/ck/ - Food & Cooking

[Anonymous No.19941387]

Is this the biggest gaslight in modern history? Is it for diversity? Marketing purposes? Why do they insist this is a thing?

>No, it's not the same as salty! Umami is a unique flavor! Huh? Describe it? Well, it's savory of course, it has a good flavor! Umami means "good taste!" What do you mean vague? It sounds pretty descriptive to me!

[Anonymous No.19941399]

It literally started as a Japanese ploy to sell their excess kelp.

[Anonymous No.19941433]

>>19941387
I imagine umami to be the flavor you get when you lick a Japanese girl's armpit

[Anonymous No.19941440]

>>19941387
It's actually closest to what we in the west would called gamey but even then it's not exactly the same thing. Why are you so angry that specific words mean specific things? Is it because nobody speaks your native language outside of a shanty village near a disgusting muddy river?

[Anonymous No.19941451]

"Umami" is not the same thing as salty, and you trying to conflate the two brings out exactly why people are being disingenuous whenever they try to say that "savory" and "umami" mean the same thing.
>>19941387
>describe it?
Can you describe any flavor? Go ahead. Try to describe "sweet" or "salty" without just saying they're sweet/salty, or pointing to specific ingredients that possess those attributes. Why does this upset you so much? Why do you want the world to be as small and uninteresting as possible? Do you get upset when one out of ten screens at the movie theater is showing something other than a Marvel movie? Because that's exactly what you sound like.

[Anonymous No.19941477]

>>19941387
Nope. There's real science behind it.

Read a little of this and you will learn.

https://flavourjournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/2044-7248-4-13

[Anonymous No.19941546]

>>19941477
OP here, unfortunately I'm illiterate but thanks for the thought. Still going with salty.

[Anonymous No.19941571]

>>19941477
regardless of wether op is right or not, you don't understand what "real science" is if you think that link proves anything

[Anonymous No.19941624]

>>19941571
Remarkably idiotic response. It goes into detail on the history of umami becoming recognized as a taste. It is exactly the resource OP could use to further inform himself on what umami actually is. He is clearly as ignorant on it as you are.

Notice how the piece has citations? Hmmmmmmmm. Maybe those are more than just a history lesson. HMMMMM.

>>19941546
Low intelligence people will never change their opinion because of their ego. The truth is a 10 minute read away, and you can't even muster that. Good luck, bud.

[Anonymous No.19941628]

>>19941624
>10 minute read
Lol slow reading moron

[Anonymous No.19941635]

>>19941628
I accept your concession, bud. :) no need to get... SALTY! Get it? Haha.

[Anonymous No.19941648]

They should call it "meaty" instead of "umami."
Sprinkle some MSG on a steak and it'll taste slightly more "meaty" than before. Same if you put some on veggies.
I sometimes only use MSG when cooking meats and veggies from scratch, and I've got some Lawry's seasoned salt and ketchup on the dinner table if it needs a little more je ne sais quoi. Salt for liquids and tomato gravy for solids.

[Anonymous No.19941652]

>>19941635
I’m not the anons you were trying to insult. It’s just funny that you think so highly of your own intelligence and say that tiny article is a ten minute read. Stop mouthing words when you read, stupid.

[Anonymous No.19941667]

>>19941387
Just the Asians trying to push MSG.

[Anonymous No.19941671]

>>19941546
you certainly sound pretty fucking salty Rajesh

[Anonymous No.19941688]

>>19941671
>you certainly sound pretty fucking salty Rajesh
My name is Pajeet.

[Anonymous No.19941699]

>>19941652
What's reallg funny is that you lack the ability to understand why I said 10 minutes. My advice to you? Try to keep up, sweetie.

Open up for the spoon feed, little man! >>19941546

[Anonymous No.19941700]

>>19941387
Bot post slide it.

[Anonymous No.19941746]

>>19941451
>why people are being disingenuous whenever they try to say that "savory" and "umami" mean the same thing.
What's the difference? I ask that genuinely, I've always thought they meant the same thing.

[Anonymous No.19941985]

the biggest gaslight is that bayleaf adds anything to recipes. Umami is just a different word for savoury.

[Anonymous No.19942001]

>>19941387
T/N: "umami" means "savoury".

[Anonymous No.19942131]

>>19941387
salty? only retards would equate umami with salty
that's like saying sweet and sour are the same because you find them together often

[Anonymous No.19942133]

[Anonymous No.19942137]

>>19942131
>that's like saying sweet and sour are the same because you find them together often
What are you expecting to find in sweet and sour sauce?
You boomers! You make me laugh!

[Anonymous No.19942138]

the word umami is the cringiest

just say salty

[Anonymous No.19942139]

>>19941387
>Describe it?
Describe "salty"

[Anonymous No.19942141]

>>19942137
>monoSODIUM glutamate
it’s just less salty salt

[Anonymous No.19942145]

>>19942141
what about that stuff you didn't capitalize?

[Anonymous No.19942156]

>>19941387
>it’s another umami bait thread

[Anonymous No.19942165]

>CTRL+F Glutamines
>Phrase not found
These boards are now either fully populated with bots or abject retreads
I'll bet Plebbit now has higher quality threads

[Anonymous No.19942171]

>>19942165
glutamine is not glutamate

[Anonymous No.19942173]

>>19942165
I'll F your glutamines

[Anonymous No.19942182]

>>19941387
another word for savory funkiness

[Anonymous No.19942184]

>>19942145
It’s the stuff that makes salt less salty.

[Anonymous No.19942186]

>>19942184
what else does it do

[Anonymous No.19942187]

>>19942171
you can piss and moan about it's anionic form as well, but THAT wasn't mentioned, and neither was Glutamic acid
>>19942173
UwU
Top shelf innuendo, fageet

[Anonymous No.19942191]

>>19942186
Makes pedants seethe

[Anonymous No.19942193]

>>19942187
>THAT wasn't mentioned
what's that got to do with anything
you (or he) pissed and moaned about everyone being retarded because they didn't say "glutamines" but glutamines isn't correct

[Anonymous No.19942194]

>>19942193
>you (or he) pissed and moaned about everyone being retarded because they didn't say "glutamines" but glutamines isn't correct
Stop trying to gaslight us.

[Anonymous No.19942198]

>>19942194
whatever, stay retarded then.
one day you'll do some grandstanding like that IRL while being wrong and then you'll feel differently about carrying on like that

[Anonymous No.19942199]

>>19942194
>us
Who?

[Anonymous No.19942221]

>>19942198
KEK! Yeah, chump, I wasn't either of those other replies, but I find it curious you didn't "Chime in" earlier when the simple thing that defines "Umami" is simply Glutamates and their derivatives.
You're still a faggot even if technically correct.
There... You feel vindicated now?
I noticed you didn't jump all over the fact that SODIUM isn't salt.
IRL if we were having that conversation, I'd say, oh yeah, that's what I meant, and we'd MOVE ON...
But you're one of THOSE insufferable faggots.
Pobody's Nerfect

[Anonymous No.19942229]

>>19942221
go bak 2 reddit

[Anonymous No.19942230]

>>19941387
umami is my favourite meguca

[Anonymous No.19942231]

>>19942229
You can go eat sugar, faggot, I've never been there.

[Anonymous No.19942235]

>>19942221
Ah, little baby is umami

[Anonymous No.19942255]

>>19942231
>You can go eat sugar, faggot, I've never been there.
Haha, you've never been to Sugar. What a poor! He can't afford a plane ticket to Sugar like us rich people!
You don't know what you are missing out on! Go to Sugar while you still can! Do it for the lulz.

[Anonymous No.19942258]

>>19942230
Gives good head

[Anonymous No.19942261]

>>19942255
>DoubleChecked
It's true...I wuz born a poor Black child, an' I'se sho'Nuff ain't nevah bees on no Autoplane befoe--'Specialike nots to SUGAR..
But po' black chile kin DREAM cain't he?

[Anonymous No.19942281]

>>19942221
>IRL if we were having that conversation, I'd say, oh yeah, that's what I meant, and we'd MOVE ON...
exactly. what took you so long?

[Anonymous No.19942287]

>>19942281
>exactly. what took you so long?
Oh yeah, that's what I meant.
Now MUHFUGGIN move on before I make you squeal like a pig!

[Anonymous No.19942294]

>>19942287
You’re the only one squealing ITT, umami bitchboi

[Anonymous No.19942310]

>>19942294
That's it. Okay. Give me your home address. I'm buying the earliest plane ticket I can get and I'm going to rent a car so I can drive to your mama's house and beat your ass.
If you don't post your address, then YOU are the real umami bitchboi

[Anonymous No.19942314]

>>19941451
>why people are being disingenuous whenever they try to say that "savory" and "umami" mean the same thing.
IT IS THE SAME GODDAMN THING AND YOU KNOW IT. That's it, Umami just means savory, it's a flavor profile we've known about literally forever but decided to attach a fancy name to.

