/ck/ - Food & Cooking

>>14898978
Is there a rule saying they always have to make this face? Why...

>>14899007
Marketing basically. Look at the app store too, all the games have someone screaming.

>>14898978
Because it doesn't taste the same despite what you oniongargling faggots try to lead us to believe.

>>14898978
People who eat meat still have an ego and do not want to be reminded that eating meat kills something.

>>14898978
listen buddy im vegan and I think meat substitues suck, its like drinking decaf

>>14898978
Why would you want to eat meat if you’re vegan? I thought plants were these magical amazing foods that you should love?
Why don’t regular people try to make meat based lettuce or meat based carrots?

>>14899019
Eating plants kill things too. You know plants are alive right? You know they have to kill all the bugs and birds and rodents who would naturally eat the plants in the fields right?

>>14898978
Why is there so much backlash over cynanide as an almond alternative. If it taste the same and better for the environment, there is no reason not to eat it.

>Why is there so much backlash over genocide alternatives? If it kills the same and better for the environment, there is no reason not to enact it.

>>14899035
Because its not for vegans, it's to try and convert non-vegans. Or at least normalise meat alternatives in a slippery slope weening off animal protein.

>>14899181
Bullshit, it might be used as argument over and over again by vegans but they are still the people that eat it the most.

>>14898978
It doesn't taste the same. Nowhere near the same. Some of the "meat replacements" I've tried taste okay, but they definitely don't taste like meat.
Plus it's at least twice as expensive.

>>14898978
People are worried that meat “alternatives” will stop being alternatives and they will be made to eat them, either through increasing taxes on meat itself or meat farming. And no, this isn’t unfounded. A methane tax on cattle farming has been proposed several times.

>>14899303
We should tax things based on the actual cost of production + environmental impact.
Why should farmers get subsidies?

>>14899303
implying thats a bad thing

>>14899311
All tax is theft.

To answer your question, it is because of Monsanto’s gmos requiring a debt based economy from farmers to stay competitive and keep costs even close to profits. Unfortunately, Monsanto is a giant corporation that has the means to lobby for insane tax breaks on itself, which means that the tax burden is pushed onto the farmers.

>>14899303
Kind of the way taxpayers are “made to” fund cattle ranchers and chicken farmers through subsidies? Please don’t tell me you believe a burger costs $2.

>>14899311
>We should tax things
Stopped reading, started cringing

>>14899365
See >>14899363
Because the giant companies such as Monsanto are paying almost no tax, the burden is pushed to farmers who simply would not be able to afford being a farmer without subsidies.

>>14898978
I know this is a worthless thread, but you've displayed it yourself. There are three main reasons here. First, it's that we're told over and fucking over that you can't tell the difference between fake and real. You can with every product out there. Every fucking one of them. Beyond Meat doesn't emulate real meat exactly.

Second, people act like there's some sort of morality to eating it. Don't push your gay lifestyle choices on other people. Finally, they act like it's healthier when it's still processed junk.

>>14899381
I'm vegan but I refrain from revealing that in public because I can't stand the vegan movement and the mentality behind it.

I like the impossible meat just fine, but it's hard to buy it at $12 a pound when whole chuck is $3 a pound

>>14899386
I mean, if it naturally comes up, there's no problem. The problem is there's nearly no natural time for it to come up. And anyone who tries pushing their shit out of context is insufferable.

>Hey yeah, I'll take a coors
What, you drink domestic? Hah, pleb.

Look at how much more water cows milk takes to produce compared to almond and rice milk!
:^)
Debunk this vegan haters! You cant just like you cant disprove global warming.

>>14899399
what about eating at a restaurant?

>>14899399
Yes, only when it's necessary I'll mention it. Like if someone offers me something I know I don't eat, I'll just tell them I'm vegan. Unless someone who already knows im vegan starts telling other people i'm vegan, but that's out of my control.

>>14899406
I usually just prepare beforehand and check if there's anything a restaurant can do that is made vegan, and i'll just ask them to omit anything that isn't vegan, without outright saying "oh i'm vegan, can you do this this this and that for my dish?" I also understand that there are some people who are just mean for no reason, and some people hate vegans and like to mess with them for no reason.

>>14899406
You order what you want. I doubt >>14899408 is really going to be the guy who makes everyone else change their plans because of him. It's all contextual. If there's discussion about where to eat, you chip in a place that has options for you. If it's already pre-planned, you fucking make do. Nobody wants to hear, "Oh, I know you guys were planning on going to a steakhouse, but I can only eat like two sides there. Let's go to the place I want to go instead."

>>14899303
I’m happy about this, your days are numbered meatcucks

>>14898978
Soy it's not better for the environment or it is more ethical if you really now how much it takes to produce it

>>14899405
I flushed my out-of-date toilet from the 1970s for every word in your post. Checkmate, vegans.

>>14899414
that makes sense, seems like alot of work though, usually we just kinda randomly pick a place to eat when we're roaming around the city, I feel like my friends would make fun of me for not eating meat at a restarunt, thats why I just them im vegan so they expect me to order shit like tofu

>>14898978
I eat meat for the nutrution. I wouldn't eat it if I didn't need it. My body is a temple.

>>14899424
Unless it's for a birthday party, my family is usually very accommodating to make sure there's at least one dish I can eat.

>>14899443
Well in my local area I already know which restaurants have what, so I only do that if it's a new place. Thankfully I live in an area that has vegan restaurants, so unless I'm eating out with other people I don't really need to worry if there's going to be something for me to eat.

just clogged the toilet in my apartmet complex after eating 1kg of metamucil take that meatcucks
>>14899445
name one nutrient you NEED from meat that actually comes from meat

>>14899460
B12

>>14899460
Testosterone

>>14899462
they add b12 to the meat retard, it doesnt come from meat it comes from bacteria, NEXT
>>14899466
pretty sure you're getting mostly estrogen

>>14898978
spergs are tendie connoisseurs. you try serving them fake tendies and see what shit they do in retaliation

>>14899472
Why is it okay to plants?

