/diy/ - Do It Yourself

Building houses in the US is all about production. Theres no point in setting up scaffolding if all it does is eat up time.

>>1443437
i've worked on steep pitched roof <35 degrees with just a harness and found we could done a better job and faster if we had steel scaffold errected

>>1443436
We use disposable brown serfs

I even roofed without a harness once when I was a lil youngin. That wasnt a jobsite though, it was my familys house.

Fuck roofing though. Im from a part of CA where it gets over 100 in the summers, sometimes over 110.

>>1443442
this, beaners don’t know any better, or care.

>>1443436
It is actually illegal in most places, to not use certain gear, but nothing is done about it until after someone falls off. The USA is all about local laws. There's no federal law about such things. So, it is up to the state, county, or city/town to make the laws then enforce them. The people who do roofing are disposable dumbshits anyway. It is a good method for removing stupid people from the gene pool.

>>1443527
I've never seen harnesses, rails, or any other safety gear being used out here in BFE. I've seen 4 people fall off the roofs too, though only 1 was hurt bad enough to need the emergency room. One caught himself before it was too late or he'd be dead.

>>1443540
Where I live afaik harnesses are required by law but not scaffolding. I think. I dont roof and try to avoid getting off the ground at all. My dad fell off a ladder and landed on his knee on cement. This was 30ish years ago but he still can't walk quite right.

Born in Fresno, then Santa Cruz now in Monterey btw.

>>1443540
>>It is actually illegal in most places
>>Illegal
>>most places

Look, we all know if it doesn't involve illegals or free hand outs, it's probably illegal in cuckafornia.

>>1443577
You can check the codes & laws for most larger municipalities online. A lot of places started making it law when the Occupational Safety and Health Act of 1970 came about.

>>1443436
why would you need scaffold if you can just stand on the pitch.. I kinda get it for something really steep but then its in the way and you are still leaning over

>>1443527
>>1443442
just had my roof redone after a few hail storms fucked up the old one... 10 mexicans showed up, ripped the old one off, cleaned that shit up and had new tar paper and shingles down in 3 hours.

fyi- my roof is only like a 4-12 pitch

>>1443612
>just had my roof redone after a few hail storms fucked up the old one... 10 mexicans showed up, ripped the old one off, cleaned that shit up and had new tar paper and shingles down in 3 hours.

>Stealing muh $50 an hour union job with benefits and pensions

>>1443577
California is 100% set up to exploit the cheap labor that illegals represent. And lots of stuff is illegal because we don't wanna end up like you lead-drinkers in who-gives-a-fuck-about-it murrica. One of the great things about this current president - he's fucking the federal regs. Leaving it up to the state. Which means all the shitty, dangerous, toxic, slave labor work will keep getting done by illegals, and the red states. Where you think we ship our toxic waste and depleted uranium too lol. Arizona and Tennessee and shit.

in England we always use scaffolding because whether reroofing or laying a new roof we will have to have a place to put several tons of ceramic tiles. it's also much safer. the benefits of ceramic tiles are obvious and have been for centuries: a well tiled roof should last for over 100 years.

>>1443640
>in England we always use scaffolding

>Flat roof
>3.28084-foot tall knee wall around the entire perimeter of the building.
>Stair access to the roof.
>Have to be certified retarded to fall off.

Welp, time to put up the scaffolds gents. Also, remember to keep three points of contact at all times whenever you are more than 6.096 decimeters in the air. I want to see every one of you stooped over dragging a hand on the ground if you walk anywhere while up on that roof.

Don't forget to call your supervisor if you need to use the bathroom. They will want to observe to make sure you shake it the prescribed number of times and/or wipe in the proper widdershins direction as approved in Workplace (Health, Safety and Welfare) Regulations Series L24.

>>1443635
>>Stealing muh $50 an hour union job with benefits and pensions

unions went and fucked themselves by getting greedy and becoming corrupt so dont bitch when you are out of a job

>being proud of living in commiefornia
lol

>>1443436
No idea wtf u are on about. Me and my best friends built a mantion with me monkey climbing and his 400 pound brother counter weight

The next place i fell building a church and almost died

>>1443640
its mostly cement tile or corrugated sheet steel "Colorbond" here in convictland
samething with scaffold its just so much easier espeically if you have to put in spouting, downpipes and box gutters

>>1443436

productivity > safety

good news is we have a steady flow of beaners who are replaceable and they know it.

