/ck/ - Food & Cooking

>>16205247
Depends on how it was stored, vintage, etc. I had a 30 y.o champagne that tasted great. Ive had 30 y.o red wine that tasted like grandmas ****. Why dont you try some yourself and find out?

>>16205247
It depends. Most wines need a few years minimum. Many great wines improve and gain new flavors over the span of 30-100 years.

>>16205247
I'm not hyper-mega-knowledgeable about wines, but I picked up some stuff here and there.
Most old wine is actually worse than vinegar, since it is 'cassé' (uhh... 'shattered', I guess?). At least with vinegar you can make something like shrub or sekanjabin out of it.
Wine that can actually age is pretty rare. White/rose wine generally doesn't age well (except if it's dessert or fortified), red wine is a dice roll. That champagne wouldn't taste anything like you'd expect champagne to taste. All the CO2 is gone.

>>16205280
poor

>>16205247
Older vines produce better tasting grapes. Darker reds thrive with aging

>>16205247
Shes actually drinking champagne in that pic, doesnt age as well as wine. Still I find whiskey ages better than wine. Wine just needs to clarify.

no we've been trolling you for 2 millennia.
fucking dumbass.

>>16205319
more like 7 milennia

Male wine drinker here. It’s funny buying a good Bordeaux. I usually get asked who I’m buying it for, Wife? Mother? Sister? Surely it can’t be for yourself. Then when I tell it’s for me, I get a shocked look. They recover and decide to ‘play along’ with me. Then they start telling me lots of things I know I about wine.
It’s at this point, if I can be bothered, I go through their shelves and tell them all the ones I’ve tasted and why I like them or not. Which regions I prefer, big up Marlborough, and why I’m not a fan of Californian and 100% prefer Spanish.
Now is when I think they feel bad. Because they always offer me loads of samples. I can usually free taste like 4/5 different ones min on every visit.
Having said that met a really nice man last time through the airport who was giving out Schlumberger samples. We had a great chat. He was awesome.
Now girls at bars when you order a large white find you immediately intriguing. They watch you take a sip. I think they are waiting to see if you make a face. When you look pleased then they have their in to strike up a conversation.
I don’t know a lot of other male wine drinkers but I wish I did. I can only go on so many tasting sessions with girls.

>>16205364
Tl;dr

>>16205247
older wines have radically different flavor profiles--most of the fruitiness of young wine disappears and you're left with things like leather, potpourri, almond/walnut, etc. Tannins are also in a constant state of binding and rebinding with each other, and the larger chains will gradually fall out of suspension over time--old wines typically have quite a bit of sediment collected at the bottom. The result is the moutfeel of the wine changes from mouth-gripping like black tea that was steeped too long to something a bit silkier

>>16205319

are you the Jew?

>>16205247
wow her face

that's quite a face/jaw/neck/head shape

like, dang

>>16205439
wait thats mia khalifa????? wow she got some AMAZING work done thats like the best work ive ever seen, made her artistic

>>16205401
>from mouth-gripping like black tea that was steeped too long
Is it bad that I rather enjoy this?

>>16205465
I don't even understand what that means.

>>16205465
not at all, everyone is going to enjoy things differently. get some nebbiolo, sagrantino, aglianico or tannat if you want big grippy tannins

>>16205439
>>16205445
The irony is getting too many levels deep for me. Just to be clear, this is a terrible angle and terrible makeup on a completely average arab woman

>>16205531
She has nice hair though.

>>16205531

Nah, she's gorgeous and you're gay

bro... I want a bottle of wine...

>>16205364

Based and Grindr-pilled.

Every wine can improve with few months.
Most non trash wine get better after 1-2 years.
Anything more than that and it depends.

>>16205531
>Just to be clear,

the way 16 year old incels write, like you're telling other people something.

>>16205569
skin too dark, Ahmed.

what kind of wine should I get from the store... budget $110

>>16205247
That's a man

>>16205247
Uhh, when people say "it's a 1999 Rioja" is not about the wine being old, but because the wine from whatever year is supposed to have been a particular good one.

Wine goes through aging, but it's 5 years tops (2 in a barrel and another 3 in the bottle). This is called Reserve/Reserva wine. It's usually consider better than wines with less aging, but it's a matter of taste. Reserves taste stronger, more complex, nuttier and get some taste from the barrel.

>>16205586
I am telling you something nigger: This cakeface arab whore is disgusting and if you are attracted to her you have pathetically low standards

How does new wine factories make money if they have to wait 5 years to 100 years before they can start selling?

>>16205736
You need about 5 years before you can obtain something usable (albeit in need of heavy rectification, or even chaptalization) out of the vineyard.

There are things you can do with the grapes before that, ex. produce grape juice, or purified grape syrup, or some sort of grape molasses, or make bunk wine and distill it into industrial alcohol, or make vinegar, extract various acids (malic, tartric), tannins etc.

