Changing My Diet So I Don't Die

[Anonymous No.4793919]

Just came back to the doctor, and he said I need to completely overhaul my diet. I am just a few steps away from a heart attack. And I am only 34.

I have to start eating less meat, especially red, and start consuming more fruits, vegetables, grains, and legumes. So basically a vegetarian diet, although I'll still eat meat a couple times a week.

Oh chef senseis of /ck/, teach me how to make delicious vegetarian food. I love ethnic cuisine, so Indian recipes and such would be perfect.

[Anonymous No.4793925]

Hummus sandwich with cucumbers (and other veg. toppings) is a good lunch.

[Anonymous No.4793936]

>>4793925
I've had this before, was pretty good. Would it be cheaper to make my own hummus?

[Anonymous No.4793944]

>>4793936
I would certainly assume so, but I would go with making your own hummus just because it tastes better.

Also, nut loaf is a surprisingly good meat substitute for dinner.

[Anonymous No.4793960]

Eat more oats, they lower your cholesterol.

[Anonymous No.4793980]

The red meat thing isn't science at all, protein is protein. Just try to lower the amount you eat of everything.

[Anonymous No.4793984]

>>4793980
This is the sound of hope and delusion.

[Anonymous No.4793995]

>>4793980
>The red meat thing isn't science at all, protein is protein. Just try to lower the amount you eat of everything.

This is so patently wrong, but I tire of digging up JREF citations every time somebody spouts this sort of nonsense. OP if you're at all confused by 4channers contradicting your doctor's advice, just google the topic until you're satisfied 4chan is full of tards.

[Anonymous No.4794038]

>>4793995
>http://www.marksdailyapple.com/will-eating-red-meat-kill-you/#axzz2ehYnwUCN

Red meat is less dangerous than the cow it comes from.

[Anonymous No.4794039]

>>4793995

Explain how red meat kills, please. I'm interested.

[The Australian with koala powe(...) No.4794040]

>>4793919
>less saturated fats
>more seafood
>very small portions for food and soft drinks
>walk 3000 steps


You are now an average japanese male

[Anonymous No.4794049]

>>4794040

Seafood is loaded with cholesterol and OP will die if he eats it.

[Anonymous No.4794056]

>>4794049
dietary cholesterol =/= blood cholesterol

BAD cholesterol doesn't exist, what does exist is oxidized cholesterol, which is the result of having too many free radicals exposed into your system.

eat more anti-oxidants and eat less of shit that introduces free radicals into your body (bad fats, gains)

[Anonymous No.4794063]

>>4794039
Seems to be a gut flora thing. High saturated fat diet leads to unhealthy balance of guy flora. Diet high in vegetable fiber promotes healthy gut flora balance. Look it up - the study made the news last week.

[Anonymous No.4794065]

>>4794049
>not understanding how dietary cholesterol works
Sure, avoid bottom-feeders just to be safe, but most fresh fish will be fine. Avoid junk like tilapia and swai, and overfished animals like cod and tuna.

Walk a few miles a day. Literally, go for an hour walk. No point putting excess stress on your heart, but you need the exercise.

[Anonymous No.4794079]

Cholesterol is a vital substance in every cell in your body. What your doctors measure is not how much cholesterol you have, but how much lipoproteins you have that transport cholesterol.

When your arteries are blocked from "high cholesterol" foods, it is oxidized lipoproteins that get stuck on your blood vessels.

Your body produces the actual cholesterol itself and will regulate the amount very well without you doing anything. If you eat foods that have a lot of cholesterol, then your body will limit how much it makes and vice versa.

[Anonymous No.4794080]

>>4794063

It kills because of gut flora.

I don't think so.

[Anonymous No.4794094]

>>4794080
You're wrong

[Anonymous No.4794106]

>>4794039
>Explain how red meat kills, please. I'm interested.
This is the anon you responded to, and as I said I'm not going to dig up medical journal citations to try to force-educate a random 4chan fucktard who will reject the science as flawed anyway. On the off chance that you're genuinely interested and literate, google something like "red meat cancer study," or do a google news search for very recent articles on the topic, and go from there.

[Anonymous No.4794110]

>>4794106

Or instead of being a pompous ass, you could have tried to summarize it up in few senteces. Instead, you just failed miserably on being convincing.

[Anonymous No.4794114]

Written by the son of the guy who did that huge study that was featured in Forks over Knives. Either way, it's a good book and the recipes aren't a pain in the ass.

[Anonymous No.4794125]

Meat being bad for you is as well-documented as smoking being bad for you. Will eating a little meat give you heart disease? Probably not. Will a little smoking give you lung cancer? Probably not. The problem is most people don't do either of these things in moderation, and if someone can't control their intake then it's safer for them to just not consume the product at all.

[Anonymous No.4794129]

The biggest problem with these eating yourself to a heart disease types is that they eat too much and too narrow. You should diversify your diet to plants, nuts, legumes, fruits and such but also keep some meat in there. Eat balanced and don't go rushing overboard on eating from only one end of the spectrum

[Anonymous No.4794136]

OP here. I asked for recipes and cooking tips, not a pissing contest about meat's unhealthiness. This isn't a nutrition forum, it's food & cooking. So less talk about disease and more talk about pots and pans.

[Anonymous No.4794141]

If you're trying to get your cholesterol under control, you can make some simple changes and substitutions, man.

Instead of beef and pork, you can try chicken or shrimp. However, how your meat is cooked is also important. Boiled or steamed shrimp is great, battered/deep fried shrimp is not.

Also, look into vegetarian meat substitutes. I don't get why people throw such tantrums about imitation meat, it's honestly not that bad. Tofurky makes really great vegan/soy lunchmeats that are low in fat and calories. Morningstar makes meatless chicken nuggets, hamburgers, bacon, etc. Give it a try.

I would suggest that you get a calorie/diet tracker app for your phone (or make an account on a website, there are many free ones to choose from) so you can look at what you're eating. Understanding the problems with your diet is the first step to making better choices.

[The Australian with koala powe(...) No.4794160]

>>4794065
3000 steps is all is needed if OP can do that and 7.5oz of Tea he would be fin

[Anonymous No.4794164]

>>4794141
>I don't get why people throw such tantrums about imitation meat, it's honestly not that bad

They're usually more expensive than meat, even compared to high quality meat.

They taste worse.

