/ck/ - Food & Cooking

[Anonymous No.19524857]

Is this really all I need?
It seems like it's quite thin and not full tang so can it be used as a Western chef knife? Looking at the Wusthof or Zwilling forged knives makes me wonder if it's inadequate

[Anonymous No.19524863]

>>19524857
Millions of people for millions of years have cut meat and vegetables without paying more than $20 for a meme knife

[Anonymous No.19524864]

Should I ask my family for a Wusthof Ikon or would that be wasted on me and a fibrox is good enough? I want to get a job as a cook

[Anonymous No.19524866]

>>19524863
Maybe in the past knives were a higher % of income than they are today
$20 might have been a lot of money

[Anonymous No.19524870]

>>19524857
I've had it for 3 years or so. Just using a honing rod has kept it very sharp (for my standards at least). For the price you really can't go wrong.

[Anonymous No.19524872]

>>19524857
Dude it's a fucking knife of course you can do knife shit with it.

[Anonymous No.19524874]

>>19524863
Most people seem to use dull as fuck knives, even if they were expensive. Some people just buy a new knife when an old one gets dull because they can't fathom sharpening it. I wouldn't use "good enough for normies" as a way of deciding anything.

[Anonymous No.19524882]

you can get that, or if you arent retarded and know how to take basic care of your tools, a Misono Sweden gyuto is a much better knife for a bit more

[Anonymous No.19524884]

>>19524857
I own a wusthof classic 6" and a Victorinox Fibrox 10"
the fibrox stays sharper longer and gets used more

[Anonymous No.19524888]

>>19524884
You've given me two things I wanted
1. told me to get the cheaper knife
2. mentioned the 10" fibrox
Is it worth getting the 10" instead of the 8"?
>>19524882
I am going to learn how to sharpen
>>19524870
How often do you need to use a honing rod as a professional cook? If I learn to sharpen on whetstones is it necessary?

[Anonymous No.19524892]

>>19524888
>How often do you need to use a honing rod as a professional cook?
No clue since I'm not one. I just do it every time I cook a meal. Btw not the guy you asked but I'd get the 8 incher every time, 10 inches is too unwieldy for most people (since most people suck at knife work, me included)

[Anonymous No.19524900]

>>19524888
>How often do you need to use a honing rod as a professional cook
depends on a lot of things, if i'm cutting delicate herbs or anything that requires particularly clean/precise cuts i'll give my knife a very light pass or two on each side with my ceramic rod when i feel like things might be starting to drag a little more than i'd like.
the honing rod is used to maintain the edge that you create with whetstones, and if used properly will greatly increase the time between sharpenings

[Anonymous No.19524928]

>>19524863
Millons of people cut with a dull knife and never questions it.

[Anonymous No.19524936]

Is the thing about onions and sharp knives true?

[Anonymous No.19524940]

>>19524863
Knives were expensive, relative to how much people earned anyway. The idea of almost everything being so disposable is relatively new.
I was in need of an umbrella recently and stumbled into an umbrella shop that some old umbrella autist lady was running. I mentioned that I wanted a cheap one because I'm more likely to lose it than it breaking, and her argument was that back in her day most umbrellas cost at least the equivalent of like 40 bucks and you sure as fuck never lost one twice.

[Anonymous No.19524946]

>>19524936
Yes, a blunt knife will rupture more of the onion cells releasing more of the irritant.

[Anonymous No.19524947]

>>19524857
Full tang sum ting wong

[Anonymous No.19525001]

>>19524857
It sucks, like objectively speaking this knife is shit. Spend $100, get a Zwilling instead, unless you only cook twice a week.

[Anonymous No.19525014]

>>19524888
>Is it worth getting the 10" instead of the 8"?
Yes, get the 10 inch. While it may seem a little awkward at first, you'll get used to it quickly.

>How often do you need to use a honing rod as a professional cook?
Depends. I usually give my knives a few passes when I get home after I wash them. If I feel them starting to lose a bit of edge, I'll hit it with the steel real quick. But normally, just the few passes at the end of the night is sufficient enough to keep them sharp.

[Anonymous No.19525100]

>>19524888
DO NOT get that knife. Terrible.

[Anonymous No.19525122]

>>19524888
I had the 8" and gave it to a girlfriend so I would have an excuse to buy the 10", I prefer the 10" though it's a hassle to store.

[Anonymous No.19525149]

>>19525100
this is fine. there are no foods you'd cut with a kitchen knife that require significant force, at least if you know how to slice

[Anonymous No.19525184]

>>19525149
Talk about needing to baby a knife! OY VEY!

[Anonymous No.19525239]

>>19524857
>full tang
Anon, you are slicing carrots with it not prepping wood for a campfire.
Kitchen knives get up to medium quality compared to outdoor knives, but can cost ridiculous amounts of money.
Just get one that feels good in your hand, that's it all.

[Anonymous No.19525248]

>>19525239
>Just get one that feels good in your hand
If you're using a proper grip, this will never be a fibrox knife.

[Anonymous No.19525259]

>>19525184
not at all. the hardest foods i'm aware of cut like butter with the knife in my hand, a few years since last sharpening. can you name a particularly hard/tough food that requires any force?

