/diy/ - Do It Yourself

>>62613
>You, Mrs and kid???
Nope, close friends and kindred spirits.

>>62615
>I say a little ways because we live in Northwestern Ontario and our winters, especially where we live, is notorious.

It's not impossible! I did some reading about successful high tunnels in Canada. I don't think they are productive all year round, but they will at least extend your season enough to bring you closer to sustaining yourselves.

>>62604
>What is your source of income: your farm?

The farm is the main source of income. I also do freelance web design work, and I work on contract for a non-profit organization doing tech consulting as well as grant proposal writing. Of the three people that live on the farm, one has a full-time job elsewhere which also helps pay the bills.

>>62595
>Also how much would I be producing if I had a 2'x6' box or should I use individual pots for each plant?

Depending on what you're growing...if you wanted to mix it up, you could get 6 kale plants, 2 cabbage or lettuce plants (I would suggest lettuce, if you harvest it right it will grow back in a month and you can keep harvesting), and 2-4 pole bean plants. The beans you'll have to find a way to grow them up poles, but it's possible.

>>62569
>I live in a humble apartment in Northern IL and I really want to grow some kale or cabbage infront of my northfacing screendoor window. Now I'm thinking I could start with greenbeans but I worry that this winter weather and the lowlight I'm thinking I may just make a sweet little table and grow them with a light. Thoughts?

Do you mean inside or outside of your door? If outside, you could definitely grow some kale. Maybe just get a small floating cover cloth on it (you could find it at a garden center) whenever it freezes. It might last all winter. However it's way too late to try to start that now and get a harvest any time soon. If you started it now and kept the seedling inside till about february, then put it outside and protected it in frost, you'd have some early kale in mid-March or so. Or if you start it in February and put it outside in March, you'll have some by April.

As far as planting inside by a window, you're right about the dwindling sunlight being a problem right now. You probably couldn't get anything to significantly grow past seedling just on sunlight in a window right now. I don't have any experience growing inside with lights. All I could say is make sure you get a powerful enough light. They make lights for starting seedlings which wouldn't be powerful enough to grow a food plant, so just know what you're getting when you go for it. Good luck.

>>62474
>One of my chickens died recently. There was some blood on the last egg she laid. What the fuck happened?

That's almost impossible to know without a professional necropsy. If you have more chickens , and another dies similarly, check with local agricultural resources to find out where you can take the dead chicken to get tested. It shouldn't be too expensive and it will let you know whether or not you have a potential disease or something. Be warned that if they find something harmful and contagious, they will "quarantine" your place (no animals in or out).

If she didn't show any signs of being sick, and just randomly died after laying a bloody egg, it doesn't sound much like disease. If it was one of the cross breeds meant for high production, it's possible something just went wrong inside. They're prone to health issues like that. If it were a heritage breed, I would definitely watch your other hens closely.

>>62468
>I grew some peppers in my yard last season, and they were plagued by caterpillars. I would go to work and everything was fine, and come home to find nothing but stalks. What's an organic way to deal with these guys outside of picking them off by hand?

There are a few options. Like anon pointed out, beneficial insects can normally do the trick if you have enough of an ecosystem for them to thrive. If there isn't much foliage in your yard then they may not stay there, or they may die from overpopulation. For caterpillars, I would suggest praying mantis or beneficial nematodes. Local garden centers should be able to hook you up with these.

There are also organic pesticides which will work. I said earlier, I don't know if these are much better for the environment than synthetics, though they are better for the plants and safer for humans. Spinosad is the only kind I have used, and I've only used it once in a dire situation.

If my plants are established enough to not be harmed by chickens, I'll let a few roam around in the garden for a few days, and they'll take care of all the caterpillars.

>>62064
>This any good OP? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1P6_M-VnGo

That's way beyond good. These kinds of systems are so incredibly inspiration in the sustainable food movement. Someday I hope to be involved in agriculture in the same way this man is. Some how turn the business into a non-profit and help nourish the lower-income communities. What he said about how families cut healthy food out of their budget first to pay bills is depressingly true.

Those systems are also very innovative. Passively heated greenhouses are becoming a reality and with them, the potential for local food in off-seasons recognized. I wonder how the keep birds out of those worms though...

Thanks much for the video. My weekend will be full of stories and workshops focusing on systems like this at the NC Sustainable Ag conference. I'm incredibly excited.

