/diy/ - Do It Yourself

If someone is worried about it exploding I've filled a small container with steel wool that will be attached to a bubbler to prevent explosions.

>>474091
Damn that sounds cool.

This are the initial schematics for the plates disposition, there is 5mm between plates, but I think I should separate the 3 or even 2 mm, , the maximum height the plates can have is about 7 cm, I've thought of making them of 5 cm so there is more energy passing through the water, I don't want to have too much area because I'm afraid I't will let pass lots of energy and I won't get enough HHO.

How many square meters should I use to be powered with a 12 car battery?

>>474094
I can't help you with your problem OP but this interests me. how does this thing prevent explosions?

>>474096
Thanks, if I only had the formulas so I could optimize them...

>>474100
The steel wool divides the HHO into small parts so if the flame gets into the tube the explosion won't be able to pass through it, also id it fails theres a bubbler with a pipe going into the watter so small bubbles have to reach the surface, isolating them so the explosion can't reach the cristal can.

>>474100
I think it is a spark arrestor. You use the same sort of device oxygen using torches like oxy-acetylene. The OP's setup will be oxy-hydrogen.

>>474091
I've been wanting to make an oxy-hydrogen torch since forever, but haven't been able to locally find the sheet metal I want to use.

There are many square plate designs online that use some sort of gasket system between the plates to contain the water and isolate the plates. They are "dry cell" designs like in this image.

Would having a hydrogen injection system (think nitrous but with hydroden tanks) work? I like the idea of having a system like yours but it doesnt seem all that efficient if your gonna use power from your alternator.

>>474106
I'm going to use the metal from a computer case, I've tested it with hidrogen peroxide to see if it was stainless steel, it is, so I think it's just perfect.

>>474111
I'M NOT GOING TO USE IT IN A CAR, it's not efficient, you end wasting more petrol to get HHO that won't be so efficient as the pretrol it's by itself.

>>474105
>>474106
Neat, so it's a homemade flashback arrestor that's built like a spark arrestor on a engine exhaust.

The flashback arrestor on my torch makes a clicking noise when you turn the torch off so I assume it's actually some sort of valve or something.

>>474099
This is the only background I have and they didn't even use plates:
http://www.dangerouslaboratories.org/hydrogen1.html

>>474111
I recommend starting your own thread, since this has nothing to do with the OP's project really. Be prepared for backlash and maximum trolling.

>>474112
Ha, I've been slowly collecting similar scrap.

>>474116
Geez, thanks for clarifying in your previous posts. No need to be aggressive, douche.

>>474099

You'll get around half liters of oxyhydrogen gas per 1Ah of electricity. Thus, one liter per minute flow would need a 120A supply. If you use 12V supply, most of the voltage will be wasted, unless you have several electrolysis cells in series.

>>474117
>The flashback arrestor on my torch makes a clicking noise when you turn the torch off so I assume it's actually some sort of valve or something

It most likely is a type of check valve. The same thing can be installed additionally to a homemade oxyhydrogen torch for added safety.

The link you provided uses a "wet cell" design. "dry cell" designs are more efficient, but a little more difficult to build.

>>474134
Yeah, you need a low voltage, "high" amp power source. The cells need to be around ...2.5v I think, I don't remember the optimal voltage off the top of my head (look it up, sorry). People stack them in series because most people don't use a 2.5v power supply. However, if you did have a power supply that met the single cell voltage then that would be far more efficient than anything else (and a 12v PSU would of course be wasted as you say). You'd then just hook up more cells in parallel if you need more fuel to be made with the 2.5v PSU.

>>474100
>pic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_S-6_KDju8

Seems like a "power factor corrector" (PFC), which isn't really needed in most homes in the first place since most devices with this problem have power factor correcting circuitry in them already (like a PSU on a PC). Only big ass motors need that stuff and randomly plugging in a bunch of capacitors isn't really a good idea. Most new house air conditioner units use DC motors and a switching PSU with a boost converter to do PFC already.

Which is why in the video I'm posting they are using an AC motor that doesn't have it's own PFC. lol

Thus, the device works, but only if your house appliances don't already perform that function.

>>474228
this particular device does not work. It's just a little circuit to power an LED that has two 1000 microfarad resistors on it

it doesn't do anything at all

>>474094
Steel plates aren't optimal fir gas production. You want something with high surface area, like steel wool. >>474094

>>474180
Im thinking about putting 15 plates separated 3mm from each other, I guess with that will be just fine

I've finally decided to do it as grant thompson did, I will place two plates separated by a plastic washer, and the two plates will be separated from another two by a metal nut and so...
The plates will be placed like this.

>>474094
I made a device like that when I was young. It did explode. One of the terminal screws hit my finger and gave me a black nail.

