/diy/ - Do It Yourself

The blades clearly got thicker, but the blade spacing stayed the same, that's the only possible explanation.

>>2593101
>buying 2x4s with heart wood in them
I seriously hope you guys don't do this

>>2593101
Yes I too was shocked when I found out 2x4's weren't actually 2" x 4". I think it was 4th grade shop class. then I got over it.

>>2593101
>Industrial grade shrinkflation
Obviously, globoworming's making trees shorter; gotta adjust accordingly

>>2593306
as a non-american, this is news to me

>>2593101
44x96’s don’t have this problem

>>2593106
>>2593306
>>2593440
An original 2x4 was, in fact, 2x4 with rough, saw cut faces on all 4 sides. The legend that I was taught was that they started milling them to make them easier to handle without gloves. My experience confirms that this is a possibility. If you get an old 2x4 that measure true, it will be rough cut, and they are nasty to handle by hand. As far as I am concerned, the new rubberized gloves negate all of this. My grip is stronger with them than without and they are cheap. We should go back to rough sawn. I empathize that no one wanted to do framing with leather gloves back in the old days. I amortize about 20 cents per day for hand protection with the new gloves..

>>2593457
Did you typo? That combination of numbers does not ring a bell for me. Perhaps 4x4x96? They can be had both milled or unmilled... at least usually.

>>2593461
Expressed with real SI units, not in retard freedom units

>>2593469
nigger that was expressed in no units, just numbers

Back in my day 2x4 was actually 3x5 before them goddamn commies and socialists and Jews got to my wood

>>2593515
and 2x4 isnt?

>>2593528
The phrase "2x4" exists in the context of common understanding autism-anon, hence why the units aren't rewuired. Nobody knows what the fuck 44x96s are

>>2593530
I know and that other anon knows

>I know and that other anon knows

>>2593534
>saging in the name field
See? Two(by four) can play that game

>>2593101

Time to return

>>2593101
its sold as 48x98mm here and thats its exact dimensions and whats required to mill off actual rough cut 2x4" to make them smooth. thats a difference of 2,8/3,6mm, been so for as long i have known.
you can still buy actual rough cut 2x4 but no one does unless its some time correct restoration project.

>>2593459
yes duh we know.

>>2593440
no one cares what you know

>>2593101
>give manufacturers standards
>include + or - tolerances to stay within their standards
>as manufacturing becomes more accurate, start manufacturing them closer to the low end of tolerance to give you less material for the same price
>become so commonplace the standards change

Wa La!

>>2593101
Lumber's nominal dimensions are larger than the actual standard dimensions of finished lumber. Historically, the nominal dimensions were the size of the green (not dried), rough (unfinished) boards that eventually became smaller finished lumber through drying and planing (to smooth the wood). Today, the standards specify the final finished dimensions and the mill cuts the logs to whatever size it needs to achieve those final dimensions. Typically, that rough cut is smaller than the nominal dimensions because modern technology makes it possible to use the logs more efficiently. For example, a "2×4" board historically started out as a green, rough board actually 2 by 4 inches (51 mm × 102 mm). After drying and planing, it would be smaller by a nonstandard amount. Today, a "2×4" board starts out as something smaller than 2 inches by 4 inches and not specified by standards, and after drying and planing is minimally 1+1⁄2 by 3+1⁄2 inches (38 mm × 89 mm).

>>2593530
> Nobody knows what the fuck 44x96s are
What the fuck do you think European carpenters call these then? 2x4s or some other retarded name that doesn’t match their size?
We call them 44x96 or “four four nine six”. Then there’s 44x44 aka 44-square, 44x69, and 44x144 aka 144-er.

>>2593110
>FOHC on framing lumber

look at mr fancy pants over here

>>2593457
Not 46x96?

>>2593101
Notice they're also getting rounder all the time.

>>2593469
>not in retard freedom units
"British" imperial units

>>2593744
In 2100 they'll just be dowels

>>2593101
only mutts can be so retarded to reduce the size due to planing them, instead of making the raw cut bigger


Around here i can buy the same sizes in raw cut or planed

>>2593750
same size like 2x4 and "2x4"?

>>2593757
no actually same size, measured in a real unit too

>>2593762
>real unit
hohoheheheheeehahahahaaaaa
36 barleycorns = 12 inches (or thumbs here) = 1 foot
yeah thats totally precise and constant measurements that never changes. a dicklength is always 12 inches right?

