DIY HVAC

[Anonymous No.2441335]

You ABSOLUTELY can diy HVAC yourself, if youre not completely retarded.

HVAC contractors are the biggest ripoff I've seen.
They charge 2-3x market value for parts and will charge you $XXX in labor for undoing 5 screws and 4 wires being swapped.

The fact they they feel the unchecked entitlement to charge this is proof in itself that their clientele are retards.

[Anonymous No.2441338]

Yeah, most things are do-able if you can be arsed to understand the principles

except teeth

best dentist in the world can't do their own teeth

[Anonymous No.2441340]

if thats so, then why hasnt an HVAC tech undercut their competition by now and forced the market cheaper to claim market share?

[Anonymous No.2441347]

>>2441340
Bro just call them up and ask about parts and price check their asses
Guy just tried to sell me an $11 part for $35.

[Anonymous No.2441348]

>>2441335
one of my heat pumps stopped working a few days ago. seems someone had bypassed the defrost board (before we got the house). which is fine since where I live it's not a big problem in the winter. BUT somehow the board was passing 120v to the thermostat and messed it up. The company I called quoted $950 for the board.

I know damn well that the board should not be that much but needed it working and thought they could get it faster than I could. they took $200 off the parts. they still took 3 business days to get the part.

luckily our house has 2 ac units so we weren't totally without AC. then the other unit went out. called them out again (still waiting on parts for the first). second unit stopped working because the condenser drain clogged and tripped a float switch in the drain.

The board in question for the first unit cost no more than $150 when I got the old one and looked it up.

I am in the process of fixing the bad board. it has a blown relay, blown, blown,1n4148, 5 blown electrolytics, and a blown npn transistor (parts on order). I may have to replace the 2 chips on the board but won't know till later.

now the invoice did not have labor on it so not sure if that is included in their pricing or what?

either way I got service info on both units and I am pre-emptively ordering common failure parts. next time there is a problem I will try to fix it before calling anyone.

[Anonymous No.2441355]

>>2441335
Because they are running an actual business and have themselves and their employees to support.

If you want an actual professional that is certified, licensed, bonded, insured and offers warranty on their service then you will have to pay a premium for that. It is simply the way that it is.

There is plenty of work to go around, most of these guys don't have to undercut each other. Reputation travels, the shitty ones tend not to survive too long.

[Anonymous No.2441361]

>>2441355
Reread what I said, they make their money in labor, I'm mostly bitching about price gouging parts. They didn't make the capacitor or whatever

[Anonymous No.2441362]

>>2441361
They have to spend the time looking it up, talking to you, ordering it, getting it, delivering it, etc
Ofc they will mark it up to account for that

[Anonymous No.2441365]

>>2441362
Ok, once again, they charge MORE than the stores online that do the same fucking thing.
They are scalpers, not legitimate businessmen.

[Anonymous No.2441369]

>>2441362
They mark it up because they know that HVAC suppliers play fuck fuck games when it comes to selling direct to consumers. Some don't even sell to consumers because ???

Don't fucking @ me about how HVAC is somehow any more dangerous than other trades. Didn't ask, don't care, spend more time sucking each other off.

[Anonymous No.2441374]

>>2441369
This

[Anonymous No.2441376]

>>2441362
Most of these hvac faggots call me at the supply house to do their research and find a part for them. Lots of them use the instruction manual as a knee pad.
>>2441369
We don't sell homeowners because they will usually fuck it all up and contractors spend shit loads of money every year in our stores.

[Anonymous No.2441385]

>>2441376
Imagine literally any other market tried this shit
>Lowe's won't sell you a saw or wood because you might break them or build a house that falls down
>Walmart won't sell you laundry detergent because you might ruin your clothes and Sue Walmart, youre not a laundry mat
I want you to Livestream your suicide

[Anonymous No.2441391]

>>2441385
>Imagine literally any other market tried this shit
They have cover because you don't have EPA certs or a mechanical license.

[Anonymous No.2441393]

[Anonymous No.2441398]

>>2441391
I need a fucking capacitor and was denied a sale because "I might burn my house down"
Fuck the EPA and fuck you
Dispose of your freon in an exit bag on Livestream you fucking faggots

[Anonymous No.2441402]

>>2441398
>being this mad
Calm down, lad; you'll live longer. Search for the part number online and order one that way if the local houses won't play ball.

[Anonymous No.2441405]

>>2441402
Yea, and that's the only way I'll be buying shit now.
Fuck American businesses, most Jewish shit ever.
I'm convinced that HVAC suppliers are just HVAC repairmen that schemed a way to make money off other HVAC repairmen and just stuck to their fraudulent "you can't diy HVAC" memes.

[Anonymous No.2441411]

>>2441405
>I'm convinced that HVAC suppliers are just HVAC repairmen that schemed a way to make money off other HVAC repairmen and just stuck to their fraudulent "you can't diy HVAC" memes.
You are probably right. It was the one automotive repair I was apprehensive to make until I got in an did it. Now, it's been 10 years, and the A/C in the car is working just as well as it did the day I completed the compressor replacement. It's no different than anything else DIY as long as you have or can get the right tool. I know people get nervous about natural gas, but that didn't stop me from running the 7" wc 3/4" black iron pipe I needed.

[Anonymous No.2441412]

>>2441398
I would sell you a capacitor as long as you know what one you need.

[Anonymous No.2441413]

>>2441412
Then youre not that bad

[Anonymous No.2441420]

>>2441338
I had a lady doctor whose husband was a urologist and did his own vasectomy.

[Anonymous No.2441422]

>>2441420
Kinda makes you wonder what he knew other doctors do to patients even they are knocked out

[Anonymous No.2441424]

>>2441391
Every time I hear shit like this, it's used as a justification for why it's better to pay a """licensed professional."""

>b-b-b-but you have no recourse if you burn down your house

If they burn down my house, they'll just magically go out of business and fail to pay any judgements against them, and insurance will screw me anyway. HVAC and electricians are the two most insufferable trades.
>>2441405
Why do you think the building codes are so complex? They kick back money to politicians to require all this bullshit "because of the children". The building codes are how these assholes make money.

[Anonymous No.2441426]

>>2441422
Yeah. My brother used to be an OR tech, and I'd get sent pictures once in a while. "Check out the size of this hernia!" He didn't even know it was a thing until he realized that every time something really gross/cool happened, everybody outside the sterile field would whip out their phones.

[Anonymous No.2441430]

>>2441426
Absolutely disgusting, belligerent violation of privacy.

[Anonymous No.2441432]

>>2441413
What I won't do is sell a boiler or a furnace to someone who has zero experience. They'll want you to size up their house, figure out any duct work or any other shit that's over their head.

[Anonymous No.2441433]

>>2441424
>Every time I hear shit like this, it's used as a justification for why it's better to pay a """licensed professional."""
I am just parroting their excuse. It is bullshit.

[Anonymous No.2441444]

>>2441432
>boiler
Like a hot water heater or 1930s radiator thing?

Also not doing the work for them is one thing, but if the can figure out what they want in their own then you really should sell it to them.
Forcing people to use as many middlemen as possible is just wicked.

[Anonymous No.2441445]

>>2441430
Hospitalfag here. It happens in every OR in the world. Nobody cares as long as your pictures don't have anything identifiable.

[Anonymous No.2441446]

>>2441445
>Implying anyone is checking
These assholes don't deserve money either

[Anonymous No.2441448]

>>2441335
The difference between HVAC and most other DIY projects is that you get only get to work on it or tinker with it when it breaks, and if you fuck it up, you are out >$5000. Sure you can DIY it, but if you're going to learn the skills to work on it you might as well become a tech.

[Anonymous No.2441449]

>>2441448
You assume everyone that isn't an HVAC tech is a soiboi.
Welders laugh at you
Mechanics are rolling over in their graves before mechanics are even dead

[Anonymous No.2441453]

>>2441449
No, I assume most people make enough money in their profession and value their time enough that they can afford to farm out work that needs to happen once every couple of years to someone else.

At a certain point you are costing yourself more working on something yourself, than you are saving by doing it yourself.

Drive an old beater car that breaks down once a week?
Lern2wrench.

Have a condenser with a leaky coil?
Pay a tech to fix it and refill it with refrigerant. (It would cost you as much to buy the refrigerant as it would the tech to fill it with the bottle he already has on his truck).

[Anonymous No.2441470]

>>2441453
Yes can I please get a jug of r410? What? Its how much? I just need a couple of pounds, bro.

[Anonymous No.2441477]

Ac bros...got a question

My ac seems like its running way longer and struggles to cool as good as it used to. I cleaned the coils which werent that dirty and it didnt seem to make a significant difference. Me thinks its low on freon? It's a package style unit that i installed myself used about 2 years ago. In the moving process the TXV? valve broke and i had a friend solder on a new one and recharged the system. I remember he ran out of mapp gas and we used propane to finish the job. I'm thinking there may be a pinhole leak?

[Anonymous No.2441479]

>>2441453
>Drive an old beater car that breaks down once a week?
>Lern2wrench.
>Have a condenser with a leaky coil?
>Pay a tech to fix it a
My oxyacetylene setup is bigger than yours because of that.

I'm disabled and can't afford their Jew prices, guess I deserve to fester in the humid heat huh
>>2441453
>(It would cost you as much to buy the refrigerant as it would the tech to fill it with the bottle he already has on his truck).
Why if it needs done every few years like you say it would seem a tank is a good investment, or do you mean because I have to buy greymarket because of the gatekeeping price gouging (((HVAC tech/wholesalers)))

[Anonymous No.2441484]

>>2441479
>Why if it needs done every few years like you say it would seem a tank is a good investment

I mean that your system may be need to be worked on every few years. If you are putting an entire
bottle worth of refrigerant in your system every couple of years, you've got bigger problems.


You can probably change a fan motor or a capacitor yourself, but if you get into the compressor or line set, your are better off paying someone else to do it, even if prices are inflated.

I will grant that there are tons of shitty residential HVAC companies.

[Anonymous No.2441486]

>>2441484
>If you are putting an entire
>bottle worth of refrigerant in your system every couple of years, you've got bigger problems.
Yea, I meant more of a "probably going to need a jug of this shit at some point in the next 80 years" hoarder point of view.

>but if you get into the compressor or line set, your are better off paying someone else to do it, even if prices are inflated.
If I can braze and have vacuum pumps and reclaim machines, how so?

>I will grant that there are tons of shitty residential HVAC companies.
That's my fucking problem.
My central air unit is almost entirely unserviceable due to the position it's installed in, and all of my tools that were in my basement left with the contractor.
Fuck those niggers

[Anonymous No.2441488]

What's the name of the supply house that turned you away?

[Anonymous No.2441490]

>>2441488
Why?
It's just some local fag
And the only local supply house apparently..
I'm going to put him out of business :)

[Anonymous No.2441501]

>>2441477
I would say you're probably right. You really should use Oxyacetylene to braze anything in an AC unit, and you really shouldn't change brazing techniques halfway through a job.

[Anonymous No.2441506]

>>2441501
Nah it's fine

>>2441477
Just cover the holes with some electric tape

[Anonymous No.2441510]

>>2441335
I know this is a troll post but fuck it I'll bite.

You absolutely can do anything you set your mind to. Welding, carpentry, tile laying, drywalling, you name it you can do it, sometimes after you watch a youtube video. But 9/10 people can't be bothered because they have to go do whatever it is they went to school for to make money to keep their house from getting foreclosed on and their cars from getting repo'd. So yeah, we charge what we charge because when we do the math, that's what it costs to get a $40k truck carrying $10k worth of tools and parts to show up at your house and fix whatever's broken, plus whatever it's worth to us to do in the first place. The guy who's doing it isn't going to take the liability for burger flipper wages, and neither would you. Go find an auto mechanic that will install a part you bought off Ebay and warranty it. If tradies were really that replaceable ChrisFix would have put every mechanic out of business years ago. Moral of the story if you don't want to pay someone to fix your shit, fix it yourself, we've got ten more people on the phone that will pay to not have to worry.