>>14898978
But I want to have the bone

>>14899472
Yeah you don't know how B12 is produced and how humans consume it, probably because your brain doesn't work properly eat some meat of an animal that produce it and when your brain fog reduces talk to me, """""next"""" (;

>>14899493
can you rephrase your question?

>>14899499
Why it is """"""""ethical"""""""" to eat plants?

>>14899472
Meat. Nutrition science is only half understood. Mistakes are being made every day in the science. I eat what my ancient ancestors survived on, and those mistakes are obviated.

>>14899499
Why is eating an oyster any different from an ethical perspective than eating lettuce?

>>14899519
I've convinced vegans to eat oysters because they're basically meaty plants that do wonders for the ecosystem. We should all eat more oysters.

My only problem with vegan substitutes is the ones made with soy. Any one who think that bean is remotely vegan is a brain dead who eats mass produced overly processed shit.

>>14899379
>>14899366
>>14899365
Oops. Your stolen money is going to farmers already.

>>14899534
Yes. Mexican jumping beans clearly have sapience.

>>14899500
seething
>>14899511
your ansestors ate mostly starch with meat on occasion
>>14899508
if we accept that we have to eat something, personally id rather eat something that doesnt scream out in pain when it dies, I never tried to justify veganism from an eithcal perspective though
>>14899519
idk I never looked into the whole oyster thing, I never liked seafood anyway, just seems unnecessary to eat

>>14899556
Ha. It tells you don't know Jack shit about soy production.
Soy is the worst crap for the soil it takes all nutrients for other plants. Fuck ups rotation circles. Requires a shit ton of pesticides and GMO to grow properly because anything can kill it. Those pesticides kills not only the insects that would be a "menace" to it, but small animals who live near the farms and had nothing to do with it. People who work with those pesticides have to use HAZMAT suits to grow a fucking plant. Because those pesticides are so toxic that if you don't you gonna get cancer or some respiratory problem. But what happens with people who live near those farms? They don't know that. So they get sick anyways. Kids are born retarded or malformed. People grow tumors. Forest are cut down to grow this shit.
So tell me what's good for the environment or ethical about it? Go on. Teach me oh superior first world vegan.
T. I live in a shithole who grow it and know first hand how shit and unethical soy is.
But yeah go ahead show me how is vegan.

>>14899598
how does organic soy exist then?

>>14899573
There are plenty of plants which respond negatively to damage and there are plenty of animals which don't "scream out." It sounds like you're saying that it's just your preference to not eat meat.

>>14899598
>not realizing it was a joke
You can make your argument for nearly all produce.

>>14899607
Organic doesn't mean that pesticides aren't used.

>>14899311
Food production is a national security issue. If we go to war with Mexico we’ll be fucked if we’ve outsourced all the farming to them. Yeah we subsidize corn like crazy but at least it’s our corn.

>>14899047
not to mention automatic harvesting machines kill millions of ground dwelling rodents and moles. Truthfully if you want to go the "every life is equal" faggotry, its actually likely your vegan diet has taken MORE life.

>>14899620
Yeah palm oil isn't vegan either. If we go to the root of veganism ideology you shouldn't eat shit

>>14899607
You are brain dead. Please don't talk to me anymore

>>14899405
Now go ahead and get me those figures on growing the actual almonds and get back to me fagbag.

>>14899531
Yeah, I wish people put more thought into why they're vegan instead of just "hurting animal bad." For instance, I'm mostly vegetarian, though I support hunting and will eat hunted meat. The conservation of land is more important than the conservation of individuals that are mostly out of the breeding pool anyway and that would quickly overpopulate since natural predators such as wolves were removed, just for an example.

>>14899620
>Organic doesn't mean that pesticides aren't used.
ok, that wasnt meant to be a gotcha or something, im just curious b/c they have orgainc tofu at my local supermarket
>It sounds like you're saying that it's just your preference to not eat meat
yeh thats correct, I never said in the thread that other people should be vegan, I just responded to somone that said they need meat in their diet for "nutrients"
>>14899641
yes but we have to eat something (well I guess we dont have to, but we do if we want to survive) so we may as well reduce the amount of suffering while where here, I just dont understand why somone would eat meat when its an unessercary addition to the diet

>>14899553
Are you genuinely incapable of thinking more than one step ahead? The money wouldn't need to be stolen at all if there were no taxes period - which would make the food be worth its actual value - or if Monsanto paid its actual tax burden - which would obviate the need for subsidies since farmers could compete without paying into their debt based near monopoly.

Or are you agreeing with me? I legitimately do not know what point you're trying to make.

>>14899657
People are really removed from what they eat or how the world really functions. There's some tweet from a journalist where they are amazed at how nature makes all of those crazy geometrical patterns that you can see while you fly overhead. They had no idea what farmland was.

>>14899640
Do you not understand that food is grown to feed cows as well? Ground dwelling rodents and moles are killed with this too. Fewer animals still die on a vegetarian diet.

>>14899663
Including "suffering" in there does make an ethical argument, you know. You're empathizing with animals that share qualities with you and judge their lives to contain "more suffering" if extinguished than, say, a mushroom's.

ITT: Farm suckling faggots
Grow your own crops
Hunt your own animals
Everything outside of this lifestyle is a detriment to the environment and isn't worth bitching at each other about.

