/diy/ - Do It Yourself

>Using bread yeast: Don't ever do this. It has next to zero alcohol tolerance and the flavor will be a far cry from what it could be if you used a proper dry ale/wine/champagne yeast. It's called bread yeast for a reason.

correct, bread yeast is prison tier

>Making a yeast starter: First, make sure you understand what a yeast starter actually is. Putting your yeast in warm water for 10 minutes is not a starter. Starters take 24 hours at the minimum as well as a stir plate and an erlenmeyer flask. If you're using a proper dry yeast, (like saf-04 or ec-1118), making a starter will actually harm the yeast. Only make a starter with liquid yeast.

not always necessary, but it doesnt hurt.

>Using carboys: You know those blue plastic carboys you see used for water? Don't ever use those are homebrewing. Those are much cheaper plastic and are designed to breath oxygen in and out because oxygen is good with water but not with your fermenting beer/wine. Also, on every one of those blue carboys you'll see a date on the bottom and that's not necessarily the expiration date of the water, it's the date that they no longer can guarantee that BPA chemicals won't leak into the liquid.

full of shit. dont listen to this guy about this one. they are perfectly fine.

i have been brewing for over a decade, ask me questions instead.

>>435185

No, you're wrong. Ever notice how those blue carboys clearly have "For drinking water only - not be used with any other liquid" printed on the bottom of them?

Look into higher quality plastic carboys like Better Bottles.

>>435190
wrong again

stop making bullshit up. they are perfectly fine.

>>435171
>Using bread yeast: Don't ever do this. It has next to zero alcohol tolerance and the flavor will be a far cry from what it could be if you used a proper dry ale/wine/champagne yeast. It's called bread yeast for a reason.

Incorrect.

You can use Fleischmann's Active Dry bread yeast to replace Lalvin's EC-1118 champagne yeast. Any recipe tailored to EC-1118 can use it. Any recipe tailored specifically to Fleischmann's of course can use it too. It is unlike other bread yeasts, fyi. I've been able to attain 19%ABV on a number of occasions using Fleischmann's. Like all yeast variants, you really need to know your stuff if you want to have your brew excel. You can't simply make anything with Fleischmann's and start drinking it a week later. Like most brews, you need to age it for at least 1 year for a white, 2 years for a dark, and up to 10-20 years for pure black elderberry.

If you don't know how to use Fleischmann's properly or you swap it into a recipe not designed for EC-1118 then you will be altering the recipe and won't get the exact results you'd hoped for. Other bread yeasts, I cannot vouch for in the slightest and some can make horrific brews; from which most of the anti-bread yeast sentiment comes from.

>You know those blue plastic carboys you see used for water? Don't ever use those are homebrewing.

Agreed. However, only for the BPA, not specifically the oxygen. That is of little concern prior to aging. If you are trying to age your brew in plastic then you may have oxygen problems. During the primary fermentation stage oxygen infusion from migration through plastic won't matter. You will get far more oxygen into your brew when you rack it even when using CO2 or argon to help prevent it than will ever migrate through the plastic during primary fermentation.

>Anything else I can try to cover?

How about proper sanitation/sterilization methods and tools you should/shouldn't use if you can help it?

>>435194
...continued

Wooden spoons, vinyl/plastic racking tubes, reusing fruit bags, and plastic buckets/carboys. These can inadvertently be sources of contamination if they are not properly sanitized. Wooden spoons would need to be boiled for 10 minutes between brews, if you use them, though I highly recommend just using stainless steel spoons. Fruit bags need to be wash normally then boiled for 5 minutes to sanitize them. You can use a no-rise sanitizer with these if you wish. They can be sterilized in an autoclave/pressure cooker if you wish. vinyl/plastic tubing is normally best sanitized in a pot of no-rinse sanitizer for an extended amount of time. Plastic buckets/carboys all should have extended times of sanitization. For all vinyl/plastic equipment use water that is very hot, but not close to boiling as your sanitization medium. This helps get into any surface scratches.