[Anonymous No.2441512]

>>2441510
>Bait
It's not, read the thread Im pissed the distributors only sell to HVAC fags and HVAC fags are price gouging parts, I needed a capacitor and got rid to go fuck myself

>ChrisFix would have put every mechanic
He all but did

>Do it yourself
Can't because HVAC lies and jewery stopped me from buying a $10 cap so I'm sitting in the heat costing you jobs.

[Anonymous No.2441610]

>>2441512
>stopped me from buying a $10 cap
a capacitor is a capacitor
you can replace it with a generic part

[Anonymous No.2441635]

>>2441610
That is the generic part
The HVAC retards want $45 for the thing
Dumbass distributor won't sell it to me because I'm not epa certified

Also stop namefagging, nobody cares who you are, this isn't plebbit

[Anonymous No.2441679]

>>2441635
You can buy generic parts from non-HVAC jews
You can buy it from an electronics supplier or whatever

[Anonymous No.2441681]

>>2441635
>They won't sell to me
It's a generic cap, try radio shack/AliExpress/mouser/digikey or wherever really
>Stop name fagging
Get your eyesight checked

[Anonymous No.2441682]

>>2441635
Ok, but can’t you just get a capacitor from any place that sells electric components? It’s not a special part. You can get them from china on the internet like everything else.

[Anonymous No.2441684]

>>2441393
neat

[Anonymous No.2441697]

>>2441393
>trane
Are they the best? Any HVAC anons here that would input if they could install any system they wanted, what would they choose?

I have an2016 sqf been home that I have been using a window a/c unit (12k BTU) in for years. It keeps the house cool even in very hot weather, but it runs all the time. For heat I use a wood furnace that very easily keeps up. I already have ducting installed. I took out the furnace many years ago because I couldn’t afford the propane and it was very noisy system. A/C system was 2.5 ton, but had to move it to redo some waterproofing on the outside.

If you installed a system, what company and size unit would you install? I want electric heat because I’d only use it if it were mildly cool out.

Wood heat is my favorite heat.

[Anonymous No.2441712]

>>2441697
An electric baseboard is an electric baseboard for heat. It's a giant piece of corrugated metal with a resistor in place simplest shit in the world been the same for 100 years. Unless that's not what you're talking about.

[Anonymous No.2441713]

The internet ruined a lot of these guys still plenty of NPCs for their business though. Before the internet all they had to do was refuse to sell parts to anyone not in the local HVAC club and you were basically shit out of luck.

[Anonymous No.2441740]

All you really need for home HVAC work is the wonderfully versatile Dremel

[Anonymous No.2441741]

>>2441335
I’m not allowed to buy Freon. How do you get around the Freon problem?

[Anonymous No.2441748]

>>2441361
By that logic restaurants shouldn't be charging 3x markup on menu items. But you're paying for the luxury of not having to do shit yourself.

[Anonymous No.2441754]

>>2441347
Yes he's going to charge $11 for a part he has to drive over, install and warranty for someone who cries about $24

[Anonymous No.2441760]

>>2441335
dunno how it works where you live?
here
>business customers have 1 year minimum warranty by law, if its a large corporate deal they will most likely have 3 year
>private customers have 5 year minimum warranty by law
i as the professional part have to front that warranty, the factory in japan, china, italy, germany, finland whatever i get parts from dont. if you somehow manage to get thoose parts for cheap yourself im not fucking touching it because the moment i do i become legally obligated to uphold warranty on it.
also i can charge what i want because people are stupid and require my help.
fuck you, cope and seethe all you want.

[Anonymous No.2441780]

>>2441748
Yeah, they already are.. with some items it's as much as 10-20x.

Some suppliers simply don't want to deal with the public. Even for businesses, some suppliers won't deal with you unless they fully vet you out and decide you're worth their time..

Take trane as an example since it was mentioned here. They might not want their spare parts sold to anyone unless they're certified. Why? Implied warranty.

Go buy your generic or after market parts and do the repair.

[Anonymous No.2441810]

>>2441712
I don’t want an electric baseboard anon. I want an electric furnace that sits on top of the air handler that has an a/c unit outside. The most common setup in the US.

[Anonymous No.2441820]

You can do it, but should you. You can avoid frustration by paying someone with a license and an established skill set. I like DIY, but there are some things that I don't attempt.

[Anonymous No.2441854]

>i have a business to run! i can't sell you parts near market value!
=
>i have created a huge market inefficiency in which you have to pay me 2x market value for some reason, because i want your misunderstanding of the market (i.e. you accepting my market inefficiency as an efficiency) to pay for my kids' college education

[Anonymous No.2441858]

>>2441741
In America you just buy it off eBay or several other websites because they don't give a shit and none of the EPA's rules are actually enforced. You just have to sign a disclaimer saying you're actually buying it for a professional to use. They don't check.

[Anonymous No.2441888]

>>2441682
>>2441679
Online is the only option, it's a small flyovertown. There's not electronics suppliers like that here. I can order the part online but the point is they are price gouging jews

[Anonymous No.2441891]

>>2441748
The restaurant actually does some work, and no they shouldn't be charging 300% markup either.
These capacitors were made with Chinese slaves and brought all the way here for $15.
This slimebag isn't getting $45 . He's done no work .

[Anonymous No.2441892]

>>2441754
He's not installing shit he didn't do a fucking thing

[Anonymous No.2441897]

>>2441820
That skillshet is basic bitch shit that anyone above "house wife using a high heel show as a hammer" should have.
You rip people off inorder to live above your means and you spread lies like this inorder to sustain your otherwise entirely unsustainable business model

[Anonymous No.2441929]

>>2441393
We sell ICP products in my supply house.

[Anonymous No.2441931]

>>2441929
>We sell ICP products in my supply house.
You might be able to help me

[Anonymous No.2441933]

>>2441931
What do you need help with? If you have an android, get the app "fast mobile tech" you can put in ICP model & serial numbers to find part numbers you need.

[Anonymous No.2441943]

>>2441933
>What do you need help with?
FUCKIN MAGNETS!
How do they work!?

[Anonymous No.2441956]

>>2441897
*in order

You are welcomed.

[Anonymous No.2441966]

>>2441760
>if you somehow manage to get thoose parts for cheap yourself im not fucking touching it because the moment i do i become legally obligated to uphold warranty on it.
Ding ding ding. We have this problem all the fucking time.
>customer sees price for condenser fan replacement, goes off about how he can do it himself
>a month later he calls back because he's burned out the compressor, because the fan wasn't wired right or he's bought the wrong motor, or one of a million stupid things he's done because durr hvac monkeys no work good
>proceeds to chimp out because we'll tell him we're not touching his trailer park wiring job
People don't understand, you're not just paying for me to show up and fix your shit, you're paying to uphold the warranty. If you had any idea how many parts warranty repairs are actually performed, you'd pay the $100 and leave that shit alone. Also have fun when you finally find a supplier that will sell you a full split unit and you find out they manufacturer isn't giving you a warranty. Or, when you replace something with an Ebay part and then a warrantied part actually does fuck up, then find out that the tech isn't going to honor the warranty you did have because you've fucked with the unit. But I work commercial, so I'll never have to hold your hand and explain to you how and why warranties work the way they do.

[Anonymous No.2441967]

>>2441335
8/10 baitpost OP. You're gonna hook a few live ones. Bravo!

[Anonymous No.2441979]

>>2441335
>You ABSOLUTELY can diy HVAC yourself, if youre not completely retarded.
Sure, certain things are simple. Blown capacitor? Bad contactor? Simple, especially if you get a like-for-like replacement. Bad compressor? Reversing valve? TXV? Heat exchanger? These things require specialized tools and knowledge to do properly, stuff beyond what the average DIYer can usually handle. Could you buy torches, a vacuum pump, nitrogen rig, the parts, and learn on the fly. Maybe. You'd likely be unable to buy refrigerant, and even if you did you still have to figure all this shit out and get it done right.

It's like a car. Can I replace brakes, an alternator, starter, etc? Sure. Can I pull and engine and rebuild it? No. So I have to pay someone or find a friend in the business to trade labor with.

Also, HVAC is one of the most government regulated businesses to operate. You need an EPA certification, state license, local licenses in every city you operate in, liability insurance and bonding, vehicle insurance, gas and vehicle maintenance, employees require payroll taxes, health insurance, training, plus you need to have a vehicle stocked with parts and materials so you do repairs right away. It costs the average HVAC contractor roughly $80 just to park in your driveway.

Are there guys who rip people off or overcharge? Sure. I know plenty of scumbags in the business. They're usually the guys with the most ads and cheapest advertised rates. You think anyone actually gets the $39 service call? They gotta make it up somewhere. If you don't like a quoted price pay the man his service call and refuse the repair. Ask friends and family who they use. Check reviews. Avoid the cheapest guys, and don't let yourself be pressured. If a guy is applying the hard-sell or says things like "you need to do this now or you could die/be in a fire/whatever" then definitely be wary. Get second opinions on major failures like compressors or heat exchangers.

[Anonymous No.2441987]

>>2441365
>>2441369
>>2441385
>>2441391
>>2441398
>>2441405
>>2441490
>>2441512
>>2441635
Supply house fag here. Let me explain why we won't sell parts to the public:
1 - liability. If we sell you a part and you DO manage to electrocute yourself or start a fire or whatever then we are gonna get sued. Even though YOU might not be a retard there are a lot of retards out there and it only takes one. Years ago I worked at a supply house that took pity on a guy with no heat and sold him a gas valve. Sure enough, he started a fire and did some serious damage before suing us. They ended up having to pay him a settlement because he wasn't even supposed to be able to get the part.
2 - many HVAC brands closely monitor who sells what to whom. A supply house could lose their dealership if they were caught selling parts or equipment retail. Many brand names now will void your warranty if you buy their stuff online. No one is going to risk a dealership for you.
3 - It would hurt their business if word got out they were selling to homeowners. HVAC contractors would stop going to a supply house if they were selling to homeowners. After all, you're costing them money and work.
4 - Retail is an absolute pain in the ass. Homeowners often guess wrong when ordering, order the wrong parts, or just buy one of everything trying to get the right part. Returns are a pain, and so is trying to provide tech support to someone that doesn't undertand the basics.
5 - Some states don't allow it. Certain states require you to have a state HVAC license to purchase parts wholesale. The wholesaler has to keep license copies on file and can be fined or even shut down for violating the laws.

BTW it's federal law (for a couple years now) that you MUST have an EPA card to buy any refrigerant. Supply houses are supposed to keep copies of your card on file - and the EPA does spot check. We've been inspected once already by them for compliance (luckily no violations).

[Anonymous No.2441988]

>>2441470
If you don't have an EPA card you're pretty well out of luck. Try craigslist or offer up and see if someone is selling a partial bottle you could grab. Ask around if any friends or friends-of-friends do HVAC and maybe see if you can barter some off a guy.

I'd avoid ordering online, especially from asian websites. You may get a completely different gas or something fucked up like propane.

[Anonymous No.2441989]

>>2441348
>I am in the process of fixing the bad board. it has a blown relay, blown, blown,1n4148, 5 blown electrolytics, and a blown npn transistor (parts on order). I may have to replace the 2 chips on the board but won't know till later.
This is just dumb. Get a new board. Once you have the OEM part number it should be easy to find. There may even be an aftermarket kit or version that's less expensive.

>>2441412
There's a contractor near me that added a retail counter. He'll sell you any part you want to fix it yourself, and if you really fuck it up you can pay him to send a tech over to un-fuck it. Only catch is no returns on electrical stuff so you need to be sure what you need.

[Anonymous No.2441997]

>>2441966
>>customer sees price for condenser fan replacement, goes off about how he can do it himself
>a month later he calls back because he's burned out the compressor, because the fan wasn't wired right or he's bought the wrong motor, or one of a million stupid things he's done because durr hvac monkeys no work good
Had this two years ago. Guy had a bad fan motor in a twenty year old unit. Two service companies told him replace the AC they wouldn't fix it, so he ordered his own motor online. Spent two days trying to get it installed, wired it like a Christmas tree. Day three his wife got my number from a friend of hers I did work for and begged me to come look at it. I went over there and spent about 20 minutes figuring out what he did and got it working. I could've been a dick about it but I don't work like that. I charged them a service call and my time, $160. This year he finally had the money for a new setup and called me. I gave him a fair price and swapped it out. It's all in finding someone honest you can deal with.