>>14899663
I get that and as I said in the first post my only real problem with vegan substitutes is soy. Soy isn't ethical or vegan to consume neither palm oil
I like seitan tho as an example I had tasted some good dishes with it

>>14899379
>>14899363
interesting.. never heard of Monsanto before, now today I got it from this thread twice, and from >>14897373 by watching the video
honestly, what should I do, lads? The world seems so bleak after the revelation. I'm already consuming only about 300kcal a day, and a small meal every 2 or 3 days, but what else can I do to improve things? I feel so powerless

>>14898978
>people get angry over food they will never eat in their lives.
welcome to /ck/

>>14899405
Creating almond-milk doesn't require much water, creating almonds however:

https://www.paesta.psu.edu/podcast/how-much-water-does-it-really-take-grow-almonds-paesta-podcast-series-episode-43
>>"To grow one almond requires 1.1 gallons of water, and to grow a pound takes 1,900 gal/ lb[1]. The crazy thing about that is that walnuts, hazelnuts, pistachios, and cashews all use roughly the same amount of water to grow as well, but it is the almond which is in such high demand at this time. Currently, California is in the midst of a 5 year drought that has everyone looking at the nut industry to blame. Because people are buying more almonds and nuts in general, farmers are shifting towards growing more of them, which can lead to pointing the blame at them for the water crisis in California. And because of the drought, the price per pound of almonds has gone way up to $6 a pound, as opposed to $2 a pound back in 2010 [2]. This gives farmers even more incentive to grow them, even with the water crisis going on."


https://newrepublic.com/article/125450/heres-real-problem-almonds
>>"sucks up 15 percent of the state’s (California's) irrigation water"

>>14899709
That's not even true, either. If everyone did grow their own food, it would be terribly inefficient and still bad for the environment. Economies are scale are better, but there has to be proper market forces to necessitate efficient allocation of resources. Water is relatively cheap, so wasting it to ensure crop success is economically viable.

If anything, the advocation for hunting/farming is one of quality over environmentalism.

>>14899737
TICK-TOCK, MEXITARDS. YOUR CONTRACTUAL WATER TRANSFER IS DUE THIS YEAR, AND YOU'RE 430 MILLION CUBIC METRES OF WATER IN DEBT TO THE BIG BURGER BOYS.

>>14899709
Pretty much yeah
It is better for the environment to eat seasonal vegetables and anything that is not capable of growing naturally on your country or the season you are on, you shouldn't be eating.

>>14899742
Imagine if everyone was forced to grow their own food to survive. Imagine how much smaller and more maintainable the population would be.
Imagine.

>>14899709
>grow your own crops
Time to go clear a native grassland, spray pesticides over the environment, unleash my cats to control the mice, run a massive mechanical tiller and combine harvester that spews co2 into the atmosphere and requires rare earth elements from around half the world because it's all computer-controlled nowadays and pretend I'm doing better for the environment.

>>14899742
You know you can use rain water for growing food right? Well water too. If everyone use state regulated ™ water yeah it would be bad for the environment but you are not thinking clearly

>>14899772
Embracing non-starter genocide ideas is the biggest form of cope artistry around when concerning the environment.

>>14899773
Bruh. You can grow vegetables for a family without having to use anything mechanical, pesticides, or fertilizers.
You really are braindead and big farmpilled.

>>14899796
>You can grow vegetables for a family without having to use anything mechanical, pesticides, or fertilizers.
Spoken like a true urbanite. Nobody does the everything manual farmstead LARP you idealize in practice. Go out into the countryside and see how things are actually done, faggot.

>>14899699
I guess but have to come up with some kind of understanding of what suffering is, it makes sense to me to base our understanding of what suffering is based on our own expriance, we cant really know/understand things outside of our lived expriance and so we can't really make a prescriptive claim based on a lack of understanding, like you cant tell me "dont eat vegetables beacuse plants suffer" because we dont really know if they do or not, or we can't sypmathise with their pain or make sense of it if it exists, but we do know that animals suffer to a certian degree, since we understand that then it makes sence to not want to engage in it if your goal is to reduce suffering

>>14899699
>You're empathizing with animals that share qualities with you and judge their lives to contain "more suffering" if extinguished than, say, a mushroom's.
This line of argumentation leads to solipsism. Other people are animals that share qualities with you and you judge their lives to contain more suffering if extinguished over a plant.

>>14899803
>Go out into the countryside and see how things are actually done, faggot.
not him but
aren't those farms owned by big companies that just want profit? it's a no brainer that they would use things to accelerate production
also, take it easy

>>14899803
Nigger I grew up on a homestead because my parents are rightwing nutjobs.
Every spring through fall we were tending to the garden daily. We planned our crops for proper rotation and growing times. We were basically canning every single week.
In the fall we would hunt and process the animals, using every bit, even the bones after stock were burned and turned into a sort of fertilizer.
How about you go see how it's done, you massive faggot.

>>14899814
>everything in the countryside is big agra
So yes, this is an urbanite LARP thread. None of you will ever create your perfect forest garden permaculture homestead that lives in harmony with naturr.

>>14899824
>rightwing nutjobs
>describes a hippy commune
doubt

>>14899803
You are not growing to sell but consume, yes you need something to kill plague and shit but you can do that organic too, I have a book someone gave me for when she was studying botanic and it teaches you how to do that with out using heavy toxic chemicals.
As i repeat it is only for small scale farming like you and a family of 4*
Obviously not mass production

>>14899828
why are you being hostile for no reason? i was asking something, seriously
give some tips/facts about how they do it in the countryside from your perspective and how to adapt it for household scale?

>>14899848
please teach me, I want to get into agri stuff
regret that I took the electronics engineer pill

>>14899814
Not that guy, but people would fall into a lot of the same poor behavior. It's easy to say you never want to use pesticides until you have a sizable amount of one crop and start seeing it get ravaged by pests. It turns out that raising food is kind of a job, and there is a conflict between wanting high yields with low time investment.

>>14899862
I'm not a botanic student myself, but I bet you can find academics books about it easily or bang a chick who studied that as I'm doing, I learned a lot of botanic this year

>>14899871
>It turns out that raising food is kind of a job, and there is a conflict between wanting high yields with low time investment.
well yes
big agri use chemicals bc they are effective, cheap, easy to deploy and give quick results.
A sensible human with a heart would probably hire people/specialists/train dogs to fight against pests, but those cost money and time

>>14898978
>If it taste the same
It doesn't. Imitation meat is only able to copy the absolute shittiest versions of meat products. Sure, the Impossible Whopper tastes kinda like a Whopper, but that's only because the Whopper already tastes disgusting. Fast food meat is already 90% artificial flavoring anyways.
Vegan imitation meat is nowhere close to being able to replicate a nice rare steak, and never will be. The only reasonable way to eradicate meat farming is lab-grown meat.