These items can be used and can be sanitized properly, however, most have alternatives that are better suited to be sanitized or even sterilized. Use stainless steel and glass when possible. You can bake glassware at 350F/176C for 2.5 to 3.5 hours to sterilize it (make sure the glassware has cooled before opening the oven or it may shatter due to thermal shock.) Bleach can be used to sanitized and sterilize. To sterilized you need to let the items stand in bleach for 20 minutes or more. Sanitization only needs a cursory 2 minute wash over. Rinse the bleach off using boiled and cooled water.

>>435195
...continued

Don't rinse with water that has not been boiled. You are merely recontaminating your equipment. Always scrub your hands well prior to making your brews. Properly sanitization/sterilization is basically for consistency with your brewing, so that each identical batch you make will taste as close to each other as possible. Most contaminations are minor and are wiped out by the yeast's natural defenses during the initial fermentation. Racking and bottling is the most dangerous time for brew contamination. During these times the yeast is dead and/or dormant and can no longer defend against contaminations. Take extra care when you rack and bottle to prevent contamination.

>>435195
>all this bullshit

i love it when retards like yourself go on and on about sanatization. true its important, but you make it seem like you need to clean your shit hospital grade style

you dont. but if it makes you feel better, go right ahead. enjoy your wasted time, money and resources

>>435171
>24-hour starter

These additional hours depends on the yeast strain and you learn as you go. Many of the lighter yeasts for white wines take ages to properly activate while more vigorous strains like EC-1118 are so vigorous you can sprinkle them right on top of the must and away they go.

>>435185
>correct, bread yeast is prison tier

Incorrect. Prison brewing is "pruno" and a completely different type of fermentation, usually employing, though inadvertently, bacteria.

>full of shit. dont listen to this guy about this one. they are perfectly fine.

They are not. Certain plastics degrade and release chemicals more readily in an acidic environment starting as 5.5pH. Other plastics like those used for Better Bottles are good for primary fermentation. I don't recommend doing secondary fermentation or aging in them. Age in your bottles at least, or in glass/stainless steel containers if you really need the consistency during aging.

>>435192

Did you even read what I said? Please share a source that's not your misinformed ass to prove me wrong. Don't use blue plastic carboys for home brewing.

>>435194
>>435195
>>435196

So you're a type of person i mentioned in the op. One that tried to do research but didn't really understand the whole story.

Wooden spoons don't need to be boiled as long as you use a high quality cleanser like Easy Clean or One step. There is no such thing as a powdered sanitizer, they will always be liquid. Look into high quality brewing sanitizers like Star-san or Saniclean. The powdered stuff is for cleaning and you don't need to boil anything.

You are also kind of contradicting yourself. Yes, bleach CAN be used to sanitize but it has to sit for a long time, (like you mentioned), but bleach also requires a very thorough rinsing which contradicts your other statement about rinsing with water that's been boiled, (which was wrong). I thought we lived in America. you know, a first world country where our drinking water was sanitary? You can rinse with sanitized equipment with tap water and be perfectly fine.

>>435200
fuck off you dumb cunt, i said its prison tier, not it is prison yeast

>>435201
did you even read what you said? please fuck off and back up your claims

>>435200

Dry yeast can ALWAYS be sprinkled on top, nothing else is required. This is 2013 after all, I think we have labs that can make proper brewing yeasts in dry form at this point.

>>435211
this

so many dumb cunts ITT

while op is not a dumb cunt, he is retarded when it comes to carboys

>>435208
>I thought we lived in America. you know, a first world country where our drinking water was sanitary?
>You can rinse with sanitized equipment with tap water and be perfectly fine.

Incorrect. Tap water is merely safe for human consumption. It does not carry a guarantee for not contaminating your brew.

