur and down. Whenever I go into the city in Philadelphia, I see tons of people with fur coats.

>>13026131
I left it at my job where it belongs.

>>13026140
Anf that's where you stop pouring your family's manure out into the ocean and put it to good use in the fields.

>>13026145
It only flows into the oceans because factory farms (Both plant and meat) don't feel the sting when they get fined for manure/pesticides leeching into the water table/tributaries.


That's why I'm more of an advocate for abolishing factory farms and reverting back to a society in which gardening is taught as part of a mandatory home ec course.

>>13026075
>>13026091
animals are 'conscious'
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_consciousness

and what do you mean by abstract thought?

do you find it morally acceptable to kill any human beings who don't have 'abstract thought'?
those with autism? down syndrome? those in vegetative states? mentally disabled people? indigenous tribes people who are not able to reciprocate or conform to first world civilizations?

google search
'name the trait fallacy'

>>13026097
no it's not ANYTHING that causes pain or suffering to animals
it's UNNECESSARY pain and suffering

we do not need to eat meat to survive or wear leather in order to survive

>Vegans are against having pets
that is incorrect, vegans are for reducing the unnecessary suffering and death of animals
if an animal is going to die in a pound, most vegans would most likely prefer to have someone take the pet and take care of it then to let it be put down. though they themselves are not obligated to, a vegan is for removing meat and animals products from their consumption, they aren't obligated to become an animal shelter worker but in general are against unnecessary death and suffering if an animal has cancer and will live a life of agony that is a different matter

killing a coyote is different than euthanizing a pet as the coyote has a chance of survival naturally through their own means, a domesticated dog is different.

>animals will have to die at slaughterhouses
dogs do not have to eat meat to live cats are a complicated matter, there are many alternatives
yes they are required to eat meat though you still do not have to directly support the industry
they have leftovers, scrapings, certain vegan-oriented brands
regardless that is a completely different issue
it isn't about instantly removing all animal products and killing ourselves
it's reducing the amount as much as possible with what is not needed to live

>took the shearling redpill

Soyboys can get fucked animal products are the greatest. Even Adam and Eve wore leather jackets.

>>13025007
The way I see it is a portion of leather goods is a by product of the meat industry, so why not make full use of it (i know this is not always the case). I’m also more interested in some rarer leathers e.g. Kangaroos which are not bred but selectively culled since we have a lot of em over here. Thoughts about culled animal fur e.g. ferals?

Leather synthetics are neat though as a concept, Rombaut does really cool things with it and Pinatex has the potential to go mainstream.

As a whole I’m more interested in the human cost of clothing production (slave labour, unfair wages and living conditions) and would like to improve that in my wardrobe before i even start considering animal cost.

>>13026158
I'm a vegetarian and I think you're retarded. Animals have an IQ of what? 20 max? I like humans, you don't.

>>13026110
if the coyotes aren't physically attacking people why go out and seek and hunt them for 'population control'?
even if they are 'overpopulated' they have been hunted through out history and have only adapted to the system of being hunted and increased due to it

as i said
fission-fusion adaptation

the only reason they have become overpopulated is due to the unnatural intervention of human hunters

>>13025214
He never mentioned China so why are you bringing it up is beyond me, care to explain?

>>13025255
>silk
Abuse of silkworms?

>>13026165
You look dumb using that meme word

>>13026131
Care to back that up with some cold hard facts?

>>13026153
I agree with you. But i don't see how supporting factory farms while we work towards that future is in any way defendable.

>>13026158
Dogs DO need to eat meat, they're more carnivorous than anything. This is why vegetable heavy dog food Beneful was pulled from shelves after dogs started to die from lack of nutrients that they needed from meat.

Cats/Ferrets/numerous others are obligates, and thusly slaughterhouses would remain for production of food for them.,

So the vegan pipe dream of ending meat production is nothing more than an ideological fallacy, much like the liberal ideological/rhetorical fallacy of tolerance.

>>13026178
gotta kill the worms inside of the cocoons to harvest the silk. peta says: Approximately 3,000 silkworms are killed to make every pound of silk

>>13026158
You have a warped sense of knowledge about animal husbandry

>dogs do not have to eat meat
Fuck no. The grain pellets can cause long term health problems especially in their gut which is why a lot of people feed meat based or make their own. They can tolerate some, not substitute their entire diet with it

>>13026081
>>13026086
formatting is perfectly fine, i got you

cats kill mice and birds does that make it acceptable to kill the cats in order to save the mice and birds?

vegans are not against self-survival, if a coyote is physically attacking you then it is not morally wrong to kill it, if a coyote is minding it's own business in the wild, doing what it is designed to do (hunt animals) it is morally wrong to kill and interfere with it. it is simply unnecessary death. it also bottlenecks the eco-system.

vegans aren't against killing someone or something that threatens your own life.