[Anonymous No.19942317]

>>19942314
I agree with that, but sometimes people mean to refer to a type of dish with savory.. Umami disambiguates it. People know exactly what you mean when you say that.

[Anonymous No.19942318]

>>19942314
>IT IS THE SAME GODDAMN THING AND YOU KNOW IT. That's it, Umami just means savory, it's a flavor profile we've known about literally forever but decided to attach a fancy name to.
That sounds incredibly disingenuous.

[Anonymous No.19942320]

>>19942314
Umami is just jap for salty. Enough with this glorious nippon savory bullshit. Just because it’s from Japan doesn’t it make better. We already have umami here. It’s called salt

[Anonymous No.19942326]

>>19942320
is this umami?

[Anonymous No.19942335]

>>19942165
Stupid idiot.
See: >>19941477

You never mentioned inosinic acid, or guanylic acid. What does that make you?

[Anonymous No.19942341]

>>19942320
>Umami is just jap for salty.
No it isn't, they use it for the taste of meat primarily. The japanese word for something being salty is shiokarai.

[Anonymous No.19942356]

>>19942326
>is salty fish goo salty
Yes. Glad we agree umami just means salty

[Anonymous No.19942430]

>>19942356
Only an extreme tastelet would think salty is the same as umami. It's incredibly stupid.

Saltiness come from salt, sodium chloride. There are specific taste receptors that detect saltiness.

Umami comes from glutamic acid, guanylic acid and inosinic acid, and usually combined with other flavors. There are specific taste receptors that detect these. The taste signals a high protein meal, so we have developed a strong affinity towards that taste.

Imagine if I was making the claim that bitterness is just salty because I didn't have the vocabulary, taste experiences, or specific knowledge to understand or recognize the physical difference between them. It would sound incredibly retarded.

[Anonymous No.19942613]

>>19941746
Up until just recently we didn't even know that "umami" was a distinct taste. While it is true that "savory" was often used to describe umami, it has a much broader definition, and can't just be retroactively redefined because a few incels on an anime image board hate weebs. Typically, "savory" is used as a contrast to "sweet", which is why bringing up the conflation with "salty" is apt. For the most part, "savory" just means "not sweet". Yes, it is true that some people would say things like, "this steak and wild mushroom demi glace is incredibly savory", as though they were aware of this other taste; but without a distinct word to name it, things become muddled and communication falters. That's the point. We want to strive for nuance, and appreciate complexity. Refusing to use the word "umami" while accepting the concept, and then deciding that "savory" now means the same thing is no different than people in the South who use "Coke" to refer to all soda pop. Don't be like one of them.

[Anonymous No.19942617]

try some furikake from trader joe's OP
then you will know about the umamis

[Anonymous No.19942618]

Japanese food, you know... it's highly overrated... in my opinion. Michelin went there and handed out 3 stars like they were popcorn, and why? Because of a morbid fascination with the Orient? It's highly illogical, when I earned my 3 stars there was a set method to reaching 3, you had to have put out high quality food and a high quality service for years on end before you could achieve the 3rd and you know something, by just handing out 3 stars everywhere these days all they have done to continue to damage their reputation, they are after all, a tyre company first and foremost and I say, stick to tyres. I have spoken to Japanese chefs in Japan, which I have been to, and you know something? All their best chefs, in my opinion, were all classically trained in the French method, they are Chefs who learned from the great men of France, not from the Japanese. What I don't like however is when I go to a Japanese restaurant, high quality restaurant, supposedly fine dining and I go in, I am seated and the man there is explaining the food I am about to eat, how to eat it, why it is supposed to be amazing, no choice just his however many course 'experience' and spending more time trying to sell me on his dish than having me eat it. That's not food... that's not dining. In my opinion, the food should speak for itself, the customer should have the choice in what they wish to eat and I like a big portion, who doesn't? Cuisine should be simplified not a big song and dance. Good food. Done right. It's that easy. Nothing upsets me more than having a dish presented so pretty but the taste... bland. And you know something? Let's stop with this umami business. Umami, what does it mean? Savoury, are we going to pretend the Japanese invented savoury food? Really? People have been eating food for thousands of years and couldn't explain the taste until the Japanese invented a word? Nonsense.

[Anonymous No.19942690]

Why is /ck/ afraid of loanwords, english is full of them

[Anonymous No.19942713]

>>19942690
We already have a word that means the exact same thing, so no thanks shlomo-dono but we don't need your loan.

[Anonymous No.19942862]

Every time I eat something described as umami, it is savory. Umami and savory are interchangeable imo, but I still use umami to sound pretentious to annoy my wife

[Anonymous No.19942865]

>>19942862
>Every time I eat something described as umami, it is savory.
Incredible. What are the odds?

[Anonymous No.19942906]

is it fishy?

[Anonymous No.19942912]

>>19941624
>Remarkably idiotic response. It goes into detail on the history of lobotomies becoming recognized as a world changing medical procedure. It is exactly the resource OP could use to further inform himself on what mordern medicene actually is. He is clearly as ignorant on it as you are.
>Notice how the piece has citations? Hmmmmmmmm. Maybe those are more than just a history lesson. HMMMMM.


There needs to be a syndrome or illness recognized for people thinking that current-day science is infallible and treat any gay study they see like the word of god they are so desperately missing from the hole in their hearts. If you truly loved science and human progress you would be thinking about how retarded we are going to look to humans in even just 100 years.

>those fucking cavemen thought the sun was a giant fusion reactor in 2000, can you fucking believe that?

[Anonymous No.19942948]

>>19941387
>le gaslight buzzword
Just use the word "lie", zoomer.

[Anonymous No.19942949]

>>19942690
Because there's already a word for it in English, and having a foreign word to describe a basic taste isn't a good idea because it makes it sound more like a pretentious cooking style. It stands out too much.

It does feel like gas lighting because I've never heard of umami until around 3 years ago.

[Anonymous No.19942955]

>>19942949
I definitely used it 15 years ago

[Anonymous No.19942965]

ITT: pol zoomers flip their shit over a jap term
A tale as old as 2016

[Anonymous No.19942987]

>>19941451
>Can you describe any flavor?
Flavors exist to tell us what nutrients a food contains. Pleasant flavors incentivise us to seek out the foods associated with them, which ensures we get what we need to survive. So yes, common flavors can be described.
>Salty tastes like salt
We need salts, ergo we like salty foods.
>Sweet tastes like sugar
Sugars are a significant source of carbohydrates, which give us quick and efficient energy.
>Sour tastes like acid
In terms of foods, acids typically correlate with fruit. Which means dietary fiber, yet another source of carbohydrates, and most notably vitamin C. Sour can also indicate fermentation, which benefits digestion.
>Savory tastes like meat
Meat provides protein, which we need to develop. This also makes more likely to get nutrients only available through eating animals.
>Alkaline tastes basic
Bases are usually pretty harmful to us, at least as far as eating, so alkaline flavors are seen as unfavorable*.
>Bitter tastes toxic
We don't want to poison ourselves, so bitter flavors are unpleasant*.
(*You can train yourself to enjoy good foods associated with these flavors, see: acquired tastes)
>"Umami" tastes like (often caramelized) salted meat
Note that the components are already represented by other common flavors. Umami doesn't bring anything new to the table, it's just a convenient way to convey a combination of both salty and savory. Which isn't bad, it's just been far overused by insufferable retards and marketers.

[Anonymous No.19942988]

First of all you can just call it lying, no need for throwing around retarded terms like gaslighting.

Second of all, umami IS savoury. Any attempt to insist that umami is unique and distinct from savoury ought fall on deaf ears. It's just marketing.

[Anonymous No.19943027]

>>19942341
>The japanese word for something being salty is shiokarai.
No it's not, you dumb fuck weeb. It's しょっぱい

[Anonymous No.19943032]

>>19942987
I assume we have a sophisticated bitter palate for figuring out what will and will not kill us. Now we've subverted it to enjoy beer and coffee. My love of Americanos can only be described as "pathetic".

[Anonymous No.19943044]

>>19941387
>pretend black people have big dicks to demoralize the west
>pretend japanese have big flavor to demoralize the west

>why peepoo dun flavor dey food, dey goin extinct, dun got small dicks sheeet better eat that sushi roll white boi

it's a psyop to destablize the west like everything else.

[Anonymous No.19943070]

>>19943044
western foods have lots of umami

[Anonymous No.19943076]

>>19943032
Probably something like that. There are different intensities of every flavor, and we can obviously distinguish between a saltlick and a saltine.
It makes sense that we can judge the bitterness between something like moonseed berries and a cup of coffee, and (clearly) learn to enjoy the latter.

