ITT: Making money general/Stocks im about to drop some money on shares and shit does anyone here play with the market? any tips on how to do good in the stock market? what mite b good, what to nope.jpeg what online brokers/firms do you use?

File: 1.92 MB, 1698x1131, moneystack.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Tue Apr 16 03:13:23 2013 No.437910 [Reply] [Original]

ITT: Making money general/Stocks

im about to drop some money on shares and shit

does anyone here play with the market?

any tips on how to do good in the stock market? what mite b good, what to nope.jpeg

what online brokers/firms do you use?

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 16 09:44:22 2013 No.438009 If you had a good way of making money would you tell others how you do it and risk ruining a good thing?

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 16 16:52:57 2013 No.438122 maybe this can help you get started: http://en.tradimo.com/home/

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 16 22:34:42 2013 No.438298 Sell in May and go away. Methinks you should play around in investopedia simulator before you lose all your monies. You can try UVXY and hope the market tanks all summer.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 16 23:11:12 2013 No.438327 Steal precious recyclable metals from foreclosed or for sale houses. Then sell it to recycling plants 2 counties away from where you stole it.

Anonymous Tue Apr 16 23:41:28 2013 No.438350

At the risk of fucking up a potentially highly profitable enterprise, I've been experimenting with the use of ANNs in an automated trading simulation.

Since starting this testing a couple weeks ago, it has almost consistently yielded profits in excess of a half percent, even on bad days for the market.

I'm currently contemplating how to lower the frequency of the trades without sacrificing profits to minimize transaction costs. If all goes well, I'm hoping to take on the real stock market in 2014.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 16 23:44:13 2013 No.438352 >>438350 does that cover trading fees as well? most sites charge you upfront and then refund the amount you are discounted at the end of the quarter for high volume trading.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 16 23:54:13 2013 No.438356 >>438352 At the moment, it does not cover trading fees. Currently trying to tackle that issue, since they would drain me at the rate my system currently trades. Even if I cut it down to 4-5 trades a day, they would rob me of most of my profits.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 00:07:13 2013 No.438361 >>438356 you might want to consider retooling your system for a currency exchange market like BTC-E. The fees are much less prohibitive.

Anonymous Wed Apr 17 00:29:13 2013 No.438368

>>438361
I'll look into it.

Do BTC-E or other currency exchanges offer any sort of API, and how detailed is the data typically provided? The ANN I use considers a couple dozen different factors, and so just an exchange rate alone probably won't be enough for it to have any sort of effectiveness.

Anonymous Wed Apr 17 00:35:58 2013 No.438371

>>438368

Interactive Brokers.

I've been developing my autonomous trading engine for almost three years now. I've had the most luck with 5sec bars. Playing regime switching strategies and short term mean reversion. non-linear strategies are where it's at these days. there's so much garbage out there.

no single strategy works all the time, so you can't just hardcode a magic trading solution. i had to build an engine that can support any trading model i can throw at it, and any portfolio model as well.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 00:44:43 2013 No.438374 File: 1.02 MB, 1681x1050, obligatory screenshot.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>438371 forgot my obligatory screenshot.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 00:52:46 2013 No.438377 >>438374 wow. Good on you, anon.

Anonymous Wed Apr 17 01:06:31 2013 No.438381
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>>438377
thank you. it's not ready yet, still a few bugs to work out and some strategies to tweak. when it's beat-steady-knockin in a week or two i'mma do an AMA.

Anonymous Wed Apr 17 01:17:02 2013 No.438388

>>438371
Thanks, I'll take all of that into consideration.

It was actually about three years ago that I began thinking about this; an anon, on /r9k/ if I recall, described how he had developed a relatively effective autonomous engine (noted that it didn't yield a ton but at least covered rent), which I found fascinating and inspiring, and I started my own project about a year later. I can't help but wonder if that was yourself.

Anonymous Wed Apr 17 01:21:32 2013 No.438389

internet says avoid these:

Coca Cola
Maggi Garnier
Tommy Hilfiger
Kotex
Helena Rubinstein
NOKIA
Banana Republic
Selfridges &Co
Wonderbra
La Roche-Posay
Nursery World
Lancôme Paris
Victorias Secret
Léggs
La Mer
Harper Collins
Hillshire Farm
Kia Ora
Home Depot
Georgia Lightning
Estee Lauder
Buitoni
DIM
Perrier
Just My size
Lindex
Aramis
origins
HEMA
Perscriptives
Vichy
Playtex
Structure
Aoste
Bryan
Lovable
BallPark
Dohwe Egberts
Kotex
Mast Industries
Nur die
The White barn candle
River Island
Pauls
Johnson&Johnson
Sanez
McDonalds
Kraft
IBM
Ambi Pur
Jimmi Dean
ICQ
Levi's
Intel
Redken
Kleenex
Carrefour
Calvin Klein
SKY
Revlon
Huggies
Kiwi
TIME
Nestle
Sunkist
Pepsi
Frutopia
Star
Kit Kat
Loreal
Libby's
Kimberly-Clark
Sara Lee
Gap
Boss
Gossard
KFC
Schweppes
Armani
20 century Fox
Ralph Lauren
Donna Karan
Maybelline
Starbucks
The Times
Danone
Disney
Marks & Spencer

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 02:52:45 2013 No.438416 >>437910 Spam every where you can about your "hot stock." Dump when price rises?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 03:23:31 2013 No.438425 >>438416 That's apparently illegal.

Anonymous Wed Apr 17 10:08:49 2013 No.438511

>>438425
>That's apparently illegal.
>apparently

what country do you live in? I give my "friends" stock tips all the time. They buy and tell all their friends about the great deal. Your not an insider, you don't work for the company, you're not a broker, you're just a dude with the right to free speech.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 10:24:04 2013 No.438513 >>438511 >you're just a dude with the right to free speech. Not if you live in the USA. This made the news fairly recently. I believe it was an american athlete that posted a tip on his twitter account.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 10:43:35 2013 No.438520 >>438513 but guys on tv can talk about hot stocks. citation for it being illegal to give your opinion on a stock?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 11:03:48 2013 No.438524 >>438511 It's fraud because you are manipulating the stock price with false or baseless claims. The practice is called "pump and dump", and if you do it on a large scale expect the financial authorities to take note.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 11:11:04 2013 No.438526 >>438513 It was actually 50 Cent: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/11/50-cent-makes-87-million-on-twitter-encourages-fans-to-invest-in-scheme_n_807327.html

Anonymous Wed Apr 17 11:17:20 2013 No.438527

>>438526

and as usual, this thread is full of shit:

”If [50 Cent] has a managerial role, interlocking business relationships, or if he’s on the board, the company could be dragged into a suit as well,” Andrew Stoltmann told the site.

it would be ok for 50 cent to "pump" ibm stock all day long.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 11:24:53 2013 No.438531 >>438527 Not if he held significant investments in IBM and didn't tell anyone about it.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 11:28:18 2013 No.438533 >>438513 >I believe it was an american athlete >It was actually 50 Cent >All black people look alike

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 11:53:03 2013 No.438549 File: 57 KB, 450x350, 50cent.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>438533 AIDS not even once.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 12:14:18 2013 No.438555 >>438531 >Not if he held significant investments in IBM and didn't tell anyone about it. lolwut? "hey bob, i'm making a killing on a stock, but I'm not saying which stock" it would kind of defeat the purpose, if he "didn't tell anyone"

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 12:21:05 2013 No.438557 >>438555 Lrn2 reading comprehension.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 12:23:49 2013 No.438558 the whole idea behind "share holding" is to promote the health of the company. Tell all your friends to invest in your investments. this does almost nothing to increase the price, but it will help stop it from dropping.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 12:46:03 2013 No.438562 >>438374 What sort of research did you do before hand?

Anonymous Wed Apr 17 12:55:01 2013 No.438566

>>438350 here.

Does anyone know where I can download source code to a STABLE stock market simulation client?

While I have great faith in the performance of my neural network and related algorithms, the simulation client itself (written from scratch) is a miserable pile of shit that has serious atomicity and integrity issues with respect to data operations, and quite frankly its bugginess is pissing me off.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 12:58:31 2013 No.438567 Invest in an indexed fund, fagets. Whatever you lose from not having a team of investors constantly trading the hottest stocks you gain back from not having to pay their salaries.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 13:11:02 2013 No.438574 For stocks: Buy diverse, keep and hold. Go read "A Random Walk Down Wall Street".

Anonymous Wed Apr 17 16:52:15 2013 No.438681

>>438520
yeah and those shows have legal disclaimers about being for entertainment. And an army of lawyers to back them up.

Insider trading is near universal. But the authorties only come after the loud, the stupid, or the bold. You have to at least try to keep it on the dl to maintain plausible deniability. So if you just go around telling everyone to buy this great new stock, you're likely going to get caught over it.

