/ck/ - Food & Cooking

>>9583086
All americans think they're upper class/rich at heart, and are deeply offended when they find cultural barriers that shatter that illusion
>american bumpkin gets into fine dining restaurant
this doesn't appeal to me so it is wrong, it should appeal to me!
>European bumpkin gets into high class restaurant
Interesting experience. I'm clearly not the target audience but I can see the appeal.

o b s e s s e d

>>9583153
o b e s e d

name a place youve been to that you consider "fine dining".

>>9583223
noma.

My dad is a mason that helped them get the first noma running back in the day, so we got one of the earlier reservation and a extra thank you. It sounds freaky to eat fermented stuff and ants but it was actually pretty damn good.
People complain about portion sizes but at places like that you go in and get maybe 12 plates of small portions combined with a new glass of wine for every meal. That fills you up pretty fucking fast.

>>9583234
>he fell for the noma meme
go eat at an actual fine dining restaurant instead of an edible art showcase

>>9583234
>noma
Anyone have the live shrimp and ants plate?

American dining is eating something full of flavor and being full. Taste buds are so shot from pop and manufactured flavors that we can't taste anything from things that weren't processed.

However
>>9583234
>ants
Bugs are not fine dining, I don't care how pompous the presentation or how high the cost is.

>american fine dining

>>9583247
>>9583242
Meh, I've been to Geranium for their "wine menu" as well. That's supposedly fine dining but i'd eat stuff from noma any day of the week over that. I know it sounds weird with bugs and fermented carrots and stuff. But it tastes amazing.

>>9583245
Live shrimp is actually pretty good. You tear off the head and then dip it in a sauce thing and then eat it.
I've previously bought live shrimp to do it at home.
I don't think anywhere uses living ants though. At noma it was ground up into a sauce thing and they tasted kind of lemony, slightly sour.

Americans are too smart to fall for the meme of getting ripped off.

>I eat a restaurants for the experience

>>9583259
wa la

>>9583281
>Americans
>smart
kek

>>9583314
Understand though that a large chunk of Americans never finished high school. However, that number is comparable to the number of Russians who never finished. Just as an example.

>>9583314
Fucking Hell........

>>9583336
>never finished highschool
>large chunk of americans

just say niggers.

>>9583086
I like having a mouthful of food in me mouth, thank you.

>>9583314
i keep seeing this meme. whats the source?

>>9583354
fucking hell...people blindly believe whatever bullshit is posted on a ching chong image board if its in a picture. do you really think they would sell a 1/3 pound and a quarter pounder burger for the same price? this never happened, its probably just made up for fun or someone just pointing out the general population isnt very smart.

>>9583269
så du vil anbefale noma over geranium?

>>9583247
lol

see >>9583105
>this doesn't appeal to me so it is wrong, it should appeal to me!

>>9583314
I like these memes

>>9583314

I would actually believe this. That idiots in my lands would fall for this.

>>9583336
You learn this in elementary

>>9583511
elementary... school?

>>9583513
Yes

>>9583419
Post moar.
Is funny.

>>9583381
>meme
You're a fucking idiot.
It's from an A&W marketing report.

>>9583511
I legitimately forgot how to multiply fractions the other day it was embarrassing

>>9583419
kek. amerishits on suicide watch

>>9583511
Yes, but that is just a reason they don't finish high school. You literally don't need to try in elementary.

>>9583555
how is that relevant to how americans fail elementary school math?

>>9583086
That is a completely retarded thesis. Fine dining is a huge part of the American economy and there are tons of Michelin-starred restaurants in America. Try again.

>>9583105
This is so clearly pulled from your ass that I would be shocked if you aren't a shitposter.

>>9583558
>how is that relevant
Because you can graduate elementary school without trying. I mean that literally. Education standards in some parts of the United States mean you can literally fail every class and they still give you a gold star and send you on your way.

Even the local high school here just lets you graduate even if you fail all the core classes. Though you do need to pass a test.

>>9583569
if by ass you mean my personal, anecdotal experiences, yes.

>>9583314
These memes crack me up, post a couple more.

>>9583397
Google it.
It's 100% true.
These tards struggle with basic fractions.