>>1443819
isnt OSHA a big thing for you guys over there

>>1443827

OSHA only cares if you call them. what spic is gonna report his boss and lose his $40 dollars a day

>>1443819
what about all the white roofers

>>1443832
>white roofers
meth heads who are working under the table anyways.

>>1443673
Ironically they use scaffolding even when redoing a flat roof!

>>1443832
those are called formen

>>1443612
And it's gonna take 3 minutes of rain to destroy your roof again. You'd better have someone else take a look at it before you start taking a shower in your living room.

>>1443436
if you're replacing a roof you're also checking the drainage plumbing. good luck replacing guttering 3m off the ground without a platform to work on. or idk maybe people get damaged roofing and dont bother to check this. you're not required to use scaffolding to work on roofing anywhere. the point being that a roof can be of an arbitrary height and you're not working on the siding. you only use scaffolding if there's nothing for you to stand on directly below you.

>>1443827
OSHA is too small to have any sort of real presence in residential construction, it also only applies to employees. Most jobs in residential construction are done by contract.

>>1443440
Laying asphalt shingles? You're high.

>>1443860
lol its already rained since then.. its shingles, not rocket science.. they are going to get destroyed in the next few years too from hail according to what neighbors are telling me. Apparently golf ball sized hail is pretty normal around here. The last roof was only 5 years old and class4 as well.

I quit roofing when they started all this safety shit 30 years ago. Then they relaxed about it anyway. Oh well good riddance.

>>1443436
>North American roofers
You mean Central Americans? Nobody cares.

They're cheap and expendable, and they have a death wish since they live on roofs.

>>1444169
>OSHA is too small to have any sort of real presence in residential construction

This

>>1443640
No use wasting that on a roof on a house that will be lucky to make 50 years... we just have a shitload more space to build than you bongs so theirs always another place you can plunk a house down... whereas I think you guys build them to last on a different timescale than ours because your on a bloody island.

>>1443527
and zero humidity. shut the fuck up you pussy and get some real southern heat.

>>1444371
>No use wasting that on a roof on a house that will be lucky to make 50 years...
The absolute state of american mentality.
You are like the nigger-chinese of construction, even your homes are single-use.
Well guess wh, motherfucker - some places in the world have this thing called "culture" and "heritage". When you build something good, you want it to last.

>>1443436
Worked under the table for just over 3 years in a grunt/bundle humping position because I hate people enough to prefer doing it over customer service related jobs and had no alternatives because I'm a professional fuck up. When the terrifying jobs started coming in, we were gradually pushed to start neglecting safety in order to stay profitable.

No safety gear 80% of the time as productivity was favored above all else. If you could stand on it, you could work without safety gear unless you were dealing with 30-40ft + drops, large overhangs, tricky spots or happened to be contracted on large commercial jobs where gear was mandatory. The saying was "if you fall off of the roof, you're fired before you hit the ground". Ironically the only broken bone I suffered happened outside of work.

$150-$200/day on good days. Now I do it on the side when I need to make rent and can cherry-pick the jobs I do. Safety slowed us all down to the point of not being profitable because competition was high and prices were unreasonably low.

When you're dealing with small residential stuff and you've developed cat-like footing, harnessing up for a 10' low slope is just counterproductive.

Watching "legit" crews harness up and take almost 2 weeks to do a 20sq. bungalow so they could charge the homeowner obscene prices for installation was pathetic and indefensible.

When safety became mandatory but the company wanted jobs done at the same pace (1-3 per day) and wouldn't pay fairly, we disbanded and went our separate ways.

Also, all three OH&S guys we dealt with over those years were Arab. Strange coincidence I guess.

I nail down boards to stand on and move them as i go

>>1443803
This, also easier for all the cladding/exterior work.

>>1444475
its honestly easier to tear down a timber frame house and start again rather than renovate it.

you have architect confused with civil engineer. you build something for your use. 50 years ago we used to have the daughters room as a legit architectural choice. girls could only enter and exit their bedrooms through the parents bedroom. to stop the sluts from sneaking out. then in the 80s it became trendy to not fuck within earshot of your teenage children and divide the house so that the kids live on one side of the living areas and parents on the other.