And, they're often (but not always) loaded with all sorts of artificial shit. If your goal is to eat healthier then many of these "fake meat" products are counterproductive in that regard.

There's nothing wrong with eating less meat, I just don't see the need to alter one food into something that it's not. If you want something with a "meaty" texture then a portabello mushroom cap is great--you can cook it just like you would a hamburger or a steak--and has zero questionable additives. As for other foods, why not just enjoy veggies for what they are?

[The Australian with koala powe(...) No.4794171]

>>4794164
>eating less meat

That is fine but meat is still bad

[Anonymous No.4794174]

>>4794136
Well OP, can you tell me what foods you like? Indian dishes are often high in fat and made with a lot of cream and butter, but some of them are healthy.

I would suggest you look into vegan indian recipes, especially those with chickpeas or lentils as a main ingredient. Invest in a good selection of spices like turmeric, curry and garam masala.

[Anonymous No.4794194]

>>4794063
You realize gut flora are only in the large intestine right

And that the large intestine only absorbs water and some electrolytes.

As usual, vegetarian faggots can't into digestion.

Also OP, you're retarded if you think there's no inbetween from steak every day faggot and animals have feelings to vegans

[Anonymous No.4794195]

You should leave /ck/ and make /fit/ your new home instead.

[Anonymous No.4794200]

>>4794079
This guy knows what's up, inb4 naturalhealthnews faggots

[Anonymous No.4794209]

>>4794171

So are morningstar patties. The ingredients list is worse that cheap fast food.

[Anonymous No.4794216]

Red meat is only bad for you because it is related to increased all cause mortality, but only in "processed" form. All cause mortality includes car crashes and being shot by niggers.

[Anonymous No.4794219]

>>4794164
What dangerous additives are specifically in artificial meat? Other than the possible correlation with soy/estrogen?

I eat imitation meats because I'm allergic to a few preservatives commonly found in things like bacon, hot dogs and lunchmeats.

You can argue that real meat tastes better, but I don't know if it's healthier than soy meats. Real meat has more fat/calories than artificial meat, but soy meat isn't 'natural'.

I guess it's subjective and depends on what you define as being healthier.

[Anonymous No.4794227]

>>4794219

Meat is a very broad statement. Sure bacon has a lot of fat, but chicken breast is basically fat free, as are shrimps. So don't use the word meat when talking like this, be more specific.

[Anonymous No.4794232]

>>4794209
Can you explain what's so unhealthy in morningstar burgers? Here is the list of ingredients from their website in their standard soy burger:

TEXTURED VEGETABLE PROTEIN (WHEAT GLUTEN, SOY PROTEIN CONCENTRATE, WATER FOR HYDRATION), EGG WHITES, CORN OIL, CALCIUM CASEINATE, CONTAINS TWO PERCENT OR LESS OF MODIFIED TAPIOCA STARCH, ONION POWDER, CANOLA OIL, TRIGLYCERIDES FROM COCONUT OIL, HYDROLYZED VEGETABLE PROTEIN (CORN GLUTEN, WHEAT GLUTEN, SOY PROTEIN), DEXTROSE, SALT, SOY PROTEIN ISOLATE, AUTOLYZED YEAST EXTRACT, SUGAR, NATURAL AND ARTIFICIAL FLAVORS FROM NON-MEAT SOURCES, CARAMEL COLOR, CULTURED WHEY, MALTODEXTRIN, GARLIC POWDER, SPICE, CELLULOSE GUM, DISODIUM GUANYLATE, DISODIUM INOSINATE, SOY SAUCE (WATER, SOYBEANS, SALT, WHEAT), VITAMINS AND MINERALS (NIACINAMIDE, IRON [FERROUS SULFATE], THIAMIN MONONITRATE [VITAMIN B1], PYRIDOXINE HYDROCHLORIDE [VITAMIN B6], RIBOFLAVIN [VITAMIN B2], VITAMIN B12), SESAME SEED OIL, CELERY EXTRACT, SOY LECITHIN.


I don't understand which of these ingredients is worse than fast food?

[Anonymous No.4794252]

>>4794110
>Or instead of being a pompous ass, you could have tried to summarize it up in few senteces. Instead, you just failed miserably on being convincing.

Trying to answer tardanon's "explain how red meat kills you" is futile; he can keep coming like a 2-year-old with "how?" It kills you through cancer and cardiovascular disease. Do you really want an explanation of how cardiovascular disease kills you? I guess the easy answer is it clogs your arteries. But the process of plaque formation, rupture, platelets bonding and causing clots and such is all rather complicated at the molecular level, and is easily googleable if tardanon is genuinely interested. He's not. He's here to troll, or to spout Ameritard-style anti-science. Seriously, just google "red meat cancer study" if you're interested, why do you want to derail the thread being spoonfed basic knowledge?

[Anonymous No.4794261]

>>4794219
>I eat imitation meats because I'm allergic to a few preservatives commonly found in things like bacon, hot dogs and lunchmeats.

I'm skeptical. Most meat (e.g. FRESH meat) has no preservatives of any kind. Properly made bacon or sausages don't have any preservatives either. It's only the cheap stuff that contains preservatives, and that stuff is in most meat replacement products anyway.

If you're allergic to preservatives then I'd advise you to stop buying ANY kind of processed food--meat and fake meat included--and instead buy ingredients only and cook from scratch. Frozen veggies are OK since those generally don't have preservatvies, but anything that's pre-prepared should be skipped over. (It's cheaper to cook from scratch too). Instead of buying highly processed lunchmeat (or fake lunchmeat) just go buy a whole chicken or a ham or a rib roast (beef). Season with salt and pepper, then roast it in the oven. Use a meat thermometer to check to see when it's done. Tadaa! You just made your own lunchmeat, Not only is it half the price (if not less) compared to buying it, but it has zero preservatives or additives or anything else to upset your allergy.

Anyway, there's some pretty good info on what goes into many processed meat products here:
http://foodbabe.com/2012/07/02/think-twice-before-buying-this-type-of-burger/

...note the photos of the ingredient lists and see what's actually in there.

[Anonymous No.4794268]

>>4794227
Well, the poster I was responding to was generally speaking about real meat vs. imitation meat, so that's how I was addressing it.

You're right, those are low fat/calorie meats, but even chicken breasts often have a lot of preservatives and growth hormones in them, and those same type of additives are what people often talk about when deeming soy meats as unhealthy.