>>16205640
bump
how would you spend $110 right now shopping for wine

>>16205519
Nice, thanks for the suggestion. I like them with creamy and peppery sauces. Anything else they're supposed to particularly go with?

>>16205510
>I don't even understand what that means.
Like a dry or almost grainy feeling on your tongue, as if your mouth was really dehydrated. Minus the discomfort.

>>16205247
Not all wine can age for a long time and the stuff that can will be more expensive. However, even considering a properly expensive and aged wine... To the average consumer who just wants a fruity sugary alcopop then they will absolutely taste worse. It is definitely an acquired taste and it is up to the individual if they are invested in acquiring it.

>>16205810
What is in the store? I like the Kamen cab sav in that price range but I have to get it shipped. The Kashmirs are excellent but they push $200.

>wine

>>16205851
I go to a corporate store called abc in florida (it's not the same as abc stores up north which I think are govt controlled)
it's kind of like total wine but not quite as big

you would spend the whole $110 on one bottle?

>>16205874
Oh I misread the question. I would buy a bunch of bottles. I like the Cline Zinfandels and the Landmark Chardonays.

>>16205247
You can't just age any wine, nor can you compare different harvests.

Yes you can age champagne and white wine and get a better result.

Aging only works if your harvest fits the bill. Which is easier for reds, then whites, then bubbles. Rosé doesn't age.

>>16205810
20 dollars on a box of either cab sav or pinot noir
the rest on gay sex

God I hate women

>>16205780
>>16205736
In your second year you can already have grapes good enough to make decent cheap bottles or bulk wine, depending on the climate.

You also REALLY don't need long ageing for most wines, stuff like 10+ years aged is just a small niche.

>>16205247
Did you mean vinegar?

>>16206007
>Rosé doesn't age.
Rosè could age if people didn't care so much about it looking bright and lively.

>>16206123
sex. have it.

Wow, super old champagne looks like diarrhea.
Aged wines are overrated & overpriced. 98% of the reds peaks at 4-8 years max.

>>16206007
Chateau clibone, vina tondobia rose, domain tempier, and even blush zinfandel from montebello are all roses that age well.

>>16205586
>incel
Tongue my anus nigger

>>16206156
No

>>16206173
90% of wine purchased is consumed within 4 hours

>>16205364
>intriguing
Murrika? Because in Europe, even here in Germany, nobody bets an eye when you out yourself as wine-only.

>>16205519
What's a good red if, unlike that anon, I hate the grippy tannins?

It's just fermentation length preference.

>>16205247
She has potential but I think she'd be less clocky if she didn't put on so much makeup. The high contrast lipstick makes her long philtrum very prominent, that combined with the overstyled hair makes her look more like a drag queen than a woman. Also the excessive eye makeup draws undue attention to her interpupillary distance, and the fingernails just yikes. I'll bet she's wearing heels too, poor thing :(

>>16205531
You're corect and only a gay pretending to be straight or a drunk finna get his Johnson johnsucked would argue with your correct statement. Based.

>>16205247
Dunno. I have a bottle of strawberry wine I bottled in 2017. It tasted like strawberry bubblegum when I last tasted it (in 2018). Will open it next weekend and see how it developed. Recommend me a food pairing.

>>16206310
>less clocky
What the fuck are you on about mate

>>16206539
blue cheese

>MM YES
>OLD WINE
>THIS TASTES LIKE LEATHER, OAK, RUSTY NAILS
>JUST LIKE GRANDFATHER'S WORKBENCH I BIT INTO WHEN HE FUCKED MY TIGHT ASS

Old wine is a bigger meme than "fresh", and tastes even worse.

>>16205247
It tastes worse to new drinkers and better to old drinkers.
From my own tasting experience I think it doesn't take long until you're looking for a wine with flavors that stick out, which you will see with older wine.
That said if you age cheap wine you just straight up lose flavor with time.

>>16205401
Sounds like an argument in favor of Solera wine over purely aged stock.

>>16206143
Rosé is not even real wine

>>16206310
>She has potential
She's a whore and her nudes are easy to find.

>>16207321
Does she have a big dick? She looks like she has a big dick.

>>16205315
So much nonsense in one post

Good quality champagne ages extremely well, often 50+ years
Champagne IS wine
Whiskey doesn't age at all once it's bottled, it's a distilled product and is essentially inert save possibly degradation from UV exposure
Wine won't clarify with age, that's a process that's applied to it pre-bottling

>>16205247
To answer your question, OP, it really depends on the wine. Most wine produced is intended to drink young- within a few years at most of production. Of the remainder, most only benefits from short-term (5-10 years) cellaring. But some can develop over substantial amounts of time, occasionally over 50 years. Honestly, though, the development of flavors in a wine with a lot of age is something not everyone is into anyway. The fruit flavors tend to recede, the acid becomes more subtle and the tannins softer and smoother; you get more dried fruit, nutty flavors, and tertiary flavors like tea, leather, earth etc.

