/diy/ - Do It Yourself

>>2718503
dilate

>>2718503
>yourpicrel
Timber framing?

This is somethin. I think we need Red Foreman to call someone a dumbass

>>2718503
That's called stick frame. Retard

>>2718503
slither back to the mud hut you crawled out of

For me its an H Frame Quonset Hut.

Hijacking this retarded thread. I'm currently saving up to build a home, thinking about hiring a contractor for a concrete footing and doing a pole barn style since it seems easier to /diy/. Any advice for a tradie-in-progress?

>>2718744
depending on size you may want to look at a pre-fab kit, actual timber frames are a ton of work
you will also need a crane or other machine that is capable of lifting several thousand pounds very high
the more guys you have the less you spend on crane / machine time while assembling

>>2718503
Timber framing is the most based way to build
Stuck framing(your pic) is cost effective and allows people to own large homes that, when done properly, will last for generations

>>2718744
Depends a lot on the specific design, but generally I wouldn't call pole-barn 'easier'. It can be fast and economical, but unless you're building something tiny you'll have more need for heavy equipment for the columns and trusses. And if you go the typical route of steel panel exterior, you're going to need help. Handling them by yourself can be a real bitch, and far, far more likely to damage them.

>>2718744
Post frame**** is what you're talking about
Pole barns were built with actual poles in the ground
I would have a foundation guy pour a footing of appropriate depth for your area and frame on top of the foundation wall
Menards will sell you everything you need
You'll need to rent a lift for standing up the sections and probably a man lift to get your purlins on but post frame is, by far, the cheapest way to build with a lot of positives like increased insulating capacity and ease of wiring and plumbing

>>2718503
this post is suspiciously demoralizing
which jew faction are you from that wants to end the forestry industry?
the stupid one that insists pouring concrete is somehow more green than sequestering co2 in peoples' walls?
the stupid one that insists that private home ownership has to be ended and the populations moved to urban hives?
the stupid one that just wants to fuck with people and make the world burn?
the stupid one that owns a brick factory?

>>2718503
Stick framing is pretty much fine, good against earthquakes, lasts a good while if done right and maintained well. I'd rather live in that than in a brick-only house like they make them in P*land, fuck that brittle shit, needs at least 4 rc pillars, 1 on each corner.
t. lives in reinforced concrete+brick in country where 99% of objects from skyscrapers to sheds are built that way

>>2718870
Poland and Germany don't have quakes so we get away without RC-Columns, does not pose a inbuilt heat bridge when using perlite filled clay bricks.

so you can build a well insulated house without using additional plastic insulation PS/PUR.

Whats the problem? Its cheapest, easiest and most accessible construction for /diy/

>>2718630
Yo, I can make 800 hamburgers out of one deer? Hold on, I need to go visit /k/ real quick

>>2718883
>Poland and Germany don't have quakes so we get away without RC-Columns
It will always seem sketchy as fuck to me. I would still rather live in stick frame any fucking day of the week.

>>2718870
You obviously don't live where tornadoes exist, cause the last place I'd want to be in a tornado is a matchstick house

>>2718970
>buried alive in bricks is better than your house blowing away

>>2718503
Proper mortise and tenon timber framing is not the same as stick builds wrapped in wood chips and glue.

The fastest tornado ever measured was 302 mph.
That's only 1.1 tons of wind force per m2.
Imagine building a house so weak it can't withstand that.

There are areas here where we spec roofs for 2-3x that in snow load. Conventional timer framed roof.
With very mild adaptations, a house like that would be completely unimpressed by any tornado or earthquake.

>>2718970
>You obviously don't live where tornadoes exist
Yes indeed, there are no tornadoes in the balkans.
>cause the last place I'd want to be in a tornado is a matchstick house
You do you bro. I guess the balkanhut with an adequate foundation would have its roof tiles blown off but otherwise it would be undamaged.
You can build with the balkan method to resist 8.5 strength earthquakes if that means anything.
>>2719043
>With very mild adaptations, a house like that would be completely unimpressed by any tornado or earthquake.
Are you for fucking real? Why the fuck don't they do it then? Never underestimate americanism.

>>2718503
Mass timber?

>>2719052
>this same butthurt serb in every thread

>>2719111
>butthurt
Not at all though, I literally defended stick framing. It's done here sometimes, as prefab panels that are assembled into a house on site. The biggest issue I see is that it needs more maintenance than our usual methods. If the other anon is right and you can make a stick framed house that can shrug off tornadoes WHY DO YOU NOT DO IT EVER? It would shut the krauts up for once, I fucking hate those shit smelling faggots so much it's unreal.

>>2718970
unless your house is 100% reinforced concrete, a direct hit from a tornado is going to fuck it up.

>>2718503
Isn't that stick/balloon framing in the pic? Timber framing is the mortise and tenon style half-timber building isn't it?

>>2718630
Metric is french.

>>2718503
Ah yes. Americans and their cardboard boxes.

>>2718751
I was thinking single floor with a root cellar, four beds two baths, main focus is the kitchen, both my partner and I cook a lot. Side extension 2-3 car garage for a workshop, because I work on my car and do chemistry.
>>2718788
The primary appeal to me is how straightforward it is to design and get the skeleton together (trusses aside), it just jives with my brain better, not necessarily objectively better. Additionally, being able to adjust the floor plan ad-hoc seems more doable with post frame, which pleases my ADD brain.
I do appreciate the warnings though, helps me think things through fully. Got any resources for stick or timber framing? Most likely it'll be me and 2-3 other people max helping me build, so using some machinery is not necessarily a given, but somewhat assumed.
>>2718790
One thing I haven't seen talked about much is attics. With post frames is the attic an afterthought due to trusses, or is it feasible to have maintenance zones up there?
Also, I'm sure it's a little retarded, but concrete footing is just outside my current skill set. Is it possible to do a post frame home on a CMU foundation? The only thing I can't think my way around is securing the post brackets adequately.

there's timber framing, stick framing, post framing. What else is there?