[Anonymous No.19943078]

its starting to seem like the japanese concept of salty differs because they mainly use soy sauce interchangeably with salt, so that where we would have a salt shaker on the table to use as needed the japanese would instead use a bottle of soy sauce. what they define as salty would always assume there being automatically a soy sauce flavor along with it

[Anonymous No.19943108]

>19943078
it doesn't mean salty you absolute faggot

[Anonymous No.19943109]

>>19941477
Heck yeah science the shit out them!

[Anonymous No.19943138]

>>19942912
I don't think that and never once said I did. Im pureblooded. You are ultra stupid.

[Anonymous No.19943143]

>>19943108
you have already lost

[Anonymous No.19943145]

>>19943143
no u

[Anonymous No.19943148]

>>19942965
They also prove how remarkably stupid they are.

[Anonymous No.19943149]

>>19941399
>Japanese ploy to sell their excess kelp.
>Japanese
The vast majority of kombu supplied internationally is Chinese. It may have Japanese hiragana on the packaging, but it's a product of China. I have in fact never seen Japanese kombu for sale anywhere in the US, outside of specialty shops that import it directly.

[Anonymous No.19943150]

>>19941451
>>19941477
Now describe unctuousness with science.

[Anonymous No.19943256]

>>19943138
You type like you are underage, and you couldn't contain your excitement that SCIENCE!!! aka some retarded article has your back on something.

[Anonymous No.19943265]

the word science means very little anymore, its a rhetorical trick anymore these days. It's like dumb boomers defending the patriot act, "what are you, not a patriot? :^)" / "What are you a science denier?"
Theres more psuedoscience than science anymore, but it all gets lumped together and retarded normalfag redditors whole being lights up when they see an article that jives with their confirmation bias.

I'd prefer retarded religious nuts attacking science than retarded cattle pretending it's god

[Anonymous No.19943266]

>>19943150
You're missing the point entirely, lil' zoomzoom.

We have a nervous system with receptors in our mouth. These receptors and nerves dictate the quality of an eating experience. If we look closer we find that these receptors are tuned to produce a pleasurable response from very specific things... How are you going to change the goalposts and be stupid now?

[Anonymous No.19943273]

>>19943256
Respond to this, retard.
>>19942430

That article is a brief history of the acceptance of umami world wide. It isn't even a study or anything. How braindead are you to think that? Ohh wait. You see a link and the word science and completely shut down like the good little npc you are. SAD.

[Anonymous No.19943409]

>>19943273
>the acceptance of umami world wide
No one says umami other than internet pseuds like you trying to sound cultured

[Anonymous No.19943439]

>>19943409
>ignores my argument completely
>responds with pure stupidity.

I accept your concession, buddy. No need to get salty. Maybe call umami if you're sad about losing. :)

[Anonymous No.19943466]

>>19941477
I'm not gonna waste my time reading some smugly posted food blog, someone tl'dr it pls

[Anonymous No.19943469]

>>19943439
I called you an umami bitchboi way up thread and you’re still so umami about it you’re accusing everyone who disagrees with you of being the same anon. Sad. Cry more delicious umami tears while you get umami mined left and right from multiple anons, you dumb jap fever having kelp lover.

[Anonymous No.19943481]

>>19943466
It's a quick read that is properly sourced and cited. Very far from a food blog.

The teal deer is that umami was maybe a thing, and then people were having similar discussions like this thread, but not with 90% braindead people, and then umami became a recognized food science term in a bunch of countries after further research, isolation, and discussion. America specifically took interest in learning about umami because it is an addictive flavor to have in (fast)foods.

It quickly dispels the umami isn't a real thing crowd, and I have not heard one solid argument against the little paper I posted.

[Anonymous No.19943484]

>>19943469
Not an argument. I win. ;)

[Anonymous No.19943491]

>>19943481
Did they do a discriminatory analysis that shows its meaningfully different and distinct from savory?

[Anonymous No.19943517]

>>19943484
Wrong as always, child. I have already won many times over, you just don’t realize it yet. Enjoy prison.

[Anonymous No.19943524]

>some faggot highschooler finds a paper written by some faggy labcoat HECK YA SCIENTIST about umami (japan is so awesome)
> People who aren't braindead niggers tell him it just means savory
>YOU ARE ALL DUMB SCIENCE DENIERS

Go back to r*ddit, I don't need to read a scientific paper to know what savory means in Japanese.

[Anonymous No.19943527]

The cope from the little smooth brained zoomzoom is out of this world! Pretty cute actually.

>>19943491
Umami is more specific than savory. It really is that simple.

[Anonymous No.19943532]

>>19941387
>Umami
>It has the same taste as eating a raw tomato
>Or tasting soysauce
>Or eating persimmon
Well fuck me those are three different flavros!

[Anonymous No.19943539]

Anyone who has more than three taste buds in their mouth knows that umami is nothing but a savory flavor with a hint of sweetness and a bit tarty at the end, that's it, that's literally what umami is all about

[Anonymous No.19943541]

>>19943532
That also seems fucking wrong because I would NEVER describe raw tomato as umami.

[Anonymous No.19943559]

>>19943541
>>19943539
>>19943532
Umami is the taste imparted by a number of substances, predominantly the amino acid glutamate and 5′-ribonucleotides such as inosinate and guanylate.

Umami is more specific than savory.

[Anonymous No.19943562]

>>19943559
Umami is just savory.

[Anonymous No.19943605]

>>19943559
>be completely normal and not unhinged person
>taste soy sauce
>OHHHHHHHHHH IS THAT FUCKING 5′-RIBONUCLEATIDES HMMM MAYBE GUANYLATE?
>UMMM YES, YES IT IS... UMAMI!

[Anonymous No.19943626]

>>19943562
Umami is a more specific term than savory. Savory is more like a category of foods rather than a specific taste. Sweet foods vs savory foods.

Umami is a specific taste that is created by the compounds mentioned in my previous post.

>>19943605
>NOOO YOU CAN'T UNDERSTAND THINGS FOR WHAT THEY ARE. THIS HURTS AND CONFUSES ME! STOP!

[Anonymous No.19943631]

>>19943626
Umami is just the Japanese word for savory.

[Anonymous No.19943642]

>>19943631
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO YOU DONT UNDERSTAND

LISTEN

THERES HECKING SCIENCE BEHIND THIS
LOOKS AT THESE CHEMICALS PHD LABCOAT FOUND IN HIS STUDY

SEE IT PROVES ITS NOT THE SAME!

[Anonymous No.19943647]

>>19942987
>try to describe "sweet" or "salty" without just saying they're sweet/salty, or pointing to specific ingredients
>salty tastes like salt
>sweet tastes like sugar

[Anonymous No.19943649]

>>19943631
No it isnt.

[Anonymous No.19943651]

>>19943626
We English speakers have a more specific term already, gaiji-san. It’s called salty.

[Anonymous No.19943661]

>>19943651
See
>>19942430

[Anonymous No.19943687]

>>19943651
Would you describe the flavor of raw tomato as salty, or savory?

[Anonymous No.19943705]

>>19943687
Salty, and sour secondarily. There is NOTHING savory about raw tomato what the fuck?

[Anonymous No.19943711]

These >>19943705 are the kinds of people arguing that umami is BS. Lmfao.

[Anonymous No.19943719]

>>19943705
>salty
No
>There is NOTHING savory about raw tomato
That's the point you buzzword spouting ESL shitbird. Tomatos contain natural MSG which gives them a unique flavor profile called umami. Now go back to your faggot zoomer board and spam jaks about it

[Anonymous No.19943723]

>>19943719
Tomatoes are a mix of salty and a little sour anon. They don't have some sort of special unique taste. Stay mad your tastebuds are broken.

[Anonymous No.19943724]

>>19943149
It started that way retard, as in many many moons ago when japs were lousy with kelp and wanted to drum up export biz.

[Anonymous No.19943730]

>>19943687
I'd say it's a little sweet and savory depending on the 'to

[Anonymous No.19943745]

>>19943723
Calling tomatoes salty tasting is one of the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

He isn't referring to a special unique taste like you say. He is referring to the FACT that they contain high levels of glutamic acid like cured meats, cheese, mushrooms, soy sauce, etc.

[Anonymous No.19943749]

>>19943745
And yet none of these things taste alike and so describing them with a single word is nonsensical.

[Anonymous No.19943768]

>>19943749
>hurr durr chocolate and pepsi dont taste alike so describing them both as sweet is nonsensical adurr *eats fistful of paste*

[Anonymous No.19943778]

>>19943749
Are you serious? No one is describing them as only umami, dummy. My point is that they all share a similar quality because they have high levels of glutamic acid.