Anonymous Wed Apr 17 17:02:16 2013 No.438690

honestly I want to try an investment strategy that should work.

I call it Banking on Corruption:
1) It's not illegal for congress to inside trade. They are explicitly exempt from such legislation by the rationale that writing laws that effect the economy isn't considered insider knowledge. It's horseshit but it's a thing.
2) Their corporate donors are well known, since Citizens United no one has to be sneaky about campaign financing.
3) Watch each piece of legislation. Identify it's main supporters, then identify the common industry or companies that are funding them.
4) The actual content of the legislation doesn't matter as the pork is likely to be well hidden in legalese, but those in the know will know about it.
5) Invest in the backers of the legislation about to pass.

It's cynical as hell. But historically you can expect 200%-300% gains in a couple months if you pay attention. Bush had Exxon and Haliburton going into Iraq, a handful of the Pharm Giants when he restructured Medicade, and then all the Bailouts. Obama has had more Bailouts, "Education Stimulus" that favors banks giving out student loans, "Job stimulus" that again favored a few corporations tax wise, and Obamacare which was gangbusters for some of the big names in Medical and Insurance industry.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 17:12:01 2013 No.438700 >>438690 This guy might be onto something.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 21:08:30 2013 No.438867 >>438690 >>438700 +1 interested let's discuss

Anonymous Wed Apr 17 21:24:31 2013 No.438878

>>438700
>>438867
well the sequester is sort of throwing a wrench in things right now. But you would have to begin by cataloging at least the president, his cabinet, all of congress and the senate. Congress, Senate, and Presidential campaign doners should be easy to find, there's tons of nonprofits that track this stuff. It also wouldn't hurt to look into previous employers especially of cabinet members and any congressmen sitting on a particular committee.

Digging deeper you have to go into their personal relationships. Are they married into any big industries, are congressmen without direct connections likely to side with friends and allies who are, etc.

After that you start looking at each bill that comes up, look who submitted it, who supports it what the major opposition forces are. Bills might not even have to pass, you may be able to simply play off the volatility as a bill becomes more hotly debated. This is also kind of longer term as most bills don't go into effect until years pass, you would only be getting in at the speculation stage and selling before things settle down and people realize realized profits are a few years out. Guaranteed future returns should positively effect the stock either way.

But this isn't exactly simple, Congress, the presidents staff, and heads of federal departments numbers almost 600 people. Add to that tracking their family and close friends, and it becomes a very heavy research project.Not only that but you have to keep current on all of them.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 21:25:47 2013 No.438880 >>438878 sorry I know I keep switching between saying "congress" when I'm talking about the "house of reps" buy you get what I'm saying.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 21:30:46 2013 No.438888 >>438878 Have you done this before?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 21:34:01 2013 No.438891 >>438890 I'm interested, anon. Do you think we could make a project of this?

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 21:34:16 2013 No.438890 >>438888 no its just been an idea I've had going for the last decade or so. The problem is that it requires such a massive amount of research up front to even test. And the information is always changing. It would be a full time hobby for a while.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 21:36:02 2013 No.438893 >>438891 I don't see why not, might want to do some googling first, for all I know the majority of this info could be compiled on some campaign transparency website. Drop me a line at the junk email above and I'll send you some contact info.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 21:42:47 2013 No.438898 >>438893 I remember a "WhiteHouse Watch" website a while back, I'll check if I have it bookmarked.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 21:44:46 2013 No.438899 >>438893 Sent.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 22:00:47 2013 No.438905 >>438893 If anyone else is interested in getting involved in this send me an email. If we get enough people together I can put together a wiki or a google group or something.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 23:05:45 2013 No.438942 File: 267 KB, 594x392, 1361168168009.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>438905 I didn't get your mail anon, did you get mine? pls respond

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 23:14:30 2013 No.438946 >>438942 sorry went to take a shower and forgot about it. just sent a reply. I'll talk more tomarrow. I gotta get some sleep now though.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 23:26:01 2013 No.438951 >>438946 Alright, sounds good.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 17 23:36:17 2013 No.438957 >>438905 Make your findings dynamically updated and machine readable, and you'll have my interest.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 00:06:01 2013 No.438979 >>438957 >Implying you would bring anything to the table >Implying they would give you access to their work when they're trying to make money off of it.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 00:59:00 2013 No.438997 >>438979 >bring anything to the table That amount of research isn't going to be done without a lot of manpower. I responded just because what the fuck, I might as well try to get in on this. it sounds like a great idea.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 01:22:16 2013 No.439018 >>438997 >Make your findings dynamically updated and machine readable, and you'll have my interest I believe the phrase is "beggars can't be choosers".

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 01:23:17 2013 No.439020 >>439018 I'm a different poster. I came into the thread after it seemingly died.

Anonymous Thu Apr 18 01:34:15 2013 No.439034

>>438389
coca cola, intel, disney, goodle, ibm, and a few otherse are very stable

meaning, you won't get shit immediately

if its long term investing, you can probably take it out around retirement and have a nice cushy life

its still a risk, but a much safer one than say, apple, or some other new business

cokes aint goin nowhere.

Anonymous Thu Apr 18 02:21:31 2013 No.439070 [DELETED]

File: 14 KB, 175x175, Rippln-App-Icon.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>437910

You can always make money through Rippln' once it takes off. It's currently in the private back door stage but will be publicly released soon.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uNmZ7A-pV4

>>reply for how to join

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 03:14:31 2013 No.439094 >>438979 I'm a grad student doing AI research. I'd like to say I'm capable of bringing some interesting ideas to the table. I just don't want to put too much energy into anything that can't be automated.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 11:16:57 2013 No.439213 >>439070 >Advertising on /diy/ How do you expect to make any money if you can't even find the correct places to advertise?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 11:38:56 2013 No.439228 >>438566 Never mind, did a complete overhaul yesterday and the new client works quite well. Polite sage.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 16:06:25 2013 No.439339 Dear op, You facilitate finance, therefore you are the scum of the Earth, and maybe even of the Universe. You should rethink your life.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 16:45:40 2013 No.439356 >>439339 Fag.

Anonymous Thu Apr 18 16:47:25 2013 No.439357

>>439094
Hey there Anon.

I was one of the original two.

I haven't heard back from the other Anon yet, but if you email him he'll probably get back to both of us later.

I'm assuming most things can be automated, it's just an issue of finding reliable databases that we can mine for information.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 17:35:40 2013 No.439368 >>439034 >intel/ibm >stable someone doesnt keep up on tech news

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 18:29:40 2013 No.439380 >>437910 >what mite b good, what to nope.jpeg I promise you are no the next Gordon Gecko.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 19:46:26 2013 No.439411 I bought 5 shares of Apple in September, when it went for $640 a share. This seemed like a low at the time because it had just hit 700 a couple weeks before. Now it's below 400 and I've lost over a thousand dollars.

Anonymous Thu Apr 18 20:20:26 2013 No.439427

How much money you talking? I'm looking for investors all the time, but it would probably take $500,000 to make it worth our while. You could invest as much as you wanted though too, up to probably 2 or 3 million. 4-5% annual return on investment plus the investment itself will (hopefully/likely) gain value.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 20:29:25 2013 No.439432 >>437910 Just invest on bitcoins, it's way much more fun And you can profit as much easily

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 20:41:54 2013 No.439441 >>439432 I have registered account in mtgox and I am in wating line for authorization of my account. Bitcoins is quite bit better that stocks because there isn't as much of trading fees

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 22:04:39 2013 No.439489 >>439380 I promise you will never learn to speak English. Fag.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 22:19:09 2013 No.439502 >>439411 >buying apple shares when samsung was starting to get into the swing of the smartphone war nigga u even invest?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 22:24:26 2013 No.439507 >>439502 >not buying apple shares in the mid '90s before jobs returned

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 22:34:55 2013 No.439509 Can you do any of this with something like... $500?

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 22:35:54 2013 No.439510 >>439509 Of course you can Of course you're to win/lose almost nothing

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 22:37:55 2013 No.439511 >>439509 get lucky with a penny stock but in all seriousness, don't

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 18 22:53:54 2013 No.439523 Silver and Gold are being crushed. Buy physical while you can. Shits about to get real.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 19 03:35:07 2013 No.439628 Lel

Anonymous Fri Apr 19 17:28:58 2013 No.439807

>>439502
>the smartphone war

lmao. checkout youtube, hundreds of vids popping up of people crushing melting burning and putting their old iphones in the microwave or a vat of acid.
there's no smartphone war going on. apple insurgents are just suicide bombing- themselves. Now HTC and Samsung may be going at it in the near future, but apple isn't even in the game anymore.