Is that a steel lid you have there?
>Conductive

>>475055
I meant the OP picture.

>>474579
You need to match the voltage with how many cells you'll have to get optimal power usage versus oxyhydrogen output. It should be in the 1.25-2.5 volts per cell range. So, divide your input voltage by the number of cells to find out how much voltage you'll have per cell.

>>474463
>two 1000 microfarad resistors

Oh, do tell, you sound like an expert on the matter.

>dripping sarcasm, pic related

That device does work, but it isn't a massive energy saver because modern most appliances already compensate for power factor and it will only work on circuits that are connected one buss on your breaker/fuse box.

Inside it has capacitors/inductors that help compensate for power factor from unregulated devices. This reduces electric use.

But, like I said previously, this device is bollocks in the 21st century. It'd be great for the 1980s when next to nothing you use in your home corrected for power factor. It isn't a snake oil device, it is just a nearly useless device today.

Here, read up,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_factor

>>475055
Yeah, I'd recommend a plastic container and plastic lid. lol

>>475055
Yeah, i'ts conductive, but I will place some nural 28 to prevent shortcuts.
Also I'm thinking about making a hole on the lid of the main jar covered by a thin plastic that will break if the pressure is exceeded to avoid lots of glass pieces flying in all directions.

>>475091
Thanks for the explanation, I was going to use about 6 or 7 cells but I don't know if I should put the plates by pairs or I should leave the same distance between them alternating the polarity like this (+ -+-+-+-+-+....-)
Also just cut the plates, they will be 8cm tall per the cm corresponding to it's place in the jar, so they can describe a circumference.

>>475091
To be more specific, which design should I chose, A or B, why?
What if B had 3 volts per cell?
How does the separation between cells affects the working of the generator?
How I can measure the distance I should let between two plates in a cell?

>>475177
Forgot file

>>475178
Here:

http://www.hho4free.com/configurator/cell_configurator.htm

>>475180
Oh god, thanks!!

I've decided to try this, 3 volts per cell is a bit excesive but it will allow me to get a decent amount of HHO without overheating, If I have enough space I'll add one more cell on each side

I've began to cut some plates, I'll create a new thread when it's totally finished

>>474091
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqjn3mup1So

>>476016
I've seen it, I think he doesn't ikes toive deais so people have to buy his $20 pdf.
But the video is pretty neat.

>>474091
Does this produce enough gas per watt so we can use it in a rocket using water as fuel and the cell to split it?

>>477361
You want to make a rocket with an extension cord to power it? Gas per watt is you pumping electricity through water to get gas to burn. A standard batter won't cut it.

>>477361
No, LOL, the one I'm disigning runs with ~130 watts and it produces 0,6-0,7 liters per minute (without electrolite) , the only way you could power a rocket is by liquidifying the oxygen and the hydrogen and storing them in separated containers and build an efficient combustion chamber to burn the gases, in fact, most of the rockets that are launched by the nasa are powered with stored hydrogen and oxygen.

Now this thread is on the front page again I will post some updates:
-I haven't been able to find plastic washers and bolts in the local hardware shops, so I've began working on the case and security systems.

>>477654
Barnished tem so they look nice

Also working on a pressure valve for the bubbler, simple but effective

>>477656
This is how it works

I don't know what space will be between plates because I haven't bought the plastic washers yet, that's why I still haven't made the others 16 plates, only got 4.
Also the metal washers I bought are horrible, I'll have to sand them if I want the plates to be completely parallel.

This is how it should look like

So let me get this right:

You want to put O2 and H2 through the same tube and light it up on the way out? That's a very elaborate suicide device. Why don't you extract H2 to one tube and O2 to another, and mix them where you want the torch to be, this way there will be no way of the fire going into the tube. That's how the welding equipment works too.

>>477942
Making the H2 and the 0 go through different tubes may seem easy but it isn't, it's easier to make both gases flow through the same tube and create different security systems to prevent explosions even if the fire gets into the tube.

The bubbler will isolate the gas from the fire, in case it fails (even though they are relatively safe) a pot filled with steel wool will stop the fire to get into the generator creating a bigger explosion.

I will also add pressure valves, one to the bubbler and another one to the generator, to let the pressure flow out before it blows up the containers.

>>477952
may seem simple but it isn't? Resdesign your plate so the anode and cathode are separated into different gas chambers

>>475540 ->This

How I would be able to sepparate the anodes from the cathodes and create different gas chambers when the disposition is (- + - + - + - + - ++ - + - + - + - + -) and the maximum gap I can let between a positive and a negative plate (a cell) is 2mm?

It would be way easier If I had 1 anode and 1 cathode, but I have 10 anodes and 10 cathodes.

Try pic related with 20 cells, but without increasing the power supply, It's impossible.