This is what I'm talking about. Just suggest the idea that imitation meats might be healthier than natural meats and people kind of freak out.

[Anonymous No.4794278]

>>4794232
>I don't understand which of these ingredients is worse than fast food?

I didn't say the specific ingredients were worse than fast food. I said the ingredient list as a whole was worse than cheap fast food.

That list has more additives in it than Mcdonalds puts in chicken nuggets or hamburgers.

but anyway, why eat anythign with so many additives at all? Want a hamburger? Great! Use beef. Worried about that? Then buy grass-fed free range beef. Won't eat meat at all? Get a portabello mushroom cap. Zero additives.

[Anonymous No.4794298]

>>4794261
Good luck finding sausages without preservatives...

[Anonymous No.4794302]

>>4794261

Dude, I've been tested by doctors and nutritionists and I am allergic to certain types of preservatives in processed meats in things like bacon, lunchmeat and hot dogs. To be specific: it's certain types of sulfates and sulfites and they give me horrible migraines.

Yes, these preservatives are more common in cheap meats, but they're still present even in high quality meats. I eat more fake meats because they typically don't aggravate my allergy.

I'm not interested in risking my allergy on testing out stuff because the migraines are so bad I have to be hospitalized. I also can't drink wine and some other things.

[Anonymous No.4794305]

>>4793919
Since no one else asked the question:

What were your usual eating habits before this doctor visit?

[Anonymous No.4794309]

>>4794252
>just google "red meat cancer study" if you're interested,

I did. I also read the study, as well as several reviews of it. It doesn't say anything like what you imply that it said.

The study found that among those people who ate 10 or more servings of processed or red meat a week had a slightly higher risk of fatality if they happened to develop colon cancer. The specific numbers were 43 percent fatality for the red-or-processed meat eaters vs. 37 percent for the less-than-10-servings-a-week eaters.

These numbers don't mean much. The study considered 184,000 people. Only 2300 of them--about one in 80--ever got colon cancer, and among that group there was a 6% difference in fatality rate. The consumption of red or processed meat did not affect the incidence of getting colon cancer--it only affected its severity if the person had it.

So really what's being said here is that out of 184,000 people about one in a hundred developed colon cancer for reasons other than eating red meat, but if you were of those unlucky few consuming a lot of red meat resulted in a slight increase in the fatality rate.

How on earth do you get from that very specific conclusion to "lol red meat causes cancer"--especially when the study concluded that red meat didn't cause the cancer at all.

The only thing to take home form that study is that if you're worried about colon cancer then you should eat fewer than 10 servings of red or processed meat a week--and frankly that's easy. Who eats anywhere close to 10 servings of red meat a week? Even eating a steak every day doesn't risk that.

[Anonymous No.4794312]

>>4794298

Go to your butcher. Ask them to make sausages for you according to whatever you want to put in them. That's what they do.

Or you could make them yourself. It's not difficult and the equipment is not expensive.

[Anonymous No.4794317]

>>4794278
Okay, but can you tell me why it's bad? You keep saying that the additives are so terrible, but which additives? And what do you define as an additive?

Why is it so much more terrible than fast food?

I'm perfectly willing to be reasonable and listen to why you guys think that fake meat is unhealthy as compared to real meat, but nobody can tell me specifically what is so bad about it?

[Anonymous No.4794320]

>>4794309
The number of studies showing that vegetarian diets are healthier than meat diets is overwhelming. A meta-analysis of a dozen major studies shows that vegetarians have 25% lower risk of heart disease, and 20% lower risk of cancer. And this is looking at multiple countries and populations. Can't explain away those numbers with simple, "Well the vegetarians must exercise more and live healthier lifestyles."

[Anonymous No.4794322]

>>4794302
>but they're still present even in high quality meats

There are no sulfites/sulfates in a steak, or a roast, or a chicken, or a fish. In fact, there's no preservatives or additives of any kind in those things.

You need to avoid processed meats, not meat in general. It's really simple: if it's in a package or has a brand name, don't buy it. Buy fresh. Zero bullshit additives.

[Anonymous No.4794334]

Not reading this thread, but I'm guessing op's poor health is because he's morbidly obese and not directly linked to his diet.

Maybe if the majority of your meat intake wasn't pepperoni you wouldn't be so quick to think vegetarianism is the way to optimal health

[Anonymous No.4794338]

>>4794278
Here is the full list of ingredients in McDonalds chicken nuggets:

CHICKEN MCNUGGETS:
Ingredients: White Boneless Chicken, Water, Food Starch-Modified, Salt, Seasoning (Autolyzed Yeast Extract, Salt, Wheat Starch, Natural Flavoring [Botanical
Source], Safflower Oil, Dextrose, Citric Acid), Sodium Phosphates, Natural Flavor (Botanical Source). Battered and Breaded with: Water, Enriched Flour (Bleached
Wheat Flour, Niacin, Reduced Iron, Thiamin Mononitrate, Riboflavin, Folic Acid), Yellow Corn Flour, Bleached Wheat Flour, Food Starch-Modified, Salt, Leavening
(Baking Soda, Sodium Acid Pyrophosphate, Sodium Aluminum Phosphate, Monocalcium Phosphate, Calcium Lactate), Spices, Wheat Starch, Dextrose, Corn
Starch.

There are more additives in that then there are in the morningstar burger, mate.

[Anonymous No.4794347]

Red meat has more myoglobin. That's what everyone is afraid of. Extra color. The cancer link is just famous universities fishing for even more renown. You should understand there is no cure for cancer but plenty of people selling themselves as experts.

[Anonymous No.4794361]

>>4794322
Calm your tits, anon. I do eat some meats, but only if I buy the meat and prepare it myself. The problem is that my allergy is so severe that it's safer for me to totally avoid natural meats unless I know for sure that there are no preservatives.

Why do people take it as a personal affront that I often choose imitation meats over natural meats? I don't understand how it's so offensive.

[Anonymous No.4794367]

vegetarian diet for lifting:
oats + linseeds in the morning
at least a litre of milk
pot of grams of yoghurt
slices of wholegrain bread (preferably seeded), marmite spread on them
100 grams of pumpkin seeds (25grams on their own 75 grams as part of the what follows)
stir fry comprised of brocoli and meat substitute soya stuff +(75 grams of pumpkin seeds and whatever veg you might like)
brown rice + lentils/beans/chickpeas (either dal'd or kichdi'd) whatever

also eggs. very occasionally you should eat some seaweed or maybe algae.

