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/diy/ - Do It Yourself

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File: 59 KB, 544x751, 1998-ford-expedition-transponder-key-blank-10.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
1486646 No.1486646 [Reply] [Original]

I have a little something I have been toying with recently.
My 1999 Ford Mustang uses a transponder inside the key in order to allow it to start. My research has yielded that it uses a radio chip in the key to signal to the receiver that it is OK to start the car.
I tested it with a key cut at a hardware store for my car and without the chip, it wouldn't turn over. However, when I hold my chipped key near it, it will turn over with the hardware store key. So it obviously has nothing to do with physical contact between the chip and ignition so it's all wireless. This means that there is a signal coming from the chip.
My question is, what would I need to do to intercept and duplicate this signal without a chip? And could it work on newer cars with push button starts? I think this could be useful for people who don't want to be raped by locksmiths charging 60$ a pop for cutting a key and pressing a button and even more so for new cars where a replacement key can cost multiple hundreds of dollars.
I am aware of some devices being used by high end car thieves but there is not much documentation on the technology that I've found.

>> No.1486664

>>1486646
stop jamal go back to jail

>> No.1486667

>>1486646
>intercept and duplicate this signal without a chip
It doesn't work that way. Modern chips use a rolling code.
If you want to bypass this check youtube. Plenty of videos on howtadodat.

>> No.1486670

>>1486646
you could bypass the receiver in the car

>> No.1486673

>>1486664
Make me whitey

>> No.1487623

>>1486646
I had a faulty system in my Jeep.


I took the SKIM out of the steering collum (received signal from key) then I bough a new ECU/PCM (computer for the car) and asked them to program it to ignore SKIM data. Now I can start the car and run it for less than half of the cost of programing a new key.

>> No.1487630

>>1486646
>why isn't there a product to duplicate the rfid chip in my key?!?
>fucking Jews at the hardware store want their $60 to program chip

Though need an rfid reader, writer, and a spare chip at the right frequency for your make and with enough storage for your car identification.

>> No.1487631

Nice try nigger.

>> No.1487637

try starting your car with your cheapo key, while holding the real one close

once it starts, get rid of the real key

if it stays running, then the solution is easy, find the relay that closes when that key is near, cut the one control
wire that supplys the 12v with key near, and just plumb in straight 12v off your igniton key on --> start momentary post.

>> No.1487644

>>1487637
Car electrician here.
Doesn't work that way.
Signal goes to ecm/antitheft module, not directly to engine. On most modern vehicles, you need an $80+ PAC bypass module and more knowledge than OP to properly install it.

OP, there is no way you will be able to make your own key for less than $60.
Your best bet would be to make a duplicate key/keys at home depot or whatever and take the original key with the transponder, grind/cut off the metal key part, and hide the transponder inside the ignition switch assembly.

Most vehicles have a clamshell 2 piece cover that clips in from the top and screws in from the bottom. It's what is covering your steering column amd ignition.
Take that apart and hide the transponder inside by glueing it or adhering it safely so it wont move or shake off.

Put it all back together and you will now be able to make as many keys as you want.
The only problem is that a nigger with a decent screwdriver will be able to brake in to your vehicle and force the ignition cylinder to turn so he can steal your vehicle.

You can help prevent that by installing a killswitch hidden somewhere that disables "ignition 1" and "ignition 2" from your igntion cylinder. It may enable your car to turn over but it WILL NOT run.

>> No.1488004

>>1487644
This guy gets it.

I did something like his with an old ranger to which I broke the ignition cilinder and it allowed a start with no key. I picked a screw on the seat and wired a 555 to it. You had to touch the screw once after ignition on to allow the starter to work.

This is called "security by obscurity" and it is quite effective.

>> No.1488124

As a new locksmith, just cut the keys or get a new ecu and have it programmed to ignore not having a transponder, we get a ton of fleet vehicles like this.

And my boss is pretty cool with me cutting a single extra copy for each car as long as I pay for the parts. Those transponders start at $22 a pop, the key part is like $0.20 on a bad day for uncommon keys.

Or get a Hyundai, non of them use transponder keys.

>> No.1488125

>>1486646
You can code more keys using your vehicle and no other equipment. Read moar....

>> No.1488215

>>1486646
go steal cars somewhere else tyrone.

>> No.1488249

Unironically I went and got three key copies made for mine, and they were raw keys. They'll open the door, and I can even turn the engine on but it turns off in a few seconds (no alarm). I figure I don't give a damn because the only reason I'd need a spare key is if I locked mine in the car.

I went back to make a few more (I gave the spare house+car to people I trust) and they gave me a line that they're not supposed to make fobless copies.