Anonymous Fri Apr 19 20:31:28 2013 No.439859
File: 45 KB, 300x345, gecko.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>437910

If you don't have a clue, better staying off active investing. Buy some managed funds who've beaten the market consistently or, in case you think their commissions are too high, get some indexed portfolios (ETFs and the like)

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 19 21:47:44 2013 No.439882 >>439807 >Being this deluded DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 20 13:38:42 2013 No.440153 Vanguard index funds baby. Buy and hold youll lose your ass on fees alone buying and selling. Put 4.5k in a reit fund this year and have already made 400$ check their site out. Get some etf's if you think you really want to buy and sell

>>	Fingie Sat Apr 20 13:43:27 2013 No.440157 >>439628 I was about to like your comment but I forgot it's not facebook.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 20 14:32:12 2013 No.440177 >>439807 apple's gonna come back with a cheep option that will look super fly just because they don't have that same kinda monopoly doesn't mean their out and done

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 20 14:47:42 2013 No.440182 Stock: DDD Long 400 shares, 10 year hold

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 20 14:58:41 2013 No.440188 >>440177 >apple's gonna >cheep >their out and done I don't know. You don't come off as educated.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 20 17:41:11 2013 No.440270 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-3LHujyhTxw

Anonymous Sat Apr 20 18:30:42 2013 No.440298

>>440153
This is my method too. I'll never understand why people never got that INVESTING, rather than gambling with different stocks is reliably more profitable. It's just common knowledge that the market's bound to go up eventually. Look at where the market was ten, twenty, and fifty years ago. It's going to keep doing that. Mutual Funds can't be beat, I swear.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 21 01:26:12 2013 No.440472 Any way to buy less than 100 shares at a time. I'd like to spread $2,000 across a dozen or so stocks but would be getting a few dozen of each. Any way to do this without beign raped by fees?

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 21 01:39:12 2013 No.440480 >>438567 >>439859 >>440153 Listen to these guys. Buy a traditional index fund (by e.g. Vanguard) or then an index ETF. No hassle and cheaper than diversifying yourself. Then just sit and hope the world doesn't end.

Anonymous Sun Apr 21 01:54:42 2013 No.440498

>>438690
>>438690
I guess an example would be $MON Monsanto:
There's the USDA and FDA (run by ex Monsanto execs) passing laws and regulations not only giving their farmers subsidies, and allowing GMO Lawsuit-Ready magic beans, but there's corn and soy in pretty much everything.
Corn syrup in the water supply, call it soft drinks.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 21 22:25:40 2013 No.440986 bump for interest.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 22 19:23:23 2013 No.441427 >>440472 I'm curious about this myself.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 22 20:29:09 2013 No.441448 I am a noob with little money who did some research, I want to buy a few shares of American Express, less than 10. How do I go about doing this?

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 22 23:23:39 2013 No.441516 >>441448 Get more money, do more research. Less than ten shares of American Express isn't going to bring you in more than a couple bucks at best (and that's assuming it goes up), and most of the profits will be hampered by transaction fees.

Anonymous Tue Apr 23 00:35:48 2013 No.441527

>>437910
OP, anyone who tells you to pick certain stocks and doesn't spend 10 hours a day analyzing the market is leading you astray.

The market is moderately efficient, and people with knowledge make money. Every stock transfer is a dumb and a smart exchanging a stock for money.

If you aren't a smart, that makes you the dumb.

source: I am a private equity attorney. All I do all day is deals and hang with ibankers.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 23 01:06:25 2013 No.441532 You cannot beat index funds.

Anonymous Tue Apr 23 03:39:24 2013 No.441576

Don't you have friends? Get out there and meet people. Insider trading regulations prevent me from profiting from knowing what's happening in the company I work for, but nothing says i can tell the guys from my fraternity. They in turn tell me what's happening in their companies, and nothing stops me from investing in them. We have a system so it's all perfectly legit. We get together once a week. If your company is doing poorly, and about to take a dive, then you walk around with a "light beer"
If your company is so-so you drink a regular beer.
If your company is hot, then you drink an imported beer. Nobody outside our group knows our system, so they will never catch on.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 23 04:35:08 2013 No.441607 >>439427 4-5% returns pretty poor considering some popular muni bond etfs return that much TAX free... which is the equivalent of 8-9% returns depending on your tax bracket

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 23 17:29:24 2013 No.441843 >>440498 @Ellen Page: Do you genetically modify your conscience so you can sleep at night? Oh my God I know it's so wrong but I want to fuck that liberal bitch into another dimension and have her lecture me on why I need to check my privilege. HNNNNG.

Anonymous Tue Apr 23 17:31:26 2013 No.441844

>>441527
>The market is moderately efficient, and people with knowledge make money. Every stock transfer is a dumb and a smart exchanging a stock for money.
>If you aren't a smart, that makes you the dumb.
>source: I am a private equity attorney. All I do all day is deals and hang with ibankers.
>2013
>Being this deluded

If you knew anything about economics you would understand that zero sum is a myth. Old people need money, sell stocks to young people who need investments. Derp derp, that makes them a dumb!

Don't pretend that being in a legal division makes you a financier, anymore than having a lawyer makes a mob boss a paralegal.

Anonymous Tue Apr 23 17:32:40 2013 No.441845

>>441576
I've always been confused on this; is it insider trading if I tell people that my company is really profitable and you should invest in it?

What if I tell one person before making it public? Is that how it becomes insider trading?

All the regulations on investment seem a little wonky to me.

>>	Anonymous Tue Apr 23 18:34:54 2013 No.441871 >>441845 insider trading is using any information that the public doesn't have. It is vague.

Anonymous Tue Apr 23 22:36:09 2013 No.441983

Say my company announced a new 8 core smartphone that we're developing. People are interested, they start buying stock, the price goes up. I already owned stock in the company, and it's now up 30%. I can sell because people are buying, and I like money. We announce that there have been a few delays. It's not our fault, based on the chip maker's specs there was no problem, but the tests were done with a heatsink on the processor, and the heatsink is too big to go in a phone. The public doesn't like that news, and the stock tumbles. I didn't lose faith, I still believe in the project, so I buy back in now that the price is lower than ever. We call the chip maker and order the new low voltage chips that don't run as hot, and of course we announce that we're doing this. If this works, we'll be able to launch our new phone soon, so people buy the stock again, and as always I'm happy about making money, so i'll gladly sell my stock when it's up. I had no way of knowing the chip specs were wrong. These chips are lower voltage, but the only have 4 active cores. of course, we'll have to make an announcement about this. My decision to buy and sell, was based solely on the price, not on insider information. Some people might be mad if they knew I made huge profits 5 times in a row, but that's what it's all about.

Anonymous Wed Apr 24 02:01:24 2013 No.442076

>>441983
like >>441871 said, it's a very vaguely defined crime.

No matter how specific you make your situation its going to come down to the whims of federal prosecutors. First of all, it happens all the time and not with the stupid beer order idea some guy up in here was talking about. They just meet for lunch and tell each other, most of the insiders have known each other for a very long time, they trust each other, and if they're smart they don't fucking tell anyone else. Just as an example Martha Stewart got nailed because she told a fed she had a conversation with a guy once, that was enough. If she had plead the fifth and not said a fucking word they would of had nothing to convict her on. That's how flimsy an insider trading case can be. They mostly try to find guys that are being way to obvious and trying to make examples out of them.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 24 16:30:40 2013 No.442360 >>442076 >as an example Martha Stewart got nailed because she told a fed she had a conversation with a guy once that's not exactly true. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ImClone_Systems

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 24 19:48:57 2013 No.442464 >>437910 Buy share in FB (facebook). It will not end up like myspace.

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 24 20:52:11 2013 No.442492 >>442464 amd >yfw when i got 1000 shares for 2.25 a few weeks back

>>	Anonymous Wed Apr 24 21:18:57 2013 No.442501 >>440480 interested, explain please

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 04:13:56 2013 No.442659

what do you guys think about subsidizing stocks. the government regulates stock prices so investors don't get ripped off so easily. announcements are made well in advance of any proposed change in the price, to give ample time for investors to make a decision whether to sell or stay the course.
No more kissing your money goodbye just after you buy into a company, your investment will be safe for days, maybe even weeks.
Minor high-low fluctuations could be ironed out to achieve this fair and balanced marketplace. No more spikes and dips, or need for constant updates. you'd be able to relax, and enjoy yourself for a change.

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 05:06:18 2013 No.442671

>>442659
thats fucking retarded. the price of stocks are determined by who buys and who sells. Any government regulation would effectively just be a forced price freeze. Your stock isn't safe.

You may be comfortable sitting around with your $100 stock, but you won't find any fucking buyers if everyone knows its only worth $20 and they are just waiting out some arbitrary government freeze on trading.

And that's not even getting into the can of worms opened by allowing the government to control such a thing. The rewards for corruption and collusion would be massive even in comparison to our current system.

