/ck/ - Food & Cooking

foc-acc-you!

looks pretty fuckin tasty though though. i thought foccacia was more airy than that

If that is an actual picture of your creation then hot damn

>>5019561
>i thought foccacia was more airy than that

So did I. The texture is light and flaky, but it didn't get very thick.

>>5019575
huh. what kind of flour did you use and how long did you let it rise and proof?

>>5019578
I used 00 bread flour.
For the first rise, I let it sit 2 hours and then after shaping it, I let it sit another 45 minutes.

Maybe it's too cold in my apartment?

One time I was at a local farmer's market. There was a stand of Amish women selling home made breads and pastries. Their focaccia was looking damn good so I ordered a loaf. The woman I was talking to took my money and another behind her grabbed the bread and handed it to me. Her forearms were covered in scabs and sores. I couldn't bring myself to eat it. Still can't eat focaccia.

>>5019588
that also crossed my mind, what part of the world are you in? I live in georgia and it got fuckin cold real quick this year.

>>5019627
New England. It's 19 degF out and the air is very dry.

The recipe I used:

Mix:
- 1 tsp yeast
- 1 c water
- 2 Tbsp olive oil
- 1 tsp salt
- 1/4 c flour
Knead in:
- 2 c flour, give or take
Then knead in:
- 3 Tbsp olive oil
Let rise until doubled (1-2 hours)
Form into rectangle on an oiled baking sheet
Drizzle on:
- 1 Tbsp olive oil
Poke like hell with your fingers
Let rise again (about 45min to an hour)
Sprinkle on
- 1 Tbsp olive oil
- 2 tsp sea salt
- 2 tsp chopped rosemary
Bake for 13-15 min at 475 degF
Brush with more olive oil right out of the oven

It's a lot of oil.

>>5019632
yeah that'll probably do it or on the other end of things it may be just warm enough inside but you may have overproofed and it didn't get any oven spring.

>>5019653
>overproofed

This is a thing? I let it sit for a long time thinking "It hasn't quite doubled." Also, how do you gauge when it's doubled or just risen a little bit?

>>5019660
I'm honestly a pretty bad baker, but i know it can happen because it almost always happens to my dough. I have the same mindset as you, always thinking, oh it'll go a little more. Experience is how you tell, because my mom has never fucked up a loaf, and to date i've made 3 that i didn't have to throw out.

I made a pretty damn good serrano cheesy bread today. It was a basic white bread recipe that I added serranos and cheddar to. I also added some bacon grease and some cheese "sauce" that I made that turned out to thick.

How do I make bread to keep? I made my first loaf the other day, just yeast, flower, water, and a pinch of salt, and it turned out really well. I was excited to eat the other half in the morning but by the time I woke up the whole loaf was rock hard. Why is my bread going stale so fast?

I made some basic pizza crust just now. Pizza is in the oven. Pic is somewhat related in that it is the sauce I made to go on said pizza.

Your bread looks really good OP, even if it didn't spring like you wanted it to.

Anyone got tips for working with really wet, gloopy dough? I make whole, multigrain bread, and add gluten flour to it for softness, but it's still pretty dense.

I've read that if your dough is like 90% water, it bakes much better. It gets all sticky and gooey too though, so I haven't added that much water to the loafs I bake

>>5019982
It has no preservatives. Trust me: that's a good thing.
First off, if you're baking for yourself only, bake smaller loaves. 200g of flour is enough for me for 2-3 days of bread (I bake near daily, at least 4 days each week).
Anyway, keeping it freshish depends on the type of bread you bake and that decides also how you should store it. If baking a high hydration, crusty bread, cut yourself a slice and store the rest of the loaf on the cutting board cut-side down as the hard crust will help it (but not deter completely) from going stale quickly. It can keep relatively fresh for another 2 days after baking.
If baking softer, English/American-style bread, just store it in a plastic bag and force out as much air as possible. I use a produce bag from the grocer.
If bread goes stale, though, don't toss it. Make bread crumbs. Use it to make dumplings (semmelknödel, the secular matzo-ball). Use it to make dressing/stuffing/whatever. Use it to make bread pudding. Deep-fry it for croutons. Etc etc etc. So long as it's not moldy, it's fine.

>>5019982
I cut mine up and freeze it after its no longer hot, its not the best but its better than leaving it out to go hard.

>>5020007

I asked FF once, i think the consensus was to use a dough knife on a non-porous surface and keep your hands oiled. I can't offer any firsthand advice, though. I've fucked up multiple loaves because they just became pools of dough slop.