>Umami is the taste imparted by a number of substances, predominantly the amino acid glutamate and 5′-ribonucleotides such as inosinate and guanylate. After the discovery of umami by Kikunae Ikeda in 1908 [1], almost 100 years were required to obtain a global scientific recognition of umami as one of the basic tastes together with sweet, sour, salty, and bitter. The original idea of researching on glutamate occurred to Kikunae Ikeda when studying physical chemistry in the laboratory of Wilhelm Ostwald in Leipzig, Germany [2]. During his stay in Germany (from 1899 to 1901), he found that there was a quite peculiar and subtle taste common in tomato, asparagus, cheese, meat, etc., which he first experienced in Germany. Ikeda recognized that there were four well-defined taste qualities, sweet, sour, salty, and bitter. However, he also considered the possibility of an additional taste quality, which was quite distinct from the well-known four basic tastes. After returning to Japan and tasting again the traditional soup stock dashi made from dried seaweed konbu (Laminariaceae Bory), he realized that dashi hold the same taste he had experienced in German foods. As a result, he began a study to identify the key chemical component in konbu responsible for this unique taste.

[Anonymous No.19943990]

>>19943745
all those items listed taste vastly different from each other unlike sweet, salty, sour which are all obvious and taste the same no matter what food contains it. why is there only ambiguity for umami, if its so vital? and the perceived saltiness of tomato owes to its acidity which is why foods containing a lot of tomato give many people really bad heartburn.

[Anonymous No.19944076]

>>19943990
There is no ambiguity for umami. There are basic taste receptors for umami just like the other flavors. You should really just read the paper I posted.

Sweet contains sugar
Salty contains salt
Sour contains acid
Umami contains glutamic acid

>In the First International Symposium on Umami held in Hawaii in 1985, Michael O’Mahony introduced the results of the description on the taste qualities of an MSG solution by Japanese and American subjects. More than 50% of Japanese subjects answered that the taste of an MSG solution was umami, while only 10% of American subjects answered that MSG tasted umami. More than 40% of the American subjects described the taste of the MSG solution as salty and the remaining 10% said that MSG holds an ‘indefinite taste’ [13]. Since dashi, which has a simple umami taste, is the fundamental soup stock used to cook a variety of Japanese dishes, it is easy for Japanese people to associate the taste of MSG solution with the umami taste in dashi. In contrast, the perception of a clear umami taste is not common in Western cultures, most likely because until recently the Western cuisine has not used pure, umami-rich ingredients. Discussion of the key issues pertaining to the establishment of umami as a basic taste lasted until the discovery of human umami taste receptors that was published in 2002 [14].

[Anonymous No.19944190]

>>19941433
extremely unpleasant if she's wearing deoderant

[Anonymous No.19944195]

if tomatoes, walnuts, mushrooms, cheese, meat, etc all contain concentrations of msg, and msg contains salt, then "umami" is just a subdivision of salty. it would actually be impossible to separate the two. in fact americans inability to differentiate msg from salt unlike the japanese in the study suggests the perception of umami is almost completely subjective and owed mostly to cultural biases than something inherent to our biology

[Anonymous No.19944203]

What is the real reason umami causes such seething flareups of autism? Is it poltards mad that a Japanese person named and described it? Actual subhumans who really can't distinguish umami from salty? Qa losers just being disruptive because their own board is dead and gay? Why?

[Anonymous No.19944214]

>>19944203
you lose

[Anonymous No.19944221]

>>19942187
glutamate is the conjugate base (anion) of glutamic acid, glutamine is a totally different amino acid.

[Anonymous No.19944291]

>>19943647
>flavor is named after thing that gives that flavor
>>S-STOP YOU CAN'T JUST EXPLAIN THAT!
Shut up you gross fucking aspie. Jesus Christ.

[Anonymous No.19944314]

>>19944195
There are basic taste receptors for the umami compounds. What is so very difficult to understand about that? You're denying basic human biology.

[Anonymous No.19944315]

>>19944291
>S-STOP YOU CAN'T JUST EXPLAIN THAT!
That was my entire fucking point, retard. If you can only describe a basic flavor by pointing to examples of it, then OP rhetorically asking for someone to describe "umami" and then complaining that the definition is "vague" could apply to every other taste.

[Anonymous No.19944347]

>>19944190
They don't wear deodorant.
Like, actually, they don't. Look it up. East Asians in general don't have the same strength armpit sweat glands.

They also have flakey ear wax as opposed to slimey.

[Anonymous No.19944356]

>>19944314
>What is so very difficult to understand about that?
that the foods used to describe umami still contain salt, which makes umami inseparable from salty or more appropriately a subdivision of salty. in others words if you use umami receptors you still have to use salty receptors. you can't separate them

[Anonymous No.19944367]

Umami is just savory. As seen by the fact that all things we describe as "umami" are interchangeably described as savory by people who haven't heard of umami (and by the fact we didn't have a concept for it despite having "umami" tasting foods for hundreds of years), and that umami is roughly translated as savory tasting. It's just a cultural/linguistic fragment caused by the fact that Japan's concept of salty differs from most of the world's, because they add salty flavour primarily through soy sauce and not through actual salt.

>but the science!
The articles listed here are soft science because they're dependent on the self reports of tasters deciding if what they taste is savory or umami.

[Anonymous No.19944375]

>>19941387
Umami is used to describe the meaty flavors from amino acids and their complexes.

[Anonymous No.19944381]

>>19944367
Don't forget to take your horse paste today.

[Anonymous No.19944382]

>>19944315
It works like this. When you get down to the elemental level of something, in this case taste, the building blocks of it are simply defined by themselves because that's what taste is. Bitter, Salty, Sour, Sweet. Savory was added because it's recognized as independent of those four. Umami either tries to be a replacement for Savory or gets caught out when people describe it as a Salty Savoriness, which disqualifies it from being basic if Savory and Salty make it. Anyway, stop being a fag.

[Anonymous No.19944384]

>>19941387
Please explain "sweet" to me without comparing it to other flavors

[Anonymous No.19944399]

>>19944367
great post

[Anonymous No.19944415]

After a little experimenting with ramen making, I realized that parmesan has a lot of umami. Looked it up and it turned out to be true. It has significantly more glutamates than other cheeses. It's probably the easiest way for westerners to understand umami.

[Anonymous No.19944416]

>>19943076
You really have to wonder how people figured out nightshades. Though one could argue with the cosmetic use of belladonna, they didn't.

[Anonymous No.19944422]

>>19944382
>or gets caught out when people describe it as a Salty Savoriness, which disqualifies it from being basic if Savory and Salty make it.
right. at best its a compound of savory and salty with salty being the parent category and savory being the spectrum of saltiness that comprises it. umami is basically just the japanese section of that spectrum with japanese staples like dashi, shouyu, etc comprising it

[Anonymous No.19944423]

>>19941648
I've always preferred it described as the "savoury" flavour, which is why salt, MSG, Worcestershire sauce are so good on so many non-sweet dishes.

[Anonymous No.19944425]

>>19944382
>the building blocks of it are simply defined by themselves because that's what taste is
>savory was added because it's recognized as independent of those four
You just made a positivistic argument and then immediately followed it up with a structuralist one. You then casually inserted the false premise that "savory" was considered the 5th flavor before "umami" was introduced, which is just factually untrue. You're either arguing in bad faith, or are an idiot.

[Anonymous No.19944434]

>>19944415
except parmesan has one of the highest salt contents of all the cheeses

[Anonymous No.19944438]

>>19944425
is an atom of gold, silver or gold?

[Anonymous No.19944456]

>>19944438
Oh...you're an idiot.

[Anonymous No.19944460]

>>19944438
I accept your concession of defeat. My cock is quite salty, but very savory. Enjoy my umami taste.

[Anonymous No.19944461]

Okay you giant fags, here's what you do.

>amass a variety of different foods
>have people taste all if the foods, the more people and the more background diversity of those people, the better
>have people group the foods, without using any names or linguistic concepts, merely placing like foods with like
>if enough people are putting all of the foods supposedly associated with umami in their own distinct category and that category is consistent across individuals, then we can reasonable concluded umami is its own distinct flavour or taste

[Anonymous No.19944518]

>>19944367
Wrong. At first they used subjective tasting, but then specific umami taste receptors were discovered. Farthest you can get from soft science.

[Anonymous No.19944560]

>>19944518
Those taste receptors are nested inside savory and salty taste receptors.

[Anonymous No.19944596]

>>19944560
Source? That does not take away from the fact that humans have specific umami receptors.

