/diy/ - Do It Yourself

>>682465
there is one wooden called wolfstrap on the officiial reprap site it may help you with ideas,
I hope you get it done, one of my dreams is having one of those printers.

>>682467
>there is one wooden called wolfstrap on the officiial reprap site it may help you with ideas,
Yeah I know, I have a few hundreds sites saved about 3D printers. The repstraps were an inspiration for this.

>>682465
fyi i hate projects like this, there is no need for it to be 'open source', there is nothing unique or interesting about a linear translation stage using off the shelf parts.
If you designed a new extruder or something that nobody had seen before and it was so awesome that it revolutionised the 3d printing industry and companies were furious they didn't invent and patent it first; thats when you can gloat about it being 'open source', when its actually worth something.
right now its just a turd of an idea that is never going to happen.
no offence.

anyway the drive for the height being offset like that is probably the worst thing i have ever seen. No doubt that the height will vary as the head moves, not just because the top part will sit at an angle but also because the shifting weight of the head.

Why bother? There's tons of other free designs out there using off the shelf parts. Unless you are a mechanical engineer, you aren't really "designing" anything. Other people have already gone through the hardship and the various iterations to arrive at machines that actually work.

OP, every person who ever been fucked up and has a smart phone or uses computer at the library where they shower, has had this idea while drunk or high. This was a drunk txt from a friend recently

> So it's not officially put together. But the general model/plan involves Design Solutions. There will likely eventually be many different industries involved (residential/commercial, automotive, bicycle culture, etc.) but everything involved has to do with utilizing design in order to solve problems, and also the ability to make whatever is required with a 3D printer. Outsourcing things at first till we have enough money to have everything in-house. all very modern all involving opensourcing the 3d printer to industry.

>>682809
>mfw mom's coworker and his friends actually went through with this
>mfw will probably ask for an internship/summer job after 1st year of uni

dude and all his friends have rich families so they can afford for it to fail

>>683030
There are plenty of great things in the list of stoner buzzword pile there, they just require some money and or investors. Most stoners have weed and one cool entertainment vice like guitar, drums, TV, PC etc. To those that do, pick a buzz word and have fun. Entertainment 720

>>682465
>make the custom parts out of cardboard
Uhh... most 3D printers have some kind of registration issue, even those that are 100% metal.

>>682465
OP, the Z axis could bind because the leadscrew is on one side. RepRap has two leadscrews for Z, no?

What happened to 3D printers?
We heard so much promise and now it is like there is no hope. Even that $100 Peachy printer is having nothing but problems getting it to print right.

Also it was supposed to be such a big deal that those laser metal printer patents expired, but no one seems to be doing anything with it.

>>683103
turns out rapid prototyping machines don't have much application outside of rapid prototyping

>>683103
You can get commercial laser printing systems right now if you have the money.

Main reason you don't see buzz about hobbyists doing it is that high power laser equipment is really, really fucking expensive.

>>683103

>100$
>having nothing but problems.

Uh, yeah.

There's only so cheap you can make a linear motion machine without making it shit. And personally I wouldn't touch a 100 dollar one with a 10 ft pole.

>>683112
>Main reason you don't see buzz about hobbyists doing it is that high power laser equipment is really, really fucking expensive.

I thought this was the reason myself, but then I found a thread on reprap talking about the wattages to laser sinter metal. It is basically dvd writer power. Not no fancy high power CO2 crap.

>>683103
To be honest I never thought the peachy was a good idea. Yes headphones and galvanometers are both coil driven but heaphones need the frequency to be right not the volume. Even a smal change in resistance means the mirror position is off.

>>683170
I think whoever said that is just plain wrong.
DVD writer power lasers are used to burn shit like paper and melt plastic, so you can sinter nylon particles together very, very slowly.

But metal? I don't believe it. I'd happily eat my words if I'm wrong.

>>683276
well there is also plastic laser sintering. Maybe they just mixed it up. Last time I was on the reprap IRC talking about SLA stuff they drifted away to bioprinting.

i like what you have so far. here are a few ideas and suggestions and thoughts about things ive dealt with while dealing with my 3d printers and making 3d printers;
-the most simple thing you can do is make it properly with no bullshit or fuckign around. which means no cardboard, no printed parts(for anything mechanically rigid , no wood, and less laser cut acyrlic. do not dick around with ANYTHING from the hardware store. you will, seriously, not get anything useful there. you will get a load of ghetto bullshit and non metric garbage.

is this suppossed to be on the cheap like low cost or what? what is your scope?
-dont make the parts out of plastic or wood.
-dont use rods, rods are gross, rails are real shit
-give the zaxis rods top support, thats the main problem with all printers with this style
-keep the xmotor on the inside of the leadscrew
-you need a way bigger and heavier base
-if the whole thing is not metric, just stop now and redo the whole thing over.
- make the zaxis rods fixed top and bottom
-3 point yaxis bed leveling
-3 or 4 bearings instead of 2 for the xaxis
-probably gonna need another leadscrew for the zaxis or need to change the position of something. the way you have the motor and rods with no top support or bottom support, and one leadscrew you will get leaning on the x axis plane and the whole z/x assembly will tilt up at the idler end because of the weight of the motor
>>682538
because every reprap sucks compared to something you design your self.


