/diy/ - Do It Yourself

oh it most certainly can be done, just takes time and immersion. That last part is the hardest one if you aren't someplace that actually speaks the language you're trying to learn.

>>72190
>Do you think too
>but spare time, but

You could start with English. Germanfag here, I´m fluent in English and understand some basic Spanish. I might move to Norway for some time and learn Norsk once I´m at university.

Feels good to be part of the multilingual masterrace.

>>72191

I'm moving to Spain for 3 months hopefully next summer, so it should make it easier to learn it them.

I suppose it's something you need to have the "sink or swim" attitude with. If you go there and live, you NEED to learn it to get along.

I was gonna try Rosetta Stone, but I spoke to a language uni student of mine and she say's it's a waste of money, I'd be better off buying night classes.

Fuck dat shit, I wanna /diy/.

>>72193

Hey man I'm wasting away in self pity, under the influence and been up for 47 hours now.

Excuse me for making mistakes... :(

>>72197
>:(

might wanna go to bed. But some tips for you. German is rather easy to speak because we speak like we write and vice verse, however the grammar is rather difficult and we have strong accents depending on the region (the Germany you may know is in fact only a small part of the whole. If foreigners think about Germany they mostly think about Bavaria, but there are 15 more federal states.)

Spanish is nice and I don´t really know what else to say. It´s not a very difficult language but you still have to learn all the different conjugations so as far as that is concerned it´s nearly as difficult as German.

French is very difficult to pronounce and the French are racist assholes, difficult language but if you like the taste of sperm you might also love French. I heard that chicks really like guys who can talk French but as far as I know only fags learn French.

I have a real colored picture as captcha wtf. Thought you should know.

Byki - try the free one.

>>72203

French was last in importance tbh. German was first and then Spanish.

I'll try some Rosetta Stone just now cause it's free, obv.

Any other tips? Like what did you do to help speed up learning?

Thanks for the input btw.

You can still become completely fluent in a language at 22--what you start losing is your ability to pick up perfect phonology naturally and easily. Everything else? You'll be fine, you just need to devote more time and energy to learning.

Oh, and with adult learners what you want to get out of learning a language is what you do get out (provided you put in the requisite work). If you don't care about speaking, but want to be able to read and write like a native speaker, that's what'll happen.

As to languages, yes, German and Spanish have spellings that reflect the way they're pronounced. French is still using the spelling that scribes under Charlemagne came up with, that's why it's weird. German and French will register as easier to you, since you speak English. If you have to use Rosetta Stone, use it in conjunction with a *good* textbook to teach yourself grammar and other vocabulary, watch the news/shows you find interesting in that language, and check out movies in that language (and watch them with subtitles). Also, comics. Comics are easy to learn from, and I'd say more interesting than most of the material out there for language-learners.

since we're on the topic:

there a big chance of doing my masters in NL; I was thinking of learning german for a while, but now I don't know whether to try and learn dutch from 0, or to continue with german.

I know a bit of german, but not a lot. From ROmania.

>>72221
You should start learning Dutch. The German would help in the sense that they're closely related languages and the countries are incredibly close, but the languages are different enough that they aren't mutually intelligible (unless you've been learning Plattdeutsch).

>>72223

Dutch has round about 10% in common with German

Tbh.

>>72215

Cool, I'll start Spanish RS and buy some textbooks from amazon.

Looking forward to this.

>>72231

Do you actually want to learn a language? Any polyglot worth their salt will tell you to stay as far from Rosetta Stone as possible.

Ankiというソフトを使ったほうがいいよ。 You can Google translate that or if you're willing to forego the bad bill of goods you've been sold from cheesy tv commercials I'll be happy to explain in more depth. By the by, I learned Japanese a 22.

>Any polyglot worth their salt will tell you to stay as far from Rosetta Stone as possible.

Why is this? I'm curious.

>>72247

It's difficult to articulate without your having tried it first but in short it doesn't demand of you the production of vocabulary on a scale or frequency that will allow for you to truly internalize a body of words large enough to really begin to feel comfortable in a language. The single largest hurdle in any language is the vocabulary. Grammar will fall into place if you don't spend your time fumbling with the words you don't know. I HIGHLY recommend a book called "The Word Brain" and I believe the PDF is free on their site.

http://www.thewordbrain.com/

It changed the way I approached language acquisition.