>>14898978
Omnivores are all opportunist predators which is our nature. Corporations who offer cheap grain filler "meat substitutes" are super cheap compared to raising animals that can be sold to other consumer markets for more (((money))). The excess carb fake meat is processed garbage that is less healthy than actual meat.

>>14898978
Why not just make some kickass vegetable dishes and bring out their best according to what they are rather than trying to mask them as something that they are not?

I get that vegans want to do what they want, I'm not arguing against it in this instance, but wouldn't it be better to show that vegetables and non animal products can be awesome too rather than trying to mask them as meat? If they're awesome and reasonably priced on top of being good for you then that'd be great. Also isn't one of the larger hurdles for this imitation meat stuff that itvs still relatively expensive? If it is as good as it is I imagine more would be willing to adopt it if it was scaled enough for it to become cheaper.

Also I remember reading somewhere that farming techniques are pretty crap for the phosphorus cycle since it doesn't replenish fast enough so aren't we kinda fucked even if we switched? Legit someone educate me on this last one.

>>14899092
kek

>>14898978
>taste the same
No
>better for the environment
Soybean oil is farmed in unsustainable ways in the US, Argentina and Brazil while the byproducts are fed to cattle anyway, you're doing jackshit

If you're going to buy overpriced meat, buy local grass-fed beef. It's literally the best for the environment and you're health.

>>14899923
And who eats a fine rare steak everyday anyway ? That's the point, most of your meals won't have very fancy meat in them so you might as well replace it with a more ecological alternative

>>14899405
wow, mammals need more than plants. No shit? That is why we need to stop eating eat you Marxist cunt.

>>14899019
I know eating meat kills something. I kill my own animals for food you nimrod.

It's the vegans who don't want to be reminded of the environmental destruction of crop monocultures. They think animal feed production is bad? If vegans knew the shit that goes into almond, coconut, palm, fruit and veg production they would need to up their cognitive dissonance level to the next level.

>>14899689
What about cows that live on pasture and are grass finished? Who kills more then?

>>14898978
Meat alternatives are the trans people of food.

>>14899013
>He doesn't know

>>14899988
Shhh dude you are making sense and pointing out a flaw in their logic about meat substitutes that's gonna make them angry

>>14900023
The demand is so large that majority of beef has to be grain fed. If demand went down then yeaaybe we could switch to grass fed, but demand must go down first.

>>14900096
If people only bought grass finished there would be a greater demand for it.

Not to mention you can get grass finished cheaper if you buy wholesale.
Alternatively if you want red meat you can get smaller animals like goat and sheep or hunt wild ruminant game. The demand for meat will always be there, and the supply will be right behind. Even if somehow a law was passed that made meat illegal the demand and supply would still be around.

For me, the only way I found out of this shit system is to produce my own food. Vegans always bitch about feeding the world, but I just want the world to feed itself. Clearly we have the ability to produce enough food to feed people with room to spare (i.e waste) and fill landfills and give hogs in feedlots. But when you produce your own food there is no way in shitstain hell you are going to waste or binge on it.
A single person can eat a conventionally raised broiler hen in a day. It takes me a week to eat an entire duck carcass, and even longer because I still have the heads, feet, necks, wing tips, fat, and organs of all my ducks.

>>14899439
>>14899651
>>14899737
>>14900007
You all fell for it!

Liters per calorie for almond (((milk))): 2 1/3
Liters per calorie for milk: 1.1

See pic related for calorie counts, the "editors" on wikipedia trying to make real milk look bad but I can see through the facade. Sure a cup of milk is has a larger "footprint" but who gives a fuck? Its twice as efficient as bullshit almonds.

>>14900016
That duck is looking at you thinking
>how could you do this to me after all we've been through?

Replacement meat is unironically more expensive than real meat over here. It tastes worse and is less healthy.

>>14901116
That duck isn't thinking shit. Before I scalded it the eyes were shut, the skin shrunk around the eyes during scalding and made them open.

Tbh I don't think the duck was even thinking when I cut it's head off, note the bruise on top of his head from stunning.

>>14899386
Bootlicker

>>14899007
people have made that face to over exaggerate excitement for years it's only a recent phenomenon where it's become a manufactured "problem" by left/right online culture wars.

>>14900016
>If vegans knew the shit that goes into almond, coconut, palm, fruit and veg production they would need to up their cognitive dissonance level to the next level.
The truth is vegans don't care about any living thing other than themselves.

It's just virtue signaling. They go vegan to elevate themselves above others.

>>14899405
you know textile industry is the more danger for the environment

>>14901181
What dish did you make out of it? Post pics. Hope the ducky gave up its life for something tasty.

>'haha but plants tho'
>we feed most of our produce to animals
>'g-grass fed tho'
>animals have to take up way more space, reducing total supply of meat to everyone and making it far more expensive

Meatcucks please dilate.

>>14901204

>>14901202
Thats very true mr treadmill man.
My older sister is a fucking cunt and is a vegan. Probably one of the most horrible people I have ever known. I remember she spent many hours as a kid trying to convince me I did horrible shit that she did (which usually involved cruelty to/mistreatment of animals). She literally would lock me in a room and tell me I did shit that she did and wouldn't let me leave until I "admitted" I did it. Her gaslighting level was quite high and even for a kid her lack of empathy astounds me to this day. She is an absolute fucking egotistical psycho.

>>14901225
>converting native grasslands that need large grazers to maintain themselves in the first place to non-native cropland good
Do vegans really?

>>14901181
I'm joking with you!

>>14901182
Okay?

>>14898978
It doesn't taste the same and it's not as nutritious. It's not bad but it's not really a meat alternative, it's basically junk food that is okay to have as an occasional treat but probably shouldn't be used to completely replace meat. Lab-grown meat seems like it'll eventually be a more suitable replacement.