>>61957
>Enjoy your low yield and pests.
You obviously don't know much about organic growing.

>>61916
>do you think I could live of my land like you do?
If you used high-tunnels like ours and grew the right sorts of crops, you probably could. You might need to store more in the winter, like potatoes or canned goods (there's not much that can't be canned). What you could grow in the tunnels in winter would be pretty limited too, but possible. Other than that, the rest of the year is amazing growing weather for many crops.

>>61871
>how do you insulate your chickens efficiently?
In the wintertime, we put a thermal foil material (insulated with small air bubbles) around their coops. This keeps them warm enough to make it through near 0 degree Fahrenheit temperatures at night. We've never lost a chicken due to cold weather.

>>61137
>Hops
I've thought about growing hops before. My brother has the ultimate goal of starting a brewery and would like me to grow organic hops for him. I've started to view agriculture through the lens of efficiency in output of nutrients, so hops are rather useless in that sense. I think it would be a decent venture though.

>Migrant workers
A lot of people view this sort of labor as exploitation. And in some cases, it is. But in reality, these workers are very grateful for the opportunity to come here in certain seasons to work. Opportunities to make that sort of money don't exist where they come from. Some farm owners take advantage of them and treat them similarly to slaves, but some have great relationships and bring in the same workers every year. It can be beneficial for both the farmer and the worker.

>Farmall Cub
We're sticking to our two-wheel tractor to give an example of how farming is possible with a lower budget, but man I'd love a cub.

Also, you'll notice the roots in the rows in that picture...those are bermuda grass roots and are the bane of my existence. They will spread for 3 or 4 feet underground before they even need to pop up for sunlight. The roots are so tangled and massed that they cause major problems for most plants. They were largely cleaned out of those rows before we planted, and then about 3-4 hours a week is spent just trying to take care of that grass.

Bumpin with a simple example of a small plot of land worked and ready to be planted. This particular plot is about 45' long 32" wide rows with 3 lines of drip irrigation on each row. We raise the earth for better drainage from the irrigation. Depending on the season, sometimes we don't raise rows or lay down irrigation and just let the rain do the work.

I'll be back here later this afternoon, feel free to ask questions, talk shit, or troll.

>>61092
>If one wanted to get into agriculture, what would you suggest as a good "first plant"? Herbs? A simple vegetable?
I would honestly just try a few different kinds of easy and hardy plants. Kale is one of the easiest, healthiest, and most productive things you could grow. It grows in the spring and fall, you can harvest leaves weekly, it's resistant to cold weather and fairly resistant to warm weather (though it can get bitter if it gets hot). Lettuce is also particularly easy, and if you harvest it right, it will grow back in about a month, so you can continue to harvest it. Different kinds of lettuce to better in different climates and seasons. Tomatoes are a good way to break into caring for a plant. They are easy enough, but they require consistent water and cultivation, a little work, and you have to watch them for pests and disease. They're easy but more involved than the others I mentioned. Also green beans, as anon said, fix nitrogen to soil, so it's good to plant those ahead of most leafy greens.

>Also, do you think it would be reasonable for someone to raise a few chickens for eggs? What would the cost of that be, roughly?
Very reasonable, I know more than a few people with backyard chicken flocks. The cost will probably be proportionate to however much you spend on eggs at the grocery store. You might even make a small profit if you get more eggs than you can eat and sell them. The amount you spend on food will vary on season and quality of the food. If you eat a lot of eggs, it will be well worth the investment, and they're fun to raise too.

>>61070
>Actually, there are many industries that still work this way, and it's still a purely capitalist situation.

I would agree, but there is a major difference in a system like this implemented through capitalism. Money becomes the main resource, and it becomes easy for cunning and greedy people to skim resources off the top. Resources are then unfairly distributed.

I wouldn't ever advocate a system where participation is required in a sustaining system. I think people should be allowed to be greedy and cunning. But I don't wish to participate in a system in where the resources that I require or produce benefits somebody disproportionately to the amount of work they put into the system. Money was created to make trade easier, but it also allows for easier exploitation.

>Do you ever hope to expand to a point where you are no longer doing all the manual labor, in a company that has like 20+ employees?
Probably not. We have plenty of help from volunteers from our CSA, interns and apprentices volunteering for the learning and experience. Sometimes if there is some hard manual labor to be done I'll pay someone on a contract basis. At most I think we'll probably expand to a point of 5-10 workers part-time or full-time.