[Anonymous No.2441998]

>>2441967
I'm 100% serious
Hvacucks are going to seethe anyway.
A mechanic is more qualified than those idiots

[Anonymous No.2442001]

>>2441979
>in the business
That's the biggest issue with you fags
You are circle jerk of walking egos that can't accept your own inadequacy.

[Anonymous No.2442004]

>>2441979
>You need an EPA certification,
That's the only regulation you listed over a hotdog seller, but even then you need a food license and a vendors license so you are unqualified to even be making hotdogs cause youre not in the industry!

[Anonymous No.2442010]

>>2441987
>then we are gonna get sued.
No you won't, that's never happened.

>HVAC contractors would stop going to a supply house if they were selling to homeowners.
And there it is!
You deserve a slow clap for being honest about something, if you are being honest.
But now, HVAC contracts are going to shit over this and you are going to loose even more sales.
I'm not using HVAC contractors because they probably got left parts from the dick that refused to sell me stuff
Now all of the local market will hurt and I'll send my money to China

[Anonymous No.2442012]

>>2441989
The man just told you he's fixing it for $5

[Anonymous No.2442016]

>>2441997
>wo service companies told him replace the AC they wouldn't fix it
Yeah, unless that thing was completely smoked (doesn't sound like it was) you don't go around doing that shit. We had a guy who sold someone's 80 year old grandmother a Wifi thermostat when she didn't have internet in her house.

[Anonymous No.2442017]

>>2441998
>I'm 100% serious
>Hvacucks are going to seethe anyway.
Show us on the doll where the technician touched you,

>A mechanic is more qualified than those idiots
I will concede that there are a lot of unqualified techs out there. There's guys who got taught wrong, guys who are just lazy and cut corners, guys who know how to do it right but don't, and guys who are still too green to be out on their own but they are anyway.
Like any trade we have our share of scammers and bottom feeders too. Are we all that way? Of course not. You know that, you're just enraged because you got told no and you're not used to that.

So, why not just order the part you need online? If you want to DIY you have to accept some discomfort might come with that. Try posting an ad in craigslist wanted or barter and see if you can find a tech who will sell you one off his truck.

Or just vent your fury on an anonymous Khazakhstani knitting forum.

[Anonymous No.2442019]

>>2442010
no ones gonna miss you. there is a reason professionals dont want to deal with residential unless they have to, there is simply no money to make and if there isnt why would we do it?
i got customers who have full access to the price list from our parts dealers, they dont question our markup, they know how the world operates. and they do the exact same thing themselfs.
no one works for free.

[Anonymous No.2442023]

>>2442017
He tried to molest my wallet in a heatwave and I'm ordering online because they are all jews

[Anonymous No.2442024]

>>2442004
>you are unqualified to even be making hotdogs cause youre not in the industry!
I can go buy a pack of hotdogs at the store, but you can't go buy a jug of refrigerant.

>>2442010
>>then we are gonna get sued.
>No you won't, that's never happened.
I was there when it happened. If you don't want to believe me then I can't make you but it is true.
>I'm not using HVAC contractors because they probably got left parts from the dick that refused to sell me stuff
>Now all of the local market will hurt and I'll send my money to China
We in the local market have lived in fear of the day you would forsake us for China, and now it's here.

>>2442012
>The man just told you he's fixing it for $5
His fixes won't work. He's wasting a ton of time on trying to repair a disposable part (and in the meantime has no AC). I could see replacing the board with a new one and then repairing the old one in your spare time as an emergency backup, but I wouldn't rely on something like that as a permanent repair. If he screws it up he could damage his unit.

[Anonymous No.2442025]

>>2442019
"Noone works for free"
That's the problem with this world, there's no work on his end involved.

[Anonymous No.2442028]

>>2442023
>He tried to molest my wallet in a heatwave
And there it is!
You deserve a slow clap for being honest about something.
>I'm ordering online because they are all jews
Actually, there's nothing wrong with doing this if you're comfortable with doing the repair yourself. Just remember to pull the disconnect and discharge the old cap first (short the terminals with an insulated screwdriver to discharge the cap), pay attention to where the wires go (don't want to swap FAN and HERM or you'll get a surprise), and put the control door back on before you put the power back to it.

I'd hate for you have to post another tirade because shorted a charged cap into your hand or some other dumb shit.

[Anonymous No.2442029]

>>2442024
>His fixes won't work. He's wasting a ton of time on trying to repair a disposable part (and in the meantime has no AC). I could see replacing the board with a new one and then repairing the old one in your spare time as an emergency backup, but I wouldn't rely on something like that as a permanent repair. If he screws it up he could damage his unit.

So much to unload here, the mental gymnastics you just sent through are dizzying.
Maybe your repairs won't work and would damage the unite, but anyone doing component level repair is a bit above a parts swapper.
Also you just gave the same excuse you give plebs against doing work to a guy doing work that's beyond your ability, maybe he should be doing HVAC and you shouldnt

[Anonymous No.2442032]

>>2442028
Now hold on, you and I both know that if you swap HERM with FAN it makes the system 100% more efficient.

[Anonymous No.2442033]

>>2442028
I had the discharged, pulled, tested capacitor in my hand when I went to them and asked how much for a new one because the Jew HVAC store wouldn't sell, they charge 2-3 times it's market price.
Are you even following the thread or are you just seething and shit posting at this point?
You're all going out of business because of this shit.

[Anonymous No.2442045]

>>2442024
>I was there when it happened. If you don't want to believe me then I can't make you but it is true.
And Im more likely to believe a story of an HVAC store getting Sue for refusing to seem summer safe equipment and the guy has to buy eBay shit that failed, like bad limit switches, causing him to burn his house down

[Anonymous No.2442051]

>>2442033
Maybe I don't understand? You took it out and the HVAC supply house (rightly) refused to sell you one. You found a contractor that would sell you one but he wanted 3X what they cost online. So, you elected to order one online and be without AC for a couple days instead of paying the higher price.
I don't understand all the anger. $35 isn't a lot of money, so I don't see why you didn't just get it so you could have AC today. I could understand the vitriol if he wanted $60 or $100 but $35 isn't shit. Yeah, it's high for a cap but you're also paying for the convenience of getting it today.

It's not us HVAC guys you're mad at. So, who is it? Wife walk out? Bad review at work? What really happened OP that made you spaz over $35 fucking dollars?

[Anonymous No.2442052]

>>2442045
>And Im more likely to believe a story of an HVAC store getting Sue for refusing to seem summer safe equipment and the guy has to buy eBay shit that failed, like bad limit switches, causing him to burn his house down
Huh?

[Anonymous No.2442057]

>>2442051
I'm a man of principle and I'd rather do without then to allow someone to rip me off. If the hooks can make it and get it to this country and listed on the market ready to ship, then this dick doesn't need to be charging 3x that to larp as a businessman. It's price gouging and it's what destroyed this country.

>Rightfully denied sale
You should be prohibited ever setting foot in 99% of stores again, you really should die for this attitude.
I'm willing to pay more for the convenience but that kind of markup if unacceptable.
>Not a lot of money
Only people with that sentiment are fucking other people over.

[Anonymous No.2442058]

>>2442045
>And Im more likely to believe a story of an HVAC store getting Sue
I've been trying to get Sue for ages, and I always thought I kind of felt a connection, but when I shooted my shot she told me she doesn't go with manlets under 6 feet high. I had my condor ready to go and everything

[Anonymous No.2442061]

>>2442052
Fucking autocorrect

I'm more likely to believe a story of an HVAC store with a monopoly getting sued for refusing to sell someone a something like a thermal limit switch and the guy burning his house down for having to but shitty internet parts, a catastrophe that wouldn't have happened if they had just sold him a part from a reputable manufacturer.

If you buy welding gas and gas yourself, nobody has ever sued the gas supplier
If you buy a gun and shoot yourself you don't get to sue to gun company.

My point of that you giving living and there's no liability involved for you.

[Anonymous No.2442067]

>>2442057
>I'm a man of principle and I'd rather do without then to allow someone to rip me off.
Hats off to you for sticking to your principles then.

>>Rightfully denied sale
>You should be prohibited ever setting foot in 99% of stores again, you really should die for this attitude
You are exactly the reason I wouldn't sell to homeowners. You're an entitled cunt who thinks he should be able to get whatever he wants as cheap as possible. You'll pay $1k for a cell phone that costs $3 to make in some Chinese sweatshop but you'll have a brain hemorrhage over a $35 capacitor.
Do you buy steaks at the butcher and demand your local steakhouse make them for you to your liking? Or do you pay the ridiculous steakhouse markup? Any idiot can cook a steak. Why should they get to charge double or triple market price for one?

[Anonymous No.2442071]

>>2442067
You should be institutionalized instead of having been given a business license

You think you can flip something made for $00.01 in a Chinese sweatshop for $35 as if you made it yourself, without delivery, without installation, without doing a fucking thing besides sucking off the guy at the HVAC shop.

Get over yourself, you shouldn't be allowed to buy steaks from the butcher because youre not a chef!

[Anonymous No.2442076]

>>2442067
> I can charge as much as I want but you're the asshole for wanting to pay the least.

That's how capitalism works dipshit. Welcome to basic business concepts.

[Anonymous No.2442078]

>>2442061
>If you buy welding gas and gas yourself, nobody has ever sued the gas supplier
https://caselaw.findlaw.com/ms-supreme-court/1046035.html
Two men killed when a leaking welding tank hose caused an explosion. The family sued the welding gas supplier and the manufacturer of the gear.

>If you buy a gun and shoot yourself you don't get to sue to gun company.
https://www.enjuris.com/blog/news/walmart-gun-suicide-lawsuit/
Guy bought a gun, shot himself, and his family sued Walmart for selling it to him. Remington just settled for $73 million to the parents whose kids were killed at Sandy Hook. Etc etc.

[Anonymous No.2442081]

>>2442078
>were working as welders for Mainstream, Inc.
So they were in the industry :)
Guess youre liable no matter what

[Anonymous No.2442086]

>>2442078
>Guy bought a gun, shot himself, and his family sued Walmart for selling it to him.
Not relevant, if I had said I plan to killyself with it then denying the sale would apply here

>Remington just settled for $73 million to the parents whose kids were killed at Sandy Hook. Etc etc.
They shouldn't have

[Anonymous No.2442088]

>>2442071
>You think you can flip something made for $00.01 in a Chinese sweatshop for $35 as if you made it yourself, without delivery, without installation, without doing a fucking thing besides sucking off the guy at the HVAC sho
Your grasp of supply chain economics is staggering. You left out the part where I have to have a warehouse (which costs rent, utilities, insurance, and taxes), then I have to stock it was a sufficient variety of parts to cover most of the popular units in my area (currently sitting on $500,000 in inventory), I need to have employees to organize and sell it all (payroll, taxes, insurance, benefits), I need to be able to look up the parts and provide tech support (computers, manuals, training), provide billing and manage accounts (more computers, point of sale terminals, and an army of credit people), AND we do deliver parts so (driver, truck, more insurance, DOT inspections, maintenance, gas, plates and registrations).
I sell your shitty cap to the contractor for $9, which is roughly a 30% markup. After all the taxes fees and overhead I pocket around .75¢ each in pure profit.

[Anonymous No.2442094]

>>2442025
then buy the part and to it yourself? its not a controlled substance like freon, for gods sake just buy it. if they dont want to sell it to you its because you are an asshole and they dont want to deal with assholes, get it on alibaba or whatever instead. oh wait they dont want to deal with 10 000 male diy male Karens from usa so they 10x the price of a single item versus thoose who buy bulk in containers.
thats how it works, thats the work involved you have to pay for. china is an assembly plant they dont ship to individuals.

[Anonymous No.2442098]

>>2442088
I would have paid him an extra $5 or so, but I'm not doubling or tripling the price.
You're like a teen girl that expects a tip on a carryout order

[Anonymous No.2442100]

>>2442098
>I would have paid him an extra &5
Did you try offering him less?

