/diy/ - Do It Yourself

>>1957535
americans are jokes. can't even do concrete.

>>1957535
Americans build houses on a 10cm concrete foundation they cut Every corner they can just to save a buck because they are turbos capitalists with littel regulation the rest of the world would do the same but can't

>>1957535
Garages are the place you park your car. It's a covered parking space. You ain't gonna use the same thickness of concrete with as much reinforcement as for the foundation of a house.

Very common in America, I can't speak for the rest of the planet. I always request lots of rebar and I specify it's positioning. I also use a minimum of 5 inches and wet cure for a month. I never have any cracks. Americans actually believe "all concrete cracks"

>>1957535
I don’t think it’s an American thing but it’s quite recent.

>>1957686
I wouldn't say it's recent either, my house that was built in 1970 has this issue.

Imagine being such a eurofag that you only think concrete cracks in America...

>>1957830
kek

>>1957535
>claims not to have ever seen concrete cracked
>knows what a control joint is

its more of a soil thing.
some areas have soil that swells and contracts with different seasons. The amount of deflection depends solely on the soil mixture.
Blaming it on being american is probably the most ignorant thing I have read all day from this website.

For some reason it's now popular to saw cut expansion Joints in the concrete slabs instead of just putting them in when it's wet.

>>1957900
Easier to make it look straight and probably faster. The trades have been invaded by low skill people in the last 50 years and none of them take pride in their work. It is all about speed, speed, speed (maybe crank to mix things up), get paid, go home and take painkillers, drink, beat their kids/spouses, and repeat. The only time anyone gives a shit is if they are high-end, very costly craftsmen. None of them are doing tract houses.

>>1957535
>Is this more of an American thing, because they use a different kind of concrete?
No it's actually because we put heavy duty real cars in our garages instead of motorcycle engines with eggshells.

>>1957623
Construction Engineer here.
Rebar causes cracks
Concrete cracks
5" slab is common
A month of wet cure is a ludicrous amount of time. A week is enough.
3 things will always happen with concrete.
It gets hard, it shrinks, and it cracks.

>>1957959
>The trades have been invaded by spics
this is what you meant to say.

>>1957535
You've never seen a foundation crack before? Yeah, this is common in certain soil types no matter the foundation. Or, for most foundations used in the US at least.

>>1957535
doesnt this happen in colder climates due to the ground heaving around like a motherfucker with the constant freeze-thaw cycles over 50 years?

>>1958003
The trades have been invaded by retarded high school dropouts.
Blue collar work has become synonymous with "The only option other than the Military for the poor and the stupid.".

Your only value is your back, you cant be surprised that mexicans who are 100x more motivated than you are taking over.

>>1957686
I meant control joints are more recent.

>>1957840
>>knows what a control joint is
I meant to say that the first time I saw it was on youtube. The Essential guy is doing videos on it.

But I've never seen control joints IRL, just as I don't recall cracked concrete inside a house, only outside.
All the upper floors in our houses here are made of concrete too.

>>1957535
here in Germany people just have to over engineer. we removed our garden path and it was made from 6" of concrete, on top 2" thick concrete pavers and 8" of gravel underneath. and our whole driveway is this thick.

this is why Germans make the best demo hammers.

>>1957979
Yep. You sound like every engineer I've ever spoken with. Completely clueless.
Rebar that corodes causes cracks. Rebar placed in concrete on top of a vapor barrier and inside a building stays dry after the initial mix water disipates. 30 days is a well documented cure time. 4 inches is the standard.

You should ask your school for a refund.

Composition, curing, conditioning, and coverage. Never done contrete but I assume that properly covering the concrete with plaster and having tightly packed sediment is necessary to prevent chemical and physical abrasion. Next, the composition matters; Greeks and Romans poured concrete superstructures that where made of dusts that held well in their particular environment. Finally I'm sure that you wouldn't want to set the concrete at an abrasive time span such as during sever weather fluctuation or during icing.

>>1958198
You pretty much got it.

no it's a concrete thing. regardless of configuration (flat and thin or cube and dense) or reinforcing applied, concrete will crack, period. you just haven't noticed. that is the simple reason control joints are made.. i.e. make the concrete crack where most suiting.