[Anonymous No.19525323]

>>19525259
>a few years since last sharpening.
You're babying you knife or don't cook.

Yes I can name plenty of hard/ tough foods.

[Anonymous No.19525327]

>>19524857
Broadly speaking there's two types of knife users: Those that use their knives daily, and those who use their knives for a day
If you're using a knife to make dinner whenever you can't be arsed to pay for UberEats, then almost any knife will do. You'll probably end up banging it on something and ruining the blade before it even starts to get dull. Whatever benefits real or imaginary a higher-end knife might have you'd never get to enjoy.
However if you're using a knife as a professional then it is largely irrelevant how well the blade keeps its sharpness or even mostly how sharp it is. You'll need to sharpen it multiple times a day regardless until there is no more knife to sharpen. To these people a knife is disposable.
There is technically a third category. Those that don't actually use their knives. These are the people who buy the four hundred dollar damascus knives with chinese letters on the side that say "Help! I'm trapped in a knifemaking factory!"

[Anonymous No.19525372]

>>19525327
Wrong! High end knives don't just have better edge retention, and there's plenty to appreciate about actually great knives before they get dull.

[Anonymous No.19525413]

>>19525327
Oh look, it's retarded.

[Anonymous No.19525457]

>>19525327
>However if you're using a knife as a professional then it is largely irrelevant how well the blade keeps its sharpness or even mostly how sharp it is. You'll need to sharpen it multiple times a day regardless until there is no more knife to sharpen. To these people a knife is disposable.
This might be the most retarded statement I've read here.

[Anonymous No.19525462]

>>19525327
>You'll need to sharpen it multiple times a day regardless until there is no more knife to sharpen
This motherfucker thinks knives are pencils

[Anonymous No.19525471]

>>19525323
not really. i just hone it before each use

name one hard/tough ingredient

[Anonymous No.19525479]

>>19525471
Rocks

[Anonymous No.19525827]

>>19524940
Well don't leave us hanging. Did you buy it or didn't you?

[Anonymous No.19525870]

>>19524857
Skilled craftsmen and artists use good tools. If you are neither that knife is fine.
>>19524863
>>19524872
Ask me how I know you're fat and live on microwaved food.
>>19524866
The irony is around 1900 a kitchen knife cost $20 dollars--which was about a days wage back then. The further you go back, the rarer and more expensive they get.

[Anonymous No.19525881]

>>19525827
I bought a 30€ doppler in the end, I was already considering getting a nice umbrella once before mainly because I wanted a bigger one, the with portable ones I usually get my legs wet because my strides are too long. I hope I really will treat it with more vigilance.

[Anonymous No.19525905]

>still getting worked into a shoot by the 'Nox 'Brox

[Anonymous No.19525980]

>>19525870
>Well off craftsmen and artists use good tools.
ftfy

[Anonymous No.19526408]

>>19524857
Yes, just sharpen it. Nothing matters but the shape of the blade and it's edge when you're just talking about the ability to efficiently execute a meal you have the skills to make.

[Anonymous No.19526455]

>>19525980
You didn't fix anything. You just outed yourself as a moron who doesn't know shit about art or cooking and you have the reading skills of a child.

I expect you'll respond with something trite because you're clearly very stupid.

[Anonymous No.19526458]

>>19526408
>I don't know anything about metal or knives so I'm going to tell you what I understand from Wikepida: the post
Material matters.

[Anonymous No.19526486]

>>19526458
All the other properties of knives besides their geometry relate to how durable they are, how quickly they wear down, how easily they'll corrode, how easily they'll chip, etc. If you start cooking with a sharp knife, and cut with good technique, all but the very shittiest chinesium knives will be able to easily execute what you need to do.

That isn't to say nicer knives don't have value, I'm commissioning a custom knife set with magnacut blades and beautiful wood burl handles and have a variety of other nice knives, but my main workhorse for years has been a basic victorinox fibrox. I've scribed registration marks into the sides of the blade so I can perfectly line it up with my sharpening jig every time, making touching up the blade to an aggressive 24 degree included angle (aka 12 degree sharpening angle) trivial. I never would have intentionally put scratches into a more expensive knife, but it's so damn convenient (saving metal and sharpening time) that I'm integrating similar registration marks into the knives I'm commissioning.

[Anonymous No.19526634]

I bought this knife 3 years ago and it's been alright.
I sharpen and hone it from time to time with the Victorinox sharpener and rod.
The edge has some chips, though, but I don't notice them when cutting.
Which knives require even less maintenance? Global?
Also looking for sharpener/honing rod upgrade suggestions.

[Anonymous No.19526644]

>>19524888
You use a honing rod (get a ceramic one) every time you use the knife. You store the knife in a knife block or magnetic knife holder. You Sharpen the knife once every few months or get it sent off to get sharpened. You do not sharpen bread knives.