>>2718958
they are allegedly only ~35% burgerworthy, but that's still actually a decent way to size up game

>>2719316
> partner

Your business partner?

>>2719347
No my wife. But she's my favorite deputy.

>>2719052
>no tornadoes in the balkans
Maybe but severe storms still kill you.

>>2718630
god forbid we make useful comparisons the average person can understand

>>2718503
My only problem with timber farming is that natural forest being destroyed. I miss hunting/playing in old forests were there wasn't much undergrowth. Timber land is usually nothing but thick briar patches.

>>2719317
stone stacking

>>2719317
city slickin

>>2719452
Most commercial lumber is cut from farmed trees. At least for North America.

>>2719452
>I miss hunting/playing in old forests were there wasn't much undergrowth
you miss the 1880s?

>>2718503
At least post timber framing
t. framer

>>2718630
>>2719451
exactly. the metric system is garbage because not only is 10 not divisible by 3 or 4, it's not immediately useful to human beings in the same way that old systems of measurement were. the metric system is for robots. celsius in particular is very retarded.

>>2719322
is that figure just the amount of meat on the deer which isn't good for anything other than getting ground up? i'm sure more than 35% of a deer is edible meat, be it organ meat, steaks, or ground meat.

>>2719439
>killing at least five people in Croatia, Bosnia, and Slovenia
And that was their last five people too

>>2718958
a car would suffice

>>2719316
if it's only a single floor it won't be that bad, with some ropes and rigging you can move big pieces pretty easily.

here's how I secure posts at the bottom, which passes code for strength and uplift in my area.
>1/4" 6" x 6" steel plate with a 3" x 6" tab welded in the center, and bolt holes near the corners
>chainsaw a slot into the post and drill shallow relief holes for the bolt heads / nuts
>send 4x 5" long 3/8" diameter simpson concrete bolts that have the flaring base at the bottom thru the plate into concrete
>drop the post onto the tab
>send a 1/4" diameter screw horizontally thru the post and tab (you'll need to drill this so that the screw goes thru)

you can also buy fancy pre-made powder coated plate kits, but any idiot with a welder and some 1/4 plate stock can make these.
they're almost invisible and it just looks like the post is floating a tiny bit above the ground

>>2719017
That method of building hasn’t been used in 50 years for good reason, brainlet.

>>2720307
It is in Japan and Korea. Glulam is becoming more popular in the west too

Other than cost how the fuck is match stick and cardboard better?

>>2718958
you can get something like 60+ pounds of meat off an adult deer.. that's a lot of burgers

>>2719451
>useful comparisons the average person can understand
of course amerifats know by heart how much weight is in 800 burgers

>>2718503
yes they have

>>2720330
They use straps/nail plates/bracing plywood on pre made stick frames so notched framing (which is labour intensive) is now obsolete in the west. In Australia 95% of new housing uses this fast and economical methodology. T carpenter

>>2718744
Stick framing is much easier to DIY.

>>2718993
Are you retarded? In both situations, you SHOULD have driven away, so you wouldn't be buried alive. Let's assume you didn't get away from the tornado, you're dead in either circumstance nigga.

anyone can build a house that simple resist, but not all can build one that barely resist. Stick framing structure engineering seems appealing for someone who just wants to build bigger with less money and easier diy

What are some good resources?

>>2720805
laugh all you want, its pretty easy to wrap my head around the amount of burgers one person eats in a year

>>2720954
>other than cost
>labor intensive
Yes we know, but you didn't answer his question. I will build log cabins and everyone can suck my dick
t. also carpenter

>>2720330
Everything else that a house needs is designed with 2"x lumber in mind
you'll need tons of custom bits, SIPs, specialized contractors who know how to their thing around timber frames, etc
you'll also end up framing in a bunch of studs for doors, windows, blocking etc at which point you may as well have stick framed it.
even ignoring the cost of all that it can be way harder to find everything you need unless you just buy a kit

It's also much easier to modify than a timber frame. Ignoring cost is retarded, if you could do that we'd all live in titanium alloy houses because "durr it's stronger"
t. actual timber framer

>>2721753

Do you have any good books on how to timber frame? I think there's a beautiful value to your art (all kinds of carpentry desu) and I also want to learn how to do it. I assume you can stick frame internal walls and stuff, once you have the main structure set up?

>>2719451
>it's 800 25oz burgers at one store
>4oz everywhere else
So fucking useful.

>>2722071
you serve me a 4oz burger im legally killing you in self defense

>>2722085
Four ounces is the standard patty size for fast food burgers like Burger King's Whopper and McDonald's Quarter Pounder (hint).

>>2718970
>muh tornados

Even in the worst areas of tornado valley, the ODDS that a Tornado is ever going to hit YOUR HOUSE are so miniscule as not to even be worthy of consideration.

And if it really, truly, concerns you then you get a homeowners insurance plan that will cover tornadoes and if your house is destroyed you can get a brand new house built exactly how you want it.

>>2722018
it definitely is beautiful and neat, just expensive and kind of time consuming
check out the list at https://timberframehq.com/books/

timber frame houses usually have very few partition walls, but yeah you basically just toenail 2x4's into the frame where you need them.
you can see in pic related a large amount of space is left open, and one side (or one L shape) walled in.