>>5020019

Did you read anything about how to get it to bake without sticking at the bottom? Even my mildly wet dough will stick to wax paper, I have to throw flour underneath and even pat it on the bottom of the loaf to make a solid bottom before it bakes. I don't think that'd work with ultragloop dough

>>5019652
If you're shooting for a very light/billowy focaccia, then your problem is likely the olive oil. It inhibits gluten formation which means you don't have the structure required to support significant oven spring. Most focaccias, however, have a denser crumb, and yours does not look far off.

Then there's the weirdo focaccia that you can get every now and then in Italy, which is tomato sauce and mozzarella sandwiched between two paper thin layers of pizza dough. Also delicious.

>>5020041
You mean schiacciata (pic related)?

>>5020048
Just that I am from Italy and the only thing I can think of similar to what you describe is either schiacciata (this pic is also related) or torta al testo.

>>5019551
Looks pretty good for a first attempt. If you want your foccaccia to be lighter and airier you need to make a wetter dough.

Here's a ciabatta I whipped up recently.

>>5020061
sweet merciful jesus Iscariot

>>5020048
No, this. I've only ever had it in Recco, though. Your image also looks very delicious.

>>5020007
Persistence and patience is the most important component of working with a very wet dough. It can be infuriating, to be sure. Wet hands, a bench knife, and the slap and fold technique is key. You also just have to be willing to get covered in flour. Them's the breaks.

>>5020090
Whoops, forgot to attach the focaccia col formaggio picture!

>>5020061

How did you get it to be so...tall? I thought Ciabatta was normally spread out in a big slab.

>>5020061
Damn that's impressive.

Thanks for the tip. I'll make sure to use wetter dough next time.

Regular Baguette, not going to win any awards for form but it's damn tasty.

Instead of just water I did half water/half 2% milk. I think it ended up being a far more rich tasty bread.

Bread is such a joy to make, every cook should really get into it. It's so nice to not have to go anywhere for a fresh bread .

Ever been to a Salvation Army / Goodwill / thrift store? An old tube TV? Gone. A working toaster...sold. Yellowed, greasy toaster over...fucking sold before it gets put on the self. But look at the bottom shelf...full of bread machines nobody wants. With one of these used $5 beauties a poor person could easily turn flour into bread like a damn messiah...but nobody wants that shit. The record I've seen is 7, seven bread machines on the bottom shelf at a Goodwill.
That's my homemade bread story, have a nice day.

>>5020173
>>5020353

Thanks.

This is a recipe based on Peter Reinhart's in Bread Baker's Apprentice. I used bread flour, 80% hydration and folded the dough over itself several times to build gluten strength. If done properly ciabatta puffs up like a balloon in the oven. These loaves were nearly flat when I put them in.

One of the biggest steps in becoming a good baker, for me, was using good books and a good online resource (http://www.thefreshloaf.com/).). If you want to make real good bread you need to move beyond the generic recipes you find on allrecipes.com

>>5020381
I think Bread Machines are unpopular because most people who get them are gifts or just impulse buys, most people make a few breads and then get annoyed by it taking precious counter space.

Since the majority of midrange ovens have convection (and everyone has a mixer) I really don't know why'd you'd want a Bread Maker. You also obviously can't make pretty breads like OP's and >>5020090

>>5020387

Did you use a stand mixer to mix in the water to the flour?

>>5020399
I don't really want a bread maker. Of course, counter real estate is at a premium, plus I have a needless fascination with doing everything by hand, so I'll knead and stir with a stick until my shoulder's sore, even though I could just plop it in a mixer and have a beer.

>>5020373
>Bread is such a joy to make
This is the truth. It's like nothing else. Possibly because bread is such a staple and is also making it is more physically involved than most other foods.

Posting in an epic bread

>>5020399
A loaf of bread takes only 5 mins of work with a machine. If you had roommates that devoured a loaf everyday, you will need a bread machine. But for a group that is less than three, it is pretty useless, since you can bake a weeks worth of bread in a few hours of work.

>>5020434
I guess I never thought of it that way. It's me and a roommate right now and we might go through 1/2 bread everyday. So it's still fun for me to make Bread the slow way.

Started my Sourdough Starter today, very excited to see how that develops.

For very, very active fermentation, you've got to get your yeast ready. I've been doing this, and it's really stepping up my yeast baking game.