[Anonymous No.19945040]

you can actually readily buy pure glutamate as L-glutamic powder yet for some reason no one does this for their cooking. why not? apparently if you eat glutamate by itself it tastes supposedly sour (can't find any clear information on this anywhere either kind of hinting at its unpopularity) but its neutralized when added to salt which is why msg (mono SODIUM GLUTAMATE) tastes salty not sour. in other words no one eats glutamate in a vacuum and the presence of sodium completely alters its flavor to something resembling salty. why don't you buy some L glutamic acid and test this out for yourself its the only way to really prove to you that glutamate by itself isn't umami and if msg = umami and msg = salty then umami = a derivative version of salty

[Anonymous No.19945165]

Pizza is apparently a highly palatable food because of the synergy of cheese and tomatoes, both of which are supposed to be very high umami foods. I’ve never heard someone complain about a pizza being too savory, yet I have heard many people complain that a pizza is too salty.

[Anonymous No.19945195]

>>19945040
MSG absolutely does not taste salty. Stick to Hot Pockets tastelet.

[Anonymous No.19945196]

>>19945165
If you add too much msg to a piece of ham it tastes really disgusting. I also added msg to watermelon and it was vile.

[Anonymous No.19945219]

>>19941451
>>19941387
Salty is the taste sensation induced by the presence of free sodium ions. Free chloride, calcium, magnesium, and a few other anions also produce a "salty" flavor, but somewhat different than that of sodium ions.

Sour taste sensation is produced by the presence of solute hydrogen ions, such as from acids.

Umami is primarily produced by the presence of glutamate ions. Other flavors could ostensibly be described as umami, such as the flavor of melanoidins, produced when proteins and sugars become covalently bonded as part of the mallard reaction, but this isn't what umami technically is.

I used to flavor food with glutamic acid (an amino acid) powder purchased from a body building site. It gives food a strong tangy and umami taste, as when it is in solution it is both a hydrogen donor (it's an acid) and a glutamate producer (glutamic acid disassociates to H+ and glutamate in solution)

[Anonymous No.19945220]

>>19945196
>I salted a salt cured meat and it was gross
>I salted a piece of fruit and it was gross
Quit salting food that doesn’t need to be salted, stupid

[Anonymous No.19945224]

>>19943265
>the word science means very little anymore (to me)

[Anonymous No.19945236]

>>19943642
What is the last honest to god printed book that you read?

[Anonymous No.19945238]

>>19945220
You really are tremendously stupid. Can you try just a little harder to follow along, guy?

[Anonymous No.19945241]

>>19945236
Mushoku tensai light novel vol 16

[Anonymous No.19945245]

>>19945195
msg is literally half salt
https://tastecooking.com/how-to-cook-with-msg/
>When placed on the tongue by itself, MSG tastes like a mild salt without any unique quality.

[Anonymous No.19945247]

>>19945241
woe be unto you

[Anonymous No.19945259]

>>19945238
>zero argument
>calling someone guy
yikes, cringe, and oof
Salt some more cured meat and complain how its too salty. Have you tried salting an apple yet?

[Anonymous No.19945267]

>>19945259
Still doesn't get it... Really sad. Let me spoonfeed you the context of my post to show you how stupid you are. Pay attention. I will make this as simple as possible for your smooth brain.

>>19945165
>I’ve never heard someone complain about a pizza being too savory, yet I have heard many people complain that a pizza is too salty

Notice how he said never heard of pizza being too savory? I was simply stating that you can achieve an overly savory taste by adding msg to things like ham or fruit. Got it? See how stupid you look now?

[Anonymous No.19945292]

>>19945236
The Making of Modern Japan

[Anonymous No.19945315]

>>19945267
>spoonfeed
>smooth brain
Do you have any other five year old internet meme words to try to prove your point with because you're a parrot without an original thought?
>simply stating
The only simple thing here is you.
Ham is one of the most savory foods there is, no shit salting it further makes it inedible. Fruit shouldn't be savory, no shit salting fruit makes it taste bad. Pizza can be too savory if its covered in ham and fruit, stupid. That's why people object so strongly to Hawaiian pizza.

[Anonymous No.19945352]

>>19945219
this seems to be spliced together from miscellaneous forum posts and the chemistry explanation at the end is totally off topic and seems to be giving an answer to an unrelated third party's question about chemical processes. what logic do you have to even include that bit i honestly want to know. its so totally off topic.

you also seem to be the only person on the internet allegedly using glutamic powder as a seasoning. i searched every possible combination of glutamic acid and seasoning food with +reddit and +forums tags and literally found no one else doing this anywhere

[Anonymous No.19945363]

>>19945315
HE STILL DOESN'T GET IT, LMFAO. I thank you for the entertainment! You REALLY need to take a break from the internet, loser. Your behavior is borderline mental illness.

[Anonymous No.19945382]

>>19945363
>still can't refute a single point
>has to yell in caps lock
>calls someone else mentally ill
Did you accidentally umami your brain and dry it out?

[Anonymous No.19945415]

>>19945382
First you misunderstood what I was saying, "refuted" me when I corrected your clear misunderstanding of what I was saying, and now that I ignore your "argument" I'm in the wrong. You are an absolute joke. Try raising an animal or growing a plant with that attitude.

I seriously wish the best of luck to you. It's going to be a tough road ahead for you.

[Anonymous No.19945448]

>>19945415
>gets directly called out
>turns off caps lock and pretends to be calm
>refuses to address umami=salty after being relentlessly trolled
>condescendingly suggests the person he is aruging with just needs more life experience
>passive aggressively offers his best wishes
You argue like a woman, salt brain.

[Anonymous No.19945476]

buttery.... :(
buttery but in Japanese... :D

[Anonymous No.19945488]

>>19945476
Based. One of the few non-retards and mentally ill people in this thread. Well done.

[Anonymous No.19945490]

>>19945476
Non retard and non mentally ill. Sorry for the confusion.

[Anonymous No.19945497]

>>19945488
Salted or unsalted butter?

[Anonymous No.19945502]

>>19942862
>every time i eat out my wife it tastes like mammalian cooch
>therefore my wife’s pussy is interchangeable with my dog’s pussy
Dude…pick up a book every now and then and stop fucking your dog.

[Anonymous No.19945504]

>>19945497
It depends on application and butter type. Usually I go for unsalted and salt myself if needed. More versatile that way.

There's a special french butter that has flaky sea salt hand rolled into it. This butter is phenomenal as a spread on toast. A special butter that impresses everyone you share it with.

[Anonymous No.19945641]

>>19945352
Thanks.
It's an original idea I had for a spice

[Anonymous No.19945670]

>>19945641
you just avoided every question i asked you

[Anonymous No.19945683]

>>19945641
No you don't. Every spice has already been discovered. Every spice blend has already been mixed.

[Anonymous No.19945716]

>>19941387
11/10 bait you have people all mad arguing about ineffable qualia

[Anonymous No.19945976]

Umami snobs, huh you never stop learning

[Anonymous No.19946009]

Saltchads win again. USA USA

[Anonymous No.19946254]

>>19945476
umami means buttery now?

[Anonymous No.19946257]

>biggest gaslight in modern history
kosher salt

[Anonymous No.19946262]

>>19945976
>>19946009
try it yourself. I used to suspect that myself, years ago. I'd try adding salt to a gravy or broth to get to the desired savory level, but it doesn't really replace MSG or fish sauce. it needs a little.. somethin. one might call it umami since the guy who discovered it called it that

[Anonymous No.19946679]

>>19941477
>deboonked deboonked
>muh soience says so

[Anonymous No.19946883]

>>19945641
i started doing a little more research on L_glutamic powder (pure glutamate) because you actually had the audacity to come back and try to save face after posting your 100% bullshit post about adding glutamic powder to season your food and discovered that glutamic powder TASTES TERRIBLE

first of all glutamic powder is sold as a dubious work out supplement and when consumed not only tastes awful but produces a mild burning sensation according to multiple amazon reviewers
>https://www.amazon.com/Bulksupplements-L-Glutamic-Acid-Powder-Grams/product-reviews/B012DVXQ9K/ref=cm_cr_dp_d_show_all_btm?ie=UTF8&reviewerType=all_reviews
heres the kicker not only does pure glutamate taste horrible but the only way to make it palatable for human consumption IS TO ADD SALT

[Anonymous No.19946885]

>>19946883
>monosodium
>glutemate

[Anonymous No.19946899]

>>19946885
sodium (salt) neutralizes the glutamate altering its flavor into something palatable which is why people only use mono sodium glutamate (msg) to season their food and never pure glutamate.

whats the secret ingredient behind it all? SALT

[Anonymous No.19947104]

>>19942326
>luring fish with micro plastics
i really need to start donating blood

[Anonymous No.19947822]

>>19946899
>>19946883
you ever try snacking on pure sodium chloride? doesn't taste good

[Anonymous No.19947835]

>>19946899
>millennia old hidden flavour of ancient esoteric Asian arts is just salt
HAH sure thing colonizer pig dog! hah!