>>9583567
He's not saying that fine dining doesn't exist in the US. What he is saying is that there's a phobia of fine dining held by american lower classes that's largely unique, which is pretty accurate. >>9583105 hits the nail on the head. It has to do with the distinct way Americans think about class.

>>9583567
>Fine dining is a huge part of the American economy
Wrong, it's a very small part.

>>9583638
Be honest, you thought it was real didn't you?

>>9583649
Americans really are this dumb.
Believe it, bitch.

>>9583658
Obsession

>>9583649
>damagecontrol.jpg

It’s not only Americans. It’s people who live in industrial towns and suburbs without a strong restaurant culture. It just happens that there are a lot more Americans in this situation.

>>9583662
Obese

>>9583086
It's not the plating or small portion sizes.

>>9583676
>small portion sizes.
always love when plebs fail to realize how much food you're actually getting by the end of a typical 7+ course tasting menu. You are always full by the end.

>>9583679
Manlet detected

>>9583686
>continues posting about things he knows nothing about

>>9583523

>>9583631

>>9583694
Sadly, that one is obviously fake. Dublin has more Irish flags than NYC has rats.

>>9583381
>https://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/27/magazine/why-do-americans-stink-at-math.html
The legendary A&W chimpout.

>>9583086
because in America its super easy to find excellent food that isn't presented pretentiously and is reasonably priced

>>9583569
As an american, I can confirm that he's not.

>>9583259

>>9583770
naisu

>>9583086
I mocked it until I tried it. But these place can easily cross into meme territory. But the American sees that dish and thinks "I can eat more than that". Not knowing its one of eight courses plus bread, cheese, and wine.

What a lot of people tend to forget is that America is a fuckheug country. Of course there's gonna be some rotten eggs here. There's 350,000,000 people.

Although, every time I see this, I'm so embarrassed >>9583314

>>9583817
No, an American looks at the serving and says "I can eat 16 of those"

>>9583817
I think the fundamental problem is that americans eat until they feel full, not until they are no longer hungry.

>>9583870
This. It is a downward spiral into madness. I was raised to eat until I feel full. Not American.

>>9583870
No the problem is that they place more value in feeling full than in the taste, texture, quality etc of the food itself.

>>9583314
Jesus.....
I knew my fellow countrymen were mostly idiots, but goddamn that's embarrassing.

That said, in am, honesty, you pretty much have to have lived in a big city in the US to understand fine dining. You have to have experienced a full rounded food culture.
I grew up in a small town, and my parents made a point of driving us to one of the close big cities at least once a month to go out to a fine dining establishment so we would learn that side of food culture. What's weird is when I go home to visit now, the town has grown to a small city, and people have opened what they THINK are "fine dining" restaurants, but in reality are just expensive mid-tier bullshit.

>>9583877
>t. skinny fedora wearer
A balance is necessary. You wouldn't pay $50 for a single peanut grown by a sherpa on the top of a mountain and lovingly housed betwixt his asscheeks as he brought it down to you and released on a silver platter to be brought to you.

You pay for a decent meal. True, quality and taste are more important, but feeling like the meal actually mattered is also important. There must be a balance between quality and quantity.

I'm not even gonna read this thread, just dropping by to say anyone who uses the word pretentious is most likely a moron.

>>9583890
>>A balance is necessary. You wouldn't pay $50 for a single peanut grown by a sherpa on the top of a mountain and lovingly housed betwixt his asscheeks as he brought it down to you and released on a silver platter to be brought to you.
If it was delicious enough, sure why wouldn't I? It's not like I can't just eat other stuff in addition to meet my nutritional needs. If that one peanut is a truly unforgettable sensory experience then damn right I'll pay 50 bucks for it and worry about satiation later.

I understand food better than Americans.

German here, that's literally toy food and anyone who eats that garbage is a child. Serve me proper food or fuck off to Auschwitz.

>>9584187
Thank you for your irrelevant opinion.

>>9583336
It's not our fault we have black people

>>9583400
Ikke OP men har været begge stedet inden for 1½ år
Service og vin er bedst på geranium. Maden på Noma er bedre.

im euro and if im not full after a expensive 3 course meal it's fucking shit

>>9584188
>irrelevant
>literally the country running Europe

Nice going brainlet, why don't you have more toy food to fill up the cavity in your skull?