Add the yeast to water that is hot to touch, but not scalding. Add a small about of flour, a very small amount of sugar and salt. Let that mix sit, make sure it doesn't get cold, for maybe 10 minutes or until there's a good froth on top.

Mix liquids and solids separately, then all together. It's key that you not add too many heavy ingredients- if it's not a flour or a yeast or a spice, you want to be very sparing, as it'll make the end result less fluffy.

This has entered my regular dinner rotation for wraps:

http://www.budgetbytes.com/2010/09/naan/

Honestly, it's the most common yeast bread I make. Shit's dynamite, takes less than a minute a piece to fry up, and serves hot with a ton of Mediterranean dishes.

>>5020535
>a very small amount of sugar and salt

Doesn't salt inhibit yeast growth?

>>5021097
Most people leave out the salt and flour when proofing yeast. Just a little sugar.

http://www.kingarthurflour.com/tips/yeast-dough-tips.html

>>5021097
>Doesn't salt inhibit yeast growth?

Yes, but it doesn't totally stop it. It slows it down. The trick is to use the correct amount of salt.

>>5020535
So what's the difference between this and a sponge or a ferment? Letting a small amount of yeast multiply for like 12 hours?

>>5021141
If you really want to be in control, get yourself two scales. One with a 5lb capacity and 1 gram resolution for weighing flour, and a digital 'pocket scale' with .1 gram resolution for weighing yeast, salt, etc.

And then start converting your recipes to baker's percentage

https://www.kingarthurflour.com/professional/bakers-percentage.html

http://www.kingarthurflour.com/recipe/master-weight-chart.html

>>5021490
Sponges and preferments are larger. I suspect he's probably not fermenting more than a tablespoon of flour, max.

I almost never proof my yeast for two reasons:

I use instant dry yeast and it's not necessary.

I keep my yeast in the freezer, in a freezer bag, and replace it when it starts to get old.

That said, preferments are a good way of getting more flavor into a bread, as is reducing the amount of yeast used and fermenting overnight, or for a few days, in the refrigerator.

>>5021510
>>5021490

I forgot to mention that you were right to point out that preferments work for several hours, and he's only proofing his yeast for a few minutes.

>>5020535
Your yeast will thank you if you start adding the salt to the flour, and not to the yeast proofing process.

i want to make sandwich bread
like a loaf of bread to cut up into slices

i have flour, yeast, other stuff and a bread machine

im pretty alright at making pizza dough, what do i do to make bread dough, anyone got a super simple easy bread recipe i can build off of?

also what are some ways to flare out my pizza dough, pretty bland.
flour, salt, sugar, yeast, water and oil

>>5020007
i throw more flour in there n turn the bread machine back on

>>5019551
Dude. That looks awesome. Good job.

>>5022195
1 1/3 C warm water
Add to it 2 1/4 t yeast
1 T sugar

Let sit ten minutes. In a bowl mix 3 1/2 C flour and 1 t salt, add your yeast/water mixture and stir until it comes together. Knead 5 minutes. Let rise until double, punch it down, pAt it out, and roll it up. Put if in a loaf pan and let it rise again. Bake in a 375 oven for about 25 minutes.

>>5022279
Oops. Needs 2 T oil also.

I want to make a combination of "cinnamon swirl bread" and some kind of dark, dense and hearty wheat molasses bread.

Any suggestions? Right now I'm planning on taking a recipe for 'oat molasses' bread, using whole wheat flour, and rolling it up with cinnamon inside.

What do you guys think?

>>5022279
hey, how do i skip the 2nd part using a bread machine? just dump all that stuff in the bread machine? should i add garlic or any simple spices?

Yeast is good but I'm living at my gf's now so the kitchen is colder than my old place. Was thinking of putting a shallow pan of hot water in the oven(along with the bread) to promote rising. Is this feasible?

>>5022536
Yep.

>>5022540
Sweetness thanks mate, I'll put pictures up tomorrow when I make some

>>5022536
btw i have a gf

I really love this kind of German "dark bread" (scwartzbrot) and I was thinking about buying a bread machine to make it.

What do you think of it?

>>5022589

Forgot to post pic.

What do you think about buying a bread machine to make dark bread?

>>5022584
Sweet, didn't question that in any way but kudos to you.

>>5020011
Thank you for the tips! I'm making another loaf tonight, and if my guests and I don't manage to finish it somehow I'll try that cut-down thing.

>>5022584

Grats man.

>>5022323
Starting first rise

>>5022848
About to go into oven!!

>>5022848
>>5023266
good luck! can't wait to see some pics

>>5022347
bread is done, taste pleasant!