>a child is completely different from a wild animal
how so? because the child isn't 'wild'? would it be okay to kill a feral child then?
it's a 'name the trait' fallacy.


thank you for being open-minded, i applaud you for that. it is really just a matter of logic and morality. it is difficult to change something you have grown up doing for our whole lives.

i wasn't born vegan and used to eat meat as well


i think of it more as NOT doing something rather than changing what you do
NOT eating meat
instead of ONLY eating anything that isn't meat

>>13026189
That's why I don't.

One of a few blessings of living in a predominantly agricultural state.

>>13026185
It's a capitalist society, nothing's more sacred than money.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/how-indias-sacred-cows-are-beaten-abused-and-poisoned-to-make-leather-for-high-street-shops-724696.html

>>13026191
Ooh right. That makes sense, although i tend to associate “abuse” with ongoing sufferig instead of terminating then and there. Also dont they turn to mush while in the cocoon stage? Like the entire worm body liquifies

>>13026217
I think they're being boiled alive or gassed, then you have to scratch out the remains from the cocoons. The thing is, if they hatched, they'd dissolve the silk in the cocoon in order to exit.

>>13026191
And they're gonna die a few days later anyway, so why the fuck do they care?

I used to be a vegan, for a good three years or so, so I know what I'm talking about here. Firstly, vegan 'leather' nowadays is definitely a reasonable option for people who don't want to buy genuine leather products. Most of it still looks incredibly tacky and plasticky, but there are several brands now that are doing realistic looking shoes, and I've never met anyone that could tell the difference (pic related). This is of course at the upper end of the scale, so you'll need to shell out at least 300 dollars for anything good. Beyond that, I'm not aware of anyone making better quality shoes. I'm only making the switch back to leather because: firstly, I eat meat now so who cares; and secondly because I am looking for the highest quality possible now. I'm perfectly happy with the shoes I have, and they still look great after years of use.

With regards to fur, don't know and don't care, but I'm not convinced there's a good wool alternative. The best wool is unbelievably soft and incredibly warm. Maybe there is a good alternative, but I've never found a good selection of stylish coats made of vegan 'wool'. I mean, I'm sure there's a reasonable alternative but I'm not going to spend twice what I normally would on a blind buy from some place thousands of miles away.

>>13026236
I think it's rather got to do with being consistent in their stance against animal derived product, if you mean why peta bothers with silk.

As for me, I'm no saint. I've copped a few leather items since I started eating vegan one year ago.

>>13026168
so if a person has an IQ of 20 or less it's okay to kill them?
>>13026190
why are you choosing to ignore the fact that there are alternatives than directly buying catfood that contains meat such as scrapings, companies that are vegan-focused or lab grown meat in the future for the time being that we still have domestic animals?

it isn't an over night change, there will be meat eaters for tons and tons of years and domestic animals as well
that doesn't excuse human beings personally wearing or eating dead animals for their own taste pleasure of comfort

perhaps there will be a system in the future where there are less domesticated animals and if there are there can be an ethical way to have them naturally obtain the vitamins they are required to have in order to live without having cows or fish or other animals murdered through human-intervention, cats cannot naturally kill a cow. cats can naturally eat fish and mice and everything else as they were designed to do.

just because the world can't be perfect does not mean we shouldn't be as morally good as possible given whatever situation we have.

>much like the liberal ideological/rhetorical fallacy of tolerance.
i don't understand this or know what it has to do with the topic
>>13026203
>You have a warped sense of knowledge about animal husbandry
how so?
>They can tolerate some, not substitute their entire diet with it
you're right
every dog is different but see above
the simple fact is that buying animal products for a human's own consumption is immoral and causes unnecessary death and suffering of sentient beings

>>13026236
you're gonna die eventually? why shouldn't someone kill you?

>>13026263
Not sure if you’ve looked this up but you are aware of how much it costs to lab produce meat right? What i’m saying is we wont be having any of that available in the near future. How do you think cat food is made anyway, premium cuts? And how would a “vegan focused” catfood company source their products? You’re also asking to substitute whole food products with vitamin supplementation which imo is more abuse. Meat subs its not even that simple, meat has amino acids and multiple other components. Its not also as simple as feeding cat whey and having them live healthy happy lives. If you had any awareness on how that works then I would have said otherwise on animal husbandry. Your proposed ideas are just as bad as the industrial farming you opose

I'm plant based for about two years now but still wear leather shoes sometimes

I'll prob stop buying leather soon,like beginning of 2018. Never wore fur

>>13026265
>getting this upset over worms

>>13026296
okay? they were just possible ideas

you're right i am not an expert on domesticated animals, i don't have much experience in pet owning anyways
still doesn't make eating or wearing animals morally acceptable
just because domesticated animals need meat to survive doesn't mean we do

>>13026311
not upset

on the possibility that worms have sentience (as far as i know there is no decisive evidence on either side) i'd rather not take the risk of contributing to their pain and suffering

They're dying whether you wear leather or not.