>>9584242
Running Europe into the ground, you mean.

>>9584249
spain, italy and greece aren't running EU

>>9584242
You are not your country though, remember? You're just some random manchild posting on 4chan and living an otherwise totally unimportant life.

>>9584254
A country is its people and every single one counts, not like a toy food eating moron would understand.

>>9584254
What a sad, sad comment

>>9584254
so are you

>>9583314
I believe it. I work in retail in America and let me tell you, the average person in this country is a drooling, slack-jawed retard. Primarily because we have this ass-backwards culturethat values "the wisdom of simple folk" over higher education and the power of knowledge.

>>9584255
Except the brown ones right? /pol/ sure is funny.

>>9584283
if they dont hold the same general values as the rest of the country, yeah.

if they respect and follow the rules, fine

only a fucking retard would think rapefugees are fine, and im not even a poltard and im not even the guy you replied to.

get a grip on reality you fucking moron

>>9583314
>be shitty chain
>try to compete with global supergiant mcdonalds
>fail because no one knows what the fuck A&W is apart from shitty root beer
>get butthurt no one is eating at your shitty restaurant
>it's americans' fault! they don't know fractions! it wasn't us making stupid business decisions!

This is idiotic because McDonald's itself made the Angus 1/3 Pounder which was hugely successful

>>9584294
>has Angus in the name
>people think it's fancy and think it's ok to pay for it

>>9584292
You realize that your perception of what those values are is likely radically different from the majority of your fellow countrymen right? You know, the people that voted for CDU and SDP? What makes you more qualified to judge what defines your nation than them?

>>9583086
Many Americans harbor an anxiety that the upper crust is secretly mocking them (and to a certain extent that's true) so they're afraid that if they say the wrong thing about a wine or don't enjoy a certain dish they will be laughed out of the room. So anything that is considered fine or fancy is to be avoided, lest you make a social faux pas.
There's also still a big influence from protestantism and the notion that even a small indulgence, like a fancy dinner, is socially sinful.
Our fucked up attitude towards wealth and social class goes back to the colonial days and won't be sorted out anytime soon and that's going to hinder a lot of Americans' ability to enjoy something nice once in a while.

>t. American that grew up on the lower rungs of the ladder in fly over land, but still learned to enjoy something fancy now and then without being self-conscious about it

>>9584331
I don't enjoy having nice, expensive experiences. To me, traveling a long ways for a vacation and spending thousands of dollars is absolutely stupid. I'd rather indulge in materialism which isn't really any better.

t. poor american

You've got to be a turbo moron to let food scammers trick you into paying premium for dressed up leftovers they couldn't sell to intelligent customers.

>>9584331
America has a much better view on class than Europe and pretty much the entire rest of the world though

I've had a three course meal on a carnival cruise. does that count?

>>9584351
This brings up another thing. A lot of Americans are focused on a kind of out dated, drag show version of luxury. Things that aren't actually all that fancy are presented to them in a cartoonishly fancy manner and they love it because they can feel like their indulging in something without actually leaving their comfort zone.
Like a cruise ship buffet. They can feel like they're living the upper class life, but nobody will say anything about them ordering 5 lbs of breaded shrimp and a mega margarita.

You see similar phenomenon among the new money middle class from places like Brazil or China.

>>9583105
Only Europeans enjoy and find comfort in having others above them.

>>9584389
>>9584397
The timing of these two posts is utterly perfect.

>>9584397
I don't condemn those who have more than me, but I think they're being foolish when they aren't being frugal. They think all of the things that they are enjoying today will be there tomorrow. If I live fairly humble life, then the thing that is coming that will change all of the US won't be a bother to me. I slaughter animals that I eat. Not all of the meat I eat, but I definitely know how to do it. I also grow and can vegetables. I believe that intelligent people aren't investing in service, but rather the resources needed in order to serve themselves.

I actually look down on rich people, not envy them.

>>9584443
it wasn't a buffet though.