[Anonymous No.4794368]

>>4794317
Personally, there's two reasons why I avoid fake meat: First, it's more expensive than real meat. And two, it tastes worse than real meat. Those two reasons alone ensure that I will never buy processed meat. Why pay more money for an inferior tasting product?

Beyond that: There are new studies coming out every that indicate the health risks of various things...and then they change again. For example, in the 40's and 50's the whole "low fat" craze started, so people invented things like Margerine so they wouldn't be eating that evil animal fat....and now we've learned that margerine is trans-fats, and those are one of the least healthy things you can put in your mouth. In other words the "solution" was worse than the problem. In the 1990's the focus was on low-cholesterol. Now we know that dietary cholesterol doesn't affect your serum cholesterol so that whole craze was a waste of time, and so on. The conclusion is that we really don't know much about the safety of modern food additives but our knowledge regarding those things changes all the time. How are you supposed to know what is safe and what is not? Easy: you think back to human history and realize that we've been eating whole foods for thousands and thousands of years, but only recently have we seen the epidemic of obesity, thyroid problems, autism, and so on. That just so happens to coincide with the prevalence of fake meat, TV dinners, and other processed foods. Does that prove that those things caused those health problems? No, it's not proof. But it's a warning sign that I choose to heed; I will choose the side of history before I trust research that hasn't yet been performed: I don't buy processed food, ever. I buy whole ingredients and cook. That completely avoids the guessing game of "what additives are OK -- oh wait, we just realized how bad that really was", AND my grocery expenditures dropped to nearly half of what I used to pay when I bought premade stuff.

[Anonymous No.4794385]

>>4794361
>Why do people take it as a personal affront that I often choose imitation meats over natural meats? I don't understand how it's so offensive.

I don't take it as a personal affront at all. I just am confused by the idiocy. You have a legitimate medical issue (the allergy) yet the way you deal with it is backwards.

I completely understand that you have an allergy to preservatives. Given that, why would you ever buy a pre-packaged meat product? A pre-packaged product ALWAYS carries the risk of containing something you're allergic to. On the other hand, fresh meat NEVER contains preservatives.

In other words, it's NOT safer for you to avoid natural meats. In fact, it's actually the opposite--it's safest for you to buy natural meat (where by definition there are ZERO preservatives), as opposed to buying processed meat (fake or otherwise) which has the risk of having preservatives.

[Anonymous No.4794408]

>>4794385

this

nobody cares if you choose fake meat or natural meat.

you're getting replies because you seem to think that natural meat contains preservatives, which is wrong because the whole point of natural meat is that has no additives of any sort.

[Anonymous No.4794424]

>>4794385
I'd just rather be safe than sorry. Honestly: I understand what you're saying, and I get where you're coming from, but even fresh from the butcher meats can contain sulfites. I don't have an allergic reaction to soy meat and so I eat soy meat.

[Anonymous No.4794437]

>>4793919
>So basically a vegetarian diet, although I'll still eat meat a couple times a week.

[Anonymous No.4794451]

>>4794424
>but even fresh from the butcher meats can contain sulfites

NO.

Sulfites are a risk in processed meats like hot dogs or lunchmeat or bacon. They do not occur in plain fresh meat because fresh meat has nothing added to it.

[Anonymous No.4794473]

>>4794437
It's common in diets for health reasons. Bill Clinton is 99% vegan after his heart surgery, but he will have some animal products occasionally, let's say at a party etc.

[Anonymous No.4794645]

>>4794367
Pumpkin seeds sound great. How about putting them on pasta?

[Anonymous No.4794713]

>>4794473
yeah, but eating meat SEVERAL TIMES A WEEK does not qualify as a vegetarian diet by any decent measure.

[Anonymous No.4794718]

>>4794473

More proof vegans are liars, Clinton is one of them.

OR IS HE?!?!

[Anonymous No.4794727]

>>4794713
OP says "basically a vegetarian diet." If 90% of your meals are vegetarian, that is a predominantly vegetarian diet.

[Anonymous No.4794729]

>>4794424

I might have missed it but did you get tested for allergies to sulphite? With food reactions there's always a good chance of panic disorder, no offense intended towards you at all. It's just something human beings seem to do a lot.

[Anonymous No.4794744]

why do you people still respond.
he just stopped calling them his nightly vegan thread.
He still writes a subject and that is how you know it's the troll.

[Anonymous No.4794749]

A doctor is not allowed to tell you to stop eating meat, it is outside of his scope of practice. physicians are not dietitians.

your story is a lie and you are a bad troll

[Anonymous No.4794750]

>>4794744
>any thread with a subject is a troll
Do you also oppose books and movies that have titles, and delete all the song names in your iTunes?

[Anonymous No.4794760]

>>4794749
guessing you've never been to a doctor
they will tell you any advice that is widely considered beneficial, like "exercise more" or "watch the weight."
they don't have to be a dietician to comment on diet

[Anonymous No.4794757]

>>4794750
>implying I said any thread with a subject is a troll
I suppose it just happens to be a coincidence that the daily anti meat and anti dairy threads that pop up or are bumped at the same time all have subjects?
even though people do not typically write anything in the subject field and it is actually more unusual than not to see a subject?
couldn't possibly be the same guy making them every day right?

[Anonymous No.4794763]

>>4794760
>they don't have to be a dietician to comment on diet
yeah they actually do. if they say "stop eating meat" they are acting outside of their scope and can lose their medical license over it.
This is the field I work in, don't talk about shit you don't know

[Anonymous No.4794777]

>>4794760
>guessing you've never been to a doctor
what a shitty argument.
confirmed for "I acted retarded for 100 post, EPIC TROLL" retard. fuck off, retard.

[Anonymous No.4794782]

>>4794763
First off, the OP just says "doctor," which can refer to a dietician depending on their degree. Second off, OP says the doctor said to change diet. Nowhere does it say "doctor told me to stop eating meat." It is well within the scope of even general practitioners to simply comment on the possibility of needing a dietary change.

One of the most renowned cardiologists there is, Caldwell Esselstyn, is also a huge advocate of having his patients adapt a plant-based diet to treat heart disease.

