VEGAN GENERAL

[Anonymous No.9639141]

A place for discussing all things vegan recipes, ethics & health

Meat consumption is ruining the environment.
- Pollutes rivers
- Forests cleared for livestock
- Causes soil degradation
- Massive inefficiency
- Major contributor to global warming.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_impact_of_meat_production

Vegan Health

https://www.reddit.com/r/veganfitness/wiki/index

https://www.reddit.com/r/vegan/wiki/dieteticorgs

Animals ethics crash course - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3-BX-jN_Ac

The most common and well known argument is the argument from marginal cases. Loosely speaking, the argument contends that animals as sentient & intelligent as retards should have the same moral status

http://www.iep.utm.edu/anim-eth/#SSH1fi

(Meatcucks please read the following before leaving a stupid comment)

Ad Hominem - https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem e.g. vegans are faggots

Strawman - https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman e.g. vegans want white genocide

Appeal to nature - https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/appeal-to-nature e.g. meat is natural and therefore ethical

Tu Quoque - https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/tu-quoque e.g. vegans buy computers

Morality is relative - Science, logic, mathematics are all based on axioms that are not proven, what is different about morality and moral axioms? Think this argument through before arguing for it, it is not as simple as you think. (most philosophers are moral realists and believe moral propositions can in fact be true)

Meatcucks please realise the difference between normative ethics (what we ought to do) and descriptive ethics (what beliefs do people have). Normative ethics is what is being discussed with regards to veganism and morality.

e.g.
- people should not eat animals for x reason (relevant normative claim)
- people eat animals for y reason (irrelevant descriptive claim)

Honest Advertising for Omnivores

https://youtu.be/zF_MlhXAjiE

Vegans of 4chan

discord
.gg/gqFR5z

[Anonymous No.9639144]

bacon

[Anonymous No.9639149]

[Anonymous No.9639175]

>>9639141
(you)

[Anonymous No.9639276]

>>9639141

Okay look, it's about time someone finally said something. Listen here heathen, /ck/ is a board dedicated to QUALITY food and QUALITY threads. That leaves little to no room for alternative (read: SHIT) diets, such as veganism. In my personal experience on /ck/, I experienced a transformation from consuming the godawful innard-wreckers known as McDonalds and Mountain Dew, to enjoying the finer things life has to offer, such as Checkers and Bang's.

If there are two things that I've learned here from my time on /ck/, it's that 1.) /ck/ is pronounced /cock/, not /see-kay/. And 2.) You're a stupid fucking nigger lover bitch titties dick slap cock whore spic fucker faggot, all because you made this stupid fucking thread. Bitch. As an experienced 4Chan browser, I can assure you that I FUCKING HATE REDDIT and recommend you go there, as degenerate fag lovers such as yourself deserve to become compost on a cow farm.

Oh, what's that? You don't like cow farms? That's too fucking bad, hippiedick. Thousands of years of procreation among your human ancestors led to you being born. You are the pinnacle of everything they fought, bled, sweat, and died for. And what did you do with this opportunity of a - literal - lifetime? You became a fucking vegan who deserves to be shit on endlessly in death by fucking cows. Nigger titties. Oh, and on a closing note? Yes, I would fucking eat my cowbro if it made you cry. Pussycock. If there's one thing I hate more than niggers, it's plant tards. Find a rope Sammy, you need to die asap.

[Anonymous No.9639281]

>animals as sentient & intelligent as retards should have the same moral status
So you're saying we should start eating tards?
I could get behind that.
Does anyone have a good recipe for potato & potato stew?

[Anonymous No.9639284]

>>9639141
>B12 Deficiency General

[Anonymous No.9639296]

My favorite part of meeting a vegan is when they tell me they're a vegan and won't shut up about it

[chop No.9639302]

>>9639141
I think you guys have a valid point about the environmental impact of eating meat but it drowns in your obnoxiousness.

[Anonymous No.9639304]

>>9639141
>VEGAN GENERAL
Get this shit off my board and fuck off back to >>>/lgbt/

[Anonymous No.9639310]

I'm going for breakfast in an hour just because of this thread I'm ordering an extra side of sausage and bacon. Not even sure I'll eat it either.

