/ck/ - Food & Cooking

>>13926276
ok boomer

>>13926276
it's probably, in general, the healthiest diet for humans. anthropologically speaking, pescatarianism is the basal, ancestral diet of homo sapiens

>>13926295
This.

the world has essentially zero remaining wild species that aren't overfished and it's obviously colossally more brutal than livestock farming. if you're happy to eat capelin for every meal for the rest of your life you'd be getting somewhere

>>13926276
So basically an omnivore with extra steps

>>13926295
Humans didn't start eating seafood until the megafauna went extinct.

The perfect diet of man is fatty red meat. Beef is the closest approximation we can get.

>>13926315
t. Cancer

>>13926315
I would say that people evolved eating gathered shellfish and fruit mostly for the large part of history

Pescetarian would be fine if it weren't for the mercury.

>>13926322
just don't eat too many sharks and mackarels. its that difficult?

>>13926320
i would say you're wrong since anthropological and evolutionary biological evidence suggest you're wrong.

fruit has never been an important part of the human diet. ever.

>>13926276
>plants are radical
I can already tell your entire life in one second if you think plants are radical, and that assumption is that you're a Pizza addicted fried chicken addict

>>13926331
Not really. Almost all fish has some mercury in it. If that's all you consume your exposure goes up so much. It's not worth it.

>>13926315
Humans didn't start eating red meat until they developed fire.

The perfect diet of man is carrion. Roadkill is the closest approximation we can get.

>>13926276
Ovo-Pescetetrian is def a nice way to live. I had fishing the half of my life, but after the taxes and rents are so fucked up here in Flyover-Europoor i cant afford my fresh fish any longer.

>>13926546
>if that's all you consume
Lol, who said that is eating only fish? My primary food are grains and vegetables, only having fish and seafood about 2 or 3 times per week, first because its the amount recommended by doctors and nutritionists, second because I live in a second world country and fish is not that cheap.

And do a research about the amount of mercury in fishes, most of them have a very low amount that are not dangerous at all.

>>13926512
The amount of processed food you've eaten has fried your brain. You can't even interpret a simple text anymore

>>13926574
Hey Eurofriend, I live in South America and although I'm in a coastal area, fish aren't that cheap. Like I said, you don't have to eat it everyday, eat your fish a couple of times per week and you will be healthy with all the micro nutrients you need, the eggs and plants will fulfill the remaining protein you need

>>13926595
Your text is too long so I'm not going to green text it
OP thinks veggies are radical because he eats nothing but steak, dairy pizza, and chick fill a.

Also I eat beans and rice every day, not processed, good assumption you didnt even have a base like OP did

>>13926595
>Lol, who said that is eating only fish?
That's literally the definition of pescetarian.

>>13926603
are you baiting or are plantcucks really this deranged
my man you need some animal fat to get that brain of yours firing right

>are you baiting or are plantcucks really this deranged
my man you need some animal fat to get that brain of yours firing right

>>13926276

Just eat the goddamn bugs and stop dreaming about alternatives.

>>13926318
https://annals.org/aim/fullarticle/2752328/unprocessed-red-meat-processed-meat-consumption-dietary-guideline-recommendations-from

>>13926276
I'm vegetarian and would probably be vegan (or more strict about where I get my animal products) if I had better access to food, but I don't like the idea of having to supplement. I've been looking into eating oysters and mussels (which seem to fill in nutritional gaps perfectly and therefore eliminate the need for supplementation) and while I'm still on the fence about it, I am leaning towards it being acceptable.

I should note that I think every individual should choose their diet for themselves and should be informed, so I try not to tell people what to do, just to be a source of information when they ask for it. That being said, for me, I don't think I would be able to eat most fish for the same reason why I don't agree with eating land animals. With the information that is presently out there, I do think it is a better alternative to eating land animals. In general, I think the more removed something is from human, the better it is to eat. Mammals are just too weird. This is all my opinion though.

However, certain molluscs (keyword: certain), seem to be mostly analogous to most plants regarding sentience and nerve structure, and farming them actually contributes to bettering the environment instead of harming it.

I will now post some of the links I'm currently using for my research, if anyone is interested:

https://dianaverse.com/2020/04/07/bivalveganpart1/

https://dianaverse.com/2020/04/07/bivalveganpart2/

Beyond that if you're interested you can do more research, it seems like the major hangup with it for vegans is "they're animals so they're not vegan" which I think is kind of silly argument that can be broken down by how many plants we eat that don't want to be eaten.