>>1958198

The Romans even had a damned good underwater setting concrete. The secret ingredient is blood. Supposedly (as written) it was all pig's blood. (Not written: everyone not a citizen of the Holy Roman Empire is a pig.)
(Sure, some of them too.)

>>1958239
It's a shitty concrete thing. A proper mix and adequate reinforcement plus a full cure cycle will prevent cracking in a house foundation. Allowing water ingress and freezing as well as chemical build up and corrosion of reinforcement will cause cracks. Steps can be taken to avoid this with the use of very hard aggregate. High cement content, fines being added as pozzolans and the use of a hard trowel finish. Using a densifier helps alot. This would only be feasible for a patio or driveway, it would be a waste of money in a foundation and completely ridiculous for something as large as a highway. Concrete doesn't have to crack, but sometimes it's the only economical thing to do.

>>1958190
And the best cannibal killers

>>1957535
US houses will be demo'ed in fifty years and replaced with more expensive homes due to growth. Europe is full so they may as well build for the ages.

Why are people so offended by appropriate design choices? Life itself is ephemeral. Garages are for car storage and cracks only offend autspergtards. I reinforce my slabs but I do rude things to them consumers will never need to do.

I want an explanation why disposable housing offends manchildren. I don't need a home longer than I will live. The next generation will tear it down because of styling and technology. A home more than a decade old is ancient tech and Americans move often while Euros have no disposable income. We don't need a Parthenon. It does not serve us.

>>1957535
Why does the control joint stop short of the end of the slab?

>>1958037
illegal beaners willing to work for 1/10 the cost, under the table because they're already getting welfare and housing paid for because of the 10 kids they shat out over here.

>>1958990
If the bar wasn't set at "high school dropout who can barely read and write", then maybe the mexicans wouldn't be replacing the likes of you.

>>1959005
I work in STEM, you stupid piece of shit faggot. The home town I grew up in has been overrun by beans and they're taking the jobs that would otherwise go to highschoolers or college students, while white americans are forced to pay for their welfare leeching. In tech we're being overrun by poo-in-loos for those sweet diversity quotas which is just as bad.

Diversity makes people miserable
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1467-9477.2007.00176.x

I hope someone in your family gets raped by a nigger.

>>1959016
>I work in STEM, you stupid piece of shit faggot.
Oh really?
What exactly is the job description of STEM?
Or are you a larping NEET who hasnt actually been in the workforce yet?

>I hope someone in your family gets raped by a nigger.

Sorry, none of my family works in the low level trades, and none of my family stupidly hopped into the code monkey bubble. So that just isnt going to happen. No nigger nor mexican nor pajeet is going to rape or take their jobs my friend.

>>1959021
Cuckstain, the best part of you dribbled down your mother's leg. Filthy shitskin lover.

Cucks like you love indoctrinating your family into relaxing around blacks so it's highly likely that one of your family members is going to get raped or stabbed by a shitskin. That's the best thing about antwhites like you, you're the architects of your own destruction.

And I like my job except when I have to deal with LGTBBQ faggots like you.

>>1959028
>bunch of deflections

Yeah, just like I thought. This guy is literally a NEET.

>>1959031
What's your reddit account name, you faggot?

>>1959005
Don't forget alcoholic with an opioid problem and a restraining order for domestic violence. They won't even look at you in the trades if you are white unless you have one of those things or are living in a trailer park and have a $90k pickup truck.

>>1959034
One white alcoholic tradesman is worth 10 limp wristed numales posting on /diy/ about how based illegal immigrants are.

>>1959037
Too bad they need a ride to work like a schoolboy because they aren't allowed to operate a motor vehicle on public roads anymore. Then you have to deal with them bitching all day about their pay being garnished for alimony/child support. Let's not forget about the time the ol' boy had a few too many Dudfinders, I mean Budweisers, at lunch and ran over the OSHA rep with a Skylift. That cost the company a few grand in fines. Then there was the nailgun episode, which speaks for itself:

https://nypost.com/2019/10/09/construction-worker-shoots-himself-with-nail-gun-tries-to-remove-nail-with-pliers/

>>1959044
Better than working with a numale like you.

