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/diy/ - Do-It-Yourself

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File: 68 KB, 1000x1000, 15amp_120V_7a6ca00f-b10f-4bb2-a74f-b42e25485140_1024x1024.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2470873 No.2470873 [Reply] [Original] [archived.moe]

I have a yuropoor coffee machine that I want to run off my 240V stove outleti, so I'm thinking of making an extension cord ending in a box with two outlets, one for the 14-50 plug off the stove, and one for the coffee machine (and a 15A breaker wired with the coffee machine's plug, in case something stupid happens).

Can I use a basic 120V plug and outlet (which I already have lying around) for that part? Lop the weird euro-plug end off the power cord and replace it with a normal one. Or does it actually need to be a 240V plug/outlet (which I don't already have and would have to buy)? Are 120V-rated connectors actually at risk of arcing through their insulation if they have 240V pushed through them? I haven't looked up NEMA standards or insulator breakdown voltage yet because I'm lazy.

>> No.2470897

Do it at least halfway right and use the correct plugs and receptacles. Voltage isn't the important part for what a component can handle, amperage is. NEMA 5-15 receptacles like the one you pictured won't handle the current your oven can draw, so you'll need a 50A receptacle for it, and you might as well get a NEMA 6 (240V) plug and receptacle for the coffee maker since it won't cost much more than using the 120V connectors.

But more than that, how special is this coffee maker that you're going to all this trouble and expense to use it?

>> No.2470907
File: 45 KB, 620x512, cbi-metal-quad-box-12-gauge-sjoow-25ft-12.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

The oven is going to plug into a proper 14-50 receptacle, that part is fine. I'm just making a gang-box type extension cord with two outlets on the end, so I can run the coffee machine off the same circuit (and I'll never be running every element and the oven and the coffee machine at the same time, so no issues with tripping the 50A breaker at the panel). The coffee machine won't be pulling 50A (and like I said, I'll stick a 15A breaker in with it just in case) so there's no risk of anything melting. My only concern was whether a 120 connector would do something retarded like arc out due to insufficient insulation. I already have some spare 120v plugs and receptacles, that's why I wanted to see if I could get away without buying 240v shit for no reason.

It's special enough, the thing costs like $2k here and my Polish relative gave me his one for free. I have a 2kw transformer, but I'm not sticking that stupid thing on my counter.

Pic related, the kind of thing I'm thinking of making, but bigger and with different receptacles because it's 50A.

>> No.2470908

so how are you gonna supply single phase 240v when all you have is split phase 240v?

>> No.2470912

you need to get 2 hot wires and combine them together for the voltage to add up

>> No.2470919

before you turn your kitchen into a hack job fire hazard you might as well check this coffee maker's specs to see if it can run off 120v, in which case just rewire it and be on your way

>> No.2470937

He's going to energize the neutral bonded chassis.

>> No.2470960

Why would the chassis be bonded to neutral if the plug has a ground pin?

>> No.2470988

If that's the case, then it'll work with the NEMA 5 (120V) receptacles and plugs then as long as you don't go retarded and plug something else into it because it's technically wrong. The 120V receptacles won't arc internally at 240V.

He's not using a neutral, he is supplying line to line single phase 240V. His oven is using 240V single phase.

>> No.2471000

So where does OP say whether he has single phase 240v or not? Because if he's in the US he more than likely doesn't.

>> No.2471008

>His oven is using 240V single phase.
Not in with a NEMA 14-50. There are four lugs 2x 120 VAC 180 degrees out of phase, one neutral for unbalanced current return, and one grounding conductor.
You aren't wrong, but it's no guarantee. Inadvertently energizing the chassis is the biggest risk running a Euro 240 VAC nominal appliance with 2 120 VAC nominal hots.

>> No.2471033
File: 271 KB, 1080x922, Screenshot_20220922_180636.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

They sell splitters for us 240v outlets because people use them for EV chargers.

Maybe make sure there's a fuse in your cable to the coffee maker.

>> No.2471034

It actually is single phase. Your house is two legs of one transformer with one phase of power on the other side.

3 phase is perfectly common in the US, any large apartment or commercial block will probably be 3 phase.

>> No.2471043

>Inadvertently energizing the chassis
In that case, I'll just check for continuity between the ground pin and all external metal on the machine. It would be retarded if they bonded neutral to the outer shell when there's a perfectly good ground pin, but I suppose euros like to do retarded shit.

>> No.2471045

Neutral pin, rather. And live, just in case some monkey swapped

>> No.2471053

the colors during assebly, fucking autopost.

>> No.2471065

They don't bond the neutral to chassis in Europe because European plugs are unpolarized. There's no guarantee which one will be neutral. Should work fine on split phase 240V

>> No.2471079 [DELETED] 

The chassis floats with a Euro plug or is a ground pin guaranteed?

>> No.2471080

>They don't bond the neutral to chassis in Europe because European plugs are unpolarized.
>Europlugs are only designed for low-power (less than 2.5 A) Class II (double-insulated) devices that operate at normal room temperature and do not require a protective-earth connection.
The yuropoor coffee machine in OP's post can't possibly be fewer than 2.5 A.

>> No.2471083

>Can I use a basic 120V plug and outlet (which I already have lying around) for that part?
You can, there are countries that are using US sockets with 220V like china.
But it is dodgy. I'd rather get proper schuko wired.
Order it from aliexpress or idk
Voltage is important too.
I mean, try using 16A circuit breaker (220 VAC) on e-bike with 70+ VDC. It would get fried real fast.
Yes, fuse is a good idea actually.

>> No.2471085

European plug =/= Europlugs

Several European plugs (but not all) are unpolarized including SchuKo and the Italian Type L plugs.