>>14901222
First I roasted him on a bed of radishes, potatoes, onions, and garlic and herbs from my garden. I then stuffed his cavity and breasts with apples. Baked on low for a long period of time, and then stewed the duck for a delicious sweet, tender meat that demanded to be savored. Bones were saved for recooking into stock with veggie scraps It took me a week to eat it all because he was just too damn delicious and rich and sweet to just inhale like your conventional poultry. I also collected the rendered fat (pic related) and use it on tons of cooking. Nothing, and I mean, NOTHING fries potatoes better than duck fat. You can take that to the bank.

The head, feet, neck, neck skin, fat, and of course organs (gizzard, liver, heart, kidney, testicles, and lungs) are still chilling in the freezer with the rest of my cull males. The down and pinfeathers were saved for later use in crafts and for pillows. The only thing that is "wasted" currently is the intestines and vent (aka butthole). Though in the future I might clean them out and try to find a use for them. And when I say waste I mean they are composted.

I am very much into nose to tail eating. The only pics I have of my cooked ducks are earlier ducks I had where I cut the tail off (I don't do that anymore since the roasting and stewing fully utilized the tail.) Next time I cook one I'll save pics tho! :)

>>14901274
Let's be realistic here, fastfood vegan alternatives are just as bad as their authentic fastfood counterparts.

>>14901225
>"most crops are fed to animals! we could just eat it ourselves"
>Animal feed is mostly byproduct of production for human use which is inedible and would have to be discarded if it wasn't fed to animals. Animals turn waste into high quality food. Without animals we would have to grow far more crops and cause far more environmental destruction due to inefficiency caused by not upcycling waste into food.
>"..."

>>14901317
It's a shame this board is infested with so much fast food posts.

>>14899640
im not vegan or anything, but you're such a massive brainlet if you truly believe what you just wrote.

>>14901347
I agree with you on that.

>>14901317
Clearly worse. Beef provides nutrition.

>>14901351
As does beyond burger and impossible. But I'm not going to bother arguing this with you. I don't really care about these things enough to further this discussion.

>>14901351
Red meat gives you heart disease and colon cancer.

>>14901412
Being obese gives you heart disease and colon cancer and vegan food doesn't make you immune to obesity. Only processed red meat increases your risk of colon cancer a bit but unprocessed meat wasn't definitely proven to do it as well.

>>14899092
keked

>>14898978
A lot of people are extremely insecure and choose to posture over how """masculine""" they are for eating meat, as though that's notable at all.

>>14899035
Vegans are still omnivores that crave meat.

>Why don’t regular people try to make meat based lettuce or meat based carrots?
Because you can just eat lettuce and carrots. What a retarded thing to say.

>>14901700
As a vegan I can truthfully say I don't crave meat. I do from time to time contemplate eating eggs, but then I realize I don't need to.

>>14899379
Monsanto does not deal directly in meat and dairy. Agribusiness for the last half-century has been greedy cunts as evidenced by the meat market being cornered by 4 large companies. Even so, they undercut the market by hiring illegal immigrants and making widespread use of CAFOs. If you think that Monsanto alone has caused the fucked situation then you’re ignorant of the industry.

>>14901717
You are but one vegan.

>>14901717
>Doesn't crave meat but always looking for something warm, fatty, and salty.

>>14899007
it's so the algorithm recognizes they're excited about something

>>14900016
ducks have extremely regular feather attachment points on their torso

>>14901412
ACKSHULLY if you look at the research the WHO did to attempt to prove the theory that meat gives you colorectal cancer is true they did some fucked up shit to my rodent homies, like injecting them with known carcinogens before even beginning the experiments. And then megadosed the rodents with way more low quality meat than most people, even Sv3rige probably eats in a day.

Their findings actually show that not only did these poor tortured rodents not get colorectal cancer but the meat might even have some anti cancer properties. Thats why these faggots had to say "probably". They got paid out the wazooo to try to prove that a religious nut 100 years ago was right. And she wasn't. Boo hoo fuck Kelloggs.

Heart disease is more likely caused by stress, sugar, and refined seed oils. All of those things cause inflammation.

>>14898978
rich people will still eat meat and the wealth of the 20th century that allowed regular joes to eat better than kings did will disappear
is the fear
but if I can't tell tell the difference, it's cheaper, and I don't have to kill an animal directly I will eat it

>>14901966
meat alternatives are more expensive than their meat counterparts mainly due to the fact that they are a relatively new product on the market, the government subsidizes meat producers, and consuming meat has been engrained in american culture for the past century.

>>14899092
lel

>>14901979
if pseudomeat gets pushed by making meat unaffordable to the common person I will resent it
if they manage to just make it cheap by technological and business innovation without dealbreaking costs in quality, which should not be impossible given that it's competing with the issues of livestock production, I will end up switching to it by choice and not resent it

>>14902024
meat will not become unaffordable to the average person anytime soon. the meat industry lobbies congress heavily to keep subsidies up and regulations low. meat prices have stayed relatively stable over the past decade and i don't see any dramatic changes to meat prices happening in the next decade unless there is some sort of shortage of labor or animals.
meat alternative prices are projected to go down in price in the coming decade due to improvements in the underlying process, entrance of new competitors, and increased consumer interest.
beyond meat has only started turning a profit in the first quarter of 2020, and is starting to open up new facilities across the us and europe to produce beyond meat

>>14902061
You are a fucking retard who has never actually been to a god damn farm, aren't you?

>>14899007

>>14902073
i have been to a vertically integrated farm run by one of the big 4 meat producers in the us and several independent farms. obviously covid is affecting production, but consumer demand is still there.

>>14899013
I'm actually a little sick of this argument. Why does it have to taste exactly like meat? It should be a meat alternative. Protein, fats, etc in a package that has some umami flavor to it. Meat replacement not meat imitation.