>>2593647
*voìla

>>2593802
Go home newfag

>>2593750
Imagine seething so hard you co vince yourself that Americans can't buy lumber rough or surfaced (on 1 to 4 sides) at any dimension they are willing to pay for, just like any place with basic sawmill facilities.

>>2593825
Custom lumber is illegal in America. You will buy the undersized 2x4 and you will be happy. So much for the "land of the free"!

>>2593802
Would you prefer "fiddle," retard?

>>2593743
No but they used to be listed like that years ago iirc. But there’s a +-1mm tolerance on the standard anyway. They’re basically 2”x4” minus 3mm planing loss on each side, raw is 48x100 or 50x100

>>2593101
it is rather amusing.
there's an actual lumber yard/mill near me, in business since 1862 I think.
they sell both the smooth machined "nominal" 2x4 and the rough cut actual 2x4
the amusing thing is, that the rough cut actual true 2x4 is like nearly a whole dollar cheaper than the nominal smoothed 2x4 that you'd get at any BIGBOX lumber store.

So people are actually paying MORE for less wood, but it's smooth so they don't get splinters.

>>2593884
I see, I'd been working with boards pulled from an old shed in a building project and they were consistently 46x96

>>2593886
>People actually pay more for flour than for wheat
anon...

>>2593886
You wouldn't believe the premium that home-gamers will pay for "smooth, finished stuff". When dumb Boomers ask my cashiers for "1x3 pine", they're sold a furring strip that's not even fit for a fence picket.

So then I show them our S4S screen stock, they lose their minds and say YAAASSSS THAT'S WHAT I NEED and immediately go back for an exchange. The screen stock is $16 for an eight-footer, while the furring strip is three bucks and change. They really want that "smooth, finished stuff".

Not to mention the premium they'll pay for A|C plywood so their grandkids don't get splinters off their guestroom bunkbed. It would never occur to them to fucking sand and seal the shit, and save $80/sheet.

>>2593893
How bad are the surfaces in this rough cut wood?

>>2593889
> pay more for flour
Dude, I can’t even buy wheat in any grocery store here, even though it’s grown 5 minutes out if the city in any direction.

>>2593459
I heard that legend, too. I think it’s BS.

More believable is that the rough and furry surface was more prone to catch fire, especially back in the knob and tube electrical era.

They had leather gloves back then, and used them!

In fact, you’re probably more prone to get deadly huge splinters now, as the smooth wood is more prone to slide across your hand, the roughsawn was more grippy by itself.

>>2593886
Hey Mr Tough Guy, there's a reason why people don't use rough cut lumber and it's not because they're scared of getting splinters.

>>2593902
I keep my regular SPF indoors, above a concrete floor, and none of it ever looks like that. That shit looks like it's been out in the sun getting steamed.

>>2593898
The furring strips I mentioned? Pretty rough, so I try to only sell it by the bundle, as fence pickets.

My grandfather's generation didn't mind rough, but my father's expects everything to look like S4S, right out of the yard. And nobody wants to paint anything, anymore.

>>2593902
that shit doesnt look any worse than the garbage you get at home depot.

>>2593918
Because everyone realized painting is bullshit work. Like sweeping, the primary purpose of painting was to create the illusion of productivity.

>>2593101
The lumber mills kept cheaping out on the wood they were selling smaller wood that they were saying was by4/6/8/etc. It gets even worse the bigger the cut. By 10's are barely 8 inches

>>2593727
This post almost makes me glad that we destroyed your entire continent and allowed jewish politics to infect it, leading to your eventual displacement by brown rape hordes.

>>2593977
And later, when they converted all plywood to be metric, of course they rounded DOWN when manufacturing it, so your true ¾" router bit cuts too big, and your plywood wobbles in the joint. So you buy more glue, new bits, and thicker plywood.

>>2594040
I like that this post could apply to either america or europe.

>>2593960
Retard

>>2594040
Yet I can walk alone in every neighbourhood of every city in the country, at any hour, without getting robbed. Can you?

>>2593457
>just use the entire tree

Climate change means that trees grow faster, as the limiting factor for trees are nutrients and Co2, one of them is going up due to climate change.

>>2594368
so more co2 is a good thing?

>>2593106
>>2593325
>>2593750
>>2593837
>>2593901
>>2593977
>>2594040

>>2593902
>planing wood stops it from warping
Boomers were a mistake.