>>13026158

>>13026317
>not upset

>>13025007
All thrifted and secondhand clothes are fundamentally vegan, they're also more environmentally friendly than vegan clothes bought new.

>>13025021
Kek, hope you said that ironically

saw this thread in the catalog and was expecting shit like pic related

>>13025711
wew, I didn't expect this thread to get this many posts. Thanks for that. many here are fucked in the head and utterly deluded but I see there are quite some thinking beings here aswell. Like I said, I don't want to push anyone to any believe so I won't but thanks for letting me know how you guys feel about all this shit

>>13025234
Cow leather is a byproduct of the meat industry.

Cow, pig, goat, sheep, and rabbit are all byproducts of the food industry. Raising these animals just for their skin would be a massive waste.

Additionally, despite what they want you think, there's virtually no wasted animal parts in the food industry. If theres a market for it they sell it.

Things like coyote abd beaver are trapped. And that is controlled through management programs. Beavers are almost exclusively trapped from areas where they're a nuisance.

Wild fox is mainly a russian thing. And the market pelts like blue fox are all ranched.

>>13025007
Killing and eating things that don't want to die is super fucking scummy but I do it anyway because It's comfy.

Just like how I could give food or money to the homeless, but don't.

I, and everyone else, just don't care. It's the last thing on our minds.

However if people were making leather out of parrots, I'd travel and go on a shooting spree.

>>13026111
Nice pic, mate. I know that imagining that sort of world is not a solution but maintaining this vision is important, writing it down and talking about it is important for it to become more widely attractive to future generations. In practice I tend to buy and wear lots of wool and leather but all of my leather and most of my wool clothes are >30, some ~100 years old. The only thing I bought fresh were my merino shirts, underwear and socks, which are very high quality, last a long time and I only need very few of. Calling out the slaughter houses and animal cruelty is just as important a vision to maintain for future generations. There is no way to stop the problem now, as the people behind this industry are too powerful and the population at large is under their spell. All we can do is build an alternative modernity through cultural means that among our children and children'S children will flourish into a new social reality.

>>13027257
I make leather out of parrots, you wouldn't believe how well the iPhone sleeves I make from it sell.

Ethics and fashion don't mix.
The people who bitch at me for wearing inherited mink are the same people dragging along a choker-wearing 9 year old girl, most likely with "S L U T" written across her ass.
Try putting morals into fashion before you force ethics in there.

>>13025653
cotton is a plant

>>13026423
>Kek
I hope (You) said (That) ironically

>>13027746
ok i guess fast fashion is uhhh good now

also cool example of a person that actually exists and that you definitely encountered

>leather is ethical

>>13027746
What are you even saying? That people can be hypocrites? That's a totally convincing argument.

Instead, let's think about how hard it is to be an ethical consumer when supply chains are largely unknown, unknowable, and potentially unchangeable from a consumer perspective.

>>13029340
>posts a feed cow in a conversation about leather

>>13029340
le appeal to emotions

Fur is tacky but most of all it's the product of what's probably the most disgusting farming in the world. Guess what, tons of fur farms are located in China and Russia. Subhumans
Can't get dressed properly without leather tho

>>13029362
edgelord can't recognise harm when he sees it

>>13025030
Yah. I mean, if we're gonna eat animals, we may aswell wear them. I really do not understand people that are against wearing leather but are fine eating meat.

>>13030844
First ban clothing, then consuming. You'll never satisfy a social movement. Look at where feminism is at now.

>>13025525
How's that?

>>13025653
How come there is a humane way to capture and hunt animals but a humane way to capture and hunt humans is out of the question?

>>13030872
I don't even consider myself an edgy person but I really wish there were more clothing options made with human materials

Wouldn't it be possible to make leather out of a corpse? Like having a pair of high quality, long-lasting boots made out of a deceased parent or something seems like it would be a really nice keepsake

>>13027257
Yeah it's pretty cool how our secular society made us all proud of being hypocrites and amoral.

>>13030889
Pretty impossible considering deceased's relative would likely forbid it
>>13030891
lmao

>>13030889
There are these.

CCP has done some stuff with human hair -- sweater, armless coat, tie.

>>13030889
Sure. There's the problem that fashion is largely about boasting what you're wearing, and wearing the skin of someone will sit wrong with pretty much everyone unless there's a RADICAL change in society. But that doesn't sound like a bad idea (unless human leather is bad which it could iduno)

>>13030899
Yeah, but I mean you could still use the materials in a way that isn't trying to be outrageous

Even something like coat buttons made of human bone

Pic related best belts I’ve ever bought. I’ve had the bottom one for 9 years.

get in here vegan lads

discord
.gg/w8c9Bcg