[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / ic / jp / lit / sci / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports ] [ become a patron ] [ status ]
2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/ck/ - Food & Cooking

View post   
File: 289 KB, 500x380, 1434371943468.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6596809 No.6596809 [Reply] [Original]

Should junk food and processed "food" get taxed heavier?

>> No.6596814

No.

>> No.6596820

>>6596809
Yes if the government subsidises healthcare.

>> No.6596822

>>6596809
No I wanna eat that stuff so I don't want it to be more expensive.

>> No.6596825

>>6596822
we all want to eat that stuff, it's designed to appeal to our bodies. But it's bad for our bodies and only good for profit

>> No.6596829

>>6596825
What's your point? Who cares about the fatties that can't control themselves, I want it to be cheap.

>> No.6596831

>>6596829
>Who cares about the fatties that can't control themselves, I want it to be cheap.
This.

>> No.6596833

>>6596809
>Should US be moderately shifted into direction of near-socialistic nannystates like Scandinavia?
Maybe. There's a point when you can't thick headedly blame poverty and crime into people being lazy and have to realize there's something to better in the system.

>> No.6596835

>>6596831
People who pay taxes. People who value infrastructure.

>> No.6596842

/pol/ fucking leave

>> No.6596844

No, let the fat fucks eat as much of it as they want so they die sooner. Make it cheaper would be a better solution.

>> No.6596846

>>6596831
>>6596833
Tobacco is heavily regulated because it's a real strain on public health. You will only hear the rare person calling for these regulations to cease. Processed food is similar (although to a lower degree) when you take it from the stance of public health.
People don't regulate themselves, if heroin were available for purchase in stores we'd have nations crumbling because no one would give a shit and shooting h all day.

And then look at the profits that feed into the giant handful of companies that make these foods. That's quite a lot of power they have the throw around with their cash

>> No.6596850

>>6596844
I kind of like this but it'll never be reality. While the fatties are still alive they have voting power and spending power which can counter you or your ideological/politics groups. They are the majority, not you, unfortunately.

>> No.6596854

>>6596846
Tobacco is heavily regulated because it directly affects people who don't even use it themselves. You choose what food you eat.

>> No.6596861

>>6596854
>Tobacco is heavily regulated because it directly affects people who don't even use it themselves
Sorry, I'm lazy, but I know we didn't always know this. When regulation came in was this an accepted fact during the creating of the legislation?

>> No.6596873

>>6596861

Absolutely. The Surgeon general's report on the effects of smoking was released in 1964. Smoking regulation didn't really start until the '70s.

>> No.6596875

>>6596846
Are you saying you would start doing heroin if it were more easily accessible? Or are you not people? Or are you talking about different people? Who are these people?

>> No.6596889

>>6596875
>Are you saying you would start doing heroin if it were more easily accessible?
if it were legal, sold everywhere, advertised like crazy, and there were no warnings about it, yes, of course. You would too. The reason we don't is because we know how horrible it is for us

>> No.6596932
File: 96 KB, 1166x549, 61QEU4Nx8yL._SL1166_.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6596932

Yes because I live close to the Mexico border so I could start a business smuggling in cheap Gansitos.

>> No.6596967

>>6596809
Depends on the situation. Is there a national healthcare system in place? If so it makes sense to tax products that wreck people's health, because that shit costs everyone money. A pack of cigarettes in Australia costs more than $25. This makes sense in a place where everyone's tax dollars cover healthcare costs.

In a place like the US this doesn't make sense, because we don't yet have a proper healthcare system. Yes, diseases related to poor diet choices cost us money, but not nearly as much as it would under a national healthcare system.

In the US a tax on junk food is absurd. Because our taxes already heavily subsidize the industries that make that junk food - farmers who grow corn and soy and the processors who smash it into things like HFCS and TVP.

If we just stopped subsidizing the production of shitty food in America the stuff wouldn't be so artificially cheap in the first place, so people would eat less of it.

>> No.6596971

No.
Bans and restrictions are the dumbest, heavy-handed nanny-state way of dealing with problems.

>> No.6597011
File: 22 KB, 252x310, 1399205204789.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6597011

>>6596854
>You choose what food you eat.
and you also choose the poison you want your offspring to shove down their gullets, and consequently create eating habits for them.

>> No.6597019

>>6596854
Lots of things directly affect people who don't even use them themselves that aren't heavily regulated. That's a bullshit excuse.