Good luck anon

[Anonymous No.19526647]

>>19526644
I'm a bit confused about ceramic rods
It seems the guys into Japanese knives only use ceramic rods but they say that with Western knives it's ok to use metal rods

[Anonymous No.19526652]

>>19526647

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl2L5aKdVVM just watch her vids bra she explains it pretty well. It depends on what knife you use to some extent but you don't need to be a knife autist. If you don't care too much about your knives I wouldn't bother learning how to use a whetstone either

[Anonymous No.19526746]

>>19526486
12 degrees on a vic = folded edge from cutting lettuce. Post your knife. I want to see.

[Anonymous No.19526829]

>>19526746
I would, but I'm literally half a world away right now. I put all my belongings in storage and am traveling, and have had to make do with even shittier cooking equipment (a cheap pull sharpener I bought after deciding I couldn't take " can't even cut my own skin" dull hostel knives anymore being my most expensive concession). And yet I can still put together a meal.

(The risotto contains minced shallot and garlic)

I agree the victorinox isn't going to hold an aggressive edge as well as a harder steel, but it's also not as bad as you're suggesting. I would sharpen it once or twice a week, or sometimes before especially large jobs like french onion soup, and it was wonderful. When I get back and finish the magnacut commission project I'm sure I'll love it way more than my fibrox. But if you're poor, you don't need a nice knife to be self to cook, you just need a sharp one.

[Anonymous No.19526839]

>>19526829
Fair enough. Sharpening a knife once or twice a week is a crazy proposition for most people, and unacceptable performance in my books. You have your jig, so it is convenient for you tho.

[Anonymous No.19526842]

>>19526746
I did find a pic of the knife with the registration marks scratched into it and the wood burl I plan to use for the commission on the background, just so you know I'm not completely full of shit.

>>19526839
It's the jig + registration marks that really make it possible. I can place the knife bang on in the exact same spot, so bringing it back to perfectly sharp takes basically no time.

[Anonymous No.19526873]

You also need a bread knife. For bread.

[Anonymous No.19526910]

>>19526842
Nice wood. I did a commission for a dude in cpm cruwear with burl handles a while back. Fancy ass stuff. I think I like curly figure better, but it's close.

[Anonymous No.19526917]

This guys curly rosewood may be my favorite aside from ebony. An HD video is needed to give it justice.

[Anonymous No.19526932]

>>19526910
God damn, beautiful work anon. Really funky profiles though, are 1 & 3 meant for butchery or something?

Also, do you have a contact or website? When I get back from my trip in a month or two (and once I have a new place and all my stuff unpacked) I'll want to actually finish this knife project. I've had the materials for about a year now, and if you're open for commissions I'd definitely consider you. The main thing I'm worried about is getting a proper heat treatment for the MagnaCut. From what I understand it's kind of particular to get the best performance out of it (Google cpm magnacut datasheet).

[Anonymous No.19526965]

>>19526647
Ceramic honing rods are harder and typically more abrasive. Japanese knives are typicality harder than western knives and often harder than most honing steels. With a softer western knife a hone helps straighten out the bent edge, a harder Japanese style knife does not need this (it will chip before it bends). A hone for fixing bends on the edge does not need to be be abrasive and in fact if too course can tear the edge tip incited of fixing it. Some hones (such as ceramic, diamond plated, synthetic ruby) are capable of polishing (or even sharpening) the knife and can in theory be used with all knives. A proper set of stones is still generally better for full sharpening. If you only have one hone a fine grit ceramic is probably the most versatile however if you only intend to hone (and not polish/sharpen) a good fine grit steel or glass rod may be better.

[Anonymous No.19527082]

>>19526932
Ty, they're lamb butchering knives.

I have a precision electric kiln, but for the crazier steels I prefer to just send the knives to peters heat treat. They have vacuum kilns, cryo, hrc testing and they straighten the blades for you.

Yeah, I could do them. I actually did this vic clone using 26c3 for someone off here. [e-mail]

What sort of set are you looking to have done?

[Anonymous No.19527107]

>>19524857
>asking about knives on /ck/
Victorinox is too good for you. Get a Walmart knife set.

[Anonymous No.19527145]

>>19525100
>>19525184
What are you cutting in a kitchen that would be hard enough to bust a tang like that?
With how thin the blade on a Victorinox is, you'd sooner disfigure it irreparably than break the tang.

[Anonymous No.19527150]

>>19524888
You are more likely to want a 6/7" knife before you want a 10" knife.
10" is too large for even most commercial kitchens and outside of slicing roast beef, isn't really that useful.
A smaller knife is better if you're doing anything that requires delicate cuts.

[Anonymous No.19527170]

tojiro dp3 21cm or victorinox fibrox 8"

[Anonymous No.19527179]

>>19527170
$98 for the first, $65 for the second

[Anonymous No.19527294]

>>19527170
Different knives with different good aspects.
That seems overpriced for the Fibrox. If that is the only price you can find it for, upgrading to the Tojiro is your best bet. VG-10 is a great knife making steel.

[Anonymous No.19527318]

>>19524900
>create with whetstones
I refuse to believe actual professionals use whetstones for their knives

[Anonymous No.19527381]

>>19527179
Why would you spend $65 for a fibrox? I would think they're even cheaper in yurobux, but maybe your tax is just that bad. Alternatives are basically any industrial knife.