Building a lid for the bubbler, the plastic lid doesn't seems very safe...
I did a circle in the wood and filled it whith a subtitute of joints called nural 20.
I will drill holes for the valve and the in and out tubes.
I will saw the excess of wood and place over the bubbler, attached to the wood case so the pressure made by the bolts and nuts hold the bubbler againsy the joint.

>>474116
He said he wasn't using the car to generate the HHO you illiterate prick.
>>474111
I too wish that someone would take this seriously. I am interested if pre-bottled Hydrogen OR oxygen would improve power or mileage.


>>474091
OP When I was younger i used Graphite rods in place of steel, and produced enough HHO to call it a "candle" of sorts. Graphite is cheaper than stainless and holds up almost as well. I don't know if they are as optimized as you are looking for.

This has a pretty lame afternoon, it's rainig and I didn't make any significant progress with the HHO generator.
I spent 2 hours in order to make this whistle with scrap brass tubes, sounds very nice.

>>478058
thats a nice flute.
you should get some holes in it

Just ended with the wiring

>>478138
Looks nice to me

I'm sorry but what is the point of this other than an interest project? It seems like it'll consume way more electricity than a standard electric torch.

>>478360

Hotter flame?
Btw, does anyone have idea how long those stainless steel electrodes last?

>>478364
Right, torch as in blowtorch, now I understand this thread.

And they'd last a long time I'd guess, they're not the components being electrolysed, the water is.

>>478366

The positive electrode is exposed to atomic oxygen, which corrodes almost everything.

>>478364
Till time stops.

Also the size of the flame is always directly related to the amount of amps. More Amps, More Gas, Bigger Flame.

>>478360
I have some batteries charged by a solar panel and It would be nice to use the generator to have an unlimited source of heat to work with.

Pic related is the panel, some idiot threw a rock at it and cracked it but it still works fine.

>>478364>
It's stainless steel so it can handle better the corrosion, although the water turns a bit red-brown because of the rust (I guess) but the effect on the plates is unapreciable, but you have to dry them after using it so the water doesn't corrodes them.

The joint for the bubbler looks perfect, I applied a layer of black paint to the wood which surrounds it to prevent water from damaging the wood

>>478057
pre bottled oxygen would be crazy for power, you could make it into a nos system without much more work.

dudebro. Go with graphite rods. Stand them upright on the bottom of two plates that won't become part of the electrolosys (look up what would work I forget the specifics of it) hang another piece of steel or plastic or glass to keep them separated and you can keep your gasses separate and keep your cylinder form factor

>>478389
how do I into hydrogen embrittlemebt and oxidation reactions?

Update:
installed the pressure security valve and the in and out conexions for the bubbler, I spent most of the day cleaning the garage.

Almost completely made, I've uploaded a video of it to youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVh5lAC31lw

>>479076
Sorry, I messed it up with the editor, I'll be reuploaded in few minutes

Here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DilHdFnD8rE&feature=youtube_gdata_player

>>479090
Done!

>>479256
Now it's completely sealed and capable of retaining the gas without leaks.

Now I just have to make the last connections and create the cells (I'm still looking for a decent hardware to find plastic threaded rods and washers).

>>479263
Let me share a story from my past

> Want this
> Build it from two plastic salad containers
> Aluminium electrodes iirc
> Use NaOH for faster production
> Catch HHO in soap bubbles
> Light 5 bubbles
> Wowawesomewhatisthissweetdude
> Wait for 10 minutes
> Ignite another 5 bubbles
> 5 bubbles ignite 10 other bubbles
> 10 bubbles ignite gas in the tube
> Tube-gas ignites gas buildup above water surface
> Both plastic containers shatter to pieces

Removed ~20 pieces of plastic from my face, then went to the ER for having gotten NaOH in my eyes

Be careful OP... be careful

>>479811
He'll be fine. As longer as there's a bubbler and a flash back arrestor.

If you keep your bubbler topped up with water even if your flashback arrestor fails you will only get a small explosion.

I've had a bubbler explosion. All that happened was a loud bang as the plastic lid blew off. I got covered in water and had a loud ringing in my ears for a few hours- after that fine.

>>479811
>Aluminium electrodes
>NaOH
durr

>>480299
Also the top and base of the generator are made of wood so glass won't trepass it, the only damage I can get is in my legs, I'll maybe ad a grid for further protection.

UPDATE TIME!:

Finally! I've made the plates and fitted into the bell jar, I just have to end the connections and I'll be able to try it.
It has taken me more time than what it should because I couldn't find plastic washers or plastic threaded rods so I had to be a bit imaginative and make them by my own.

20 plates in total, 10 cells, 2.4 volts per cell and about 130W of power and a production of 0,7-1 liters per minute

An with this it's the third time i cut my left thumb in one week.