>> No.6597028

>>6597011
>poison

Both you and the fat people who want to claim they're addicts so people will feel bad for them need to get some goddamned perspective.

>> No.6597045
File: 906 KB, 160x120, 1360035213412.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6597045

>Americlaps always hating on Scandinavian countries
>socialist shitholes w/ shariah law, etc.
>economic stability vastly ahead of the US
>public health vastly ahead of the US
>social mobility vastly ahead of the US
>sustainable energy vastly ahead of the US
>educational system vastly ahead of the US

Mine sider!

>> No.6597076
File: 63 KB, 388x525, 1391892284893.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6597076

>>6597028
like the soda you drink isnt poison, fuck off my diet is impeccable, i want subsidized cheap healthy food not cheap fucking pogos nigger

>> No.6597085

>>6597076
If you want to insist on the drug abuse analogy, all food should be taxed because healthy foods can be used to make bad ones.

>prove you won't use these potatoes to make french fries
>prove you won't turn this fruit into pie filling
>prove you're not going to turn these chicken breasts into tendies
>prove you're not going to drown this tofu in sweet-and-sour sauce
>prove you don't plan to tempura these vegetables

We restrict people's ability to buy allergy medicine for similar reasons.

>> No.6597090

>>6597045
>population less than 10% of america and about to get shit on by putin and his stolen superbowl ring

>> No.6597091

>>6597090
top kek

>> No.6597094

>>6597085
>implying any of those things are unhealthy

>> No.6597138

>>6596820
/thread

>> No.6597145

>>6596809
No, the government shouldn't be using taxes to regulate behavior.

>> No.6597168

Processed food should subsidise expensive wholefoods, though a tax might not be the best way of achieving that.

>> No.6597200

Not a single idiot on this threaealizes government subsidies of junk food (and tobacco) are the problem. This shit is artificially cheap thanks to taxpayers, but sure, tax it to doubly penalize the people who buy it. Far better to end the subsidies and force the companies to sell it at a fair market price, but that would gore too many oxen in congress.

>> No.6597250

>>6597200
I said that here >>6596967

>> No.6597425

>>6596809
Yes because people need to be saved from themselves

>> No.6597439

>>6596825
All it will prove is that people will still pay more for it.
It's a cash grab nothing more.
You can't legeslate morality or health

>> No.6597446

>>6597094
>being this retarded

>> No.6597566

>>6597446
you're probably fat

>> No.6597687

>>6596820
Pretty much this. If the public has to pay for everyone's health care then measures should be taken to keep the costs from going through the goddamn roof due to the obesity epidemic. If health care is the responsibility of the individual as it should be, then no because then it's their own damn fault and their own damn problem.

>> No.6597691

>>6597687
widespread obesity imposes costs on others whether health care is public or not

>> No.6597736

>>6597566
By calling you retarded for implying tendies are not unhealthy?
I bet your captian ham planet

>> No.6597740

>>6597687
Why not just euthanize anyone not deemed healthy ebough? Or people with bad genetics?
Why stop at obesity?
Or is it just convenient?

>> No.6597779

>>6597736
>i know you are but what am i?
let's not do this, okay?

fatty

>> No.6597783

>>6596809
No.

But companies that make them should be sanctioned. They're as seedy and thrifty and powerful and mercenary and sanctimonious as Big Tobacco and Big Alcohol and Big Pharma.

>> No.6597789

>>6597779
Your cisco tears are slippidown your ham cheeks fatty fatty 2x4

>> No.6597807

>>6596846
>if heroin were available for purchase in stores we'd have nations crumbling because no one would give a shit and shooting h all day.
you'd think so but it doesn't turn out this way. making drugs illegal either encourages their use or keeps it the same.

most of all we need to educate about junk food. many people don't realize how shitty the foods they eat really are, because the companies selling it want to pretend it's healthful, and in America said companies own the government. people are dying because of foods they think aren't even bad.

>> No.6597808

How do you decide what gets taxed and what doesn't? I'm sure McDonalds can prove in court that their food is healthy in certain circumstances.

>> No.6597822

>>6597808
ideally fruit and vegetables would be subsidized instead of stuff like corn and soybeans

>> No.6597830

>>6597808
Notice it's fast food that is on the tax block but not gourmet restaurants?