[Anonymous No.19527383]

>>19527294
In USD it is $66 and $44, I mostly added prices for a price ratio
I mostly just want a high bang for my buck knife

[Anonymous No.19527388]

>>19527383
Can get a wusthof ikon for $170 USD btw
Good value?

[Anonymous No.19527390]

>>19527318
They're used a lot in nipland.

[Anonymous No.19527392]

What do western professionals use?

[Anonymous No.19527395]

>>19527392
*for sharpening

[Anonymous No.19527396]

>>19527388
Not really.
The only real reason to get a Wusthof is that they're tough, good for breaking lobster shells and the like. But there are cheaper knifes that are just as good for that role.
I wouldn't bother with them.
>>19527383
Victorinox are meant to be the bang-for-your-buck knife, but in your context it is comparatively overpriced.
The Tojiro is the better knife for most applications.

[Anonymous No.19527405]

>>19527392
Is it a good knife?
Then a whetstone.
Is it a beater?
Then you give a buddy $20 to sharpen it up on his electric sharpener.

[Anonymous No.19527412]

>>19527383
That makes more sense. I would personally go for the tojiro, but it depends on your preference and practice. Tojiro are not as corrosion resistant, but will have a sturdier (and I find more comfortable) feel, if that makes sense. The fibrox will be a little easier to sharpen, and will wear a little more evenly (making many people think they stay sharp longer, but they really don't). Both are great knives for learning to sharpen, though. Tojiro has a harder tempered vg-10 core, which will maintain a keen edge better, but will be a little harder to sharpen, and a slightly more grainy feel to it when sharpening. The grain really won't make much difference if you're learning. If you sharpen them side by side for a while, or if you use both for a long while through however many sharpenings it takes depending on how certain you are about feedback, you will start to feel the difference.

[Anonymous No.19528148]

>>19527396
>>19527412
Thanks for telling me what I wanted to hear and giving me some good info especially
>Both are great knives for learning to sharpen, though
This
I am going to learn to sharpen on the knife so I needed to know that
>good for breaking lobster shells and the like
Is this a consideration for a professional kitchen? What I mean is, is the guy responsible for cutting with an all purpose knife also going to be breaking down lobster shells? Why not have a purpose built knife/cleaver for that?

[Anonymous No.19528228]

I just hone on the back of a mug when i need the sharpness. if I had a ceramic rod is use it but I dont. sharpen maybe once a year on stones

[Anonymous No.19528233]

>>19524857
You can get a cheaper chefs knife from Chinese-made calphalon that will perform better

[Anonymous No.19528298]

>>19528148
Back in the day people did it all with one knife.
These days especially with the rise in Chinese cleavers, people will use a different knife.
Dengjia makes a good all-purpose light cleaver. But learning how to navigate the market of Chinese cleavers is a whole thing of its own.

[Anonymous No.19528432]

>>19526829

wtf why do you sharpen that often? I've never heard of someone sharpening more than like 4 times a year

[Anonymous No.19528436]

>>19528432
Low angles on soft steel become dull quickly

[Anonymous No.19529389]

>>19527392
Trend Diamond blocks
Sharpening wheels on variable speed grinders with partial immersion troughs
>>19527405
I've only ever seen one "professional" sharpener use this and he was the service rep at the sporting goods section of a general store--I think he charged like 5 bucks a knife or something but I never would never let any of my knives near this piece of shit.

[Anonymous No.19529601]

>>19528436
You don't sharpen soft steel to a low angle. That's stupid.

[Anonymous No.19529647]

>>19529601
Once I tried sharpening to a low angle, I couldn't go back.

[Anonymous No.19529826]

>>19524857
You're about to get swamped with weebs and teutophiles telling you that you need to spend at least $300 to have a proper chef knife when the reality is you just can't beat Victorinox for the price. Anything else garners diminishing returns very quickly when you look at benefit per dollar.

[Anonymous No.19529832]

>>19525100
This weeb faggot is STILL posting the same image a week later and seething over being BTFO by Victorinox lmao. Get a life dude, don't you have a job? We already know you samefag these threads from last time when you admitted it.

[Anonymous No.19529848]

>>19529647
Get a better knife. There are a bunch of non-Chinese AUS10 blades on the market for fantastic prices and the explosion in popularity of Japanese VG10 has finally resulted in a glut of product on the market so even the high end brand prices have come down.

[Anonymous No.19529858]

>>19529848
>>19529647
This is probably the best knife for a home cook on the market right now.

https://www.knifemerchant.com/product.asp?productID=2699&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIqbC48fyngAMVpQ-tBh0nMA0gEAQYDyABEgIv3PD_BwE

[Anonymous No.19529864]

>>19529826
The $20 Ikea knife I bought 8 years ago outperformed the vic-shit knife I gave to my sister in nearly every regard.

[Anonymous No.19529871]

>>19529864
Samefagging again I see lmao. you have a very obvious tell and it's amusing to see you in every Victorinox thread.

[Anonymous No.19529874]

>>19524857
expensive knives are a meme, just buy a whetstone and put a low angle edge in the knife.