>>16205364
Wow, Anon, you are are impressive. I'm impressed.

>>16205364
>everyone replying seriously to this pasta
/ck/ isn't the same anymore

>>16207662
>occasionally over 50 years
You run into problems with this. Standards were lower back then, sometimes so much so that even with the aging it's worse than something new.

>>16207164
fun fact, most champagne operates on a reserve system not dissimilar to a solera, the vast majority by volume is non-vintage because the new vintage is blended with older vintages to preserve consistency

the argument against this/soleras is when you have a really great year, you want to showcase it singularly. The old-world ethos is that each year should be tasted individually as a joint effort between farmers, wine-makers, and mother nature

Many wines are made to be drank new. Big red wines with lots of tannic acids from the grape skins take time to mellow out.

>>16205364
People react the same way with me, except I only drink cum.

>>16208037
>consistency
I'm not that concerned about consistency, but "the fruitiness of young wine" is quite desirable, and "leather, potpourri, almond/walnut, etc" is desirable in small proportion / as a complexity addition, but certainly not at the cost of all fruitiness.
This is more of a concern for whisky though, where stating the youngest constituent or not offering an age statement brings down perceived value even though it would theoretically result in a better product.

>>16205319
Kek

>>16205280
>****
wow

Old champagne is definitely a meme, who the fuck are you people saying it's good? It's fucking trash and everyone knows it.

>>16205247
read The Billionaire's Vinegar

>>16208543
It's no different from gambling, honestly. You have a very low chance of getting something good, and a very high chance of ending up with some disgusting sink-drain candidate.

really old wines taste like crap 90+% of the times.
unless you just like to collect sealed bottles, it's always better to drink your wine within 10-15 years max, otherwise you risk ruining it. I am talking about great expensive bottles, most run-of-the-mill wines, even if pretty good, are not really suited for aging.
In case of champagne even less: drink it in a couple years max if you want to appreciate the perlage.

>>16205308
>That champagne wouldn't taste anything like you'd expect champagne to taste. All the CO2 is gone.

30yr bottles have plenty of carbonation

>>16206249

Pinot Noir

>>16205247
I didn't recognise her without the glasses and the cock in her mouth.

Some wine gets better with age, and some definitely doesn't.

>>16205319
The world accepted the earth as the center of the universe for millenia. It's time for a new Galileo to expose your mom science.

>>16205247
A few years ago I was at Ridge and some dipshit walked in, bought a 87 Montebello (one of the famous CA vs France wines that pushed CA to victory), drank half of the $1000 library wine, and just fucked off. The staff discreetly inquired around as to who was interested, and I got a full standard glass of 87 Montebello (we were drinking CURRENT YEAR - 3 Montebello). My wife didn’t like it, at all.

I took some time to try to understand it. The best way I can put it, is that it ages in a blue cheese direction. You either like that direction or you don’t. Once you have that mental framework, everything really opens up. You are drinking basically a 30 year labor of love, at tremendous human cost; the growing, barreling, bottling, and ideal condition cave storage for 30 years. Not something to be taken lightly, even if it were shit— just the continuity itself is an amazing achievement.

When you sink into a glass of it, over some time, it just starts unlocking a story you cannot opt out of. It’s like when a roller coaster goes click-click-click as you’re going up. The only people who know how it goes are people who have taken the ride before. Some complexity is pleasant, some is challenging, and with an old wine, suddenly you are not the master of it. The wine is, and it may just buck you off back onto the desert sands. Or you may just hold on to tell the tale.

I held on, learned some things, appreciated the ride, but my wife got bucked off and ran away crying. Is there a lesson here? Probably not.

>>16205280
>****
Hi, grandma.

>>16205284
Most wines get worse with age.

The amount of fucking retards in this thread I swear to god.

>>16205247
Wine tasting is an absolute meme as proven time and time again, but old wines do taste worse to 95% of people.

>>16209165
The lesson here is that the wine was shit, you're autistic and your wife has more common sense than you.
Stop trying to pretend at sophistication because you scored a single free glass of overpriced shit from someone richer than you.

>>16209165
cringe

No, it's purely meant as a status symbol.

>>16205247
Is that Champagne even chilled?

>>16205831
red meat, especially with plenty of fat like roast lamb shoulder

>>16206249
pinot noir is the most obvious choice but prices are pretty inflated. otherwise try: grenache, gamay, merlot, frappato, zweigelt, st laurent

>>16205247
yeah, as it ages it loses alcohol content (don't quote me on this), becomes sweeter, develops different flavours

>>16209165
please tell me this is pasta

>>16209165
Congratulations! You made the absolute gayest post ITT!