[Anonymous No.9639322]

>>9639302
if the point is valid why does it matter if there is obnoxious presentation of said point?

[Anonymous No.9639327]

>>9639322
Probably not the best way to convert people to your cause if you're a gigantic faggot idk

[Anonymous No.9639336]

>>9639284
not really- nor protein or iron deficiency either

[chop No.9639338]

>>9639322
Because you're talking to people, not robots.
If your maths teacher shows up for class naked, shits on the floor, and calls everybody a cunt do you really think it's the perfectly good mathematics on the blackboard you'll remember?

Going vegan really would be very good for the environment but instead of calmly explaining that to people we have PETA people taking off their clothes, covering themselves in blood, and pretending to be steaks at food festivals. You're not winning people over with that crap.

[Anonymous No.9639340]

>animals as sentient as retards should have the same moral status as retards

[Anonymous No.9639344]

>>9639327
If the point is valid that's the only relevant thing. I'm not vegan myself but your reasoning is retarded.

[Anonymous No.9639348]

>>9639338
That's a fair point but i don't think any of the examples given in the OP are as insane as those. It's like any perspective- there are going to be retarded extremists who make it look foolish.

[Anonymous No.9639351]

>>9639344
The point is completely subjective and contextual with lifestyle choice. Do I agree with vegans a lot? Yes, Do I want that to be my lifestyle choice? No. It doesn't help knowing a million asshole vegans either. It puts people off.

[Anonymous No.9639677]

meatcucks will defend this

[Anonymous No.9639711]

>>9639677
No, but I still defend eating them

[Anonymous No.9639739]

ok I have a fwb who is a vegan and I never know what to bring her, when I visit . something that goes with wine or beer ?

we have crappy fruit selection here

[chop No.9639749]

>>9639677
I've seen footage of babysitters doing stuff like that to children. Doesn't mean they're all doing it.

[Anonymous No.9639756]

meatcucks will also defend this

[Anonymous No.9639771]

>>9639677
An interesting glipse into the actions of sociopaths, truly.

May they be caught and punished.

[chop No.9639785]

>>9639756
That looks like a nice quick death.
Do they just throw away the piglets? Do you think they'd let me have one if I asked nicely?

[Anonymous No.9639806]

>>9639677
>posting american farms
>projecting the practices of his shitty country to the rest of the world
where I live, there is something called animal welfare laws and they are very strictly enforced.

[Anonymous No.9639823]

>>9639756
>>9639677

any of these fucks get arrested or what?

[Anonymous No.9639867]

>>9639823
the pig treatment is standard practice, it's called 'thumping'

[Anonymous No.9639878]

>>9639756
>>9639677
>hey look these specific people are cruel to animals so you should feel bad by proxy

[Anonymous No.9639915]

>>9639276
Classic.

[Anonymous No.9639943]

>>9639141
>Meatcucks
To breed and torture then kill and consume something is your idea of being cucked by it? Or is this some attempt to coin a derogatory term for people who don't agree with you? If anythings being cucked its the meat, and the meat eating humans are the bulls. Any way its a shit name, meatfags would be better, even if its outdated.

[Anonymous No.9639944]

>>9639284
>tfw meat animals are supplemented with B12

[Anonymous No.9640052]

>>9639677
based dairy farmers

[Anonymous No.9640062]

>>9639141
What is it with vegans and their obsession with men on steroids?

[Anonymous No.9640091]

>>9639141
>Appeal to nature - https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/appeal-to-nature e.g. meat is natural and therefore ethical
Meat is natural and it was ethical when farms were smaller. An animal on a farm was most likely living a happier life than it would in the wild, where they're constantly fighting and probably going to die a slow and painful death. Factory farming changed that though.

But, cultured/lab-grown meat is probably going to be the biggest help to animals. There are lots of vegans who say they'll eat meat again when this is available in stores, and with a younger generation and maybe things like celebrity endorsements, it'll probably be more easily accepted than giving up animal products entirely. As long as they don't change the nutritional profiles of them (which they're doing, removing lactose from milk, removing iron from red meat, etc. This isn't a good thing for people who don't overconsume red meat or can digest lactose)

I'm not a vegan but I do respect some who do it for moral reasons. Unfortunately there are a lot of vegans who start dehumanizing non-vegans and celebrating things like disease-spreading ticks because a side effect of the disease they spread is an allergy to red meat. They don't see the hypocrisy in that. They form a cult-like mentality where non-vegans aren't worthy, and this turns people off to helping animals. "I'm gonna go eat a big burger now" is a common response to fanatical vegans.