Earth is a self balancing mechanism, and one of such mechanisms is that stuff that uses CO2 expands when there is more CO2.

Overall, no, however, the climate thing is a bit over the top, as the adaptations we're making now would have to be made in 40 years anyway, as we would have ran out of fossil fuels

>>2594416
Boomers created civilization as you know it, and probably your very life. What you do with it is up to you, but at least try and be somewhat thankful and move on. Whats done is done. Back in the day we were just like anybody else. “Here, take this thalidomide for morning sickness” …“duhh, ok.”

>>2593902
>heartwood and sapwood in the same board
>surprised when it turns into a banana
>"surely a planer could have stopped this"
please think before u post

>>2593101
power of basing measurement units on body parts

>>2594458
>w-we created civilization!!
Jesus Christ boomers are mentally ill. Tick tock boomboom, death and an eternity in the lake of fire soon

>>2594371
>i suck at memeing
That moment when the joke flies over your head

>>2594451
>muh peakoil
Lol
Lmao

>>2594451
Also
>muh fossil fuels
If it was fossil (which it isn't), it'd be a renewable green bioenergy
Inb4 muh ebil ICE
Just call them for what they are: thermoelectric engines

>>2593719
>As previously noted, less wood is needed to produce a given finished size than when standards called for the green lumber to be the full nominal dimension. However, even the dimensions for finished lumber of a given nominal size have changed over time. In 1910, a typical finished 1-inch (25mm) board was13⁄16in (21mm). In 1928, that was reduced by 4%, and yet again by 4% in 1956. In 1961, at a meeting in Scottsdale, Arizona, the Committee on Grade Simplification and Standardization agreed to what is now the current U.S. standard: in part, the dressed size of a 1-inch (nominal) board was fixed at3⁄4inch; while the dressed size of 2inch (nominal) lumber wasreducedfrom1+5⁄8inch to the current1+1⁄2inch.
>Dimensional lumber is available in green, unfinished state, and for that kind of lumber, the nominal dimensions are the actual dimensions.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lumber#Dimensional_lumber

wood is for fags, boomers bring shame on our ancestors

>>2594332
yes

>>2593101
jews.

>>2594595
Shoddy workmanship has always existed

>>2594332
>pic related

>>2593440
seconding i guess
kinda frustrating but then again i'm annoyed capacities aren't put on as gibibyte on storage media

>>2593534
the box because the bump is gone

>>2595185
exception defines the rule
i'd be more cautious of my driving habits though
sweltering and gloating in comparative misery doesn't solve a thing
demand accountable politics and transparent policymaking
maybe even do "faggy" shit like protest over it
in the end i bet both if us would rather see things improve rather than bicker who has it worse as a way to rationalize and cope with things that are shitty despite them being far from unchangeable in reality

>>2595185
>>2595209
I wasn't even the anon you were talking with.

But, yes. We are all in the same boat.

If you can't stop working for the rest of your life, you're a wage slave like the rest of us plebs.

>>2593306
I love how smug and casual you are about getting fucked in the ass

>>2593101
Yeah, tying in new stock with a house built in 1947. All the old lumber is larger, and stamped kiln-dried. Not the easiest to drill through.

>>2594687
That's what happens when an architect thinks he doesn't need an engineer.

>>2593889
bro, you can build plenty of shit out of a rough cut board, you are commiting suicide if you try to eat raw wheat.

>>2595291
keep your fetishes off this board.

>>2595305
The flaws add character. It's a real human work of art, and not a soulless geometric figure.

>>2595313
Anon you can literally just put it in stews?

>>2595313
You can build plenty of shit out of lots of things, including literal shit. Doesn't mean you should.

>>2594370
For plants, yes. For established agriculture? No. Imagine all the wheat producing areas moving about 2 states north. All family farms in Iowa struggling for a new crop they can grow.

Lots of ocean life that can’t relocate will die off, and thrive in new areas. Overfishing and acidic oceans are the real threat here though.

Water allocation will be a real bitch too. Not sure how southwest us will survive in 100 years.

>>2593901
>>2593459
It's possible it was a fire code thing. Although it could be argued that they smooth cut the boards for the no glove thing because: 1 company starts smooth cutting them using splinters/labor saving is an argument, grows like crazy, and others follow suit. Then it becomes an industry standard.

>>2594595
>>2594687
How many of you fags still believe that the stone were cut and placed into shape?