[Anonymous No.19529878]

>>19529871
I'm not the only one that thinks that knife is shit, but yeah, there's a reason why I kept this as my beater knife and gave away my vic-shit knife.

[Anonymous No.19529890]

>>19524857
It's nice to have a paring knife, too

[Anonymous No.19529896]

>>19528233
Misen makes the core in Japan and finishes it in china. If you want an affordable VG-10 blade and don't care about the China stigma than Misen isn't a bad option.

Calphalon uses mystery meat metals completely produced in China: full stop hell no.

Truthfully I'm not sure why people see "cheap" as a virtue more valued than "durability" and "low maintenance"

For $50 more you can have a blade that's 200% better.

[Anonymous No.19529899]

>>19529878
It does have 200 one star reviews on Amazon, so you're not wrong when you say you're not the only person who doesn't like it, but I think you should also take into account the 8,000 five star reviews.

[Anonymous No.19529907]

>>19529874
>I'm poor so have never owned a decent knife in my life but my opinion is valid
lol, sure dude, enjoy your microwaved ramin and soda.

[Anonymous No.19529910]

>>19525327
holy fucking retard with a electric 'sharpener'
if you didnt know, the popular electric bullshit will cut a new (shitty) edge on your knife every time you use it, and idiots like this will pull it through multiple times to get it 'sharper'. A good knife with heavy use needs sharpening bimonthly at worst. Lightly used knives that are cared for will hold an edge for a year.

[Anonymous No.19529926]

>>19527396
The only good Victorinox is their paring knife. It's the only knife I've ever had that gets razor sharp on a pull through sharpener and you have zero guilt for abusing the shit out of it because a 4 pack is like 10 bucks.

[Anonymous No.19529927]

>>19529899
Amazon reviews are a terrible metric for determining if something is actually worthwhile. The Victorinox chef's knife has a weird balance and handle that's not designed for pinch grip at all, so you'll learn bad habits using it. It feels cheap in its overall construction, and was just not something I enjoyed using or maintaining. If you don't cook often, or are super new to home cooking, sure it's fine, but for anyone else there's dozens of better options.

[Anonymous No.19529936]

>>19529910
Shit metal can be maintained primarily by honing on a steel honing rod. Harder steel can be maintained with a ceramic rod. I wouldn't hone anything above HRC 60... it's just silly.

[Anonymous No.19529942]

>>19529910
No one cares if it cuts a new edge and you lose an extra .5mm for it.
Knives are cheap.

[Anonymous No.19529996]

>>19529871
Hahahaha.WRONG again, schizo! It is pretty amusing to have you in these threads, so I will gladly welcome you back.

[Anonymous No.19530250]

>>19529910
>guy in the corner at a party they don't know about my wet stone meme.tar
9/10, if you give me two more sentences like that you'll have a new pasta.

[Anonymous No.19530266]

>>19529942
>Buy shit tools
>Treat them like shit
>Don't care about it just buy another one
Ah yes, the talentless, poor, 80IQ who lives on microwave pasta and monkey meat is giving advice on cooking again I see.

[Anonymous No.19530321]

>>19524857
>quite thin
Yeah that's how you cut things.
>not full tang
Jesus fucking Christ I cannot believe that this cancer has infected every facet of knives. You don't need a slab tang crowbar to cut broccoli.

[Anonymous No.19530384]

>>19530321
People generally go with different tang styles because it moves the center of balance around as well as some people like heavier knives--it's not because they want to use it as a crowbar. You have a very immature comprehension of knives if you don't understand this.

[Anonymous No.19530392]

>>19524863
this is the cooking board anon

[Anonymous No.19530417]

>>19530321
It’s not as heavy as a standard western chef knife and the balance is not at the handle either

[Anonymous No.19530432]

>>19530384
I'm so sure that someone complaining about a slicing tool being thin has a great understanding of blade geometry and balance.

>>19530417
Go ahead and bitch at the previous guy.

[Anonymous No.19530448]

When I slice things like cucumbers and carrots with muh vic, they all stick to the blade and push each other up until one falls off the top and rolls around either on the floor or in the way of my cuts. Can you keep this from happening? Right now I just have to stop a lot. Trying to get faster.

[Anonymous No.19530468]

>>19530432
You need thicker blades to work with meats and denser ingredients. You very obviously don't know anything about knives why are you so insistent on talking about what you obviously have very little knowledge or experience of.

You seem more like some pathetic looser who's angry at their parents and venting on randos on the internet than someone who actually knows anything about knives--which you clearly don't.

[Anonymous No.19530492]

>>19530468
You certainly do not need a thick blade to cut through any kind of meat.

[Anonymous No.19530515]

>>19529832
>defending a corporation for free on an online basket weaving forums
>get a life
Lol lmfao even

[Anonymous No.19530557]

>>19524888
>Is it worth getting the 10" instead of the 8"
Not really. I have both the 8" and the 10" knife and use the 8" almost exclusively. The 10" is pretty unwieldy, especially for a beginner to use. I cook pretty often (daily) and consider myself a decent, experienced home cook, if that helps explain my perspective.
BTW the Wusthofs are nice, but can't hold an edge for shit. Easy to get sharp, lose edge quickly, require almost constant honing on a steel (before every use and every few minutes when cutting meat).