>>2719439
>at least five people in Croatia, Bosnia and Slovenia
Out of 10 million people, FIVE died? Probably all killed by trees that were uprooted, not from structural collapses, I don't think that even happened. 2 cranes fell over here, no one died.
>20/07/2023
Yeah man that shit was crazy, the fucking sky went solid brown for 5 seconds. I saw some videos of roofs being blown off and insulations falling off, but that's it.

>>2718503
My dog kennel is built stronger than that

>>2722420

>>2722420
Does your dog hate breathing?

>>2722456
Ever heard of vents?

>>2723033
Just that one tiny shit in the front?

>>2721753
Timber Frame+SIP wall panels+radiant heat+metal roofing is the best way to build a solid, modern home that is well insulated and wont fall apart in 50 years.

>>2723033
bruh, you leave your doggie in there in the summer he will fucking die

>>2723033
forgot i wasnt in the abomination thread for a minute

>>2723066
And two in the back
>>2723218
It's for sleeping in. You know, at night, after sun goes down

>>2723262
Lmao liar you posted the back>>2722420

>>2723267
>holes for vents cannot possibly be cut in timber
Was you dad a tard too?

>>2723269
>i cut the holes after bro i swear
>im not a dog suffocating retard u r

>>2723275
>doubles down on the derp
Inter-generational retard confirmed

>>2723318
Post the vent holes

>>2723214
It definitely is a great choice, but every single step of the build is more complicated and expensive than stick framing.
Don't get me wrong, I love timber framing but it is definitely not an option for the average home buyer / builder.

I do wish more people would do metal roofs though. We have to talk clients out of doing shingles a lot because it matches their house / the neighbors and HOA rules are pure crabs in a bucket mentality, even though metal is so much better and comes in every color / finish

>>2719317
squirrel smashing

>>2723434

Copper roofs literally last forever, and they turn from a beautiful copper color to an invincible and wise green patina. Shingles meanwhile get fucked by heavy wind

>>2718503
Shit literally grows on tree, why wouldn't you want to use it???

>>2718630
We are using mostly British Imperial, this shit is retarded.

>>2724109
Depending on location, a copper roof might not last through the night. Copper gutters definitely don't.

>>2724170
>Depending on location, a copper roof might not last through the night. Copper gutters definitely don't.

Copper roofs are rare in my area; the only one I ever saw was on the roof of a house owned by the owner of a million dollar roofing company. That doesn't disprove your comment, but the Statue of Liberty sorta does. What do you mean, "might not last through one night"?

>>2719452
That forest you're describing exists all over Appalachia. It only takes ~40 or so years to go from clear cut to tall oak trees with little undergrowth.

>>2720307
Because it requires skilled carpenters and whole timbers - aka "more expensive".
Stick framing is meant to be within the ability of your average cheap unskilled labor.

>>2724188
It takes much longer for the forest to recover than just the trees growing back. It takes a couple hundred years, at least, for everything else to recover. The undergrowth returning, the underground mycellium network to regrow, the local fauna to return, etc.

>>2720023
If you'd switch your entire numeric system to base 12 then you might have a point. As it stands you're just using an obtusely retarded mishmash of units that have no intrinsic properties not share with other random-ass units. The only difference is that you're used to yours.

>>2718970
tornadoes absolutely delete everything they touch. a stone house isn't safe either. all you can do is get away from it, or go underground.

>>2723033
sorry fella but if your dog fits in there, you might be gay

>>2722018
I talked to an old timber framer at handworks and he recommended Jack Sobon. Haven't gotten around to it so I can't speak to it personally. I read "learn to timber frame" by will beemer and think it's solid, if a bit shallow. And I'm reading Timber framing fundamentals" by the timber framers guild and it has some interesting stuff, but couldn't teach you to timber frame by itself.
Both the books I mentioned are available at the timber framers guild website. Theres some good youtube channels as well, might post them later

>>2724198
They're not autistically aligned to the number 12 but they are useful to humans without having to think intensely about it.
>0F is as cold as it gets in really cold places, 100F is as hot as it gets in really hot places. It's calibrated to the comfortable range of temperatures for humans.
>Celsius is calibrated to the temperature of water, the only benefit of which is that it makes it easier to remember the boiling and freezing point of water. If you're a human, it's retarded because the comfortable air temperature range for humans is squashed into half the degrees. 0F is -18 and 100F is 38, which is stupid and arbitrary because those are the numbers which are actually important to me as a human.
>1 foot divides into 12 inches which makes it great for dividing measurements. An inch is also the perfect size of a measurement to measure human things, like height. One inch is about the smallest unit of variability in human height that's meaningful. If you're 5'11.5 no one will care if you call yourself 6'0. There's also the advantage in being able to express height in feet + inches, because the cutoffs for each full foot of height provide the right benchmarks for human height. 1' to 2' is a baby. 3' is a 2 year old. 4' is a 7 year old. 5' is a 13 year old, and so on.
>Meters are the worst fucking measurement for human height because the units are either too small, or too big and require decimal points. Centimeters is a retarded measurement for human height because a centimeter is too fucking small. It's 40% the height of an inch. It makes no sense to say, "I'm 180 pencil widths tall." And decimeters or full meters are even worse, because they're too big to represent the correct level of detail in height. And because everything is based on multiples of 10, you can't abbreviate heights in celsius the way you can with the US customary system. The only thing it's good for is measuring dick size. Metric is a dick-based measuring system.
cont