>You seem to be confident in the process of aquaculture; do you ever dream of being the man who can successfully implement that system on a national or global scale?
I have no experience with it, I've only read a lot about it and seen some pretty amazing and interesting stuff. Maybe once we reach an equilibrium here, I would expand into something like that to help explore and implement those systems where they are needed. My personal project right now is learning the best ways for people to grow food in their back yard and encouraging people to become less dependent on Big Agriculture.

>>60972
In my mind, I have them outside during the summer, roaming around my food forest, eating worms and pests and shit. But what would they eat in the winter months? Corn?
In a self-sufficient system, you would be growing and milling your own feed, which means that you'd have to grow enough grain and soy for a whole year. They require a wide variety of nutrients so you'd have to grow a wide variety of cereal grains and such. If you have the land and the ability to harvest and store it, it becomes a pretty easy thing to do. You would have to feed them more in the winter than the summer.

>We have like three months of pretty cold weather, so I imagine I'd have to heat the chicken house, too.
How cold? The heritage breed chickens are usually very hardy. The only ones that might have a problem are the ones bred for production. Otherwise, having a small enough coop helps them trap body heat and keeps them warm in the winter. If you live in a very cold climate, you could definitely find a way to passively heat the houses. A type of solar water heater could radiate enough heat to keep them through the night.

>As you've said, being self-sufficient is hard.
I personally feel it would be better to exist as a community rather than a self-sufficient system. Maintaining your own system fed by another system, which feeds other system, and so on, would be ideal. Communities like this are completely possible but rarely even thought about in a capitalist society.

>>60873
>farmer a would you sell me some fertile guinea fowl eggs

If I could find them :p. Our guineas have a pretty wide territory. The clutches I'm able to find I usually hatch myself or give them to my 4H kids.

>>60227
>where did you learn everything you know?
I had no formal education in agriculture. I studied independently very diligently for a while. I took some free agriculture classes on iTunes U. I went around to farmers' markets and asked producers about their systems. I volunteered a bit at some local farms to see exactly how it was done. A degree in agriculture would be invaluable, but it's not necessary. Hands-on experience is the best things you can do, and the agriculture program would have to offer plenty of that.

>i want to do almost exactly what you do except without animals.
I said a couple posts ago, this is possible, but very hard. I have a very knowledgeable friend who just grows produce sustainably. He survives, but works constantly for little payoff. It takes a lot of time, work, and knowledge. to build a produce business from the ground up.

>how did you get the startup money and how did you learn what you needed?
The farm land we were able to buy for just as much as I was able to sell my townhome in town for (property value had skyrocketed from when it was purchased...got really lucky). The rest came from things like grants, retirement funds, savings, and financing. I learned what I needed from visiting farms doing something similar to what I wanted to do.

>is there anyone who lives/works with you?
3 people live on the farm, one works full-time elsewhere and part-time on the farm, me and the other work full-time here.

>i'm 19; were you involved in this stuff at my age?
Not at all. I was going to school for anthropology. I wanted to teach at a university.

>if so, how would you go about it differently if you could do it again?
I would study agriculture in school. Networking is as important as knowledge and experience. I'd say I got lucky being able to do this and having it work...most people can't just start farming out of nowhere.

Good luck, I hope you're able to find your highest excitement.

>>60861
>I think you might be overlooking the fertilizer thing though. Or maybe you just live in a high farming density area. One woman I know bags up her goat manure and sells it as it doesn't require composting like other types.
That's definitely the case. There are about 25 livestock farms in a 30 mile radius around here. We get tons of cow manure for free. Where you are, it would definitely be different. I'd imagine people search far and wide for natural fertilizers. Maybe you could make a business out of it? Goat manure isn't the best fertilizer, though it's decent. Chicken manure is very high quality fertilizer so I would look into that if I were you. It's rather easy to localize too, since they're kept in coops at night. Our goats poop everywhere...it would be impossible to collect it.

>I wasn't being hypocritical as I eat meat as well and am not naive as to where it comes from. I am just trying to learn how to live as healthy a lifestyle as I can.
Sorry, I wasn't trying to call you hypocritical yourself. I was really just stating a random opinion. I've been called a murderer by someone who eats chicken at KFC before. I thought it was pretty funny.