I have more hope in cultured/lab-grown animal products than trying to convert everyone to veganism.

[Anonymous No.9640097]

>>9640091
you act like small-scale farming doesn't exist anymore, which is utter crap.

Yes, factory farming has all sorts of problems (producing shitty albeit cheap meat being one of them). But there are plenty of opportunities to get non-factory-farmed meat as well, especially in the age of pocket computers & easy mail-order shipping.

[Anonymous No.9640154]

>>9639677
m u h poor animuls
ah boo :(
share if u liek ;'(

[Anonymous No.9640161]

>>9640097
It still exists and it's still viable for some people but it's more expensive and not everyone can afford that. But even with small-scale farming you still have to kill the animals, and you're going to have a small number of botched slaughters that result in more suffering. You can say death is natural or whatever but that doesn't mean it's good, and we should be trying to minimize the amount of death required for us to live and thrive.

[Anonymous No.9640171]

>>9639141
She cute

[Anonymous No.9640176]

>>9640161
>but it's more expensive and not everyone can afford that.
They can if they reduce the amount of meat they consume.

>>and we should be trying to minimize the amount of death required for us to live and thrive.
Do you know how many animals get killed when land is cleared for farming and when the actual farming is taking place? Habitat loss. Pesticides. Or simply being smashed alive when pic related goes through a field. Why do people act as if farming vegetables donesn't result in the death of animals?

[Anonymous No.9640178]

>>9639276
>pussycock

[Anonymous No.9640182]

>>9640176
>They can if they reduce the amount of meat they consume.
I only eat meat like once a week but I still don't have a lot of extra money to spend and need to save wherever I can to make sure rent and other bills can be paid on time.

>Why do people act as if farming vegetables donesn't result in the death of animals?
Vegans will say that it still results in less deaths than how many die for meat-eaters to consume, but that's a problem too. We should be trying to develop ways to grow and harvest crops that don't kill those animals.

I've been interested in vertical farming for a while too, if it's viable it'll cut down on pesticides, habitat loss, and the death of animals during harvest.

[Anonymous No.9640186]

>>9639141
Faggot food hipster lies general

[Anonymous No.9640192]

>bla bla bla meat are bad
>bla bla we are not suppose to take meat
>bla bla suddenly PETA bla bla

why cant vegan just talk about their recipe without shaming meat eaters?

[Anonymous No.9640193]

>>9640192
because their food sucks

[Anonymous No.9640196]

>>9639141
Guy in the suit is qt. Who is he?

[Anonymous No.9640202]

>>9639141
Hey, Vegan.
I have a question for you:

What do you plan to do with the 80+% inedible chaff, stems, leaves, stalks, and byproduct of farming staple grains you require for food?

Corn, Soy, Rice, and Grain all produce more inedible material by weight than edible materials.

Also, where are you going to find the farmland appropriate for growing food-quality staple grains?
Land used for hay, field corn (inedible), alfalfa, and other feed crops are not suited for growing human food. They would have poor yields and deplete the soil.

Also, how are you going to fertilize crops, replenish nitrogen, potassium, phosphorus, and calcium without hydrocarbon (oil) based fertilizers?
The traditional method was with animal blood and bone ash.
Without a meat industry, we have no source of those.

I eagerly await your reply.

[Anonymous No.9640215]

>>9640202
Omnivore here. These questions are just retarded.

>80+% inedible chaff, stems, leaves, stalks, and byproduct of farming staple grains you require for food?
Compost. They can also be burned to create energy, or fermented to make ethanol.

>>Also, how are you going to fertilize crops, replenish nitrogen, potassium, phosphorus, and calcium without hydrocarbon (oil) based fertilizers?
Hydrocarbons don't generally contain those chemicals, anon. They contain hydrogen, oxygen, and carbon mostly. Anything else would be vanishingly small. Anyway, to answer your question: compost fertilization and crop rotation, combined with industrially produced fertilizer.

