/diy/ - Do It Yourself

Of course, founding a town requires a hell of a lot of building. We'd need help with setting up windmills, solar collection units, homes, stores, plumbing and rainwater collection systems... the works.

Pic is of an "earthbag home". Essentially, it's a home made from sandbags - extremely cheap, extremely durable, and relatively easy to build.

>>82816
Proceed... instructions?

>misogynists
>sociopaths
>paranoiacs
>teenagers
>nazis
>shut-ins
>aspies
>stoners
>crossdressers
>the functionally illiterate
>obeasts
>anorexics
>cutters

If we were playing a video game about starting a town, this motley would be the equivalent of departing Independence, Missouri with 200 Grandfather Clocks and nothing else in Oregon Trail. If all you want to do all day is smoke dope and play video games, I can understand if not join your endeavor. But this looks like a group more likely to join a cult, work for free on a South American plantation, then drink the kool-aid en mass.

The human spirit will only get you so far. It will take 40 young people to the middle of nowhere with enough building materials and juice boxes to last them a month. But then people will start asking themselves if it was really so bad living in mom's basement. There they had flush toilets, central heating, abundant food and an internet connection, all for the low price of nagging and ennui. The Amish break their backs trying to live off the land independent of society, and they don't need a power grid, sanitation system, and ISP. Do you have any idea how hard it will be to provide any one of those things to your community? And you'll need to, before they get bored of staring at the same 4 girls and sick of smelling poop everywhere and go home to mom.

Let me throw out the idea to use bio-methane for most of your energy needs. Its a simple system that can provide hot water, cooking fire, and heating, all derived from your grocery bill. That still leaves the issue of:

How do you get groceries in the first place? For $20 a month you can feed a starving brown kid. But US food prices are ten times that, per person.

Can you, as a group, recognize when someone knows what they're talking about, and cooperate? If not, nothing will ever get done.

Why, exactly, are you doing this anyway? Because there are less elaborate ways of getting out of mom's basement.

>>82888
>your ideas are dumb no matter what because I say so.

that's the /diy/ attitude.

>>82903
If that's your interpretation of a list of practical concerns your are a complete fool who is literally going to get himself killed.

>>82903
He's got some legitimate concerns. He seems to have a very poor view of /x/philes, but otherwise, he's kind of right.

>>82888
>>insults readers of the site
>>is a reader of the site


>>>also, trips

If you feed me money, I will feed you electricity, and many other wondrous things.

It's more the fact that every thread on this board is turning into:

> how do I do this?
> you're a retard/idiot/peon

It's getting tired that most every thread is someone talking down to the OP that his idea crazy/worthless, or saying they know how to do shit, but the knowledge would be lost on OP.

>>82907
Pic related. Your sort of reply is so common and tired around here that they really don't mean anything to me anymore.

they ought aban the words "kid" and the phrase "you can't" and "you shouldn't" from this /diy/ of ours

>>82920
This is the exact kind of false reductionism that is going to destroy your life if you attempt to leave the basement.

I've been to your site and seen 4chan's finest and their excellent debate skills at work. In defense of solar power, arguing that it was cheap, one of your greatest minds linked a $500 solar panel that provides 80 watts nameplate. The CPU in his computer sucks up more power. Another one of your brilliant and capable leaders said wind turbines were cheap, not because he knew, but because they looked simple. The answer is $20,000 for a single 10kW nameplate that will power 1 (one) American home. Then Sister Gaia Winter Sprite told us about how she's grown herbs and we could sell those for revenue, and she also reads tarot, and we could sell souvenirs. or run a youtube channel with ads for revenue.

And then there is the assumption that we'll be growing twice as much food as we eat. If I told one of you roodypoos how to use a trowel you would greentext at me with implying bullshit. The assumption that you won't starve to death is the perfect recipe for starving to death. The biosphere 2 kids were in a constant state of starvation, and their skin turned orange from all the carrots and sweet potatoes, and they knew their shit.

4channers don't know shit about shit. They know how to browse the internet. That is not a constructive life skill, especially not for life on a frontier where you literally build a community from scratch. Worse, they are so clueless, they don't know that they don't know. See here at this moron's shenanigans:

>>82934
I posted helpful information pertaining to planning with a solid idea about power generation and dealing with sewage. My ideas were wasted on you because you are illiterate.

>>82937
You are attempting to walk in the footsteps of the men of iron when the ships were wood, who tried and failed to found towns, killing hundreds in the process, and you're afraid of using the oven, can't change your own oil, and get emotionally upset at the existence of other people that have skills, especially when they are trying to teach you those skills. What the fuck do you think your odds are?

>>82947
you're assuming that people who are online are incapable of cooking, building, and surviving. not everyone is like you dude, quit projecting.

also, >>kid

>>82939
>you are illiterate.

I enjoy that your insults are so poorly conceived that you would type out an insult that I cannot read. Try harder.

>>82939
Solar and wind power are not good.

You're better off taking a small block chevy, and direct driving a repurposed 3 phase motor with it.

Don't like oil based fuels?

Fine. Add a wood gasifier!

Probably could do about 40 kW with that setup.

>>82949
I posted a whole crop of ideas and you didn't even see them because you are buttmad and more concerned about me making you feel that you're special and gifted than how you're going to generate power or deal with sewage.

>>82939


people trying to found towns in the modern western world do not starve to death and freeze during winter when supplies can't arrive from another continent and fierce indian braves attack in the night, you fucking mouthbreather

go yell at your gramma, I'm sure she's beginning to worry about you cursing out loud all alone in her basement

>>82948
That's not an assumption. How long have you fucking been here? Have you looked at the New Eden website? These people have no skills and cannot think straight. They freely admit they have no skills and need adults who can farm and build to make a town for them so they can smoke dope and do nothing all day. That is literally what they are trying to do. And the second someone who knows anything gives them advice, they get buttmad because their FEEWINGS get hurt. Solar is expensive? WAH I NEED A TROPHY FOR GOOD EFFORT. Should I google "wind power" for knowledge? NO IMMA GUESS HOW HARD COULD IT BE LOL. Biomethane to deal with sewage? HOW DARE YOU CAST DISPERSIONS ON MY PLANS.

The fucking second you people respond to a single damn thing in any sort of rational way I will shoot myself in the fucking head. At this rate I will live forever.

Why is there so much hate in this thread. =(

>>82952
That really underlines what I'm saying about how unprepared you are when you just assume you're going to be saved from your own foolishness. In case of starvation and cold, how will the federal government know to help if not one of you can operate a HAM radio? People die in cult compounds all the time for a fucking reason. But if your contingency plan even works out, tthe federal government will declare your compound unfit for human habitation and truck you all away. The adults will later face criminal charges. The entire nation will try to get a judge to fine the adults the cost of the evacuation. And the entire world will laugh at your stupidity.

>>82959
regardless of their idiocy, they are not going to starve to death, nor have any of the hard times our forefathers had.

you're haranguing them instead of assisting them. If they bother you this much, go do something else for a while, as you are just clogging up their chatter.

seriously.

>>82966
From the New Eden website:

>Why Other "Utopias" Fail
>Laziness.

Starvation it is.

>>82967
>>privileged white kids who don't intend to give up internet access
>>not likely to starve anywhere in the US

>>82951
I'm not even OP, so that argument doesn't work.

Try harder.

>>82966
I did assist them. They didn't see that and neither do you. They don't want my assistance because it has genuine information in it and they don't want help, they want a trophy for good effort because this is all self-esteem camp to them. They can't handle facts and reason because they cannot emotionally deal with the idea that some answers are better than others. You're talking about someone using a computer with a 600 watt power supply unit, saying that "solar isn't expensive" because he saw an 80 watt nameplate for $500. By the way, for you and the rest of the kids who don't know what "nameplate" means in green power jargon, its basically never going to generate 80 watts continuous, that's its theoretical maximum.

>>82971
Yes, it does. Can you even build legos? Not with logic as sloppy as that. And you think you can build a town?

>>82964
Morons from /x/. If only they would go away. Into the wilderness. Perhaps join a cult and live on a compound they never leave. That would be great. Especially if they starved to death because of their stupidity. That would be keen. Then there wouldn't be hate in this thread. The morons would be gone forever.

>>82972
I'm not one of the "kids" you've been talking to. I'm just fed up with your crap.

for them, solar will not be out of reach. why? because they're a pile of privileged white kids.

They might actually be able to do something like this- and with more solid tech advice (i.e., buy broken solar cells, here's a tutorial about solar, etc etc) it might be ok.

I don't know for sure who shit in your cheetos, but man, wipe out your mouth and start over.

(I have been adding my two cents about chickens and domestic animals for them in a friendly way and they have been taking notes furiously.)

I'm one of those already living in a prepared state, it's no skin off my nose to tell others how to do shit. and I don't get butthurt when they don't want the exact solution I offer.

kid.

>>82974
I'm pretty great with legos, actually. The idea that you're mus-identifying me has nothing to do with my competency with legos.

Again, I am not OP. I am not trying to build a town. Your insistence on that is pretty funny though, even when I directly pointed out that it wasn't true.

Try harder.

Wow, lotsa hate in this thread.

I agree though, Solar is way too expensive until we get well established. At first, its gonna be fully on the grid (once we get electricity, that is).

And the majority of our money is going to be coming from real jobs, but most of our food will be self-produced, as well, lowering overhead.

>>82983
It really isn't that hard to go off grid.

...if you don't mind chopping wood.

>>82987
moving to a place where woodstove in middle of big room is my heat was the best move I ever made. chopping wood isn't bad at all, bit fun, gets the old aggression out. and I've been looking into a genny, my neighbor (miles away is the closest) has one that's old but awesome, been keeping my eyes peeled.

these "kids" are talking gradually receding from the grid, if I read everything right. you don't even need a community to do that or much knowledge, you can indeed learn as you go.

really?
really now?
/x/ making a town? the most paranoid, unrealistic, drug users of 4chan? the ones who believe in ghosts and spirits?
These are the grounded people you expect to do well in founding a town?

good luck to you my friends, we'll see what happens when the /x/philes go without their meds for too long

>>82999

>>82999
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand here's another one.

Can we just call this place /g2/ and be done with it?

You must be from this summer, long after /b/ made a mess of /x/.

>>82999
>ghosts and spirits
>implying /x/ truly believes in that shit

>>83007
>implying they don't.

>>83005
> this summer, long after /b/ made a mess of /x/.
That happened long before this summer.

helpful chicken adviser here again.

I too find it absolutely hilarious that of all boards it would be /x/ doing this shit.

I hope they get a haunted patch of woods.