There is this phenomenon known as Regulatory Capture, you should familiarize yourself with it.

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 06:29:12 2013 No.442701

>>442671
don't be silly, the government wouldn't be "involved" it would merely implement regulations requiring corporations to govern themselves in a more lawful manner.
monthly price adjustments based on actual company valuation, rather than speculation and lies. If the math comes out to between $56 - $60 a share for that month, then the price is set at the average $58. no "freeze" those who wish sell may do so. Shareholders are given advance notice as to proposed price adjustments. If the pending adjustment will mean a loss for the investor, then they have a right to sell, or keep it if they choose. If the pending adjustment will mean an increase in the price, perhaps knowing in advance will help prevent the shareholder from making a costly mistake, for example selling based on lies rumors and speculation. All of this could easily be avoided.
As a result the company is more financially stable. Investors are encouraged to hold onto their investment, knowing that it is financially sound, rather than subject to manipulation as is presently the case.

You have it backwards,my friend. There should not be rewards for corruption and collusion, there should be severe penalties for such things.

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 07:06:56 2013 No.442703

>>442701

>Shareholders are given advance notice as to proposed price adjustments

how old are you, 12?

everything you are proposing is pants on head retarded and cannot work. planned economies always fail for one simple reason: human greed. our flawed system acknowledges that human greed is the driving force behind all stock transactions. that is why it sucks, but that is why it works.

my god your idealism is adorable, but please get some real world experience.

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 07:15:11 2013 No.442704

>>438374
What areas of CS does this fall under?

I'm a CS undergrad who recently began reading up on macroeconomics and I got another big book (mankiw's) in my sights, so I began interested in this and I was thinking of going into machine learning and making a bot and hooking it up to investopedia's simulator to see how it works.

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 08:34:13 2013 No.442716

>>442703
What you're saying is it won't work the way you want it to. You want to be able to rip people off basically, amirite? The way the system works now, that essentially what it's all about... taking money from foolish investors who choose to gamble. Many corporations make this their primary agenda, electing CEO's who are most suited for this purpose, rather than focusing on day to day operations. Companies would be far more likely to show continued growth and steady profits, if they stopped spending so much of their time on these charades, and actually worked for a living.

>hurr hurr you is retarded.
>but please get some real world experience.

That's the best argument you can make: "greed is good" and you call me retarded.

Buying stock in a company is investing. In banking there are such regulations in place. Investing with a bank, you have a certain degree of trust, backed up by a contract. Terms of the agreement may be changed with notice of such changes duly given. You receive x% on your investment guaranteed.

Investing without such a guarantee, is gambling. Call it what it is, don't pretend that it's capitalism. It's simply a means of taking money from less the fortunate, and believe me I am experienced at this, I simply have a guilty conscience.

All investments should be based upon trust. Would you loan money to a complete stranger? If you buy stock that's exactly what you're doing. The person who sold it to you can take your money and run with it. Well, not all of it, that piece of paper may still have some value. No guarantees, no contract, just a worth-less piece of paper. And to add insult to injury, it's illegal for the person in whom you've placed your trust, to warn you about the mistake you're making.

Invest in publicly traded companies: not even once. Instead I make a lot of money investing in private corporations. With contracts, and agreements, and trust built on sound principals. It's still gambling, i'm not going to lie.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 25 11:45:56 2013 No.442776 >>442704 The part where everyone who knows a bit about computers seem to think it automatically makes them financial fucking geniuses as well and turn into Captain fucking Libertard of the USS Ron Paul.

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 12:56:13 2013 No.442791

>>442701
> the government wouldn't be "involved" it would merely implement regulations requiring corporations to govern themselves in a more lawful manner.
So a system of regulation without any penalty or method of enforcement.

>There should not be rewards for corruption and collusion, there should be severe penalties for such things.
We don't live in should land. The behavior of real people is significantly divorced from ideals. If you don't see how a system of top down price setting would lead to more corruption then you really are retarded.

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 13:13:11 2013 No.442793

>>442716
You still don't seem to get how regulation works. There's a reason almost all government regulatory bodies eventually wind up serving the industries they were designed to regulate. It's a matter of incentives. No one else gives a shit about regulation, not really, but the companies that are subject to it care a whole lot. They spend a lot of time and money greasing the wheels of bureaucracy to get the regulations to work out favorably for established members of the industry. It's not about greed, or evil, or exploitation, it's about incentives; and if you were in the same position you would be just as pressured to do it as well. You can say "I'm too moral to do that". Well good for you, but all that means is that you aren't doing what is in the best interest of your company, and sooner or later the company suffers or you will be replaced by someone willing to do the job you weren't.

You are advocating a system where some combination of government and corporate bodies are allowed to hide, fix, or freeze the value of a stock. What kind of incentive does that create? What could you realistically expect from people within those organizations, all of whom's job is to increase profits for the corporation?

If your answer is "they will want to treat total strangers investments more fairly", then you are indeed a fucking idiot. If you don't want people to get screwed over by bad investments then tell those people to do their research. The problem isn't fluctuating stock prices, it's the predictable stupidity of most people that leads to booms, overvaluations, and busts. Most people don't invest, they gamble, and that' not a problem any regulatory body can fix.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 25 13:14:13 2013 No.442794 >>442716 Please don't try to talk like an anime character I'm getting second hand embarrassment

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 25 14:49:49 2013 No.442840 >>442776 Jesus, I'm not even him but what the hell is your problem?

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 18:24:56 2013 No.442909

i generally just ride the wave in $10-$15 stocks in game industries that i know are going to release something good in time, example activision before CoD, blizzard before Di3 (fail but made money), TTWO upcomming for GTA5. For just starting this worked out for me, longterm is good if you have a boatload to reap the gains but if you only have like 3K initially you can double that through the year.

Just look at market trends:
Easter: invest in whoever makes peeps
Christmas: invest in 3M who makes scotch tape

i wouldn't say i'm any sort of master at this though, Zynga trade was hilarious , $9/share->$14 in one day before FB fail

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 19:21:14 2013 No.442930

>>442776
Yeah, because god damn, wanting to learn shit and build shit is so fucking stupid. Let me just go back to watching the simpsons reruns because hurr durr.
Point out one place where I called myself a genius, captain dip shit. I'm just curious and I want to explore.

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 19:25:27 2013 No.442932

>>442793
>tell those people to do their research. The problem isn't fluctuating stock prices, it's the predictable stupidity of most people that leads to booms, overvaluations, and busts. Most people don't invest, they gamble, and that' not a problem any regulatory body can fix.

When they bring the horses out just before a race I watch them and do my research on how they're going to perform. That horse who just took a dump before the race wins 70% of the time. I'll take those odds any day. Trouble is sometimes after the bets are in, another horse decides to take a last minute dump on the way to the starting line. It's too late to change you bet by that point. But here's where experience comes in... those last minute shitters are still walking funny after just pinching a loaf, and that ain't a good thing when you're trying to run. If their sphincter is still puckered, they can't run like that. It's all in the timing. The early pooper has a distinct advantage over the ones that still need to go poop.

I'll second your advice to noobs, you gotta do your own research, butt when a stock takes a dump it don't mean shit.

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 25 19:43:43 2013 No.442941 File: 55 KB, 300x400, jimmies-are-delicious.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>442794 >Please don't try to talk like an anime character I'm getting second hand embarrassment engrish no your're second ranguage?

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 20:17:00 2013 No.442951

I guess we should just make this a 'Daily Personal Finance' thread or some such thing, at least until moot makes a finance board...

>A man can dream

I just started setting up a simple spreadsheet to keep track of my monthly finances, feels pretty good. Just counted my 'tip jar' from work and I have 73.89 in just tips.

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 22:46:13 2013 No.442997

>>441527

First, the is a crapton of dumb money that doesn't take much research to beat.

Second, there are legit reasons for two smart players to exchange at a price that is good for both of them, if they have different appetites for risk or need for liquidity.

For someone like the OP who doesn't know what the fuck they are doing it would be all too easy to end up in the dumb money camp. You can do hours of reading and analysis but you can't really understand things if you haven't actually tried some trades, and got burnt when you fucked it up. If you don't have a lot of money to spare learning I reccommend a trial dummy account where you pretend to make trades and see how much money you would ahve made or lost this way. However this will only tell you about the micro game, you also have to be aware of marketwide news driven trends that have a longer periodicity. If all you do is buy stocks and every single stock is down you can have a really bad day.

The only way to learn this is to be an avid market watcher, historian and analyst for a few years. This is why there is so much dumb money.

You do this for a while and you realise that the reasons for the market moving that are reported in the news media are often just totally incorrect. There are people who invest based on that information.

Anonymous Thu Apr 25 23:23:59 2013 No.443028
File: 1.43 MB, 1373x545, optimizationsearch.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>442704
Mr. Obligatory Here. Dunno who that other prick was.