>>2724198
>>2724453
>A mile is how far you can walk in 20 minutes. It's how far you can drive in a minute on the highway, or 2-3 minutes on residential roads. It's how far you can bike in 8-10 minutes. It's 1/3 of a league.
>Kilometers may be the least egregious metric measurement, probably because the retardedness of a meter evens out after 1000 of them. Just remember that 1 kilometer is 4.82 leagues, and you can do all the other calculations in your head :)
>100 pounds is a very light man. 150 pounds is a medium man. 200+ pounds is an overweight man.
>Kilograms are too big to represent human weight, or the weight of things that humans carry. The only thing the metric system of weight/mass is good for is drugs, even though they are used interchangeably with ounces and pounds. Metric is a semi-drug-based measurement system.
>1 gallon is how much water you need to drink in a day. Gallons are very nicely and autistically divided. 4 quarts, or 8 pints, or 16 cups, or 128 fluid ounces equals a gallon.
>3.7 liters is how much water you need to drink in a day. 10 deciliters, or 100 centileters, or 1000 milliliters, equals a liter. If something is sufficiently smaller than a liter, there's no good way to measure it because again, the smaller measurements are all based on 10s and will either be too small or too big.

>>2724205
Possibly. Check out the interior. Sheepskin, with a foam mattress below

>>2724541
Post the vent holes

>>2724541
vent the post holes

>>2724541
that dog's living better than I do lmao

>>2724453
> 0°C is when the roads become slippery, under 5C i wear a hat, 10C is when i start wearing gloves outside, 15C is when I don't zip up my jacket and 20C is when i start going out without a jacket, 22 is t-shirt weather and anything above 25 is to hot for me anyways. i dont need any more precise definition for weather, could have been 50 divisions between freezing and boiling and it would have been preciese enough. having temperature divided up further is useless, just add a decimal point.
> 0C is 32, and 100C is 212. 32 and 212 are arbitrary numbers with no discernable relation to one another
> meters are perfect for measuring humans, a child is 1m, a normal male is 1m80, a tall man is 1m90 and a short one is 1m70. we have clothing sizes that go per cm, imagine havin all clothing sizes in 0.4in increments. thats why most amerimutts wear baggy or strechy clothes because having any understandable sizes require whole numbers
a pencil is 7mm wide, or just over a quarter inch.
> 1km is what you walk in 12 minutes, 5km in an hour
> 100km is what you drive in an hour on the freeway (where i live), 30km in residential, and 50, 70 and 80 in the other roads.
> 20 to 25km/h is what you ride on a bike
> my car does 10km on 1L of petrol, in american units that would be the arbitrary 23,5mi/gal
> for an adult, (your length in cm )-100 is your ideal weight in kg. (works for anyone taller than 140 cm).
im 186 cm and my ideal weight would be 86kg, my wife is 154cm and she weighs 54kg
> 1 Liter weighs 1 kg and is 10x10x10cm of water.
> drinking a gallon of water (3,7l) is only required if youre 185kg, as the actual amount of water one adult needs to drink is (body weight in kg)/50=(liters of water to be consumed). im 95kg and drink just under 2l of water each day.
> a liter divides up nicely in 10dl, 100cl (=cc=cm3) and 1000ml, as do all other things in our system.
cont.

>>2724678
>>2724454
>>2724453
> we don't need to remember "five tomatoes" to know our km divides up by 1000.
1750, 12, 3, 16 are all uncohesive numbers used to divide measurements. also, 14 pound to a stone? 2205 to make a ton? 1/16 make an ounce, which is not the weight of a fluid ounce of water...
> the US uses 2 kinds of pints, then there's the Imperial pint as well, and the Belgian pint (250ml = 1/4th liter)
> how many pounds do a cubic yard of water weigh?

cheers!

>>2724592
What a weird thing to obsess over. I imagine you sitting on your front porch in a rocking chair muttering about vent holes

>>2718924
>Whats the problem? Its cheapest, easiest and most accessible construction for /diy/
And then you combine it with a concrete slab. No accessibility, no repairability. Pier and beam is the way, try fixing a cracked slab with a couple screw jacks.

>>2724657
Maybe eating better too. Look at the dimensions of this thing

>>2724838
you should give less food to that dog. being fat is bad for them, just like us. if it stays fat until it's old, it will feel pain every time it walks. this is your responsibility to take better care of it.

>>2724846
I know m8. I have said similar things to my wife for 7 years now, and she just keeps on shoving treats down his throat. Have you ever tried reasoning with a female?

>>2724860
use emotional reasoning. tell her that it will make the dog be in constant pain if she doesn't stop

>>2724200
Yes it is retard wind can't move stones

>>2724806
Why wont you post them?

>>2724909
It's fun watching you sperge out over something so random. You have seen the front vent, yet somehow you have convinced yourself that there are none in the rear. It's comically bizarre

>>2724910
Whats comically bizarre is how proud you are of your morbidly obese dog and its hideous homemade torture sauna
Embarrassed 4 u tbqf

>>2724925
Imagine having a dog kennel living rent-free in your head. This is some weapons-grade autism right here. TOP KEK. WHERE ARE THE VENTS POST THE VENTS REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>2724927
Don't flatter yourself, Im just here for the (You)s

>>2724929
>admitting that you're an attention whore
Post tits.

Tits for vents.
Quid pro quo Clarice

>>2724932
>she says while attention whoring for the 4th day straight

>>2724861
He doesn't look too fat in this pic, r-right?

