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/diy/ - Do It Yourself

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824713 No.824713 [Reply] [Original]

SO I need to install something heavier on my back porch to run some power tools and such. There's already one there but its a gay ass GFI outlet at 120 15 amp. and as most know most power tools don't like this... I crawled up into the attic to check the wire, and this shit is so thin and flimsy ain't no fucking way it would pass code now days, the house was built in the late 80s. when SUPER CHEAP AND SUPER QUICK went hand in hand...

Anyways I was planning on to hire an electrician that would work with me, I was gonna buy everything he would need, the plug/outlet/#10 wire, the breaker and run it myself for him, basically all he would have to do was install it and make sure it worked.. my insurance would throw a shit-fit if I just DIY'd it without a license and my house caught fire or some stupid unrelated shit.

So my question is I want a 120 volt, 30 amp outlet. basically I can install it to the existing outlet out back.. but I also want a 220 volt outlet. But I only have 1 outlet outback and all my outside walls are concrete cinderbricks.. Is it even possible using the existing panel to run from the panel [that's in my garage] then run the sets of wires I need to a "concrete wall" I build in my backyard? Basically run the wires underground up into a cinderbrick wall so I could have more then 1 outlet. sure it would look kinda of redneck/trashy but no one looks into my backyard anyway..

OR would it be better to just build a small shed and just have them run a main to it and hook up a box and shit? I mean realistically I figured the before would be cheaper, but I don't really know how much sparkys charge for all this shit. I know its enough money that you'd expect them to suck you off too when their done.

>> No.824725

Anything is possible man.

Also I couldn't really comment on pricing, it varies so much by area.

>> No.824727
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824727

>>824713

"Sparky's" rape people for shit like this. Honestly, a monkey could run the wires that you need.

Are you really that uncomfortable that you need to hire an electrician or are you solely worried about your insurance company. If the latter, you should really consider doing the job yourself. I don't know your current educational status, but consider that almost all electricians are tradesmen who spent the majority of their highschool career in shop class.

Local electrician got my girl the other day for 300 bucks to dig a 2 foot trench and bury #10 to her freestanding garage. He came back and I gave him shit and he had some line about needing an education to do it. Fucker could barely use the English language correctly and had rotting front teeth.

Learn how to do simple stuff like this now and be free of "tradesman" for life.

>> No.824729

>>824727

Good point here.

You'll always get gouged on trench work though, because it's shitty work.

>> No.824731

>>824727
Okay, you need to hire an electrician for your insurance. not for any other reason. you do something yourself, your house goes up in flames, the insurance hires inspectors to go over your house.

>find wiring that's not known to county.

>insurance wont pay up.

they are fucking scum bags and look for any reason not to pay. you have a insured and licensed electrician to say "yup its done right" then have county come by and inspect it for a stupid fee' for a guy to basically walk around outside, walk around inside, and do nothing by stare at his clipboard and not even inspect fucking anything [that's what the shitbag did when I had the house re plumed.]

>> No.824733

Here are some considerations that relate to the Canadian Electrical Code.

All residental plugs must be sheltered. Outdoor wall plugs must be GFCI, but soffit plugs do not because even with wind, they're not going to get very wet. You can get special cover boxes to cover the outlet.

for the 120 volt outlet you cannot get 30 amp plugs in the traditional style, you can get dryer or RV style ones. There are other options if you're looking to run multiple tools at once however. I run 3 conductor wire from a 2 pole breaker as shown in the image attached. You just need to break the tab on the hot side of the outlet. This uses a 240 (2 pole) breaker and just seperates it. This is because black to red = 240, black to white = 120, and red to white = 120.

What are you planning to run on the 240v outlet and how far from the breaker panel will it be?

>> No.824734

>>824731
sorry for the retarded spelling, new phone not use to the keyboard yet..

>> No.824736

>>824733
If I go with the 220 it would be MAX 50 feet of line, and the transformer is in my yard so I have very little voltage drop.

>> No.824737

>>824727
Dig the trench yourself then, and do it by the electrical code. That means proper depth, and sand on the bottom. An electrician doesn't lower his rate because he's digging, They're going to charge you his rate no matter what he's doing.

>> No.824739

>>824736
It all depends on how much current you're drawing. at 30 amps #10 should do you fine for 50 feet of wire.

>> No.824742

>>824739
What about the 220volt? the 30 amps was for a single 120volt outlet.

Lets say I'm trying to run 5 HP electrical motors. about 3725 watts. 3 phase motor. how much juice should I be looking at with 220volt, I heard it cuts down by half the amps needed being on 220 so would a 20amp be more then enough?

>> No.824744
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824744

>>824733

This is the type of outlet box he is referring to.

Commonly called "in-use" covers.

Also, 30A GFI breakers are pretty pricey. Keep that in mind.

>> No.824746

>>824742

You have three phase service at your home? Using a VFD?

>> No.824748

>>824744
well for one that wasn't me, the OP. but yeah I know things get pricey hence why im trying to save a few bucks offering to run the wiring myself. so the dickbag sparkys can only charge for an hour, not like 4.

How much would you all figure it would cost to run a whole new box to an outside building in the backyard? At this rate it actually seems easier, not cheaper.

>> No.824749

>>824746
Not sure what it uses, but I'm pretty sure. As my AC unit is pretty beefy and when they installed it I think I asked about the motor and they told me it was a 3phase something or another.

>> No.824752

>>824749

Alright.

3725w at 220/3ph is like 10 amps

If you're mistaken and it's single phase, it's 17~.

>> No.824756

>>824752
so either way a 20 would be pretty safe? one way or another I'd just end up with moar juice?

>> No.824766
File: 20 KB, 1152x829, duplex 20A.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
824766

>>824742
You cannot get residential 30 amp recepticals, except for RV plugs and 240 recepticals. You can run two 15 amp circuits, one 20, or two 20 amps, but 20 is as high as a 120v recepticle goes.

Here is the drawing I forgot to attach. This is showing two 15 amp circuits on one outlet.
As for the 240, you likely don't have 3 phase in your house, that would be expensive as fuck. Your motor will likely have a 3 phase and single phase diagram on it, if not your 3 phase motor will not work on 240v single phase.

I would go with a 30 amp circuit on the 240 for your 5hp motor. This would allow for upgrades down the road and won't cost much more.

>> No.824770

>>824742
220 [V] at 20 [A] is 4400 [W]

>> No.824777

>>824766
but what gauge wire? still looking at #10?

>> No.824787

>>824777
for the 240, #10 copper. For the 120 #14.