>>making a bot and seeing how it works
Trial and Error multiplied by a few years is how I got this far. First as a hobby and now an obsession.

The only place I could hook up to was Interactive Brokers so I'd recommend them for your efforts. If you find anyone else with a well-documented API, let me know!

At first I experimented with genetic algorithms, neural networks, etc for market-condition responses with very limited success and I'd like to revisit that with all that I've learned since then. It took me a very long time to realize that I couldn't "reinvent the mind of a trader" with an AI. It's more apt to replicate the processes and techniques employed by a successful trader into a mechanical process. After I put aside the overtly fancy stuff I had the most success with walk-forward optimization of more-or-less traditional trading models re-tooled for high-resolution data (5sec bars).

Obligatory pic is an example of the optimization space (as visualized by my software) for a given trading model on a given stock on a given day. see "The Evaluation and Optimization of Trading Strategies" by Robert Pardo (fig 9.5 p.199) for more detail.

Don't mind the pretty lady. I designed everything to be transparent. Regular charts got really boring somewhere around 16 months into this project. I much prefer it this way.

Hang tight and let me finish up my latest version then I'll do an AMA. Everyone can pick my brain and cook up their own trading robots without having to smash their heads against the wall for two years like I did. If I could do it all again I would have actually learned to day trade before building my first few prototypes!

>>	Anonymous Thu Apr 25 23:52:43 2013 No.443044 File: 64 KB, 702x534, 20_year_S&P_chart.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] I would be damn careful about investing in anything that has to do with equities at this point.

Anonymous Fri Apr 26 00:11:28 2013 No.443051

>>442909

riding the wave is not terrible advice. I second what someone above said: it's investing, not gambling.

ever have a good idea? maybe some company is already doing it. Instead of doing it yourself, invest in them. When the rest of the world catches on, they'll buy up the stock and you can divest. When long-term-holding, set some basic goals for each stock though. You can't hold for ever :)

Also under-appreciated is the fact that these are *trades*. It's not just about the number, but how you well you execute the trade, how you break up larger blocks of stock and how you are buying/selling against the predominant pattern of the day... If you trade early in the morning, your margins will naturally be better.

Anonymous Fri Apr 26 04:22:42 2013 No.443154

>Making money general

Anyone know anything about this Hydroponics farm game? I want to set up layers upon layers of crops, but I don't what crop is profitable or how to find the market.

So far in reading, herbs were mentioned, like oregano and such, do I sell pounds of the stuff to restaurants or something? I really don't get it. I can only think up of selling strawberries at a farmer's market or craigslist or something

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 26 04:24:43 2013 No.443155 >>438374 what the fuck give me that system

Anonymous Fri Apr 26 05:09:27 2013 No.443159

>>443154
Protip: Getting into an industry you literally know nothing about is gonna lead to having a bad time.

Get a job with a produce distributor, or actually contact restaurants know for buying local. Find out if they have trouble getting certain items and see what you can do to fill that need. Farmers market isn't a bad idea, either.

But ideally know what and to whom you can sell before investing in Hydroponics setup.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 26 17:54:28 2013 No.443328 File: 87 KB, 1280x849, f47a6bef41a8804b555ae4a11fba84e5.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>443155 wait the the AMA and then build your own.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 26 19:13:50 2013 No.443373 >>439339 Nah he's just a happy merchant

Anonymous Fri Apr 26 20:29:05 2013 No.443409
File: 1.33 MB, 1920x1200, 1205253199876.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>443028
Thanks anon, it's much appreciated. I remember a captcha-solving neural network written in Python with about 40% accuracy rate that gained about 0.2% crunching captchas a day. I'm pretty good at traversing websites/scraping them, so my mind is trying to put those two things together, although my knowledge about neural networks is pretty much zilch.

Ah, this is really interesting. It's like a really cool sandbox game where you don't know the full rules.

I'll be checking for you AMA dude, I'll try to think up some questions. Thanks!

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 26 20:30:19 2013 No.443410 >>443409 Btw, that network would probably level out somewhere above 50%, getting 80% would probably be god-like. But getting a 1% return rate on stocks seems sufficient.

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 26 22:38:55 2013 No.443456 >>443410 >getting a 1% return rate on stocks loan sharks charge 30% so losing money in stocks isn't so bad

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 26 22:46:05 2013 No.443459 >>443328 o-ok sorry

Anonymous Fri Apr 26 22:52:04 2013 No.443467

>>443159
>But ideally know what and to whom you can sell before investing in Hydroponics setup

Hey give me some credit that's what I'm trying to do now, to figure out that stuff

Alright so I was close regarding selling to the restaurants, good call on the distributor, they have all the info I need.

Any info for aquaponics? Floridafag here, turns out this climate is perfect for that, who knew?

>>	Anonymous Fri Apr 26 23:25:04 2013 No.443483 >>437910 just remember to pay your taxes

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 27 01:01:04 2013 No.443514 >>443456 i only charge 20

Anonymous Sat Apr 27 01:10:21 2013 No.443516

I only do stocks when I have inside advice from the specific market. Ex: Dell went down for a while, I was told it was about to go up from someone who worked there, I dumped 50k into that. Two years later it turned into 150k.... Another trick, is to find out what something would sell for if it went to hell. It might be $17 a share, but since things are bad it's dropped to $12. Buy into it, if worse comes to worse you still make $5 a share.

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 27 03:48:04 2013 No.443544 >>443483 >just remember to pay your taxes i lol'd hard. does anyone even do that anymore? buy through your shell corporation in the caymans bro

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 27 05:14:49 2013 No.443549 >>443514 can I borrow $10k

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 27 12:57:05 2013 No.443627 bump we need more investing thread on /diy/

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 27 13:56:34 2013 No.443648 >>443516 > yfw when the SEC knocks on your door next week and arrest your ass for admitting to a crime

>>	Anonymous Sat Apr 27 13:57:21 2013 No.443649 >>443549 where you at? im in chicago or phoenix every 3 weeks

Anonymous Sat Apr 27 20:23:19 2013 No.443900

read your newspaper, and buy what we tell you to buy on television. we've done all the research for you, and we know exactly where your money is needed most. your timely investment might just save that company from bankruptcy. you might lose a little money but it's for a good cause. think of all the jobs you saved by contributing your cash to pay that business' creditors. we would never steer you wrong about investing. in no time at all that company will be back on it's feet thanks to you, and you could make a few dollars eventually

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 28 03:52:05 2013 No.444100 >>442951 Oh god, a 4chan finance board. I can already see this on the news. This is a bad idea. >>443900 FOR MOTHER RUSSIA

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 28 06:29:05 2013 No.444123 Making money? Here's one of a few things I do. Slow day today. the 120 mark would be higher but I took a vacation a bit ago.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 28 06:29:35 2013 No.444124 File: 53 KB, 669x567, yap.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>444123 I'm an idiot and forgot pic

>>	index funds k Sun Apr 28 07:16:35 2013 No.444131 Invest in an index fund. A good one. Something that tracks the market.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 28 08:17:21 2013 No.444161 >>444124 what is this

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 28 14:18:06 2013 No.444324 >>438878 Govt grad student here with bachelors in econ and govt, I just got in to grad school, and well, I think I'll do my thesis on this. Thanks.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 28 14:56:20 2013 No.444341 Does anybody have some solid ideas for earning extra cash they'd like to share? A friend suggested buying iphones with cracked screens, fixing and reselling. Not sure about this. >>444124 What are you selling? I'd like to get into the ebay game.

Anonymous Sun Apr 28 15:37:36 2013 No.444368

>>444341
Screens cost too much to turn a profit. If you want some real money, fix broken appliances from craigslist and resell. Lots of people will even let you take their old appliances when they buy the new one off of you and you can fix it that and the cycle goes on.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 28 17:47:04 2013 No.444450 >>444341 >Ebay game The only Ebay game is buyers scamming sellers and Ebay siding with the buyer 99% of the time. Deal locally or you're going to get fucked.

Anonymous Sun Apr 28 18:49:05 2013 No.444467

The ebay game tends to be tough in a lot of areas, and honestly a lot of it seems to be just trying to rip people off tbh. Like people are mentioning a lot of it consists of buying / obtaining the materials / parts, then repairing / assembling and selling for a competitive profit. I've heard of everything from building remote control cars, to repairing phone / TV / monitor screens. I think there's several For Dummies books on ebaying, download those and you should be able to find your avenue.

Anonymous Sun Apr 28 19:29:05 2013 No.444497

>>444341
broken phones/ipods/etc arent really worth it. the only way to get enough to fix to make any actual money is to buy lots on ebay, but its so saturated you barely make a dime of profit.