Well this town idea falls underneath the idea during summer when the town of Scenic, SD was for sale, too bad /x/ didn't jump in on it then as there was already infrastructure and tourist draws in existence. Really the only way to start is small and seeing if it's even possible for internet people to learn to grow enough food to live off of and even create 1 shelter. It isn't hard to buy a few acres in a random spot for $1k-$20k depending on location/money down/etc
First it needs to be proved it can work on the small scale and create the infrastructure before large scale is attempted. Rather than be like every single house/town/island project that anon has attempted in the past. Start small, roll with it for 6 months to a year, and then people might be willing to support a larger scale project.

>>83011
Yes I know. The implication is that the poster I was responding to just got here.

>>83012
holy shit all the pipe dreams in the thread on /x/

no concept whatsoever of cost or price point on their shit, i wonder if any of them even hold jobs or pay rent lol

>>83013
you're internet people, good sir. ever had a garden?

>>83022
>implying people that use the internet have no experience with anything else.

Not the guy you were responding to, but yes, I have had a garden. I have raised chickens, own well-used and still functional fishing equipment, and build computers.

Holy fuck, how do I keep all the corn husks out of my hard drive bay, huh?

>>83025
exactly my point. we are all, in this thread, the people being disparaged. we are all on 4chan, talking about shit we're not actually doing at the moment. haters gotta hate

but I for one, despite all my chicken and goat knowhow, would LOVE to see /x/town. so I will help by giving them all info I can.

without being a dick about it...

>>83022
I prefer fruit trees, but I do grow tomatoes and lettuce and of course the usual herbs. Orange tree, 2 apple trees, persimmon, and also a plum. Gotta love California weather. Trees are way less work than having to replant and tend to plants I believe. Well that's my opinion at least. I just think in these town/island projects, why not shoot small to begin with? If a smaller group can't be more organized or dedicated than some large group then there's no reason to bother. I personally would throw $1000 at some small anonland project to see it get up and running. Even if the initial group of people doesn't know shit, as long as they're willing to work and learn it can succeed. Either way, you set a low creation cost to the project and it's more likely to come to fruition. I've been involved in projects like this before and seen too many fail to believe in the large starts. Too many of the people on the boards either don't have jobs and money or are unwilling to donate more than $100-$1000 to such a project.
In my view it's more about building a stable base from which to grow rather than aim for some ideas years down the road and no spot to grow from or create from.

>>83030
Eh I know what you mean, I don't think I'm disparaging them? I just see them repeating the same mistakes of every anonland/town/island project so far

on rizon in #anonland if anyone wants to talk about general anonland/island/town concept issues

>>83034
no, the thing about "internet people" and
>>83013
>>83018

you know...just pointing out that internet people aren't just inside the internet. many go outside on occasion. lulz

>>83005
>>83007
>>83030
>>83041

I'm down for this. I was thinking of starting a similar project here on /diy/ in the coming months.

Is this the same pile of faggots who were going to try to sneak into Prypiat and found a town and pretend to be S.T.A.L.K.E.R.s in real life?

This idea gets thrown around on every board all the time. Nothing will come from this.

>living in a town full of retards who believe in every conpiracy. can't walk 10 feet without hearing "juice did 911" "man never walked on the moon" "ascending to a higher plane of energy 2012"

fuck that would frustrating. no thank you

>>82959
>smoke dope and do nothing all day

Seriously, has ANYONE suggested doing this on the forums? Because if they have, I will ban them.

>>82967

Try checking the post directly below that one.

>>83273
Then what the fuck does "get a bunch of adults to farm and build for us and they should be into conspiracies or at least open-minded" mean? I should say, what does it mean FOR YOU. Because this is self-esteem camp. That's why you kids would rather get in internet debates than talk about any practical issues. Your declared, stated purpose is to talk about paranoid delusions all day and live among other schizophrenics. So of course you're going to be unconcerned with little details like "how to actually make anything work." Of course you're going to be more concerned with having your delusions reinforced by strangers. That's the whole point. You want to make a retreat where everyone is just as crazy as you are. That's the whole point of conspiracy theories: Not facts like "we can see the footprints of Apollo astronauts on the moon," whats important is the conspiracy, the feeling, your feelings, and your feelings get hurt when people refuse to believe your conspiracies. This is just one more example. You're not pioneers who know how to farm or build, you're mental patients who need adults to farm and build for you, so you can then gibber madly through the streets without the frustration of normal people refusing to believe your conspiracies, like those meany-pants at the bus stop. "Smoke dope" is a noble goal in comparison.

Whats more, you want these thinking adults to provide for you, and you don't want to give them anything in return. I've seen the posts: No one is allowed to have money. No one is allowed to be in charge. You acknowledge how much you need people with skills and knowledge, and simultaneously refuse to give them the authority to use their skills or apply their knowledge. And then people talk about how you're all so fucking "intellectual" that you can totally pull off "anarcho-communism." Yeah ok. Your only response thus far to the skills and knowledge you so desperately need is "WAAAAAAAAH."

>>83491

You sure are angry. Let them talk, it's not going to hurt you or anyone else.

check out the documentary dark days. on one hand, look what hobos faced with survival are capable of...on the other...disease, violence, etc. seemed to pertain to the topic at hand.

>>83491

Fuck, that movie was so pretentious.

>>83501
I am disgusted by their stupidity. I am disgusted by them as they squat in /x/ gibbering about "jews did 9/11" like a hobo loitering at a bus stop, and now they're in /diy/ and every single chan in existence looking for thinking people to tell them what to do, so they can get mad that they're being told what to do. Their mental illnesses deserve mockery, their goal to literally have the inmates run the asylum deserves mockery, their hopeless plans deserve mockery, their bourgeois cluelessness deserves mockery, their inability to discuss their own project in a rational way deserves mockery, and their outreach to every other chan looking for other mental patients to recruit and productive people to exploit deserves mockery.

>mfw xtown

>>83526
So I think what you're saying is that they deserve mockery.
sorry to ask for clarification, the subtext of your statement was a little too subtle.

>>83530
KILL THE PIG. CUT HIS THROAT. BASH HIM IN.

so, /diy/. If we think /x/ and whatnot is idiotic and could never manage... How about we just do it ourselves?

Imagine it. Something straight out of Metatropolis. It could be amazing.

>>83491

>get a bunch of adults to farm and build for us and they should be into conspiracies or at least open-minded
>Your declared, stated purpose is to talk about paranoid delusions all day and live among other schizophrenics
>unconcerned with little details like "how to actually make anything work."
>conspiracies
>No one is allowed to have money.

...what the FUCK are you talking about?

The first four of these claims have never even been remotely suggested by ANYONE on the forums, the fifth was suggested by one guy who was promptly shot down.

I'm going to ignore you unless you criticize things we're actually doing.

>>83545
Because, I hope, /diy/ realizes why this wouldn't work. Starting a MODERN town requires either a location with the resources to 1) build the town 2) trade elsewhere to acquire the materials. You're not going to wander out into the wild and create a town out of scratch with the resources we have. Sorry.

Now, what would be cool is starting a town with the purposes of being a testbed for next generation infrastructures. Then we could get sponsors who had something to gain.

>>83491

>"get a bunch of adults to farm and build for us and they should be into conspiracies or at least open-minded"
>Your declared, stated purpose is to talk about paranoid delusions all day and live among other schizophrenics
>unconcerned with little details like "how to actually make anything work."
>conspiracy theories
>No one is allowed to have money.

...what the FUCK are you talking about?

The first four of these claims have never even been remotely suggested by ANYONE on the forums, and the fifth was suggested by one guy who was promptly shot down.

I'm going to ignore you unless you start criticizing things we're actually doing.

>>83552
meh, I think we could do it. We'd be living like cavepeople but let it never be said that /diy/ isn't tough as nails.

>>83552

That's what I meant- not do some kind of stupid "let's make a normal suburban town in fucknowhere". Check out Metatropolis, it's all about how society might evolve/devolve and create strange hackerspace-style communes, meta-nations, and other crazy shit.

I think /diy/ could definitely make something happen, at least a foundational thing. Remember, Roanoke disappeared but it still inspired a lot. I'm sure there's grant money or venture capital out there for it.

Yeah sure a bunch of kids from four chan ever doing anything other than harassing a fat nerd into suicide from behind the anonymity of their computers.

>>83584
and what have you ever done kid

>>83552

It's been unanimously determined that New Eden will either

1) Locate the village nearby a pre-existing town that we can rely on for goods and services; or

2) Actually try to "take over" a dying pre-existing town with sheer numbers and strategy.


I don't know why anyone thinks we'll be living in "the wild".

I think a town is too unrealistic. You could buy a shitload of property in a failing city like Detroit for practically nothing and create your own community

>>83586
4chan can probably afford to buy most of Detroit...

>>83586
living in the wild would be better

less effort to clean up and plenty of resources around

main problem is dealing with lots of people which is never easy. I've yet to see a chan video game village survive, so you can more or less guess what the outcome will be.

>>83552
I like how people keep mentioning a lack of materials.

Have you not read the dumpster diver threads? People are just throwing materials away.

I live in an apartment, so I don't have the space to put all the stuff I've gotten ahold of in my passive dumpster diving in the very select area from behind my own complex. I've even left things behind because I just didn't have an immediate use for it, so it went to total waste. I'm even talking building supplies, as I have a small lumber stock in the corner for my various projects.

If it was a group effort and we used prep time like we were a band of Bat Men, we could bring together materials needed, or scrap/trade other materials we find to get the stuff we need (as in, maybe some broken metal-made materials are useless to us, but take it to a scrapyard for cash, then use the cash to buy lumber).

I'm not saying it's an overnight thing, but there is always a way if you try, and it's not really that hard.

>>83595
>applying video games to real life.

Since we're talking about games, you are aware of John Gabriel's Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory, right?

>>83595

That might have been great for colonists, but we live in the 21st century. People are going to want access to clean water, electricity, and Internet.

>>83599
you can retain anonymity as long as you don't get caught

criminals expect that they'll remain anonymous, otherwise they wouldn't commit the crimes.

everything you see on the internet is a reflection of real life, with the exception that it's a lot more easier to see.

>>83545
>>83545
I agree. Fuck /x/. Let's build an arcology all by our damn selves. It will be a ziggurat made of shipping containers. This calls for a new thread.

>>83555
>>83555
>has not read forums
>refuses to believe it is written on the forums
>refuses to read the forums
>gets buttmad

>>83599

>John Gabriel's "Greater Internet Fuckward" Theory
>Not "Ring of Gyges" legend

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ring_of_Gyges

Seriously, this shit's older than Christ.

>>83617

You ready to put your money where your mouth is?

If ANYONE has mentioned any of that on the forums (besides the last claim, of course), post a link to the thread they said it in here. I'll gladly permaban them.

