/ck/ - Food & Cooking

>>6767499

Made a solid bread using Ken Forkish's "saturday white bread" recipe, but my dutch oven is extremely wide and flat leading to disappointingly shaped boules.

I need to get myself a better shaped dutch-oven or learn to make bread without one.

Can you post a picture dude? The Dutch oven doesn't really serve to help the bread rise in that way, it provides a hot enclosed space which emulates the conditions of a bakers steam oven (IIRC).

I think you should look to other factors before you shell out for a new piece of kit!

>>6767499
Baking a biga probably wouldn't be very good, since it's just a preferment. Loaf looks good, though. A little too much external flour for my tastes. I usually try to brush as much off before baking.

>>6767522
Baking a boule without brotform or dutch oven just requires a little extra attention. The first trick is to stick with smaller sized loaves. Second, make sure to preshape to properly orient the gluten network. Third, really focus on creating a tight boule shape without tearing the surace before proofing. Fourth, don't over-slash and release all the surface tension prior to oven spring.

>>6767634
I made a rough proofing basket from fabric at hand and was terrified of the dough sticking to it so I floured it like hell. I'll bear in mind I can just brush it off in future though.

I've never made a Biga before so just wanted to tick it off, is it really such a waste?

You provide great content btw FF, enjoy your poats. You helped me make my starter in winter and its still going strong and delicious.

>>6767627

the problem is that the dough is so lax that it spreads very aggressively when heated, but since it takes the easiest way out, it spreads sideways rather than upwards. If the pot was less wide it would meet the walls and spread upwards to a more dome-like shape which I desire.

Also the top of the loaf is going against the lid which further flattens it into an ugly shape

>>6767634

what hydration do you use.

the 72% loaf I do goes extremely lax during the final proof it after pre-shaping it, so I kinda just assumed I need a smaller pot to prevent it from stretching sideways too much.

could be that I need to work on my shaping skills to get the tension right.

could be that I overproof it since it's pretty hot inside right now.

>>6767665
Not a waste at all. Both poolishes and bigas are fine preferments, useful for a wide range of breads. I just meant that you can't just bake the preferment. You need to work it into a dough. Just being a dick about terminology. Ignore me.

I just moved into a place with a real oven for the first time in years so I've been making real simple breads. Gonna start making sourdough as soon as my starter is old enough, right now its smellin real funky tho

>>6767665
>I've never made a Biga before so just wanted to tick it off, is it really such a waste?
You haven't wasted anything yet. But biga is just a preferment that is added to a final dough. You don't just bake biga, it typically has no salt and would kinda suck.

biga/poolish.pate pate fermentee/levain are all pre fermented dough to enhance a final dough, not bake by themselves

>>6767680
I use a wide range of hydrations. The loaf in the previous picture was probably 60%. A couple weeks back I went up to 88% for a ciabatta.

>>6767691
It'll go through a bunch of funk phases. From wet paint to old cheese, it's all normal. Eventually it'll smell clean and sour.

>>6767699
If you are the guy I think you are, I watched a really excellent video you made. You have a great home bakery setup, unfortunately like me you lack an oven with steam though.

It seems like you are set up to make lots of bread, do you sell it to people or what? If so how do you go about it? I'm just curious.

>>6767683
>>6767698

Haha guys come on does the loaf in the OP really look like I mixed a Poolish and then straight up baked it? Was just shortening the type of loaf to its differentiating characteristic.

>>6767860
I guess it triggered our autism. But nobody refers to a finished bread as a biga and nobody says "bake a biga"

On /ck/ it's not really safe to assume a person isn't retarded. Good luck with your baking bro

>>6767940
'Nobody' referring I assume to within the vast network of artisan bakers discussing such topics day to day. I'll remember not to skimp on the distinction in future threads though.

I'd like more pictures of bread if anyone has any!

>>6767723
Used to sell bread to people when I had the time to produce large quantities in a home kitchen. State law here allows cottage industry, so it was all above board.