[Anonymous No.19530566]

>>19525327
my nigga what the hell. I've been on both sides and I assume you must have too. yet you fucked it all up.

[Anonymous No.19530602]

>>19524857
Spend a lil more and get the Fibrox Swiss Army model and you'll be g2g.

[Anonymous No.19530628]

>>19530492
You need a thick blade to deal with the bones my dude. You'd know this if you've ever cut more than lunchmeat for a sandwich.

[Anonymous No.19530658]

>>19530628
Are you implying that most home cooks are doing anything more than breaking down birds? Might as well get a fucking saw while we're at it

[Anonymous No.19530716]

>>19530266
If you use a tool properly, it will become damaged as it goes.
Babying your tools is for poorfags that can only afford the one knife/drill/sander and think they're some kind of artisan.
Its a knife, get it sharp, get it back to work.

[Anonymous No.19530721]

>>19530628
What bones?
If you're breaking down poultry, you should be using a set of bone shears if you have to cut through any.
Learn to use the right tool for a job instead of buying shitty oversized knifes so you can use them as a hatchet on the side.

[Anonymous No.19530842]

>>19530628
I use my petty knife or boning knife when I deal with bones, and I cut around them not through them. I cut through bones maybe once for every 10 times I cut around them.

[Anonymous No.19530843]

The higher performance a knife gets the more finely tuned it is for its specific purpose. Stupid arguments about whoch all rounder knife is best is almost entirely pointless. Can you use a chefs knife to filet a fish? Yes, but a filet knife will do a better job because it sacrifices certain qualities to achieve that.

The truth about knives is that it is always a game of balance to achieve a tool that excells at the intended task. You have to give up one thing to gain another. This is even true for the type of steel.

>>19530716
Olympic level mental gymnastics. Outstanding.

[Anonymous No.19530856]

>>19530628
This nigga cuttin' bones

[Anonymous No.19530983]

>>19530468
>You need thicker blades to work with meats and denser ingredients.
Post the spine of your favorite kitchen knife.

[Anonymous No.19531062]

Is a belly useful for cutting?
Is the ability to do the rocking cut mostly just personal preference or is it superior in a restaurant context?
It looks very rhythmic and might make hours of cutting easier mentally

[Anonymous No.19531186]

>>19529942
YOUR knives are cheap because your monkey ass can't put an edge on it. It's like having a tiny penis and convincing yourself there isn't more vagina, just pathetic. You've likely never even held a sharp knife before.

[Anonymous No.19531200]

>>19525372
false

[Anonymous No.19531207]

>>19525327
>You'll need to sharpen it multiple times a day
False again
A quick tune up with the steel is not sharpening you dipshit

[Anonymous No.19531216]

>>19531062
It's extremely useful when you have to prep 400 meals worth of mirepoix

[Anonymous No.19531339]

>>19530468
>Go to store
>Come back
>You're getting pooped on by at least 4 other people
Consider this a learning experience.

[Anonymous No.19531425]

>>19531200
Prove it.

[Anonymous No.19531835]

>>19531425
>Explain material science to an idiot
pass
>>19530658
This statement makes pretty clear you don't know anything about cooking.
>>19530721
>Uses a super thin blade to debone
>Only cares about chicken
I think you have reading issues and very limited cooking experience.
>>19530842
Yes, I can easily debone a chicken with my petty--I think you missed the point entirely as well.
>>19530856
>ESL

[Anonymous No.19531844]

>>19525471
>I hone before I use it
Just what I wanted, metal chunks in my food

[Anonymous No.19531866]

>>19531835
Woah. Tremendous stupidity from an arrogant little pretend know it all. Did you know there are blade geometries that can only be handmade? Ones that objectively improve the knife's performance? That's before we get into any sort of real blade ergonomics or the comfort from an excellent fit and finish.

[Anonymous No.19531868]

>>19531835
>ESL
It's a meme retard, and I'm ethnically english, I'm as far from ESL as you can fathomably get.

[Anonymous No.19531873]

>>19531844
i rinse it after honing

[Anonymous No.19531891]

How do I develop knife skills?
What are the cheapest vegetables to learn slicing and dicing?
What should I do with them afterwards?
Onions seem great for slicing since I can caramelise them but not sure what I can do with diced onions
How many chicken carcasses do I need to get to learn deboning? 30?

[Anonymous No.19531895]

>>19531835
Where else are you deboning?
If you ever worked in a butcher shop you'd know that they largely use some of the thinnest knives around to debone and breakdown carcasses faster and better than anyone else. You should never be cutting into bone with a knife, nor breaking them apart.
The only context where you should be cutting something other than fish bones without a bone saw is when you are breaking apart poultry quickly for roasting.

The Chinese are the only ones I can think of that violate this, with their love of 'across the bone' butchery.
But they use actual meat cleavers even still, not just a tougher chef's knife. And even then, higher end Chinese cooking is trending towards proper deboning, regardless.