>>683170
no dvd laser will sinter metal. it barely burns white plastic


also laser equipment is not nearly as expensive as it was. you can get a 40watt chinese co2 laser for sub $1000. they have them for as little as $500 shipped from cali. they are what you pay for

>>683289
>dont use rods, rods are gross, rails are real shit
Are you saying rails are good? Because I like rails.

Built my own design using rails and steppers savaged from broken machines the company I was trained at took back from coustumers. Was a nice final project.

>>683289
Thanks. This is what I made so far, this is just the basic design. I'll add side supports (something like the Robo 3d) later. It's supposed to be a low cost (300-500$) easy to build alternative to reprap, because as you said reprap kinda sucks. I wanted to build a cheap 3D printer but there isn't really something good so I decided to design an open source printer I would like. If I'm already designing it I can as well make it opensource for others.
Rails are hard to get and are expensive, it's supposed to use parts that are easy to get and relatively cheap.
So I should put the X motor between the rods, does it significantly improve anything?

>>683345
With the rails I mean it's not as easy to find something matching (on ebay, the parts should be all easy to purchasable from ebay) in length, size and price while it's easy to find the right rods.

>>683276
>so you can sinter nylon particles together very, very slowly.
>>683289
>no dvd laser will sinter metal. it barely burns white plastic

http://forums.reprap.org/read.php?153,231867

>>683571
>doing some modelling to find out how much laser power is required to do selective sintering of nylon powder
>modelling
>nylon powder
>not even thinking about wavelength

Making a 3d printer without printing is called bootstrapping. That keyword should help your google-fu.

There is a radically different type of 3d printer called "Wally" that would be significantly easier to bootstrap than the device you have in op.

http://reprap.org/wiki/Wally

To bootstrap a wally you can make the brackets, arms, and brackets out of wood, and eliminate the bearings by using nylon washers between rotary connections. Another particularly nice thing about this design is that it can print larger copies of itself in successive generations.

>>683658
>Using angular bearings for linear motion

>>683658
The problem with Wally is http://reprap.org/wiki/Wally
>Firmware
>no entry
Didn't find anything with google or on https://github.com/NicholasSeward/ConceptFORGE/tree/master/Wally

>>683103
>What happened to 3D printers?
A bunch of retards bought them not realizing that they
A. Produce plastic parts in shittier quality than you'd get from items at the dollar store.

B. You have to know how to create 3D models. And not just 3D models, but 3D models with accurate dimensions and tolerances.

C. Speaking of tolerances, most printers can't really meet them very well, so you have to adjust them over a few prints in order for the part to fit something.

The people that are excited about 3D printers don't know jack shit about actual machining or manufacturing processes in general. At work we just did the math to find out that making an assembly by laser-cutting the parts costs half the price of 3D printing in the same material. AND I get more flexibility in choosing material thicknesses that the 3D printer can't even produce reliably.

>>683670
Im basicly with you. I wouldn't want to manufacture stuff on a 3D printer. But for some stuff it is actually pretty nice to have one.
You see I often need smal parts that don't actually need to be strong or espacially accurate and I can't fit a CNC-Mill or laser cutter in my place.
I got a 3D printer knowing exactly what I was going to get.

I think we can all agree that there are some obnoxious overexited people who want to print everything and even consider "3D printed" as selling case. IMO 3D printed stuff shouldn't be bought unless there is no other option.

>>683662
>>Using angular bearings for linear motion
I know, right?! (Insert Jurassic Park "Clever Girl" pic.)

I don't like that the print bed is pulled down only by gravity. I suspect that this will be sprung in a future revision.

>>683665
>The problem with Wally is http://reprap.org/wiki/Wally
>Firmware

I understand that it uses the standard RepRap firmware configured for each axis to move 400mm per rotation. The compensation for the nonlinear arm and bed movement is done in the program segmentize.py. (not in firmware).

The print process is
3d model (.stl) -> Slic3r (g-code) -> Segmentize (machine specific g-code) -> Printer.

There's no real reason it couldn't be done in the firmware. I suspect the author's efforts are being directed elsewhere.