Of course, you can't back up any of that shit.

People who go to /x/ without the understanding that it's just /b/ with stupid bullshit are fucking weird. And that's saying something, considering that we're already on 4chan. Hate to be pessimistic, but you guys aren't successfully doing anything of the sort.

>>83597
There is a movement for super-low-cost housing that acquires a lot of their building materials for low-or-no-cost from the excess from construction sites, but that is not dumpster-diving. Its also unreliable; no construction in your area, no dice. And it means you have to build around the scrap you can get your hands on. That adds an extra random element to building a house, which you do not need. Building a house is not like playing tetris where you use what falls out of the sky, unless you want to live in a house that looks like it was built in a game of tetris.

$5,000 per housing unit is the current bare-minimum among people who actually do this, and that's using construction excess and local materials like wood from the fucking forest. Building a town of just 20 units is more unrealistic than building a single unit because you're all scavenging the same resources from the same small source at the same time.

Please use google to familiarize yourself with home building. I recommend small homes (cabins, cottages, sheds, that sort), as well as green houses (which are also small), and how to live off-grid.

>>83639

>>83639
>implying that costs for this sort of thing are the same the world over.

Please familiarize yourself with the world outside your door before you start quoting exact costs.

>>83653
It depends if the good in question is costly due to variable costs or fixed costs.

The price of wood is high because of variable costs. If you move to a country where regulations are cheap to meet, worker pay is low, and wood is plentiful, construction wood will be very cheap.

Versus a fairly new Hino medium duty truck, which costs about $50,000 no matter where you go in the world.

This would be nice if there was an apocalypse. (either zombie, natural, or spiritual, take your pick)

>>83653
I'm the one who knows about the world outside. I'm the one whose read this shit. That $5,000 is a ballpark figure from people trying to make small housing units in the US and the UK. If this is the quality of your thinkers - that they are right, without having done any research, and anyone who helps them is wrong, because they are using facts - you are all doomed to die. And not, like, a tragic death, a Darwinian one that will make the Earth better for your absence.

>>83646
1. How much did that house cost.
2. What amenities does it have.

>>83693
Pallet wood is usually free, so under $500 probably.

It has no amenities, it was an engineering project for low-cost housing for refugees.

I personally, wouldn't go with the spaced pallet & plastic approach. I'd probably just pull the boards and do a traditional wood home.

>>83690

Whoever that was, he doesn't speak for the project. Any constructive input should be appreciated, not derided.

>>83690
The amount of butthurt in your post is incredible.

Try harder.

I hope this is a troll. If not, you're asking the wrong questions. Instead of wanting to know how to make fag-bag houses and hobbit homes. I'd ask who has a decent stockpile of Antibiotics or other medicines. You could have a town of the greatest engineering minds in the world, but shit will hit the fan when one catches a nasty flu, or worse, a cut gets infected.

>>83662
regulations are almost non-existant in certain states or counties.

costs depend on materials and what's available locally, so everyone is talking out of their ass ITT

>>83708

What the hell is wrong with you, man...?

We NEED constructive criticism. If you're not able to accept that, then this project isn't for you.

>>83724
>you are all doomed to die. And not, like, a tragic death, a Darwinian one that will make the Earth better for your absence.

That's constructive criticism to you?

>>83726

>If this is the quality of your thinkers - that they are right, without having done any research, and anyone who helps them is wrong, because they are using facts -
>you are all doomed to die.

Yes. Yes, it is.

>>83731
That guy is just another bitter asshole that is making assumptions about people and declaring conclusions based on them.

If you're defending him for that, then your project is pretty much doomed, because you're so chicken shit that you're taking clear berating as helpful.

New Eden's real name should be Beta Town.

does the first femanon to move there automatically become the bloody war goddess of fertility, or is there a chance to battle for the title If you get there second.

>>83743
The word "smurf" has been brought up.

>>83765
I mean, it's not like there's no such thing as small commune-type living places. But let's be honest, if it's people from 4chan, am I allowed to stab the misogynist rapists, or will I be expected to call law enforcement. Because the not-stabbing thing wouldn't be happening.

>>83819
I'd say (And I definitely don't speak for everyone.) that rapists yes, misogynists in general no. You could probably get away with hitting them, but I think we're going to have a problem if somebody gets stabbed over something they said. As a general policy, "don't leave visible marks" seems alright. Of course if we're seriously talking about attempted rape, then you'd be pretty much free to defend yourself as necessary. Then again, we're going to be under state law at least, so it depends on where we go.

You would need everything there you wouls need to prosper.

That means simple thing, like hydralic dirt compacters that can make a 9 x 12 x 2 inch brick every 10 seconds, to a furnace that can extract aluminum from clay, fabricators and mills and everything you need to make everything you need, including simple IC burners(You don't need to make modern Intel chips, 7 year old tech is modern enough, and you should be able to make your own burner.).

>>83819
>stab the misogynist rapists,

Darlin, that thar is the cutest thing I ever did hear. Rape isn't about hating women, it's purely about power and sex. That's why women CAN do it too.

Now, misogynists have a different perspective, usually that of the abused victim. We are the guys with a REASON to be mad, the divorced fathers paying alimony and child-support to a beast that we once loved that became a crack-whore.

We want to be left alone after 20 years of pain, lawyers, custody hearings and tears, but bullshit and lies gets our dander up.

>>83849
yes, misogynists believe that they ought to have power over women. Rapists believe that women are lesser than them. It goes without saying that rapists are misogynists (keep in mind that there is more than one type of misogyny).
I'm not saying all deadbeat dads are rapists, as you seem to think I implied. I don't know where you got that from. I'm not even saying all misogynists are rapists.

>>83838
AH!

Found it!

http://opensourceecology.org/wiki/Global_Village_Construction_Set

Everything you need to by-pass the industrial age.

>>83868
You may have just saved all our lives.

>>83849
the real point I'm trying to make is that you won't get many residents if they can't feel safe, and I know for a fact that most women wouldn't feel safe with you lot, even though I've seen tons of kind and gentlemanly posts, all it takes is one fucker to ruin everything. There would need to be some serious law and punishment systems going on, and that's coming from one of the biggest idealists you could ever meet

>>83862
>yes, misogynists believe that they ought to have power over women.

Well that is a hilarious delusion. This is why jokes about her "multicultural kids", and string of black, hispanic, white, asian, middle-eastern and etc..., fathers who ran the fuck away are bigoted and hilarious.

Hey, why did the white father get sued? He was the only one with a job.

>>83882
what the fuck are you even on about?

MY point is, misogyny is not what you need to worry about.

Most common misogynists have been through the wringer. Hating us because of our feelings about what we experienced is pathetic and small, just like your opinions of our feelings.

WHY do you need more from us than we want to give? Why are you associating us with rape?

Do you really think rapists hate their victims, or do you think they love finding them in a twisted and obsessed way?

That's not hate. It's not love, either.

>>83895
I think it would be pretty unanimous that people like yourself, racists, etc. must have a very difficult time functioning in normal society, let alone a society that would be as demanding as the one they're planning to build. I'm not going to say something awful like "no hillbillies" but I think someone like you would have a hard time working with others in a situation where their survival literally depends on you not being a raving lunatic.

>>83897
Actually, we have the reputation for being helpful and sociable.

You're still talking about people that are defined by their other mental and emotional ills.

A "recluse" is not a misogynist. They are 2 different things, like an honest woman, and everything that has been alive and addicted to televised emotional response training since the 70s(I just did what you did thar.).

>>83906

Neither recluses or misogynists are going to be particularly useful in a utopian society.

>>83908
I'm glad I'm not alone here...I'm wondering how we would deal with people like this, for example, if someone was causing problems with another member, and we discovered it was because of their race, how could we deal with that?

>>83911
err, I worded that poorly. I'm talking about racists, not that we'll make some discovery that a certain race causes problems. Although you could certainly make an argument against white people if you wanted...we wouldn't want to though.

>>83908
Helpful and friendly misogynists are always needed. We're a primary contributor to communal effort, we have the time to spare AND the reason to help.

Not to mention, we usually have a few beers to spare/share after the work is done..

>>83914
>we wouldn't want to, though.

...especially since they're the most tolerant people on earth compared to the rest of the non-European world.

>>83916
"misogynist"

>>83916

As is a helpful and friendly bigot.

Misogyny is an example of a reason why utopias are practically impossible. People don't like each other. The reasons why are irrelevant.

You can put on the tolerance hat and not say anything for a while, but people can only hold up an act for so long. What happens when all of your bigots and misogynists finally let out their feelings towards those who they've been "helpful and friendly" towards?

>>83612
Agreed ,
The idea itself is great (More people means more sources of money for the general good of the group)

But is a bit flawed in planning,
If we could have better cross board intergration,
/sci/
/k/
and the like, this could progress.
Also on /random/ a while back they already had such a idea in Operation anon town, and had a fair amount of donations, but really it's failure is devotion, which we all need to this.

>>83923
Libertarian societies with a strong emphasis on personal property / personal rights have been the most prosperous throughout history.

>>83918
like I said, you could make a case against us, but it would be pointless

>>83612
I second this.

And gentlemen of the board,
arguing of unrelated content will get the progress nowhere.

>>83927
yes, but we're talking about building a community here, not "free for all".
Besides the fact that you're making sweeping claims without backing them up.

>>83931
almost literally no discussions are "unrelated". Pretty much every concern needs to be discussed to some extent.

>>83933
"Many people believe that after suffering through a severe winter, the Pilgrims’ food shortages were resolved the following spring when the Native Americans taught them to plant corn and a Thanksgiving celebration resulted. In fact, the pilgrims continued to face chronic food shortages for three years until the harvest of 1623. Bad weather or lack of farming knowledge did not cause the pilgrims’ shortages. Bad economic incentives did."

>http://www.lp.org/blogs/staff/the-pilgrims%E2%80%99-real-thanksgiving-lesson

It was still a successful, small scale colony.

>>83923
>let out those feelings

We DO. That's why we admit to being misogynists, sort of the opposite of how feminists admit to being misandrysts, in that, they don't.

WHO are you implying holds onto their feelings, again?

>>83937
that doesn't really back up what you're saying. Particularly since in that example they had their asses bailed out by native americans, who lived in successful communities for centuries with virtually NO emphasis on private property.

>>83937
What we're talking about here is entirely different to the situation faced by those people.

They survived because they had no other choice. They couldn't just give up and move back home when it got too hard.

The threat of death is a strong motivator which these people will not have to face.

>>83942
You clearly did not read the article.

EVEN AFTER native american involvement, food shortages were a problem, until they turned to private food stores.

Suddenly, women and able-bodied children are working in the fields to prevent their deaths. Fancy that.