>>1444512
Em, you do know that wooden houses are an american thing?

>>1444520
And scandinavian.

>>1443442
An idiots like me that'll crawl up there with no safety gear and expect to not be a crippled for life idiot

>>1444475
>muh culture
>muh heritage.

Be 65 year old man.
Be retire
>guess ill build a brick building and lead sheet the roof so it lasts 290 years and cost 30 times as much...

We cant afford to do shit with out funny money being worth less and less the harder we work

>>1444506

Sure. Keep thinking that way. It only took 8 feet for me to be crippled. And i wasnt a fat fuck until after that when i couldnt walk for a year

>>1443635
>3 hours

And I bet Jeff shill charged you full Union price.

That's what really pisses me off about the $5k quote I've been getting. Just don't see the value in the sheets of tar and beaners throwing it down.

>>1443436
because walking on a roof isn't difficult.

>>1443527
>dry heat
no part of CA is hot at all

ITT : a bunch of people who have never been on a a roof in their life

>>1443436
Because when a mexican falls and breaks his spine there are already 3 crossing the border to replace him

>>1444520
timber frame construction is a big thing here in germany as well, and build to last ~100 years
although we have real wood not these tiny 4x2

>>1444625
then why is part of it a desert?

>>1444702
dont be upsetting the poor burgers here now Hans. The Great Murican Constructs of 4x2 shall bear witness to McCraftsmanship, McPride Innajob and outlive us all.*
>*Unless windy, etc.

>>1444625
Are you trolling?

>>1444729
>deserts are hot no matter what
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/desert
>Desert, waste, wilderness refer to areas that are largely uninhabited. Desert emphasizes lack of water (though not specifically high temperature);

>>1444750
no, cali really is mild compared to all of the "hot" places on earth.

>>1444783
And because of said lack of water the area is incapable of stabilizing it’s climate. You see it’s the moisture in the ground, that absorbs heat and the air gets cooled via evaporate cooling and then at night slowly radiating it back into the air that lead to a mild climate. Deserts get extremely hot in the day and can drop to freezing at night the moment the Sun sets.

We just had the hottest rain ever recorded in the World, 119F here in California. And you forgot that the hottest temp is usually in Death Valley, CA.

>>1444830
>building a house and doing roofing in death valley
think again, dummy

>>1444830
highest reliably recorded temperature in death valley is 129 actually

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6028923/The-worlds-hottest-rain-fell-small-California-city-119-degrees-Fahrenheit.html

it even says so on your 119 rain article

>>1444852
autism....

>>1444852
So what’s your point...

>>1444850
I take it you don’t understand thread replies...

>>1444875
>entire reply chain is because they think it's hot when roofing
it isn't, so I guess you can't read.

>>1444475
How’s the WiFi and central air in your Bronze Age castle anon? Still use the gas lights? Or did you work out how to run knob and tube for an Edison incandescent lamp in your parlor for tea? Just make sure to turn it off before you put the kettle on or you’ll blow out a fuse...

>>1444783
Dude, you have no idea what you're talking about. There are definitely places that are hot in California. You want to rule out Death Valley? Okay. Try Redding. It's not a desert, and it's pretty far north. The joke there is that its name in native American translates to "too fucking hot to live here." Regularly hits 115° in the summer. But it's a dry heat, doesn't feel a degree over 108°.

>>1444731
Fuckoff cuck im diging a bunker.

>>1444702
Its 2x4 u backwards fuck

>>1444648
Never again. My crippled ass stays ground level forever

>>1443635

Must be why Califucks are staying and not immigrating to red states in droves.

>>1443436
What are you, some little french girl?
Just get up there for christ's sake

>>1443436
Time is money, or something

>>1444625
>t. mr. mcmoron
>>1444729
>then why is nearly half of it a desert?
fixt
>>1444783
>cali
Only true to form faggots say this. Wakass knob-gobbling starfucking wannabes. Never said by those born here.
>mild compared to all of the "hot" places on earth.
HOTTEST
TEMP
EVER
RECORDED
ON
THIS
PLANET
(Yes, Cletus, that means Earth. The entire Earth.)
134 °F (56.7 °C) on July 13, 1913 at 36°2729N 116°5215W
>checkout the sundry other records this area, being Death Valley, CA situated in the Mojave desert, has on the books. Ya, not all those other "hot" places, like uranus after a weekend of nonstop friction, twinkboi.