>>5023431
picture?

>>5023431
put some cheese, minced tomato and minced red onion on top of that on you're good to go.

>>5023442
>picture?

>>5023273
Just came out, going to let cool then cut into it first thing tomorrow morning, will post pictures and recipe!

what do i do about my yeast?

i constantly forget to use it but when i do want to it's already dead.

>>5023468
Usually I post these long explanations on why your bread didn't come out perfect but I think most of it gets lost on newbies so I lay it out nice and simple.

knead more. once for 5 minutes with a 20 min rest. then twice more with another 20 mins in between.
rest another 20 mins before shaping. watch 10 different youtube vids on shaping before you even consider thinking you got the hang of it.
last, bake it longer. start around 450 for 15 mins then drop the heat to 420 until its golden brown.
if you dont let it cool almost 100% completely, prepare to be disappointed when you slice it and it gets dense because everything got squished while warm and stuck together making the loaf dense.

>>5023609
I see u used a bread machine, disregard this. some milk and an egg or two are good additions to sandwich bread. brush butter on top before baking to keep the top soft

>>5023468
>>5023466

What recipe were you using?

http://www.kingarthurflour.com/recipes/classic-sandwich-bread-recipe

>>5023597
Assuming it's dry yeast, put it in the freezer as soon as you buy it, in a baggie or clean glass jar and seal it up.

Before using, put the amount required in some of the liquid from the recipe, warmed, with a teaspoon of sugar or so. If it starts getting frothy within ~10-20 minutes or so, it's alive.

>>5023468
See the pic at >>5021497

>>5023609
i think it came out damn fine, ty very much

>>5024913

Did you use >>5022279?

If so that's my favorite bread recipe, It's very adaptable and versatile. You can change the flour to whole wheat or a combo of the two, you can pat it out in a circle after the first rise for a pizza crust. Add a little more flour for a firmer dough and bread, use milk instead of water and leave very slack for dinner rolls. Far more important than scales or specialized baking stuff is the ability to read your dough and that only comes with experience, so keep baking and have fun.

baked this loaf this morning. whole wheat sourdough

>>5025014
Looks awesome, would eat.

>>5023479
Done, turned out amazing and rose very well for a makeshift recipe.

>>5025058

Excellent plain, as it is a hearty bread, but delicious with some butter and blackberry jam.

>>5025060

Had a very big gap between where the 'filling' was rolled in, I cant decide if I like it there or not.

>>5025066

Here is a closer look at the gap.

I made brioche rolls just now. Whilst I waited for the dough to rise I had a few glasses of mulled wine. Now I have giant rolls. Tomorrow, giant hamburgers will be made!

>>5020061
damn that looks good

>>5025684

Damn, I love hamburgers on brioche. How much butter did you use? Rich man's brioche or poor man's brioche?

I make a focaccia with rosemary, parmesan & fresh ground black pepper

>>5025060
>>5025066
>>5025072

>The most recent Cook's Illustrated has a cinnamon swirl bread article that discusses this problem. According to them, the root cause is a lack of binding between the dough and filling. Gas from the yeast, and steam generated during baking, push into the spiral, creating pressure that compresses the dough and widens the gap.

>In the specific case of cinnamon bread, they recommend using powdered (confectioner's) sugar instead of granulated, and using a large amount of cinnamon. The finer sugar dissolves more easily in moisture from the bread, quickly creating a paste that is reinforced by the cornstarch and by starches in the ground cinnamon. Misting the bread before adding the filling also helps.

>In order to make a sausage filling adhere to the bread, you would need a sticky, water-soluble element. Cornstarch or powdered gelatin spring to mind immediately as possibilities.

>The other tactic they employ is to actually expose the filling during proofing, preventing the yeast's gas (and later, steam) from building up alongside the filling. Once the filling is rolled into the dough, the loaf is cut in half lengthwise. With the two halves laid side-by-side, cut face up (exposing the filling), they are wound around each other, folding the left piece over the right until the end is reached (this is called a "Russian braid"). The ends are pinched together, and the loaf is placed in the pan to proof. This, obviously, should help with any kind of filling, not just cinnamon sugar.

From somewhere on the internet.

Hey OP, I think you focaccia bread, because all I see is a fucking lump

I made peasant bread a week ago, and when it came out of the oven it was absolutely delicious.

The next morning it was not stale or anything, but it had a really weird, chemical-ish taste, which I did not detect at all the night before. Even putting it back in the oven to heat up did not get rid of it.