I had fake chorizo sausage a while ago at a restaraunt. Didn't taste like sausage really at all. And it was fucking delicious. Gives me hope.

So long as we get the basic flavors we crave with roughly the right nutrients it's really the only way we're gonna keep feeding all the people on this earth that won't stop procreating. Lab grown meat is a meme and a waste.

Also it should be cheaper, idk where these companies are getting off thinking they should be charging double the cost of meat for something that costs so much less to make. I'm hoping off-brands get their shit together and make some edible plant based stuff to drive prices down.

>>14898978
They're really expensive. If it were cheaper and tasted the same, people would take the leap and switch.

>>14901350
We need a separate food board (/fd/?) so that /ck/ can concentrate entirely on cooking. Like how we have a dozen or so actual video game boards so that /v/ can concentrate solely on shitposting.

>>14899737
>>14901101
Okay meat-eaters, I'm the President and CEO of Antifa. We were planning to hunt you all down and put shock collars on you which prevent you from eating meat ever again-- BUT-- we are now willing to make a deal.

We vegans will agree to give up almonds if you agree to give up cows. We'll continue eating other nuts, and you'll continue to eat other animals, but no more almonds or cows for anyone. Deal?

>>14902272
4chan isnt much better than reddit anymore, but its still a place for opinions. Nothing HAS to be like anything, but if people dont like something they are going to say it. I think shitty substitutes are shitty, and im gonna say it.

>>14901312
Wow, I'm impressed and jealous. I hope you had some great company and good drink to share such fine cooking.

Please take more pictures, now more than ever the rest of us need to live through people like you. I've eaten at every restaurant imaginable, all of those meals slowly fade away, but real home cooked food off the land never leaves you.

>>14898978
Multiple reasons:
>they used to mainly be gross
>type of people pushing them are usually annoying
>meat is seen as manly and Americans are terrified that someone will think theyre gay
>people are expected meat and get disappointed when its not meat even if its good

Im not vegan or vegetarian but I like some fake meats

>>14898978
Faggots.

>>14902580
Ty bro. But don’t let it just be a dream! Last year at this time I was living in a one bedroom apartment in a major city, never had livestock and never grew anything other than herbs. I decided enough was enough and found a way out. You can too! Rural areas are losing people and actually need more folks moving there. Just be respectful, don’t be a judgemental egotistical vegan faggot, and you would be amazed at the generosity you will come across.
You can make it, people need to leave the city anyways, and if you don’t wanna be there you shouldn’t have to suffer.

>>14898978
>pricy
>less quantity
>hit-or-miss flavor
>prissy hipster consumer base
>always presented as a substitute
There are more reasons, but those are the main 5 I could think of.

>>14902930
>>14902692
almost all of your arguments were also common against renewable energy sources just a few years ago but i think meat will go much the same way in that it will gradually become more expensive partly because millions of people are being lifted from poverty in asia and africa so they will be able to afford meat and partly because it is inefficient to farm. just give it some time and it will become a bigger market

>>14899405
Oat milk is so based. It's not even gay to like oats.

>>14902968
Oat milk ice cream is awful.

>>14902957
>defending the poor taste of renewable energy resources

>>14902957
Meat will always be around. They could ban meat from human consumption tomorrow and we'd STILL raise livestock since they yield so many commercial and industrial uses.
Getting rid of cattle alone would make half of our unfarmable agricultural land useless.

>>14898978
i tried it. was actually pretty impressed. still not as good as the real thing, but not bad.

>>14898978
>if it taste the same
They don't, it's just marketing and vegan cope

>>14902957
>renewable energy sources
Wind farms literally massacre an enormous amount of any wildlife that flies around in that region

>>14902272
I don't care about the world i care about my country faggot. Go donate your food to them if you want, its not my responsibility to give my food up for people i don't give a fuck about. Kill yourself faggot.

>>14899405
Can someone explain why water use is bad? I mean it's not like it disappears once used, it then becomes rain and can be used again

>>14901356
Beyond and impossible aren't healthier and are often higher in calories than their meat counterparts, while also being higher in sodium and lower in iron. They do have higher protein counts but it's only pea protein and therefore incomplete and less bioavailable.

>>14898978
Because it's more Frankenstein than any ground beef or pink slime chicken. Beyond is barely as healthy than a shitty log of 80/20 from the grocer. The Frankenstein part comes from how easy itll be to cut costs and inject it with whatever bullshit they want us to eat. Beyond and Impossible exist for retarded vegetarians and vegans and Hope's to one day be the staple of the NWO. Where the poor will one day only dream of eating the leftover fat of Mr. Goldblooms steak.

>>14898978
>market something as "it's like meat"
>it is not like meat at all
>broken expectations, people backslash it
stunnedyellowrabbitfromchinesecartoon.mpg

>>14903904
Honestly water use being bad is generally context sensitive. There are two types of water used in agriculture. There is green water, which comes directly from rain, and blue water, which comes from established water sources like streams, creeks, lakes, aquafers, and other ground water sources.
Animals generally use green water, but it really depends on where the farms is and how/what animals are raised. Crops will generally use blue water. This is why you will hear a lot about aquafers and other standing water sources being drained for irrigation and shit.

Fun fact though, I live on a conventional soy/corn farm and because we get so much rain and there are lots of creeks and streams on the property there is no irrigation. Corn and soy are way less thirsty plants than say, nuts, fruit, and vegetables. Keep in mind most human crops will mostly be intensively grown in places that have a year round growing season, like California (which is very water insecure atm).

These plants might use less water but the water they use generally does not come from the most ethical sources.

>>14903866
ah yes. let’s just keep polluting said air. i bet the birds won’t mind as long as they don’t have to deal with wind turbines.
>inb4 nuclearfag
there still isn’t a good way to store nuclear byproduct aside from putting it in the ground and hoping it doesn’t leach into ground water.