>>9584380
elaborate

>>9584445
>I live like shit because one day I might have to live like shit
>Actually getting Stockholm syndrome for living poorly
kek

>>9584397
>A lot of Americans are focused on a kind of out dated, drag show version of luxury. Things that aren't actually all that fancy are presented to them in a cartoonishly fancy manner

This seems to be especially prevalent among Boomers in America, and I think it's partly why Boomers and Millenials (i.e. anyone born between 1982 and 2001) are so often at odds with each other. We have different values, and food provides a good example: a typical Boomer "fancy meal out" would likely consist of a prime grade steak (the bigger the better!) with plenty of rich sides to accompany it (think Ruth's Chris), whereas Millenials are much more likely to pay for food they can't easily prepare at home (e.g. the "edible art" type of crap mentioned here: >>9583242).

It's pretty well established at this point that Millenials prefer to pay for experiences. So if fine dining places wanted to stay in business, they have to find a way to provide an experience that we can't get at home. I'll never order a dish I can make myself, if I can help it. Boomer logic placed more emphasis on presentation and window dressing than what was being presented; Millenials meanwhile, will ignore the decorations and actually scrutinize what is being presented.

tl;dr Boomers focus on appearances where Millenials demand actual quality

>>9584445
>Claims not to condemn a group of people
>Condemns said group of people in very same post

Ah yes, the Humble Braggart.

>be eurofag
>obsessed with class
>spend money on appearing upper class
>never have true wealth because of this posing

>>9584457
Do you know what Stockholm Syndrome means? Anyways, the frugal life is fulfilling; less is more.

>>9584489
You're probably right. I tell myself that I'm better than them because they don't know how to serve themselves. Don't get me wrong, there are rich people that I really respect, but usually they're the ones who are more self sufficient than I could ever hope to be.

I do condemn kids with silver spoons in their mouths. Especially those who have no hobbies other than showing off how much money that they have.

Thanks for catching my lie.

>>9584482
Eh, I somewhat agree with you. But I've worked around cruise ships for the last few years and trust me there are still plenty of millennials that are into the whole Faux Luxury Burlesque experience.
Generations are not unified cultures, despite what marketing execs tell everyone. It has way more to do with the circumstances of your upbringing than when you were born.

>>9583573
maybe now elementary schools won't fail, but in the 00-01 school year, 2 of my classmates failed American Kindergarten and had to repeat

>>9584515
I've moved around a lot, and met all kinds of people from former Ethiopian copper miners to trust fund kiddies. Granted I don't know any legit 1% billionaire types but I've known some pretty well off people. I try not to judge them anymore harshly than I'd judge the poorest kid I went to school with or the Nepalese immigrant I worked that one job with.
They had a different upbringing than I did and therefore have different skills than I do. In fact I've spent a lot of time sharing my lower middle class life skills with trust fund kids in exchange for them teaching me about their world, which is part of the reason I can appreciate a fine dinner or a nice glass of wine without feeling weird about it.
I mean yeah there are rich assholes out there, but there are poor assholes to.
Most everybody just wants to be treated like a person, and it's great what you can learn from them when you do.

>>9584515
Frugality is relative.

>>9584579
You're probably right. I'm probably more akin to a poor asshole than anything. I just remember dealing with rich asshole kids when I was in school.

>>9584584
You're probably right too. I just know, relative to me, that $100+ meals are decadent. I don't have hard statistics, but I think that's true for most people from the US.

>>9583377
I second this. I'd be interested in the study

>>9584187
god damn now im hungry

>>9584572
You can repeat once or maybe twice and then they move you forward until High School because the age differences would be too drastic. High school is where you have students who have not passed anything in the last 5 years and suddenly they are expected to perform.

More on topic, I think there's a distinction to be made with formal dining and experimental dining. The latter is one that is far less experienced by most Americans and it's novelty. However, there are plenty of expensive formal dining places that fill up all the time. Is it a normal dining out fare? No, and that's where I think most of this discussion lies. Americans eat out as a regular thing, so generally they eat cheap foods that aren't fresh or good and you get this weird divide in restaurants where your choices are paying 8-10 bucks for what is essentially a Sysco entrée or paying 30 dollars. Such is the life where chains rule supreme.

>>9584518
>Generations are not unified cultures
no shit, dumbass. Do you not understand generalizations? I never said that ALL Millenials or ALL Boomers think alike, I was merely speaking in general terms.