>> No.2471095

>You can, there are countries that are using US sockets with 220V like china.
NEMA 6 exists. Additionally, just about every NEMA 5 is rated 125/250V.

>> No.2471098

Yeah, but the SchuKo and the Type L both appear to have guaranteed grounding pins regardless of orientation so the polarization is rightfully irrelevant.

>> No.2471105

just get a fucking voltage inverter, they're like $20. what the FUCK are you THINKING?

>> No.2471106

I wouldn't say irrelevant. I rather have my power switch cut off live rather than neutral.

>> No.2471113

So what are you trying to argue?

>> No.2471116

That ideally even grounded plugs should be polarized.

>> No.2471118

OK, that's fair.

>> No.2471340

I'm a fan of Schuko but I agree.

If we had to start from scratch and decide on a plug type to use in all of Europe I'd argue that the Swiss type is the best.

>> No.2472211

Don't they sell 120/240 transformers out there?

>> No.2472220

What does a decent one with enough power set you back?
You can expect a coffee machine to draw 1500W, euro ones might draw even more.

>> No.2472229

Probably the same. The issue is that if you connect that directly to 120 V will use 375 W.
That's why you need a transformer that supports 1500W, and cabling that supports 12.5 A. Then it will work properly.

>> No.2472234
File: 52 KB, 750x547, Samsung washing machine exploded at Plano home.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>Can I use a basic 120V plug and outlet

yes you can, but you shouldnt, coz the wife (or whoever) is gonna plug in the vacuum (or whatever) and burn it up.

>> No.2472235

Make sure it’s coming from the same breaker though, if one trips it’ll send voltage back into it and you’ll probably piss off your neighbors.

>> No.2472243
File: 249 KB, 1399x1193, Imagepipe_2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

I made one of these and installed a 6-20 outlet. It runs a 2.5kW yuropoor clothes iron which saves me at least 2.7s per shirt on heatup time.

Also the fuck is with lack of 5-20 appliances? Most kitchens are already wired for 20A, it would cost next to nothing to start using it. I don't think I ever even seen a 125V/20A appliance in my life.

>> No.2472250

The no-name chinesium 2kw one I have, I bought off ebay years ago for about $100. They're probably more now.

>> No.2472289

That would work. It's electricity. If your installation is not Edison age tier, the breaker will pop before damaging anything else.
You'd probably don't wanna use it when something is on in the same room because of >>2472234

>> No.2472293

The point of the thread is not to use the transformer (and have it take up valuable counter space), but to use the 240v that is already in the kitchen. There's noting /diy/ about plugging an appliance into a transformer.

>> No.2472904

> I don't think I ever even seen a 125V/20A appliance in my life.

Air conditioners and half sized water heaters can be 20a.

>> No.2472905


>> No.2472909

>Lack of 120 20a appliances
Microwaves and refrigerators are 120 20a. And we put disposals and dishwashers on their own 120 20a. What are you talking about? Big fucking appliances like electric ovens or dryers will be 240. But if you have gas it's all 120.

Also what's up with all the 6-20, 5-20, 14-50, ect shit? Plug names? I've never heard these terms before and I've been doing electric work for 5 years. I have a feeling I should know these things.

>> No.2472943
File: 68 KB, 480x412, NEMA_plug_chart_some_rotated_480x480.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

An actual 120-20amp plug looks like a normal plug with one blade sideways. You can get 15/20amp compatible outlets. Even though most 15 amp sockets can handle 20a your actual 20a/18a continuous device should have a 5-20 plug.

>> No.2473000
File: 42 KB, 665x532, 1660835659530607.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>I've been doing electric work for 5 years
>Doesn't know NEMA names

Reconsider yourself

>> No.2473034

Thanks for the image. Itll be helpful when I need to know the specific name of an outlet I need to buy for a plug. Instead of just taking a picture. I've only seen 5-20p on like two things ever. A high end microwave and a whirlpool tub motor. Despite all microwaves needing 20a they practically never come with 5-20.

>> No.2473036

I know what I've been taught on the job and what I needed to learn myself to do the job. Knowing names of plugs was never necessary. I just took a picture of a plug if I needed to buy an outlet for it. Annoying though how similar 5-20 and 6-20 look though. Almost identical.

>> No.2473056

That bugs me too. Even outlets that are wired for 20A service almost always use 5-15 receptacles, which is probably why appliances that require a 20A circuit use 5-15 plugs. I guess it saves a few bucks somewhere and the breaker is doing the protecting anyway.

>> No.2473057

NEMA 5-15Rs are rated for 20A pass through.

>> No.2473064

We've used 5-15 plugs on a 20a line simply because it's what we had and the boss didn't feel like getting 5-20. The price difference isn't that much. I don't have an issue with it really. As long as the wires are properly sized and the breaker matches I'm cool.

>> No.2473321

the europoor plugs that are recessed are often safer and better holding then the american ones.

Anyway sure you can as long as you make sure you match live and neutral (live is blue and neutral is brown) and make sure you keep ground ...

>> No.2473327

Would European 230V (L1 230V, N 0V) on American 240V split phase (L1 -120V, L2 120V)?

>> No.2473329

Do you have no outlets in the rest of your entire house? Like wtf. Why do you HAVE to tap off this outlet in particular?

>> No.2473344

This should never happen.

>> No.2473354


Does your North American house have 240v running to every outlet?

>> No.2473355


>> No.2473359

Fuck, I should sleep. I accidentally a word, and I'm from EU.
So I guess it doesn't matter what the voltage on a single wire is, only the difference between the two that are connected.

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