[Anonymous No.19531930]

>>19525327
They hated anon because he told them the truth.
I've used modern supersteels before. Magnacut, 4in fixed blade, re-angled to be slicier, ground to 8000 grit sharpness, 60+ Rockwell, and it trimmed two full brisket before coming to almost dull.
I can't use anything more brittle or thinner because the blade is liable to get bent by the weight of the brisket. Tool steels are unacceptable due to rust.
Could I still trim brisket with it? Yes. But every time I extend my use of it means more work to get it back to razor sharp.
You can bet your ass that if you're doing work (an actual job) with the blade you'd be resharpening this thing every four hours on a diamond stone.

[Anonymous No.19531933]

>>19531930
Don't you want something a bit toothier than 8000 grit for beef?

[Anonymous No.19531950]

>>19524857
if you're just a home cook desu you probably don't do enough chopping for the specific knife to have a significant different in your food prep experience (outside of special occasions like holidays where you're cooking for 20+ people). what's more important is simply whether you maintain it properly so it's always sharp enough when you need it. so for that use case, the victorinox is fine. the differences in ergonomics, edge retention, durability, etc. really only become noticeable when you're chopping for hours every day.

that said I personally don't think it's bad to spend more if you want something "nicer", even if it might just be nicer in an aesthetic sense, as long as you can afford it without going broke.

[Anonymous No.19531964]

>>19531933
I mean I can achieve the same effect just by not stropping it and leaving the burr on. In either case I 'm cutting more fat than meat (ideally), and there's multiple kinds of fat on a brisket (layered vs solid), and I feel like the slicy grind works great for the solid - which is most of the fat I want to cut out
If a toothy grind or straight up serration (pressed X to doubt) works better then great, I'm not doing it. That and I want to use the knife for other things too (peeling oranges after a wash, etc)

[Anonymous No.19532047]

>>19531866
The comment and associated replies are about blade thickness. Another fail by you.
>>19531868
I would hardly be proud of having an 8th grade reading level.
>>19531895
>Butcher shops use thin knives compared to other types culinary knives
You're embarrassing yourself allot right now... like allot.

>>19531930
>Can't use thinner to trim briskets and keep sharp

This anon gets it.

[Anonymous No.19532068]

>>19530716
You don't know how to properly use tools or cook--that much is quite obvious.
>>19530843
>There are material trade offs
I used to think this was true too but as material science improves I've come to realize some of the things people prefer in a knife have nothing to do with anything other than that's what they're used to not because it's Objectively better or worse.

[Anonymous No.19532116]

>>19532047
Go check out any butcher shop near you.
If they aren't ordering generic food service knives from the local restaurant depot, they're stocking Dexter-Russell or Victorinox knives by name.
Which all tend to be very thin knives, sometimes especially so.
The D-R boning knife might be the most popular in the US, and you can see here that it is stamped from a sheet about 1-1.5mm thick at best.

[Anonymous No.19532255]

>>19531933
What? No. That's a retarded notion.

[Anonymous No.19532404]

>>19532255
Based on what I read online I was led to believe that polishing up to 8000 was just a masturbatory thing for 99% of cooks

[Anonymous No.19532413]

>>19532404
Well, sure. But that doesn't mean
>toothy
is better for any reason. It just means there's a diminishing returns sort of aspect to things. You get smoother cuts with sharper blades. To what extent you see that as beneficial... up to you.

[Anonymous No.19532435]

>>19532413
Oh right
I've read that a 1000 grit knife will cut better than an 8000 grit knife for certain tasks

[Anonymous No.19532453]

>>19532435
I don't agree. There's an argument to be made for effort involved between required sharpening for effective results, but I don't think anyone would ague that a smoother cut is worse than a rough one if being honest. There's stuff about tearing cell walls and whatnot in fine minces vs pulverizing and stuff like that, but that's a far cry from slicing. I think a lot of that is BS, too, but even including all that, slicing is something different. Slicing is pretty straight forward. Sharp is good IMO.

[Anonymous No.19532532]

>>19532047
Wrong. Laughably wrong. Got another all star argument for me?
I know reading is difficult for you, but please try your best. (>>19525372)

[Anonymous No.19532537]

>>19532068
Very very low reading comprehension.

[Anonymous No.19533087]

>>19531835
>>19532047
You still have yet to explain the need for thicker knives for meat

[Anonymous No.19533093]

>>19533087
The retard thinks you're going to be cutting through bones when you butcher meat.

[Anonymous No.19533175]

The trick to finding good quality Chinese knives (and all other basic kitchen equipment like cutting boards, prepping containers, woks, etc.) is to try and think "where do Chinese restauranters buy their knives?"
The Chinese and Japanese are well aware of the Japanese tax in the West by now, and they've been capitalizing on it for a while too.
Don't fall for anything that has any "Oriental fetishization for Westerners" around it.
If possible, try and find your local Chinese restaurant supply wholesaler (it's obviously much easier if you live by an international port like Rotterdam, Los Angeles, etc.). They usually either have simple brick-and-mortar stores in industrial areas, websites that only tell you to call to order, or distribute to mom-and-pop shops that are either also located in industrial zones of your closest major city with Chinese people, or in your nearest substantial Chinatown.