Generally speaking, Millenials are more willing to pay a large price for something if that something is a unique experience that is not easily re-created at home. Hence, Millenials aren't buying the corn-fed, feedlot trash at Ruth's Chris, but they are buying locally farmed, sustainably raised food from restaurants that aren't chains.


>I've worked around cruise ships for the last few years...
Listen carefully, kiddo: YOUR EXPERIENCE IS NOT UNIVERSAL. Just because you've seen 20-somethings eating buffet food on a boat does not necessarily mean that ALL 20-somethings are willing to do that. Nor does it account for those people that are trying that experience simply because their parents (i.e. Boomers) said it was a good thing to do.

>It has way more to do with the circumstances of your upbringing
This is literally the basis of Generational theory: people of similar age from the same country are likely to have had similar upbringings. This leads to shared experiences during the formative years (e.g. every Millenial remembers what they were doing on 9/11/2001, just as every Boomer knows what they were doing when Jack Kennedy got merc'd.) and that leads to similar cultural values.

Maybe you should do a little more reading instead of being a condescending, wage slave retard. Go kill yourself.

>americans

>>9584614
Everybody is an asshole in school. Kids are still working on things like empathy and social skills. Continuing to hold a grudge into adulthood over school cliques is a serious waste of mental and emotional energy. Once you're an adult you have more freedom to associate or disassociate with people.
Like I said, most everyone just wants to be treated like a person. If you approach someone with that attitude and they reciprocate, keep talking to them. If they don't, move on and pay them no mind.

>>9584659
kys

eating at restaurants is just about experiencing great flavours

it isn't about sustenance...

>>9584659
Wow, that was an impressive outburst.
Anyway, I disagree. I think the majority of chatter about generations is intentionally generated by marketing to push certain products to certain groups. Like "Hey, millennial! All the other millennials are buying X! You should buy it too!" Or "Look at all those stupid millennials buying X. You smarter boomers, you should buy Y."

The only reason the Baby Boomers became a named Generation was because of an insurance study about how such a large generation would affect the health care system as they became elderly. It literally had nothing to do with cultural trends or shared experiences.
That shit didn't come until the 80-90s, when marketers decided to take targeted marketing to Omega levels on the teen aged "Generation X"

"Fine dining" is truly the hallmark of the noveau riche and those trying to emulate them. It hurts my soul to be in earshot of these individuals devouring morsel after morsel while emitting squealing noises and parading their ignorance for the whole world to see. A true connoisseur knows the value of time working on his selected single course meal, subtly changing the flavors and texture as the meal progresses. A single well crafted dish, imbued with the eternal march of time, unstoppable, singular in direction is echelons above what is at its essence a sampler plate.

>>9583086
O B S E S S E D

>>9584861
O B E S E D

>>9584670
>food is about flavor not about staying alive
>please give me your money goy im a poor stressed chef
i hope you choke on a gourmet hot dog

>>9583086
Europeans joke about it plenty as well, they just tend to do it in their own respective languages...

>>9584302
Being correct, for one.

>>9584883
he said "eating at restaurants", not "food"

>>9584723
You're obviously uninformed on Generational theory, and you're making a fool of yourself by spewing your ignorance onto this Alaskan crab fishing forum.

While marketing companies do leverage the findings of the sociologists that study generations of people, they don't do so in the ham-fisted way that you seem to think they do. Recognizing that people from the same generation GENERALLY share the same values does allow for more targeted advertising, but it also allows a person to better understand their audience, e.g. in a business meeting or during a personal interaction.

Irregardless of how the term "baby boomers" was invented, there are well-agreed upon characteristics that define people within that generations' age range. You should look up the work presented by Chuck Underwood on America's different generations. And keep in mind that, as I said above, the characteristics that define each generation are GENERALLY found in most people within a given age range; they are not universally true, nor are they presented as such. I think this is why you're getting so upset over scientists trying to understand the population better.

>>9583086
> How come motherfuckers from the humorless parts of the world aren't known to make jokes about this one thing
Congratulations, you're also stupid.

>>9583314
This is bullshit, not only is fractions a simple thing everyone learns early on, but nobody cares or thinks about autistic shot like that.