[Anonymous No.19947961]

>>19947822
pure sodium chloride is literally just table salt idiot

[Anonymous No.19947982]

>>19947835
>ancient esoteric Asian arts
and its all gimmicky bullshit just like karate not working in a real fight. its all bullshit just like umami

[Anonymous No.19948041]

>>19941387
I agree. Umami is a scam. It's just salty. Soy sauce is another example. It only adds a little color to food. It does NOTHING else. You could shit in a jar, slap a Japanese label on it and retarded weebs will call it chocolate pudding.

[Anonymous No.19949536]

>>19947961
exactly, retard

[Anonymous No.19949553]

>>19941387
Damn anon, you're a tastelet!

[Anonymous No.19949569]

>>19941387
an unseasoned steak isn't salty you fucking dope

[Anonymous No.19949586]

>>19941477
I ain't reading that shit.

[Anonymous No.19949604]

>>19949586
It's like he's got a dick on his face.

[Anonymous No.19949616]

>>19941387
Get some raw MSG and put a sprinkle in your mouth. That's umami.

[Anonymous No.19949620]

>>19945245
Sodium chloride is half chlorine but it's not toxic.

>When placed on the tongue by itself, MSG tastes like a mild salt without any unique quality.
Neither you nor whoever wrote that has ever tasted MSG.

[Anonymous No.19949623]

>>19941387
I went to sushi train with my gf today and I think the staff overheard me talking mad shit about Japanese cuisine

[Anonymous No.19949679]

>>19941387
>Umami
This sounds oddly sexual

[Anonymous No.19950289]

>>19949536
exactly, what? your point is that salt tastes salty? do you actually have a point? why don't you actually say what you mean, so i can destroy you some more

[Anonymous No.19950294]

>>19944315
The description of "umami" isn't vague, it's salty and savory. Both of which are already distinct, basic flavor profiles.
And as for your weird descriptor requirement, at a certain point of simplicity, you cannot describe something without pointing to examples. Good luck explaining the color red without using something red, for example.
Don't be a fucking retard.

[Anonymous No.19950334]

>>19950294
>good luck explaining the color red without using something red
That's exactly why I brought up structuralism earlier. You could make the argument that there are only red, yellow, blue, black, and white, and every other color is pointless because it's just a gradient of one of the above, like how there's an infinite number of points on a circle. The question is how we use words, and whether or not it's useful to have the words "green" or "purple". That's what the argument about "umami" is about. Is there a distinct flavor not captured by the words "savory" and/or "salty"? The general consensus is yes. What you're trying to do is describe green by calling it somewhat yellow and somewhat blue, when in reality everyone agrees that green is defined precisely by the fact that it's neither yellow nor blue.

[Anonymous No.19950387]

>>19949620
https://thegoodhuman.com/what-does-msg-taste-like/
>Pure MSG does not taste nice on its own. It tastes like a bit of salt with no distinctive taste when you eat MSG straight to your tongue.

[Anonymous No.19950481]

umami doesn't exist, but in the head of homosexuals
sorry, i don't make the rules

[Anonymous No.19950486]

>>19950387
This is a complete lie. Have you ever even seen raw MSG?

[Anonymous No.19950500]

>>19944381
How's that rising excess deaths doing?

[Anonymous No.19950515]

>>19950486
yeah it tastes like a less salty salt with something gamey/metallic. its impossible for it to not taste salty because its literally made of salt.

[Anonymous No.19950524]

>>19945224
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Replication_crisis

Twenty years of shitty university quality, bottom-rung entry standards and the subsequent politicization into "acceptable" data and conclusions from the oversocialization of academia has left very little backbone to the institutions anymore.

[Anonymous No.19950557]

>>19950515
It doesn't taste "salty", it tastes different from salt. The only way to describe it is "savory". It tastes like a savory stew without the stew.

[Anonymous No.19950564]

>>19950557https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Eb6kreCHtXs

[Anonymous No.19950574]

>>19950557
why does this trigger you so hard
https://www.foodnetwork.com/how-to/packages/food-network-essentials/what-is-msg
>MSG tastes like salt, but as a flavor enhancer, it does not have a distinct taste of its own.

[Anonymous No.19950586]

>>19941387
unami taste like gasoline.

[Anonymous No.19950589]

>>19942618
>Cuisine should be simplified
Did a french fuck say this? Really?

[Anonymous No.19950630]

>>19950574
Because it's an easily verified falsehood. You can walk into an asian grocery store, buy a small bag of MSG and taste it for yourself.

[Anonymous No.19950657]

>>19950524
"Science" discovered taste receptors in the human mouth that are specifically for glutamate and other umami compounds.

[Anonymous No.19950687]

>>19950657
Science also discovered that if a man says she’s a woman, she’s a woman. According to science, men can get pregnant now.

[Anonymous No.19950717]

>>19950657
too bad glutamate on its own tastes horrible

[Anonymous No.19950763]

>>19950630
actually all i have to do is google it to see thousands of people saying it tastes salty. i guess thats what happens when something is literally made of salt

[Anonymous No.19950768]

>>19945219
>the flavor of melanoidins

[Anonymous No.19950846]

>>19950687
The funny thing is that glutamate is just salt gang thinks exactly like that. Denying biology for their own gain.

>>19950717
So does salt, lol.

[Anonymous No.19950864]

>>19950763

[Anonymous No.19950884]

>>19950846
salt on its own tastes like salt. glutamate on its tastes acrid. it tastes like actual shit.

[Anonymous No.19950890]

>>19950864
so you think thousands of people are just lying got it

[Anonymous No.19950927]

>>19950890
Why don't you try it for yourself? A pound of MSG costs a fucking dollar and is widely available both in stores and online.

[Anonymous No.19950942]

>>19950927
i'm starting to wonder why you're defending msg so hard its like its tied to the core of your identity

[Anonymous No.19950978]

>>19950942
I'm wondering why you're so insistent on believing other people about something so minor. Are you scared of trying anything for yourself?

[Anonymous No.19951006]

>>19950978
dude i'm not scared of msg wtf what are you even blabbing about now

[Anonymous No.19951010]

>>19951006
If you're not scared, why don't you taste a small amount to see what it tastes like? Why do you have to rely on others to tell you something you can easily experience yourself?

[Anonymous No.19951040]

>>19951010
i have several msg seasonings in my kitchen i know what msg tastes like how would that even change what thousands of people have said about msg tasting salty are all of those testimonials supposed to just disappear? you sound super insecure about this right now

[Anonymous No.19951113]

>>19951040
Cilantro tastes like soap gang repping the disability over another spice

[Anonymous No.19951613]

>>19946883
glutamic powder is going to be extremely acidic, glutamic acid is as acidic as pure acetic acid (vinegar). Additionally, when MSG is dissolved into water the sodium and the glutamate will disassociate and be solvated fully; glutamate binding to it's receptor doesn't even involve sodium at all it's just the negatively charged glutamate.

[Anonymous No.19951630]

>>19951613
no one eats the powder straight up, its always dissolved in a solvent (water) and then consumed. it still tastes like shit. simply dissolving in water doesn't make it palatable, which can be easily fact checked by multiple reviewers unlike your conveniently source less claim

[Anonymous No.19951643]

>>19941387

Umami is the savory taste produced by certain amino acids like glutamate and inosinate. Umami is* the* savory taste.

[Anonymous No.19951644]

>>19951113
ok so everyone in the world that disagrees with you has a rare genetic disorder got it

[Anonymous No.19952408]

>>19944347
>They also have flakey ear wax
So that's what was in my Furikake!

[Anonymous No.19952449]

Why do the black Americans confuse savory for salt and vice versa? They flavor all their food with many kitchen powders that are just different kinds of salt+MSG+dried herb or vegetables. Why have Asians and white science people convinced blacks that more MSG and more salt= more good flavor?

[Anonymous No.19953039]

>>19951040
>like
kys zoomer

>how would that even change what thousands of people have said about msg tasting salty
It means they're all lying. None of them have ever tasted MSG and they're just parroting what somebody else that hasn't tasted MSG is saying.

[Anonymous No.19953810]

>>19953039
msg literally has salt in it

[Anonymous No.19953902]

>>19953810
MSG IS a salt. It's not sodium chloride and it doesn't taste like sodium chloride.

[Anonymous No.19953911]

>>19953902
Man it feels good to be White.
look at them all, reduced to crying about salt being a special flavour they invented.
Truly we are Gods.