>>2724945
We are still awaiting the bosoms. Please present them, madam. Then the precious vents will be disclosed

>>2724945

>>2724678
>> 0°C is when the roads become slippery, under 5C i wear a hat, 10C is when i start wearing gloves outside, 15C is when I don't zip up my jacket and 20C is when i start going out without a jacket, 22 is t-shirt weather and anything above 25 is to hot for me anyways. i dont need any more precise definition for weather, could have been 50 divisions between freezing and boiling and it would have been preciese enough. having temperature divided up further is useless, just add a decimal point.
You can do this with any measurement system. If we used kelvin we could say that at 273K the roads get slippery, under 278K is hat weather, etc. The difference is that F has units that make sense for humans because the normal temperature range goes from 0 to 100.
>> meters are perfect for measuring humans, a child is 1m, a normal male is 1m80, a tall man is 1m90 and a short one is 1m70.
I can tell this whole post is going to be "actually my system is better" followed by writing each incremented measurement that makes sense in US customary, but converted to metric.
>> 1 Liter weighs 1 kg and is 10x10x10cm of water.
Metric is a water-based measurement system.
>>2724698
>> we don't need to remember "five tomatoes" to know our km divides up by 1000.
I would rather remember a 2 word mnemonic than have units that are calibrated to the number 10 and not to the needs of human beings.
>also, 14 pound to a stone?
Have never heard anyone outside of Europe use "stone" as a measurement.
>2205 to make a ton?
Picrel. Americans use 2000 to make a ton. Britons use 2240 pounds to a ton.
>1/16 make an ounce, which is not the weight of a fluid ounce of water...
Your brain is not going to break because you have to remember that ounces and fluid ounces are different.
> how many pounds do a cubic yard of water weigh?
I know you think this is a gotcha but it's not. Your system is based on water so it's easy to estimate the weight of water based on volume. That's all it's good for.

>>2722132
That's something a tornado would write.

>>2718503
>Timber framing and its consequences have been disastrous for the human race
This isn't even remotely true but I wouldn't expect a 16 year old to understand why

>>2724182
Tweakers anon. Tweakers.

>>2722018
>>2724210
Yep. I highly recommend them. The older book is now instructional, the newer book is more about the history, tradition, and philosophy about why you'd timeframe in the modern age. That Beemer book is more of a step by step introduction for a specific design. They work well together. It's my dream to timber frame my house. So far I haven't gotten never far. I just hewed and rived a set of beams and joined it into a timber frame arbor for my brother's wedding. Property is unfortunately expensive but I'm saving a bunch of money for when the right land pops up.

>>2725524
Meant to post this pic lol

>>2719451
Because the average person has often seen 800 hamburgers look like.

>>2724678
thats dumb, if its been a hot summer and all of a sudden its 50F, its going to feel cold as fuck. conversely, it its been -1F, and then its 50F, thats going to be tshirt and shorts weather.

F simply has a higher resolution than C, so F is better

>>2725768
>F simply has a higher resolution
Irrelevant for normal use. For precision use, C has decimals.

>be me
>age 12
>overly loud to compensate for being misunderstood at home
>thinks they’re the sh*t
>cares an abnormal amount because wishes he could get the same back
>gets bullied
>age 18
>quiet, reserved, observant
>wants to figure out why everyone is the way they are
>”but why” “what if” “did you know”
>witnessed parents marriage dissolve before his eyes
>massive fear of love so never forms healthy attachments because letting people in means being seen and nobody needs to see the mess under the flesh
>self-destructive saviour complex
>age 22
>therapist
>persistent crippling fear of dying alone
>helps everyone to make up for how nobody helped him
>

>>2725526

Hey anon, or to any other knowledgeable anons, are there any good engineering books/computer programs to design a house and get the weight right? Highly interested in experimenting with some stuff to design a small shed for myself before I go bigger

>>2725966
No idea about programs, but as someone who's been a carpenter for 10 years and works on both homes and big industrial buildings, when in doubt, overbuild. Find a copy of your local framing code (doesn't have to be current) and just more or less go off of that. Framing doesn't change much over the years

>>2718630
the british never created the metric system, they created imperial units (aka. british imperial) which is used in america

>>2718744
Consider the cost of trusses carefully, you may find that time/ money its cheaper to do your slab/ pole then get a crane to drop in the trusses.

Some people do this clever system where they use a slab, lay pole, then join the poles with high tension steel cable. Because then you're just looking at framing internal walls, dry boarding, insulating, cladding. The mc' house.

>>2724453
>0F is as cold as it gets in really cold places, 100F is as hot as it gets in really hot places.
lmao

>>2725768
yeah and a cm has a higher resolution than an inch but i guess that's "totally different". please also explain how 0°F makes more sense than 0°C while you're at it without bringing up subjective garbage

>>2724947
I can stir fried and feed 5-7 people with it

>>2718968
these EU houses easily outlive 3+ generations of people, theres no need to

>>2724698
>how many pounds do a cubic yard of water weigh?
a real gallon actually holds 10 pounds of water but how many real gallons there are in a cubic yard, dunno

>>2725255
>I know you think this is a gotcha but it's not. Your system is based on water so it's easy to estimate the weight of water based on volume. That's all it's good for.
as it happens water is quite literally everywhere, even the human body is 70% water but in your case it's probably lard
i also hereby invite you to look up the definition of a gallon and copy paste it here so i can laugh at you even more

>>2728369
Why? New house is built to highest energy efficiency standards and comfort requirments.
Old house is just piece of shit with leaks from everywhere, crooked walls, no insulation and possibly unsafe wiring.
And if we're talking demolishing buildings every 100 years, why make them out of brick or concrete which are pain in the ass to demolish?

>>2728347
fahrenheit and celcius virgins need to step aside to make room for rankinechads
Tell me you don't love more resolution on your temperature scale

>>2718503

>>2728395
Exactly this
Ive lived in buildings from my great great great grandparent's time
Theyre well built and often very beautiful but theyre an expensive pain in the ass to live in
Ill take my cozy little properly insulated stick frame with big windows, easily accessible roof and plumbing, and electrical outlets at least every 4 meters tyvm

>>2728369
>outlive 3+ generations of people
So do wood houses, but this is a stupid argument anyways. It's like you don't even own a home or have kids of your own to say such stupid shit.