>>83944
Death is a very real possibility in any society.

You don't think I would maintain our colony's power grid for free, do you?

I expect payment, even if it was something as simple as "you don't have to farm".

>>83946
I read the article from your bullshit biased source. I wouldn't forward you an article from a communist party website as a rebuttal, since that would be obviously slanted. Just because it was said in a horribly biased editorial piece, does not make it true.

Either way, this article is trying to say that the desire to make money is greater than the desire for your entire colony to not starve to death, which I call bullshit on. People like that would probably do better in the current situation than they would in an isolated /diy/ community

>>83948

You misunderstand. If I stop working because it's too hard, I can get government payments to keep me alive. I can try to move in with a friend or family. I can eat the throwaway scraps from my neighbour.

The pilgrims that you used as an example didn't have that choice. If they stopped working, they died.

If you stopped supporting the power grid, there is a whole nation of towns surrounding you who could provide another person to run the grid.

The point is, there was no bail out back then. Now there is.

>>83954
Exactly. People aren't staying because they have to, they'd be staying because they want to. You shouldn't come to the community expecting to get gold medals for everything you do, you maintain the power grid because if you didn't, there would be no power grid. Or, you would be replaced.

>>83948
I'm afraid that what you're talking about is very different from what anyone else is talking about. i know it's very difficult to communicate online, but what are you actually suggesting?

>>83959
I wasn't arguing against fair pay for work, I was arguing that the situation that the pilgrims faced was significantly different to the that situation these modern settlers would go up against.

On the contrary, I think that without fair payment people simply wouldn't contribute. Which leads me to a question:

What do you do with those who don't contribute?

>>83959
Well, have fun replacing me.

I don't see anyone else with sustainable power grid suggestions.

So far the wood gasifier powered 350ci V8 generator seems like the best idea.

However, I guess I'll take my plans and experience with me to another paradise, one that actually values the wealth of knowledge I have spent a lifetime accumulating.

>and like that, you have no power grid

>>83966

Until the next guy comes along. You won't be missed, snowflake.

>>83963
I think we should have to have it unanimously decided that someone doesn't contribute, and then we have to, so to speak, bring down the banhammer. I'm not arguing against fair payment either, but we need to think about what fair payment IS. For example, I don't think we would "pay" (assuming we use currency) the electrical engineers more than a farmer because in the "real world" an electrician would make more money than a farmer. We need both electricity and food, so we can't value one more highly than the other. That's my opinion on the matter.

>>83963
You can do whatever you want.

Me personally, I might share some bare minimums of life with them, but that's it.

No council infringing on everybody's right to property is required. If private individuals want to care for those who don't contribute to society, they can. If they don't want to, they don't have to.

>>83970
Well, considering that so far I hold a monopoly on electrical generation...

Long run, yes, I can be replaced.

Short run, you have no solution.

>>83972

And if they were injured, elderly, or otherwise unfit for work?

>>83976
You're assuming that. It's not like no one else on this board knows a way to generate electricity, and it's not like you could take the infrastructure with you that we would all put together.

>>83976

And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why it's fucking retarded to have only one person who's an expert on something.

If this guy became unable to work, died, or left the town, you'd be without power. You'd likely also be without the knowledge and experience required to find someone to replace him.


These are the kinds of thinkers whom you want in charge of the core necessities of your town?

>>83975
My solution is clearly laid out.

Would you chip in some towards them? I would, directly to them. No interfering governing body required. I do it voluntarily, of my own accord and compassion for humankind.

>>83979
I don't see them contributing anything worthwhile? So far, I appear to be the only one.

Thankfully, I could fit my whole generator setup on a trailer.

My initial estimates were low by the way, 125 kw is more realistic of what a V8 could produce at a rate of approximately 10 lbs of wood per hour.

>>83975
That's true, I was under the impression that no one who was unfit for work would be wanting to live in this sort of place, for example, if I was seriously injured beyond the community's capacity to care for, I'd leave.
I think we could find "work" for people who need to take it easy, like if someone broke their leg, they could cook, maybe.

>>83981
I like you!

Unfortunately, not everyone wants to pony up the effort, or we'd have more Steve Wozniaks and Bill Gates' in the world.

Homesteading is a lifestyle for me. I enjoy it. I enjoy the prospect of producing maximum output with minimal long run capital investment, and minimal time invested.

>>83982
I have a feeling you'd get buttangry enough to throw a tantrum and leave within a few weeks at most. You're thinking we would trust our entire electricity infrastructure to one person, which would be absolutely stupid, especially since that person could, clearly, develop delusions that they are more important than other members. You're making it seem like you're the only person on the board who knows how to make/use a biomass generator.

>>83987
Coupled with the fact that I'm a fairly skilled mechanic and electrician, it makes me very valuable to a society.

Although the solution if I develop a god complex is simple:

Stop paying me for service. I'll obviously cut you off, but then the waiting game begins. I'll obviously receive less of whatever I'm being paid, which sucks, but I'll live. If enough people don't pay me, I'll have to cave to your demands, or I'll ultimately probably be replaced.

Isn't economics grand? It encourages all parties to benefit each other through mutually beneficial transactions, thus allowing our economy to grow. Who knows, maybe we'll produce a surplus and be able to export our goods & services, thus further growing our economy.

>>83992

You're acting like you'll be the only mechanic or electrician in town. We've been over this already.

>>83992
Why are you even here? It seems like you would fit perfectly in with the rest of the world or on your own, and don't have much desire to be a part of a /diy/ community at all. You're already touting how important you are, but if I had to choose between you and someone who would be willing to hoe a field, I know who I would choose. Hint: it's not the guy who says, I don't have to, I've already done enough.

Another thing I've noticed:
I'm seeing a lot of, "Utopias never work because:____".
I think we should work together to make a list of these things and talk about what we could do about them.

>>83992
So far, you have said nothing that says you know dick about anything besides how to act like a dick.

A distributed generation grid is difficult to set up, but it's a microgrid. A person can know enough to maintain their own connection.

>>83997

Seems like this thread has a fair few items for your list already. Seems like you've read what they are.

Why aren't they on your list yet?

>>83993
Again, so far, it appears like I am the only one who possesses the correct skill set to generate electricity cheaply and efficiently.

If someone had the correct skill set, would they replace me? Who knows. It all depends on the market.

>>83995
Congratulations, you're furthering the economics of the issue. You're saying you would be able to find someone who not only operates and maintains the community's main source of electricity, but would be willing to work a field alongside these duties.

Ultimately, that is for the market to decide. What you've basically came forth with is the equivalent of two jobs, except one you work more and get paid less.

Would someone take this up? Who knows. =)

>>83998
I post about wood gasifiers quite frequently on /diy/.

I also have a hard-on for turn of the century steam engines, but we'll leave those out, they're too inefficient to be worthwhile for us.

Some people have no clue about electricity. Would you rather leave that up to the people and potentially have deaths and injuries that the community must make up for? Or leave a professional to the task?

>>84001
Then wew will have to survive without you.

Baibai, don't let this post hit you on the ass, and don't forget to stop posting because this thread really doesn't matter to someone as important as you.

>>84003
As said, as it stands, I am the sole producer.

I don't intend to leave, why would I?

Why are you taking offense to principles of microeconomics?

>>84001
What I'm saying is that if someone says:
Farmers need help or there will not be enough food, someone who would go "augh! this is so totally not fairrrr! I work harder than THEM, I'm going to run away from home. that'll teach them"
is at risk of damaging the community. I for one would not live in a place where someone is given the power to cut off electricity when they're voted against. I'm willing to bet other anons would feel the same way

Wow. Just read most of this thread. People just keep getting off topic.

As long as we hire a professional. You are internet energy stuff savy, not "I built a wood gasifier and ran my fucking CAR on it" savy.

>>84005
Why not?

You'll just buy your electricity elsewhere. Someone else will say "I can make electricity too, just not as cheaply as that guy!"

or

"I can my electricity too! I just don't have a powerplant built yet."

It'd be no different than a farmer leaving the community because you pissed him off. What are you going to do, force him to stay? That's tyranny.

>>84006
what's off topic about it? Making this actually happen is going to be more than "where should we buy the land"

>>84004
Sorry, but we run a distributed generation microgrid, with everyone contributing power as a part of their house.

One of the first decisions we made after plumbing.

Every house generates power, and every generator can be maintained by each person. Had to do it that way, centralized power is too easy to corrupt.

>>84008
I drive a tiny fuel efficient car. Granted, I have though about adding a small trailer hitch and a gasifier. But, I'd feel too ridiculous.

No, the current project is a modified version of the Imbert gasifier with some superior filtration added. The biggest problem with gasifiers is excess tar. Fouled plugs and gummed valves aren't my idea of fun. Neither is sooty oil.

So, with a venturi scrubber added, no more tar problem.

>>84011
of course not, it's not like we'd trust food to one person either. You're bringing to the table something that's fairly unnecessary and making it out to seem like you're the asshole version of Alexander Graham Bell. If you want make money off of electricity, then you should do that, but don't expect us to rely on paying you to do it, I already do that for someone named "Horizon utilities"

>>84013
That's one way to do it.

I would still start up my powerplant and offer to tie them into a power grid in exchange for goods or services. Then it would be a matter of them deciding whether or not trading goods or services is worth the reduction in their workload for a professional electrical provider.

Welcome to capitalism.

>>84013
oof, glad someone read the entire thread. I just skimmed, i must have missed that part. I'm on board with this.

>>84017
again, why are you here.

>>84016
I think you're skipping the point.

I'm merely suggesting, that I can build and maintain an efficient powerplant for the town that would be very cheap in the long run. In exchange for goods or services, you don't have to worry about electricity. It will be my job to worry about it.

I don't expect to be the czar of electricity. I just expect to be appreciated for the niche work I provide, and paid according to the service in which I provide.

>>84019
Because it's fun to be a businessman.

>>84015
"pointing out problems" is not the same as a professional. Fixing the problems is.

All that cack from the burner can be made into a lot of chemicals and turpentine. You might be able to filter them out.

-I- can save them, separate them, refine them and make them into useful chemicals.

>>84017
it doesn't sound like "this is one way to do it"
it sounds like "this is the way we are doing it"
Time to move on.

>>84024
I'm fixing a problem. A problem of "We need cheap, efficient, grid-load electricity".

Unfortunately, it is not cost efficient to extract the tar, nor do I think it contains anything useful. It's just a liquified version of the soot you get from a campfire.

>>84027
You are more than welcome to be "off the grid". I'm sure people will share similar ideology.

However, some people don't like maintaining their own power source of 110 volts alternating current at 60 cycles. This is where I come it. I provide a service to those who want it.