Anyone know what the hell is up?

>>5028610
Post the recipe, hard to diagnose if I don't know what's in it.

>>5028948
Sorry man, I thought "peasant bread" would be enough.

http://www.alexandracooks.com/2012/11/07/my-mothers-peasant-bread-the-best-easiest-bread-you-will-ever-make/

>>5028610
>chemical-ish taste

Well, that's not very descriptive so we can only guess. Was it perhaps the smell of alcohol? Yeast of any sort produces alcohol as it works.

>>5028963
What kind of salt did you use?
Were all of your ingredients reasonably fresh?
Could you have accidentally used some self rising flour?
Were your tools and work surfaces clean?
How long did you ferment the dough?

>>5028610
how did you store it? homemade baked goods are really good at sucking up other flavors near them.

>>5028966
It was most likely the yeast. I used the exact specified amount listed on the recipe however.

>>5028977
I put it in a ziplock bag, squeezed all the air out, then left it in my bread cabinet

>>5028972
>What kind of salt did you use?
Iodized
>Were all of your ingredients reasonably fresh?
I literally bought everything besides the salt on that day
>Could you have accidentally used some self rising flour?
I used all purpose unbleached flour
>Were your tools and work surfaces clean?
Only tools I used were two bowls, some plastic wrap and two forks, all washed and cleaned thoroughly
>How long did you ferment the dough?
First rise: Hour and a half, possibly more
Second rise: 45 minutes
Is there such a thing as allowing it to rise for too long? This was the first bread I've ever made so I don't know

>>5028995
>Iodized
A teaspoon of iodized salt is not the same as a teaspoon of kosher salt, as kosher salt has larger grains, so x volume of iodized salt contains more salt than x volume of kosher salt.

I don't think that's an issue here, but it's something to keep in mind.

>Is there such a thing as allowing it to rise for too long?

Yes, underfermented and overfermented dough can both cause weird flavors, but I'm not sure that applies here. Did you rise your dough in the oven? How hot was it?

Rising should be done until the dough reaches the correct volume, rather than by a strict time, would you say the dough more than doubled in size on either rise?

>>5028995
>It was most likely the yeast. I used the exact specified amount listed on the recipe however.

Was the bread fully cooked in the middle?

>>5029121
>Did you rise your dough in the oven? How hot was it?

For the first rise, yes. I set the oven to 350, allowed it to heat for around two minutes, (it never got to 350) and then shut it off and immediately placed the bread in. I would say it definitely doubled in size the first rise. Possibly moreso (the dough was near the top of the bowl before I packed it in) Not nearly as much the second rise.

>>5029135
Yep, I cut the load right in half just to make sure.

Actually, that has nothing to with whether the salt is kosher or not. I prefer kosher because it's not idodized. But what you were saying has to do with the size of the salt crystals and nothing to do about it being kosher or not kosher.

Root cause analysis bubster.

>>5029195
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosher_salt

http://dinersjournal.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/04/28/warning-measure-your-salt/?_r=0

>>5029169
I'm stumped then, sorry.

So I haven't fucked around with sourdough bread in a while, last place I lived wasn't conducive to baking, so I decided I might as well give it another go. Just one problem, really, no sourdough starter.

I had about a tablespoon or two of some raw, unfiltered honey that was starting to crystallize, so in a glass jar I combined 70 grams of flour, 70 grams of water and 10 grams of the honey and stirred.

24 hours later no discernible change, stir thoroughly to maybe aerate a bit.

48 hours later, slightly sour aroma and taste, not sure if the bubbles I see are trapped air from stirring or signs of wild yeast activity.

Reckon I'll feed it again at 72 hours, hoping to get some obvious yeast activity here soon.

So I haven't fucked around with sourdough bread in a while and I decided I might as well give it another go. Just one problem, no sourdough starter.

I had about a tablespoon or two of some raw, unfiltered honey that was starting to crystallize, so in a glass jar I mixed 70 grams of flour, 70 grams of water and 10 grams of the honey, covered and put in a warm place.

24 hours later no discernible change, stir thoroughly to aerate a bit and maybe encourage yeast growth.

48 hours later, slightly sour aroma and taste, not sure if the bubbles I see are trapped air from stirring or signs of wild yeast activity.

Reckon I'll feed it again at 72 hours, hoping to get some obvious yeast activity here soon. If I'm lucky, it'll be a starter worth keeping (ie not taste like ass).