>Wooden spoons don't need to be boiled

Wood is porous. Regardless of how many times or how long you use a no-rinse sanitizer, it can not fully get into the pores of the wood unless the wood has been heated and pressurized. During the course of your brewing there is ample time for deeply set bacteria and wild yeasts to come out of the wood and into your brew. Fully boiling the wood prevents this from happening.

>>435211
Some brands recommend directly on their label stating you should make a starter and pitch the yeast. Not everyone makes wine after all.

>>435210

Why don't you get schooled by the manufacturers of carboys themselves?

http://www.better-bottle.com/faq.html

>Other types of plastics are not suitable for making fermentation carboys: 1) They are too permeable to oxygen, 2) They are not clear and colorless, 3) They scalp (release, pick up & transfer) flavors, 4) They stain, 5) They are porous and difficult to wash/sanitize, and 6) Some are made with substances, such as bisphenol-A (BPS) and ortho-phthalate plasticizers, that are considered toxic (see the Purity/Safety section under the Technical tab at the top of this page).

>>435214
>one company selling a specific product shit talks its competition so you buy their product

HAHAHAHAHHA get a load of this shit cunt

>>435214
This is why it pains me to see so many plastic buckets for starter kits. Though some of my best and award winning brews were made in plastic containers, I've moved fully to glass and stainless steel now since consistency is needed for my brewery.

Alas, these thing as fine for the small hobbyist.

>>435217
what pains me is dumb cunts like yourself shitting on plastic

i always do primary in plastic, and secondary in glass. its so much easier that way.

>>435214
This is why it pains me to see so many plastic buckets for starter kits. Though some of my best and award winning brews were made in plastic containers, I've moved fully to glass and stainless steel now since consistency is needed for my brewery.

Alas, these things are fine for the small hobbyist.

>>435213

I don't think you understand what making a starter actually means, so avoid using that term. What shitty dry yeasts are you using? Because no where have I found on a Saf yeast packet or a Lalvin packet to tell me to dehydrate the yeast. (probably because it doesn't require it)

DIfferent Anon here.

So someone point to the correct/tried and true information here in this thread I should add to the mac/diy/ver wiki.

At this point I am not sure who to trust.

http://editthis.info/macdiyvers/Main_Page wiki.

>>435223
dont trust the /ck/ tripfag

dont trust OP on his hate for plastic

>>435220
>>435223
I highly suggest you read this very informative link,

>6.5 Preparing Yeast and Yeast Starters
http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter6-5.html

>>435215

>ignoring the facts and responding with name calling

How old are you? Do you have any links backed by scientific research to prove me wrong or are you just a troll?

>>435220
My apologies, my copy/paste function failed me,

>Lalvin's "Importance of rehydrating yeast"
http://www.lalvinyeast.com/importance_rehydration.asp

>>435228
>facts

you mean opinions? thats all this thread is, peoples opinions on how to do things, shit cunt

>>435233

You obviously didn't read the link to Better Bottle's frequently asked questions, (FAQ). I understand, it probably had too many SAT words for you to understand

Anyone have any experience with Hard Lemonade?
I heard that the acidity can actually kill off many strains of yeast.
I'm skeptical though because isn't beer acidic? I know lemonade would be more so, but I thought the yeast would be hardier than that.
Any recommended types by the way? I was thinking of using cider yeast but I fear it would dull the taste and make it sweeter than I wanted

>>435504
commercially they just take malt liqour and add lemonade flavoring
unless you want limoncello

>>435171
I have used bread yeast in my wine with a very good result. It worked better then when i used wine yeast because of a higher alcohol content and better taste

>>435523
gross man

>>435520
I've never heard of limoncello before but it looks interesting.

I knew commercially they did that but I kind of just want to try it with straight lemonade almost like a cider but not sweet

>>435616
yeah I'd just go with limoncello honestly
if you make it yourself it can be a strong as apple pie
the recipe I know is stupid simple:
grate a bunch of spanish lemon peels
soak in liter of grain
boil three liters of water, add a bunch of sugar
let the sugar water cool, sieve grain into water
voila

>>435620
what kind of flavors will the grain give off?
and what type of grain?