[Anonymous No.4794788]

>>4794782
if he actually went to a dietitian he wouldn't have made this thread because he would have been given specific foods and recipes, so we know this story is full of shit based on that alone.
A doctor isnt going to say "sorry dude you need to change your diet"
they are going to send you to a specialist and you are going to get a book a few inches thick full of information on what you need to eat.

but he said doctor, not a dietitian, not a cardiologist. Very specific things that were not mentioned. if you were having heart problems your general practitioner would give you a referral to a cardiologist who would give you a referral to a dietitian if they determined your eating habits were the cause of your heart problems. They would never say anything about diet themselves.

a general practitioner giving you specific dietary advice is like your optometrist giving you stretches to relieve your back pain. When something goes wrong guess who is liable?
no doctor is stupid enough to step outside their scope of practice especially with the hair trigger malpractice lawyers have.

and as for your desperate appeal to authority I could always bring up dr.atkins, the cardiologist that believe in all bacon all the time

[Anonymous No.4794791]

why do amerilards get so butthurt when someone start a vegetarian thread?

[Anonymous No.4794803]

>>4793919
>less meat
>more fruits, vegetables, grains, and legumes
Meanwhile, at OP's dentist...

[Anonymous No.4794808]

>>4794791
Because we have at least two every day started by the same person. The only vegans and vegetarians on here are trolls.

[Anonymous No.4794813]

>>4794791
I've often wondered this too. People don't get nearly as upset about smoking or drinking when people suggest it's not healthy as they do about meat. I think it's because vegetarianism has an ethical component too it, and so if you eat meat and are told you shouldn't the natural response is anger/defensiveness, since it's like implying you're a bad person. We all want to think we're awesome, basic psychology there.

[Anonymous No.4794818]

>>4794813
>he says in response to his own post

[Anonymous No.4794817]

>>4794813
Most of the "scientific"arguments are based on flawed evidence and confuse correlation and causation. /sci/ would destroy the stuff posted here, it's all pop-nutrition and Natural News type shit.

[Anonymous No.4794835]

>>4794803
Dentist or dead. What to choose...

[Anonymous No.4794846]

>>4794835
>vegetarians live forever
>the oldest living people on record certainly don't eat meat

[Anonymous No.4794871]

>>4794817
The "meat is bad for you" studies have been done by pretty much every renowned university. Harvard's School of Public Health has countless articles on the relationship between meat and disease. Calling it "Nature News type shit" is a cop out because you don't like the results.

[Anonymous No.4794881]

>>4794835
I'd choose death.
If you had my teeth, you would as well.

Seriously though, you're blaming meat for something caused by hamplanet eating habits. If you eat like a horse, you'd better exercise like a horse.

I've actually been on OP's kind of diet for the entire summer, and I gained weight, felt like shit and couldn't even find the strength to exercise. Meanwhile, two weeks of a mostly protein and fat diet with some bread here and there have completely reverted any damage done by that.

[Anonymous No.4794884]

>>4794871

Harvard is a cult.

[Anonymous No.4794889]

>>4794881
>protein and fat
Because legumes, grains, nuts, and seeds aren't overflowing with protein and healthy fat?

[Anonymous No.4794891]

>>4794338
>Aluminum
Isn't that toxic in the same way mercury is?

[Anonymous No.4794893]

>>4793919
>Oh chef senseis of /ck/, teach me how to make delicious vegetarian food. I love ethnic cuisine, so Indian recipes and such would be perfect.
Alrighty, to start with this is not a post about whether or not you should eat meat. Forget about that point. It has nothing to do with saving your life. You need to entirely change your outlook on food--how you perceive eating in every aspect. You can eat a perfectly vegan/veggie diet and unless you change your relationship with food, you're still going to die because you'll still overeat. You'll still stuff your gullet with shit that isn't good for you. You'll still not be as active as you need to be.

Don't change your diet, change your life.

[Anonymous No.4794896]

>>4794891
all metals have a toxicity level to them. some we're more tolerant of than others, and some don't exit the body once in.

[Anonymous No.4794905]

>>4794889
The problem with these is that they contain toxins that our bodies haven't evolved to tolerate in the doses we eat them in today.

I actually do eat oats, and beans for the cheap protein shot that they offer. I just make sure to eat as little of them as possible, and replace the minerals flushed out in the process.
As for wheat, I'd like to avoid it entirely but I haven't found a good substitute for bread yet.

[Anonymous No.4794909]

>>4794040
>tfw no toohoo privliege

japan can kiss my ass, I fought my ass off to save THIS COUTNRY and they can just go fuck themselfs their mutilating our children

[Anonymous No.4794964]

>>4794905
>I haven't found a good substitute for bread yet.
Bread doesn't = wheat. You can make bread wheat-free no problem.

[Anonymous No.4794983]

>>4794905
Apparently, the phytic acid in grains doesn't really rob your body of nutrients, as it's already bound to some by the time you eat it. Of course, this depends on the amount of phytic acid, but you're just not getting some nutrients, it's not really robbing you of them.

[Anonymous No.4795157]

>>4794791
see >>4794817
also, nice sage bro.

[Anonymous No.4795193]

>>4794871
none of them are able to conclude meat is bad. they conclude too much fat is bad, not meat.
meat is the muscle, the muscle is not bad.

it just so happens people who eat the muscle often, not always but often eat a lot of the fat too

[Anonymous No.4795321]

>>4794232
Only thing bad is the TVP and Eggs.

[Anonymous No.4795329]

>>4794749
That pic is hilarious.

>Veggie Slices

>Vegan

>Donuts

>Vegan

[Anonymous No.4795509]

>>4795193
All of them conclude that the more meat you eat, the more disease and cancer you'll get. Obviously genetics and other factors play a big role. You can eat 10 burgers a day and live to 100, just like there are people who smoke a pack a day, and drink from dawn to dusk yet live to 100. But for the general population, the more meat you eat the sooner you'll die.

[Anonymous No.4795519]

>>4795509
you're not getting what he's saying.

"meat" has two main aspects: fat and muscle. Sometimes they're visually separate and other times not so much, but the point he's making is that it's the FAT that's unhealthy, not the muscle/protein/whatever you want to call the lean part.

and if you just look at it all under the broad category of "meat" then no shit it's going to look like meat is bad, because you're lumping someone who eats a lot of salmon and grilled chicken breast with someone who eats deep-fried chicken wings, bacon, and pulled pork all day.