>>5029374
Update: hey neat, the starter doubled in volume overnight. Time to feed again and store in the fridge, I suppose.

>>5029952

Nope. It's not ripe until it can double in volume in about 4 hours. Three days isn't long enough to build up a colony of yeast.

Some no-knead breads.

1/3

2/3

3/3

Mixed white and wholemeal + sunflower seeds.

>>5029957
Ah, noted.

Yo, guys. Have a batch working on the last hour of proofing right now. Tried the pan of water in the oven, it gave me the rising I wanted but left the top slightly sticky. I'll put some pics up when it's done

Just pulled a loaf out of the oven with a really dense crumb. I think I use too much salt. Is 3 tsp way too much for 3 cups of flour?

>tfw you just like salty bread

>>5030793
Hey buddy, you have to let the bread cool before you start cutting it. When it's still hot, the starch isn't fully set and your knife is just going to mash the crumb together. But yeah, you've almost certainly got too much salt in that loaf assuming it doesn't have a shitload of other ingredients.

>salt
>3 tsp = 1 TBS
Yeah, hey that's too much salt. I'm going to assume that your 3 cups of flour weighs 1lb, 1.5oz. I'm also going to assume that you're using regular old table salt, so 3 tsp is going to weigh 2/3rds of an oz.

With those numbers in mind...

Flour 100%
Salt, table 3.82%

I usually keep the salt in the 1.75 to 2.75% range, note that the higher end of that scale is doughs with quite a lot of sugar and fat in them.

My advice? Cut the salt in half to 1.5 tsp if using table salt.

Also, buy a digital scale. I know it seems stupid, but measuring cups are such bullshit when you're dealing with a powder that easily compacts, like flour.

Finally, if you want to know more about those crazy numbers I was talking about, go check out https://www.kingarthurflour.com/professional/bakers-percentage.html

It's really easy, and it makes understanding recipes for bread doughs at a glance so fucking easy.

>>5019588
Man thats very fine for bread making, why did you use that?

>>5031069
>>5030793

Oh yeah, another awesome tool is http://tools.foodsim.com/

The calculator on the left side will convert all sorts of ingredients from mass to volume, or from volume to mass, and even takes into account the method you normally use to measure flour.

The calculator on the right allows you to figure out the mass of a mixture of flours, or the mixture of flours required to reach a certain gluten content. I never need it, but maybe you might.

>>5030793
I use 2 tsp for a 3 cup loaf. Don't mind all the people bitching about weights and measures. Just learn to read your dough and you'll never need a scale or measuring cup again (measuring cups are handy for consistency). If your bread is really dense you may have killed your yeast on accident.

>>5029952
>>5029957
Do you keep dough for a starter? I keep more of a sponge. It's runny batter consistency but it doesn't "grow" in size. I've known a lot of sourdough bakers but none of them have kept a dough starter, it's always been a spongeish starter. Pic related.

made my first bread (almost) all by myself earlier today

had to restart because i messed up the first batch, but after a lot of work on this one it came out pretty well

im probably gonna make another smaller batch on thursday just to makes sure i have the hang of it before i move onto any other recipes

>>5031089
>Don't mind all the people bitching about weights and measures.

I see a lot of people putting their absolute best effort into making bread on /ck/ and making brickloaves. You want to know the easy way to fix most of that? Weighing your shit. It's cheap, it's easier than dealing with measuring cups and spoons, and it fuckin' works right now by removing another variable that you can fuck up if you're just starting out.

>>5031114
That bread is the same color as library paste.

Something went wrong.

Go consult the picture at >>5021497

>>5031075

Actually, it is mainly a difference in gluten content that makes 00 flour special. It is on the low end of the spectrum. A bread flour will typically have a high gluten content, which will allow for a better crumb as it promotes the creation of pockets in the dough.

The more you know.

>>5031132
But it only takes a few loaves to figure out. The only weight measure that I ever used professionally was a 50 pound bag of flour, that doesn't always weigh 50 pounds. Being able to identify the different stages a dough goes through is the hat trick, and is only gained through experience. scales are pretty cheap now so do it if you want to

>>5031162
>it only takes a few loaves to figure out.
Says you. You know why nobody in this country bakes well at home? Because they're all giving and getting the same terrible advice like 'uh, mix stuff together until it feels right, that's the hat trick!'. Maybe you were a professional baker. Maybe that method worked for you, but it's a bullshit method if you're just learning.

Scales are cheap, they're widely available, and the sooner you start eliminating variables, the sooner you can start figuring out what really works and why.