>>84030
You're not making any point, because everyone except you agrees that your system is not a good system. In fact, if we wanted to pay someone to make electricity for us we'd stay home.

>>84032
you're a pretty shitty businessman if you're expecting to sell something to /diy/hards that they have the opportunity generate themselves.

>>84035
>>84033
That may be your choice, but some people would prefer to do other things instead. I can produce electricity cheaper and more efficiently than they can. So rather than producing electricity expensively, and inefficiently, some people will inevitably want someone else to provide their electricity. In exchange for a modest paycheck to me, I provide them with electricity so they can go do other things, whatever they may be.

It's the same reason all towns had a blacksmith. Because it was better cost and time savings to pay someone else to metalwork, than for you to do it yourself (badly).

>>84038
Difference being, if /diy/hards could all blacksmith perfectly well on their own, they would do it.

Wow... just wow. In this entire thread of butthurt and rage there has been 0 fucking progress towards this "town".

Keep it up 4chan.

>>84047
>implying
>implying kid
>4chan
>implying 4kids
>implying kid chan

>>84048
fuck I forgot >2011
this entire thread.
ah well.
so it goes.

>>84048
k

if the internet is the 6th continent why not try to found a town upon it

>>84038
Yeah, but you're not worth it.

Personally, I mean.

Now, someone who has actual experience could be valuable.

Bump.

I'm going to bed, but I'll just note that a town based on /x/ and/or /diy/ stuff might work well with /tg/. If you think Warhammer 40K style stuff would fit, they'd be all over it, and I've seen them have a thread about living in a caravan together, so they'd probably be up for using towns made by other boards when they need a more permanent base of operations.

>>82888
>implying $200 to stay fed in America.

Sounds pretty cheap to me.

>>84780
We posted on /tg/. They raged about guns for a bit and then the thread died.

>>83698
>Pallet wood is usually free, so under $500 probably.
"Paletten Haus are in South Africa right now developing a low-cost unit that runs $11/ sq foot."

http://inhabitat.com/pallet-haus-an-efficient-affordable-modular-house/pallet-haus-2/?extend=1

$11/square foot * 500 sq. ft. = $5500

In the prototype, 800 pallets were involved. The final structure was 645 square feet and cost over $100000.

this thread is full of people with mental disorders, kids who dont know shit, and fucking retarded people

let this thread die, kids

I wish all the best. I dont know why everyone assume that those guys will just go there like nothing and try to build a land. Trying to achieve "new eden" will take a lot of time. If those guys actually will work on this it can succeed

http://today.seattletimes.com/2011/12/kalakala-update-1-with-conditions-coast-guard-wants-it-gone/

If anyone's interested, we've got a new thread on /sci/.

>>>/sci/4109519

>>85721

I don't spend my time on /sci/ and particularly not on /x/, but still... Wasn't that a bad move?

>>85724
Like it or not, we need engineers. /x/ and /sci/ have gotten along in the past; maybe we can get along now.

This just in: One of our members has purchased 200 acres of land in Texas. Pic related.

>>86564
fuck that even the promise of a glorious utopia can't make me want to move to Texas.

>>86564
What kind of homes are you guys going to build in your town? Cobhouses? Yurts? Earthships?

I have this fantasy of buying property and putting in a swimming pool and a hot tub right next to my yurt.

>>86564
>200 acres
>texas
So you just blew the whole $10,000 budget?

Lulz aside, let me know when you guys need some bees.

You will need bees.

>>86584
>animooted

communists!

>>86584

We've actually had a little discussion on the pros and cons of raising bees already. They could provide us with honey and beeswax, both of which are fungible commodities as well as being useful to the town.

Do you happen to be a beekeeper? Because yes, we need bees.

Wow, everyone on here either thinks this can't work and all involved will die, or they are overly optimistic and a little clueless. Why don't you all go read Ecotopia and come back later

>>86590
Far from it. I want to sell them electricity at a reasonable price.

>>86597

As long as its kept reasonable, you'll be welcome in our town.


>>86590

In response, I'd like to repost something from the /sci/ thread:

>If you like the general idea of this project, but don't like certain details (such as what we're selling, how we'll be governed, etc) don't just complain about them. Go on the forums, denounce whoever's suggesting those details, and give us a plan that will
>actually work.

>>86593
Bees hold quite a bit of value in terms of agriculture as well. You can even rent them out to fruit farmers in neighboring areas during spring bloom to boost pollination percentages.

I'm merely aspiring now, since I can't really bring a hive with me in my truck and expect them to stay in hibernation all year, even with a food supply. The last thing I need is for them to swarm while I'm going down the road at 70mph.

I'm going to start constructing hives when I get in my new truck in the next few months. I'd gladly barter them for an oversized mailbox in your town.

>>86626
>I can't really bring a hive with me in my truck

No. You CAN do this. Become the Johnny Appleseed of bees.

You have my pledge that if people actually start heading out to this plot with intentions of starting things I will provide a modest starter set of tools to the occupants of the plot.

Likely a couple of specialized power tools, a set or two of basic cordless and then several sets of basic hand tools (can't have a town full of people waiting in line to use the 1 phillips head screwdriver.)

Also I live in Oklahoma and depending on where this plot of land is coming down a weekend at a time to work/help out might be a possibility for me. (I ain't living there though.)

>>86642
But there are already italian bees all over the continent.

Some jackass johnny apppleseed of bees was responsible for the africanized bee fiasco of the last 2 decades.

>>86646
Nah, that was some Brazilian biologist. Warwick Kerr.

>>86564
Any idea of the county that this plot is in? I'd be interested in purchasing a nearby lot of 80 acres. (Its a bitch searching by coordinates on my phone)

>>86649
Braziallian biologist, johnny appleseed...

Tomato, tomatoe.

>>86669
Hudspeth county.

>>83594
actually 3 weeks ago, i could have bought a 950 sq ft house and 3800 sq ft lot in detroit for 4200 bucks total, paperwork and taxes everything included.

>>86687

>hudspeth county
>13 hour drive

well maybe I come down there for a week a couple times a year then and help out instead of on weekends.

>>86687
Around where in Hudspeth County? I must be too stupid to figure it out using the image provided.

>>86697
I'm possibly less than 2 hours away so I want to get a better idea.

>>86697
31.425148,-105.363007 plug that into google maps.

>>86706
It's about 2 hours away. I guess I can help.

Also whoever owns the land may want to set it up as a land trust (prolly clt) rather than just owning it outright. They could still control the property* but it would protect against things like them dying unexpectedly (car crash or something) and their cousin inheriting it and evicting everyone, or the person having debtors come after the property (Texas is a homestead state but owner anon may have a primary residence elsewhere.) I know this is supposed to be a commune or something but ignoring the larger legal system which exists outside of and ultimately governs the community you're building will come back to bite you in the ass. Before things get heavy underway a couple of trips to a lawyer might be a good investment of time/money.

The worst case scenario for a single anon owning the land would be:
>A year(s) has gone by; it was a hard year(s) but worth it
>Amenities and improvements have been made
>People celebrating the first "4chan RL community" that made it happen
>Owner Anon pulls up
>These are the squatters I was telling you about, sheriff. Evict them immediately.
*There are other things you could do here too like different anons owning different improvements and on paper having things leased out for $1/year or something so that you can have a lease agreement.

In case anyone else is interested in nearby land:

http://www.landsoftexas.com/texas/land-for-sale/index.cfm?sort=4&pagenum=1&county=&sqft=
0%2C10000000&source=&price=0%2C10000000000&city_id=&region_id=&searchit=county&a
mp;listingtype=ForSale&style=&fs=1&site_id=&getres=Search+Properties&state_id=48
&landforsale=&search=county&county_id=0%2C6037&mm=

In case anyone else is interested in nearby land:
>so you can do it yourself

http://www.landsoftexas.com/texas/land-for-sale/index.cfm?sort=4&pagenum=1&county=&sqft=
0%2C10000000&source=&price=0%2C10000000000&city_id=&region_id=&searchit=county&a
mp;listingtype=ForSale&style=&fs=1&site_id=&getres=Search+Properties&state_id=48
&landforsale=&search=county&county_id=0%2C6037&mm=

<!--begin 2 cents-->

>bneweden.runboard
>images uploaded on 'photobucket'
>say that again?!?
>...photobucket
>tolerates photobucket
>implying admins uploading pics on photobucket weren't idiots
>implying photobucket is the only pic-uploading site
>implying photobucket is the best of them all
>there goes the blablablah

>Guy1: why should we trust people blabbering everything they want... and still uploads on photobucket

>Guy2: <sarcasm>because THEY'RE L33T AS HELL, MOTHAFUCKA, THEY KNOW THEIR SHIT!!!!!!!!! THEY HAVE CHOSEN THE BEST IMAGEHOST... THEREFORE WE SHALL BOW DOWN TO THE ETERNAL EDEN OF THEIR CHOOSING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!</sarcasm>

<!--end 2 cents-->

>>86883
That's the shit, man. Admins of bneweden.runboard.com can't even find a better image host... and yet they focused on finding a town. How trustable.

/inb4 all kinds of logical fallacies

>>82997
Rocket Mass Stove and efficient room design.

Also, since I can't be arsed to join yet another forum:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garden_city_movement

Read up on the ecology of cities, with balances between the different land uses needed.

Also; google permaculture and investigate it thoroughly.

This thread has a lot of stuff on vertical farming, and indoor farming in general:

>>>/sci/4114553

>>82888

>this motley would be the equivalent of departing Independence, Missouri with 200 Grandfather Clocks and nothing else in Oregon Trail

i just cackled in hysterical laughter

>>81858
>In Texas possession of lab grade In Texas possession of lab grade glass ware without a permit is a crime.

I won't be living in Texas.

So if you folks are really serious about this INCORPORATE. juss sayen. MemeTown USA Inc. will have more rights than that "cult over there". Might be nice to have more rights/liberties collectively (according to current laws), than as homesteading individuals.
-$.02
p.s. Why no one post pics?

Hey diy, what do you think of my cutting board? Any one else mess around with this stuff?

Dig out foundation at least four feet deep (geotherm ftw) pour foundation. Around edges of foundation rebar. Pile dirt on top of foundation in a big mound. Bend/ weld rebar from imbedded bars in foundation over mound. Add chainlink. wire it to rebar. Use wood to make frames for doors and windows. Pour concrete over dirt/metal dome. Dig out dirt from inside through doors, put on top. Plant garden on top. Hobbit hole 1/3 cost of traditional home. Nondescript and disaster "resistant"
pic sorta related

OH GAWD, are you suppressed violent simians still going on about this crap? You utopians are as bad as seabros and spacebros.

In order to make anything like this work, you have to have money. Lots of it. But people with lots of money already have a comfortable existence. So they won't join you.