Mostly I was just going to go with stupid simple lemon/water/sugar/yeast but this is insteresting.

>>435631
no no I mean grain alcohol
like
everclear or graves
or moonshine of course

>>435632
oh, God I'm dumb
I was so confused on what the point of the grain was.

Thanks for the recipe though

>>435633
no problem man

>>435620
oh i forgot, you should soak the lemon zest for at least 2 weeks
i think like a month

OP, you shouldn't give 'HARD MYTHBUSTERS ADVICE' on shit you're actually dead wrong about.

>Using bread yeast: Don't ever do this. It has next to zero alcohol tolerance and the flavor will be a far cry from what it could be if you used a proper dry ale/wine/champagne yeast. It's called bread yeast for a reason.

>Making a yeast starter: First, make sure you understand what a yeast starter actually is. Putting your yeast in warm water for 10 minutes is not a starter. Starters take 24 hours at the minimum as well as a stir plate and an erlenmeyer flask. If you're using a proper dry yeast, (like saf-04 or ec-1118), making a starter will actually harm the yeast. Only make a starter with liquid yeast.

Both of these, incorrect. Stop giving bad advice.

>>435640
>using bread yeast ever

ive never had a reason to use a yeast starter anyways so I have nothing to say on that subject

>>435641
I don't know about beer/wine, but bread yeast is actually superior for rum making IMO. I've done many side by side comparisons with bread yeast, ec1118, red star, nottnghams, safale, etc. and the bread yeast gave better flavors. I also like it better for certain whiskeys.

It also is MORE alcohol tolerant than a lot of beer or ale yeasts, which usually top out around 8% or so. Bread yeast can go up to 12% pretty easily.

>>435643
>12%
but turbo yeast can reach 25% easily...

>>435646
So? I said 'SOME' not all. EC1118 goes up to like 18%, beer yeasts like windsor or nottingham go like 8%. Bread yeast is 12%, pretty middle of the road, and VERY fucking far from 'no tolerance for alcohol'.

>>435504
Look up skeeter pee.

It's about 45 oz of Real Lemon, 10lbs of sugar, 6 gallons of water, and Lavlin 1118

>>435670
Holy shit that's a lot of sugar
That's what I'm looking for, just wanted to find a good yeast that can withstand it the acidity. Thanks!

>mfw this thread
>autist slapfight

>>435704
>Plastic is a death sentence!
>Glass faggots need to get the stick out of their ass!
>What the fuck, BREAD yeast?! Are you POOR or just DUMB?
>It works FINE you FAGGOT

question:
after you bottle the beer (assuming you're just using one of those jugs with a big rubber stop at the top) how long will it last before you open it again? can you store it for 6+ months?

>>435706
>bottling beer
>not using beer bottles
>not capping it

enjoy your flat beer

At what point in the process do you split the beer atom to make the bubbles?

>>435728
bottling

>>435192
dumbass. plastic blue carboys aren't meant for home brew purposes. either supply source for your theory or stop trolling.

Newbie here.
I wanted to get into making my own beer.
The local Bevmo has "Beer Kits" on sale for $40 or $50.I wish I knew more about it, but I would assume it has the basic things I'd need to get started with making my own beer.

Would you guys suggest I buy one of those as a "testing the water" to homebrewing? or should I just ask for a list of things I should look for at my local home depot and make what's needed?

>>435651
>Bread yeast is 12%

This depends on the brand you use. 12% to 19% normally. With as many variations in flavor notes too.