>> No.6597833

>>6596846
>People don't regulate themselves, if heroin were available for purchase in stores we'd have nations crumbling because no one would give a shit and shooting h all day.

That's actually not true.
For decades heroin was available legally over the counter. So were other drugs that we consider harmful, like cocaine. Yet these days--with those drugs being highly illegal--we actually have higher incidences of addiction.

Fact is that most of the danger with "drugs" comes from the fact that they are illegal and therefore forced into a black market. That creates a problem of criminal dealings and also unknown potency of the drug. Most overdoses happen because of unknown potency or identity of the drug.

>> No.6597854

>>6596846
>people don't regulate themselves
bull fucking shit
nanny state motherfucker

>> No.6597887

>>6596809
Are you taxing for revenue or taxing to change behavior?

>> No.6597895

>>6597887
Whichever polls better (but in reality all we care about is the money and power and to look like we're still doing something in office).

>> No.6597898

>>6596889
Uruguay, Argentina, and Switzerland are proof that you're full of shit.

>> No.6597899

>>6597830
Yeah that another thing. Gourmet food can be pretty damn unhealthy. I think >>6597822 has the right idea remove subsidies on corn and soy and subsidize fruits and veggies.

>> No.6597907

>>6597899
Wha lot of food will go up in price if you end subsidiaries

>> No.6597916

>>6597907
That's the point isn't it? Corn and Soy in themselves aren't bad. The fact that they're used as cheap filler in fast food and industrial meat is the problem.

>> No.6597917

>>6597916
So on top of ending a subsidiary you'll tax it?

>> No.6597921

>>6597917
No. You cant justify taxing crops.

>> No.6597927
File: 17 KB, 480x200, stewie-on-steroids-family.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6597927

>>6596814
thank-you

>> No.6597930

>>6597822
this

>> No.6597931

>>6597921
So the federal government can justify double-taxing income through the death-tax, but crops are a no-no?

>> No.6597935

>>6597931
Yup. Crops are much more a basis of a society than income.

>> No.6597937

>>6597045
Much lower quality of life. brainwashed populace who thinks they live in the best place on earth when that is totally subjective. Super expensive alcohol. Nanny state.

>> No.6597946

>>6597822
dubs of truth

>> No.6598492

>>6597937
> this much denial
YOU'RE NOT DOING BETTER, YOU'RE ALL BRAINWASHED!!! FREEDOM FREEDOM USA USA!!!!

>> No.6598965

No.

Also, define junk food

>> No.6598990
File: 96 KB, 680x453, raw-oreo-cookies.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6598990

>>6597807
>most of all we need to educate about junk food. many people don't realize how shitty the foods they eat really are, because the companies selling it want to pretend it's healthful
>companies selling it want to pretend it's healthful
>oreos healthful
lol

And googling that term, it seems some people are advertising their versions as healthful... but not the company who makes the real ones.

>> No.6598994

>>6597822
/thread

>> No.6598999

Staple food should be free.

>> No.6599000
File: 52 KB, 500x500, 51JWJYDAD5L.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6599000

>>6598990
people trying to lose weight won't eat those but they will eat these, which even less resemble actual food

>> No.6599038

>>6599000
>dissing my devil's food SnackWells

Those are tastier than they have any right to be.

>> No.6599118
File: 1.71 MB, 500x500, 1430247438592.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6599118

>>6597937
>much lower quality of life

Keep telling yourself that, bubba.

>> No.6599151

>>6597085
None of that is remotely unhealthy, with exercise excess fats actually enhance performance. The sweet n sour sauce is processed food you dumb nigger.

>> No.6599346

>>6597898
>Uruguay, Argentina, and Switzerland are proof that you're full of shit.
I highly doubt they advertise hard drugs the way processed food is advertised

>> No.6599356
File: 1.17 MB, 170x113, 1364232539393.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6599356

>>6597740
>bad genetics

>> No.6599901

>>6599356
Never said anything about that fat head. Does your fat clog your ears too fatty?

>> No.6600254

Junk food should be taxed and soda should be taxed, but the difficulty comes in the definition of junk food. A poorly-worded law would equate to too much collateral damage and ruin the pricing of healthy food due to a loophole. IE canned goods skyrocketing in price if the definition is based on salt, as an example.