>>9583086
I love fine dining, but I'm not really paying for intentionally smaller portion's of something not very expensive, or plated in some ridiculous way that makes it more difficult to eat or just less edible, like leaving shit that should be removed from something because "it looks nice"

>>9583086

because it's NOT fine. it's not better. it tastes different. not better. it's just an ostentatious way to shove your head up your own ass.

>>9583105
Class doesn't exist you socialist fag, you can either afford something or you cant.

You're thinking of having manners and understanding what presentation is for.

>>9584482
this is somewhat true but as >>9584518 said there are plenty of shit-eating millennials as well. But yeah I would agree boomers are the generation with possibly the LEAST amount of taste since middle-class Victorians and responsible for a lot of loose standards.

I mean Christ just follow their lives as they start to shape and influence food culture in the 60s, 70s, and 80s before finally loosing touch in the late 90s and you get an idea of why culinary standards are finally recovering a bit.

>>9586839
>Class doesn't exist you socialist fag,
lmao

>>9583419
What's wrong with the second example?

>>9586977
Nvm, I got it.

>that pic
I see someone plays mystic messenger

>>9583770
This is why i hate fine dining. Pretentious fake bullshit

>>9583105
Your whole post can be boiled down to:
>people that I don't like behave irrationally in my hypothetical situation
>people that I do like behave rationally in my in my hypothetical situation
Only an absolute retard would think this post is actually stating something substantial.

>never been fine dining
feelsbadman.jpg

>>9586839
>Class doesn't exist you socialist fag
>you can either afford something or you cant.
Is this what an extra chromosome looks like?

>>9586839
>Class doesn't exist you socialist fag, you can either be industrious enough to afford something or you can be a fat slob who can't muster the ability to get out of the bed every day
*ftfy

>>9583086

Same reason why every politician in the US tries to appear to be "the little/local guy."

The easiest way to explain it is "boots vs suits" with boots meaning cowboy boots and suits meaning city folk. An overwhelming majority of Americans polled, regardless of where they are from, prefer "rural, western, or southern" culture to "urban" culture, and when asked why the majority of responses praise rural culture for being "humble" or "simple." A massive, overwhelming majority of Americans despise people who flaunt their money and praise people who appear to be more down to earth. The food in question is aimed at upper classes of people and appears extremely pretentious to Americans, which puts most people off.

This goes back literally hundreds of years in the US, one of the earliest instances of this is the "hard cider" campaign where Harrison claimed to be a man of the people because he was a frontiersman and soldier, and he drank hard cider, while Van Buren drank wine.

I know you were posting a meme thread but there is a legitimate psychological and cultural reason for it, which is that Americans HATE urban pretentious shit, even if they don't want to admit it.

>>9587810
I'm a rural and suburban retard, and I agree with you!

I think it really just goes to show how idiotic Americans are that even in a thread where the OP explicitly states a multicourse meal, people still bring up how the picture is too small to satiate an appetite

>>9587865
Yeah, man. Those fucking retarded Americans. Don't they realize having multiple, pretentious breadcrumbs makes all the difference?

>>9586839
>people aren't culturally different based off of their wealth
this is exactly what I'm talking about. the difference is that Americans actually want to believe this blatant farce, and get offended when expensive luxuries break that illusion

>>9583220

>>9587936
If you ever bothered spending more than 7 dollars on your meal at wendy's you would realize that a multicourse meal is more than enough to be 'full' or whatever it is you call stuffing yourself with enough fat and sugar to drop into a food-induced coma

>>9587639
It really can't be boiled down to that at all.

>>9588110
t. pretentious shit who can't handle the concept a meal or the reasonable price it comes with

>>9584268
>values "the wisdom of simple folk" over higher education and the power of knowledge.
This will be the downfall of the empire.

>>9588121
yes because apparently I always and only eat at fine dining restaurants?

>>9588125
>confesses to being a piece of shit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyIMKiWpdU4

>>9588122
communist infiltration of "higher" education? yes, /pol/ has known this for years

>>9584445
Seneca was good, but he should have taken stoicism as a base to develop a roman form of epicurianism. there was a good foundation for a better hedonism than the purely dionysian.

>>9583086
I'm English and think that it's dumb.

>>9583870
Everyone eats until full. European restaurants are no different and neither is fine dining. Michelin restaurants give you more than enough food to have internal bleeding. They just do it with a lot of small dishes.