>>5031216
> You know why nobody in this country bakes well at home?

Because they never do it and expect perfect results the first time and then get frustrated? People baked bread for thousands of years without scales. It's not Rocket surgery.

More interesting to me is the starter though. Dough or sponge?

>>5031231
It's not rocket surgery, but it is science.

>mfw professional baker doesn't know what the consistency of a 100% hydration paste is.

>>5031238
Sure is making assumptions in here. You have to walk before you can run and the hand loaf is the first step. Just because you had difficulty doesn't mean everyone does. Back to that thousands of years, we understand it as science now, but baking is a skill that can be learned. It is learned through experience.

>>5031263
I posted exactly how I created my starter, including how much water and flour.

You suggest that the best way to teach someone how to do the right thing is to encourage them to do it the wrong way until they 'figure it out' on their own.

I suggest that if you want to learn how to do something, learn how to do it right from the start, develop all that experiential learning, and then try doing it the hardest way possible.

You're going to have to excuse me if I think you're trolling.

>that feel when you get frustrated with failed breads

>fuck it lets wing it
>wing it
>loaf comes out of the oven looking great

fuck everything /ck/ why is it when i try i fail and when i don't i succeed

I've tried to bake bread many times but it always turns out shit, using a gas oven.
Don't know what I'm doing wrong, maybe I'll figure it out one day.

Just recently started making bread myself, and damn do I enjoy it. It's just so... relaxing, don't know why. Haven't done anything really crazy yet (just finished some decent baguettes, crust was crispy and it was tasty, but was pale, too much steam I think), but I've been looking into different things to try out.

Question to you all is, what's a good place to get bulk flour from at a lower cost? I've looked around but all I've found was places that ship in 50 bags of 50 pounds of flour, and that's just too much for me at one time.

>>5032025

Call the nearest grocery store with a bakery, or an actual bakery, ask to talk to whoever is in charge of ordering flour.

Ask very politely if it would be possible to have them tack another 50lb sack onto their next purchase, you're willing to pay up front and in cash.

>>5032025
>>5032204

You can try that with small pizza operators that actually make their own dough, you name it. If you're lucky someone's going to be cool.

>>5031949
>>5031922

Check out the pic at >>5021497 and save it, use it to help diagnose what went wrong with your loaves.

Keep notes. How long did you knead? How long did the loaves rise? Was the liquid warm or cold, etc.

Also consider buying a digital scale. If all you do is weigh flour (assuming that a cup of flour should weight about 4.5oz), you'll be eliminating the uncertainty of 'did I use too much flour or not enough?' that so often screws up people when just starting out.

Once you get the hang of making loaves successfully on a consistent basis, and know what the dough should look and feel like, then by all means consider eyeballing all your ingredients like some people.

Here's how /I/ usually make 'sandwich' bread:

Get out the ingredients and the scale.

Put the mixing bowl on the scale, press the 'tare' button that clears the weight of the bowl from the scale.

Put flour in the bowl until I've got enough.

At this point, I repeat the weighing process for the salt, sugar, yeast, fat and liquid because I like the control that gives me, but you DON'T have to. Volume works fine for sugar, salt, yeast and liquids, I just don't like cleaning measuring cups and spoons.

Mix the dough until everything is incorporated.

Knead the dough either in a machine or by hand, until it passes the 'window pane test' (picture related, google for details).

I place the dough in a clean, lightly oiled bowl and cover with plastic wrap, or a plastic grocery bag held on with a rubber band, whatever.

When the dough has doubled in size, I gently deflate the dough and turn it out onto my clean, lightly oiled work surface (I use PAM, because oil does a better job of preventing the dough from sticking without adding too much extra flour which can make your dough dense and dry).

I'll usually start preheating the oven about this time.

I shape my loaves, rolls, whatever and put them in a lightly oiled pan until they have again doubled in volume, and then into the oven they go.

>>5032504
I ran out of room, the loaves rise, gently covered with a lightly oiled piece of plastic wrap. The oil keeps the dough from sticking, and the plastic wrap keeps the dough from drying out.

Dry dough with an 'elephant skin' wont rise properly, and the crust wont be right when baked.

>>5032504

i thought they were panties from the way its being held

l-lewd

>>5032527
Dirty panty threads on /b/. So much inadequate wiping. Gah.