[Anonymous No.2442101]

>>2442094
>then buy the part and to it yourself?
This entire thread be has been about doing it yourself and being prohibited by not being allowed to purchase capacitors

>its not a controlled substance like freon
Then fucking sell the part to people

[Anonymous No.2442104]

>>2442100
No, but one guy didn't have change and tried to sell it to me for even more money though

[Anonymous No.2442111]

>>2442101
did you read my post?
what do you think a cellphone charger cost to make?
can you buy one directly from the factory?
no, its through a dealer that takes 100x profit from it and you still think its cheap because it wasnt 300x like the 15$ one st the gas station....
now how many xx ac parts break daily? what would the cost be to bring that specific part to your adress and at the same time while, hold on to your chair here.... GIVE THE FULL WARRANTY THAT YOU ARE LEGALLY ENTITLED TO. because you are clearly a full blown retard and will fuck up and blaim the parts not your own work.
its a free world, you can sell to whoever you want and no one want to sell to you. dont like it start your own business.

[Anonymous No.2442114]

>>2442016
No point even showing up to a client thats trying to lowball you from the get go
They'll bitch about the price afterwards too

[Anonymous No.2442117]

>>2441335
I want to install zone control for my ducted heating. I want it to be really simple, just a panel with a button for each zone and an indicator so you know if it's open or closed. Any advice?
I can't seem to find anything that's simple and cheap so I'm thinking of doing it with an arduino

[Anonymous No.2442121]

>>2442111
I think I did but it's getting increasingly difficult to read these posts.

As a kid when we'd go to the flea market, I'd see all of these guys with boxes of new merch lined up, hardly anything worth buying though. I'd ask them where they got it and with a demeanor I now recognize, they'd put on a smug pokerface and tell me they e got suppliers.
Now that I'm older, I see this same shit on AliExpress. They aren't businessmen and the should be ashamed of themselves for trying to use words like suppliers, and for larping as some kind of man with status.
They are you. Youre someone trying to make a quick buck off if idiots that don't know better.

>Come to my house
Your not reading my lists either, I went there
>Warranty
For what? Stores always tell me to call the company.

[Anonymous No.2442134]

>>2441989
>This is just dumb. Get a new board.
fixing the board will cost about $12 $138 less than a new board.

[Anonymous No.2442138]

>>2442121
>quick buck
i know you are american im not, doesnt really change the subject. you can in my country just google the name of any business and get their reports for the last 5 years, this company that you think price gouge barely has profit, this other company that gives parts away for free
has less profit. its a balance, you pay for hours and parts and the sum makes my wage and the company profit. no profit on parts then higher profit on hours.
again, everything can be bought online but dont think anyone will give the same price to you compared to my dealer network.

[Anonymous No.2442141]

Just clean your unit yearly. Use some dish soap mixed with water, spray your coils down and get dirt / grime off them and you won't likely ever have issues.

Most of the time your AC unit won't start it's the capacitor too which you can cheaply replace on Amazon.

[Anonymous No.2442147]

>>2442138
>hurr I save 15% buying as a contractor then mark it up 200%
>you can't match my prices bro!
>also I never shop around for parts cuz the customer is paying either way

[Anonymous No.2442151]

>>2441997
Local company that made and installed my AC unit in 1998 was sold to ARS. they then stopped making the AC units, and stopped making parts.

heat stops working. company comes out and tells me my heat exchanger is bad and is tripping an overheat sensor, and no parts can be ordered. he puts a condemned sticker on the unit. tells me I need to get a new AC unit and they will do it for $9000 minus some government rebate that will expire so HURRY ORDER NOW.

I tell him to skip fixing it.

he leaves. I go up on roof at my next opportunity. open unit and look at heat exchanger expecting to see a hole in it. instead I see pic related. it was just held in place with swaging or something like that.

take the heat exchanger out and take it to a professional welder. have the whole thing welded. put it back in. total cost to fix with misc parts and paying someone to help me $242.

guy comes out to service unit at end of season sees the repair and condemned sticker removed. asks who authorized the repair and removal. I tell him I did, he tells me I can't do that. I tell him to get the hell off my property and cancel our service contract. claims I'm going to die from CO poisoning. I have a CO detector and it never registered any amount of CO.

unit worked another 6 years with no problems (total of 20) and no CO leakage (when we replaced it).

Later I found that the heat exchanger was still being made.

FUCK ARS.

[Anonymous No.2442155]

>>2442024
>His fixes won't work.
my fix will work, because I am replacing any component that might have been damaged by the 120v including the 2 common chips on the board.

CD4541BE timer
CD4066BE quad bilateral switch
1 transistor.

also they replaced the board and my ac IS working, I am fixing the board as a spare and will test it as well.

/diy/ that MOTHAFUCKA!

[Anonymous No.2442160]

>>2442151
Many such cases

>You cand do that
That means THEY don't know how and it's easier to rape you in the wallet than it is to repair something properly.

Everyone wants to be a partswapper these days

[Anonymous No.2442162]

>>2442147
>15%
its actually 50% atleast
and im not ashamed of saying it

[Anonymous No.2442164]

>>2442151
also ARS is American Residential Services they own rescue rooter, the same people what over charged me for replacing my sewer line. they had a ton of complaints to my states attorney general office regarding their business practices.

basically the MO is to buy up small repair and manufacturing companies, close down manufacturing side of the businesses and then coerce their customers in to buying over priced equipment and services.

[Anonymous No.2442167]

>>2442151
>go up on roof at my next opportunity. open unit and look at heat exchanger
Why is your heat exchanger outside?

[Anonymous No.2442170]

>>2442167
because the AC unit and gaspac are all in the same box on the roof. where it belongs.

[Anonymous No.2442185]

>>2442170
Are you heating the outside?

[Anonymous No.2442201]

>>2442185
no dumbass. you seem to not know what a gas pac is or how it works.

[Anonymous No.2442206]

>>2442201
Were you born with this knowledge

[Anonymous No.2442242]

>>2442151
Any heat exchanger like that that's come uncrimped, cracked, or has holes in it is considered failed by the manufacturer even if it isn't releasing CO. I agree with you declining the repair, but I would've done some follow-up by making some calls and trying to locate a heat exchanger. A tubular heat exchanger means you have an induced draft furnace which rarely ever cause CO poisoning because the heat exchanger is in a negative while it's running. I have however seen a dozen or so in my career that caught fire. No service company makes their own equipment, but some national companies buy furnaces and put their own labels on them to make you think they do. One I used to work for even used to remove the model/serial tags to make you go to them for parts.
However, no service company anywhere would ever repair a heat exchanger for any reason. You're assuming assloads of liability by doing so. One missed spot or warp/gap that doesn't seal 100% is all it takes to cause a fire or poison a family. I've seen slumlords seal cracks with silicone, patch them with cans or muffler patcb, etc. If the unit catches fire and your insurance discovers your handiwork they will deny your shit instantly.
I'm glad it worked for you but that's still really dangerous and I don't recommend anyone else try it.

[Anonymous No.2442243]

>>2442155
Sweet, when it malfunctions and you lose a compressor because of it at least you can say you saved money by fixing it yourself.

[Anonymous No.2442246]

>>2442164
Avoid big national companies. They all overcharge, and they all force their techs to be "sales techs" - they sit through classes about how to give a hard sell, how to work people over, etc.
Most of them don't pay you shit unless you're selling extras either. I used to work at One Hour, they pay their techs piece rate. Meaning instead of an hourly rate, you get a percentage of whatever the service ticket is. They don't pay travel time to drive between calls either. They have meetings every week and actively shame guys who don't sell enough. They are the most expensive around and told me when I worked there they don't care if you can fix things as long as you sell extras. The guys I worked with were all scumbags who used to scare elderly people,into repairs and even new units they didn't need just to make more money. I quit after a month because I couldn't take advantage of people like that. I'll never work for a national company again.

[Anonymous No.2442259]

>>2442167
He's talking about a package unit. The idea with these is that both coils (the evap and condenser) and the furnace are all located in one big box, usually along with the air handler blower-- whether that's on the roof or beside the building etc etc.
They're a good choice for DIYers in my opinion because all you do is put them on a little pad and run gas, electric, thermostat wire, a condensate drain, and air ducts to and from the unit. You don't have to fuck with the refrigerant or running copper lines to install one. They're also usually fairly pleasant to work on compared to split systems. The rooftop versions often have adjustable air shutters to let in some fresh air into the mix too.

[Anonymous No.2442289]

>>2442155
You're over these guys heads they think you won't get the springs in the chip in the right orientation and when it's a full moon it's going to dump 1kv into everything

>>2442243
You are so fucking stupid
Explain how you think a 24v-120v source source is going to fry a 240v compressor

[Anonymous No.2442310]

>>2442259
Thanks for explaining it, I was concerned whoever did my installation was gassing me or that anon was behind global warming

[Anonymous No.2442324]

>>2442289
>Explain how you think a 24v-120v source source is going to fry a 240v compressor
>shitty diy-repaired board drops the condenser fan out while compressor is on in AC mode
>compressor starts overheating, pulling more amps, windings get cooked
>but hey you fixed it yourself for cheap!

[Anonymous No.2442337]

>muh epa card
You know there are half a dozen websites that will give you a Type I Cert for $25 after taking the pathetically easy open book 608 exam right from your living room yeah

Dunno why hvac fags act like it's a special club or a real license.

[Anonymous No.2442362]

>>2441391
the EPA 608 refrigerant cert is like $15 and takes maybe a few hours max. I have one somewhere and I've never even worked HVAC

[Anonymous No.2442376]

>>2442078
>welding tank
they sold them a leaking bottle
>remington
they were sued on the basis of advertisement laws, not because of a shooting

[Anonymous No.2442379]

>>2442337
Because they are walking egos that can't justify their inadequacy compared to their desire to live like rockstars
>Muh company car
>Muh gas money
>Muh car insurance

[Anonymous No.2442381]

>>2442078
>The family sued the welding gas supplier and the manufacturer of the gear.
And lost. Anyone can sue anyone for anything at any time for any reason. It doesn't mean they'll win. What is your point?

[Anonymous No.2442384]

>>2442324
>What is thermal protection
This isn't 1950, if it worked how you say them every failed $10 cap would result in an entirely wrecked system.
I literally run 240v fans at 120 and after 12 hours they overheat, shut off, cool down and restart.
I swear to God I have an electric motor from 1920 that has an overheat protected circuit, it even still works, it's got cloth insulation inside it.

[Anonymous No.2442386]

>>2442362
Google says it's $300

[Anonymous No.2442390]

>>2442386
>Google says it's $300
This is literally the third result in google.

[Anonymous No.2442394]

>>2442386
idk i did it before lunch one day in a votech class.

[Anonymous No.2442403]

>>2442381
>What is your point?
Getting sued is still expensive you mong. Lawyers will take a big chunk out of you even if you win or it gets dismissed. You know what's cheaper? Not getting sued because you sold some asshat a part you shouldn't have.

>>2442384
>What is thermal protection
Thermal protection is only good for so long. Compressors will only take so much abuse.
>every failed $10 cap would result in an entirely wrecked system
Sometimes they do. A bad cap can take out the compressor.
>I swear to God I have an electric motor from 1920 that has an overheat protected circuit
Good for you, I hate to be the one to tell you this, but they don't build things to last like they used to.
>>2442390
Good luck answering a few simple questions. Oh, BTW, the EPA made the tests a lot more difficult a year or two ago to stop people from doing exactly what you suggested.

[Anonymous No.2442404]

>>2442384
>I literally run 240v fans at 120 and after 12 hours they overheat, shut off, cool down and restart
what does that have to do with anything? you seem like you got everything all figured out, good luck to ya

[Anonymous No.2442412]

>>2442403
>Oh, BTW, the EPA made the tests a lot more difficult
It's open book you fucktard. Jesus christ, you are either the actual stereotypical meathead HVAC techie tough guy or you're collecting (you)'s with painful shitposting.

[Anonymous No.2442414]

>>2442403
>Not getting sued because you sold some asshat a part
I don't even know what you're arguing. A welding gas explosion in Mississippi from the mid 19-fucking-80s FORTY YEARS AGO as your PRIME example of why no one but HVAC niggers should be allowed to buy HVAC parts is so outside the realm of reality it's a fucking comic book at this point. It doesn't even pass a cursory sniff test, to this day anyone at all can walk into a welding supply store and buy tanks of gas. Again I ask you what is your point?