[Anonymous No.4795526]

>>4794763
>This is the field I work in

You should quit now.

[Anonymous No.4795528]

>>4794788
Are you actually crying?

[Anonymous No.4795559]

>>4794749
that pic is the biggest troll in this whole thread.

[Anonymous No.4795564]

>>4794964
is that what that Sprouted bread shit is all about?

[Anonymous No.4795566]

>>4793980

If health is the issue, a cup of beans provides just as much protein as 5 ounces of steak with none of the fat.

[Anonymous No.4795611]

>>4794909
what?
captcha related: 95348835 808

[Anonymous No.4795639]

>>4794129
>>4794129
>>4794129
seconding this

[Anonymous No.4795641]

>>4793919

Meat does not cause a heart attack. What is your height/weight.

How often do you consume the folowing: Sodas of any type, fast food, refined oils, junk food of any type?

What is your typical grocery store purchase. Do you buy lots of microwaveable meals. Or anything high in sugar.

[Anonymous No.4795648]

>>4794038

>Mark's Daily Apple

What next, a citiation of the Westboro Baptist Church on why gays are bad?

[Anonymous No.4795663]

One of the tastiest vegetarian/vegan things I make is a barley and lentil soup. You can either start it with some roasted vegetable stock (best option), or start it with leftover water from previously boiled lentils. For this REASON, I tend to make the soup the day after I've made some other lentil dish

Basically you chop up some potatoes, onion, celery, and carrot, chuck it into the pot, add in some tomato paste (a little at a time, or else you might overtomato the soup), add in enough lentils and pearled barley to fill about 1/4 of the water level, and simmer it gently until everything's cooked through. Doesn't even require any seasoning besides some salt and pepper, maybe some cayenne if you want to Chef John it. Delicious as all fuck and just as healthy. I thicken mine with a little agar powder, but potato starch should work too

Also check out nutritionfacts for good information on what exactly is good in certain plant foods and bad in others, beyond just standard vitamin and mineral content

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYdi0RpI1SU

[Anonymous No.4795667]

>>4795641

>Meat does not cause a heart attack

Is The Heart Attack Grill a vegetarian restaurant?

[Anonymous No.4795675]

>>4795667
lol

[Anonymous No.4795697]

>>4794320
Vegetarians are more often than not conscious about weight and health or else they probably wouldn't be vegetarians, those who don't care about either also happen to not care about whether or not they eat meat. I'm surprised the statistic isn't higher though, there must be more fat vegetarians running around than I thought.

[Anonymous No.4795741]

>>4795697

You can't cling to that random guess forever. Even controlled, longterm studies like the Adventist Health Studies that measure people who abstain from drinking, smoking, and get exercise but have different diets show better health in people who don't eat meat

[Anonymous No.4795768]

>>4795741
This. Meat is just objectively unhealthy. Eating it, even when other factors are controlled for, increases your risk of heart disease, cancer, and a host of other serious health issues.

[Anonymous No.4795775]

I have a huge rump steak on my kitchen bench right now, I'm getting it up to room temperature so I can nom it later on.

[Anonymous No.4795780]

>>4795775

Yeah, I bet you LIKE eating rumps

[Anonymous No.4796318]

>>4794252
You obviously have an aversion to the science, or are not reading the articles properly. Biologist here, and eating meat in large portions is unhealthy, eating about 70-120g with your meal is the healthiest option (more healthy than veges alone.)
refer to >>4794817

OP, the best thing for you is eating a meal that has a range of colours. That ensures all nutrients, and just smaller portions of meat. Also, use as much oil as you want, seriously, it's only bad if it's hydrogenated. I use lard.

[Sony Computer Entertainment of(...) No.4796321]

>>4793919

I'm a genetic homosexual who was a heroin addict. Statistically, I have about two years left to live.

That's not why I choose to be vegan, though! GET YOUR SHIT TOGETHER MAN!

See this pizza! It's fucking vegetarian!

You're making me oh, so mad.

[Sony Computer Entertainment of(...) No.4796322]

>>4796321

AND THAT COULD VERY WELL BE CLOUDEAR FUNGUS!

I thought it was cheese, but that looks like some sort of ham or some shit.

[Anonymous No.4796332]

>>4794905
>The problem with these is that they contain toxins that our bodies haven't evolved to tolerate in the doses we eat them in today.
paleo pls

[Anonymous No.4796382]

>>4794905

>toxins

every time I hear someone mention toxins irl I ask them to name 1 toxin. This won't translate over to the internet because you can just google something, but none of them have even been able to reference a single toxin.

[Anonymous No.4796403]

>>4796321
>vegetarian
>ham

[Anonymous No.4796431]

>>4796382
The only actual toxin I can think of in regular food is that stuff potato's make when you fry them. I forget what it is called but there is such a small amount of it that it isn't worth talking about.

[Anonymous No.4796443]

>>4796431

Are you talking about solanine? That's not "made by potatoes when you fry them", it's naturally occurring in green potato skins, though like you said it's present in small quantities so it's not likely to affect anyone unless they eat a massive amount of potato peels. Also, it's destroyed by high heat, so the cooking process can render it safe as well.

[Anonymous No.4796453]

>>4796443
I think he's talking about acrylamide, and the evidence for that's pretty shaky.

[Anonymous No.4796605]

>>4796382
Paleo is like a religion. Logical thinking skills get left at the door, otherwise the whole thing falls to pieces.

[Anonymous No.4796642]

>>4796321
>See this pizza! It's fucking vegetarian!
Yep, and that cheese pizza is healthier than if it were smothered in pepperoni and sausage.

[Anonymous No.4796687]

>>4794905

Paleo takes the things people are allergic to, milk and eggs and peanuts and so on, and then tried to find a unifying answer as to why. They suggest evolution hasn't caught up to our diet. The solution, however, is strict caveman reenactments and jars of exotic vitamins and oils and convincing people they're gonna fucking die if they eat wheat. It's like the vegetarian fad of yesterday, driven by fad producers.

[Anonymous No.4796698]

>>4796431

I guess they're referring to gluten as a toxin these days due to increasing allergy, but not peanut butter for some reason.

[Anonymous No.4796707]

>>4796321
There's so much grease, it's pooling in the centre. That looks really unappetising :'^(

[Anonymous No.4796726]

>>4796707
Lots of cheese tends to do that. Too much pepperoni will do it too. both leave a good bit of grease.