>> No.1488804

>>1487623
>bough a new ECU/PCM (computer for the car) and asked them to program it to ignore SKIM data
I just took the shroud off the steering column so I could unplug the SKIM and plug it back in whenever it refuses to recognize the key. so far it works every time. Also sometimes I can get it into gear and moving before it realizes the key is 'missing', it won't shut down the engine once you start moving.

OP, this is just RFID. you can buy RFID readers and writers.

>> No.1488831

>>1486670
this

also underappreciated for it being the only real sane solution

>> No.1488858
File: 85 KB, 778x1600, IMG-20181029-WA0038.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
1488858

>>1488831
180 bux for the key to sit in a box and the RFID t be retransmitted to the skim.

>> No.1488931

>>1486646
I
>If the key snapped, just glue the transponder part inside the key to the steering dashboard.
>you can now make unlimited cheap car keys
???
Profit

>> No.1488958

You can buy a machine for 60 dollars that can program keys and it's quickly avaliable and also can clone keys with it and on version of the machine can intercept and duplicate a signal!

>> No.1489012
File: 65 KB, 900x900, zed bull.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
1489012

>>1488958
This, hop on ebay and you can get a transponder cloning machine.
This one is like 35$

>> No.1489080

>>1486646
come to Las Vegas. When you walk through the door to the casino, you pass through a scanner that reads you like a book. It reads every RFID and magnetic strip in your wallet, including bills larger than $20 plus smart keys and driver's licenses as well. It also copies your address book, and all the data, and history off your phone.
Just ask a security guy in the casino "What's the code for my Ford key" and they can send it to your phone. There's an app, that lets your smartphone act like an rfid transponder. enter the code in the app for your car, and just push the button.

>> No.1489110

>>1487623
Why by another ecu when you already had one? And who was able to do that kind of programming? I don't remember doing that kind of programming at the stealership.

>> No.1489112

>>1489080
>There's an app, that lets your smartphone act like an rfid transponder. enter the code in the app for your car, and just push the button.
Jesus Christ.
Does rfid use the nfc antenna?

>> No.1489124

>>1489112
optional
you can use near field if you want but that limits you to 4 inches. most people just want to leave their phone in their pocket

https://www.getkisi.com/blog/how-to-copy-access-cards-and-keyfobs

>> No.1489167

>>1489124
Then what is replicating the rfid signal? Admittedly I don't know shit about rfid other than it's a low power radio signal with limited range and the ability to send a tiny bit of data.

>> No.1489242

This whole system fucking sucks, and I'd much rather go back to dealing with the odds my car gets stolen than lose the ability to drive because I forgot to take my key out of my pocket when I went swimming.

>> No.1489383

>>1489167
Near field is used for Access systems and has a range of 4 inches, practically touching. RFID works at 40 feet.

>> No.1489389

>>1489383
I get that nfc has virtually no range but I don't know how rfid works with a phone. Bluetooth?

>> No.1489394

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMLkIy2alQY

>> No.1489400

>>1489389
RFID works with bluetooth

>> No.1489445

>>1489242
Do you normally swim in your clothes? What the fuck?

>> No.1489448

>>1489012
>ebay
I usually find bulls on Craigslist

>> No.1489461

>>1489445
swim trunks have pockets for a reason

>> No.1489524

>>1489400
[citation needed]

>> No.1489566

>>1489461
>trusting swim trunk pockets
Top kek anon.

>> No.1489600

>>1486646
Most Ford and Chrysler vehicles let you program new transponder keys if you have two working ones already. There's a procedure in the manual that'll walk you through it.

If you don't have two working keys just take the cover off the steering column and glue your working key near the ignition switch.

>> No.1489615

>>1486646
Hey op, fuck all these clowns, here's what you do:
>take the plastic off your column
>rubber band the chip key to the ignition tumbler
>replace plastic
>start your car with $2 cut keys for life

>> No.1489616

>>1489524
>[citation needed]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bp2y9Ytn-s4

>> No.1489711

>>1489616
Only 2.4 - 5.8GHz RFID uses the Bluetooth standard, and there are 4 other bands in use. The GHz band also requires active RFID tags, i.e. they require their own power source, so any phone that can connect to a passive RFID device cannot solely use bluetooth. Not that I know of any phones that can read passive RFID tags or RFID tags in general, only ones that support NFC.

>> No.1490029

>>1489711
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APGT4xZ_zXg

>> No.1490197

>>1490029
hey I was just reading the wikipedia page for the standard, neat looking phone though

>> No.1490225

Not exactly what you're asking, but check your owners manual. It may have a procedure for programming new chipped keys yourself- I've done it on a 2011 fusion. I got a set of two chipped blanks from ebay for about $12, took it to a hardware store to get the bitting cut, and followed the instruction manual to program it. End result: 2 spare keys for $12 and $3 to get them cut