>>1445052
>>1445053
Enjoy those knees at fifty, that's if you make it there.

>>1445066
>July 10, 1913*
ffs

>>1444648
I helped my dad reshingle the roof on his house years ago. It's a shitty job. You have to watch him, because at 75, he's still likely to get up there by himself to redo storm damaged shingles. Mom is pretty good about calling me if she knows what he is up to.

>>1444970
yes I do, it's not hot and you don't do roofing in death valley, dummy
hot is also an opinion.
there's no temperature without humidity that I'd feel worse in vs anything with humidity.

>>1445066
>being born in cali
I'd kill myself honestly, what a loser
a) you don't do roofing in death valley
b) that temp isn't real nor does it count toward record since it wasn't recorded verify-ably.

Americans really build houses with 2 by 4 cm wood? How do they even hold themselves up?

>>1444895
Oh, so building houses from thin sticks is progress now?
Building things that last is being backward?
>wifi
I love it how some Americans think they have better internet access than Europeyans.

>>1445156
You have real trouble with reading comprehension, don't you?

>>1445309
irony

>>1443832
Contractor here. I make $550/sq to strip and reinstall shingles. But that's because there are no beaners here so we don't have to earn slave wages.

>>1445315
Troll.

>>1444881
Man are you retardation incarnate.

>>1445070
So. Thermometers were accurate then.

>>1445333
death valley is fucking hot, people also don't live there

>>1445335
http://articles.latimes.com/2001/jun/10/local/me-8861

But if you actually follow the thread, Death Valley was brought up as rebuttal to the “deserts aren’t hot post” not roofing per se.

>>1445069

How is what he is doing any more stressful on his knees than other labour intensive jobs?

>>1445052
>>1445053
I was thinking these guys are all pansies but what this guy is doing is genuinely terrifying even in video form...

>>1445383
t. Someone who hasn't been up a ladder before

>>1444372
fuck I flinched lol

>>1445331
>waa it's too hot in death valley for me to roof elsewhere

>>1445391

I have been up many a ladder. I also have no idea what flatland looks like.

>>1445399
Do you even understand how replies and post numbers work here? I haven't even mentioned Death Valley, so I don't know what you're even saying now. Unless it's like I said:

>Trolling

>>1445419
>replies to a chain about death valley
>askes others if they know how it works
lol idiot

>>1445441

I did not reply to a chain.

>>1445274
Yes, it’s what society progressed to after we worked out how to stack rocks which is where your still stuck at.

>>1445442
idiot

>>1445274
Easy when your country is the size of some of our cities.

>>1443436
>>1443527
I've never roofed with a harness. I worked for 3 roofing companies and they never gave me or wore harnesses. I worked for a contractor on grain terminals putting up catwalks and spouts and they still didn't give me a harness. fuckin a

>>1445525
Tbh I've never seen one either. I've never roofed, besides cleaning debris and carrying up the ladder for some friends because I'm a pussy afraid of heights but still, I've never seen it. One of those buddies does roofing for a living too. It always just looked to me like you just make sure you've got sure footing.
On the other side, I have heard of a guy who would place the shingles on the pitch and not peak, which lead to the shingles sliding down toward him at a point, and he had to jump them. That's just his own dumb fault though and he still didn't get hurt aside from his pride since like 3 guys told him before it happened not to do that

>>1445506

I get the point that map is trying to make but...fucking Alaska?

Really?

>>1445053
>>1445052
Hnnnnggg OSB

>>1445442
>feeding the lame excuses for trolls
jus stahp ples

>>1445383
Pick up (d/l if that's ur thing) an anatomy and physiology book. Open. Read. All the forces at play, extreme in that example, will guarantee after a short span at a full time job that one's weight bearing joints will be blown out. A decade if lucky. Also, the pitch doesn't need to be that crazy, that's just hastening the inevitable. Doubt that every home is like that, though.