[Anonymous No.2442426]

Hilarious that this thread is still going. Supply house guy here again and customers like you are insufferable we usually tell you to get fuckin lost and don't come back.

[Anonymous No.2442464]

>>2441933
SHIT, not him but thanks that's probably one of the more useful things I got from this board in 10+ years. are there any other apps for other brands?

[Anonymous No.2442468]

>>2442242
>No service company makes their own equipment
goettl did

[Anonymous No.2442471]

>>2442242
here's another heat exchanger I worked on. this one belonged to my brother who is a poor.

when I was looking for parts for his unit (Goodman) the first sites that came up wanted over $500 for a new heat exchanger, I found one (new) on GoodmanRepairparts.com for $180 shipped. took about 2 hours to replace.

never buy parts from the first place you find.

[Anonymous No.2442473]

>>2442289
>You're over these guys heads they think you won't get the springs in the chip in the right orientation and when it's a full moon it's going to dump 1kv into everything
WTF am I reading?

[Anonymous No.2442474]

>>2442185
where do you live that AC units don't have a piggy back heater and they are not installed on the roof? seriously at least 60% of AC units in my city are done this way.

[Anonymous No.2442475]

>>2442243
gatekeeping, seething hvac tech.

[Anonymous No.2442476]

>>2442246
the thing is I didn't know at the time that ARS had bought the small honest company I was using. they since sold to a guy who has spent the last 10 years trying to clear the old companies name from the harm ARS caused.

[Anonymous No.2442477]

>>2442324
nice fan fiction, the defrost board isn't a HAL9000 it's a timer chip, quad bilateral switch, 2 relays, 1 transistor, and various passives. it's ALL over the counter stuff nothing proprietary.

cope

[Anonymous No.2442480]

>>2442403
>Getting sued
who's going to sue who? I repaired the board, if it fails I'm not going to so me or digikey. I will just buy new board or whatever parts need to be repaired.

please don't worry your pretty little head about other people anon.

[Anonymous No.2442571]

>>2442138
this is tax fraud
I never thought somebody would try to use tax fraud to try to defend the honor of those poor, wretched millionaires
the guys that barely make ends meet are (some of the) mom and pop shops that aren't required to publish statements to the public, only to the government

though I guess the point kinda stands for some mom and pop shops and I'm just being pedantic

t. third party

[Anonymous No.2442580]

>>2442426
Another guy, but I never could undestand why some wholesalers try to sell so much higher that retailers. It's clearly already profitable for retailers to sell piecemeal at their prices, if it's manpower then get more workers if you need to.
Would retailers bitch out and stop buying from you in revenge? Maybe make people pay 10% above going retail price, but don't go way overboard, this way you are just earning the retailers more money since you are sending customers back to them.

[Anonymous No.2442610]

>>2441335
I pay $10 a month for an insurance plan with the power company. if any of my appliances break they come out and fix it for free

They've already completely replaced my furnace twice over the last 15 years (the first one was improperly installed which led to premature breakdown) which would have cost me over $10,000, plus various maintenance calls on the AC unit, furnace, fridge, freezer, microwave, etc, which themselves are already worth the $120 a year spent.

[Anonymous No.2442641]

>>2442571
no, the fact we have public tax reports should give you a hint to how its straight out impossible to do tax fraud at such levels here. it "can" be done, but it will be discovered and thats the end of that business. everything is traceable from you purchasing the part to the point where you sell it, only thing i can do tax fraud with is used parts i sometimes pick up for free, thoose i could sell under the table but whats the benefit in it for me and if the customer ask for a recipe and warranty then i have to write it down anyway.
again, not usa but tax nazi europe.

[Anonymous No.2442670]

>>2442167
>Why is your heat exchanger outside?
>>2442185
>Are you heating the outside?
Do a search for "package units." I think that's what he is talking about. In the US, they are generally for commercial installations so you may not recognize or be familiar with them.

[Anonymous No.2442678]

>>2442404
Thanks of ya need any help just let me know

[Anonymous No.2442710]

>>2442477
He doesn't know what you are saying and he's afraid that fixing HVAC for $10 will be the new thing people demand instead of making $300 by upselling you to a $2000 circuit board be bought for $300 which costs $6 to make and give to the HVAC store.
Basically he's seething because you are exposing him for the fraud that he is, and liers only know how to double down.

[Anonymous No.2442711]

>>2442474
Flyover state in America, where do you live?
I'm training residential, youre describing what the roof of stores looks like.
Here house use a split system with the AC being on the ground beside the house.
Only thing in them is radiator, compressor, and fan, capacitor, and contactor.

[Anonymous No.2442714]

>>2442414
And youre skipping the part where they "were in the industry", which is the entire premise of his argument for not being able to sell to people not in the industry.

[Anonymous No.2442777]

>>2442711
yes we have them where I live as well but lots of older houses still use the AC/Heater on the roof.

heat pumps didn't become a thing here until the natural gas "shortage" in the early 90's and new neighborhoods went all electric.

[Anonymous No.2442779]

>>2442710
with jlbpcb I could have the boards made for about $1 ea. I could even have them populated with most of the components if I went with SMD. I'd still have to solder on connectors and such.

here's the board before I worked on it.

[Anonymous No.2442781]

>>2441340
Because nobody wants to be an HVAC tech and you have more work than you can handle and you charge what you want

[Anonymous No.2442827]

>>2442781
>nobody wants to be an HVAC tech
Nobody makes them be one.
They do it to price gouge.

[Anonymous No.2442836]

Hvac workers are subhuman animals

[Anonymous No.2442943]

>>2441892
>he didn't do a fucking thing
Except go down and buy one for you, a fully fitted out van is like $100k, and you expect them to just work for what would be less than minimum wage or something?

[Anonymous No.2442947]

>>2442943
>HVAC store gatekeeps parts because HVAC guys would boycott them
>HVAC guys should price gouge cause he has to buy the part for me what do I want him to work for free
You "people" should be shot like dogs

[Anonymous No.2443526]

>>2442032
What's it actually do, no start?

[Anonymous No.2443920]

>>2442641
you are retarded, laddie
companies use several techniques to report no profit (income tax is based on profits)
easiest to understand is splitting a company and paying bogus licensing fees to an overseas branch
there are many other ways

[∆nonymous No.2443927]

>>2441335
I tend to ask some seemingly unrelated question to contractors before hiring them.
>go to local HVACfag company
>blah blah quote blah $23k
>"Hey HVACfag, I noticed the model manual specifies a range of different line diameters, I'm just curious when would you use bigger vs smaller one?"
>"herp derp non-answer"
>he doesn't fucking know
>one job to do HVAC and he can't even HVAC
>get picrel for $5k and install it myself
Cope and seethe hvacfags.

[Anonymous No.2444110]

>>2443927
Why that one?

[Anonymous No.2444277]

>>2442943
>a fully fitted out van is like $100k
Hes not buying the whole fucking van, hes buying a 10$ capacitor the guy with the van paid 10$ for and wants to sell for 35$, theres no labor or overhead there retard, just price gouging.

[Anonymous No.2444285]

>>2444110
Because "Amazon Recommended" it amongst the dozens of identical units from fly-by-night Chinese companies with randomly-generated names.

[Anonymous No.2444369]

>>2444277
Out of curiosity what would you say a fair price would be for a $10 capacitor that someone had to pick up and bring to you or give to you then reorder? Or if they purchased it from a wholesaler for $10 and then you picked it up from them?

I'm conflicted on parts houses not selling to the general public. On one hand it's bullshit and enables contractors to rape people but on the other hand I don't blame them for not dealing with the general public if they don't have to.

[Anonymous No.2444411]

>>2441335
I hired one of the most popular companies around here and they fucked up TWICE when installing my new unit. First they installed the coil wrong, then some shit turned out to be defective or something, and the compressor froze solid. And most importantly, their salesman sold me on a "great deal" which turned out to be too small for the house. The temperature could never go lower than 75 even when it was 85 outside. The AC keeps blowing all day. They then offered to install an additional return "at cost" which cost me another grand (if that's "at cost" then I don't know how much they would charge including profit for 1-2 hours of work, so it is total bullshit). And btw they just hire random subcontractors who do work for them. So I keep scheduling service calls, and they just measure 20F temp drop over the coil and announce that "everything is working correctly". I told them that I don't give a shit about the drop, I want the AC to cool the house down to 70-72F in 90F weather which was never a problem in my old house which had a larger unit. They give me this bullshit how "every house is different maybe your old house had better insulation". Well duh it is YOUR responsibility to size it up and recommend proper equipment instead of giving me bullshit excuses how "it is picking up heat off the wall". It is a fucking nightmare. Why the fuck would I even bother hiring a company like that, if I could just buy my own AC unit off the internet then hire a contractor directly to install it. They could also fuck up but at least it would be much cheaper. And I could buy a larger and cheaper unit.

[Anonymous No.2444480]

>>2444369
not him but if one uses ones googlefu one can find good capacitors for less than $10.

[Anonymous No.2444517]

>>2444480
Earlier in the thread they stated they wanted one same day. If you have an account with a wholesaler most residential capacitors are between $4 and $7 for me.

[Anonymous No.2444567]

>>2444517
I didn't say same day, infact I fucked around calling around for a few days before I got done with all of their shit.

>>2444480
I said earlier that I would have have him some extra, idfk what he pays bit other hvacs said they get 50% off from local stores, which won't sell to end-users because hvscs would boycott them.
If he's paying $10, I would have gave him $15 or $20 for same-day delivery, but because he buys from and aperently threatens the HVAC store into not selling to me or and/or buys from a store that won't sell to me II ordered online and will be stsrting my own HVAC store and selling shit at cost because fuck that Jew.
I'm disabled and broke, shouldn't fuck with people's lives like that.
I legitimately only have one thing better to do, and this will help me accomplish that goal.

[Anonymous No.2444573]

>>2444411
Op here, it could be the insulation.
I can tell you right above my intake the insulation is all fucked up and it sucks attic air down over the thermostat and into the intake, you can literally feel a 20 degree difference just walking near it and it's not even in it's own room. The AC never shuts off because of this, and the other rooms start getting freezing cold. Running the AC in my house involves changing the temperature on the thermostats no more than 3 degrees between "it won't turn on" and "it won't shut off" with the air from the other rooms being the deciding factor by mixing with the hot attic air being sucked in.
Now if I wasn't a complete nigger I'd fix the insulation, but that's far beyond getting off of my iceberg of a couch in the dead of summer and crawling into the hell of an attic I have.

[Anonymous No.2444579]

>>2444369
>We don't want to deal with Joe Homeowner and retarded angry customers all day
That's a completely normal and sensible position to take
>We will get boycotted by scalpers who make up the lions share of customers
That shit should be illegal

>>2444411
Sir, you didn't hire a decent company and they didn't do any kind of actual load calculation. That said, I've never actually heard of a company around my area doing real load calcs for residential old work-- pretty much anyone who has a brain is already working a higher paid position in commercial, industrial, or at the least selling to builders.
Didn't they just replace a broken old unit that was already there with an equivalent sized unit?

Also, don't be so confident that it's undersized unless it has had at least a few days to operate-- it can take a very long time for a marginally or properly sized unit to cool an entire house down once all the contents and materials in the house get hot as fuck.

[Anonymous No.2444580]

>>2444369
I replied to the wrong person, see this post : >>2444567


You saying "had to pick up for me" is triggering me more and more because that's a problem of the contractors own making. Imagine if the hardware store wouldn't sell you wood or saws because you might build a shitty house that kills you and they get sued, it's just not a fucking thing and it's all lies.