I'm under no delusions of this being a finished product with the same support as a RepRap. I should have disclaimed that at the beginning.

>>683670
>You have to know how to create 3D models. And not just 3D models, but 3D models with accurate dimensions
This. Absolutely. The hardest part of doing 3d printing BY FAR is making the model. I've played with Sketchup FreeCad, OpenSCAD, and AutoCad's new 3d printing tools and all of them feel painfully clunky. I welcome the development of better tools for this.

One day I hope we develop an actual 3D 3-D CAD program, with Oculous rift or lightfield 3-d display and intuitive controls that work in 3 dimensions. Until then... <crickets />

so far I have this
http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=177&u=14686367

If Mecedes annon is in here, Sorry I couldn't reach out to you.

>>683764
I think 3C is the best of those but I'd go for a XY-Head Z-Bed design instead

>>684001
I agree with c3 but I think the desire for symmetry is wasting space.

>>684001
z bed AND head
b/c allthread is slow as fuck

>>684247
I always used quad start lead screws for Z movement. No problem with those.

>>683764
thats pretty slick looking
all you need now, something that it seems no one in the reprap community understands ,is
dowel pins , dowel pins, dowel pins! it will make life so much better.

one thing i forgot to ask before, do you have a 3d printer already or whats the scoop?
if this is your first one, or what ever , make the printer for your self first and foremost. dont do something because its "stardard reprap" ,.
>>683345
because easy and cheap are just that.
besides, if you are buying from the internet, everything is easy.
you can still opensource your printer and all that . make the printer something you want for your self, then make it work for others.

>xmotor
i put mine in between the rods because I have found on other printers with the xmotor in a nasty spot, it wants to arc to one side, like the idler side lifts and makes slanted prints.


>>683696
sketchup is basically a colouring book, freecad is kinda wack, openscad lol and boxy parts, autocad?what year is this?

its called solidworks homie or seimens nx, what ever.


they do have a firmware for "wally", psure it uses marlin scara

>>684381
yummy

>>682532
your the type of guy to suck at a game, and bash it cuz you booty at it.

>>684566
>dowel pins
What would I use them for?
>one thing i forgot to ask before, do you have a 3d printer already or whats the scoop?
It's the first one, I studied electrotechnic, I know what I'm doing and you can find tons of stuff on the Internet. But because I want to make it as simple as possible it's better to ask where the problems might be. I would as well like trying to sell it, so I want to build something people might like.

I guess I'll go with this. One big plate for X axis should be the best, it should make the axis more robust and the assembly easier.
I had to put all the parts on one side of the plate because of symmetry and balance.

dowel pins are used for locating parts and keeping them square. holes for screws are drilled over size so there will always be play, dowel pins are drilled for a perfect fit
http://us.misumi-ec.com/maker/misumi/mech/tech/locating_pins_tutorial/

>>685025
that thing is looking awesome, and yeah the one large xplate is best.

>>685025
One X plate looks way better. I'm unsure about that Y axis though.

>>685040
dowel pins are a double edge though. You need to clamp the parts together in the exactly right position and then drill and ream trough both pieces. And if you fucked up your positioning at first thats it. If you were smart enough to drill all the way trough you can get the pin out and only have a useless hole

>>685366
The Y axis is for simplicity and saving space. There are printers that work like that. It isn't supposed to be a high precision printer, with these types of printer you don't get a high precision anyway.
I'll try to make the bed the standard way as well since it would increase printing speed.

>>685407
You are right. FDM isn't the most accurate thing anyways. I'll be fine.
Reducing the mooving mass is a good practice to get higher printing speeds. And the bed is relatively heavy. especially with your design.
Just saying it again. If I were to design an FDM printer again I'd porbably go for XY-Head Z-Bed. That doesn't mean everything else is bad.

btw have you thought trough your extruder setup already? Seems like you are going for a direct drive. I always used at least some gearing. One time planetary gearing made for the stepper I used and the other time something belt based from parts that were around.

I made a mistake and made the bed too big last time. I'll make the base a bit bigger as well.
>>685416
It's primary for direct drive because of simplicity but I'll try to make it for geared drive too. Direct drive should be OK for 1.75 filament.

>>685481
>should be OK for 1.75 filament
Then make sure your drive gear is fairly smal and your hodend is good. I once had a shitty J-head clone (they are not all bad) and I was barely able to push the filament trough by hand.
Canged it out and everything was smooth.

Was trying to put together an alu frame.

simplified

>>685639
i dunno man, i can see the z giving you issues
I know you have two bearing blocks but it just gives me the willies having the drive screw offset from the axis of possible (but unlikely) rotation

>>685675
This might work, it as well can use the same parts as >>685481, it will be more universal.