>>72251
Agreement. Rosetta Stone is built on flawed assumptions of language use, saying that you should learn a language as an adult the way you learned it as a child. Doesn't work like that, and, like you said, there isn't nearly enough vocabulary in there.

>>72260
here
*language learning

>>72251
Oh, gee. The Word Brain seems useful. Thanks!

Sorry for the attempted hijack, but the last thread was about language resources. So how about how to actually LEARN a language from those resources?

>>72324
The most important thing is to try to use the language for something every single day. This could mean that you keep a diary in Greek and write in it every night before you go to bed, or actively watch/read an hour's worth of Spanish news, or spend an hour conversing with that friend of yours who happens to be learning German just like you, or anything else you can think of.
A language is a lot like a musical instrument: you either use it constantly and develop facility on it, or ignore it and watch your facility slowly fade away.

....On that note, I need to go practice.

>>72260
I thought RS worked pretty well for languages that are relatively similar to your own, like an English speaker learning Spanish. I know its crap for learning something like Mandarin, Arabic, or Japanese.

>>72190 Hi OP.
I'm 23, and started learning a new language about 18 months ago. I chose Japanese, for whatever reason, which is pretty much the linguistic opposite of my native language, English. I currently know somewhere around 4,500 - 5,000 words (not including the many words the Japanese have borrowed from English), just from learning at home using an SRS, and I can listen to and comprehend intermediate level Japanese. I read kanji and know their proper stroke orders. I've passed the JLPT which is required to work in Japan, and am aiming for a passing a higher level of that test in the next couple of weeks.
So, I'd say it's possible to learn languages as an adult, and it doesn't have to take years, so long as you put in effort daily. I slacked off many times along the way with my SRS, I wasn't constantly learning new words, and I didn't always review the words I had recently learned, yet I still have achieved a pretty impressive level of understanding with Japanese for such a short period of time. This is because, if I did skip out on my SRS, I always made up for it with extra listening or reading that day. There hasn't been a single day that I haven't done something with my target language. You don't have to dedicate your life to flashcards, but you do have to dedicate your life (for the time being) to the language. You need a minimum of several hundred hours of time put into learning a new language, and the only real way to get there fast is to devote more hours a day to it. If it's worth the time and effort to you, then you will certainly be able to tackle any language you choose, no matter the difficulty level.

>>72190
ajatt.com is pretty fucking cool when it comes to the attitude you need in learning a new language.
Learning Japanese it is even more useful.

OP wanted to learn a language similar to English and not Japanese, that´s why I said Rosetta Stone might be useful. It is most certainly not perfect but a good and cheap (if you use torrent) way to start and get a first feeling for the language.

My tip would be that you should try to start to think in the language you want to learn. Don´t think to yourself "I would like a beer now" , think "Ich hätte jetzt gerne ein Bier" or "deseo una cerveza". Focus on getting better with what you know and less on learning something new.

That Spanish sentence was probably wrong, I never use my Spanish skills so you see what happens if you do that. Learned it for 3 years and can´t even say such a simple sentence now without doubting myself.

With the time spent in learning japanese or mandarin you could master Spanish, French, Italian and Norsk!

Hola, OP.

I'm attempting to learn Spanish at 29, using some books and CDs I downloaded. Good luck to you.

>>72369
I've got no motivation when I think about learning Spanish, Italian or French. I'd rather challenge myself with Swahili and Japanese.

(Norsk, however, is my morsmål!)

>>72362
Even if OP's goal isn't Japanese, the method is the same no matter the language. If I can understand 4,500 to 5,000 words and an intermediate level of listening comprehension in a language vastly different from English in 18 months, then I can probably achieve an equal understanding of French using the same method and putting in the same amount of time daily, in about 3 to 6 months (since English is so closely related to French). So can OP, or anyone else for that matter. Rosetta Stone, as was discussed earlier, can't give you enough vocabulary, and thus can't get you to fluency. It's better to just sit down with a flashcard program and learn 25 new vocab words a day, then combine it with a good grammar book, and listening to things you enjoy in French (like dubbed tv shows, audio books, podcasts etc.). The more things you find that you enjoy doing with the language, the more you'll expose yourself to the language and the faster you'll learn. It's not that you can't learn something from Rosetta Stone, it's just that it's not the all-inclusive language learning guide it sells itself as and that people believe it to be, nor is it the quickest way to learn. Plus, you'll have more fun just jumping into the language than you will testing the water with Rosetta Stone or anything like it.