You know what you call a lot of broke hippies in one spot? HOMELESS.

This utopian ideal appeals to the LOSERS of society. By definition, since you are LOSERS, you can't get this project done. Losers LOSE. That's the rule.

where are these 200 acres? i also live in texas :) would love to watch you from google maps.

>>87287

31.425148,-105.363007

It's slightly to the west of this location, actually. Try to match up the landscape with the the image I posted before.

>>87287
Because google maps works in real time

Like every other civialization one thing is in common, Order and hiearchy. This I think is what this idea needs most as of the moment. Some of us have an exceptional idea, yet we are limiting our selves to playing anonymous on 4chan. In order for us to manage a flow of ideas we need to establish a site mainly for this cause. On such site we will be able to organize and develop ideas better than we would ever be able to on 4chan.

I took the leap to make a temporary forum to manage ideas.
http://thechantown.forumotion.com/

Everyone post on the forum. :D

>>87447

Err, we already have a forum: http://bneweden.runboard.com/

Still, I suppose there's no problem with two. I'll sign up.

>>87447
>>87456

But OP already linked to a forum. Also, I think we should have a social order based merge sort, but only if form a linked list of all citizens.

>>87461
Apologies for the second forum. Perhaps ideas can be yielded from both sources.

>>87475

It says that "only administrators can post on this forum".

lol when did /x/ decide to make a town?

come to /k/, they have threads like these everyday.

>>87503

Permissions problem should be fixed.

>>87513

>when did /x/ decide to make a town?

Years ago, actually. This project is based off of the original.

And yes, we might advertise on /k/ soon. Most /k/ommandos seem skilled, well-supplied and very interested in projects like this. We do have a few qualms, though - having our village full of gun-toting survivalists would give us a bad reputation with locals and especially with the ATF, which is something we'd very much like to avoid.

>>84038
I had a lot of respect for you in the HAM thread, but holly shit you are a douche bag. You just sound like typical basement dweller. Your gasifier wont power that much shit mmkay. I have researched it, and unless you have acres upon acres of wood to feed it good luck. Also blacksmith was an investment and apprenticeship, like a sushi chef in Japan, which takes time to learn, back then life was different no wikipedia, no amazon, and no youtube.
>>86687
That place is a fucking scam, I am surprised that no one has found out yet. Water is either restricted or hard to drill, full of salt, it's a shithole, as in nothing fucking grows there easily. I almost bought a property there that's why I know.


As far as this whole electricity crap goes, why not Water turbine, steady year round stream can easily support many anons. Imagine 2 circuits, one from the hydro in case shit happens to the second one like solar or wind.

>>87513
I remember that shit on /K/remlin. Once they wanted to raid Somali pirates just to kill legally people
Or
other time they wanted to start a floating nation and become mobile pirates, being part of NAto and UN

Never laughed so hard in my life

>>87528
to explain better, let's say each house would have an option of their own power source and also be connected to the grid aka hydro station. In case of shady days or no wind anon would have a backup from the hydro.

The problems: Permits for water power are not cheap around 12K, initial cost seems high

The Good: unless that shit freezes the electricity would be non-stop year -round available. Let's say overnight the demand would not be as high as during the day, the electric tractor, cars and what not could be charged.

making a 4chan town? amazing. I can see all the assholes running around painting dicks and swastikas all over the place.

>>87528
>holly shit you are a douche bag
Try speaking for yourself.

>>87534
The permits are expensive, yes. The land is more expensive if there is a stream on it. You have to respect the water rights of those downstream, as those upstream respect yours. You have to respect whatever endangered species lives there. There's actually buying the device. Fear of a bad freeze. The possibility of breakdown due to moving parts.

Wind power is reliable in part because your standard 10kW turbine is sitting on a tower 30 meters high. At or near ground level, yes, you run the risk of having your turbine becalmed. But when you make inquiries about wind power, you are shown maps with mean wind speed at a height of 30 meters. At that altitude they are dependable because the world is not going to cease to turn. The sun is not ever going to heat the whole surface of the earth equally.

Also, a 10kW turbine, tower, and installation costs $20k. Compare to just the permit for microhydro, which you said costs $12k.

While 10kW of electricity doesn't seem like enough to run a whole town, it is enough to run the electrical appliances of a town if we have another source of energy. Since we have to deal with sanitation anyway, I recommend bio-methane.

Every inhabitant (and their 4 chickens, 1 pig, and 1 goat each) will feed blackwater into a central cistern, heated and pressurized and populated with methanogenic archaea. Food waste will go in too, after being ground up. The archaea produce biogas, which is run through a water tower to clean it to grid-quality methane. This will fuel cooking, heating, air conditioning (including refrigeration), water pumps, and water heaters for hot showers, all more efficiency than electricity. It can even be used in a ICE to recharge the battery pack.

Also, the bio-sludge that comes out of the cistern is ready to be used as fertilizer on our crops, which we will eventually eat. It is the circle of poop.

In this way you will have hot showers and thus will also have women.

>>87528

>Water is either restricted or hard to drill

Yeah, currently we're trying to figure out ways to get around this problem. There are a few communities/people located in Hudspeth that I'm trying to get into contact with so I can ask them some questions. We'll definitely need to have water trucked in for the first few months, but if we can get a well dug we can use it in combination with rainwater collectors and water conservation techniques to sustain ourselves (at least). If not, then we'll just have to keep getting water trucked in.

I'm thinking if we can reach a point where we have a surplus of water, we could sell it town to other towns and residents in the area and make quite a bit of money.

>>87563
you are correct, but wind turbine has far more moving parts. There are always the typical problems of wind gusts and let's say tornadoes etc. I personally love the idea of hydr but would prefer the "easiness" of wind. There are few problems with wind also, besides the fact that some green nut ob can say that some endangered species can be negatively affected by the spinning blades, the I guess "wooshing" noise seem to annoy some people, I could care less. The big difference between hydro and wind is that hydro is all the time given good location and year round creek vs. sometimes wind blows sometimes doesn't. I know that land with running water is very premium vs. land where there is steady wind. How would you deal with electricity shortages? Battery bank hydrogen cell? Both are expensive solutions. I would also like to know examples of land with stream or small creek vs. regular land. I have seen let's call it nice land like good location, not too far from town etc. for around 700 an acre. Also, I really like your methane system, something I was always interested in.

About hydro and retention ponds and such:

In flat, mostly dry country that still gets seasonal rain like in Oklahoma (where I live) making a retention pond can be very effective. You could hook up hydro to that, with the idea being that you could put a floodgate in to control the water flow, so when there is less wind you can release some water to make up the shortage. It will not produce as much power as hydro working off of a river/stream but it would be a way to control your power production and would produce more electricity than not having it. Also there exist federal and in most states state incentives for creating retention ponds. There are also in some states programs (I know in Oklahoma there are) where you can get like 1k fish fry (bluegill, channel cat and largemouth bass) put into a new pond for free. Also if you have your own pond vs. a stream your neighbors will have less of a say in what you can/can't do.

You would, of course, want a 2 tier system so that water you let drain out doesn't just disappear on you. And some permanent source of water will be vital to having any kind of livestock.

(cont.)

>>87655

Another great thing about the 2-tier system is that with a pump you now have a battery of sorts. If your wind is producing on one day more power than you need/can store with conventional means you can run your pump to move water from your lower pond into your upper pond. Also if a really bad freeze is coming (assuming you have a heads up) you can just empty the upper pond to protect your equipment. (you can also do this to catch giant catfish easily heh--or harvest aquaculture--if you want) And depending on the needs of your neighbors and how prepared they are you may be able to sell them your water.

Even if we don't end up doing hydro, it still would be a very good idea to create a retention pond if we don't have a permanent source of water on whatever property we do this on. Here is the best part though--and I may be wrong, I'll have to look into this--I don't believe that you have to get a permit (or at least the same permit--there might be regular building permits but it's the impact studies and flow studies and such that get ya to 12k) to build hydro if it's not built on flowing water (like a river/stream)This may only be in Oklahoma though, and I'm basing this claim off of what people I know/family have done. I will have to call them to confirm.

>>87656
>>87655

Also if we do get a property that it makes sense to put a retention pond on, we should probably make shaping that the first thing we do since there is a bit of waiting involved in going from hole to pond.

And if this thing ends up going to shit before really getting under way, whoever bought the land is in a much better position to sell it at a profit with a couple of new ponds on it than if the only recognizable improvement is "shanty town"

>>87619
1. Battery banks don't have to be expensive. Edison cells are cheap and long-lasting. Their low energy density isn't right for cars, but this isn't a car! They're part of the Global Village Construction Set. The alternative is a hook up to the grid, to sell when we've got the watts and buy when we don't, but that also costs several thousand dollars.

2. The wind always blows. It may not always blow at ground level, but it is blowing overhead. Hence the 30m pole.

3. Excess methane gets run through an internal combustion engine to recharge the battery bank. So even if there is a problem with the turbine, there is no problem with our electricity.

4. The company that sells the turbine warrantees it for 20 years of preventative maintenance. The calculated total cost of that wind turbine per kW/h is a tenth the cost of grid power.

5. Get your water from the air. $5k may sound steep, but it gets you the machine and the solar panels to run it. I forget the exact number of gallons per day, but this isn't Mars, which is what this thing was initially designed for in the first place. 100 gallons/day input is fine if we use water-efficient appliances and recycle the graywater. Also, it means we don't have to worry about industrial pollutants in the local water supply. Just the air.

>>87818
A 30m hub height isn't really going to reach the wind that's 'always blowing'. Wind speed variability is tremendously imprecise and why commercial scale wind farms rely on hundreds of turbines (with hub heights from 50-80m). They have to provide production forecasts everyday and consistently lowball due to the inexact nature of meteorological predictions.

This isn't to say you have to rule out wind, but you should probably supplement it with something else. Solar is expensive, but has the benefit of being most productive when wind is least productive (middle of the day). There's also hydrogen - which would take more work, but could remove your need for battery backups.

Also - don't set up a turbine without siting the area and collecting data for some period (industry standard 1 year) beforehand. Just because the wind is blowing now doesn't mean it'll be as fast or even there at all come next season. There's also the need for laminar flow instead of just lots of wind. Dirty wind can be worse than useless for energy production and can damage turbines (specifically those using gear box technologies).

Depending on where you intend to install a turbine, north american turbines can have a useable lifespan half that of their european counterparts. Gear boxes burn out and you'll be looking at a complete nacelle replacement. Preventative warranties won't necessarily cover such defects either unless you can prove serial defect (difficult without an entire windfarm).

Some things to keep in mind...