>>16205308
You just get a very soft and smooth carbonation, it's pretty unique really

>>16205712
Post your gf right now

>>16206546
He thinks she's trans for some reason lmao

Well I think he knows that she isn't but has posted some elaborate bait using incel language

>>16205247
Who is she? She is my ideal gf.

>>16209651
shazia sahari

>>16206243
>Murrika?
obviously. in the civilised world it's normal to drink wine

>>16205284
>Many great wines improve and gain new flavors over the span of 30-100 years.
lmao, wtf? Such a fucking meme. You're just going off stupid headlines that hit the news every now and then of some rich faggots buying ancient bottles of wine that people discover. If extremely old wine was such an improvement, people would have already started building very long term aging facilities. Just because a bottle could in theory last a 100+ years doesn't mean it gets better with time. Its optimum drinking window is way past its prime.

>>16210175
I'm talking from experience not from a news article. Many great wines, like first growth bordeaux, retain power and freshness with age, but the tannins and acidity smooth out, so you get very big, complex flavors that are gentle in texture as well. If you had these wines when they were too young the tannins would be overpowering. The classic saying is an iron fist in a velvet glove.
Many wineries actually do keep old stock of all their vintages. They will occasionally release aged bottles and they fetch a premium because their provenance is essentially as good as it gets.
I've had a tokaji from 1929 and it was incredibly good not a single thing wrong with the taste. Sweet wines transform into something only attainable through a long aging process.

I wouldn't waste old wine on a woman

>>16205247
Old wine is a meme.
All wine has a shelf life which you can tell usually by the colour.
If it doesn't have that cherry dark red it's spoiled. It goes brown.
Most old wines use cork which means air and fluids can exchange.
Fluids touching the cork can cause breakdown also.
Screw tops improve shelf life but most wine snobs frown upon them as cheap.
Modern preservatives also extend shelf life.
Some age favourably and may develop a port like taste most do not.
Most modern expensive wines mature around the 5year mark
Honestly aldi wine is just as good and can be had straight away.

>>16209165

scrolled this whole fucking thread hoping to see some booba. am disappoint, with myself mostly

>>16205247
It isn't really the fact that's it's old, it's based on the vineyard/location and the year. If 1997 was a great growing year for grapes in Champagne France then bottles of wine from that year and place will be sought after. If you're under the impression "older == better" then you're over simplifying it. My parents had some nice bottles from a German brand that were made in 1980 something, and we opened one last year and it was atrocious because the cork had deteriorated and spoiled the wine. We opened another one that hadn't spoiled and it was very meh. A lot of the time it isn't until years later that someone says "Hey that bottle was really good" and starts buying bottles from that year and place that it gets popular.

>>16211372
Actually no it really is about old. Even in a superb vintage drinking it right away you're basically pissing your money away.

And it's not a mystery which wines will be good later, this isn't the 1600s anymore.

>>16211565
depends on the region, there are plenty of premium new-world wines that can be drank immediately

hell, I'd say the majority of napa wines can't withstand 10 years these days. Blame Silver Oak.

>>16211332
>>>/s/

>>16212108
>depends on the region, there are plenty of premium new-world wines that can be drank immediately
You're arguing about something else entirely now.

>>16205736
>whatareloans.mp4

>>16205247
>>16205280
I only drink old Muscat or Topaque, otherwise it's cheap wine all the way, vintages only matter if you are after that select year people rant about

>>16205247
I was part of a wine club where people who knew way more about wine than I ever will bought discount bottles that could be skunked or could be excellent, and through that club I tried several wines that were valued at well over $1k a bottle, but in my experience unless you have a palate for it you can tell that a wine is very good but you can't appreciate a wine of that value unless you're regularly consuming glasses/bottles of wine in the hundred dollar range. In other words, the best wine was wasted on me.

>>16213169
This is very true in my experience. The quality of the oak, the texture of the tannins, the freshness and power of a wine. Hard to know without trying a lot of good stuff and some decent stuff to understand the spectrum.
I would argue that sweet and semi sweet wines are so much more approachable that even a beginner wine drinker would be able to really appreciate an expensive and/or aged one. Not as much as someone with knowledge and experience, but still. A high quality auslese is basically the greatest fruit juice in the world, so it will be somewhat familiar to anyone who has had juice before where a first growth bordeaux doesn't really have that.

>>16205736
Is this just a setup for your punchline?

>>16210175
>people would be building facilities for aging
that's probably why they've built facilities for long term aging you stupid fucking cunt

>*clears throat*
Hello gentlemen.

>>16210175
embarrassing

>>16205315
>>16205280
past 10 years the better taste is pure placebo

>>16205364
>

For me, it's the best bumwine with an astonishing price of 10,20€ (12,46$ in burger currency)