>>1958196
Concrete Mix designer here, it wont crack if it has enough air entrained on batch, but most companies obviously do little to no QC on residential work, not to mention slump related issues

if it's good mud and treated correctly, it will not crack. Dont bother trying to explain that to the drivers or Mexicans, however

Concrete will crack given enough force.

>Canadian city opens up a new sub
>rushes the job. Used to be a swamp, in the prairies.
>ground gets prepped for burb houses already going up
>pure cast pours with rebar. The ground here is really really bad.
>like so bad if you have a block basement and your gutter leaks in a month your walls are done.
>entire businesses based on reinforcing basements flourish here. Fuck they write songs about it.
>1/2 to 3 Mil homes go onto market. Families move in.
>Barely a year the families have to move out. Houses sinking, shifting, walls punching inwards finished basement destroyed along with other floors due to the stresses.
>20 or so houses went up. Most are junk now. No more building for 10 years until drainage is effective or substrate is replaced entirely.

>>1959044

What's the issue with the nailgun? Accidents happen, and he tried to pull the nail out but couldn't. I'd do the same thing if it happened. A dose of antibiotics and he is back to work the same day.

>>1957535
>I've never seen a garage with a cracked concrete floor
sad to hear that you don't get out much, but this is 4chan so you are at home

>>1957535
My father is a high end paint contractor. Over time you see the cheats that home builders use, like paying less for thinner slabs, resulting in pic related.
It's not their fault tho. People are too stupid to inspect their purchases and still buy an overpriced home with a tight lot and very close neighbors with a 30 year mortgage.
This housing bubble is super weird, and unless the dollar collapses, it will never pop.

>>1957535
>>1957565
>>1957585
RENT FREE EUROcucks. Get bent and suck a fat one.

>>1959562
I live in the south so air entrainment wasn't on my mind, but you're correct.

>>1958190
there was a time i think probably 60s, were concrete was used like nothing

my neighbor tried to remove a concrete stair case with ~5 stairs, after chipping up one stair the saw it was made entirely out of concrete and just left it like that lol

>>1959755
Consolidation's a bitch lol. Geotechnical surveys, who needs em.

>>1958196
>4" inches is the standard
Oh you're a residential contractor. I don't think about your standards much since I'm a commercial contractor. Enjoy wasting your time curing your driveway for an extra 3 weeks when you should have just ordered better mud. Curing compound goes a long way too but if your laborers are so worthless that you can afford to have them stand around and baby sit a curing slab then your budget is probably too tight for curing compound. You guys are also trash at de-mucking and compacting the subgrade, so all the curing in the world wont stop it from cracking when the subgrade shifts.

I don't understand any of this thread lol

>>1958190
>>1959865
You guys overbuilt some other stuff in the 40s too

>>1957535
So he rented the concrete saw and stopped before getting to the door??? Wtf


Also, most volume American builders build walk out basement homes which always take moving dirt which is why so much of our concrete blows.

Also, it doesn't fucking matter

>>1960324
commercial encompasses a very large area. There are no standards in commercial. Every job is different. You would know that if you had ever seen a job site. A dam isnt going to be the same as a walmart as a 40 story apartment. You sound like a moron. I put curing blankets on my pours, it takes way less time than spraying compound. roll that shit out over 1000 square feet in about 30 seconds. its also reusable, and they can be heated if its winter time. You sound like a moron. we remove certain types of expansive clay, and replace with lime and native soils, we compact it with jumping jacks and drive piles in extreme situations. You sound like a moron.

>>1960324
now are you a contractor or an engineer. Because in one post you say you are an engineer and then in another post you say you are a contractor. Im calling bullshit on everything you say.

>>1960800
>There are no standards in commercial
Ill make sure to tell that to the threshold inspector next time hes on site. He'll get a kick out of it.

>>1960801
>contractors dont hire engineers
You're an idiot if you think this.