I wont tell you what i sell or how i get it (i'd be stupid to do so) but what I can suggest is go with what you know. into cars? I bet you know where to get good deals on stuff, etc etc

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 28 19:44:49 2013 No.444504 >>444450 thats only true if you sell bootleg/knockoff/hong kong wholesell bullshit theres plenty of money to be made legitely in ebay, you just have to see it.

Anonymous Sun Apr 28 19:51:04 2013 No.444511

>>444504
What are you even talking about? I said BUYERS scamming SELLERS. Not the other way around. As in, buyers disputing the items or issuing chargebacks. It happens on everything, especially electronics or anything over $50. I even know a guy who had a guy scam him out of some fucking golf balls, the dude sent him back some pens in a box and ebay/paypal told him tough shit, which is what they do 99% in favor of the buyer. Not only will they do that, but they'll also demand free stuff for leaving feedback. The whole system is broken as fuck and Ebay doesn't give a shit because they get to keep their money because you agree to their terms of service and there isn't shit you can do about it.

Anonymous Sun Apr 28 20:04:06 2013 No.444521

>>444511
my bad, missread what you said.

though your right that you can run into some shady buyers, I've been a professional ebayer for almost 2 years now and I can honestly say its not -that bad-

don't get me wrong, as a seller you're backed against a corner on a lot of things and i absolutely hate about 90% of ebays policies, but its not -that- bad.

I've maybe had 5 bad buyers in my time, most of them are just assholes who leave neutral/negative feedback because an item gets frozen during shipping and dont care that theres nothing i can do.

as far as scammers go, ebays actually pretty good about helping buyers out. As long as you do tracking info for everything your pretty good. if someone sends you back a box of rocks for a return, ebays normally willing ot take care of you as long as youre an active seller and not a 1 time guy.

Anonymous Sun Apr 28 20:08:35 2013 No.444524

>>444521
I'd complain more about the fees and how they are almost 100% unwilling to touch your feedback regardless of if its justified or not.

fees: ebay will nickle and dime you to living hell. but they did just change their policies a few weeks ago that makes it a little better (for store owners at least)

feedback revisions: i've only had 1 successful feedback revision, the reset they just say "we cant do anything about it", again items got frozen in transit (with tracking attatched to show when i sent it) and buyer leaves neutral/negative for slow shipping, ebay doesnt care and leaves you with it.

I also had an instance where ebay not only wouldnt fix my feedback, but in turn removed all negative feedback i ever left anyone, it was a time when i somehow managed to deal with about 7 bad sellers at once (items werent being shipped, being sent to wrong address, etc), i won all my cases, left negative feedback for bad sellers, and they wound up removing everything i left anyone. that was a big middle finger ot me and omg did it piss me off

Anonymous Sun Apr 28 20:13:20 2013 No.444528

>>444521
Some items are more prone to scammers than others. Of course, if you're a powerseller, they're going to look after you because you keep their bills paid. The major problem with chargebacks is that they refuse to give you the chargeback summary, giving you almost no legal recourse to go after your owed money and in many cases you won't even find out about the chargeback until months after the fact and then your only option is to pay Ebay to avoid going to collections and lose your item as well.

Ebay just does not care about law or justice, just their bottom line.

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 28 20:28:21 2013 No.444538 >>444528 well I sell all kinds of stuff in tons of niches and of all values, from 4 dollar items to 500 dollar items...most people are too scared to try and pull such a thing

>>	Anonymous Sun Apr 28 20:43:35 2013 No.444542 >>443483 Shut the fuck up obama

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 29 01:12:49 2013 No.444698 File: 448 KB, 245x190, interesting.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Is this in excess of market performance? Are you taking into account that the S&P and DJIA have been steadily on the rise, on average, for the past year?

Anonymous Mon Apr 29 01:15:20 2013 No.444701
File: 800 KB, 305x235, 1350043029912.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>438566

TDAmeritrade has a fucking excellent real time and simulated trading platform. It allows you to interface with your own code as well. You automatically get access to the software when you set up an account with them, and there's no maintenance fee on your account - only like 10 bucks per transaction.

Anonymous Mon Apr 29 09:28:50 2013 No.444824
File: 577 KB, 1083x361, exOfPerformance.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>444701

Mr Obligatory Here.

Interactive Brokers is 0.005 cents per share, minimum $1.

100 shares for $1 trade cost.
200 for $1.
300 for $1.50.
400 for $2.00, etc

I highly recommend it for micro-trading. I also feel their API is simply the best, and is free to all regardless of having an account.

I'm still hard at work. All mechanical aspects of the autonomous trading platform are fully operational. I'm currently focusing all my attention on adding trading strategies to it's library and getting them to feedback performance anticipation data, based on the optimization search's findings, into a portfolio model to properly pick stocks and match them with apt models and apt configurations for those models.

Compared to everything before, this is the easy part.

Obligatory Pic is the performance curve of my best trading strategy (still a work in progress) paper trading with only Apple on Jan 2nd's historical data. ~$1,100 profit before 11am then the model starts faltering and finishes the day around ~$850. These numbers include trade costs. Now, Apple is a very expensive stock consuming a vast majority of the nasdaq's daily trading volume, so this is the higher end of possibility for reasonable performance expectations across the market. I can't say much more on expected profits from any particular trading strategy until I've compiled some more results. However it is worth pointing out that this is from only one stock and my system is technically capable of trading on over a dozen simultaneously, limited only by my available capital. I'd say this strategy is close to market-ready but it still needs attention.

A quick disclaimer for those that are blinded by the results seen here:
I built this alone. It took years to get this far. Fair to say this is my life's work.
You want in on the action? Build your own. If you're willing to put in the work, my AMA will tell you everything you'll need know and save you years of fishing in the dark.

PS- Scarjo's legs.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 29 10:23:04 2013 No.444860 >>444824 you can stop jerking yourself off now

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 29 19:02:04 2013 No.445104 >>444860 Top lel.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 29 19:39:19 2013 No.445124 Just become a US Senator or Congressman. They can now legally engage in insider trading again as of last week. (Like they ever abided by their self-imposed ban anyway).

Anonymous Mon Apr 29 19:49:05 2013 No.445129

I'll tell you what I know: The markets are the absolute hardest way to make easy money.
Also this: you wouldn't ask a forum how to fly a plane or perform brain surgery, but everyone thinks they can read a few books and then become traders. Good luck with that.
I speak from experience. Making money in the markets is easy... keeping it is hard.
The illusion of the markets is that it is so simple. Believe me, that does not equate to "easy". I lost consistently for 7 years. Then I simply broke even for another 3. Then I started showing a small profit. If you can survive the learning curve, it can be done... Most give up too soon.

>>	Anonymous Mon Apr 29 20:18:04 2013 No.445149 File: 18 KB, 426x282, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >this thread >believing any of it hahahahahhaha so much disinfo

Anonymous Tue Apr 30 20:24:22 2013 No.445677

have any of you ever planted a bug in someone's office.
insider trading means your broker can't tell you about things, but maybe he and his buddies laugh their asses off when he hangs up the phone with you.
I'm not suggesting that you do this, I'm just asking for confessions of anyone who has.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 1 01:05:50 2013 No.445834 File: 849 KB, 568x1429, Budgeting How To.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	notop Wed May 1 01:31:06 2013 No.445841 >>445834 durr turn off phantom power devices. Less than $30/year in overestimated enregy 'costs' for phantom power devices. Solution: Buy a $45 power strip and turn them off manually all the fucking time. Fucking a'

>>	Anonymous Wed May 1 01:57:21 2013 No.445854 >>445841 Where the fuck do you find a power strip for $45?

>>	Anonymous Wed May 1 02:55:20 2013 No.445871 >>445854 Lol, buy an overpriced Monster brand one.

Anonymous Wed May 1 03:21:35 2013 No.445877

>>444824
I'm reading up on your posts while reading the book you recommended. I'm willing to put in the work, have nothing to lose anyway as my time isn't very valuable and it would be like a hobby to me. Are you still around or gone busy working on your stuff?

Anonymous Wed May 1 21:02:27 2013 No.446284
File: 47 KB, 600x397, scarjo.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>444824
>PS- Scarjo's legs.
I am totally down with the chub and cellulite.

Still refining my NN and also incorporating more "hard-coded" elements into the simulation like stop-losses and stop-gains.

Hoping to make stop-gain handling a bit more flexible (perhaps a moving threshold) since I feel like I might be screwing myself out of additional profits. Aside from that, my automation seems to be working out quite nicely.

Pardon my ignorance though, with respect to 0.005 cents per share, does that include any combination of shares in an order? Or do you have to specifically order 200+ shares of a certain company?

>>	Anonymous Thu May 2 10:41:30 2013 No.446596 >>440182 up 13%

>>	Anonymous Thu May 2 21:10:00 2013 No.446939 Still waiting on dat AMA. [spoiler];_;

>>	Anonymous Thu May 2 21:11:01 2013 No.446940 Still waiting on dat AMA. ;_;

Anonymous Fri May 3 16:51:01 2013 No.447341
File: 1.23 MB, 1618x532, tweakingstrats.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Mr Obligatory Here.