>>87831
Yes, good to keep in mind. Pic related, its hurricane force winds in Scotland. Still, between the wind turbine and the bio-methane from humans and livestock, we should be able to keep the Edison cells charged. (Those can get 6.6 watts per dollar with a 20-40 year lifespan, btw.) Math would be required, but if we want to add solar to the mix, it won't be too expensive, since we don't need too many panels to just supplement the wind and methane.

Also, someone should run the numbers on geothermal. Degree celsius increase per meter depth in select areas, cost to drill to a certain depth, cost of machinery. The middle of Oklahoma might not be a geothermal hot spot, but the vicinity of Yellowstone or Mt. Rainier would. As I understand it, its little more complex than dick in a box:

1. Find a volcano.
2. Drill a hole in that volcano.
3. Put your water in that volcano.
4. Slide a steam turbine over that volcano.

I would do it now but I am literally sick and tired. I'll do it tomorrow if no one else does by then.

>>87875
-$2-5M per 1MW (lower bound is as expensive as wind).
-Scalable for small towns like us.
-High capital costs and no fuel costs, like most green energy.
-High capacity factor, unlike most green energy (96% nameplate).

Also I see the Earth releases fumes almost identical to bio-gas. Since we would have the water tower to scrub it into pure methane, and the infrastructure to use the methane, I suggest we do so.

>>87831
Storing hydrogen in any form is inefficient. You have to deal with large pressurized containers, cryogenics, and constant boil-off. My background studying hydrogen fuel is in aerospace, where I learned that even when going to the moon, hydrogen is more trouble than its worth. Methane is much, much, much easier to deal with, and almost as efficient (350 seconds ISP instead of 450). It is also easier to deal with on the surface of the Earth! If you want to use hydrogen, I recommend converting it to methane via the Sabatier reaction. Easier to deal with, and the methane thus created is carbon-neutral.

In spite of what has been said, looking over it I think these guys could make a go of it. Their main problem is going to be organisation. Running something like this by committee works in a professional environment, where everyone knows everyone else is qualified to have an informed opinion and there is a clear hierarchy. With these people...... I don't know. A lot of the motivation seems to be a subconscious desire to get away from authority. Unfortunately, authority is exactly what is needed on any large project. You want to build a town, you will need a ballbreaker in charge to give orders, not suggestions, orders, and be able to ensure that they are carried out, be able to shut people down when they make or look like they're going to make stupid decisions, and so on.
I don't imagine many of these people will take kindly to that, and that's going to be the start of the problems.
If you've ever worked on a large project, you'll know how quickly things can turn toxic. In an office, no massive deal. The project will suffer, but it's not the end of the world and you can get away from people at evenings and weekends. Out in the sticks, it's not a recipe for disaster, it's a recipe for catastrophe, and potentially lethal.
You've got a bunch of people, each with their own pet skill or idea, and they will not like working on other people's ideas, especially if it's at the expense of theirs, even if their non-compliance will be to the detriment of the whole community.
How will missy herbalist take being told to help build something instead of wander around picking leaves?
How will people react if they're busting a gut and see someone else doing what they perceive as sweet FA, and yet sharing the results of the work?

These are major, major problems. If they don't have a system in place to deal with this, it will break the whole scheme within days.
Fail to organise properly, and you may as well not even bother to start.

>>87891
Perhaps living in a commune for a little while should be a prerequisite. Or - and this is less efficient, in that you would not benefit from economy of scale - you can make every unit independent of each other. Then its more like any rural town: Bunch of homesteaders, a post office and a fire department.

I agree about the jealousy example. But the thing about communal living is there is a real sense of community. Everyone pitches in and does what they can. Someone with the right attitude will trust their neighbors; someone with the wrong attitude will mistrust them. Envy and jealousy are not hard problems to solve, like engineering or financing. They're largely an artifact of the capitalist society the inhabitants of a commune have consciously rejected.

This isn't to say we should emulate 20th century socialists. No putting people up against the wall for "hoarding" or "parasitism." I heartily recommend a resource economy using the kWh as currency. How else is the commune supposed to deal with the guy with four video cards and a 1kW PSU in his computer, which he never turns off?

>>87656
>>87655
Damn that's a really good idea man, I have seen this practiced in Europe, where they build a huge pool on a hill, and during peak times make electricity, and afterwards during night, when the usage is low pump the water back up. Also, fish would be easy and awesome source of food. You don't need as many permits as for the stream hydro because there aren't as many agencies involved like wildlife, epa, county planning, and more dipshits.

>>87818
I didn't know about the warranty, that's great by the way. I know that in 30m the wind blows not always because if it did I could see the wind turbines spinning by me.
Yes there would be ton of storage for batteries, which is great.
I know about the device that pulls water from the air, it's very cool. I was thinking the same, to hook up to the grid in the beginning, then just be tied to the grid. Sell the excess, and use it as needed.

>>87885
Yeah my background in hydrogen is google, so I my knowledge is nothing compared to yours.

Just throwing ideas there aka brainstorming.

>>87891
You are very right, sadly it would turn out in bloodbath, since it's 4chan. I would try to maybe emulate Amish without the religion, or work out a quota system, where the herbalist would have to provide certain amount of herbs and farmer certain amount of corn and livestock and so on.
Great idea,

>>87891

Yeah, people picking leaves for alternative 'medicine' is a lot like praying: a way to do nothing and still feel like you're helping. The way I see it is there should be a 4 hour work day (in shifts), and then the rest of the day is spent on picking how ever many magic roots you want and exchanging them with anyone stupid enough to buy. What you're talking about, basically, is a command economy. But the best leaders aren't people who bark orders nor the people who talk talk talk and never do; it's the people who will actually work to build informed decisions, and then give the order after they've heard all the ideas. The other side of it is that there should be multiple leaders and factions all competing, so that bad leaders can be defected from, and good leaders will grow their factions.

People can earn their food and water on 4 hours a day, then have 12 hours of time for free enterprise. All of the entertainment, culture, optional projects, and visionary projects can come from those 12 hours for every person. That's effectively a 50% GNP contribution to 'the arts,' et al, compared to the 40 hour work week of the rest of the world that keeps people too exhausted to participate in 'optional projects,' such as open source work.

Massive banks of these on roof tops, under eves, on top of hill etc. Cheap, easy, windbelt generators. As an alternative to turbines.

Punch holes in this. This is half brain fart. The old style company town model mixed with socialist commune / micro economy free market.
Key points:
1) Community owned corporation (trust?)
this owns the land, large equipment, general store, housing, handles majority of money (IE company bank), insurance, legal, etc
2) Inventory of general store driven by local demand. Goods bought in bulk/wholesale sold at ridiculously low rates to residents.
3) Any business ideas (income generating plans) can be reviewed by community, voted on then funded by the corporation (branch divisions). Allowing an environment both prosperous for entrepreneurs and folks that just wana do a job and go home and be a good neighbor (labor force).
4) Internal micro economy work hours translate into our "town cash" which is used like money. It can always be traded in for $$ at any time but with the ability to have a stock of what you like at the company store, and the ability to ask your "pet corporation" to use it's wholesale license to order you what you want through your account, means $$ good for going out to town for a movie or vacation. But it keeps a great majority of profits inside the walls for personal growth/ investment.

The business model could work for everyone not just the land barrens. Just a thought.

>>87956
very interesting, especially the model makes kind f sure that people are not lazy as in leeches. What are the preventions in corruption and over ruling?

It is a legitimate concern that we would be incapable. There MUST be guidelines (regular showers, physical fitness requirements, everyone pulls their weight, no sociopathic bullshit everyone must act with the utmost in, integrity not including the occasional rape).
Aside from that, we must make an instruction set book that lets us get stuff done without any hesitation.

>>87983
I figure it's a proven business model (for tyrants) if everyone is a share holder (instead of the tyrant), it's hard to justify abusing yourself. Community center/debate hall instead of a ceo office. Wired into a local internet so community issues/ company decisions could be handled by everyone real time without the need for a massive gathering.
Just pitching ideas.
this was the captcha for my first post, no foolies

>>87988
Like in a casino assholes are cashed out and given an invitation to the world. Peer pressure does wonders for society if used for good.

Found 50 acres in the wine country outside of Vacaville, CA which is a good sized town about an hour north of the Bay Area. Existing infrastructure is good. A house, internal roads, electricity, water and Comcast business class internet are readily available. The property sits on the edge of a hillside that gets a good watershed for collecting water through permaculture swales.

Current price is 575,000 which is comparable in cost to a good apartment in San Francisco.

If you guys have income streams, commute to the Bay, or can generate a few thousand a month then you'd probably be able to handle the mortgage for such a place.

>>87997
That's a good strategy. If they can't take the heat, then they'll WANT to leave the kitchen and it's not going to be easy.

>>87991
something like real time decision voting with out being present, for example you are farming and you get a message concerning issue, so with out being present and wasting time you can vote in few seconds and keep on working.


Also, this is just an idea, OK?
Amish have many regulations that don't apply to them only because they are religion exempt, same with many taxes. So, how about we start some kind off bullshit religion in order to get many of the benefits that Amish have? Like a bible that instead of fairy tales has actual rules for the community, like commandments saying though shall work 4 hours a day, though shall not troll little kids etc.

Also, the shares system is a great idea.

>>88000
50 acres is too small, believe it or not. Once you account for wind turbines, fields, common place, warehouse or some kind of storage, it would be like Chinatown.

AS far as design of the town, would it be houses and then individual places in the field, or each house would come with a plot of land?

>>87956 continuing ...
5) Visitor hostel coffin motel type bunk house in community center w/laundry, kitchen, bath house. New folks can stay here for a few nights and move on or stick around as temp worker/ living interview process.
6) Apartments/rooms for the next stage once someone has been excepted (endorsed, voted in, and offered a share to buy)
7) Once a share is bought and you are part of the company you then can lease some land enough for a comfy dwelling, propose a build and have it funded with a company loan/grant (details) The addition to the property value can be appraised and added to your account as it enriches the community/ company.
8) Resident based businesses (branch divisions) can be made with community grants if it will generate jobs and profit for the company, and low interest loans if it's a one person operation and will benefit just a few. Not everything has to included everyone. Place for everyone willing to try.

>>88011
before you get waco comments "... if you want to make a lot of money start a religion" -L Ron Hubbard, genius lunatic. Successful so not an unsound idea. However I would like to quote >>87150 ">MemeTown USA Inc. will have more rights than that "cult over there". Might be nice to have more rights/liberties collectively (according to current laws), than as homesteading individuals."