[Anonymous No.4796789]

>>4793919
Invest in TVP, nutritional yeast (gives a meaty flavour to any meal, try it in everything), gluten flour, chickpeas (or other beans) and lentils.

Use TVP as a substitute for ground meat in any dish.

Gluten flour is for your new, delicious veggie burgers (3 parts legumes, 2 parts grains (such as gluten flour and oats), 2 parts veggies = great blend). Remember to use lots of spices, a bit of oil and a bit of lemon juice/vinegar. Mash the ingredients and form burgers. Bake them in the oven for 15 min before you grill/fry them (or just eat them straight), so they cook all the way through. Make a huge portion and freeze them down for convenience.

Lentil soups are delicious and you can vary them endlessly with different vegetables. Use vegetarian stock.

Chickpeas are great in salads, theyre full of proteins and they fill you up.

Tofu is great in dishes where you would use diced meat, such as in woks and stews.

Oats with soy milk for breakfast gives you lots of protein. Add bananas/other fruit and/or raisins as a sweetener.

On your (healthy coarse) bread: hummus, other bean spreads (use your imagination, i like mashed soybeans with jalapenos and garam masala. Can also be made with lentils), nut butters, jams, jellies and marmelade (make it yourself and sweeten it with stevia), tomatoes and avocado with salt and pepper, green capsicum, herbs of all kinds, raisins, chopped up olives. Remember to use a healthy light margarine type with vegetable fats.

Not eating meat may seem like a restriction to you now, but it will probably open your eyes up to the endless world of vegetarian goodness. Welcome to a new culinary adventure.

[Anonymous No.4796798]

>>4796789
as he replies to his own thread again pretending to be someone else

look, the anti meat and anti dairy threads bumped at the same time again. What a coincidence

[Anonymous No.4796812]

>>4796798
Im not OP.

[Anonymous No.4796813]

>>4796318

>eating about 70-120g with your meal is the healthiest option (more healthy than veges alone.)

Specifically why?

>Also, use as much oil as you want, seriously, it's only bad if it's hydrogenated. I use lard.

Pic related. The fuck kind of advice is that? What is that even based on?

[Anonymous No.4796830]

>>4796813
The person youre responding to is obviously a troll. "Its only bad if its hydrogenated". Yeah, and if you use too much of it. Trolling these threads is easy because some people are threatened by vegetables.

[Anonymous No.4797618]

>>4796830
>some people are threatened by vegetables.
If it didn't die screaming, I won't eat it. That's my motto. And who cares if I only live to 40, we all gotta die eventually.

[Anonymous No.4798027]

>>4796813
First, that much meat gives you all the nutrients you will need without putting too much strain on you like eating a lot of meat, which fucks your body.
Secondly, it's based from biology and chemistry.
>>4796830
Not a troll. lrn2science. Afraid of veges? Are you retarded? I said you want as many diff colours in your food, that implies veges.

[Anonymous No.4798034]

>>4797618
Enjoy your IBS/kidney stones/gout

[Anonymous No.4798062]

>>4798034
Not to mention cancer.

[Anonymous No.4799128]

What's a good vegetarian resource site?

[Anonymous No.4799137]

Interesting thread OP. Considering contribootin some of the stuff I eat. Is the thread on topic or did it derail like usual when anything with veg in the title appears on /ck/? I dont fancy going thru all the bs /ck/ has to offer regarding not eating meat.

About to make a light version of shepherds pie using brown lentils to replace meat in about an hour.

[Anonymous No.4799140]

>>4794063
top keksem
fucking vegan slit your throat you worthless pos

[Anonymous No.4799146]

>>4793919
>Just came back to the doctor

suuure, eat shit and die dumbass

[Anonymous No.4799176]

>>4793919

I had to do the same thing at 31 Op. I cut back on carbs and stopped eating anything fried. Stopped drinking everything but water.

Also started eating oatmeal for breakfast and nuts for snacks.

Started walking 30 minutes a day too.

After 6 months of doing so my blood work showed I had done a complete 180 and was healthy enough to stop all meds. I had also lost about 25 pounds.

Take it seriously, eat healthy and exercise. You can do it. A vegetarian diet with exercise will make you feel so much better too.

[Anonymous No.4799202]

>>4799176
>A vegetarian diet with exercise
This is the winning combo, imo. Diet alone can do a lot, but add exercise on top and you've nailed it. I've lost 30 lbs of fat, and gained 20 lbs of muscle in the 2 years I've been vegetarian and started working out.

[Anonymous No.4799220]

>I have to start eating less meat, especially red

Ha

>grains

HaHa

Eat lean red meat and complex carbohydrate. Your average american product made from grain is worse than the fat on your meat. The best reason to cut down on animal fat is caloric intake, not heart disease. And actually do serious reading on heart disease and cholesterol instead of listening to heavily simplified doctor's advice.

[Anonymous No.4799229]

This thread is the biggest bro- and momscience bogaloo i saw in a long time

[Racist Transethnic Transgender(...) No.4799238]

>>4793919
>Changing My Diet So I Don't Die
>wanting to live forever

what a rpole

[Anonymous No.4799494]

>>4799238
Well the longest living human smoked and drank like hell. Said her secret was olive oil. The longest living dog, however, was fed a vegan diet.

[Anonymous No.4799536]

>>4798027

>First, that much meat gives you all the nutrients you will need

Like what? Why's that better than a few scoops of lentils, which not only have no downsides like the fat content and cancer-causing aspects of red meat but also improve your health in other ways like the second meal effect, phytnonutrients, and its fiber and carbohydrate content?

[Anonymous No.4799546]

>>4793919

Wow. Imagine that, /ck/. When faced with health problems, most doctors agree. Eat as little meat as possible and eat a shitton of raw fruits and vegetables.

I wonder... What are we supposed to be eating?

[Anonymous No.4799557]

>>4799546


This is the truth. I hate to say it, but it is so fucking obvious that it hurts. Fruits and vegetables will save us.

[Anonymous No.4799569]

>>4799557

While human canines are pretty shitty, it's also dumb to say "canines = meat-eater" in the first place because canines are useful for much more than meat. Horses, deer, elephants, gorillas, etc have canines and they aren't meat-eaters

[Anonymous No.4799579]

>>4799546
>most doctors agree
citation needed

Vegan arguments for health are based upon the fact that if you overdo something, it makes the thing you're doing bad even in moderation. Lean meat is perfectly healthy, and red in moderation.