>>435728
During bottling. The process is called "priming".

http://www.howtobrew.com/section1/chapter11.html

>>435766
Take a look at the kits with the most equipment in them. Then just look around your house then the local stores for the same things. Some pots for boiling water, 5 gallon buckets and tubing is usually all you really need. If you want it a bit better, get cheap stainless steel stock pots from a dollar store. You can get copper tubing to make a wort chiller if you want to, that can hook up to your sink faucet.

>>435766
if it's a Mr Beer kit then personally I'd stay away from it

While you can make beer, if you have any lasting interest and desire to make other things you'll just end up buying a different setup anyway.
Also, look into a book called "The Complete Joy of Homebrewing" by Charlie Papazian. I'm reading through it (New to homebrew myself outside of a few gallons of cider) but it's been teaching me a lot

Quick question. I'm fermenting 4 gallons of mead right now. Week 7 will be this Monday. Its slowed down a lot but its still bubbling. Most of the yeast has died and sunk to the bottom. Its still dark but not nearly as cloudy. Should I give it one more week?

>>436002
Also the recipe I'm using calls for 2 months of fermenting which is why I'm asking.

>>435792

a lot of the issue here is the generalization of the term "bread yeast", not all strains are identical even if they are all the same genus and species (well, at least in terms of ale yeasts, its all saccharomyces cerevisiae in the end), many subspecies/brands aren't even remotely similar in their tolerances

I've tried a great many types in my attempts to make as much for as little

Red Star has given me terrible results often stalling out at <8% so I gave up attempting to use them

Fleischmann's active dry in the jar has done better usually getting me to about 15%, quick rush to 6% and a slow climb past 6%, lots of trub so really needs racking to a secondary (or tertiary sometimes)
Skip the rest of the Fleischmann's family, classic active dry or forget it

King Arthur's has usually done well but I think they recently changed strains, lot more vigorous but much lower tolerance, new one has lots of banana flavors in the beer, very odd.

Rossmoor is an odd one, seems to take forever to get to 5% then almost overnight goes insanely active and pushes up past 8%.
I can only ever get it from my local bakery in bulk "can I borrow a cup of yeast" fashion.

Oetker I swear is just some commercial beer yeast sold in a package for baking, the stuff is hard to find stateside but I've always gotten good attenuation out of it, easily over 12%, if I fed the batch I probably could have gotten it over 20%.

wtf

>>436003
>>436002
Follow the recipe.

>>436063
>Skip the rest of the Fleischmann's family, classic active dry or forget it

Seconding this. Fleischmann's Active Dry or no other bread yeast really. It's like a tank and has never failed me. I use it to restart failed brews where the brewing yeast stalled or wouldn't work properly.

>new one has lots of banana flavors in the beer

Warmth of the brew during fermentation can cause that. the warmer it is the more fruity it will become. Keep it around 72F if you can. A general rule of thumb is if you are comfortable with the temperature, the top-fermenting yest will be too.

>Red Star...stalling

I've had trouble with it too. It seems storage methods are to blame more than anything else. So, it can be the time of year you buy it and how it has been stored prior to you buying it. Sometimes it is great and other times 6 packets won't work, all of this with the same recipes.

>>435235
Here's a man who knows what he's talking about. Good for you!

Guys like us know that it's important to buy quality products, like Monster cables.

OP has sound advice. The problem is that this is 4chan. Grampa's Prohibition Era techniques, prison potato hooch, rebel teen closet beer, and sheer idiocy are mixed in with well meaning but misinformed posters. There is no way a novice can filter good data from here. 1 in 10 posters are good brewers and have sensible advice.
My advice: go somewhere else, this is 4CHAN!
Go to a reputable website, get the Papazian book, Randy Mosher book, Dave Miller book, or all three. Find a local '2 guys homebrew' shop and make friends. They usually will happily talk on the phone for an hour if you order from them.
This is 4chan, the place where people post pictures of their dicks.
This is 4chanthisis4chanthisisetc

it would be a shame for this thread to die

does anyone have any experience fermenting in those plastic buckets with a grommeted hole for the airlock in the lid?