It's a pipe dream, but I think the ideal taxes on junk food and soda while simultaneously lifting some income tax would be lovely. This could shift the lower classes' perceptions of "what foods are the best value for me?" and solve more health issues via preventing them (educating people on better food choices via making the better choices more attractive) rather than treating the symptoms (everyone gets healthcare to deal with their obesity-induced problems). Along with removing shitty food from schools so children aren't constantly tempted by garbage every day, but that's another topic.

>> No.6601316

>>6600254
what if we say processed foods?

>> No.6601353

Just stop subsidizing corn, soy, meat and dairy. It would do the same thing to the price but in a much more "free market" way. Maybe fatties will eat better if the calories they need aren't so much cheaper in candy bar form.

>> No.6601358

>>6596809

How about we stop subsidizing them so much?

>> No.6601451

>>6601316
How much processing qualifies? What separates "processed shit" from "processed but healthy"? Many foods could count as processed if the definition is too loose - yoghurt, certain condiments, canned food, dried foods, etc.

Do it by labelling of chemicals? Sorry, doesn't work either unless there's a massive database of taxable chemicals, along with huge room for fuckups that such bureaucracy includes. Food is way, way too varied.

>>6601353
>stop subsidizing them
>suddenly supermarket shopping becomes like wall street as food prices jump around like crazy

Subsidizing is intended to keep consumers complacent by keeping prices relatively stable and competitive. Belieive it or not there's more than Monsanto farming out there.

Also:
>Corn
>Soy
>Meat
>Dairy

Good luck, you just killed a lot of incentive for farming product diversity. Plus none of these things are really bad inherently. It's what people do with them.

Another example:
There's a lot of oils that are shitty and only provide empty calories, but are used due to their low-cost and high smoke point, so it's relatively easy to run a machine through them.

And it's relatively less likely that a kid on his first job will stink up the restaurant with the lovely scent of burning olive oil because he made it too hot.


This is a hugely complex issue. There's no perfect solution. What we have now is not working, but anything heavy handed will just fuck everyone up. The only real options are to educate people in a FACTUAL non-shitty way. Which is STILL hard as new research comes out all the fucking time about what is, is not, and wasn't-but-actually-is healthy. PLUS in order to work this crap needs to be taught to kids before they reach the age where they want to rebel and eat shit anyway.

If anyone reading this thread actually is a parent, teach your kids to not eat like shit. Discipline with portions in moderation, personal accountability for fuckups, and understanding nutrition data and ingredients.

>> No.6601519

>>6598990
Almost all of these kind of things have "low-fat", "fat-free" and even fucking "gluten-free" as selling points. So yes, they are pushed as healthful to some extent.

>> No.6601523

>>6599151
WELCOME TO WHAT'S WRONG WITH THE JUNK FOOD TAX, YOU LITERAL SPECIAL ED STUDENT

THERE IS NO BAD FOOD, ONLY BAD PEOPLE

>> No.6601524

>>6601519
>being gluten-free means it's healthful
i really hate people

>> No.6601707

>>6596809
Speaking as a fattie I'd say yes butat the same time it wouldn't help me lose weight because I'm fat from the ginormous portion sizes of healthy home made foods I prepare on a daily basis.

>> No.6601750

>>6597085
No because nutmeg is legal
>prove u wont use this seasoning to get high lel

>> No.6601754

>>6596854
Trying sitting at the cinema next to one of those inexplicably land-dwelling sea mammals or trying to get around them in a grocery aisle and tell me their food choices don't affect you.

>> No.6601785

How do you define 'processed' food and what makes it inherently unhealthy?

>> No.6601791

>>6601754
Taxing cheap food won't change that. They'll just chow down on wholemeal bread and dripping except they'll be more insufferable because they're eating 'healthily'

>> No.6602080

>>6601524
Gluten-free eating is alright for health as it means you have to read everything.

Prepackaged gluten-free imitations of wheat-based food is often even more terrible due to using extra processing shit to make the subpar ingredients palatable.

Because people won't just eat damn corn tortillas or rice cakes instead of a 7-chem nowheat approximation of white bread.

>> No.6602131

>>6596820
Boom, done

>> No.6602142

>>6596809
Sure, why not? Imagine all the jobs created as food companies hire people to engineer their food to get it just in under the cutoffs for higher taxes and lobby congress to give their kinds of foods an exemption.

>> No.6602435

>>6596846
Average tax on a single cigarette is about 7 cents. We should tax 7 cents on 12oz of soda.