[Anonymous No.4799587]

>>4799579

>eating anything you have to moderate

Nah. I can eat as much broccoli and kale as I want. The same can't be said for cheeseburgers.

[Anonymous No.4799590]

>>4799579

>in moderation

The thing about that is, if you have to strictly limit it to reduce its adverse health effects, it's probably not something you should be eating in the first place

>fuck you, cigarettes aren't bad for you if you just smoke a couple a day

[Anonymous No.4799591]

>>4799587

>yfw this simple logic finally woke you the fuck up

Stop putting shit into your bodies. That tit-milk covered dead flesh doesn't just disappear wen you slide it down your throat. Your body has to deal with it.

[Anonymous No.4799601]

>>4799587
>>4799590
>>4799591
>hurr if I take a whole bottle of aspirin I'll die, better not take one for a headache
>even though a glass of red wine is healthy, if you drink gallons of it you will die, so i must be bad

Thank you for proving how retarded your mindset it, I think I'm done here if the concept of moderation is above you guys.

[Anonymous No.4799608]

>>4799601

It's simple. It the world of facts and numbers. If you can avoid anything that needs moderation, why wouldn't you?

[Anonymous No.4799612]

>>4799608
It's simple, if things are good in moderation, then why wouldn't you consume them as intended?

>driving a car at 100mph on the freeway is illegal, better not drive at all!
THIS IS HOW VEGANS RATIONALIZE THEIR SELECTIVE EATING DISORDER TO THEMSELVES

(I'm done, responding to further posts would be a waste of time for me)

[Anonymous No.4799613]

>>4799601

Aspirin is not food, and a glass of red wine won't improve your health unless your health is already shitty, like if you eat a lot of meat. Eat a lot of fruits and red wine does absolutely nothing for you

[Anonymous No.4799623]

>>4799601

>aspirin is good for you because it makes your head not hurt. ignore all the side-effects

I don't even understand what you're trying to say with that example

http://www.drugs.com/sfx/aspirin-side-effects.html

[Anonymous No.4799626]

>>4799608
because there exists nosubstance for which moderation is not needed.

Except maybe thc, it's a feat in itself to smoke the lethal dose of 1.5 lbs before losing the ability to continue smoking

[Anonymous No.4799637]

>>4799612
Even in countries like Japan, with low meat consumption, vegetarians live longer and have lower rates of disease.

[Anonymous No.4799645]

>>4799637

Interestingly, these countries with traditionally low meat consumption are beginning to westernize their diets now with more beef, eggs, chicken, etc and are becoming much more prone to heart disease and obesity

[Anonymous No.4799648]

>>4799601
>aspirin is food

[Anonymous No.4799654]

Enough said. You can't ignore this anymore. Unless you enjoy being wrong and eating shit not designed for your anatomy.

[Anonymous No.4799657]

>>4799648
it's edible, serves a helpful purpose and is perfectly healthy at the correct portions

[Anonymous No.4799659]

>>4799654

FUK U MUHFUGGA WE DONT GOTTA EVOLVE TO EAT MEAT CUZ WE GOT TECHNOLOGY. MUH BACON

[Anonymous No.4799666]

>>4799654
>humans are vegetarian
>underdeveloped appendix

[Anonymous No.4799669]

>>4799657

>and is perfectly healthy at the correct portions

You confuse the effect of numbing you to a symptom with the idea of it being good for you. Aspirin's not "healthy" at any amount, it just provides temporary relief from pain caused by something else, and it comes with side-effects of its own. Every drug does. Prescription drugs, even safely taken in the recommended amounts, are the fourth leading cause of death in the US because of adverse reactions people have to them

You and your "moderation"

[Anonymous No.4799671]

why do these threads last so long? just report it and click the minus button on the side, all of you are being retarded.

[Anonymous No.4799675]

>>4799671
Did you report this thread?

[Anonymous No.4799676]

Think about what needs to be done to meat before you can consume it. We grow meat by raising animals. We grow fruit and vegetables by tending to the crop. But there is a very distinct difference between the end result of meat and fruits and vegetables. To eat meat, you have to kill the animal, carve said animal up, cure the flesh, season it for cooking, cook it, and finally eat it.

To eat vegetables and fruits after your done tending to their growth, you pick it, wash it, and eat it.

Think about it.

[Anonymous No.4799678]

>>4799671

>Being this mad about facts

[Anonymous No.4799680]

>>4799669
>even safely taken in the recommended amounts
only when another substance becomes involved

[Anonymous No.4799690]

>>4799680
Lots of research is finding out that plenty of the common painkillers have some pretty bad side effects, including inducing asthma in children.

[Anonymous No.4799703]

>>4799675
yes sadly when i leave the board and come back it expands again. these threads are just obvious baiting and nothing but "muh facts" shitposting happens here. i already took several screenshots of threads like these and plan to take them to /q/. sadly when actual vegetarian threads pop out they get shitposted on because muh feelings of threads like this. this is an example of a good thread that will probably get shitposted on >>4799682

[Anonymous No.4799712]

>>4799703

It' because the majority of America think meat is a part of every meal. And they throw a babby tantrum when they don't eat meat with everything.

[Anonymous No.4799720]

>>4799712
Or it's because these threads are always filled with people who think they're right and push the blame on the other party. Like you.

[Anonymous No.4799763]

I see no reason given in this thread why I should give up meat. Also can't do it anyway since I can't cook.

[Anonymous No.4799768]

>>4799763

How about 15 reasons?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30gEiweaAVQ

[Anonymous No.4799770]

>>4795559
i've met vegetarians that will stuff their face with rice and white bread and mayo and wonder why they are fat/have poor blood labs

[Anonymous No.4799786]

>>4799768
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30gEiweaAVQ
Pretty darn long video.

[Anonymous No.4799790]

>>4799786

The contents of that video may SAVE YOUR LIFE

[Anonymous No.4799814]

>>4799790
I'm falling asleep at the wheel.

[Anonymous No.4799828]

>>4799676
Yep, which is why it's kinda funny when people call vegetarians extreme. We would take our kids to pick apples, but never take them to a slaughterhouse. Meat production is as extremist as it gets.

[Anonymous No.4800855]

>>4799690
Yes, and vaccines give children autism

[Anonymous No.4801143]

>>4794367
>algay