>>13926276
>not so brutal as livestock farming
>not so harmful for the environment
Addressing these points, you made me curious as to if fish farming is better or not, or good for the environment. I will post my findings here:

https://www.fisheriessciences.com/fisheries-aqua/effects-of-fish-farming-on-marine-environment.php?aid=6896
>The most common negative environmental impacts that have been associated with aquaculture include: waters eutrophication, water quality, alteration or destruction of natural habitats; introduction and transmission of aquatic animal diseases (FAO, 2006a).

https://www.aquaculturealliance.org/blog/what-is-the-environmental-impact-of-aquaculture/
>Fish farming, *when done sustainably,* can be the answer to filling the gap in seafood supply that stressed fisheries are creating.

https://www.europeanceo.com/industry-outlook/fish-farming-is-on-the-rise-but-theres-an-environmental-catch/
>Fish farms will need to address sustainability issues eventually or risk damaging their own long-term interests, but a solution will need to be found that does as little damage as possible to their immediate growth prospects.

On environmental impact vs livestock, it was hard for me to find anything actually comparing the two, but I did find this:

https://www.washington.edu/news/2018/06/11/choice-matters-the-environmental-costs-of-producing-meat-seafood/
>...in general, industrial beef production and farmed catfish are the most taxing on the environment, while small, wild-caught fish and farmed mollusks like oysters, mussels and scallops have the lowest environmental impact, according to a new analysis.

My conclusion is, it can be brutal, it can be really harmful for the environment, so you just need to make sure that where you get your stuff supports sustainability and has good practices. I'd be curious to read where you got your information on those two points, if you'd like to post on them.

>>13926276
yeah because the oceans aren't massively overfished and fish farms be it norway or thailand turned out to be such a great thing

>>13926276
I tried dating a pescetarian once, but it didn't work out. I don't get along well with protestant girls.

>>13926276
there's a reason why the japs have such long healthy lifespans. all that seafood.

>>13926309
Sardines for dinner man.

>>13926315
>Beef is the closest approximation we can get.
That would be game.

>>13926350
Shit fossils suggest early man ate a ton of plants judging from the fibers

>>13927340
Early man ate more meat than carnivorous animals. This is proven by bone analysis.

Only vegans desperately cling to this fossilised dung lie.

>>13926295
There have been period of fish eating and ruminant eating. Humans have eaten both in great amounts in different ages.

>>13926276
This is only good if you eat low tropic-level fish. All the large fish (tuna/salmon) carry the most heavy metals. It's even debatable if Atlantic farm-raised salmon are worse due to slightly worse fat content than wild-caught.

>>13927340
Yet, the ultimate test, which is isotope carbon/nitrogen testing, says we didn't. Cool beans fuck off

>"but LOOK, we found raw wheat in this poop!"

>>13927340
Whycome every settlement has a shit-tonne of gnawed animal bone then
Hell Russia has a whole illegal mammoth tusk industry solely from digging excavating early man villages.

>>13926747
Very interesting. Thank you. I live down by the coast in Ireland and seagulls literally rain the fucking things down on the tow path all day to break them open and eat. There are broken shells everywhere.

Yet they are surprisingly hard to get in local supermarkets, and if you can it is pre-packaged shit in plastic with e.g. factory made white wine sauce etc. Given how easy/cheap they are to farm and how delicious they are if cooked properly it is a shame there isn't a more widespread culture of eating them. I mean all the local restaurants do them but very few cook or eat them at home.

>>13927334
>I have never eaten game
Game isn't nearly as fatty as ice age megafauna. It's not a good approximation

>>13926276
much much much easier to introduce plastic into your system

the only fish that is definitely safe is from an aquaponic system

>>13926546
Obviously you eat plants primarily as with all non-meme diets

>boomer NEETs pretending their lifestyles require the same diets as their ancestors

Eating fish once or twice a week as your only source of meat is the future. It's inevitable. Let the cope commence.

>>13930431
>the future
Hardly. We overfish already. The future is vegan. Better start getting used to legumes and grains being your sources of protein.