My SIL is an annoying vegan cunt and everytime she brings up our "addiction to eating meat," I've been saying WE EAT THE MEAT CAUSE THE MEAT HAD A SOUL. WE TAKE A LIFE CAUSE TO HURT MAKES US WHOLE progressively and progressively louder. Bonus points to anyone who can regonize that without googling it.

>>14904510
She is just butthurt because she has been so domesticated by capitalist oppressors who do not want her to become self aware of the fact that she is in fact, livestock (worse than livestock) and to try to break free of her bonds.

Veganisim is nutrient deficient and cholesterol deficient. We need cholesterol to make said nutrients bioavailable. Our brain is heavily dependent on cholesterol. She is a moron and she serves our oligarchical system of oppression wonderfully.

Beyond meat tastes like shit

>>14898978
>why the backlash
It is revolting garbage made from poisonous chemicals
>if it tastes the same
I literally don't know what I would have to do to meat to make it taste as disgusting as any of this shit. Maybe leave it in the freezer for five years then put it in the microwave for half an hour. At least t wouldn't have any of the poisonous chemicals though
>better for the environment
No it isn't, it's produced in factories from poisonous monocultures that utterly destroy every biome they are placed in rendering the earth barren and dead.

Actual animal agriculture, not your abominable american shit where animals are raised in sheds and fed on the same revolting poison you eat, literally regenerates desert. A cow pasture supports THOUSANDS of species from insects to wild mammals and predators like foxes and birds of prey. Humans are also literally obligate carnivores and eating anything else directly damages your health.

>>14902272
Then why not just eat actual fucking vegetables if they're so delicious? Because even an absolutely revolting mockery of meat is still better than any actual vegetable despite being the end result of a massive industrial process that created far more waste and did more harm to the environment than meat ever could.

>>14899985
Humans are purely predatory and purely carnivorous. The only plant matter you should eat is the small amount of fruit available in the autumn which stimulates fat retention for winter. almost nothing that grows on the entire Earth is edible, it has to have its entire molecular structure destroyed with heat before you can even chew it and it creates all known disease. Every part of every mammal, bird and fish however is easily edible to humans excepting the livers of walrus and polar bears and the toxin sacs of some fish. You literally have enzymes in your stomach to break down bone, hair and especially cholesterol but none that digest any plant matter.

>>14899381

To be honest, I can't tell the difference between an impossible burger and a regular burger unless im eating both of them in the same sitting

>>14904510
That is entirely inaccurate. Hurting others doesn't make anyone whole, it just further deepens that hatred in you that is extremely transparent. I'm not saying don't eat meat, but you should do some self reflection.

>>14901181

>das it mane

i like meat a lot but i'm not a selfish idiot, so i'd be happy to switch over to similar alternatives if it would have a large-scale environmental impact. haven't tried the "beyond" or "impossible" stuff yet, maybe it's good.

>>14905733
we don't shit in our pants, but humans are not designed to use toilets. why is animalism your baseline for making decisions?

>>14905733
Now I just have to wait for a vegan saying completely the opposite thing and the circle of meat eater asshole and vegan asshole will be complete

>>14898978
>If it taste the same
It doesn't taste the same at all, thats like comparing regular and diet coke.

>>14905862
t. has never tasted it, or picky manchild

I know this is a bait thread, but the "backlash" is because it's being BLATANTLY forced. It's completely inorganic, and there's not even the thinnest veil over the fact that these vegans are trying to get it established in stores so that they can then move forward with phase two: Get rid of the real meat.

>>14905876
and why does that warrant backlash? it's morally correct (not for the purposes of animals, but for environmental purposes).
are you immoral, or do you reject reality? it's one or the other.

Why is this shit thread still up? Goddamn, the /ck/ mods are shit.
>>14898978
You are an absolute tastelet if you thing the fake stuff tastes like real meat.

>>14905873
Or, and here is a strange idea, I haven't ruined my taste buds with smoking and can actually taste things.

>>14898978
Care to explain how it's better for the environment?

>>14898978
You are free to eat whatever you want but let me eat whatever I want too.

End of this debate.

>>14906145
Nope. We live in a democracy, not Ancapistan, lolbert bitch. You can go hunt the dolphin just as soon as you petition the state to let you. :)

>>14906123
Less cow farts.

>>14906167
But it's made in a lab, synthesized and grown from aminos that are constructed from hydrocarbons?

>>14906186
that's not a cow fart

>>14906233
We're talking about science, not the circumstances of your conception.

>>14906123
It's more energy efficient to produce than meat.

Legit question is there a research paper you can link me?

>>14905926
Why wouldn't the thread be up? This board is about food.
>>14906100
Neither have I. Difference between you and I is that I'm not a picky child, and you still are.
>>14906145
But is there a particular reason why you should be free to eat what you like, beyond "muh philosophy?"

>>14905895
What is environmentally correct is to fix our agricultural system as a whole. Having a food product that is heavily processed made from multiple ingredients shipped in from all over the world is not going to be more environmentally friendly than a burger. Like, do you even know how expeller pressed canola oil is made? Do you know how much god damn equipment is required to produce it??? Do you know how much fuel is required to run the equipment to produce it? And that's just ONE ingredient.
You are the one rejecting reality if you think this industrial food system is suddenly going to become sustainable just from genociding all of our domestic animals to extinction.

Industrial agriculture is shit, but so is having 99% of the western population not producing any food whatsoever and stealing it from the land it colonized.

>>14905876
It has nothing to do with vegans, the people in charge of saving the environment are omnivores

>>14906980
ok, fine, you seem like you know what you're talking about so i'm just going to agree with you on this

>>14905895
>>14899742
>>14899405
>>14898978

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIG9ozEDPVg&ab_channel=QuickDickMcDick

>>14902075
based poo in the loo

>>14907204
what a dumb faggot

>>14898978
Propaganda put out by the meat industry and those with stake in it if I had to guess. Kinda seems like yet another case of retards being manipulated into getting upset over shit that has no effect on them whatsoever.