[Anonymous No.19953932]

>>19953902
sodium ions are always salty idiot
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK50958/
>Because sodium and lithium are the only ions known to produce a purely salt taste, it is believed that these sodium- and lithium-specific channel receptors play a major role in sensing saltiness (Beauchamp and Stein, 2008; McCaughey, 2007).

[Anonymous No.19953951]

>>19950289
read the posts it was in response to, dipshit
fuck you're stupid

[Anonymous No.19953970]

>>19944347
I do have armpit sweat glands but i don't wear deodorant anyways.
I find the smell is invasive and supposedly it's not good for you anyways.
It's cold here most months and i shower everyday so it doesn't get too pervasive, and most of it gets contained by the shirt fabric so it doesn't usually just waft everywhere (at least to my knowledge)

[Anonymous No.19954229]

>>19953951
you're done here

[Anonymous No.19954234]

>>19953951
you're done here.

[Anonymous No.19954325]

>>19954234
yeah because there's no sense in discussing something with someone who can't follow a basic conversation

this is you rn

[Anonymous No.19954339]

>>19954325
in the end it seems that you were the one who became the saltiest of all

[Anonymous No.19954344]

>>19954339
salt is good

[Anonymous No.19954831]

>>19941387
It's the taste of glutamate ions, that is, protein. It's why meat tastes so good.
It's called Umami because a Japanese scientist discovered it, proved that there were actual receptors for it, and overturned a bunch of crusty old dogma. If an American had done the scientific legwork then it would be called Savory, but it wasn't.
"Umami" had the extra benefit of being a word that wasn't used for anything else in English. "Savory" is also the name of an edible plant (it's pretty good in salads).

[Anonymous No.19954848]

>>19941451
>"Umami" is not the same thing as salty
Some people have a genetic disorder where the taste of meat is identical to salt.
Meat tastes like salt to them

[Anonymous No.19954853]

>>19941546
How can glutamic acid taste salty? It's not the same compound

[Anonymous No.19954857]

>>19942186
Not my problem

[Anonymous No.19954921]

>>19954831
nice try
>In 1908, Japanese researcher Kikunae Ikeda of the Tokyo Imperial University identified brown crystals left behind after the evaporation of a large amount of kombu broth as glutamic acid.
they actually do sell glutamic acid by itself as a dubious work out supplement and its taste has been confirmed by everyone that tries it to taste like shit.
>These crystals, when tasted, reproduced the ineffable but undeniable flavor he detected in many foods, most especially in seaweed. Professor Ikeda termed this flavor umami.
so according to professor ikeda himself, glutamic acid (tastes like shit) = umami
>He then patented a method of mass-producing a crystalline salt of glutamic acid, monosodium glutamate.[14][15]
in realizing how shit glutamic acid tastes, he knew he needed to proceed to add sodium to glutamate hence patenting mono sodium glutamate as the only way to become palatable for human consumption. in other words, he knew that the only way to make glutamate not taste like shit was to add saltiness, because without saltiness it literally tastes like shit.

[Anonymous No.19954922]

>>19941387
I've thought this for years. It literally just means 'savory.'

[Anonymous No.19954932]

>>19954848
ok so everyone that disagrees with you has a rare name less genetic disorder that doesn't even exist that you just made up on the spot got it

[Anonymous No.19954948]

>>19954921
This isn't the own you think it is
Meat also tastes like shit without salt

[Anonymous No.19954952]

>Umami is NEW! It's a previously not understood flavor compound, DUMB BAKA WESTERNERS wouldn't understand!
And yet, tomato paste and ground anchovies, two foods high in glutamates (msg) are added to all kinds of sauces to increase their savory qualities and have been since these ingredients were first used for cooking. Same with literally every other source of "umami".

[Anonymous No.19954955]

>>19954948
too bad "umami" aka glutamic acid (according to professor ikeda himself) tastes like shit unless you add sodium to make it taste salty

let me spell it out for you again and hopefully for the last time: umami isnt its own unique flavor. ITS LITERALLY SALTY. it can't be its own flavor if its also another flavor.

[Anonymous No.19954956]

>>19954952

[Anonymous No.19954963]

>>19954955
>umami isnt its own unique flavor. ITS LITERALLY SALTY. it can't be its own flavor if its also another flavor.
That's literally how Lawry's seasoned salt works. It isn't a flavor because it is also other flavors.
I'm not retarded.

[Anonymous No.19954965]

>>19954963
you are extremely retarded

[Anonymous No.19954971]

>>19954956
I fail to see how this has anything to do with my post

[Anonymous No.19954993]

>>19954971
yes umami can't be its own flavor, since its made of other already existing flavors (salty)

[Anonymous No.19955027]

savory in english :(
savory in nipponese :)

[Anonymous No.19955033]

>>19953810
i am going to go try a little bit of msg on my finger. i think it is basically synthetic salt. it does activate my "want to eat more and faster" reaction.

"buttery" should be its own taste/flavor. the vietnamese have a specific word for it.

[Anonymous No.19955042]

>>19955033
>"buttery" should be its own taste/flavor. the vietnamese have a specific word for it.
I think they call it "fat" in vietnamese

[Anonymous No.19955047]

>>19941387
The real thing we should be talking about is astringency.

[Anonymous No.19955081]

>>19955033
msg is basically a composite flavor where the sodium (s) dissociates from the glutamate (g) when it touches a solvent like water, which in this case is the water in your saliva. then after they split up they each go to their (s) and (g) receptors on your tongue.
the big issue is that just glutamate by itself doesn't taste good without sodium also being simultaneously in your mouth. thats why professor ikeda had to add sodium to glutmate to make mono sodium glutamate since it would not have tasted good with just glutamate by itself. thats why just glutamate by itself isnt sold and used as a seasoning but msg is. it needs that saltiness.

[Anonymous No.19955085]

Salt has a salty flavor, but it also modulates other flavors.

Msg has a certain "taste" but it also modulates other flavors.

Inosinate and guanylate are other umami flavors, and they absolutely have a taste more than just salty.

[Anonymous No.19955089]

>>19955047
Also just salt

[Anonymous No.19955093]

>>19955033
>"buttery" should be its own taste/flavor
Literally salt. Butter has no taste without salt

[Anonymous No.19955098]

>>19955085
the problem with it is any of these flavors don't taste good to us without also salt. you can't call something a base flavor if it also depends on salt to taste good.

[Anonymous No.19955787]

the thumbnail looks like that gay crocodile skeleton SCP

[Anonymous No.19955950]

>>19955098
First that is entirely subjective, and secondly you understand that a steak with salt, but no umami compounds would also taste bad, right?

[Anonymous No.19956141]

>>19955950
you can't say a "steak with salt" like all meat a steak already has naturally occurring sodium inside it. you can't seperate the amino acids inside it from the sodium inside it and still be a steak. professor ikeda tried to do that with seaweed, which produced pure glutamic acid, which tastes like pure shit, which he had to recombine back with sodium to taste good again. whenever you say the word "umami" you're never describing the flavor of just amino acids - you're describing the result of what different amino acids taste like when combined with sodium. try to understand that they are inseparable.

[Anonymous No.19956166]

>>19956141
It's a thought experiment. Remove the salt from the steak and it would be bland.
Remove the umami compounds and leave the salt it would also be bland.

Inosinate and guanylate both have distinct flavors that aren't actually bad.

If you add inosinate and guanylate to msg it synergizes and makes the umami taste much more pronounced. Go ahead and get some to prove yourself wrong.

[Anonymous No.19956205]

inosinate and guanylate are also combined with sodium just like sodium is combined with glutamate to produce mono sodium glutamate. for example sodium is combined with inosinate and guanylate to produce the common food additives disodium inosinate and disodium guanylate. thats what they put it in stuff like cup o noodles. again these flavors are inseparable and any attempt to seperate them will result in something that tastes worse. the point is to admit that it isnt one base flavor you're tasting but a result of a combination of flavors coming together.

[Anonymous No.19956222]

>>19956205
by the way i just checked and you can't even buy inosinate or guanylate by itself you can only get it with sodium as disodium inosinate and disodium guanylate.

[Anonymous No.19956223]

>>19956205
Really really stupid. The human tongue has specific taste receptors for umami compounds. These receptors are different from salt receptors.

Inosinate and guanylate have very distinct flavors that are not bad. I know you have not tried their salt forms like I have.
It really does not matter if you're tasting salt along with them. Now go back to licking your Himalayan pink salt block, you salt obsessed lunatic.

[Anonymous No.19956226]

>>19956222
Obviously not. Buy that and try some. It has a flavor that is absolutely not just salty, and it isn't bad like msg either.

[Anonymous No.19956239]

>>19956223
>It really does not matter if you're tasting salt along with them.
it literally does matter. thats the whole point. you're not just tasting one thing here. its the whole reason professor ikeda had to combine sodium to glutamate to actually make it tasty. because its the combination thats tasty not just one thing by itself.