People's kids aren't going to wait until their parents die to get a home, that's fucking retarded. They'll be old as shit themselves by then in most cases and with their own kids.
They'll have their own by then. and either sell the inherited one with their siblings and split the money, or buy each other out for the property.

>>2728372
>look up the definition of a gallon and copy paste it here
for some reason this question always goes unanswered. anyone?

>>2728400
>rankine
lel, it's like someone copied Kelvin's homework but made a spin on it so it isn't that obvious

>>2718630
...the metric system is french. the british were/are notoriously slow to switch to metric and even today it's a mishmash of units
not as bad as canada or the US but still

>>2722283
God I love this style of loft home. It will forever chap my ass that you tend to find these in the most overpriced homes on earth. And it's also also always in the homes that take forever to sell and the owners NEVER come back to earth on the price.

>>2718630
Using metric is wasteful. Since inches are larger, you don't need as many to measure.

>>2728879
Honestly, it doesn't matter what you use for most day to day things. It's rare to convert the weight of water to volume and stuff like that. It's just important that other people know your system. The scientists would make metric worth it but weighing yourself in stones or whatever doesn't matter as long as everyone else in your country is also.

there's definitely a financial/economic incentive behind it. probably faster, cheaper. more profitable. americans definitely move more often and were the first to become known for house flipping. we're the greediest, that's the reputation. constantly buying and selling shit. wood frame houses are the mcdonalds of houses. mcmansions started here. an entire industry for spraying termites too.

>>2728804

>A gallon is a unit of measurement for liquids that is equal to eight pints. In Britain, it is equal to about 4.546 litres. In America, it is equal to about 3.785 litres.

I dont get it

>>2725255
You understand imperial because your brain has adapted to it, proven by your retarded dogshit examples such as 1 mile being 20 minutes (1 km is 10 minutes unless youre dystrophic or obese). Objectively, from a neutral standpoint where one hasn't gotten used to the units, metric is superior which is why imperial is officially defined after metric and why all the highly educated and complex fields in clapistan use metric. Imperial has no use whatsoever, all the body parts measurements are bronze age tier in accuracy since thumbs and feet can vary with 30% so your body sort of matching up with it is useless. Not to mention you complain about the celsius scale being squished with regards to human scale but centimeters being too small for height, make up your mind faget

>>2728950
>a gallon is defined as 8 times 1/8th of a gallon
that is not the definition of a gallon. actually look up its dimensions and then report back. it's hilarious

>>2728946
eh, i actually wanted to know what volume my favourite cup really is so i filled it with water and put it on a kitchen scale, then made the difficult conversion of grams of water to ml
i can agree that for simple things like everyday measurements a cm is not superior in any way to an inch, but when things get slightly more complex imperial becomes pants on head retarded. like that cup thing, how would you know how many fluid ounces you get by measuring the weight? and how many square feet are there in an acre, without looking it up? how is an acre actually defined?
it was 250 gram btw, or 25 cl

>>2725255
>Have never heard anyone outside of Europe use "stone" as a measurement.
so feet and teaspoons as a unit of measurement is fine but using stones is taking it too far? i thought you used imperial, so what's so bad about imperial then?
also, 5 different tons in your pic. if i didn't know any better i would think it's satire

>>2726137
>they created imperial units (aka. british imperial) which is used in america
they actually didn't create it, most countries (even cities) had their own special snowflake version of imperial units before they threw it out and adopted an international and consistent measurement system, which happend in the late 18th century in most of europe
to further illustrate the point, a british inch was different from an american inch as late as the 50's, and a british gallon today is different from an american gallon but i think in the UK they mostly use litres now

>>2729411
19th century, not a mistake i often make but i'm drunk posting

>>2729398
The acre is a side thing though. Square miles or square yards would be the standard imperial units. Acres were since holdover tradition from how much an ox can plow in a day or something like that. Definitely weird but it's tradition now. Even if we switched to metric I bet it'd somehow survive. Like how Japanese people measure apartment sizes, or traditional carpentry units.

>>2724453
This has taken a strange turn from stick framing into measurement units. As an oldfag leaf I like centigrade as a measurement unit but dont like many other frog units especially pressure, pounds on an inch i can relate to, kpa or bar gimmee a break

>>2729776
I'm a zoomer leaf whose parents were born three years after Canada began adopting metric. I learned SI and US units and like both for different scenarios. Celsius in the lab, Fahrenheit in the kitchen, grams for baking, ounces for cooking, etc.

>>2729776
i suppose that is your opinion. personally i like that a bar is around atmospheric pressure, 10m of water colum, or 1kgf/cm^2, but if i have to calculate anyhing of note i tend to stick with pascal
and how is atmospheric pressure unrelatable you're literally exposed to it right now

>>2729523
it's used pretty often in surveying though, and that you need a book to look up its definition and then a calculator to figure out how many square feet there are i do not find this ideal no
>Even if we switched to metric I bet it'd somehow survive
probably not, just like how the feet has completely disappeared in most of the world i don't get why some outdated area unit that supposedly is the size you can plow with a pair of oxen would be any different. is this the part where they tell me it's "more human relatable" than a hectare?

>>2729896
The existing land divisions will persist until subdivided though. The acre would have a crazy amount of momentum. I mean, it's been probably a century or so already when people were plowing fields with oxen and not a tractor, not to mention plow tech probably making it inaccurate already. Why isn't everything in square yards already in burgerland?