>>6767860
NBD. All of my bread photos are on another laptop that I haven't turned on in months. I really should retrieve them.

Any tips or processes for getting a soft crumb and crust? The only reliable recipe I have is practically 10% oil (pic related).

It's not that I'm particularly bothered about fat content, it's just that evidence from commercial bread suggests there are other methods available, and I'd like to understand the mechanics.

baking this now. rosemary and widmer cheese no knead bread. will post an update when it's done.

>>6769180
Look up lecithin as an additive? IIRC it can improve textures and shelf-life (home shelf life in this case, meaning you get a spare day or two before your fresh loaf is a stalish loaf)

Made some bitchin' banana-walnut bread yesterday. I want to try sourdough, so I'm also feeding a starter and praying to Lord Ainsley that I don't end up poisoning myself.

>>6770186
You won't poison yourself bro, you can tell if if a starter has gone bad by the smell. It will be funky at first but eventually have a pleasant wheaty sour smell.

>>6770110
done

>>6770255
looks great, can we get a crumb shot?

>>6770274
when it cools down

>>6770255
hydration? how did it keep its boule shape without a banneton, anon. this baffles me

>>6770290
I used this cast iron pot to bake it in. When I let it rise I just form it into a boule and it stays that way. It's a relatively low hydration bread, so it maintains shape well. Something around 40% I think? I use AB's no knead recipe as a basis which is obviously based on Lahey's no knead recipe. But my le creuset is fucking amazing for baking with this recipe. I can't use the top though because it has the rubber handle which I don't feel right using above 350f. I messed up with this bake and set it at 400 and not 450 so I didn't get a good oven spring really

>>6770274
here you go

>>6770340
>Something around 40% I think?
40% hydration bread is pretty much impossible

a firm dough is 60% hydration

>>6770364
perhaps I misunderstand bakers percentages but if I follow this recipe and use 17.5oz flour and 12oz water then 12/(17.5+12) is something around 40%, no?

>>6770376
sorry, this recipe
http://www.foodnetwork.com/recipes/knead-not-sourdough-recipe.html

>>6770376
Baker's percentages are not a total percentage, it represents the percentage relative to flour.
ie:
If you have 600g flour and 300g water, you have a 50% percentage of water.

>>6770340
we have the same dutch oven! Yours is more fuckered up than mine, tho.

>>6770383
so it's 12/17.5? which is around 70% so I'm completely fucking retarded

>>6770389
You're not retarded. You calculated percents int he way that literally everyone but a baker calculates them. The only utility of baker's percentages is the ability to very quickly calculate the required quantities of the ingredients relative to flour. Otherwise it would make more sense to report percent hydration as the quantity of water relative to the total weight of all ingredients. Baking is weird like that, though. Values like percent extraction and absorption ratios are also weird as hell.

>>6770340
great dutch oven anon. can't afford a le creuset yet, but i have pic related. can't seem to get a good oven spring on mine, they come out retardedly flat even at 70% hydration

>>6770356
also, nice even crumb.

>>6770570
You might be letting them rest for too long before baking.

>>6770580
oh fuck. how long do you proof yours? last one i tried was 12/1 hours, rest/proof. flat as a tire with a slightly gummy crumb.

>>6770570
I got lucky and inherited the le creuset set from my parent's wedding. So fucking legit, they've lasted over 25 years

>>6770164
That looks promising. Apparently it helps you jizz more too.

Thanks anon, win win.

>>6770186
I second, in the unlikely case that your starter goes bad you won't have to ask us, you will know.

why does your bread look like a wookie?

just moved and am still trying to figure out my new oven. this is the best i've done in it so far.

>>6771207
>figure out my new oven

All ovens are pretty similar, and relatively simple! There is a knob or buttons that you turn or press to set the temperature. You then wait until the oven "preheats", which is when the inside of the oven reaches the set desired temperature. Handily, modern ovens will beep when this is achieved. Next, place the item you wish to bake into the oven. When the amount of time it requires to bake the item has elapsed, you remove it.