>>1445567
I have a great time when I go to Alaska.

>>1445600

The 2% of it that's actually populated or more towards the areas where there's _nothing_ for 200 miles in any direction?

>>1445604
The populated part.

>>1445052
>>1445053
>foam "sheathing"
>osb
>staples
>trusses
Canadian framing is gross.

>>1445615
I'm sure there are shitty little tinderbox suburbs build like this thing in the states but yeah theres a lot of flimsy shit houses going up rn. going to be intersting to see how they do the next 50 years

>>1445624
Maybe they will all fall down like that bridge in Italy just did.... My house was built in 67 making it 51 years old. I see no real difference between the way it was built and what is being built these days.

>>1445504
lol trolled you good as fuck pussyfag

>>1446127
must feel bad being so dumb

>>1445596

>All the forces at play, extreme in that example, will guarantee after a short span at a full time job that one's weight bearing joints will be blown out.

What I don't understand. Is that he does that for a few hours a day. And returns to flat, maintained pathways for the rest of his time and he gets his knees blown out in a decade, but then where I live most people are on uneven terrain until they enter their house and we have lots of people, even past labourers who carried 100lbs sacks of cement on terrain ssteeper than 60° (we are talking digging holes in the hillside to create a soil ladder) walking into their century birthdays.

Why don't we have more crippled people in my.country?

>>1446146
because 3rd world people havent evolved as much.. 3rd worlder's are tougher than 1st worlders.. I am ok with admitting this.

>>1445567
Alaska is just the worst case,
On the average case we're talking states the size of Romania that are just as densely populated as Alaska.

Because we're not pussies.
>>1443442
Nah, more like too scared or lazy for white people to do it.

>>1446146
This. I live in PA, and do way rougher shit to my knees than what that guys doing. How can anything get done if you don't? I get the feeling these "safety first" guys on diy don't actually do anything themselves.

>>1444506
>people taking safety precautions are indefensible

Give your head a shake. There are no beaners here so the only roofers are white since pajeet refuses to do any manual labour. Luckily, this means you can still have livable wages for this type of work. The jobs that are less safe, you charge more for because you know it's going to take longer. If your house has a crazy roof, you should have considered the cost of maintainin that shit before you bought it.

They take the safety here very seriously. If you're caught without working at heights training and don't have proper gear, you will be fined up to $20 000. They usually reserve that number for the owner who allows workers to do that shit, as they're seen as responsible for all safety. while the worker will often be fined about $5000 if caught. They have people who are dedicated to enforcing this, driving around looking for work sites. I know a guy who got dinged with a $20grand fine. They let the workers off scott free, though. If someone falls off of a roof, they'll shut the business down permanently. I've heard of business owners paying guys off who got injured to lie about how they were injured (i.e at home working on the eaves or someshit).

>>1445615
The foam sheathing has to be covered by backer board where I live. It's used as extra insulation and vapour barrier. But I agree I wouldn't want my house built like that but it's up to code.

>>1443673
>hurr durr let's mock security guidelines because fuck not getting severely injured out of incompetence

>>1445615
Pretty sure the white sheeting stuff is thermoply.
What benifit does plywood have over OSB besides being more expensive and warped as all hell after a day in the rain.
Staples hold better than nails, I've ripped off stapled sheeting before and good fucking luck.
Trusses don't sag after 40 years, they make framing the complex and tall ass roofs people want alot easier than cutting a roof by hand let alone getting 16ft above the plates to put in a ridge beam and rafters.

>>1446638
bosses only give a shit if they get fined. protip: dob in your boss. extra protip: do it after he's working with you on an especially shitty job so he thinks its an asshole customer or another contractor he doesnt get along with

>>1445615
foam sheathing? do you mean tyvek house wrap? that stuff is key, its a moisture 'check valve'

>>1446146
>What I don't understand
Absolutely certain this will be obvious once your report is completed. Ya know, the one based on a multi-decade control-adjusted study, with all the fabricated cases and bullshit numbers.
>What I don't understand
And? The path to enllightenment was showed you. Fugg meng, worthless millenitards always insisting on being spoon-fed. You outta diapers yet?
>a couple minute long vids makes me an expert on someone I've never met
>all this anecdotal info from "my country" contradicts your statements and physics as well
Hundred year olds lugging hundred pound sacks up grades, huh? 100° and 100km high, right? Wat are they constructing up there, a hundred pyramids to show up the egyptians? Exactly how many of these stupi, errr, hard working centenarians have you talked to? Lemme guess, 100.