Something like this should be the final form. I put the rods close to the bed to have more robustness. That meant the X motor and extruder had to be repositioned. The frame was made more compact and supports the rods to make it more robust.

>>685366
dowel pins are not a double edged sword. improper machining techniques are. if you are doing dowel pins like that you are doing it wrong.
>>685712
love this second one with the 2040's

>>682465
sHOULD i GET ONE?

>>687198
>you are doing it wrong
Then they thought it wrong to me.
Can you give some reference? Please don't get this wrong, I'm not trying to be witty. Google gives me mostly wood joining.

>>686548
I'd go back to the one X-plate or use longer rods and 2 brackets per rod and side.

definitely do not do a 2part xplate. among other things, its going to put unnecessary and unwanted stress on your rods

>>687206
ok ok if were cool here,
because wood dowel pins and automation dowel/locating pins are pretty different.
http://www.zaber.com/wiki/Manuals/G-LSQ#Alignment_Procedure
i use this style of outside locating dowel pin for my rails and carriages

http://www.misumi-techcentral.com/tt/en/lca/2009/12/022-motion-mechanism-design---9-ballscrew-selection.html

check out the "next" button, there are like 4 more pages on dowel pins and workholding

http://us.misumi-ec.com/maker/misumi/mech/tech/locatingpinshowtheyareused/

i use these other 2 styles are like slip fit and press fit work for like my end of arm tools (extruder for 3d printer)) for my machines

the difference is soooo night and day.


for machinining dowel pins one would be smaller than the other for a fit type pin, the undersized one would not be removed and the over sized one would be the one that sees removal from the mating part.

drilling and reaming the 2 parts over top of each other is a fast way to get bad holes. i usually drill from one dowel hole to the next one and then the rest of the holes (on the mill)

>>687217
I see. I only got taught about machinining dowel pins on a drillpress. I guess you go from one dowel hole to the next one to keep the displacement between them low.
Thanks for clearing this up.

>>687202
what?

I would like the design to be as simple as possible but the full X plate adds some inconveniences I would like to avoid. Unless I'll find solutions to them I would go with this.

>>687558

>>683122
>There's only so cheap you can make a linear motion machine without making it shit. And personally I wouldn't touch a 100 dollar one with a 10 ft pole.
it's not a linear motion machine and operates in a manner entirely different from conventional 3d printers in order to lower costs.

>>687558
explain

>>687604
The problem with peachy is they wanted to make it way too simple and cheap. They used audio output because USB wasn't universal enough for them. The XY laser system is used in laser show projectors and you can buy it on ebay for around $100 or you could make your own from stepper motors for a few bugs. But no, they had to make their own stuff.
I was thinking that if this gets at least a little popular (I'll try making an indiegogo campaign to see if there's interest) I would design a peachy like printer for around $200 using again standard parts.

>>687613
It's not a problem for your type but here I see these problems:
1. Everything is packed too close together - assembly problems
2. Can't access the X bearings and belt fixture properly because of the plate - assembly problems
3. Can't use a simplified (prusa i3 like) frame because the rods would have to be too much away from the corners and the frame supports wouldn't reach the frame. Or the base plate would have to be made smaller, that's not so good.
4. Rods will be pushed away from the bed - robustness decreases.

>>687614
I think they use audio output rather than USB so they could avoid intermediate microcontrollers and drive the coils directly?

>>687632
Yeah, I watched the video now and it was to remove extra components. They saved like $10 with this.
>most cards are 16bit
I'm not an expert on audio but I believe this means nothing because the signal gets distorted by the components it has to go through and noise. They as well didn't take into account you sometimes need holes in the parts and only acted on it when people from KS mentioned it.

>>687619
>It's not a problem for your type
it was though. when i was still dicking around with rods and plastic parts.
its also much more , i dont want to say important, but important to have access to the extruder motor and hot end than the rods and belts. with a good design they rarely need service and with a good design, you can service them from the back.

it just good to be able to see the hot end to monitor what its doing. it is, of course hot, you will want to see if its jamming, melting the frame, what ever, ect.
I know its direct drive, but even with direct drive its also ,i want to say necessary, to be able to feed the filament by hand and be able to turn the drive somehow.

I think i like what youve done with the xmotor though, in between the rod and leadscrew.

I would post a real pic of that printer, but that one isnt mine, but one im drawing up for a girl I like at work. so I dont have any of the parts with me.

also highlight/explain what you mean by 3 and 4

and what do you think of mine?

>>687640
But you can see the hotend, that was just a back view to show the rods supporting the X frame.

how mucho munny to get one

>>687667
around $300 I guess, I see if I can get it lower