And lets face it the corporation is nothing more than a new name for TRIBE the social construct is as old as dirt, and what folks are talking about here is "tribe-ing up" which is a legitimate reaction. Tribalism is the most resilient for of civil order, and as this get more and more unstable people will naturally converge into tribes in one name or an other (group,gang,corp,family,church etc)

We all know the corporate business model works, unnervingly well in fact. The heads are making more money than they can spend in ten lifetimes, this tells me if it was run evenly there would be more than enough for everyone. Especially if we stop being led by addictions to short sighted greed. Start building things to last, and realize good business means everyone profits and keeps profiting more and more, wealth can be made and not just accrued. Scarcity is manufactured.

>>88015 more points/ ideas
9) A community like this would naturally want to be built to last with the best available tech. So the idea of having a division of trained grant writers to receive yummy experimental green tech funding to build the town could be set up.
10) The techniques and skills acquired in doing this could be a great foundation for a construction business. Which would be great PR for the community/ company outsourcing skills and labor, establishing cred globally/locally.

How much money do you have?

My family is selling 470 acres in Livermore Ca.
About a quarter of property has grape vines and we've only developed a small portion for living.
There are 5 new model eco houses (approx. 3600 sqft. each) A big community pool, 1000 sqft underground wine cellar, 7 wells and septic systems (though we get water and electric from the county anyways) And around 60 goats.
pic related..looks exactly like our property.

>>88027
Thanks,
I am >>88011

It would be great to get an accountant or someone who understand this stuff they whey in on Pros and cons of different establishments.

>>88031
What are they asking for it? Are they negotiable?

>>88031
not sure if I'll ever go back or even stay on the west.

http://www.google.com/search?q=japan+debris+west+coast&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=or
g.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

Definitely need mineral rights coz of fracking and no California htak you. High taxes etc. we need good land, and state with very favorable laws toward corporations

I vote for a nice farm town gutted by big AG abandoned and cheap some were midland.

>>88048
Yes, ghost towns, abandoned yet with infrastructure that would save a lot of money and time

>>88048

Why would big AG abandon farmland? I'm not familiar with what you're referring to. I thought Big AG consolidated more and more land to be endless sprawling fields and only left hilly dry land for private ownership by actual families.

>>88053
They'll buy a dozen or so family farms.

the families leave, and nobody moves back into the buildings.

>>88048
Some where workshops/warehouse factories can be put up easy, central location for a personal shipping hub for goods and traveling construction teams making a living reproducing communities/working parts ( biogas generators, eco houses, power generators etc) as contractors. Hopefully with enough flat land for a small runway.

>>88031
Wine country? Not sure I even want to know what the bargain price is for that piece of land.

For us to establish our own town we'd have to look at the last remaining frontier region of the Continental United States, that big old chunk of land in Texas between El Paso and San Antonio. Cheap as hell down there, primarily because there isn't jack shit you can do with it with regards to farming. Grazing, maybe, if you own a hell of a lot of land, but don't even think about growing vegetables.

Personally, I don't mind that fact too much, a 6 month experiment in organic farming gone wrong (was the vegetable production manager for some asshole with 1000 acres in East Texas, a dairyman wanting to make a little more money with a 10 acre plot of veg) has left me rather jaded in that whole affair, or at least with the whole affair of growing a surplus to keep some yuppie in Dallas content with their weekly bok choi. I opt instead for some slick-looking hydroponic operation that can be largely automated so that we can put our collective brain-power to more rewarding monetary pursuits. The desert looks like a pretty fitting place to construct some AI.

Oh, Nevada is probably cheap as hell too, and ideal if anyone here has a thing for hookers. I only suggested West Texas because it's a quick commute for me.

>>88065
Using rain catchment swales on contour you can probably grow fruit trees. Some permaculture guys pulled off such a set up in the Jordanian desert outside the Dead Sea.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sohI6vnWZmk

>>88065
Also, same guy, I happen to know that there might be something interesting happening in the town of Rockdale, TX. Alcoa has shut down this massive 35,000 acre aluminum strip mine and offered it to the town for use as a park, but they didn't care to spend any money developing the thing, so a friend of mine is thinking that it might be a swell place for a massive agricultural incubator.

I haven't the slightest clue where this is going really, all I've heard is the idea and that they might have grant money and that I might be on the Board of Advisors for this wild scheme. Like I said, not too hot on organic farming, but if anything happens then I'll try leaking out some more info

>>88038
We have the option to parcel the land. So its basically how much land do you need? Would you be interested in buying the houses as well?
They are all new construction located in a gated environment with their own a private driveway/street.
Right now and until July the houses are leased to UCB to house some big shot professors and their families.

>>88065
Colorado land is just as cheap, and it rains more than once a year.

I remember when /r9k/ was going to buy a apartment complex, turned into a cluster fuck, if this goes though its first stage, I have quite a few dollars to buy some land

Whoever is posting all these architectural designs, you are seriously over-thinking things. There are literally thousands of steel shipping containers floating around that can be bought on the cheep and finished into living quarters. There is a contractor in town that does this, then sells/leases them for storage or office space.

If I ever get a budget to make a disaster shelter, that's totally what I'm going to do.

>>88069

Nice video!

And I completely agree with >>88065

Agriculture is back breaking work, and hydroponics to reduce the work and bring it to waist height is tremendously important because it doesn't matter how industrious we are, our brain power would be wasted if we were all reduced to manual laborers.

Oops, pardon my 'sage,' forgot to clear the name field.

>>88065
I say we get spacefag on this. Think of this as colonizing a semi hostile planet with good amounts of water/air. It's the 21st century, log cabins and tilling the earth is a bit played out. I like a green house, the pond hydro-geny/ fishfarm = aquaponic/ aeroponic nutrients were talking dang near closed loop and automation should be a standard this is DIY after all. It's like biodome without airlocks. Poormans Mars colony. Shoot we could sell it as a reality TV show (documentation should happen anyway), have exclusive footage rights and broadcast from the server farm.

>>83530
Why the fuck did the american version change the boys from public schoolboys to a bunch of military cadets. Completely undermined a key theme of the book.

>>88069
I remember watching that video, was and still is a favorite of mine, just kinda forgot about it. That's the other downside of always working for someone else, though they could be convinced to switch to organic methods, the whole concept of permaculture was a little too far-fetched for them, especially if it involved digging massive ditches (swales).

>>88074
Huh, well if that's the case I actually like Colorado more myself.

>>88079
it's going to be about 20 years before space travel (even one way) drops to the price range where a bunch of idiots from the internet can afford it.

>>88079
shipping containers reek of the poor mans "space colony"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65C9OLvmjpI&feature=player_embedded

>>88074
Colorado sounds great

>>88079
That's the spirit. Whenever you think about it, this is a lot like that Biosphere 2 experiment in Arizona. Yeah, it failed, but the reasons why it failed were primarily because it was locked away from the outside world. We don't have to do that, at least not to the degree of generating our own oxygen.

>>88086
So that's about 20 years of earth bound prototype R&D funding for a community/company specializing in the field as an excuse to live a sustainable lifestyle with current/bleeding edge tech. Excellent

So do any of you guys actually have the money for this?

>>88100

I have $3500 which I've been looking to use as the down payment on some land. I'm sure /diy/ is full of people like me. The only problem is that when a thread dies on 4ch­an it pretty much starts over from scratch and nothing gets done. If it does manage to get itself off site it probably dies when everyone realizes they hate each other and their politics soon after getting user names or meeting. Familiarity breeds contempt; anonymity holds our community together.

>>88094
or we could NOT refuse the use of algae so it would actually work. In the book "Distraction" Sterling/Gibson after the US tanks, different tribes live nomadicly around the walls of the corporate cities. One group uses Mars colonizing tech gleamed from nasa technology after the info/databanks became public doman. Good book. Described flash mobs as protest in 1998.

ChanTown. This shit is destined to fail

>>88115
No. We just might have to discover 1000 ways not to make a town first. It worked for the light bulb.

Were not reinventing the wheel here. We have a pallet that is perhaps too full. We have a thousand years of civil/economic/political techniques and theory at our disposal. We just have to be innovative DIYers and assemble something from available "off the shelf" parts into new and efficient construct. It works wonders for hardware. It's not a big logical jump to see the parallels in human society.

>>88129

I'm pretty sure we have more than 1000 by now.

http://web.archive.org/web/20090625070253/http://xparanormal.ipbfree.com/index.php?

http://tgproject.free-forums.ca/t12-read-this-the-right-mental-image

http://anontown.forumotion.com/

http://www.whenshtf.com/showthread.php?t=10264

Among many, many others.

I am a bit more surprised of the lack of
DIY neo police
DIY education that doesn't suck
and
DIY need some pro medical attention
resources for said new community.
I think It would be prudent for said new residents to live out of a van before continuing with said superstructure as it would provide a contigency for individuals who change thier mind and want to leave.

oh and how are the /x/philes going to handle decisions that are traditionally handled politically?

>>88065

You're in luck. Apparently, we already own some land in West Texas. http://bneweden.runboard.com/t39

>>88393

>education that doesn't suck

There's no way in hell we're going to have kids in our town, at least not for the first few years. We could use some help with the other stuff though, especially the medical.

>>88079

GENIUS

>>88489
that place is like the top scam in Texas. The county is Hudspeth. Here is the info http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/2006-09-26-land-scams_x.htm ust google Hudspeth county scam land. Some people, when scammed were selling the land as low as 12 bucks an acre. One poor guy got lost looking for the parcel and died. There is just so much wrong with that place, like restricted water rights, nothing would grow there. Also Texas has very lenient guidelines for homeschooling, one of the best in the country.

Let's buy a piece of Detroit, take /K/omando with us and make a Chantown. Gain power, vote our people into offices, and slowly take over Detroit.

>>88489
Yep, that's the Texan Frontier alright, located a not-too-inconvenient 3 hour drive away from where I live apparently. Skeptical about it being farmable in the conventional sense, but where there's mesquite trees there's an aquifer, just have to dig like hell to find it.

>>88396

Er... they'll handle them politically?

I mean, why wouldn't they?

>>88530

>One poor guy got lost looking for the parcel and died.

I heard he killed himself, actually. Not much better, but still.

I don't see why there'd be restricted water rights - I thought it was just very difficult to obtain water. If you can't afford a well, you have to pay to have it delivered.

>>89246
That's sad. I forgot which utility company is trying to restrict the usage rights only to them exclusively, so they could sell it to you at premium.

>>88072

I like the idea, but keep in mind that we don't have the the funding that NASA has or that the Biodome project had - vast greenhouses or dehumidifier systems don't come cheap. We can't go totally "closed loop" either - there's a ton of things we just can't produce ourselves, like medicine or clothing. Like it or not, unless we get a vast property and several wealthy financial backers, we can't live like we're in space.

>>89565
>we don't have the the funding
We might. Not quite that much, but still.

>>90144

Shit, I forgot all about that offer! I'll e-mail him ASAP.