>>438324
Those small holes are reason enough to switch to large bung carboys and large diameter blow off tubes.

>>438793

whoever did that brew is a shithead, way overfilled the bucket, and the point isn't made considering its using the same sized trap in both cases, all that was done in the carboy was left more headroom

I used buckets for like 10 years before I got my conical, they work fine just don't be a moron and put 6 gallons in a bucket designed for 5

>>438795
Not really. Using buckets at all means you are a fucking moronic shithead.

>>438809

so the same size trap magically works on the carboy but not the bucket JUST because its a carboy? has NOTHING to do with the head space? fucktard

>>438876
Not when it comes to super foamy banana wine or mead. You can get 3 feet of foam sometimes with that stuff. A blow off tube is mandatory.

>>438908

and I'd agree, IF the carboy HAD a blowoff, but in that case you may as well just stick a blowoff in the bucket

point being the example made is terrible, the carboy in question is no better than the bucket in question simply because its a carboy, its just better USED, brewer could have gotten just as good of results from the bucket had they not put 6 lbs of shit in a 5 lb bag

>>438793
Wouldn't this have all been avoided if he just used a blow off tube?

I don't have much experience with them, but I agree with the other poster

>>438974
You don't need a blow off tube on the carboy after the first stage though.

The reason plastic buckets are shit is because of leeching. Enjoy your plasticizers.

>>439172

leaching?
let me guess you think aluminium cans cause Alzheimer's too?

OP buckets are just fine until you can get a decent rig together, but no need to blow your wad on a giant glass bottle, save up for a stainless or get some used corny kegs and a conversion set

>>439172
Don't you only get a leaching problem when you add hot liquids to plastics?

>>439252
The acidity of the brew also does it. Do some googling.

>>439212
Soda cans are now lined with a material to prevent aluminum leeching.

>>439255
ah, gotcha, forgot about that

New to homebrew in general and I'm just getting my facts straight

>>439255
So i just did my research and so far all i've found is that you're safe if you use food grade plastic under a certain temp. Thoughts?

>>439254
yeah, a PLASTIC material

Ask any question on the internet and you will get a as many answers as there are users, and twice that many pointless arguments.

John Palmer's How To Brew is available to read online, so you are curious about brewing or just have a question you have no excuse not to just read a god damn book. http://www.howtobrew.com/intro.html

>>439260
Don't google homebrewing info, there's not much on that really. Instead try, "plastic leeching" and go from there,

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3222987/

That isn't the only thing you can find with general google results. Also try google scholar for more concise results.

>>439361
Some of the posters ITT have real clout, but most people here in /diy/ seem to be people new to 4chan and only coming here in the past 1-2 years. If you can find it, look up the Homebrewmen archives in /rs/. I think the biggest was the Tepache brewing archive. It contains massive amounts of researched materials, /ck/ Homebrewmen anecdotals, and tons of cool stuff and 100s of recipes.

Yeast starter does not take 24 hours. I work in a factory producing 3million litres of cider per week, and we take 20 minutes to make our yeast starter. I follow the same process at home and it works fine.

>>439369
Not all yeasts are the same.

>>439369
>>439401
A lot of yeast used for cider becomes active extremely quickly. My last cider batch used a dry red star yeast and that was fizzing and foaming like it was carbonated in less than an hour.

For most starters I just make them the night before brewing, though I have had a couple that needed a day and a half before i was satisfied with the activity.

>>439435
One reason to make a starter and pitch it, is so that the yeast will be fully healthy and fully ready to defend against the other microbes/wild yeasts in the brew. You can end up stressing the yeast by pitching it too early, which can lead to off flavors and inconsistency. If for whatever reason it is weakened because of this then it may not be able to defend against infections or microbes/wild yeasts already in the brew.

This is why some recipes and some yeast strain manufacturers recommend making a starter and pitching it.

Not all yeasts are the same.