>>2595407
Well I don't think they grew them on trees.

>>2595195
At least 1TB discs are actually at least 1TB, even though it's not the unit everything else uses

>Houses now 30% smaller with smaller 2x4s
>costs 400x as much
shirnkflation is bullshit

>>2595454
If the walls are smaller the floorspace is greater low iq anon.

>>2593110
The 1920 one is probably polewood, a faced off juvenile tree. No heartwood and in a lot of ways its the best possible (doesn't warp, naturally straight, core is onion protected). "Stick".

>>2595377
co2 rise follow temperature rise not the other way round
"radiative forcing" is very poorly designeed and how they rig the models

>>2594075
>your true ¾" router bit cuts too big
of all the fractions you could have picked you picked the one that would only be rounded down 0.05mm which is two thousandths of an inch

>>2593101
>dafuq?
Wood shrinks while it dries. Cutting wood so it will shrink to the desired dimension once dried is a skill that takes a long time to learn. A lot of people that had the skill or could have learned that skill died during WW1. By the time WW2 was over and the construction boom started, no one had the time to GAF about it. 2x4 has only been a nominal dimension since the 40s. I'm guessing OP is 18 and only just discovered this.

>>2593977
Some someone is selling you 3/4" ply that isn't 3/4 tell them to fuck off and get your wood elsewhere. My friend has been buying plywood for a bunch of projects (we share a work shop), and I've bought a few sheets recently and they've all be exactly the stated thickness. We live in Québec. The plywood was sourced from Québec or Maine. Long story short, you're being ripped off and "switching to metric" has nothing to do with it.

>>2595989
Nobody is talking about plywood...

>>2593750
Here you buy rough cut 50x100, 50x150 mm etc from a sawmill/industrial supplier and construction/consumer lumber is milled to 45x95, 45x145 mm. And if you order enough you can get any dimensions you want obviously.

>>2595195
>Be me
>Break phones a lot (retard arborist)
>Always buy 2nd hand
>New old phone has 16gb storage
>Somehow 11gb is used by android
>SD cards will only work if they're from the manufacturer
>Fuck that
>Flash ROM and install a different OS (graphene or something idk)
>Now mobile banking refuses to work
Honestly fuck the phone industry. At least generic microSD works now

>>2596352
You can use magisk to get safetynet passing again, i've gotten google wallet running on rooted lineageos
it's some dumb drm that is intended for certain apps to only run on "stock" roms (where you can't inspect or modify them)

>>2593585
>rough cut 2x4

its called an amish 2x4 because its biblical law that if its 2x4 those are the correct weights and measurements. Its also shariah law. Muslims will cut off your hands. Amish just dont want to scam as its against gods rules.

the idea that you cant make a true 2x4 because of planing...

>>2596377
Where does it fit in jewish, law is it torah or talmudic?

>>2595989
The better example is furring strips. since furring is used as a set measurement block to bring out a wall. SAY you need to bring out a wall 1/4 inch for whatever reason so you can sister 2 1/4 inch furring strips onto the studs...WRONG!!! 1/4 inch furring is not 1/4 inch.

>>2596378
talmud. saying it was a 2x4 but then it got planed is talmudic. feeding baal just the tip is technically not passing your children through the fire.

>>2596380
ment 1/2 inch. I had to do this one time fitting various sizes of bath tubs and needed the wall 1/2 inch forward to make thee new tub fit. Precut furring strips should be the solution.

The actual solution is having to buy a planer or table saw and cutting your own furring strips. thats cost prohibitive on a single job to bring a wall out 1/2 inch.

SO have various plywood scraps then glue and sister and remove plys with a hand chisel to build 1/2 inch exact furring strips is the cheapest option.

Precut furring strips are fucking worthless.

>>2596387
>why is there 1/2 an inch difference on a bathtub?

prefab house shower surrounds have no rockboard or tile on their studs. Its a 1/16 inch piece of cheesy pizza box with vinyl glued to it. in order to remodel the bathtub nook to real housing code you have to fur out the wall to accomodate the real bath tub size. 1/2 inch shorter tub.

>>2596377
>the idea that you cant make a true 2x4 because of planing...

...is a retarded statement that you pulled out of your ass so you could then "win" your strawman argument.