>>60842
I'd say that's a pretty decent number. It would really depend on soil fertility, sunlight, climate, pest problems...a very large number of variables. There are also things you can do to make more efficient use of space.

>>60835
>I don't really have a question but I'd like to know if you think it's possible to produce the majority of foods you need for your family in a smaller scale version of what you do, and also how much you find yourself having to go to the store to get. Obviously I wouldn't be growing wheat or anything like that.

I'd say it's definitely possible considering climate. If you're looking into aquaponics, it would be even more possible. One of the things I do is section off yard-size spaces to find out the most efficient way to produce food in the back yard for someone. Many plants are very prolific and offer great harvests on a weekly basis. Chickens are easy to take care of and help fertilize soil, not to mention eggs are one of the most nutrient-packed things you can eat. I'd say, after a few years of practice and experimenting with different systems, you could easily produce 80% of your family's food in a large size yard. This is also dependent on dietary requirements. Different people require different diets and some can't sustain so easily on their own.

As far as "going to the store," we normally get what food we can't produce for ourselves from our farmers' markets. We either trade or just pay cash. We'll go to the grocery store about once a month for random things.

I would say go for it. It would be such a great way to raise children. Getting them involved in growing food, becoming more self-sustaining and independent from the system. You could teach them some great values in a lifestyle like that. It makes me really happy to hear about people thinking like this.

>>60474
>Are your hens free-range? If so, how do you keep predators such as coyotes at bay?
"Free-range" would be accurate but the requirements for "free-range" are pretty lacking to carry that label. Our chickens are completely free out on pasture with no restraints. The only day-time predators we have problems with are eagles or hawks. There is a large crow population surrounding our land which chase away any raptor which flies near. In the last year we've only lost 1 chicken to an eagle.

At night, the chickens put themselves away in their coops. We close the doors, and they're safe. If we didn't close the doors, they would almost certainly be killed in one night. Possums will kill every chicken in a coop. Raccoons and skunks will also do some damage. Weasels, foxes, coyotes, bobcats...we have them all, but they're all night-time predators and our houses do very well to protect the chickens.

>>60436
>>60442
>>60464
>Milk.

You do have to keep an animal producing babies to have continuous milk production. I don't know about cows, but as far as goats go, dairy goats have to have a kid every year and they will produce milk year round. Compared to our meat goats, which produce milk for just a few months until their kid is fully grown. They will not just produce milk if you keep milking them. If this were true, babies in nature would never be weened from their mothers.

There is also killing in egg production. A chicken can live up to 10 years, but is only a productive layer for 2. Your profits would be squashed feeding that chicken for 8 extra years with no production. After 2 years, we process them and sell them as stewing hens.

>>60401
>What are your thoughts on no kill farming?
Whatever floats your boat. Someday I'll probably move away from meat production. I have nothing against vegetarians and vegans. It's a choice that I respect. However, I do feel that if someone eats meat but is unwilling to kill their own food, it is slightly hypocritical.

>Can you make enough money off of just eggs and goat milk to support them throughout their whole life?
Eggs are not the best for revenue. They sell well and bring people in but they don't provide the best income. They're not terrible but they're not reliable for money. Milk is almost impossible for small farms to sell for human consumption because of FDA regulations. There's no way I could even think about doing goat milk unless regulations change. Unless you are already in the dairy business/have a huge sum of start-up money, dairy is not a good sector of agriculture to try to start in. Thank the FDA for squishing small farmers and supporting large corporate agriculture.

I do know some who only sell produce. It's possible but not very lucrative for a long time. Eggs and produce together might be decent after a few years (10 probably) of establishing a customer base and expanding production.

>And I wonder if you are using thrown away food to feed the animals wouldn't you actually make MORE money by letting the animal live out its life if you made money off the fertilizer?
Considering we use 100% of the fertilizer our animals produce, there's not much money to be made.

Either way, you're going to reach a limit of how many animals you can hold. Killing some to sell and replacing them with new ones creates a huge income stream and is a much more efficient way for producing food. You'd get the same amount of fertilizer if you didn't kill them as if you did, because you replace every animal you kill (ideally).

Fertilizer isn't that easy to sell, either. Lots of livestock farmers willing to just give away manure.