As for him delivering it, I'd pay for the delivery.
If I go there, it better be close to what he paid, but I'm even more triggered because I was there three times and there wasn't a soul in the store, and when I got him to deliver after the second time he failed to bring change and tried to up the price to 40 without shame because I could make 3X on the spot.
Said he'd leave it at the shop, I go there later with exactly what he asked and once again not a fucking soul.
So I came home, made this thread, next day ordered an exact he replacement off Amazon, and reviewed a capacitor that is 12% out of spec as opposed to the +/-6% that is advertised so it's gotta go back.
Should be 7.5uf, it's like 6.4uf. sure it works and my house is chilly, bug God damn I'm not bitting the bullet on someone else's defective inventory. Guess that's why HVAC shops don't deal with customers, dirty ass HVAC techs would test the new one and if they did they'd just install it anyway and term the home owner to eat shit.
Fuck this entire industry, I'm an engineer, even though disabled, and I just found a new bitch to fuck

[Anonymous No.2444581]

>>2444573
consider just moving the thermostat to a more central location that stays more equalized to the rest of the house. Or getting a remote sensor thermostat-- then you wouldn't have to run wire to the ideal location

[Anonymous No.2444584]

>>2444581
I have thought about that but once again a nigger and half the time I don't even have a thermostat on it and just have the blue wire bent to touch red
Got a new thermostat so hasn't been doing that though

[Anonymous No.2444587]

>>2444285
Oh, how do you like it? I read a bad review, factory defect, nobody answered the phone, cost like $2k to fix

[Anonymous No.2444603]

>>2441989
just finished repairing the board. rigged it up with a thermostat and a light for the reversing valve solenoid. set it to 30 minutes turned on the heat. then shorted the defrost thermostat connection and it engaged the solenoid while disengaging the fan. I didn't even need the 2 IC's I ordered.

So I fixed it with:
6 capacitors $1.63.
1 transistor .64
1 relay $4.92
1 diode .06
shipping was $11 because I had to go to multiple places.
so I fixed a $150 board for $18.25.
all parts except the transistor came from digikey.

I pre-emptively ordered parts from my AC units. I have spare capacitors and the board.

I bet you I could rebuild the fan motors, I did that for my brothers cooler motor. cost me about $12 for new bearings from mcmaster carr.

[Anonymous No.2444608]

>>2444603
>then shorted the defrost thermostat connection
HA that's why ya need someone in that industreeey to do it for you ya fucking retard now I'm gonna have to fix it for ya that'll be $2k to tell you ya need a whole new system!

[Anonymous No.2444841]

>>2444608
moron shorting the defrost thermostat connection is what the defrost thermostat does when the temp gets to 32 degree.

fucking tard.

[Anonymous No.2445310]

my family needs to get a whole new AC system, ours is like 20+ years old and kinda busted... how do i ensure we dont get scammed?

[Anonymous No.2445319]

>>2441335
I ran the lines and vents and had a licensed independent fridge cert to hook up my a/c for $400.

This way I can point the finger at him if some inspector gets wiley when I go to sell my house

[Anonymous No.2445321]

>>2445310
Get a free quote from a big business
Order the same size/efficiency systems from ebay or alpine home air and then pay a craigslist fridge cert guy a few hundred to hook the a/c up

You should be able to figure out the furnace by yourself (run a wire, screw in the gas line (if applicable)

[Anonymous No.2445324]

I have a local college that charges $5,000 for AC school and I have been considering going just to learn. I would save that much changing out the AC in one of my flip houses. I have a buddy in the program and he hasn’t even finished and his phone is blowing up for AC work.

[Anonymous No.2445330]

>>2444841
It's an air conditioner not a freezer, it shouldn't be at 32 degrees

[Anonymous No.2445351]

>>2445321
hmmm im seeing systems that match what i was told i needed for <$4k and quotes were anywhere from $8k to $20k.... what do you mean by a fridge cert with regards to the craigslist guy

[Anonymous No.2445368]

>>2445351
That's because hcacuvks are gate keeping turbojews

[Anonymous No.2445392]

>>2445319
>This way I can point the finger at him if some inspector gets wiley when I go to sell my house
And what exactly the fuck do you think is going to happen? A home inspector looks around at shit, says "Hey, here's a possible issue" and documents it for the buyer/mortgage company. That's all.
They're not going to demand to speak to the person who installed it, they don't CARE if you had a permit or not, they don't care about any of this crap. They just document it and possibly recommend the buyer to have it fixed.

>>2445351
Odds are you just want to replace your current system with an equivalently sized new system. When you get 2 different quotes that vary by such a large margin (8K vs 20K) they should be able to quickly, succinctly, and reasonably explain the difference in price. If they aren't willing to do that, it's because you're being scammed. Take the cost of the unit, add 500-1000$ per workman per day that it takes to install it to arrive at your approximate price.

[Anonymous No.2445399]

Reading this thread just re-enforces I will never do residential work again.

>>2445351

These quotes are written quotes, or just someone pulling numbers out of the air?

Get multiple written quotes and compare what each include and exclude.

[Anonymous No.2445404]

>>2445351
>what do you mean by a fridge cert with regards to the craigslist guy

You must have a licensed to handle refrigerant. He is saying to find someone to take cash to charge your system with refrigerant.

I think you are getting bad information from him.

[Anonymous No.2445411]

>>2445399
ones written and has like 3 different quotes on it, another is an email system needs to be like 100k BTU and 4tons, high efficiency, i also think i need permits of some kind

[Anonymous No.2445423]

>>2445399
>Reading this thread just re-enforces I will never do residential work again.
Why, cause youre a price gouging fag?

[Anonymous No.2445430]

>>2445411

I don't do HVAC, so I can't help you with sizing.

If you have three different quotes from one place, part of the salesman's job is to educate you as to what each quote includes and how they are different, and why you would want one over the others. That is quite a large price range. There has to be a pretty profound difference between the quotes.

Have they come to your house to inspect your current system, and what they need to do?

IE:
Replace just the AC unit?
Replace the entire furnace and AC unit?
Replace the furnace, AC unit and install ducting?

[Anonymous No.2445432]

>>2445404
>You must have a licensed to handle refrigerant.

Or have the right bros or order via Ebay or buy small cans which do not require licensing in the US.

I don't care about what I've zero chance of being punished for doing and since I'm not autspergtarded give zero fucks who that bothers.

[Anonymous No.2445436]

>>2445423
I'm not him, but
there are a lot of real reasons that working residential sucks, and most of them involve having to work with homeowners.

Noone wants you to come into their shitty hoarder house to work on their system, they're already super stressed from the time that you get there, and what they REALLY want is for you to fix it in 5 minutes and tell them it will cost 25$--- but that is never ever the case.

Even if you're the hardest working, most competent tech in the fucking world and you work for poverty rates, you're still going to have most of the people you work for treating you like you're trying to rip them off because someone told them "it just needs a little charge up" when it's going to take 6 labor hours and 1500$ in parts cost to fix.

Because of "economic factors", the best way to make money doing residential is by totally fucking people over and getting a commission on selling a 12K$ new install instead of doing a 5 hour job and putting in 1K in parts. Or just by selling a new system to someone who only actually needs a minor repair like a blower motor on an older system.

If you went around charging people 20$ for the portion of times that it actually is just a quick, cheap, simple fix, then they won't appreciate it and they'll still hate you when it's actually a bigger problem next time.

At the same time, both the manufacturers and the government are responsible for shitting out crappier units that break down more and cost more to fix and install, fucking the consumer and letting the blame fall on installers and techs.

I don't even work in the field anymore, but if I did I sure as hell wouldn't be doing residential again. It's skilled, strenuous, and thankless work. If the pay wasn't half decent, then you couldn't get anyone to do it at all. When you find a field where there is a lack of decent people doing it nationwide and yet it actually pays pretty good money- It's not a coincidence. The job sucks.

[Anonymous No.2445442]

>>2445436
>Noone wants you to come into their shitty hoarder house to work on their system, they're already super stressed from the time that you get there, and what they REALLY want is for you to fix it in 5 minutes and tell them it will cost 25$--- but that is never ever the case.
I absolutely feel for you there.

[Anonymous No.2445470]

>>2445436
>involve having to work with homeowners

I am him, and yes.

[Anonymous No.2445506]

>>2445310
Get quotes in writing with itemized costs and ask questions. Compare several companies this way. Good contractors have nothing to hide and should have no problems educating you. If they're bothered by you asking questions it means they don't know the answers and were trying to make a quick sale.

Have them explain the options for equipment, top of the line efficiency vs "standard" is so little these days you rarely make up the significant additional cost in energy savings unless you live in an extreme climate.

Ask if they are doing a heat calculation or just replacing with the same size equipment.

If you see the company doing multi family buildings eliminate them as a choice immediately. Those are done by the absolute bottom tier, cheapest, get it done and move onto the next one contractors.

Don't trust word of mouth from people you know, do your own research if someone recommends a contractor. Most people don't want to admit they got fucked.

[Anonymous No.2445523]

Refrigeration equipment: a servicing and installation handbook by A C Bryant is a half decent book.
http://library.lol/main/76BFD9AB517327DCEAD0828AB2A18890

R. Trott, T C Welch Refrigeration and Air Conditioning, Third Edition is a half decent beginner reference.
http://library.lol/main/4831C1E25A37BDD0D7F786FB193458AE

What do you think of pic related?

[Anonymous No.2445623]

>>2441987
>1: They ended up having to pay him a settlement
You never "have" to pay a settlement. The supply house just figured it was cheaper to pay the guy to fuck off than to go to court. As long as the device wasn't defective, the supply house wouldn't have been found liable. If you cut your fingers off with a table saw, you won't win a suit against Home Depot.

>2: A supply house could lose their dealership if they were caught selling parts or equipment retail. Many brand names now will void your warranty if you buy their stuff online.
Extremely shady behavior. If a brand refused to honor their warranty because you bought something online, you could easily BTFO them in court. Magnuson-Moss specifically outlaws things like that.

>3: HVAC contractors would stop going to a supply house if they were selling to homeowners.
Holy shit, if that's not a perfect example of why people hate HVAC guys, then I don't know what is. No other trade acts in such a blatant anti-competitive way.

>4: Retail is an absolute pain in the ass
Agreed, consumers can be massive assholes. I completely understand not wanting to deal with consumer retail. What other wholesalers do is to just not entertain any of that bullshit.

>5 - Some states don't allow it
Refrigerant concerns aside, those regulations exist to artificially limit the supply of HVAC labor. Same reason that a "licensed hairdresser" is a thing.

I understand that there are environmental concerns behind selling refrigerant to the public, but I think that if there weren't so many barriers to obtaining parts, most people wouldn't mind calling in a licensed guy to charge/evac the system.

[Anonymous No.2445692]

>>2445506
>hurr get multiple quotes

And then you wonder why you have a bad experience when you are wasting people's time

[Anonymous No.2445697]

>>2445692
>hurr just pay what I demand and don't price check me

If you're bothered by people shopping around then you're trying to take advantage of them

[Anonymous No.2445702]

>>2445697
This

>>2445692
Lol fuck you

[Anonymous No.2445711]

>>2441697
My dad sells Rheem and I've helped him put in more Rheem than I can count and I've been happy with their quality for the most part. Nothing really wrong with Trane but usually the guys who have the dealership in my area will lie to customers' faces that they'll put in a Trane and instead slap in a cheaper brand like Goodman or something.

[Anonymous No.2445727]

>>2444608
he means he checked that defrost works when triggered
nice reading comprehension, wrench monkey
t. another engineer

[Anonymous No.2445755]

>>2441697
>what...size unit would you install?
You have to do a Manual J calculation. It's the only way to get it right.

[Anonymous No.2445768]

>>2445692
If people in the HVAC industry had demonstrated a long standing tradition of nothing but 100% honorable, honest behavior where they never fuck the customer or sell them something they don't need or anything like that, then people probably wouldn't bother getting quotes.
But that's not the world that we live in.

[Anonymous No.2445799]

>>2441335
Hvac techs work really hard and are very good at troubleshooting. Also they have certain very expensive tools that hvac equipment demands. You on the other hand are probably a retard. Enjoy getting electrocuted.

[Anonymous No.2445800]

>>2442134
And 2 hours. What’s your time worth? Might also have to be reprogrammed.

[Anonymous No.2445804]

>>2445799
LMAO
what "very special tools" do they need that nobody else would have?

[Anonymous No.2445805]

>>2445800
If he's doing that, his times worth more than yours.

[Anonymous No.2445807]

>>2441697
I would go with a Carrier Infinity series split heat pump. I would go with a 25VNA and an A-coil air handler (CAPMP)(not microchannel). If the infinity is too pricey, the comforts are fine, and so are N coils. The heat pump can have a backup resistive heater in the duct, but it will save you a lot of electrical bill by bringing heat in from outdoors.