>>1446403
>I live in PA, and do way rougher shit to my knees
Prey tell superman, it's story time.

FTR, I do actually do something myself. Installing, removing, replacing and transporting shit that weighs anywheres from 300 to 1200 pounds. Most times on flat or nearly flat surfaces and not always inna "safe" manner. Safety first, ya, to a point. Whether safe or combined with a hairy moment or three, I get shit done. I couldn't care any less how you or that other dipshit over there does it.

>>1447080
>superman
Ive not claimed to be anything supernatural. Don't get your panties in a bunch. What the guy is doing is no doubt dangerous and you'd never catch me doing it. I'm not going to defend that, I'm just agreeing that it's no worse on the knees then many other labor intensive jobs. For one, laying carpet can be way worse. I also do autoglass on heavy machinery, like busses, cranes, and backhoes. You can't set up scaffolding and ladders to do a bus windshield and keep up with me using the engine bay as a jungle gym. It's just not going to happen, or like the more recent example I hade to climb on top of the door of a party van, one foot on the arm rest, the other on the seat to cut out and reinstall the window above the windshield.

>>1443573
I’m in Sacramento and no one ever wears one

>>1443436
scaffolding? harnesses? que?

>>1443436
I roofed for 2 years and we used scaffolding and roof jacks quite a bit. I worked with a small hillbilly crew of drunkards and ex-cons fwiw. Point being we weren't a big company/legit company but instead ran by a single contractor. Likely many don't use scaffolds because they can't afford or don't want to pay for them.

>>1443440
I've set up scaffold. You're looking at adding an hour or more just setting it up. I've had my roof replaced this summer. It took them 4 hours from start to finish, removed old roof, replaced some wood, and reshingled by noon. The scaffold would've meant 6 hours minimum. Screw that.

>>1446746
We found the guy who wears a life vest in the bathtub.

>>1446746
Where's your commentary license?

My dads a roofer scaffold is expensive and pointless just use work boots and dont be a pussy

I nailed some cushion to a piece of plywood and sit/lean on it when a roofs to steep to walk

>>1443442
This

>>1445268
Because we design the structure in a way that allows it to happen.

>>1447241
>no worse on the knees then many other labor intensive jobs
Ya, NO! First, I rockit commando so the only one here wearing panties is you. That is clearly evident as replacing glass, heavy machinery or not, is not taxing your knees. Laying carpet, sure. But, climbing on the captain's seat of a party bus, pffffft. Wat you're failing to see is the innumerable steps that monkey in the video is taking while at an extreme angle. Only to top it off with a good jump at the end. The accumulation is wat fukks you.

>>1447957
What I'm actually missing is explaining the constant jumping involved with climbing up and down the engine bay of a bus, and my description of what I did to replace that glass.
Spoiler alert, it involved a 6 foot jump down without room to absorb the shock properly to get to the other side quickly enough to continue installation on that side. Regardless, you admit carpet guys have it worse, therefore it doesn't matter what I do, you're wrong and I'm right you fucking retard. Labor is by nature hard on knees unless you're a pussy that'll never get hired to actually do it.

>>1447957
This one isn't the same one, but this was my position while I had another guy cut the last bit out so I could pick it up higher and jump down from my position as its problem was a leak so I needed to save the glass.
Had to pick it up more vertical so I could hop down and make sure the glass wouldn't break because we were reinstalling it with better windshield urethane.
Least of the hardships knee wise but closest I could find in my gallery to the described situation.
Worse is wolfington bus windshields with rubber gaskets and a locking bead. It's a 2 man job that sometimes requires me to do it alone because my employees are shit.
It involves this jump many times over, 1 with the windshield in hand and also climbing back up with the windshield in hand.
The reason we blue collar guys get paid so much is because it does fuck our bodies up, but it needs to be done.
That's why women and children don't do them

>>1443436
WTF is that jabrone doing? No tarpaper, no wrap, no dripedge?