>>5032524
>Dry dough with an 'elephant skin' wont rise properly, and the crust wont be right when baked.
i get this problem a lot

>>5032524
>Dry dough with an 'elephant skin' wont rise properly, and the crust wont be right when baked.
i get this problem a lot, what is the solution to use while letting the dough rise? i saw someone just place a damp clean towel over the dough balls, one time

>>5032536
Plastic, foil, something impervious to air is definitely the way to go.

Something I've had to do a few times (when it is exceedingly cold and dry) is to put the shaped, panned dough in a cardboard box with a container of hot water to generate warmth and keep the humidity up.

>>5032539
>>5032552

I forgot to mention that I folded the box flaps in to maintain that warmth and humidity.

>>5032539
>>5032552

I forgot to mention that I folded the box flaps into the closed position to maintain that warmth and humidity.

Well it was the best-looking loaf I've ever made, but it was slightly undercooked and still super dense. I thin I slacked on the kneading. Oh well, another toast loaf it is.

>>5033466
bump

bread making noob here, is there a protocol when starting the yeast mixture?

i usually do water=>honey=>yeast then mix it for a bit, does mixing inhibit the yeast or should follow a different way when dealing with the yeast?

>>5019551
I don't like to heat my house enough in the winter to make bread rise properly. It feels like a wast of gas. Other then that I make bread like a fiend.

>>5034862
>does mixing inhibit the yeast or should follow a different way when dealing with the yeast?
I get my best bread by mixing 130 degree water, the other ingredients, and only one cup of however much flower I'm using for five minutes. I do this no matter what the recipe calls for because it always seems to make softer bread. I have no idea why.

I got a thing for rolls; more crust to them.

>>5019551
Looks good! I cant say for sure but maybe you could have thrown a bit more oil on? Crust looks a bit more like a regular bread crust rather than that great almost fried focaccia crust

>>5020061
Recipe plis

Anche mia madre la vuole

pls

I only make my own, I just received the Kifchenaid professional 600 mixer for Christmas and it does wonders for kneading dough.

I like using a pretzel recipe and making it into a big loaf of pretzel. I also do white yeast loaves, they're dense and taste amazing. Great with soups. I have to buy big jars of yeast because I make so much bread.

>>5020061
pls

>>5035062
Prepare for imminent destruction. I've trashed three of those KA 600s in the last 2 years. A few tips to maximize the longevity of your new mixer: avoid low hydration doughs, never make more than 1 loaf worth of dough of anything under 65% hydration, always mix at the lowest speed, and be sure to give your mixer cooldown breaks every 5 minutes of kneading.

Good luck!

>>5035498
why the hell do you keep buying KAs for stiff dough? they ain't made for it
wait, didn't you say (a while ago) that you finally got a hobart?

>>5035498

How would you rate the Cuisinart SM-55BC (5 1/2 quart, 800w, die cast metal) stand mixer or the Cuisinart SM70BC (7quart, 1000w motor, die cast metal)? I was looking for something with metal parts instead of shitty plastic ones like newer basic kitchenaids have and something with 800w or stronger motor. I just can't afford shelling out over $400 for a stand mixer for some of the better commercial grade stand mixers.

>>5035541
I had a Hobart A200 for a while. Sometimes I didn't want to make 6 loaves of bread, and the Hobart has a large minimum capacity. Dropping $200 or so on a KA600 when they went on sale a couple times a year wasn't a big deal. I've since moved to a Globe SP10, and I love it.

>>5035570
Honestly, there haven't been any residential mixers that have met my needs. Abandon all hope, ye who enter here.

>>5035617

My mom is getting me a KitchenAid "Classic" for Christmas. How fucked am I?

>>5035631

That's better than mixing by hand...

>>5035631
they're good, they're just not made for mixing stiff dough for an hour on a regular basis, like bread enthusiasts tend to do
it's like towing a small trailer behind a civic
can be done, run some risks, but is fine so long as it's not all the time and done with caution

>>5035674
>>5035632

Well I make like two loaves per week so I guess I should be good.

>>5034879
Well, couldn't you buy one of those heating pad things? And like wrap it around whatever bowl your dough is in, to make it rise? That might work.

god fucking mother fucking dammit

im an excellent baker, everyone says my cookies are the best they've ever had. i get everything right the first time.

but fuck me in my b-hole i cannot into bread making. ive tried 3-4 loaves and they all have something wrong with them, not to mention the last one i just tried was a complete failure. im going to have to read a book or something

>>5035934

Bread Baker's Apprentice. It will teach you how to make great bread.

>>5035934
Or if you want to keep it easy, "Artisan Bread in 5 Minutes a Day" is an amazing book. It's on tpb.