[Anonymous No.9640303]

>>9640215
>Compost. They can also be burned to create energy, or fermented to make ethanol.

Composting takes time and a healthy colony of bacteria and microorganisms. The larger the compost pile, the longer it takes, and the more attention it requires. You can't just dump it in a pile and hope it works. A small 3 pound pile takes 20 days if done perfectly. The amount of time require increases exponentially with the size of the pile. For reference, look at any trash dump that attempts to compost green waste. They have waste there still composting YEARS later.

Burning causes massive pollution, and is highly inefficient. You only get 800 calories per POUND of grass. It takes 540 calories to turn 1 gram of water into steam. It takes 95 (95000 grams) liters of water to produce ONE KWH of energy.

You'd need 65 TONS of burnable chaff for ONE KILOWATT HOUR.
1 ton of coal produces 8141 KWH.

Meanwhile, pigs, chicken, and cattle can process those into usable manure in a few hours, which can be fermented for methane.

Hydrocarbon fertilizers refer to those made via the byproducts of natural gas, coal, and oil refinement, the process makes lots of Ammonia.

[Anonymous No.9640404]

>>9639348
the 'vegans shove it on your face' meme didn't' materialize out of thin air. a large portion of vegans bring it up constantly. further they often berate you into anwsering why you're not 'but what about the animas?', 'but what about the hormones?', 'but what about the environment?'. it gets tiresome and gives the group a bad name.

yes there are extremists in every group that give that group a bad name (see: /pol/ on the right and SJW on the left) but it is so rampant in veganism that people get sick and tired about being asked 'well

[Anonymous No.9640430]

>>9639141
>Its a "vegan makes an obnoxious copypasta, posting literally nothing pertaining to food or cooking, then gets confused and offended that people use xirs thread as a shitpost general" episode

If you act like a retard everyone is going to treat you like a retard. Maybe start the thread with recipes or discussing alternatives to animal products instead of making 80% of the OP "hurr dur. MeatKEKZ are dum" and you can have a thread.

[Anonymous No.9640437]

>>9640303
>Composting takes time and a healthy colony of bacteria and microorganisms.
Sure, but that's hardly a problem.

>>Burning causes massive pollution, and is highly inefficient
That depends entirely on how things are burned. If you just burn things "campfire style" then sure, there is a lot of pollution and wasted heat. If things are burned in an incinerator that has a reclaim system and pre-heats the incoming air it becomes extremely efficient.

I agree completely that letting animals process the waste is a better solution, but pretending this is a "problem" for going vegan is just plain silly. There are far far better arguments out there.

[Anonymous No.9640464]

Is petroleum vegan?

[Anonymous No.9640561]

>>9640303
>Hydrocarbon fertilizers refer to those made via the byproducts of natural gas, coal, and oil refinement, the process makes lots of Ammonia.

Strictly speaking, fertilizer (see: nitrate) is not a byproduct of petrochemical processes - it is a primary product.
First, natural gas goes through steam reformation, which produces carbon oxides and hydrogen gas.
The hydrogen gas is then reacted with nitrogen in the presence of an iron catalyst to produce ammonia (Haber-Bosch process).
Finally, the ammonia is reacted with oxygen to create nitric acid (Ostwald process).

This chain of processes only produces two other products: carbon oxides (mainly dioxide) and water, the latter being economically irrelevant.
Note also that this chain could very well use fermentation-produced methane as a feedstock.

[Anonymous No.9641272]

>>9639276
Holy fucking kek anon my sides

[Anonymous No.9642359]

>>9639340
And just remember! Mein Fuhrer was in fact vegan!

[Anonymous No.9643128]

>>9639943
Paying someone money to kill an animal for you because you know you can't stomach it is what makes you a cuck.

[Anonymous No.9644179]

Aren't all vegan's just trolls? Or are they just granola dumbfucks

[Anonymous No.9644185]

>>9639141
Get your political bullshit of /ck/
AND GO THE FUCK BACK 2 REDDIT

[Anonymous No.9644194]

>>9644179
Lol what a pussy swing. You're supposed to slide the front hand down the shaft and use the natural inertia of the sledge augmented by the drive of the back hand to attain maximum velocity. I'd have split piggies head wide open.