>>72379
You really don't need to learn some shit like Swahili or Japanese. If you can't even speak French, you're going to get fucked. Do you have any fucking idea of how useless and boring japanese is? And by the way, you probably will drop it after a month or two. How old are you? 20? Stop wasting your time in weabo shit.

I apologize if I look like a troll.

>but everyone's telling me that it can't be done now that I'm 22. I should have done it when I was 12 or even younger.

Definitely not true. There are people who learn foreign languages as a hobby. Some languages are so simple that they you can become reasonably fluent in a year or two of intensive study. Get into the hobby of foreign language learning and you will be surprised what you can accomplish.

Flash cards and recordings are your friend, my friend.

>>72390
Swahili is far more useful than French on a day-to-day basis for me. I do think I'm going to have to buckle down and learn a Romance language at some point, however.

>Swahili is far more useful than French on a day-to-day basis for me.

A language's usefulness is dependent on so many variables. It is impossible for 1 person to tell you what languages are useful and what aren't.

Japanese could be highly useful to one person while Arabic may be highly useful to another.

>>72389
You see, the same 60-80 words take up to 60% of a language in coversation (just give a look at your post and see how the words 'it' or 'th*' appear every 5 words) You can start expanding your vocabulary via extensive reading. Oh! And if you choose to learn a language closely related to one you know (ie. spanish and portuguese, dutch and deutsch) everything will be easier to you. For example, lets take a look at romance languages:

English: Horse
Spanish: Caballo
Italian: Cavallo
French: Cheval
Vulgate: Caballus

English: Love
Spanish: Amor
Italian: Amore
French: Amour
Vulgate: Amor

>>72395
Dude! Even Standard Arabic is more useful than Swahili! Were the fuck do you live in? Mozambique? Kenya?

>>72401
>Kenya?
Yes indeed, some of the time.

>>72190
My Latin teacher in high school was teaching himself German and French and he was 58.

The man was also unbelievably intelligent.

The /sci/ guide has some useful links

>>72401
english: love
dutch: liefde
german: Liebe

>>72389
If OP has the balls to learn 10 new words every day without forgetting the old ones he will most certainly not need our help.

Again, Rosetta Stone is nice to hear the language and to get a bit of a feeling for it once you start. It´s obviously not suited to get you to a fluent level. For that you´ll have to put in a lot of work, dedication, time and some time with native speakers.

>>72401
Agreed, there are words in every language that are more frequently used than others, and since these are common, especially in conversation, you can just pick them up through reading (comics and other conversation based literature) or listening to that language. If you want a wide variety of words, vary your types of reading and listening materials.
In my opinion, these two things shouldn't be supplements to some other method though. They're the mediums by which you come across new vocabulary and grammar, as well as the way to test your progress. Also, they are the way to bridge the gap between your target language and your other interests, in the process making learning a new language more fun and something you're more likely to stick with. It seems to me, you should supplement reading and listening with vocabulary and grammar, not the other way around, especially since reading and listening at a fluent level is your goal in the first place. So, taking on a program like Rosetta Stone thinking that it will give you most of what you need and you can throw in a little listening and reading in your spare time, is not going to do you as much good as starting with reading and listening and working your way through it with an SRS and a grammar book.

>>72401
You are comparing a language of the germanic group (english) with ones of the latin group. You might as well compare english to russian.

no its possible, it just takes a little extra effort, the only difference is you'll be stuff with an accent, I've learn Romanian and I am learning German atm. I'm 18 and recently graduated (no college, waiting for the military's paperwork bullshit to go through).
tl;dr its possible

ofc its doable, you are not a 12yo stupid child wanting to play, you can really study.
However
1)learning another language is not easy
2)i dont think its easy to handle learning more than 2 languages at the same time
3)with devotion in 1 year you will be able to communicate in that language and at 3 years u will be able to speak fluently

Also a hint, by speaking 1 hour in german (or any other language) you will learn more about the language than 3 hours of vocabulary and grammar study. Dont get me wrong, you need all of these but to get the "feel" u gotta speak.

>>72193
Dude. Half my middle school in Norway took German because it's Norwegian minus throat gargling sounds plus more swoosh sounds.

Shit's easy tier for ya