With the biggest health costs being obesity related, a single soda is worse for you than a single cigarette.

>> No.6602438

>>6596854
second hand smoke is a lie

you get more toxins in your lungs from sitting in traffic.

>> No.6602449

>>6602438
>second hand smoke is a lie
mong.

>> No.6602450

>>6596846
>drugs like tobacco/heroin affect other people and are not necessities
>food does not typically affect other people and is essential for living

>> No.6602493

Just make a new law:
1. You have to apply for a grant to be allowed to use preservatives
2. Deny usage of preservatives in shelf food

Of course, this won't solve anything. Especially since Sugar, Salt and Fat is already good preservatives.
And freezing + canning is more effective than a lot of the dry storage in the first place.

>>6601316
Great meat, is processed. Anything that is made and then stored(cookies, dough, cake, canned vegetables) is processed.
The few things that are not processed is:
1. Frozen/Raw stuff
2. And.....? Basically nothing else
You don't understand how much food that is made trough processing.
Image being stuck with powder packages saying "Add X raw ingredients and water, and mix", image that.

>>6601451
Stopping subsidization of corn will lead to a massive marked change over 6 months to other sugar substitutes.
I have no idea what soy will do to America.
Stopping subsidization of Diary won't really do shit when there is so much shit cheeze and margarine on the marked.
Meat is whatever.

>> No.6602800

>>6602493
Corn is used for more that high fructose corn syrup, anon. I use corn starch, cornmeal, and masa harina all the time. These are basic ingredients and would jump in price, along with the actual on-the-cob variety people grill and roast.

Soy would make all the vegans shit themselves, all the meat industry shit itself (which admittedly isn't that bad since grass-fed is usually better) and fuck up how soy protein and soy lecithin among others, are both used as a non-shitty food additive in tons of things.

Dairy would destabilize the milk market. Milk already jumps up and down in price. I don't want fucking 20$ gallons of milk. Milk costs more than GASOLINE. As well, loads of milk products aren't shit.

Meat is a more complex problem than the rest, but stopping subsidization would not fix it, only make mcdonalds go back to a food-for-value equivalent to the 1980s and fuck over anyone who would rather have real meat.

>> No.6602922

>>6597045
shutup noguns, your just mad that you can't shoot watermelons all day and then proceed to eat said watermelons. nigger.

>> No.6602936

>>6602922
this

>> No.6602948

>>6601451
> don't stop subsidizing hugely powerful corporations
> there is no perfect solution, so it's best to do nothing
> implying nutritional information matters in a food desert
Monsanto please go.

>> No.6602981

>>6602142
Pretty small amount I'd imagine, if any

>> No.6603071

>>6602948
I don't like monsanto but there's perfect solution to this that won't be guaranteed to fuck everything up even more or do little.

I think the best way is to just educate people, since an educated population is a powerful population. If anything, the fucking hambeasts crying about fat shaming are monsanto propaganda.

>> No.6603075

>>6603071
there's NO perfect solution*
>Error: You must wait longer before you can delete this post.

>> No.6603409

>>6602493
>Image being stuck with powder packages saying "Add X raw ingredients and water, and mix", image that.
Sounds like normal cooking, except the "powder packages" are unnecessary, and you don't always use water.

>> No.6603524

>>6601785
it's jam packed with sugar, fat, and salt. It's created to be "addictive" to sell more and turn a profit.

How do you get people to buy more of your food? Make it light up the brain's pleasure sensors like a christmas tree

>> No.6603527

>>6601785
I'd also like to add that we COULD be making the healthiest food the world has even known by processing food, but it simply doesn't sell as well

>> No.6603536

>>6602800
diary is shit anyways, cut it out of your diet
>tfw diary makes me bloated and gives me the shits

>> No.6603585

No, but health care for obesity, diabetes and its co morbilities should work only for a month, unless you show response to treatament then you can THROW your Own money to he garbage

>> No.6603602

>>6596932
they sell those at Sam's Club here in CO: fucking gross

>> No.6603684

>>6596809
Junk food and heavily processed food should first be banned then lightly unrestricted plus heavily taxed more than cigarettes while under control of the ATF

>> No.6603785

>>6603536
Dairy is fine for me.

>tfw wheat doesn't give me shits, but it does make my allergies act up for days after proportionate to the amount I eat