[Anonymous No.2445808]

>>2441697
And also like anon said a proper load calculation is good. You could try a free software like BEopt. Or a manual J.

[Anonymous No.2445813]

>>2445804
Leak detector, gauge set, vacuum/recovery machine, schrader tool, nitrogen purge setup, brazing supplies, coil combs, the list goes on anon. That’s a lot of money i just listed.
>>2445805
There’s ways to make money, and there’s ways to waste your time in futility being excessively frugal. I like doing diy because it’s fun, not because it’s particularly frugal. It’s never very frugal except for the super easy shit or extremely specialty shit.

[Anonymous No.2445818]

>>2445330
It’s a heat pump. The defrost works to melt ice off of the outdoor coil. To draw head from the outdoors the coil has to be below the outdoor air temp - even if it’s freezing. Knucklehead.

[Anonymous No.2445819]

>>2444603
Damn, well done anon. I stand corrected. Good job!

[Anonymous No.2445821]

>>2445804
If they take it seriously the specialty tools get expensive. I know you're going to respond with prices of shit off ebay or Harbor Freight 5 years ago but the pro grade tools to do the job quickly and well add up. My company provides vacuum pump, reclaim machine, oxy acetylene torch kit, nitrogen regulator, and refrigerant scale which combined is close to 2k to do any refrigerant repair with another $400 in tools I own like my manifolds. If I use my big hose evac kit that alone was $400. I didn't include basic hand tools in any of that because everyone should already have those.

Conservatively I'm personally about 4k into specialty tools. I work on everything from window ACs and PTACs to 500+ ton chillers and 600 horsepower boilers so it's an extreme case. Your average residential guy is still probably 1k into tools even if the company provides some of the big stuff. If we're specifically talking about tools to change a capacitor that's all shit that any adult should own.

[Anonymous No.2445831]

>>2445821
4k is fucking nothing, the average lawn guy shows up with 20 grand worth or more depending on the mower

[Anonymous No.2445834]

>>2445813
You can find that shit in any garage minus the reclaim machine.

[Anonymous No.2445837]

>>2444603
W-what does the sneedup jumpers do?

[Anonymous No.2445838]

>>2445834
Nope

[Anonymous No.2445839]

>>2445838
What the fuck do you mean no?
YES!

[Anonymous No.2445843]

>>2445831
Speciality tools. I have a $7000 ride on mower and I use it pretty often, I'm not going to buy fucking $4000+ in HVAC tools just to do 1 repair and never touch them again for years

[Anonymous No.2445846]

>>2445839
I mean youre wrong.

[Anonymous No.2445852]

>>2445846
Well then youre lying

[Anonymous No.2445988]

>>2445837
speedup triggers the defrost if the thermostat is also triggered. so you don't have to wait 30 60 or 90 minutes.

[Anonymous No.2445990]

>>2445330
correct moon unit. that's why it has a defrost when heat is on the outside coils can make ice and need to be defrosted.

say it with me now:
>HURR DURR!

[Anonymous No.2445996]

>>2445852
Your ignorance is mot the truth.

[Anonymous No.2446006]

>>2445996
I've fucking seen that shit is shops
It's literally in shadetree shops here
Gtfo with your lies

[Anonymous No.2446026]

>>2445804
>>2445834
>>2446006
Based shitposting anon farming (You)s from the easily triggered masses

[Anonymous No.2446027]

What kind of automatic expansion valves or thermal expansion valves would anyone recommend for a simple 1kw home heat pump? Or what questions should I be asking to size it correctly?

[Anonymous No.2446030]

>>2446026
Youre on here spreading lies cashing others a troll projecting what you do onto others.
Youre a fucking idiot.
Amy worthwhile stop will have everything you listed.

[Anonymous No.2446032]

>>2441420
wudda cuck

[Anonymous No.2446039]

>>2441348
The main board in my furnace died due to the hot surface igniter falling out of its mount and shorting on the furnace sheet metal. Went down to a hvac parts place and tried to purchase the parts needed to get the furnace working again, they had the parts in stock but wouldn't sell them to the public. I had to order them on line from a place in Canada. The main board was $400 and the igniter was $100, HVAC is a scam.

[Anonymous No.2446041]

>>2446039
Yup, the board could have little been found cheaper too, probably universal ones on eBay for $20

[Anonymous No.2446068]

>>2445404
There's no such thing as a license to handle refrigerant in America you fucking retard. The new rule that you have to have a gay little certificate (that anyone can get by taking an open book test at home) to BUY refrigerant is only two years old.

[Anonymous No.2446073]

>>2446068
Nah you gotta have like 13 different licenses an $35k in equipment to do hvac

[Anonymous No.2446091]

>>2446068
You're wrong about everything other than being able to take the test at home, you can do that now. The EPA 608 license requirements go back decades and are required to handle or work with refrigerant. When we send guys to take the exam it's not open book but that might just be where we send them. In 2007 when I got mine it wasn't open book. The 609 license for automotive may be different as well. Now, all that neing said, fuck the government just do what you want but if you get caught knowingly violating EPA 608 laws the penalties can be absolutely insane.

[Anonymous No.2446094]

>>2446091
You can buy refrigerant at the shartmart zero certs required

[Anonymous No.2446113]

>>2446094
Should have been more clear that I'm referring to non automotive applications

[Anonymous No.2446251]

an hvac guy wants to also quote me for a 5ton system even tho mine is a 4ton... says it will make the upstairs get colder; is this a red flag?

[Anonymous No.2446290]

>>2446113
I've seen fridges use r134a
You probably mean bulk applications or something

[Anonymous No.2446298]

>>2446251
No it's a quote for a new AC system

[Anonymous No.2446301]

>>2446298
ok what about a tankless water heater? do i want that?

[Anonymous No.2446303]

>>2446068
>>2446094
From 40 CFR Part 82, Subpart F, section § 82.161, Technician certification:

"Any person who could be reasonably expected to violate the integrity of the refrigerant circuit during the maintenance, service, repair, or disposal of appliances (as follows in this paragraph) containing a class I or class II refrigerant or a non-exempt substitute refrigerant must pass a certification exam offered by an approved technician certification program."

The law also says that it is a crime to sell or distribute non-exempt refrigerants to someone without a license, which means that unless you synthesized your own-- there is no legal way to get ahold of the refrigerants. There are exceptions for things like propane, water, nitrogen, carbon dioxide, and also for certain quantities and types of refrigerants for motor vehicle use (hence the little cans of r134A at walmart)

That being said, obviously there is nothing stopping you from illegally buying r22 or r410a on ebay or amazon or facebook marketplace. And the government doesn't meaningfully enforce these restrictions on sellers like those.

[Anonymous No.2446306]

>>2446301
Even though tankless water heaters are theoretically more efficient in terms of energy usage, the amount of energy saved compared to a conventional tank water heater is minimal, and you will not save money on energy costs over the lifetime of the heater compared to price difference that you will pay for the tankless upgrade.

The most common situation that makes tankless a good idea is if you have enough people trying to shower or bathe in a small enough time period that you're having problems with running out of hot water from your tank heater. Imagine having 6 people all trying to get hot showers in the morning before going to school or work. If you never run into that issue, then it's not a problem for your household and you will likely lose money by switching to a tankless unit.

[Anonymous No.2446309]

>>2446306
my point is that unless there is a specific reason that you want a tankless, then you probably don't want one.

[Anonymous No.2446313]

>>2446251
You should make sure your ducts can actually handle the airflow they’ll need to move 5 tons

[Anonymous No.2446394]

>>2446303
What refrigerant do I want to make my house blow icecubes?

[Anonymous No.2446532]

>>2446091
It's not a license. If you want to play internet lawyer and pretend you're some boomer with an HVAC tech crew under you that you pay pennies you should at least be able to tell that a certificate and a license are legally distinct categories and no this isn't playing semantics. 608 is a certificate. It is not a license. There is no license to "handle" refrigerant.

[Anonymous No.2446560]

>>2446394
Which refrigerant isn't usually the main point in terms of adequately cooling your house-- it's more about getting a properly sized unit which has a proper ducting layout. (strangely, an oversized unit can make the house alternate between a feeling of swampy uncomfortable warm humidity and frigid cold while never really feeling comfortable because an oversized unit often doesn't adequately dehumidify the air)

>>2446532
Holy shit dude, yeah it's a certification rather than a license legally speaking, but the terms are often used interchangeably in common usage. You're being a pedant.
And again, "handling" would be a common and not incorrect way of describing what technicians do with them. Please go troll a different board

[Anonymous No.2446576]

>>2446068
You're flat out wrong and you know it. You are required to have an EPA certification to purchase or handle any refrigerant. The EPA also requires you to keep specific records of when and where you use every ounce of refrigerant that you purchase. You are also legally required to recover old refrigerant (not vent it) and you must keep records of how much you removed and where you disposed of it. Failure to do any of this can result in hefty fines.

[Anonymous No.2446577]

>>2446094
Not for your house.

>>2446532
It's still a legal requirement no matter what you call it.

[Anonymous No.2446651]

>>2446560
>Which refrigerant isn't usually the main point in terms of adequately cooling your house-- it's more about getting a properly sized unit which has a proper ducting layout. (strangely, an oversized unit can make the house alternate between a feeling of swampy uncomfortable warm humidity and frigid cold while never really feeling comfortable because an oversized unit often doesn't adequately dehumidify the air)
I'll take good not of your advice but I want my vents icing up and snow in the kitchen
In a no laws world, what do I want, r12? Better then r12? Propane?

[Anonymous No.2446657]

>>2446532
EPA regulations (40 CFR Part 82, Subpart FEXITEXIT EPA WEBSITE) under Section 608 of the Clean Air Act define a "technician" as an individual who performs any of the following activities:

Attaching and detaching hoses and gauges to and from an appliance to measure pressure within the appliance.

Adding refrigerant to or removing refrigerant from an appliance.

Any other activity that violates the integrity of a motor vehicle air conditioner (MVAC)-like appliance or small appliance (other than disposal).

You are correct that they refer to it as a certificate not a license in their legalese, I used the terms interchangeably. When I said it was required to handle I am referring to working with it. So it's a certificate to work with it but my original point stands that you LEGALLY need a 608 card to do anything with refrigerant not just purchase it. I also said fuck the government and do what you want anyways. I'm also about 25 years too young to be a boomer.

[Anonymous No.2447868]

>>2446576
Cite me the punishment for being in possession of refrigerant without a certificate. Cite the law the prescribes fine or jail time for refrigerant being on your person without the EPAs permission.

[Anonymous No.2447894]

>>2447868
unless you synthesized that refrigerant yourself, the only way that you could have obtained it is by purchasing or receiving it from someone else. And if you didn't have your certificate/license, then a crime was committed. In order for it to have entered your possesion legally, you would have required the certificate/license. 40 CFR Part 82
You are making a really stupid pedantic argument that makes no sense, and you're not going to convince anyone of your retarded ass way of seeing things.

People on this board really do find the stupidest things to try to be autistic about.
Squirting is just pee.
You will never be a woman.
You're legally required to possess a license in order to legally purchase refrigerant.
Shipping containers don't make nice cheap houses.

[Anonymous No.2447921]

>>2442943
>Except go down and buy one for you, a fully fitted out van is like $100k,
No that's why he's not gonna do that and why he basically told this >>2441892 jackass to kindly fuck off with a bloated tag.

>>2444277
>>2444369
Unless I installed the unit, I will not bother getting involved in someone else's fuck up. If I bought the part, installed it, and then your shitty poorly installed piece of shit dies on me then guess whose fault that is? Ultimately yours, but unfortunately the court isn't going to see it that way. It's not worth dealing with you when I can have an actual customer who will buy a unit under contract warranty. Another reason why is illustrated by this anons post:

>>2441987
>HVAC brands closely monitor who sells what to whom. A supply house could lose their dealership if they were caught selling parts or equipment retail. Many brand names now will void your warranty if you buy their stuff online.
>HVAC contractors would stop going to a supply house if they were selling to homeowners
>Retail is an absolute pain in the ass. Homeowners often guess wrong when ordering, order the wrong parts, or just buy one of everything trying to get the right part.