[Anonymous No.19956242]

>>19956239
that's true for every flavor

[Anonymous No.19956245]

>>19956242
if "umami" needs to be added to sodium to become tasty then 1. its not a base flavor or 2. it tastes like shit by itself

[Anonymous No.19956253]

>>19956223
>The human tongue has specific taste receptors
This has been disproven. All taste receptors are the same.

[Anonymous No.19956283]

>>19956245
what about pure sour or bitter? tastes good? straight table salt tastes good?

[Anonymous No.19956330]

>>19956283
i think the fact that sugar or salt or vinegar are present in every kitchen, are extremely common, and can be easily purchased anywhere in the world but pure inosinate or guanylate can't says a lot. i think the fact that pure glutamic acid can only be purchased as a dubious work out supplement (but not as a food seasoning) and all the reviewers of it say it tastes really fucking terrible also says a lot. if these things actually tasted good then they would be as available as a seasoning as sugar or salt or vinegar. but they're not. its almost impossible to find them in their pure form without sodium added to it and if they tasted so good in their pure form that would be the opposite, which makes me think they don't taste very good at all.

[Anonymous No.19956335]

>>19944221
yes anon...I already admitted I was wrong, please do try to keep up.

[Anonymous No.19956340]

>>19944221
>glutamic acid
oh you mean this?
https://www.amazon.com/Bulksupplements-L-Glutamic-Acid-Powder-grams/dp/B011VIWHYQ/ref=sr_1_6?crid=3MLQ8VE7Y75X8&keywords=glutamic+acid+powder&qid=1701340849&sprefix=glutamic+aci%2Caps%2C243&sr=8-6

[Anonymous No.19956344]

>>19944221
>glutamic acid
oh you mean this?
https://www.amazon.com/Bulksupplements-L-Glutamic-Acid-Powder-grams/dp/B011VIWHYQ/ref=sr_1_6?crid=3MLQ8VE7Y75X8&keywords=glutamic+acid+powder&qid=1701340849&sprefix=glutamic+aci%2Caps%2C243&sr=8-6

[Anonymous No.19956383]

>>19956330
well those things don't sound very "kitchen" to most people
but people do regularly stock soy sauce, fish sauce, worcestershire, stock/cubes with added glutamate, inosinate, guanylate, as well as MSG powder

you'd think if it was just a matter of salt, people wouldn't bother with those things and just add salt

[Anonymous No.19956410]

>>19956383
>stock soy sauce, fish sauce, worcestershire, stock/cubes with added glutamate, inosinate, guanylate, as well as MSG powder
if you're going to use sodium rich foods like those to describe "umami" then you also need to be honest and say that "umami" is a result of multiple flavors coming together and not only just one base flavor by itself

[Anonymous No.19956431]

>>19956410
but there is certainly a flavor in common that all of those impart that pure salt does not

[Anonymous No.19956448]

Umami = soy sauce flavour. Simple as

[Anonymous No.19956472]

>>19956431
amino acids appear to function more like a transformer or modifier of sodium so that when amino acids and sodium are simultaneously present they produce varying iterations of savory and salty that they aren't able to create independently. they work together to create something unique that they couldn't alone.
thats why people have so much trouble trying to define "umami" but its so easy to attribute sweet to sugar or salty to salt. it can't be easily defined because its not just one thing, but relies on a cooperation of things dynamically coming together.

[Anonymous No.19956483]

>>19956472
>savory and salty
sure, I agree they work well together, but you just referred to it as its own flavor yourself

[Anonymous No.19956498]

>>19956483
the whole thing
>varying iterations of savory and salty
meaning they combine into a lot of different versions and theres not just one base flavor

[Anonymous No.19956513]

>>19956498
so there is a flavor that is mixing with the salty flavor that you wouldn't call bitter, sour, or sweet?

[Anonymous No.19956527]

>>19956513
its a savory and salty flavor that are inseparable from each other, meaning it won't exist unless they both exist at the same time and if you seperated them they will both become something else completely

[Anonymous No.19956530]

>>19956527
that seems good enough to me to call it its own flavor. i don't see why it should matter that salt enables its delivery

[Anonymous No.19956542]

>>19942141
>monoSODIUM monochloride
It's just salt

[Anonymous No.19956543]

>>19956530
because it can't be considered a different flavor from salty if its also salty

[Anonymous No.19956549]

>>19956543
sure it is. I can sense it

>>19956542
pic related
they're just salt

[Anonymous No.19956551]

>>19956542
yes sodium chloride is salty, and so is msg
>>19953951

[Anonymous No.19956552]

>>19956551
and that's in no way relevant to the post you quoted
>glutamic acid alone tastes bad
>so does sodium chloride
>LOL that's just salt!
no shit

[Anonymous No.19956553]

>>19956542
yes sodium chloride is salty, and so is msg
>>19953932

[Anonymous No.19956575]

>>19956549
any time anything with sodium touches your tongue it will taste salty.

[Anonymous No.19956591]

>>19956552
you're still missing the point which is very simple: if you need to add salt to make an "umami" flavor then "umami" isnt a base flavor, its a composited flavor

[Anonymous No.19956624]

>>19956591
no, i do get what you're saying, I just don't have any reason to agree with it. Just because salt delivers the flavor and (presumably) always coincides with it, that does not mean it isn't its own flavor

just like a drug which uses sodium as part of its delivery mechanism is its own thing

[Anonymous No.19956669]

>>19956624
its because salty is already one of the only base flavors just like red green blue (rgb) are the only primary colors.
just like the secondary colors are just combinations of primary colors "umami" cant be a base flavor if its made of a base flavor.
>just like a drug which uses sodium as part of its delivery mechanism is its own thing
these drugs don't interact with the tongue

[Anonymous No.19956688]

>>19956669
>if its made of a base flavor.
this is what i am contending with
i dunno that that's true just because it comes packaged with salt. it's not necessarily a flavor made *of* salt, but experienced *with* salt

>>19956669
>these drugs don't interact with the tongue
yes I am just illustrating that the delivery mechanism isn't the thing itself

[Anonymous No.19956769]

>>19956688
personally, monosodium glutamate, disodium inosinate, and disodium guanylate all just come off as any ordinary seasoned salts since they all have sodium in them. theres really no difference in what they do and what gimmicky salts like lemon pepper salt or garlic salt do.
its just a flavoring + sodium.
>it's not necessarily a flavor made *of* salt, but experienced *with* salt
its literally made of salt dude. its going to stop tasting like "umami" the second you take the salt out of it, which would probably make it taste really really bland or just really really bad.

[Anonymous No.19956788]

>>19956769
>theres really no difference in what they do and what gimmicky salts like lemon pepper salt or garlic salt do.
nah man
either your taste buds are wack or you haven't experimented enough while cooking. it's really not the same

[Anonymous No.19956893]

>>19956788
maybe i just don't eat a lot of asian cooking? not everything needs to have a whole bunch of msg on it

[Anonymous No.19956919]

>>19956893
nah, but it is good in stocks and sauces. a homemade caesar with fish sauce is really good
I don't use MSG myself but I find that a food quality fish sauce improves just about any savory food

i think if most people tried making stock or gravy without using any kind of bouillon that has one of those flavor enhancers, they would find themselves disappointed. but if you add fish sauce it totally works. and imo in a much healthier way
it's not just an asian thing, either. europe had a long history of using garum

[Anonymous No.19956922]

>>19956919
good quality fish sauce*

[Anonymous No.19957006]

>>19956253
Source.

>>19956239
You're just ignoring me now. Very stupid opinion you have.

[Anonymous No.19957826]

>>19957006
ignore what? i don't give a fuck about your fish sauce

[Anonymous No.19957841]

>>19956919
>fish sauce!
thats really great about your fish sauce but
>its going to stop tasting like "umami" the second you take the salt out of it, which would probably make it taste really really bland or just really really bad.

[Anonymous No.19958245]

why so many people dont care or dont know any things about beeing a host?
>dont ask if youre hungry if you arrive
>if you ask for a glass of water (no they dont ask if you want one) they grab a glass, and pour the water instantly in without letting it flow for 10 seconds
>they dont have icecubes or lemons
>if you say youre hungry they only have some 6 month old freezed pizza crap in the fridge which has this certain fridge smell if you get them out
>if they have more than water its mostly room temperatured cola
>if they make noodles they never have grated cheese
>only have salt and pepper but if they have other spices they are mostly old as fuck and never used
>dont lower the volume of tvs and lower the light levels as the evening comes and the mood gets more chill

its not only that, i have so many horror storys to tell even if someone served food. it was bad most of the time. when i have guests i provide everything and make them a cola with icecubes and a lemon slice for example, why no one else does this?