[Anonymous No.19533499]

>>19533093
>Has the reading comprehension of a child
>Calls other people retarded
many such cases

[Anonymous No.19533507]

>>19532537
>I know you are but what am I
wow, you sure got me
>>19532116
I am a butcher. That's why I know you're retarded.

[Anonymous No.19533517]

>>19532532
>Incoherent rambling
yes, we've established you don't have a coherent point, not sure why you're insistent on pressing on with your seething babble.

[Anonymous No.19533586]

>>19533517
>>19533507
>Deny
>Deny
>Deny

Lmao. Incredibly stupid. You weren't even able to coherently respond to my point. Not in the slightest.
Im sure everyone can see how much bullshit you are spewing by this point. Keep it up. It's really amusing.

How about you spout off some of that materials science knowledge you claim to have as a butcher.

[Anonymous No.19533764]

>>19533586
You don't have a pont

[Anonymous No.19533773]

>>19532116
That knife is for fileting small fish (60 lbs or less) the tuna and cod tools are much beefier and absolutely thicker in the spine...as are the tools for beef and pork.

[Anonymous No.19533777]

>>19533087
>Explain butcher knife selection to a moron.
I don't really see the point.

[Anonymous No.19533802]

>>19533764
My point is you are stupid. Might be too difficult for you to understand, but everyone else sees it clear as day.

[Anonymous No.19533808]

>>19531835
retard

[Anonymous No.19533813]

>>19533773
Calling 'bull' on that.
I know butchers that do everything short of cutting steaks with basic ass Victorinox semi-stiff boning knives.
As a normalfag that only butchers venison and poultry, myself I can't think of anything I'd want a heavier knife for when it comes to breaking down an animal.
Cutting steaks calls for a long knife with reasonable stiffness, not a thick knife.

Maybe with tuna you'd want a heavy knife, but that is outside of my personal experience.

[Anonymous No.19533838]

>>19533777
Mafucka, ain't no one butchering meat at home

[Anonymous No.19533847]

>>19533802
>My point has nothing to do with the thread topic
oh, ok
>>19533813
>I know butchers
You know the lady in meat section at a grocery store.
Picrel is a kay-bar from my grand daddies butcher collection before Kay-bar got into selling knives to DoD. Show that to your butcher "friend"

[Anonymous No.19533854]

>>19533838
move them goalposts

[Anonymous No.19533865]

>>19533854
Just checking in and this nigga is STILL in here samefagging it up and getting BTFO over Victorinox lmao.

[Anonymous No.19533871]

>>19533838
I for sure break down primals at home

[Anonymous No.19533950]

>>19533847
No modern butcher is using your grand-daddy's knives.
Shit, most would probably laugh you out of the shop for coming in with a wooden handled knife with no antislip guard, even.
Hell, you could probably get basically the same knife from Ontario Knife Company today. And no one would take you seriously if you did.

Thin boning knives are the standard in any commercial butcher shop for everything short of cutting steaks.
And these days, meat saws are more common than using any slicer, even.

[Anonymous No.19533953]

>>19533871
>>19533854
If OP is asking the type of question they are, do you really think they're going to be butchering meat any time soon or at all?

I bet you also tell people to roast their own coffee beans when they ask which Keurig machine to buy

[Anonymous No.19533985]

>>19533865
>I don't know what samefagging is
>>19533950
lol,
show it to them and get back to me.

[Anonymous No.19533987]

>>19533953
>Straw man
your mental disorder is showing

[Anonymous No.19534076]

>>19533871
It is common for boomers and kids raised right to keep a deep freeze of primal cuts. I'm not using a fish filet knife to separate ribs or ribeyes steaks like the moron in this thread is suggesting.

[Anonymous No.19534118]

>>19533987
Critical thinking is the term you're looking for

[Anonymous No.19534313]

>>19534118
>Another Straw man
you really should go back on your meds. You don't even know what your argument is and now you're just making it easy for me to continue allowing you to humiliate yourself.
Continue.

[Anonymous No.19534940]

>>19524857
I use a kiwi chinese style cleaver that cost less than the shipping and it works just fine and even works as a bench scraper and spatula. It does dull very quickly though.

[Anonymous No.19534965]

Will I get laughed out of a kitchen if I have Japanese knives?
Do I need to get mercer/vnox knives in order to be taken seriously? Will my fellow cooks beat me up if I have a gyuto?

[Anonymous No.19535344]

>>19534940
I want a nakiri-cleaver highbread

[Anonymous No.19536213]

Best knives for chicken slaughter/processing?

[Anonymous No.19537786]

>>19536213
In bulk, idk. At home, a standard chef's knife and paring knife with a practiced hand will make short work of a chicken. No special knives needed.

https://youtu.be/nfY0lrdXar8

[Anonymous No.19537810]

>>19524857
I've loved all the victorinox I've owned, their handles are usually a design that fit my hand really well. Just go to a store that sells all kinds of knives and actually hold it in your hand first.. find one you like and avoid Chinesium and you're pretty set