>>2442010
>Now all of the local market will hurt and I'll send my money to China
This makes me laugh, you remind me of hundreds of calls over the years of /diy/'ers complaining after I give them the "you're fucked" routine. So go and buy another less efficient piece of shit that will cost you more in the long run. You're whining is just broken record to me at this point.


>>2446576
>unless you synthesized that refrigerant yourself
>the only way that you could have obtained it is by purchasing or receiving it from someone else
Everything is a refrigerant.

[Anonymous No.2447922]

>>2447921
yeah, and the common substances like water, propane, co2, nitrogen etc are specifically exempted from the licensing requirements, as has been already pointed out and quoted in this thread.

[Anonymous No.2448012]

>>2441335
nuh uh
t.finnish goburment

[Anonymous No.2448164]

>>2446251
>quote me for a 5ton system even tho mine is a 4ton

Get a second quote (or third) don’t tell them you are being quoted a 5 ton system. If they all say your 4 ton is undersized, then yes. Upsizing the unit only means the unit will hit the turn off temperature quicker. When you over size the unit, it is on and off and on and off and on and off, that is when things wear out prematurely and consume more energy. When the unit runs a bit longer to cool the house down actually allows the AC system to run more efficiently.

>says it will make the upstairs get colder

Well... maybe. As the other anon said, depending on your ducting. Does the system turn off at all? Does it hit the turn off temperature?

Also, heat rises. In the three houses I have owned, the upstairs has always been a bit warmer then the main floor where the thermostat is located. If it is only bad when it is really warm out, turn the furnace circulating fan on to move the air around between the floors. This will even out the air temperature differences.

[Anonymous No.2448268]

>>2448164
ive gotten a lot of quotes, and more to come lol; most promising (cheapest) one is offering a York brand 95.5% 4 ton system; anyone know if York is good/bad?

[Anonymous No.2448651]

>>2448164
But the trafoff is running a compressor and two industrial fans for hours and hours instead of just a new minutes.
Electric bill over a ten year period is going to be huuuuuge

[Anonymous No.2448670]

>>2448651
oversizing the system isn't doing you any favors. For one thing, the house will always feel either clammy and cold or swampy and hot. When there's too much humidity, it's hard to get comfortable, and it's not good for your health in terms of allergens etc.
I've also read that the start and stop cycles are what cause the compressor to wear out and that having one running most of the day is better for longevity than having it start and stop hundreds of times a day.
The slight(?) power bill increase is going to pale in comparison to having the compressor or the entire system replaced years earlier.

[Anonymous No.2448712]

>>2447921
>told this >>2441892 # jackass to kindly fuck off with a bloated tag.
I don't know what a bloated tag is not you can suck my engorged cock.
I bought a $15 expect replacement online and it's running dust find and now I'm starting my own HVAC company and putting them both out of business.

[Anonymous No.2448713]

>>2447921
I'd happily watch you bleed out

[Anonymous No.2448778]

>>2446309
An often overlooked bit about tankless is your ground water temperature. If your tap water is like ice cubes year round the tankless isn't going to do much for you. I looked into these when they were kinda new and was talking about them with the outfit that was replacing my furnace. They're more expensive to install and would've happily sold me one but they really didn't recommend them at all.

They also require yearly (or more) maintenance that is more operationally critical than traditional.

[Anonymous No.2448805]

>>2446309
I had one in my condo because it saved space in the closet but I doubt I'd use one in a house where there's plenty of space for a tank. Tankless worked great for me in the condo because I was living alone so it was pretty much unlimited hot water year around. There were a couple of unusually cold days one winter where I couldn't get the water temperature above lukewarm in the shower but other than that, it was a good solution for that particular situation.

[Anonymous No.2449988]

>>2441348
>second unit stopped working because the condenser drain clogged and tripped a float switch in the drain.
You mean the evaporator drain?

I didn't even know it was possible to clog one of those and fill it up with water without it leaking all over everything else first.

[Anonymous No.2449993]

>>2446576
>>2447894
Not necessarily, automotive shit like r124a is perfectly legal to buy and use by normal people at any store. The only restrictions on that is the amount of the container you're getting, it can't be over some number. So you can't get those 30 pound containers of it without a 609 card, or at least you're not supposed to.

[Anonymous No.2450000]

>>2441398
Can't you just buy a capacitor from anywhere if you know what the voltage rating, type, and capacity of it are

[Anonymous No.2450021]

>>2450000
Yea but nowhere else is going to have capacitors these days.

[Anonymous No.2450195]

>>2450021
wrong, you can get them from global industrial, amazon, and all sorts of hvac stores on line that never once ask if you are diy

[Anonymous No.2450232]

>>2441335
Any anons know about car ac? I have a bad compressor and found this one but the wiring harness is different from mine. How would I find out which wires correspond to my compressor?

[Anonymous No.2450233]

>>2450195
We're talking local, no shit you can buy anything online
Why wouldn't he just get one specifically for his unit if he was shopping online

[Anonymous No.2450238]

>>2448712
>I don't know what a bloated tag is not you can suck my engorged cock.
It's me finding the largest price I can find and telling you it over the phone as a kind way of letting you know I don't want to deal with you because I know you're a cheapskate fuck that thinks this is like an uber eats run.

>I bought a $15 expect replacement online and it's running dust find and now I'm starting my own HVAC company and putting them both out of business.
Wonderful. Now stop calling me.

>>2448713
I get the feeling, I basically tell these people the same thing since I know they'll be spending thousands on a new unit.

>>2447922
I don't give a shit about substance abusers, if they're tryhard enough they can get all of it on the internet for all I care. I'm just not going to be the one involved is all.
>No u need the loiscence

Yeah you need one for weed too but that doesn't magically stop it from growing out of the ground.

[Anonymous No.2450240]

>>2450232
Look up a schematic for your vehicle.

[Anonymous No.2450244]

>>2441420
"crap, honey, i don't have a condom..."

[Anonymous No.2450298]

>>2450232
I think you have better things to worry about than your AC, man.

[Anonymous No.2450301]

>>2450244
"Gimme a pocket knife, sewing needles, some string, some vodka, and 15 minutes."
>goes into bathroom
>comes out with a bloodied crotch.
"We had rubbing alcohol in there, you didn't need the vodka."
"That's not what that was for, the vodka was for drinking.
>Shows her empty bottle.
>GASP D:
"That was full when I gave it to you, how-"
"I know, now lets have sex! :D

[Anonymous No.2450319]

>>2450298
It's a photoshop you dullard.

[Anonymous No.2450323]

>>2450319
Are we not allowed to have fun here?

[Anonymous No.2450356]

>>2450323
fun?

No.
No we are not.
Internet is serious business.

[Anonymous No.2450375]

>>2450356
Ah shit you're right, I forgot. Sorry about that, man.

[Anonymous No.2450383]

>>2450232
It just operates an electromagnet. One wire is the voltage and one wire goes to ground. It doesn't matter which.

[Anonymous No.2450436]

>>2441335
you just described literally everything that isn't an industrial tier machinery. good job captain on obvious, good job.

[Anonymous No.2450477]

>>2441998
Mechanic fag here that used to be EPA certified to work on Car a/c and work on my own shit. HVAC is a skilled trade and Im going to have to crawl under my house to repair some wire insulation before I seal my ducts because the dumb fucking monekys that set this system up in the first place evidently didnt seal any of their duct work. Also theres black widows under there.

I saw this unit that you seal all your registers and blow in some kind of vaporized mastic and it will seal all your leaks. It looks pretty badass. Is it worth it to not be bit by spiders and have to do the fuckey fuckey to all my duct work? I dont know because Im not calling for a quote if any one offers it.

[Anonymous No.2450495]

>>2444608
certified HVAC here. I can confirm he's gunna need a WHOLE NEW SYSTEM

[Anonymous No.2450744]

>>2444411
HOLY SHIT I think I worked at this job. By any chance, do you happen to live on the Eastern side of PA? Was the color of the company you used a light Green?

[Anonymous No.2450852]

>>2450238
>know you're a cheapskate fuck that thinks this is like an uber eats run.
HVAC fags are the reason I had to call HVAC fags for this shit like it's u we eats.
Don't make a kitten you don't want to deal with

[Anonymous No.2452038]

>>2441347
>Guy who owns a business is trying to make a profit off of his customers
The gall of that guy

[Anonymous No.2452053]

>>2441988
No you won't. You get the same shit you get from the supply house.
T. HVAC Tech

[Anonymous No.2452057]

>>2441477
No, you're probably maxing out the unit and it's not able to keep the environment as cold as it did because we're in peak cooling season and AC's can only really give you a 10 degree colder environment than what is outdoors.

[Anonymous No.2452067]

>>2441967
In the middle of the peak cooling season and some joe-blow with a tight budget isn't getting his way in some flyover country makes a angry thread on line. What's not to believe?
There are people out there who feel AC should be a god-given right.

[Anonymous No.2452072]

>>2441340
It cost 15,000 dollars in California for a business license and that isn't even including all the industry specializations fees.

[Anonymous No.2452077]

>>2442071
>You think you can flip something made for $00.01 in a Chinese sweatshop for $35 as if you made it yourself, without delivery, without installation, without doing a fucking thing besides sucking off the guy at the HVAC shop.
Yes?

[Anonymous No.2452080]

>>2442098
And you're the asshole who doesn't tip. POS faggot.

[Anonymous No.2452081]

since its basically an AC in a box, got a question. Got a mini fridge where the retards poked the freezer box and punched small holes in the line, but everything else works great. Whats the best thing to seal them with? JB weld always leaks, no matter how much I remove it and reapply it

[Anonymous No.2452083]

>>2442117
You need to install dampers on the ducts, which would involve major work.

[Anonymous No.2452087]

>>2442141
Based DIYer that doesn't take everything personal.

[Anonymous No.2452089]

>>2442162
That's not true. I don't know what market you operate out of but the stuff we get is the same price everywhere.

[Anonymous No.2452098]

>>2442362
This is good info for anyone, but for an tech expecting to be employed in his field, a universal license is necessary and the test isn't the same. For starters, we have to take three tests, one for appliances, one for residential AC and the last for commercial AC. The tests are proctored, and you are not able to use a book.
Auto mechanics get to take a much easier version of the test because their work is not as concentrated in the AC field as an actual AC tech's job is.

[Anonymous No.2452103]

>>2442610
They'll stop coming out once they realize you're a net loss. All insurance works the same. When this happens you will then have to start at square one establishing a relationship with a new AC company.

[Anonymous No.2452955]

>>2441420
based free coomer as in freedom

[Anonymous No.2452958]

>>2441340
Retard in order to fucking purchase refrigerants you need a fucking loisense -- and for the fucking license you need to do minimum wage journeyman shit for years while studying for never ending annual tests

When all the hvac fuckers just casually release fucking refrigerants into the air and refill from the tanks; not even bothered to use refrigerant recovery machines of which should cost around 250~300$ yet being sold with 300% margin at 950$~1200$

They honestly don't even give a shit about perfectly flushing out the old and no longer used oils from the pipes or making sure a perfect vacuum status with digital manifolds when it comes to retrofitting or replacing comps from old systems, but they just shove a fucking 400~500$ worth r134a or r404a prefitted set in and call for >5000$. ofc the shit will breakdown in few years and they will come again for another 5000$.

Finally chinks nowadays got their filthy hands on HVAC tools as well that you could get the recovery machine for around 450$ from ebay or aliexpress to do a DIY seized compressor replacement. Thank god.

[Anonymous No.2453856]

>>2452958
>Retard in order to fucking purchase refrigerants you need a fucking loisense -- and for the fucking license you need to do minimum wage journeyman shit for years while studying for never ending annual tests

Not in America so fuck off with your generalizations.

[Anonymous No.2453873]

>>2453856
Yes in Canuckistan and if you are just that local air conditioner guy not a proper member of the society of corresponding engineering you got into the trade fuckery because you are stupid as fuck. You can't do the proper math for the fluid mechanics so you are just a mere fucking tool monkey working with vents by sheer guessing.

[Anonymous No.2453884]

Bump

[Anonymous No.2454081]

>>2453884
mfw I didn't realize it was past the bump limit

[Anonymous No.2454428]

>>2454081
Your dedication to the cause has been noted
You will be rewarded in the next life

HVACucks seething eternally!