>>13926276
fish gang checking in. Feeling healthy af

>>13927214
>t. Rodney Dangerfield

>>13930440
Nah, veganism will continue to grow in popularity but it's extreme & not for everyone. Not everyone wants to have to supplement. Ovo-lacto & pescatarianism are much simpler & the easiest when it comes to getting the majority, minus the boomers, onboard.

>>13926276
No, the oceans are dangerously overfished as things are and most people don't eat seafood. It's totally unsustainable and factory farmed fish has none of the qualities you describe.

>>13930507
The lacto part of ovo-lactovegetarianism is straight out if we're taking predictions of future at face value. Cattle is too resource intensive.

pescetarian is the most cancerous diet you can have
worse than vegan
>hurr i don't eat meat unless it's poached from the wild therefore i'm better than anyone else
ya fuck off with that

>>13926276
There isn't enough wild fish to feed world population. We're already having to farm fishes to meet demands.

>>13927811
I'm who you replied to. Thank you for your (You). I currently live right outside of Dublin and while I haven't officially started eating them, I can find fresh mussels and frozen bivalves in Dunnes and have found fresh mussels in Tesco. I remember the price for fresh not being too too much, enough for a Friday dinner maybe. I don't know if my near-Dublin privilege is what is affording me the benefit of having them in local supermarkets.

Keep looking anon, or maybe restrict it to when you come up to visit Howth or something? I bet the bigger southern coastal towns would have fish markets with them too, like down in Waterford. I mean, we are on an island ffs. Cheers

>>13927819
you literally get microplastics from the air now. there is no escaping the plastics. I can admire wanting to reduce plastic consumption, but I doubt you're cooking with all metal/glass/wood cookware and not using sea salt and I doubt you're using all metal/glass/wood tupperware/dishware. May be better to start reduction there.

>Fishbones make eating fish difficult
>Parasites make eating fish dangerous
>Smell makes eating fish uncomfortable
Fix these and I will eat your fish

>>13931227
>fishbones
eat invertebrates
>parasites
eat properly cooked invertebrates
>smell
eat freshly caught properly cooked invertebrates

>>13926613
It's not. Go look up the definition

>>13931271
You can eat my invertebrate any time, anon <3

>>13931289
Except cephalopods. Cephalopods are for cuddles, not for consumption <3

God I wish I was a cephalopod...

>>13930820
I can agree with that. The push for alternative milks is probably the easiest one to make thankfully. Too bad overpopulation renders most of these conversations useless though.

>>13931289
daaaaawwwwww

>>13926276
1)there is no such thing as a radical diet
2) "meat protein"? you mean protein. most meat doesn't have every amino acid, you're saying "meat protein" as if it like a premium product
3) Agreed. plenty of aquatic mammals and octopus and shit get injured and wrongly captured by trawlers however
4) debatable. probably less emissions overall but the amount of netting and plastic left in the oceans, and the damage to coral and reefs is massive
5) agreed. not the only source though.
6) sort of agree. exercise and lifestyle is more impactful though
7) if you eat fish lower on the food chain, yes
8) agree

I don't know what you are alluding to when you say "the solution". if you are talking about environmentalism then the ideal model IMO would be to replace pigs and cows with rabbits and goats. Keep chickens around for eggs but eat a lot of pigeon. A lot of people can not thrive on a vegan diet due to allergies and what not, and a lot of people simply do not want to, so large scale Veganism is impractical and unwanted. Sticking to tiny fish like sardines, anchovies rather than tuna and shit (large scale).
At the end of the day, if you live in a Western nation then the ethical component of your diet is already minimised as far as capitalism/government regulation can shrink it. If you want to be perfectly "sin-free" so to speak, go vegan. If you can't or won't, then shoot/trap your own meat and raise your own chickens. If you can't or won't do that, that don't worry about it and eat whatever you want.
Just don't become a great big fat cunt. No-one likes to look at that

>>13932180
OP already outed himself by saying veganism is too radical, we all know he can't stop himself from stuffing himself full with Pizza Hut and Popeyes, he thinks veganism is radical for one reason only; he can't give up Popeyes and Pizza hut like the rest of CK

I'd prefer to snack on tunicates. If you're going to eat an animal, go ALL the way down the evolutionary line.
Maybe try some coral while you're at it.
Munching on kelp, thinking about the possibilities of bio-engineering the perfect feel-free meat... nomnom...