There are more fussy features to modern ovens, such as "timers" and "lights", but those are for advanced users. There will be a time when you can use those features too.

Keep at it friend, and good luck!

>>6771219
You don't bake much, do you?

>>6771207
It looks like a spooky face.

Kinda like the mask that chases you from Mario 2.

>>6771219
ovens don't always heat to the temperature you set them to. my new oven runs a little cooler than my old one did so i'm trying to figure out the right temperature to set it to to achieve the crust that i want.

Are you bad enough dudes to make Meatbread?

Here's the Recipe:

1 pkg frozen bread dough (3 per pack)
1 lb extra lean ground beef
1 roll sausage (hot or mild)
One 16 oz pkg. smoked sausage (hot or mild)
8 oz grated Mozzarella cheese
8 oz grated Cheddar cheese
1 lb chopped Velveeta Pasteurized Prepared Cheese Product
One 3 oz jar stuffed olives, chopped
One 4 oz can of mushrooms
Small bunch onion tops, chopped
Small bunch parsley, chopped
1 cup chopped onion
1/2 cup chopped bell pepper
2 stalks celery, chopped
3 tbs margarine
Cook ground beef until it is very brown, then drain. Saute bell peppers, onions, celery, onion tops and parsley. Add to ground meat. Stir in half of the chopped Velveeta cheese and set aside.

Cut roll sausage in slices, brown, and put aside. Let cool and crumble. Roll out all three loaves onto floured surface. Spread melted margarine over dough.

Divide all ingredients into three parts and layer as follows:

ground meat mixture
roll sausage
smoked sausage
olives
mushrooms
Cheddar cheese
Mozzarella cheese
Velveeta cheese
Bring bread over, folding ends first. Bake 30-35 minutes if ready to bake. If not, bake at 350F for 10 minutes or until light brown, then freeze. Defrost. Bake another 20-25 minutes or until brown.

Go ahead and take pictures to prove you did it, unless you a coward.

>>6767499
That looks amazing brah, recipe?

>>6771552
>Here's the Recipe:
>1 pkg frozen bread dough

>>6771639
eh, you gotta do what you gotta do.

I've never taken a loaf to the point of most of the pictures in this thread, I'm too scared of burning it. Do they not start to taste bitter when they're that dark?

>>6770356
I cut this loaf up and toasted it and put tomatoes, cheese and anchovies on it

fight me

>>6773235
in my personal experience no but it could be that i just don't notice as much because i enjoy bittering things.

i never bother with biga/poolish/levain
i make up a large batch of dough, halve it, freeze one half for use whenever (i've never known the bread fail to rise or taste bad after defrosting), and the other half goes in the fridge overnight (it'll cope for 2 nights easily), and then simply proceed as usual with rising and baking
the taste is definitely better after being left overnight
i use autolyse method too, so make the dough so it's just brought together, leave for 15mins, knead for only a couple of mins, leave for 15mins, knead for a couple of mins... repeat until it's supersmooth

>>6770255
>>6770356
>>6771207
things of beauty

>>6774774
wouldn't folding be better than kneading? makes for great gluten development really quickly

>>6775218
it's interesting you say that, cos honestly i am not sure what folding is

when i make a dough for strudel, i roll the dough into a sausage, and then i fold it into 1/3s and then roll and stretch it into a sausage again, and then fold into 1/3s repeatedly until my shoulders are burning (it's fucking exhausting), and that produces an excellent stretchy dough

however when i've looked up 'folding' bread i tend to see people taking a dough that already looks well kneaded and simply folding it a couple of times and then putting it aside to rest, so i'm not quite clear what difference that's supposed to be making

>>6770255
recipe?