Nobody has said that you "cant" make finished S4S lumber that measures 2"×4" any more than they have said that you "can't" make a hamburger patty that weighs 1/2 pound *after* cooking, or that you "can't" build a coffeemaker or set of dinnerware that measures coffee "cups" as 8 fluid ounces instead of 5-6 as is the convention with coffee.

It's just understood that those terms are generic and not to be taken literally in those contexts...

by everyone except aspiring teenage pedants who think they've uncovered a conspiracy and can't wait to beclown themselves shouting to the world about it.

>>2596397
2x4...not to be taken literally..lol im not here to argue pilpul with you as you move the goal posts moishe. Its probably alot easier for you to build a biblical 2x4 with the proper dimensions then learning 2x4 debate class.

ANYWAY
>prefab
>premanufactured
>modular

Have a completely different set of building codes and their studs are 2x2.5. pic related.

>>2596401
OOPS..meant more like 1.5x2 after
>>2596397
whatever the fuck this guy just did to your 2x4.

fucking modern day coin shaving.

>>2596401
OHH OHHH AND AND...if you got a saw mill and cut your own lumber to build your own house because of this pile of shit not having structurally sound studs. and cut true 2x4'...you need a shotgun because not of that is approved building material or up to code.

>>2593534
DO NOT TOUCH MY PILES YOU FUCKING DEGENERATE, AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

>>2596410
>2x4' studs arent approved building material or up to code
...what?

>>2596450
well have you ever seen a house built out of two by four foot studs?

>>2596582
Yes, Victorian houses.

Stick framing became popular in the 19th C.

Engineers determined that the 2x4s used were bigger than necessary for the purpose of framing, and made them smaller in later years.

>>2596617
>Engineers determined that the 2x4s used were bigger than necessary for the purpose of framing, and made them smaller in later years.

citation needed, and some idiot will not suffice. every normal site has the same explanation that I assume has been stated earlier in this thread, about rough sawn vs planed to be true, flat, and squared.

>>2593101
You see, anon, back in 1920, all lumber was still wet from being cut recently. So they let it dry out for the next 40 years, causing it to shrink. Than, over the next 59 years, artisans meticulously planed the faces and rounded the edges, reducing the overall size to standardized dimensions which could be reliably be made from the somewhat-warped wood they had to work with.

>>2596450
YEAH 2X4'S U CUT YOURSELF AND BRICKS YOU MAKE YOURSELF ARE NOT APPROVED TO ANY STANDARD. SHIT OLD MATERIALS YOU HARVEST FROM TORN DOWN OLD BUILDINGS ARE ALSO NO LONGER APPROVED TO ANY STANDARDS. YOU CAN ONLY USE MATERIALS THAT PASSED A BUILDING STANDARDS PROCESS.

>>2593101
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEOnIpO7Xgw

>>2596681
>ARE NOT APPROVED TO ANY STANDARD
...what¿?¿?¿?¿?¿?¿?¿?¿?

Approved by who? What the fuck are you talking about?

The only """approval""" you need is the building design specifications, and the veto of the seasoned professional framing said building. Hes not going to throw a board out because it meets specifications, but isnt in common use!

ARE YOU ACTUALLY INSANE!!!!

>YOU CAN ONLY USE MATERIALS THAT PASSED A BUILDING STANDARDS PROCESS.
NO, NOT EVEN REMOTELY TRUE!!

>>2593534
She will look in both the basket and the box.

>>2593960
Hands that live in squalor typed this

>>2596403
>modern day coin shaving.

LMAO

>remove precious metal that retains its intrinsic value that may be more than the face value of the coin

> remove material from solid lumber as chips and dust that instantly have vastly less value, and then only after using labor intensive processes on a mass scale to reconstitute it into something useful.

>>2596820
>>YOU CAN ONLY USE MATERIALS THAT PASSED A BUILDING STANDARDS PROCESS.
>NO, NOT EVEN REMOTELY TRUE!!

Call your local building/permit office and ask them if it's OK to use ungraded lumber that you cut yourself. In most of the USA, this isn't allowed by code (although there are areas where the inspectors don't do their jobs thoroughly and it can easily slide through)

>>2596987
>you can only use
>ask if its allowed
Youre so slop brained you cant even comprehend the difference, fucking sad.

>>2595407
Your mind is infected.

>>2596980
>intrinsic value
No such thing. Value is an extrinsic phenomenon.

>>2596980
smaller cross-section means you can squeeze more board feet per area out of a tree. it's actually saving mills from having to process sawdust