>>2725255
you can say that about celsius as well, in normal speak here we call negative temps "cold degrees" and positive "heat degrees" and it makes total sense in our climate. above zero its """hot""" outside, simple as. higher number is hotter. there is nothing in the farenheit scale that makes sense to me, 50f, is it hot? is it cold? is the road slippery? is it snowing? will i run ac on full? i need to google it every time someone mention temperatures in F so thats your logical scale debunked right there.

>>2730094
see >>2724453
the temperature on earth never goes below 0°F or above 100°F and fahrenheit is calibrated to the comfortable range of temperatures for humans, whatever that means
it's also better for weather, because 0°C, what does that even mean, freezing? 0°F makes way more sense because that is really cold, the coldest it gets in really cold places

>>2730484
>the temperature on earth never goes below 0°F or above 100°F
>0°F... the coldest it gets in really cold places
Brother are you retarded

>>2730489
no i was being sarcastic while citing another retard

>>2724200
>>2724905
so why can't tornadoes delete hills?

I am autistic
Does anyone know of any books on the history of house making and the different techniques
Basically I want to know how a house is built without gaining the sufficient detail to actually do it, mostly interested in houses built 100+ years ago

>>2724200
there are no stone houses, except for these caves dug into a mountain
all so called stone houses just have some stone elements, like parts of the walls or a foundation

>>2730682
>mostly interested in houses built 100+ years ago
fairly easy with wood, and easier 100 years ago or earlier when there were no complications with water or electricity. Modern houses should be built as concrete husks, and then water and electricity run as external counduits. Stop making houses complicated to build and to fix

>>2718503
I don't mind it. Nobody will even know whether it's brick or timber after the house has been built and furnished.
Also it's easier to replace a rotten joist or sill than a split brick wall.

>>2724698
>a yard of x
For one thing, a yard of gravel is about 2000 lbs. The finer the heavier. Sand sits at about 2800 lbs while concrete is 4000 lbs. How much in kgs is a cubic meter of gravel?

As a civil engineer, I am flabbergasted by the amount of autism and ignorance present in this tread.

Thank goodness I live in a country where a house must be designed by a chartered professional.

>>2733434
>how many pounds do a cubic yard of water weigh?
and how many gallons is that while you're at it

>>2728395
>Old house is just piece of shit with leaks from everywhere, crooked walls
literally mine and with much reinforced concrete
it will certainly last another 50 years
>no insulation and possibly unsafe wiring.
easy enough to fix just do external wall insulation and swap the breakers for modern ones

OP, that's a stick frame.
Timber framing means using larger pieces of timber for main structural support, instead of stick frame.

Timber framing uses less actual volume of wood than stick framing. It's also superior for indoor space/design since you don't need extra structural walls. However, the details are tough to get right, like electrical/plumbing, air circulation, etc. Not many contractors are familiar with SIPs. So any timber frame build will automatically be more expensive and take longer. But if you really want a big great-room with a loft, definitely go for it.

>>2733448
And yet high school dropouts can put up a wooden building that lasts 100y for $100k + tip

>>2734410
>easy enough to fix just do external wall insulation
Its not that easy.
> and swap the breakers for modern ones
What about insulation of cables? Or insufficient amount of sockets? Or low-voltage/optical cables?
Or HVAC?
>RC
Would be fun to dig leaking pipes from it to repair them.

So yeah, you can build bunkers and then fuck with it for life, or you can build a temporary shack that's up to current standards in efficiency and comfort. And when shit goes really wrong, you demolish entire thing and start over.

>>2718503
timber framing isn't bad when it's hardwood. As we progress however, building materials get cheaper and shittier to the point where million dollar houses in Australia are getting built out of styrofoam

https://youtu.be/DXafnJY4jJI?si=GeKulcQVWjy25lWp

>>2733448
>t. overeducated underpaid yuropoor

>>2734604
Lots of softwoods are very good for timber framing. It's hard to argue with douglas fir for strength to weight and the ease of getting extremely long lengths of clear straight grain timber. They grow so big you can often get multiple timbers per log which grants the additional benefit of allowing you to avoid having the pith in the timber also. Softwood vs hardwood is too general of a term to really adequately describe the material properties.

>>2734604
>>2734653

When you guys say hardwood and softwood, are you referring to hardwood (like balsa which is very soft) and softwood (like yew which is quite hard), or to hard wood and soft wood. I always hated the stupidity of those terms.

Question: If I just stick frame with large enough lumber, am I timber framing?

I literally calculated out an A-frame cabin made with single 2x12 elements which according to the AWC (and APA, ASCE, etc for other components) would withstand a 20lb psf dead load plus a 404lb psf live load, which is a 300mph wind load.

I don't think stick framing is the issue, I think it's people being cheap and contractors doing as little as legally required as fast as fucking possible. Everyone is so used to both of these things that when they see something like Swiss stick framing it blows their mind that - holy shit - you can actually employ craftsmanship.

Also, that recent tornado in the UK showed that those European brick and timber structures get fucked, too. God forbid the UK ever has a moderate seismic event.

>>2734653
>>2734675
Australia used to use proper hardwood like eucalypt and ironbark, wood so fucking hard that they burn out spade bits trying to drill through them. Now we use structural plantation pine, you can cut it with a bread knife. Because timber is so expensive, we're starting to use steel (read: 1.2mm aluminium sheetmetal) as a framing material which is real flimsy, like if you lean against a stud it will fold.

A house built today in Australia costs approx. $400k dollarydoos and is unlikely to survive long enough for the person to pay off their 30 year mortgage

>>2734675
Annoying isn't it?

>>2735028
I thought Aussie houses were just for tax purposes?