>>445877
Almost ready. Still checking in here every few days to see if anyone cares.

>>446284
Familiarize yourself with the order types and how they behave. It'll guide your development of an order execution handler/emulator. interactivebrokers com/php/apiUsersGuide/apiguide/tables/supported_order_types htm

Take Profit / Stop Loss is a zen art. Try using the standard deviation of the price distribution. Obligatory Pic related. It's one of my starting lineup. Still a work in progress.

Read up on Markov Chain and Regime switching between two+ trading models based on market conditions in real time.
>>"MR Swing: A quantitative system for mean‐reversion and swing trading in market regimes." by Abrams and Walker.
It's a dense white paper but very much worth studying for it's practical application of this idea. You'll find it.

You'll want to look into your broker's pricing of Basket Orders to answer your last question.

>>446940
It just doesn't feel right doing an AMA until it's on the market. I'll have six and a half hours to burn every day at that point. On that note: should I do the AMA here?

>>	Anonymous Fri May 3 19:54:02 2013 No.447437 There's so much shit in this thread I don't understand. Hadn't feel this way in a while.

>>	Anonymous Fri May 3 20:34:31 2013 No.447449 >>443028 My eye was drawn right to the global minimum.

>>	Anonymous Fri May 3 20:55:46 2013 No.447457 >>447341 What programming language(s) are you using?

>>	Anonymous Mon May 6 15:24:36 2013 No.449209 bump

>>	Anonymous Mon May 6 18:39:19 2013 No.449302 >>441576 What if someone is drinking Southern comfort

Anonymous Mon May 6 18:52:05 2013 No.449307

>>442501
An index fund invests variably in a huge number of stocks. Its like buying everything on the stock market and riding the average. The fund manager is responsible for investing less in stocks they think lose and more in people that in, so it USUALLY out performs the market in good times, and loses less in bad times. I'm up like 40% since 2009 on mine. Good time to start investing, lol.

ETFs are like a stock in that you can buy shares, but each share represents a bundle of stocks. So you could buy a mining ETF, and its just a huge pack of mining companies. If one mining company goes bankrupt, the ETF still holds its value. Its like investing in a whole industry.

Anonymous Mon May 6 19:29:50 2013 No.449325

Any of you algo folks want to share some recommendations for literature (books, scholarly articles, etc.)? I've always been interested in financial theory (studying mathematics at the moment) and I'd love to learn more (especially if there's potentially money in it, lol). Also, any of you guys use functional programming languages? Trying to get my Haskell on. Big thanks for the info already provided! Best of luck on your trading systems!

>>	Anonymous Tue May 7 22:58:05 2013 No.450111 >>441576 Reported this page to the FTC.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 7 23:03:06 2013 No.450115 >>450111 The AG came right out and said that the big banks can do whatever they want and the government won't stop them. What makes you think that the FTC cares about a thread on 4chan?

>>	Anonymous Wed May 8 00:25:51 2013 No.450138 short sell bitcoins rent a botnet ddos mt gox would this work?

Anonymous Wed May 8 22:12:36 2013 No.450751

>>444341
I'm currently fixing these screens, or rather it should be called LCD refurbishing.

It's difficult, can be time consuming, and the parts are almost exclusively native.. actually not almost they just are exclusive to china, and it requires a great deal work.

It's been months and I don't have it down all the way. However I expect to have it an up and running business within the next few weeks.

The thing is it can be profitable, (put in 100, get back around 200) But there are variables that depend on how good you are, like if you break the digitizer or lcd, its over and you don't make money.

Plus you have to source the damn things and its tough to get the deals just right. And without a brick and motor you'd be selling the things of craigslist and you have to deal with potential shit heads.

Although it can be pretty lucrative.

>>	Anonymous Wed May 8 22:25:21 2013 No.450764 > without a brick and motor brick and what?

>>	Anonymous Thu May 9 06:41:06 2013 No.450999 >>450764 When you want to put your pick-up truck on blocks, the brick and motor shop is where you get them.

>>	Typo.Negetive Thu May 9 08:34:20 2013 No.451016 File: 32 KB, 388x275, 1361960862251.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>450764 Do you even Advance Auto Parts?

>>	Anonymous Thu May 9 09:51:06 2013 No.451031 Just a warning to the guy who was insider trading, they don't have to be able to prove you are insider trading to ruin your life in court, just keep that in mind

Anonymous Thu May 9 21:54:00 2013 No.451409

Neural guy here.

So I noticed that the Forex market trades 24 hours a day, and would like to test my system on it so that I have something to do with my spare computing power while the stock exchanged is closed.

But the quote data from my source (Y! Finance) seems to be severely limited compared to those of the stock market -- the only significant info available is the current exchange rate.

If I were to look into automated trading in this particular area, are there more comprehensive (free) realtime/delayed quotes available? Is the additional data that may be relevant to stock trading even relevant to Forex trading?

Anonymous Sat May 11 13:44:07 2013 No.452574
File: 188 KB, 1426x603, PortfolioConstruction.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Mr Obligatory here.

>>447449
Good eye. Stick around for more.

>>447457
Java.

>>451409
You need high resolution data. I get mine directly from the brokerage. I've yet to find anyone else that offers 5sec resolution at a reasonable price.

It doesn't take as much computer power as you'd think. It's amazing what multicores can do these days with some proper threading. My major limiting factor at the moment is the pacing limitations my brokerage puts on downloading hi-res data. I can only get one day of data per minute. Kinda frustrating but the payoff is watching the expected profit datapoints pop up on the chart while it builds a portfolio. Obligatory Pic Related.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 12 17:28:05 2013 No.453321 >>452574 Not him but you said stick around. >I can only get one day of data per minute How many days of data do you need? You can't DL a day once and store locally?

Anonymous Sun May 12 20:04:19 2013 No.453432
File: 904 KB, 1664x573, newpie.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>453321

One day of data per minute per stock. I accidently left out that last detail.

Just as I mean't to say: Stick around for the post-makingrealmoney AMA.

Right now I'm having my new experimental portfolio model do a trading model optimization analysis of all my models on the top hundred affordable stocks' with each's previous three days of data and then build a portfolio of stock+tradingmodel+setting combinations based on those results. Obligatory Pic Related. I added this little "web" touch last night to better show the portfolio building process at it crawls along the results seeking maximum expected return.

I save everything locally to avoid any redundant downloading. You should see how much work I've put into the analysis framework to prevent any redundant computation too. Building a portfolio for any given day requires 3x100 days of data. Thankfully, walking forward as I backtest and saving everything I download is cutting a lot of the time for each new day I test but it's still a very significant wait. It's taken the better part of today just to pull down twelve days of data for this process but the results are looking better than anything I've ever seen it do before. After working on this project for almost three years I've grown to hate guessing when it will be "ready" but these results are making me think it'll be extremely soon.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 12 21:27:20 2013 No.453484 I invested in Pandora and Sirius XM a while ago. They gave some great returns, but I don't see them going much further. I'm selling pretty soon.

>>	Anonymous Sun May 12 21:48:19 2013 No.453511 Herero gentus, Buzzword: binary options. Yes or nö

>>	Anonymous Sun May 12 22:59:34 2013 No.453557 >>438567 QFT

Anonymous Sun May 12 23:07:18 2013 No.453563

>>438567
>>439859
>>440153
>>440480
>>441532
>>444131
>>449307
No matter what anyone says, I will always agree with these guys. Almost all other companies make a profit on you investing through them. Doesn't that give you the slightest hint of conflict of interest?
Several index funds, like vanguard, make their money from the fund itself and not the consumers.
Investing is a blast.
PS: fuck 100-age, dumbest shit ever. Upside4life

>>	Anonymous Sun May 12 23:49:03 2013 No.453595 >>439368 wot intel maybe not but IBM? come on, they're the main source to supplying shit for every major retail corporation how can it not be one of the most stable?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 14 04:09:02 2013 No.454451 >>453595 ibm was acquired by lenovo, they may eventually phase the ibm line out completely.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 14 04:11:36 2013 No.454453 Buy SCTY on nasdaq. You didnt hear it from me. But theres some big shit in the works and its going to take off.

>>	Anonymous Tue May 14 04:20:52 2013 No.454455 >>454451 Didn't Lenovo buy out IBMs consumer computer line years ago? Now they've bought the whole company?

>>	Anonymous Tue May 14 06:23:33 2013 No.454517 >>454455 Of course they haven't. The person you replied to doesn't have a clue as to who IBM are and what they do.

Anonymous Wed May 15 21:10:46 2013 No.455631

Excuse me /diy/

Exactly how do I buy a house and then use it as an income vehicle?