>>1960836
>threshold inspector
I see you work in Florida, He would know which standard hes working on, you are such a retarded pile of dog shit, there is no single standard. There is no single standard in anything, every building is different. If you are making a condo near the beach or a walmart that is being put on reclaimed waste land. You sound really fucking stupid.

>>1960837
contractors usually get hired by engineers. Rarely the other way around. Well not rare but usually the other way. Also not relevant to what I said.

>>1960849
>Theres so many different buildings theres no way there are any standards.
I guess we can fire all our QC team and burn the ASTM manuals that take up a wall in the trailer. You sound like a blithering fool. Please stop working on other peoples property before you hurt sombody.

>>1960850
>Rarely the other way around.
Contractors will hire an engineer to approve or design something like removing a load bearing wall and adding a beam in its place, as one example of many.

>>1960850
You're thing of the engineer of record (EOR) which works for the client. Contractors hire engineers both as employees and for third party consultation.

>>1960880
there is not any one standard. Can you not read? are you mentally handicapped? Just the fact that you said it takes a wall means you understand what I am saying. there are multiple standards.

>>1960882
oh so now your talking about modifying buildings in residential scenarios. You really are god damned moron.

>>1960887
No shit kackass. Theres no one standard of anything. Its a ridiculous point made by an insufferable fool.

>>1960891
uh well, thats your original argument, so go fuck yourself.

>>1960893
Show me where I said that there is one commercial standard. Ill wait.

>>1960898
>>Theres so many different buildings theres no way there are any standards.
>I guess we can fire all our QC team and burn the ASTM manuals that take up a wall in the trailer.

eat my ass you unemployed faggot.

>>1960900
>Standards
As in plural
I rest my case I did not say that. You however said there are No standards. Which is of course ridiculous but par for the course coming from you.

>>1960903
oh I see, you are retarded and maybe speak English only as a joke, Ill hand it to you I only speak one myself, but I speak it good.

>>1960907
>I speak it good.
I hope this was supposed to be a joke.

>>1960909
I hope you are a joke.

>>1960907
I see you no longer have any substance to add to the argument and have degraded to strictly peraonal attacks. Good day you poor fool.

I dont need to. once Ive won, whats the point? Another trophy in my internet arguments trophy holder.

>>1960912
Gentlemen, these are troubled times, can’t we all just get along, it’s times like these the US need to come together and accept no one person is the ultimate authority on cracking concrete. Let’s put our differences aside celebrate the incoming Joe Biden presidency, and more importantly BUILD BACK BETTER

>>1957590
You're meant to do driveway and garage THICKER and have it on top of highly compacted ground. Pref roadbase

>>1960850
Wrong

>>1959562
Isn't air entrainment used for freeze thaw resistance? I'd like to understand how it can aid in preventing shrinkage cracking as I haven't heard of that before

>>1957979
>Construction Engineer here.
>Rebar causes cracks
you must have slept through all your classes and caught every other word because that's a retarded statement

>>1961108
oh I see you are unemployed as either a laborer contractor or engineer

>>1961176
Ill admit that was a bit hasty. Its just asier to say that then list every way rebar can cause a crack or also that due to some other factor a crack will form at the location of the rebar.

>>1959865
yes it was build in the 60s

>>1960536
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valentin_submarine_pens


>Because it seemed impossible to destroy Valentin by bombing it, the decision was made to destroy it by blasting. This idea was later abandoned because the blasting would have caused severe damage to the nearby villages of Rekum and Farge including the power-station in Farge.

they believed the collapsing mass of concrete could cause a earthquake

>>1958528
That doesn't sound sustainable

>>1961830
It's only sustainable as long as people continue to want new construction and can pay for it, eventually it will self limit so nothing is the problem

>>1961279
dude the only time a rebar actually "causes" the crack is when it starts rusting either due to being placed too close to the outside or the concrete being badly protected from weather

>>1961160
was also wondering this

>>1957590
Why? Who gives a shit if it cracks? It is a parking space. It's not like it's got a building it is holding up. It'll have like 3-4 tons on it max. Often times the floor is just a thin slab and not part of the actual foundation, which is around the edges and not directly joined with it.