Scrub here, I just made a loaf of bread using the chef john Italian peasant loaf with cornmeal. In it, he recommended, after proofing, to roll out the dough flat and then roll it into the long "italian" bread shape. I was wondering if this was in any way SOP because I ended up with really distinct internal barriers, and I've never really seen that before...

>>6775381
here
>>6770381

>>6769180
Do a slower rise and get more air in and add slightly more butter to get it more moist.

Cook 2-3 minutes less.

>>6770356
Oh that looks tasty

>>6767499

>>6776361
Sorry, posted with no Pic

>>6776366

>>6776366
>>6776371
>>6776373
SameFaggin away here....

>>6767499
I'm allergic to bread

>>6770255
>milwakee's best ice
muh nigga

>>6771207

How did you make that scoring pattern? Looks incredible.

>>6773565

>anchovies

Plebius maximus. Any matured cheese would have been better

>>6778409
Not that anon, but it looks like scissor cuts.

I've tried making whole-wheat bread, but the result is always similar to this picture.

First one is honey whole wheat bushman bread, the second is just a regular whole wheat bread.

All my whole wheat attempts ended up like that. Any clue what I'm doing wrong?

>>6779737
i never make 100% wholewheat bread
i usually make it 50/50 with plain white flour
(or any mix of spelt or rye or whatever the fuck else i find in the cupboard just so long as there's a decent amount of white too)
you'll get a far better crumb with plain flour in there (not even strong flour), but you can try seeing how low you can take the ratio of plain:wholewheat before you are back in brick territory

>>6770356
dat crumb

>>6775361
You're probably not seeing the very first steps. You basically combine the flour and water (and whatever else) until it has a form and no packets of flour. From there, you start folding. It begins to look well kneaded after that.

>>6778409
i just used a double edge razor from the dollar store. i tried to cut it so all of them would look like the top right part but the cuts on the bottom split so big that they became one.

>>6771207
today's bake. crumb to come.

>>6780755
crumb

>>6780755
>>6780760
Beautiful.

bacon sourdough, pain au bacon I made last week

>>6781926
crumb

overnight no knead white with jajapeños and cheddar folded in from last week, too

>>6781932
and the crumb of the same formula straight whit bread.

>>6781928
>>6781932
>>6781936
When do you fold the other ingredients anon? Do you let it proof with the bacon etc already folded in, will it not retard oven spring. Also wonderful crumb

>>6782245
the bacon , crisp fried and crumbled, goes into the dough at the first mix wth a little of the bacon fat. It does not retard spring much. These loaves actually spring better than straight levain loaves for me.
The cheese and chiles get folded in at the shaping of the loaves.
Thanks

>>6767499
I love baking bread
It's actually not that hard and pretty cheap (I think I spend like $0.50 at the most on a reasonable loaf)
I don't know why people don't do it more on their own

>>6780642
Tried making it again, this time it seems as if it was properly cooked all the way through. However, the dough was very heavy when I was kneading, and it has a distinct flour-y taste to the bread. The honey and molasses come through very faintly, even though I used almost 1/3 cup of the stuff in the bread. Nice crust, though. Will post pictures later, maybe--it doesn't look nearly as good as many of these breads. Plus it's half-eaten already.

>>6776413
is that a young Bernie Sanders?

>>6782845
if you want a softer loaf, then make the dough wetter
once you start kneading, the dough can get tough, so either just add some water and keep working it (once you add the water, leave it to stand for a couple of mins until the water is better absorbed if it gets really messy). don't be afraid to experiment, and if it's a really wet disaster, don't fanny about by adding more flour to dry it, just use a dough scraper (or anything with a useable flat edge) to work it for a while, and then throw it into the pan and let it rise and bake it, cos it will still produce something edible (plus i think that's good experience for working out what you can get away with doing to dough)
as a rule of thumb, i find that i generally start the kneading with the dough a little wetter than i eventually would want it
also if you are having hell generally and need a confidence boost, try working with spelt flour, cos that shit is amazing to make dough with