>>2734780
IIRC the cutoff (which is of course just an arbitrary construct) is 5" thickness for timber vs lumber. Stick framing is fine. It all depends on the engineering, in which stick excels since it is so documented you literally just pull stuff off a chart. It is soulless and such but it is totally fine practically speaking. Keep your roof and siding in good shape and the frame will last more than 100 years (who knows how long yet since stick framing's earliest version is from the 1800's). I still love timber framing though. It has a special place in my heart.

>>2719043
Snow load is like 70psf. That's 0.37 tons/m^2. Static. On the roof. Nobody is building anything that can withstand that sort of load dynamic applied to the walls.

>>2735028
>Because timber is so expensive, we're starting to use steel (read: 1.2mm aluminium sheetmetal) as a framing material which is real flimsy, like if you lean against a stud it will fold.
Holy shit. At some point you've gotta realize that the final redpill is aerated concrete block (with the addition of reinforced concrete columns if you have earthquakes) it doesn't fucking bend if you lean against it and it's a great insulator, it's easy to carve precisely for installations and it's faster to build than clay brick due to size and shape.

>>2735383
why do you need concrete walls for? You don't use structure materials for walls, walls can be made from panels, structure from hard materials

>>2735387
>why do you need concrete walls for?
Because Xella's marketing photos are going to shill as much of their products as they can. Nothing really stopping you from using drywall on the interior.

>>2734780
yes, stick is fucking fine
this board is underage is all (or worse tradies and engineers that think they have taste LOL)
4chan bb

>>2734780
>that recent tornado in the UK showed that those European brick and timber structures get fucked, too.
You act like all of Europe is identical. Balkans build out of brick and all of it withstands relatively strong earthquakes, ignoring fucking turkey, fuck them they cheaped out and got fucked, as God intended.
>God forbid the UK ever has a moderate seismic event.
Indeed. UK has the worst construction standards of the entirety of Europe. They really fucked up not keeping the Poles there.

>>2734675
Hardwood is hard wood, and softwood is soft wood. Most framing lumber is softwood (spruce, pine, fir). Quality furniture is hardwood, exotic tropical shit like mahogany. Hardwood doesn't need thickness to be strong. You could build out of hardwood, but it'd be exorbitantly expensive, and very difficult to get long pieces

>>2735848
>Hardwood is hard wood, and softwood is soft wood.

Maybe in your mind and to the average bubba, but that is not true in any real way.

>>2719312
nobody:
le zoomer: he guys i just created an epic mem-
le basement-dwelling 4chan guy: um actually it's FRENCH
not even keanu chungus:

>>2735851
>Maybe in your mind and to the average bubba, but that is not true in any real way.

>>2735851
Congratulations, you're the one old asian woman who can track a car

>>2718503
Wood is cheap and disposable and there is no reason except autism to care. I don't need to build for the ages, I need to build for myself so I do because everything is about me and I am not wealthy enough to care about anyone else.

>>2735053
>I thought Aussie houses were just for tax purposes?
nah, they're also for laundering money through
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/feb/13/no-questions-asked-money-laundering-thrives-in-australia-because-of-professionals-willing-to-facilitate-it

>>2735383
they do thatbin the North where we get cyclones but the rest of the country is relatively safe, i.e. no earthquakes, snowfall, tornadoes, etc. so they can be built out of Lego's if it was financially viable, so they're built out of literal styrofoam

>>2735906
Balsa is technically a hardwood?!

>>2723033
>T and V
Tits and Vagen?

>>2736778
It is. IIRC the scientific definition of hardwood vs softwood is based on the cellular structure of the wood and how the tree moves water within itself. But as a general rule, softwood is not as hard as hardwood.

>>2720783
>16 oz a pound
>2oz per smashburger
>60 x 8 = 480
480 venison burgers per deer

>>2718751
A small crew with a jack and winches can erect a timberframe.

Why do you think Hutterites, Quackers and Amish build them?

>>2719452
Old growth forests have very little undergrowth to them like salal Oregon grape Blackberry Etc they're pretty sterile places suitable only for fungus most of the time

>>2723434
I have to build myself a shed again in my backyard but I'm planning on going to 12x20 rather than 10x16 as I did before.

Did it with a gambrel roof, regular stick framing but I did go for a metal roof plus hand split 18 inch tapet for the siding

>>2724192
If it takes so long for the mushrooms to recover, why am I getting good crops of chantrell's enforce that's only 40 years old?

>>2724454
I'm a Canadian so my distances tend to be in kilometers, but for doing any actual woodworking it's still the imperial system for me.

>>2718503
That's not timber, but a lot of sticks, just like OP.

>>2728939
My BIL owns one on Bryan road in Pender Harbour on the waterfront.

Current assessed value is $11.5m CAN

>>2720307
Still used in central and northern europe in modified shape. The swiss do some good shit with it.

>>2735906
Been hoarding yew wood for a while now. Have some gorgeous 3 inch planks of that shit about 8 1/2 ft long

>>2718816
>which jew faction are you from that wants to end the forestry industry?
Probably the same one that calls normal non-electric cars "rube goldberg machines"

>>2718870
Croat anon is that you? Is it really you!? The pol threads from ages past were based and caused the jannies in American cardboard homes to seethe.

>>2737507
While it is true that old growth supports fewer species of plants and wildlife, they support some sort of lichen that does the nitrogen fixing in that environment, thus are vital for ensuring the soil remains nutrient rich. Most lumber is farmed nowadays though hence the fast growing monocultures with lots of knots.

If we mined the landfills there’s enough material to build a billion homes. Think trex….but made with trash.

>>2718816
the timber industry will end itself

>>2737587
The timber industry is literally the most sustainable building material industry possible

>>2735877
Fuck up zoomzoom
Humans are talking