>>14898978
>>14899007
>>14899011
>>14899013
>>14899019
>>14899022
>>14899035
>>14899047
>>14899063
>>14899092
>>14899181
>>14899211
>>14899276
>>14899303
>>14899311
>>14899360
>>14899363
>>14899365
>>14899366
I'm getting more of a seared bite on the Impossible Whopper, than I'm getting on the actual Who- no no no no no no no no.... No please don't say that no no no... No. Nonononono. No no nono no no. NONO NO NONO NO NOOOOO. Ladies and gentlemen, I'm not gonna trip. I wanted to come in a 100% hater.

I'mma tell you off the top. I wanted to take a bite of this and be like 'ehhh nah nah it it'- I'mma just flat out say it; your Impossible Whopper BK, IS BETTER THAN YOUR ACTUAL WHOPPER BK. YOUR IMPOSSIBLE WHOPPER BK IS BETTER THAN YOUR ACTUAL WHOPPER BK. IT HAS A MORE SEARED TASTE.

IT'S MORE OF A COOKOUT FLEX. IT JUST TASTES BETTER. Get over here. You get back in the bag. BK. That bite is so flavorful my m- and the fact that it works so well, it literally compliments the lettuce. Like I'm not even mad that I'm bittin' up, and I'm not even mad, that I'm eating lettuce right now and tomatoes.

You can really taste the onion because the sear, on this plant based situation right here, it's so strong and you barely get onion but the onion's there so you get a crunch off it, with soft bun action and SBA? BK, YOU'RE ONTO SOMETHING, AND I LIKE WHERE YOU, YOU GOIN' BK, THE IMPOSSIBLE WHOPPER SON!

>>14898978
>If it taste the same
It doesn't.

> better for the environment
You can better get rid of all the different kinds bisphenols first.

>>14901958
> Heart disease is more likely caused by stress, sugar, and refined seed oils

A lot more. Smoking addiction was huge in the past and is still going strong. It's linked to a lot of heart and artery diseases and increases the risk of getting those by a lot. A lot of other lifestyle choices also affect heart performance and durability.
>>14901347
Americans inhabit this board.

>>14906978
>But is there a particular reason why you should be free to eat what you like, beyond "muh philosophy?"

Are you retarded?

Because you are no one to tell me what I can or can't eat. Less when is ducking near that humans have been eating since they exist in this planet.

>>14906978
>>14909140
Not ducking near, FUCKING MEAT.

why not just eat ... less meat? why does it have to be none at all

>>14898978
What do you thinks going in there after the fake chicken op? It ain't more fake chicken :|

>>14899534

>>14908504
Based

>>14909630
Eating meat in moderation? It'll never catch on here. Name me a website that hates moderation more than 4chan.

>>14909630
people dont like being told they need to have less
it'll be easier telling them to eat more veg

>>14908504
>compliments the lettuce

>>14899092
fucking hell, that's good

>>14899365
All civilizations throughout history have subsidized agriculture. Stop acting like a great crime is being committed because 1% of the GDP goes to meat farming.

>>14899047
The point isnt to be at zero its to just be better than you are and humble yourself as best you can.

>>14898978
It’s not better for the environment you bugman retard. It’s full of gmos, also plant agriculture is responsible for more Co2 emissions than animal agriculture

>>14899472
>they add b12 to the meat retard, it doesnt come from meat it comes from bacteria,
You’re a moron

>>14906123
It isn’t

ITT meatfags seething

>>14911018
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bod8MrVah_Y&ab_channel=TVFilthyFrank

>>14909650
Every time I see this picture it somehow becomes smaller

>>14898978
1) it tastes like shit
2) you just know governments are going to ban or restrict meat "for the environment" and theyre hyping up bugman food to prepare people for it

Been vegan for a while, these are the only good subs because of how processed real meat is;
-Vegan nuggets; because its processed chicken shaped like a nugget

-Vegan burgers of any meat; this is fine too since it was meat shaped into a patty and easy to copy

>>14899007
>meat alternatives

>>14911498
>how processed real meat is
>thinks its comparable to his 69 ingredient oil and gas fest that he calls a "surrogate to meat"
What the fucking fuck?

>>14899780
Where do you think piped water comes from? It's usually from a water table, the same as a well. Where do you think that water table comes from? Rain. Same for a reservoir.
As much as I disagree with it, there's a reason that many places don't allow to to collect large amounts of rain water.
C'mon man, use some critical thought and common sense.
Plus, the water mechanisms used by large scale industry is far more efficient as far as water usage to food produced than someone with a watering pail or hose.

>>14898978
>If it taste the same and better for the environment, there is no reason not to eat it.
no, no it does not do either.

>>14902532
You obviously didn't even read his post. It applies to all tree nuts. If you want to make it a fair deal, you can eat peanuts and basically no other nut.

I'd rather nuke India and china then give up meat.

>>14912128
>>14902532
Well, upon second though, you only said cows, so that's more fair. But it still ignores that the vast, vast, vast majority of livestock feed is basically inedible to us.
I literally donate to a place that gives poor villages animals to milk and breed that can survive off of ruffage those people can't eat. Will those third world nogs etc just kill the animal and eat some and sell the rest? Maybe, possibly even probably. But I like to keep a little idealist left in me rather than going full blackpill.

>>14912227
Ok chud

Not eating meat turns you into an effeminate faggot.

>>14898978
>Why is there so much backlash over meat alternatives?
stop using social media faggot

>>14908504
normal whopper >

>>14898978
because being a vegetarian but still wanting to eat things that look/taste like meat is the same backwards retarded logic that lesbians use when they hate dicks but still use penis-shaped dildos.

>>14899019
>do not want to be reminded that eating meat kills something
speak for yourself pussy
we didnt work our way to the top of the fucking food chain for nothing
and you aren't a man until you've gone out and hunted or fished your own meal at least once.

A vegan isn't eating real meat and a lesbian is never giving you sexual validation >>14913849
Sorry chud

>>14903896
lmao

One samefagging triplefaggot is keeping this thread alive