>>13926295
>pescatarianism is the basal, ancestral diet of homo sapiens
Really? How'd they manage to get fish up in the trees and in the middle of the African savana?

>>13926315
enjoy your heart attack

>>13932180
>Veganism is impractical and unwanted
> ENJOYS EATING FISH?!

I honestly refuse to believe anyone genuinely enjoy seafood. Pescatarian nonsense is being an omnivore with more steps, but not even tasty steps.

>>13926276
Go further, just don't eat mammals. Birds and fish are okay. Mammals have the same emotions as humans.

>>13926276
no because fish will be extinct in 50 years

>>13927817
but it is a good micro nutritional one.

>>13935475
Based. Near future generations will look back at the fact that their modern ancestors still killed & ate mammals to alarming degrees in disgust. Only flyover boomers will deny this.

>>13935570
True. Milienals only deny it because they cant stop themselves from ordering Pizza hut and falsely claim they will die without their pepperoni pizza

>>13926276
>>not as radical as vegetarianism/veganism
>>you still get your meat protein
You still restrict yourself to less of diverse and varied diet. Thinking it is still normal or helpful the environment is the same flawed thinking not based in any science whatsoever. You should stop reading trash websites.

>>less cancer
Think again, buddy. This is your genetic lottery, dude, and avoiding tainted well water or being downstream or downwind from some disgusting industry (pretty much the entire rust belt and Mississippi floodplain), first and foremost.

If you want optimal nutrition for your health, you eat a variety of foods that are as fresh, aka farm to table, as possible, not of some routine lacking enzymes, trace minerals, and other little things your body needs. Not all protein is the same. Fish being healthy is simply that cold water fish oil.

>>13926320
>I would say that people evolved eating gathered shellfish and fruit mostly for the large part of history
Plenty of native peoples left behind "dumps" aka shell middens that are literal mountains of spent clamshells show this to be true.

bump

>>13931227
some fish bones can be eaten and once u get used to it u can decide which ones are safe and which ones will stab into your gums, or lodge in your windpipe, deservedly.
but some fishbones hide more meat in them.
as for parasites and smell, get it fresh from a farm or trusted supplier. theres nothing u can do about fishiness except make it worse by handling fish like an idiot

>>13934980
what retarded planet do you come from, seafood comes from the element that covers 80% of our planet we have found ways to make it enjoyable u nigger

If the world was vegan, there would be no covid-19.

Think about that.

>>13926276
How do you quantify that it's less harmful for the environment and not as brutal as livestock farming? Because I doubt either are true and if everyone or even a good chunk of the global population went pescetarian the ocean would be empty a barren, empty pool of sludge within a year.

Literally the only argument vegetarians and vegans have is that killing animals is wrong if it's unnecessary, and no matter how much meatheads go "bacon bro lol here is a deer I hunted get owned", they know that's factually true, unless you're a retard who desperately clings to moral relativism or a "god made it okay for us" moral system as an excuse. That's literally all just cope. Pescetarianism is the epitome of missing the point.

>>13926276
>not so brutal as livestock farming

>hacking live fishes heads off with knives
>gutting live fish

okay

>>13936259
*thinks about it*

>>13926747
GROW. YOUR OWN. FOOD.

>>13926315
Okay caveman, now run dozens of miles a day to properly utilize the calories you get from a red meat based diet, don't forget you need to eat all the fatty tissue as well to not starve

>>13936459
I don't own any land (yet).

>>13936543
get some. or join a commune

>>13936459
You think I can afford something like that pic?
I can barely pay my electricity bill, man. I'm not about to go out and buy a fucking orchard.

>>13936882
you wanna give me some? or some money to buy some?

we do the best with what we have when we have it. telling me to grow my own food, get land, or join a commune assumes that I haven't already thought of that avenue. my circumstances are as such that I would like to own land to farm but am presently unable to. it is something I am working towards. thanks for the recommendation though.

No. The rampant meat industry ravages the planet, causes the occasional pandemic, and has spiraled out of control with its treatment toward living creatures. Pescatarianism literally solves none of those issues. If people wanna make a change but not go to the vegan extreme (understandable), then they can do ovo-lacto so long as they're supporting local farms.

>>13926574
>fresh fish
Canned sardines are all you need