I'm trying to learn the papers and accounting around it, and the names of people like the mortgage guy(or corp) or property manager or tenant etc.

What does it mean you make a profit when you buy, and how is a land or property profitable? What do I look for here?

Anonymous Wed May 15 21:43:46 2013 No.455657

>>455631
well the property has to have some way of generating an income, usually via renting it to someone else.
You buy it, then you find someone who doesn't want to or more likely can't buy a property for reasons. Then you agree on a lease which will be a set amount of time they will rent the property (usually 1 year, then month to month after that) and then you take care of the property and they live in it or whatever and hopefully they pay you money every month.

Anonymous Wed May 15 22:14:16 2013 No.455678

>>455657
So what are all these "systems" for real estate I hear about? Are those different methods of finding property/finding tenants and setting up ways to get income from property or snake oil?

So I go find a good house, get a mortgage for 30 years to keep it cheap, and put up an ad as soon as possible to rent it, sign the lease and done? Who takes care of the insurance and landscaping and such? How do I get the lease written out, are there real estate attorneys that have cookie cutter legal lease agreements for me to window shop for?

Thanks, I get the buy part now, so property aren't toys, you buy a property when there's a plan in making that property have an income. I couldn't wrap my head around making money when you're spending on the downpayment and fees and mortgage looming over you

Anonymous Wed May 15 23:21:03 2013 No.455715

>>455678
>mortgage

The idea is that the tenants more or less maintain the mortgage for you and keep the property from being squatted.

You can either hold until it's paid off and then start receiving all the income, or sell before then and walk away with the portion that has been paid down by that point.

>get a mortgage for 30 years to keep it cheap

A 30 year mortgage is anything but cheap.

Anonymous Thu May 16 00:09:34 2013 No.455753

>>455631
If you do decide to buy a house,my uncle actually does this for a majority of his income, so I have a little advice for you.
First, look for cheap foreclosed houses. Usually good little houses work, unless you find a nice one that happens to be bigger. Look for a price range that you like, and try to buy it. If you win the highest bid, congratulations, onto the next step.
Keep in mind, when you pay for a house, keep the price low for renting, meaning you need to buy low. A good indication of how much to pay is to see if you could rent the house out for about 2% of what you bought it for. Example: Paid 20,000 for it = 400 a month rent. Simple.
Next, make sure you pay for houses all cash upfront. best way of knowing it's paid off, and you don't end up paying more for it because lol mortgage interest.
If you need help, hire cheap labor. Just realeased prison convicts and teenagers begging for jobs are usually the best subjects, but not always recommended for obvious reasons. They will work cheap most of the time, since they can't really get a job else-where.
Next, make sure the place looks homely. You don't want it to look like a hurricane hit the place. Give it some paint, clean some floors, wash the kitchen (Always messy, never understood why), clean up the backyard, and decide if you will let the renters have pets. That's a big one since they do open clientel, but also causes potential to the house. Usually just make a larger deposit on them, and your fine.

Anonymous Thu May 16 00:21:35 2013 No.455767

>>455715
>A 30 year mortgage is anything but cheap.
>The idea is that the tenants more or less maintain the mortgage for you

Right, I assumed 30 year mortgages was the way to go, since the 30 years thin out the payments, as opposed to 15 year or 5 year mortgages, which are higher, correct? I assumed we get the mortgage (a loan), since it's easy to have an income come from the rent, instead of paying 40k+ and slowly trying to break even

>>455753
>my uncle actually does this for a majority of his income, so I have a little advice for you

Oh perfect

>If you win the highest bid, congratulations
Where do you go for the foreclosure auctions? Are there any fees to pay or are they just trying to get rid of the properties?

>Next, make sure you pay for houses all cash upfront. best way of knowing it's paid off, and you don't end up paying more for it because lol mortgage interest

Ah, so according to both of you, I was about to play a sucker's game with getting homes with mortgages. I knew 30 yr were soul draining for your own home, but ok for investment properties. I thought wrong

>wash the kitchen (Always messy, never understood why)
Probably because people don't ventilate and 10 years of oil is everywhere

Is there anything form wise with taxes and financial statements I need to know? Or do I just keep in mind how much money in and out? What say you on property managers?

Anonymous Thu May 16 00:43:49 2013 No.455771

>>455767
>Where do you go for the foreclosure auctions?
I'll admit, I don't know. I know my uncle has a real-estate agent he uses to buy his houses. He literally says "So, any good houses?" She hands him a sheet of the foreclosed houses, he looks through it, finds one he likes, they go look at it, and he asks her to put in a bid for him. After that, I'm not sure what happens, because i never got to go on those trips, but my first piece of advice, if you are completely serious, is to get a real-estate agent. I understand they can be expensive, but I'm not sure what else there is you can do, as the agents basically get first dibs. TL;DR Get an agent, tell him/her your max bid, win, and pay all up front.
As for fees, there aren't many if I remember correctly. Just the agent's fee should be it, but once again, just going off of what I saw happen. If you pay in cash, I'm pretty sure it's just direct, no hassle, right then and there deal. You pay for it, you own it.
Taxes and such are just your standard property taxes and such as i remember. If you can, collect all rent in cash or check, since direct deposit is taxed, I think. (sorry, really tired and can't think straight on laws). Be your own property manager if it's your only job. If you have another job full-time, get one you can trust. Be careful though, because rent collectors are expensive, as they can take up to 15% of total rent collected as their pay. And just as a word to the wise, always make sure you have all paperwork in a binder or briefcase of sorts.

GreenGC Thu May 16 00:55:35 2013 No.455782

>>455767

I've been looking into this as well and am in the 'real estate' business in a way with building/remodeling. Here are some tips I've picked up.

There are two thoughts I've received from experience investors and it boils down to your risk tolerance.

30 yr mortgages are not a bad deal if you're strapped for cash and cant pay outright. It can be better to take calculated risk and leverage what you have rather than just doing nothing and making no progress. If you have 100k dollars and lets say you want to buy homes in the 50k range you can either buy:

2 properties outright

The two paid off properties rent for $500 with no mortgage you'd make $1000/mo or 12k a year for about 12% cash on cash return per year not bad

OR

leverage your money and put down 20% to avoid PMI and acquire 10 properties.

with that you'd have payments of roughly $266 mortgage per house at 5% for 30years if the houses rent for $500 as well that gives you $234 per house or $2340 gross a month. That's $28,080 a year 28% cash-on-cash return a year.

So there can be more money in leveraging the cash you have and acquiring more properties.

Something else to consider is vacancies if you have two properties if one house is empty that means half your money is gone for that month and even though its paid off you still owe taxes, upkeep etc. Whereas you only lose 10% of your income if one tenant is gone from your 10 properties.

As far as property managers they take about 8-12% of the GROSS month rent per property, but when dealing with 1-2 properties I've heard you're better off dealing with it yourself until you acquire 5 or more so you can negotiate percentages with them.

Anonymous Thu May 16 01:58:49 2013 No.455812

>>455771
>I'll admit, I don't know
that's fine, me neither, my dad says you have to be in a super secret investor's club, but he says alot of things.

>Get an agent
Seems clean, just pick some houses and pay what you need to, sounds good for a newbie until I can do it myself, if I can. And ouch, 15% I liked the idea since I thought they handle problems as well, guess I might not do that for the first few houses. Alright, thanks for the help, I thought I came to the thread too late so it's nice to see replies

>>455782
Then we get this hot potato of a post
>30 yr mortgages are not a bad deal if you're strapped for cash and cant pay outright.

Bingo, that's what I thought. So you could go both ways. Rates are stupid low now, and 20% is what I heard were the new down payments, as opposed to the old 10%, which sucks but you have yourself a profitable asset with money in your pocket instead of someone else's.

Dully noted with property managers, I've decided as above to not even begin until a few properties.

Excellent info, guys. I need to study the technical side because I won't be comfortable to do anything until I have numbers nailed the hell down in my head

>>	GreenGC Thu May 16 02:11:05 2013 No.455819 >>455812 If you're serious about this we can chat on Skype. I can drop a ton of info.. have some financial spreadsheets/business plans and better help you sort out a plan and see where you are and where you want to be. Plus, I love the networking.

Anonymous Thu May 16 02:41:50 2013 No.455830

>>455819
>Plus, I love the networking
Well, in case I'm giving the wrong impression, I'm just a jobless 20 something trying to set up all the numbers and the state of mind to help my dad's finance make income vehicles for his retirement, since he's far to casual and reliant on his social security. If you're fine with me and it isn't too late, I'd love all the numbers and info to play with before I start looking for a Dummies book

>>	GreenGC Thu May 16 02:50:21 2013 No.455832 >>455830 Sure thing, Skype is renewedlithium

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/diy/ - Do It Yourself